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China's economy maintained static growth in the first two months, supported by strong performances in the industrial and service sectors. The country has also announced a slew of measures to boost domestic consumption as the country moves to make domestic demand the main engine and anchor of economic growth. Meanwhile, central authorities have identified key figures of Taiwan's cyber attacks.
Welcome to Road Today, a news program with a different perspective. I'm Gaena in Beijing. To listen to this episode again or to catch up on previous episodes, you can download our podcast by searching Road Today.
China's economy maintained steady growth in the first two months of the year, supported by strong performances in the industrial and service sectors. According to the National Bureau of Statistics, value-added industrial output increased by 5.9% year-on-year, while the service sector posted a 5.6% annual growth. The private sector expanded by more than 6%. Fu Linghui is a spokesperson for the National Stats Bureau.
On the demand side, with expansion of the trade-in policy and consumption during the Spring Festival, the market saw recovery in sales and service consumption. The retail sales of consumer goods climbed 4% year-on-year in the first two months of 2025.
That's half a percentage faster than the growth rate of 2024. Domestic tourist trips during the Spring Festival increased by 5.9% year-on-year. The transaction volume of tourism service platforms increased by more than 20% in January and February.
In the 2024 to 2025 snow and ice season, the cumulative number of visitors received by ski resorts nationwide increased by 22.8% year on year. Chinese animated films have broken several box office records.
So for more on this, joining us on the line is Professor Liu Baocheng, Director of the Center for International Business Ethics, University of International Business and Economics. Thanks for joining us, Professor. Hi there. It's a pleasure.
China's industrial output accelerated in the first two months of 2025, with notable growth in equipment manufacturing and high-tech manufacturing. The National Bureau of Statistics reported that value-added industrial output of enterprises above a designated size rose by 5.9% year-on-year, exceeding analysts' expectations in a writer's poll, which is 5.3%.
What economic signals do you think this data reveals? Well, the almost 6% year-on-year growth does beat the market expectation, but it is underpinned by a number of positive reasons. One is that China is on a steady path of economic recovery. And the
Many sectors are really accelerating their technological content and the conception is there to give more of the positive signal to the supply side where investors are beginning to step up their speed.
We can see also in the first two months, the PMI, which is a strong indicator of the confidence of the production side, is moving marginally above the benchmark of 50%, which is a very good sign. And our service sector has registered
consecutively 26 months of positive operation above the benchmark. So the Chinese economic resilience is
still very strong and it's there to be reflected by many industrial sectors, particularly in the equipment manufacturing and also the trading by upgrading or the assembly lines and also by
giving better job opportunities for our employees. So all of which is something that's related to the Chinese government policy, which is there to stimulate both the industrial upgrading and also conception. So it is something that deserves
quite some sort of relief, if not congratulations. Professor, about equipment manufacturing, we saw a remarkable 10.6% year-on-year growth in this sector, with high-tech manufacturing also performing strongly. From the perspective of industrial restructuring and upgrading, what long-term impact could this rapid growth in equipment manufacturing and high-tech manufacturing have on
on China's overall industrial landscape. Ideologically, all participants in the Chinese market now embrace the idea of new quality productive force and also high quality development. So more of the concerted efforts are gathering momentum in bringing up the upgradation of the Chinese industrial
manufacturing. So the sustained investment in the high-tech sector will definitely elevate Chinese industrial ecological system. More of the opening measures towards foreign investment is also there to build more synergy between Chinese companies versus the foreign investors within China. And then the
Innovation in those technological area, particularly in the semiconductor area, related with big data, cloud computing and artificial intelligence.
already experienced a spillover effect by boosting not only industrial output, but also the revitalization of the Chinese rural development. And it also served more to the household utility by providing more convenience to the individuals and also gave more of the robust development
the support to the community management. So all of this is there to
gave more of the positive signal for China to move definitely along the path of modernization and further the urbanization and industrialization will definitely upgrade also the Chinese demand, which in turn will boost the supply side, the innovation.
Professor, interesting to see in specific product categories, new energy vehicle production surged by 47.7%, 3D printing equipment output rose by 30.2%, and industrial robot production increased by 27%. What changes in domestic and international demand do you think are driving this surge in emerging product outputs?
Well, environmental-friendly production and conception are the trendsetters on a global basis. China definitely is taking the lead in this dimension by injecting more of the innovation power into it. And also the Chinese competitive marketplace drives each of those trends.
manufacturers to really to deliver better quality through continuous improvement and also they now expand their vision to the global marketplace particularly now with the e-vehicles with the 3d printing and now even going for the generation six of communication etc so
People are also under pressure because given more of the restrictions by the United States in terms of Chinese export power, and they are devising more of their wisdom and strategy in addressing these issues through diversification of the export market. And then, you know, with more of the export earnings, they can continually to feed into their
innovation capacity and then to deliver both to the expectation of consumers at home and also abroad. Professor, from a macroeconomic perspective, how do you see the accelerated growth in industrial output over the first two months supporting China's overall GDP growth target for this year?
We are seeing a sort of divergence in different sectors because the high-tech sector is definitely seeing a growing momentum and the green energy products are also experiencing optimization of the global supply chain, whereas the mining sector is
also experiencing some difficulties and also the conventional sectors like the brick mortar shops are also experiencing a lot more difficulties at the moment. So we have to really face the right reality. Any sort of technological advancement will mean shifting of the paradigm of computation.
We believe that the Chinese businesses, particularly the private sector, are very savvy and agile to adapt to the new type of situation. And some will be squeezed out, but more will come up with better strengths and also the better adaptability to such a sort of new environment.
One last question. What key strategies and directions should China adopt to sustain its economic momentum given the complex and uncertain global economic landscape along with rising protectionist tendencies?
Well, we always say that if you do your own homework well, you do not really have to worry a lot about how harsh would be the exam. So therefore, we are facing a lot more volatility and uncertainty in the global marketplace. And given the rising protectionism and even isolation going on with the United States, if China can really
where the government works together with the market functionality in a more appropriate approach. So no one can really,
even dwindle the Chinese economic growth momentum. And more importantly, I think now, particularly after the last month's symposium of the top leader was the business leaders from the private sector. So the
I think more confidence is there to shore up to support the private sector's investment sentiment and also to boost their innovation willingness. So, and then, you know, those, you know, smart manufacturing through the new technology and amplifying its utility around the
the multiple sectors. So that's something extremely important. And also the Chinese industrial cluster is also forming more of the competitive advantage by reducing the cost, increasing the quality and providing better service. So this is the better landscape we're going to envision and we believe that it is already at the doorstep of the Chinese modernization.
Thanks, Professor, for your insightful analysis. That was Professor Liu Baocheng, Director of the Center for International Business Ethics at University of International Business and Economics. Coming up, China has announced a slew of measures to boost domestic consumption. This is World Today. Stay with us. Hi, I'm Einer Tangen, a political and economic analyst and senior fellow at the independent Taihe Institute.
World Today is news without the hype and business commentary that is informed and up to date, presenting the facts and asking incisive questions. So join us if you are someone who needs to know what is happening in China as it is happening.
China has publicized a plan for special initiatives to boost consumer spending. The plan aims to generate demand and address prominent constraints affecting consumption. The plan seeks to promote reasonable wage growth by strengthening employment support and improving the minimum wage adjustment systems.
China will push the property market to stabilize and reverse its decline and will take measures to stabilize the stock market. The country will also accelerate the development and application of new technologies and products to create new high-growth sectors.
So for more on this, my colleague Zhao Yang spoke with Liu Zhijing, senior fellow with the Chongyang Institute for Financial Studies at Renmin University of China. So first of all, how does boosting domestic consumption fit into China's broader economic vision, do you think?
I think this policy is very important for China's future. As we know, China's development in the past years - always closely related with three driving forces. For instance, the investment and the export and the consumption. But actually, the consumption side has always stayed at quite a low level. That's why -
the central government has always tried to push and stimulate the consumption power in China in order to make more contribution to China's economic growth
So I think this decision is very important strategically because this is a decisive factor, a decisive decision in order to upgrade our economic quality and also our modernization. Because without modernized and high-quality consumption,
our final goal could be hardly to be realized. Yes, and among the 30 points plan, it has put increasing the income of urban and rural residents as the first part. It's emphasized promoting the reasonable growth of wage income and employment support for the key areas. So what specific measures do you think will be the most effective way in achieving this? You know, this proposal,
has come to the first point of this 30-point plan is quite interesting, because during the last week, two sessions, many delegates and representatives have discussed warmly about this point. They put the great importance to raise the wages and income of the residents as the first driving force to stimulate the consumption.
So this is why this document has emphasized this wage income increase as the first point. I think they have several measures could be taken. First, all these industrial sections, especially for the service industry, they can increase all these salaries and incomes of these staffs regularly.
Because every year we should have twice the time and chances and opportunity to make this wages income to increase. And secondly, also to reduce the cost of the service industry and other industries.
because by reducing the cost and it is another way that to increase all this income. The third is quite important for the tax office that to further have a tax friendly policy to support
this action because only by lowering the income tax and other taxes related, that shows that the income could be really, in reality, that could be really increased and strengthened.
And the plan also pledged investment, fiscal and credit support from the government to boost the consumption. It will push for the property market to stabilize and reverse its decline and also take multiple measures to stabilize the stock market. So why are this so important to boost the domestic consumption?
You know, these two parts are the most important, but also, in my opinion, are the most sensitive and difficult parts to boost the economy. Because in the past few years, we see that some turbulences and chaos happened in the stock market and also property market.
So property market at the moment has met some difficulties and headwinds, especially the enthusiasm of the consumers are still waiting for better policy to support
-no housing buy-in. So in this way, we can see that these two sections will play an important role- -in the future, as before. So that's why the central government has always reiterated the importance- -of more policies to support property stabilization and also the stock market-
So some more measures should be followed, for instance, for the financial support to the property market and also to have more state-owned companies invest in the stock market. Of course, we should also open this market to the investors from outside. In this way, we can have multiple sources to support these two sections because only
When the stock market is booming and the property market is developing well, I think our economic
general situation will be very stabilized. And also a child care allowance system is on the cards and also those increased support for education, health care and low-income populations. So how do you view all of these efforts? We know all these points have been also discussed hotly and warmly during the two sessions.
Because these things are really closely to the livelihood of the people. When we are talking about the quality of the people's life, we have to pay great attention to this point. For instance, the child care and the allowances system and the health and education, all this is very closely concerned by the
population. If we want to have a more birth rate in the future or have a high quality birth, I think the child care allowance system is now on the agenda. Very important. And as we know, on the other side, we are coming to the aging society. So in this way, health care is becoming more important and sensitive to the people.
So in this way, all these points will be very key for the further development because the first point is that all these points could be met that the mountain will stabilize the social conditions. In this way, we can have more
opportunities and more efforts to spend and to have more investment in other areas. But these are the basic lifeline for the people. And other policies include further expanding the trade-in programs for used cars and household appliances. The government is strengthening the support for it. And during the two sessions, the government work report says there will be ultra-long treasury bonds of 300 billion yuan to support all this.
So how effective is this program in stimulating the demand for new products? As we know, the treatment program has been in practice already over one year. From the situation, we see that it has great efficiency and positives.
influence on the economic development, especially also meet the demands of the people to increase and/or to improve the quality of their life. So the treatment program is really a very good, very people-oriented policy. That's why it's warmly welcomed by the public.
So in this way, we see the government really made a great decision to have more investments, for instance, subsidies for such a trading program of old cars and old home appliances in order to promote the new manufacturing and production capacity.
By doing so, we can see more investment and more opportunities for manufacturing sections, for service sections, and also for consumption. The three areas will be together combined to be promoted.
And the policymakers also link the consumption to lifestyle improvements. For example, the measures include expanding consumption in culture, sports, and tourism. So what opportunities do you see in all these sectors, and how can they actually contribute to the overall economic growth?
Actually, in the past year or past seven weeks, we can see culture, the combination of culture, sports, tourism and other points could have really great input of the economic growth because it
All these factors are closely linked to manufacturing, to high technology development, to smarter technology, even to AI. That's why it's really a good booster or a engine to develop all
kinds of industry not only in the culture in the sport in the tourism but also closely related other actors could be also influenced so in this way we can see that more opportunities for manufacturing production line even for the new engineers
engineers, they have more chances and opportunity to produce, to design new products, advancement of equipment. So in this way, they can have a fully high efficient supply chain in order to meet that demand of the market. So the market for culture, tourism and sport are really only in China, I think in my opinion, is only on the beginning.
still have a long way to go because we have a bigger space and a room to spend more money and time. So, well, it also emphasises the need to accelerate the development of new consumption models. So with the development or advancements in technology, in AI, what kind of new consumption models do you think are emerging in China? And how do you see the outlook of AI-related spending?
Actually, in China, the AI spending or AI related spending is just at the very beginning because we know that there are many opportunities and the bigger picture for such market consumption, especially for those young people in the professional field in the manufacturing industry.
in the scholars, researchers and academic research in this field, all this scientifically research, they are interested in AI technology. But of course, in the environment protection, green development also closely related to the rescue for the relief efforts, also the AI technology.
products, AI technology could be widely implicated. So in this way, we can see there are many chances and the channels that to have more consumption in the AI. But especially for those young students, young generation, they can take the AI robust and other machinery related AI technology to improve the quality of the
jobs and also to improve the quality efficiency of the professions. So we can see a lot of things that especially in the medical care, especially in the first aid services. So we see the AI are mainly more important for the service industry, especially for education, for
Asian people and the medical care in all this field that we have different kinds of colorful consumption for AI related technologies.
That was Liu Zhijing, Senior Fellow with the Chongyang Institute for Financial Studies at Renmin University of China. More to come, China's central authorities have identified key figures of Taiwan's cyber attacks. The United States has launched large-scale airstrikes on Houthi targets in Yemen. You're listening to Road Today. We'll be back after a short break.
Welcome back to Road Today with me, Ge'enna, in Beijing. China's central security authorities say they will crack down on separatist and cyber espionage activities by Taiwan's Information, Communications and Electronic Force Command. The central authorities have identified foreign figures involved in hacking and sabotage.
Beijing warned them that independence is a dead end and vowed to punish all separatist forces. Earlier, Zhao Leji, the chair of the National People's Congress Standing Committee, has called for firm action against Taiwan's secessionist activities and external interference in the region.
He also urged efforts to safeguard national sovereignty and territorial integrity to protect the shared homeland of the Chinese nation at a symposium in Beijing marking the 20th anniversary of the enforcement of the anti-secession law. To delve into the topic, let's have Liu Kuangyu, researcher at Institute of Taiwan Studies at Chinese Academy of Social Sciences. Thanks for joining us. Hi there, this is Kuangyu.
Let's start with the most fundamental point. Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi earlier stated on the sideline of the recently concluded annual session of the National Legislature that Taiwan has never been a country and will not become one in the future. Could you help us understand the significance of this statement and the message it conveys?
Foreign Minister Wang Yi's statement, the solemn declaration of China's sovereignty and a stern warning to the separate forces for Taiwan independence on the island and both to the forces of external interference. We know that Taiwan has never been a country, so this simple and clear statement has told historical and legal facts.
that taiwan belongs to china and is part of china and also he said taiwan has never been a country and that is to would never be in country that that is to emphasize china's determination uh confidence and ability to defend our sovereignty and push for reunification and
And that attempts for so-called Taiwan independence will be crushed amidst the mammoth momentum accumulated by 1.4 billion people and thousands of years China's history pursuing reunification. And that no matter whether it's, for example, Lai Ching-Tang or external interventionist forces,
There will be never a need for any illusions on that question. So this is something that China has said and will certainly do. And I think that's what Foreign Minister Wang Yi is trying to tell the DPP authority and the whole world. Now let's delve into the highly concerning issue of the cyber attacks.
and infiltration activities against the mainland conducted by the Taiwan's Information, Communications, and Electronic Force Command. Since its establishment, this force not only engages in such malicious activities like infiltrating critical information infrastructure, sending phishing emails, and stealing account credentials, but also boasts about its so-called
So how do you interpret these actions and what does this reveal about the true nature and capabilities of such a force? I will add to three words to describe their nature. That is malicious,
inefficient and also deceptive. We know that since its establishment in 2017, the Cyber Command of Taiwan has served as a tool for Taiwan independence, employing every possible means to carry out cyber attacks and infiltration activities against China's mainland. And their actions constitute a special threat to China's sovereignty and political security and also territorial integrity.
However, their operational methods, if we look closer, are actually extremely clumsy and the capabilities they demonstrate are utterly despicable.
They frequently hire social hackers and cybersecurity companies as subcontractors to execute the network combat orders from the DPP authorities, conducting activities such as so-called stealing secrets, sabotaging systems, and spreading counterpropaganda.
And the commonly used tactics are actually very elementary measures, such as distributing phishing software or launch hacker attacks on websites and devices and so on.
Also, we found that they persist in boasting and exaggerating, claiming minor insufficient websites that they happen to control as so-called major achievements and even fabricating non-existent websites to fill the numbers. So the DPP regime, under the pretense of so-called developing asymmetric warfare capabilities, they recklessly squandered Taiwan's
competitors hard-earned money to build the cyber forces. However, behind the DPP's blind expansion of its cyber army lies widespread chaos and corruption. We see systematic failure exist at all levels with rampant power abuse, falsification, and deception. And that is our security department has revealed. Mm-hmm.
On Thursday, Lai Ching-de, or also known as William Lai, held a so-called high-level national security meeting. Following this, he delivered a speech in which he once again promoted the divisive and misleading notion that the two sides of the Taiwan Strait are not subordinate to each other. How do you assess such remarks? And what role do external forces play in fueling these remarks?
I mean, how closely is their involvement tied to such rhetoric? If we look at Le Chenda's rhetoric, actually it's a political scam. The first is trying to distorting facts. His so-called mutual non-subordination claims directly denies the one China principle using very vague and absurd language to mask Taiwan independence.
And second is trying to create so-called fear-mongering. And despite claiming to avoid conflict, Taiwan has lost actually 23 billion in foreign investment over five years due to political posturing. While infrastructure security means
real vulnerability. And his third intention, I think, is trying to sell deception. He publicly advocating peace while conducting so-called live-fire drills across the straits, reveal his true goal of resisting reunification to force
And as for the external forces, I think we can use an example. Lai Ching-te is so-called a mutual non-support nation, which is very closely to the U.S. government's attacks on the 2758 resolution of the United Nations in the last couple of years.
And that's very obvious that the U.S. will and the U.S. government are trying to give in orders or advices to the administration, to the DPP authorities. So they know what they can do and how to try to attack the one-time principle from the so-called theoretical basement. And also we know that Mark
Rubio, who is the State Secretary of the U.S. government today, is one of the most provocative members of that. There was an organization of so-called IPAC, and Rubio once was the founder of this organization that they were advocating for
in the whole world and in Taiwan of the attack on the 2758 resolution. So you can see very clearly there is a connection between the US, between Europe and Japan and with the DPP. And they are coordinating their activities, their rhetoric, their theoretical logic to attack collectively on the one China principle.
One last question, very briefly. Despite Lai and others pushing separatist Taiwan independence activities, the trend of economic and social integration between the mainland and the Taiwan region continues, right? How would you describe the current state of cross-trade people-to-people exchanges today? Yeah.
I think it's very clear that we can see that the Chinese mainland is making huge efforts trying to promote both people-to-people and also social-to-social communications, whether it's cultural, educational communications between youths and between communities, between and also of course economic exchanges.
we can see that there is huge momentum. Because we believe that this cooperation, this communication can construct what we see the basement for reunification. And also we can use it to reduce the so-called economic base for Taiwan independence. Because we know that if there is stronger tie between the two sides of the cross, two sides of the strait,
There's nothing actually the DPP or the Taiwan separatists can do to break these ties to pursue their absurd goal of so-called Taiwan independence. But of course, Lai Ching-Tien knows that very well too. So that's why we see that a couple of days ago, he's trying to use so-called 17 measures to cut off all the ties, economic ties,
cultural and educational ties between Chinese mainland and Taiwan. That is the way he's trying to pay for so-called Taiwan independence. And I think that is the most threat to current relations, exchanges, and also peace on the Taiwan Strait. Thanks, Kuan-Yi, for your insightful analysis. That was Liu Kuang-Yu, researcher at Institute of Taiwan Studies at Chinese Academy of Social Sciences.
This is World Today. The United States has launched large-scale airstrikes on Houthi targets in Yemen, citing the group's attacks on shipping in the Red Sea. The Houthi-run health ministry said the strikes killed over 50 people. The U.S. attacks marked the first large military operation in the Middle East since Donald Trump returned to the White House.
later who the rebels have claimed attacks on a U.S. aircraft carrier group twice in 24 hours. The group said the attack targeted the Harrier's Truman aircraft carrier and its accompanying warships in the Red Sea. For more on this, my colleague Zhao Ying joining us in the studio. Thanks for joining us, Zhao. Thank you. Can you walk us through what happened over the past few days and what do you believe are the key motivations behind the U.S.'s actions?
Well, on Saturday, March the 15th, the U.S. kicked off a major wave of airstrikes targeting Houthi-controlled areas in Yemen. This was a big operation. U.S. fighter jets, Air Force planes and drones hit sites across places like Sana'a, Sadr, Taiz and beyond.
And the Houthi-run health ministry says 53 people were killed, including five children and two women, with 98 injured. And residents described it as unlike anything that's seen before, with explosions shaking neighborhoods, debris everywhere, and a real toll on civilians.
And also the back and forth has heated up very fast. The Houthi leader has promised to hit U.S. ships in the Red Sea as long as these attacks continue. And as you said, they already claimed strikes on the U.S. aircraft carrier USS Harry Truman on Sunday. They call it retaliation, but the U.S. side said 11 Houthi drones were shot down and they were not getting closer to the carrier.
And as for the motivations, the US says this was all about stopping Houthi attacks on Red Sea shipping, which have been a problem since late 2023. And Trump has called it a decisive and powerful move to protect freedom of navigation.
He's been vocal about using overwhelming lethal force until those attacks stop. But of course, there's more to it. Like National Security Advisor Mike Voss also framed this as a message to Iran, which the U.S. claims is funding and arming the Houthi groups.
And Donald Trump is also warning Iran to cut ties with the Houthis or face consequences. And he also tied it to his broader push for a nuclear deal. As you mentioned, the U.S. National Security Advisor Mike Voss has threatened to hold Iran fully accountable for offending the Houthi attacks on global shipping and U.S. Navy ships. How has Iran responded to such an accusation?
Iran has pushed back hard. Iran's foreign minister, for instance, took an X on Sunday, saying the U.S. has no authority or business dictating Iranian foreign policy. And he said the era ended in 1979 with the Islamic Revolution, and he called the U.S. strikes on Yemen a violation of international law. He also urged the U.S. to stop supporting what he called Israeli genocide and terrorism in Gaza instead of pointing fingers at Iran.
And on top of that, the head of Iran's Revolutionary Guard denied any direct involvement with the Houthis. And he said Iran plays no role in setting the national or operational policies of groups like the Houthis or other groups in the region like Hezbollah or Hamas.
And he said these groups are acting on their own, not as Iranian puppets. He also warned that Iran would deliver a decisive and devastating response to any threats against it. So basically Iran's saying two things. One, we're not controlling the Houthis, so don't pin this on us. And two, if you come after us, we'll hit back hard. So that's basically what Tehran stands right now. Okay.
How might this standoff influence U.S. President Donald Trump's goal in negotiating a nuclear deal with Iran? Well, on the one hand, of course, the U.S. strikes in Yemen are being framed by Donald Trump as a warning shot to Iran. He made it clear that all options are on the table, saying that Iran could face a whole series of consequences if they do not give up their nuclear ambitions.
So Trump is seeing this as a leverage or a way to pressure Iran to the table. But of course, it could backfire, especially if you look at Iran's response. The foreign minister called the U.S. hypocritical for offering talks while bombing Yemen.
And if Iran sees this as bullying, it might make them even less willing to negotiate, especially since Donald Trump already put out of the 2015 nuclear deal once, the JCPOA. The Houthi group has tied its action to the conflict between Israel and Hamas, saying it will keep targeting Red Sea shipping until Israel lifts its blockade of Gaza. How does this connection shape the bigger picture in the region?
Yes, indeed. They're linking Yemen's conflict directly to what's happening in Gaza. And that's a big piece of the puzzle. The Houthis say they're acting in solidarity with Palestinians since October 2023 after the Israel-Hamas conflict kicked off.
They've hit over 190 vessels claiming it's about pressuring Israel and its allies. And that's forced a lot of shipping companies to detour around Africa. And that's also having a huge impact on global trade. And they are kind of seeing this way to pressure Israel over Gaza. And...
And they actually paused the attacks in January when Israel and Hamas had a truce. But when Israel blocked aid to Gaza again in March, the Houthis jumped back in and said they're not stopping until the blockade is gone. And it's turned the Red Sea in a kind of leverage point for them. Thanks, Zhao Ying. That's my colleague Zhao Ying. Coming up, OpenAI has launched an attack on its fast-rising Chinese competitor, DeepSeek. This is World Today. Stay tuned.
Hello, I am Dr. Digby James Wren, a political analyst and international relations scholar specializing in China area studies. World Today offers unmatched in-depth perspectives on China's politics, economics, business, technology and society. World Today's team of reporters and contributors provides valuable information from all of the world's major economies. I hope you can join me on World Today for the very best insights and news from China, on China, and help to build a better understanding of China's role in the world today.
You are listening to Road Today. OpenAI has launched an attack on its fast-rising Chinese competitor, DeepSeek. In a 15-page letter to the U.S. government last week, the American artificial intelligence company called DeepSeek's latest model R1 a noteworthy development, one that signals China's growing AI ambitions and underscores the tightening competition between the two countries. In
In the letter, OpenAI also criticized DeepSeek, alleging it poses significant risks and urged the U.S. government to take actions. So for more on the news, let's have Professor Qu Qiang from Minsu University of China. Thanks for joining us, Professor. Thank you.
OpenAI's recent proposal is a submission for the Trump administration's AI Action Plan Initiative, claiming that Deep Six models, including its R1 reasoning model, are insecure and state-controlled, and recommends that the U.S. government consider banning it. What do you think is OpenAI's underlying motive behind such an accusation, and is there evidence to support these claims?
Wow, I think this is just a dirty play. Basically, they have no – any proof or evidence to show that OpenAI, well, can prove that DeepSeek has all kinds of so-called backdoors or any information leak or security bug towards the government.
Well, I think the underlying motive for OpenAI is mostly come from the market competition because the rise of the deep sea actually within three months or two months directly threatened, overwhelmingly threatened OpenAI's dominance in the whole market.
R1 model of the DeepSeq is just so outstanding and to be the shout out of the 0103 model of the OpenAI. So it makes OpenAI worries that they're far, far, far leading championship in this AI marathon is actually be immediately overrun by the DeepSeq. And also secondly is because
OpenAI hope they can use the force of the Trump administration to bash down the deep sea so that they can still secure their dominant position in the whole industry.
And I think it is easier to just connect the deep sea and AI champion come from China towards the so-called national security related issues rather than just to do trash them or bad mouth about them to tell that the deep sea is probably worse in technology. So I think...
they probably spend too much of the energy trying to pat hotel to the authority rather than spending the energy or resources just to improve their own model. Professor, in his letter, OpenAI accused DeepSeek of intellectual property infringement. Yet companies like Microsoft and Amazon are reportedly using DeepSeek's models. What does this apparent contradiction reveal about the current landscape of the AI industry?
I think the IP infringement thing is basically groundless because if they're talking about the IP infringement, probably everybody are doing so. By the way, it's nonsense because we all know that Google and their team basically developed the current fundamental technology for the AI frameworks.
OpenAI, KiMi, DeepSeek, all the others, or the MidJourney, everybody are trying to develop based on the Google's basic architecture and framework. So I think this accusation is basically nonsense.
I think the reason why they're doing that is because currently the AI competition is bloody brutal. Everybody is trying their best to dominate the whole market, even though sometimes you find yourself are champions in the whole market. You probably are 10,000 miles away leading the whole market than the second place runner, but immediately
Maybe over the night, with a snap of a finger, someone else will find some other trick or find some shortcut or better technology, and then they will be before you. They're running before you, leading you without noticing you. So I think this kind of a phenomenon actually frightened OpenAI because they've been leading the whole market for at least two years.
So I think this makes the whole thing so complicated. If I cannot beat you in technology, I probably should beat you in somewhere else, like politics. So it shows that the competition in this area is getting scorching heating. But I think there's still some very large space and potential area for them to cooperate with each other. Because more and more, when you try to improve your model, you'll find out.
relying on your own resource or your own thinking pattern or your own path of development is not going to be enough i think recently the rise of the deep sea actually showed the very story because deep seek avoid to use open eyes you know development pathway so they find another way that's a reason why they can triumph of open ai so i think open and actually state open-minded
Professor, OpenAI's attack on deep-seek to many people, they believe, highlights the broader competitive landscape between China and the United States in the high-tech sector.
What does this review about the dynamics of China-U.S. competition in artificial intelligence in your opinion? And looking ahead, what areas should China's AI industry focus on to maintain its edge in the global market through investment and innovation?
Well, I think the rise up of the deep sea or the AI company from China is ultimately a very good thing because we all know the ABC of economics and a market economy is that competition is a good thing. It's competition brought you a catfish effect, a strongman.
stir your energy, it makes you and forces you to compete with the other people. You have to think harder, you have to work harder, and also for the customers, you will have more of the choices. Now that things happening with DeepSeek and also between the DeepSeek and OpenAI actually shows that. This technology competition actually stirred the whole pond, every fish.
is trying to swim harder. Now you see many more companies are trying to use DeepSeq, for example, like Microsoft, for example, like Meta. Everybody's trying to put more research into the DeepSeq model and based on that to develop their own architectures. So now we're facing a new round of
the revitalization on the new architectures and new modeling of the AI. So this is very good. And also, I think secondly, it bring down the cost. For example, DeepSeq right now are using a rather low cost to develop the large language model. I think their cost is probably one twelfths
or 1/20th of what OpenAI used to do because they have a rather new consideration in a training model. For example, OpenAI tried to use one student AI following one teacher AI. They trained very good teacher AI to monitor what the student AI are doing. This is going to be very, very expensive. Just think about how much you're going to hire a MIT or Harvard professor to monitor your student.
But for the deep sea, can they consider it a new way? They asked two students to double check or cross check each other. Maybe they're not gonna be 100% correct in one time, but after you're doing that within 1,000 or 10,000 times, you'll probably will find that students are good enough to watch each other's answers.
So it brings down the cost exponentially. And also, I think all these trends and all this synergy formed by the new catfish in the pound actually will stir a new round of innovation, and that will lead the future directions of the whole industry in the globe and help everybody to find a better and more correct path leading into a better AI.
Thanks, Professor, for your time and insights. That was Professor Qu Qiao from Mingzhu University of China. That's all the time for this edition of World Today. To listen to this episode again or to catch up on previous episodes, you can download our podcast by searching World Today. I'm Guiana in Beijing. Thank you so much for listening. Bye for now.