Will Europe's Ukraine peace plan gain US support?
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Hello and welcome to World Today, I'm Zhao Ying. Coming up, the UK and European leaders are drafting a Ukraine peace plan to present to the US. Is it just a symbolic gesture or could it pave the way for real change in a war-torn region? China's Tiangong space station is set to host its first foreign astronaut in the coming years. How significant is this?

UK Prime Minister Keir Starmer has announced a four-point plan to work with Ukraine to end the war. During a summit in London, Starmer said Britain, Ukraine, France and some other nations would form a coalition of the willing and draw up a peace plan to present to the United States.

Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky said Kyiv felt strong support and the gathering showed European unity at an extremely high level not seen for a long time. It comes two days after a fiery exchange between the Ukrainian leader and U.S. President Donald Trump in the White House. For more, we are joined by Dr. George Tsoukopoulos, Director of EU-China Programs and Senior Research Fellow at European Institute of Nice.

Colonel Zhou Bo, Senior Fellow of the Center for International Security and Strategy at Tsinghua University. Dr. Zagopoulos, let me start with you. What do you make of this four-point plan that's coming out of this London summit? And how likely do you think that will be turned into actionable results? Well, to start with, this was a summit without the participation of the United States.

and where not all EU member states participated. So practically it was a summit that could lead to the formation of a coalition of the willing

in order to promote peace in Ukraine and support Ukraine. And what we know so far is that there is a four-point plan, which is quite general in order to comment on its potential efficiency in the case of Ukraine. But I would say that the most interesting part is that the Europeans

and other countries which participated in the summit are prepared to continuously militarily support Ukraine in order to play a role toward a potential ceasefire and a potential peace agreement. But my main comment is that all this cannot happen without the participation of the United States. So it is an interesting initiative, but the final decision will be made in Washington by President Trump.

Okay, well, Colonel Joe, what are your key takeaways from the London summit on Ukraine?

well i think the european country just want to do something and to show it to the united states even without your support we can still do something because this is what they said to be an existential threat for them at the same time of course they still have hope for the united states because this is i believe is a tactical move yeah just to show the united states that uh we can do it alone but still we do not want to do it alone so eventually uh

as I said, Russia would also be involved. So this is a kind of gesture. I think there is, of course, a kind of substance in it. But given that this is a sudden so-called rupture in the transatlantic relationship, I don't believe Europe is really prepared. Europe is simply a port and is trying to find its own answer to this.

Well, Dr. Zagopoulos, we noticed that the summit emphasized a coalition of the willing to guarantee peace. I mean, what might that coalition look like in practice and which countries might be involved in this coalition?

Well, I would say that the countries which participated in the summit convened by Sir Starmer are the ones to possibly play a role in the post-war Ukrainian situation. But again, it is too early to say because the final ceasefire and possibly the final peace agreement

depend on the agreement that is expected to be reached following talks between the American and the Russian administrations.

So this is the key part. And obviously, the role of Europe and of other partners of Europe in that regard is important, but it's not crucial. So we should see this European initiative in the context of the big effort which is being made by President Trump

restore communication with President Putin and to see up to what extent this communication can lead to a result. It's not easy as both the Russian and the American delegations are suggesting, but there is an effort to be made. And Europe will play a secondary role in all that. Okay. So Colonel Joe, what kind of role do you think, do you expect this coalition of the willing to play in the peace process?

Well, definitely they can play a role, but they should not be exaggerated because coalition winning is actually not a kind of alliance. But ironically speaking, this actually is not from the allies. So what is the difference? The difference is that not all allies think alike. For example, not only Hungary would think in a different way, but there are other countries

who might think in a different way if it comes to a kind of direct support without Americans' involvement in this war. So that is a big question. So therefore, it's a kind of coalition of the willing. Whoever wishes to join this proposal can be a part of the coalition, but it remains to be seen.

how it would actually work. I believe this is something practical, but it's also a gesture. It means to actually, you know, entice the United States to come in, because without the American report, I don't believe the Europeans even are determined to fight this war on their own.

Okay, well, Dr. Zagopoulos, actually the UK and France proposed a one-month truce in the air, at sea, and our energy infrastructure. But Zelensky said it would be failure for everyone if a ceasefire were not accompanied by detailed security guarantees. What kind of guarantees was he referring to as a kind of precondition to accept a ceasefire or a peace deal?

Well, it is a very important question, and history suggests that ceasefires can be reached, but then a final peace agreement is much more difficult to be implemented and realized.

And what Ukraine is currently asking for is to make sure that its partners, most importantly the United States, will prevent an incident where Russia will be prepared to continue

the war in the medium or long term. And that's why Ukraine is asking for security guarantees. On the other hand, however, this security guarantees argument is very general in terms of what could be expected, because security guarantees, for example, might be in the form of a treaty to be signed between the United States and another country, or it can be

a general pledge by the United States. So practically, it's what the United States will decide to do in line with its own foreign policy goals, because we are looking at what the United States is doing generally and historically, even with Israel, for example, hasn't signed such an agreement. So I don't see

how the United States under President Trump will be prepared to give legal pledges to Ukraine that it will play a role in the case that a war will break out again in Ukraine following a potential ceasefire. So it's very, very complicated. And what President Trump says is that the most important thing for now is to reach the ceasefire and all other details have to follow.

Well, Colonel Zhou, actually Stalmer said that in the end, a deal will have to involve Russia, but they cannot approach this on the basis that Russia dictates the terms of any security guarantee before they even got to a deal. What are we to make of this? And how is this summit being received by the Russian side? Well, I think Prime Minister Stalmer is wrong in that Russia

uh it would not be joining at late stage you Russia should actually join that the very fastest stage that's that's the difference because when we're talking about this collective security guarantee remember Ukraine always wanted this kind of collective security guarantee because it's

The primary fear is that even if there is a kind of ceasefire, so who is going to guarantee that Russia would abide by the ceasefire and would not attack it later? So President Zelensky actually has been talking about this from time to time. And his idea is that this collective security guarantee should include Ukraine's laboring countries as well as the major powers.

But when he mentioned this in the presidential press release, he didn't mention China.

I think he has a kind of resentment about China because he believes China is pro-Russia, which is not true. But how this kind of a collective security country would look like? I don't believe that it is just a kind of a deal between the United States and Russia. This kind of guarantee actually is needed by both sides.

I have mentioned Ukraine, which is supported by the whole West, right? But how about the Russian side? Russia doesn't want to look isolated either, even if it is much stronger than Ukraine militarily. That is why Putin actually has talked about the role of China, India and Brazil in being brokers in the negotiation.

So eventually, I think it might look like something like...

collective security guarantee by all major powers, including China. So China's role is not at this stage. I think at this stage, the United States might just go ahead, Europe might go ahead, but eventually when it comes to a ceasefire, China's role will be there, most probably. Because you see, when it comes to a ceasefire, the first question is,

Where shall we stop? So where are the lines of ceasefire? Theoretically, it is to freeze the status quo, but which actually will make neither side happy, especially Russia, because Russia's Kursk is still somehow controlled by Ukrainians. And the Kursk region is an indisputable part

of Russian territory, there's no question about it. So if Russia could not take it back,

and then negotiate. Russian people might ask, okay, dear president, how come that we have even lost some of our own territory? Right? So I believe Russia will just fight and talk until, unless and until it takes back Kursk region, Russia would not be in a serious mood for any negotiations.

Well, Dr. Zagopoulos, the summit emphasized continuing military aid to Ukraine, as you mentioned in the very beginning, with Stammer pledging boots on the ground and planes in the air. How do we understand this? And is this indicating more European and military involvement? And how do you think this might be interpreted by the Russian side?

Well, to start with, the determination of Osterstammer to continuously provide military aid to Ukraine is in line with what President Trump is doing. So President Trump was asked this question by a journalist several times, and he said that the United States would continuously also provide

provide military support to Ukraine, because otherwise negotiations between the American and the Russian side would be very impossible to lead to a result. So I wouldn't say that the decision of the British prime minister is really different from what the United States is doing. And it is placed in the framework of shaping negotiations in order for a ceasefire and a peace agreement to be possibly reached.

that in the future. Now concerning the other part of the debate, which is about how a possible ceasefire could be guaranteed, then there is another debate which is very flourishing in Europe right now concerning the extent to which peacekeepers from European countries will possibly go to Ukraine in order to guarantee the ceasefire. And in that regard, possibly the

the coalition of the whaling, as Sir Starmer is suggesting, will have to play a role. But we are not there yet, because for now there is no ceasefire. But if there is a ceasefire, I expect France and the D.C. in particular to be the leaders in that regard. Now, how all this is being viewed by Russia, I would say it is being viewed very negatively, because right now the Russian side

believes that the European Union and Europe in general is not necessarily aligned with President Trump.

in supporting the possibility of a ceasefire. But at the same time, it can be understandable that the United States is taking the lead in talking to Russia, and at the same time, European partners of the United States are adopting a different approach. We should also remember that President Trump last week hosted both British Prime Minister Starman and the President of France, Macron,

in order to talk about Ukraine. So I would say that in the end, a lot depends on how American-Russian negotiations evolve and Europe's role as a export will be secondary, but important in terms of guaranteeing a potential ceasefire.

Yeah, well, Colonel Joe, actually Stalmer also announced an additional £1.6 billion of UK export finance to buy more than 5,000 air defence missiles and this comes on top of a £2.2 billion loan to provide more military aid to Ukraine backed by profits from frozen Russian assets.

What impact do you think this will have on potential peace negotiations? It matters, but in a limited way. First of all, no matter how you try to provide military assistance to Ukraine, FACS has proven that in the so-called counter-attacks.

launched by Ukraine the year before last, it actually has failed. That kind of attack was actually fully prepared. So it's an all-out attack. But if that was doomed, then basically there's no hope for Ukraine to win over Russia militarily because the fact is very simple.

Russia outnumber and outgun Ukraine. So this is the basic fact that it cannot be changed. So as I said in the beginning, it matters, but in a limited way. So even if this is a war of attrition, Russia certainly can afford more than Ukraine. So that is the ruthless effect.

Well, Dr. Zagopoulos, this summit comes two days after Zelenskyy-Trump clashed at the White House. But Stommer said the U.S. isn't an unreliable ally. What do you make of his comments? And what does this tell us about the transatlantic cooperation on this Ukrainian issue?

Well, to start with, from a Ukrainian perspective, it is understandable that the United States is by far the most important ally in the conflict which is going on. And although right now President Trump...

is following a different policy from one of his predecessors, Joe Biden. Still, the United States right now has the upper hand in this conflict and is the country that can play a crucial role toward ceasefire because it is talking to Russia. So the United States right now is talking to Russia, and obviously this is the key to a potential solution to the problem.

So even if Ukraine does not necessarily agree with the approach of President Trump, it has no other choice but to forge ties with the United States because the United States is the actor that will...

conversations with russian with ukraine toward a potential ceasefire at the same time if we are looking at things from an american approach it is important to suggest that although president trump does not really value the role of the european union in the world it's clear it's evident also from his previous administration

uh... however you feel at all of this that you guys so we've got at different european countries like brown and uh... and equally and also the united kingdom so at that moment that from the moment that they do it and they you are currently not experience very uh... good relations that the united they do not collaborate with the european at partners so we've been the complex i would think that the possibility

disagreements could be placed under control in order for a potential solution in Ukraine to be found. But again, the solution right now is in the hands of President Trump, not in the hands of the European partners of the United States.

Okay, so Colonel Zhou, would you agree that it is now in the hands of Donald Trump to decide whether this can achieve a peace deal? And do you believe that the Trump administration is playing a positive role in this peace process? Because Stammer actually said that Europe must do the heavy lifting. Well, I always argue that actually this is a war between Russia and US-led NATO.

So, yes, Washington is holding the key. Donald Trump is holding the key. Because if we look at the history, let's go a bit back. In fact, from Soviet time to Russian time, that means from a Soviet leader, Mikhail Gorbachev, down to Boris Yeltsin and down to President Putin, what do they have in common?

they have something in common, that is they all opposed to this kind of NATO expansion.

So I think that President Putin is different in that he's the man who said enough is enough because they basically believe Russian people and the Ukrainian people are just the one people. That is what he said. It could be wrong, but this is what he said. And he certainly is not the only person who thinks like that. And once read with great interest that even the

Russian dissident Lavani sort of like President Putin on this issue. So for Russia, this is not a war with Ukraine. This is a war against the whole West.

This is also what Putin has argued. So the United States is definitely behind the whole West. Therefore, I think it is most useful for Putin to have a direct talk with President Trump. And President Trump, the question is, to what extent is he really a game changer?

He's certainly the president of the most powerful country on earth. But at the same time, I think if he went too far, there could be a kind of force pulling him back. I mean, the deep state or simply the Democrats, right? And the point is, it looks like that he's going to make some concessions.

in favor of Russia. But the question, of course, is then how Europe might agree to this. So all these kind of questions so far are vexed up. It's difficult for us to see the end result. But of course, no world will last forever. And still, Mr. Trump is in the best position to make a deal.

Okay, well, Dr. Zagopoulos, how might Trump's current attitude towards Ukraine, especially after his confrontation with Zelensky, influence Ukraine's calculations or expectations in potential peace negotiations with Russia? Because, I mean, Zelensky actually said he saw no need to make amends for this row with Donald Trump, adding that this relationship will continue because this is more than a relationship in one moment. How do you look at this?

Well, it is important to understand what President Trump is seeking to achieve. And in that regard, what the American president is attempting to do is to reach a ceasefire in order to stop the war. And he links the potential ceasefire to the future of economic collaboration at first between the United States and Ukraine. And he believes that

Such an economic collaboration will perhaps function as a basis for a permanent peace agreement between Ukraine and Russia. And at the same time, the dilemma for Ukraine is this, that although it is not prepared right now, according to President Zelensky, to accept Ukraine,

a ceasefire without security guarantees, as the president is suggesting. If no ceasefire is reached, this means that the war will continue. And if the war will continue, it means that possibly Ukraine will suffer additional losses in human life, as is also the case with Russia. So this is a dilemma, and that's why wars are always terrible in terms of what...

could follow after the battlefield, after fights in the battlefield. So right now, Ukraine finds itself in a very difficult position because, on the one hand, it either has to accept the American terms and stop the war under terms which are not necessarily

favorable, at least in comparison to how the situation looked like three years ago, or it will need to continuously fight against Russia, which obviously will be a very, very bad thing for Ukrainian people. So in that regard, the relationship between Ukraine and the United States will be central to a potential ceasefire or a potential peace agreement following the ceasefire that President Trump seeks to achieve.

Well, thank you, Dr. George Tsgopoulos, Director of EU-China Programs and Senior Research Fellow at European Institute of Nice, and Colonel Jobo, Senior Fellow of the Center for International Security and Strategy at Tsinghua University. You're listening to World Today. Stay with us.

You're listening to World Today, I'm Zhao Ying. Israel has announced that it was immediately halting the entry of all goods and humanitarian aid into Gaza. The move is aimed at forcing Hamas into accepting a temporary extension of the ceasefire in the war. The initial six-week phase of the original deal between Israel and Hamas expired on Saturday.

The next phase of the deal called for a full withdrawal of Israeli troops from Gaza and a commitment to a permanent ceasefire in return for the release of all the remaining Israeli hostages. Instead, before announcing the aid stoppage, Israel proposed a seven-week extension of the temporary ceasefire with new conditions for hostage release. Hamas has rejected the Israeli conditions, describing the hard-in-aid as cheap blackmail and a blatant abandoning of the agreement.

Joining us now in the studio is my colleague Ding Heng. Thanks for being here. Hello, Zhao Yan. So, first of all, what do you make of Israel's formulation to extend Phase 1 of the Gaza ceasefire? Well, the move by Israel here will certainly disrupt the existing agreed-upon framework for negotiating an end to the war, especially a permanent end to the conflict. It will also, I think, put...

the fate of the remaining hostages, the Israeli hostages in Gaza, into some kind of untrotted territory. The Israeli government has been insistent that the war in Gaza cannot end unless Hamas is disarmed and removed from power there. But those are terms largely rejected by Hamas.

This is one thorny issue which might have played a role in terms of prompting the Israeli side to propose an extension of the phase one deal rather than immediately looking at the negotiation for the next phase.

Israel does not want to withdraw troops from Gaza because under the existing ceasefire deal, Israel is by now to have begun removing this withdrawing troops process from the Philadelphia corridor, which is a strategic trip of a land along Gaza's border with Egypt.

was the Egyptian territory. No such movement militarily has occurred at this point. Also, we have seen the testimonies by some recently released Israeli hostages describing their situation of internment in Gaza, which has shocked many Israelis. That's why

The families of those hostages who are still in Gaza have been pleading for their government to quickly put an end to the war and bring their family members back home all at once, rather than in stages, rather than in phases. Probably these calls have created additional pressure for the Israeli government,

Is it a surprise that Hamas has immediately rejected Israel's new offer?

It's no surprise that Hamas does not accept Israel's new offer without further negotiations because the proposal here allows Israelis to get hostages back without making reciprocal commitments. So from the Hamas perspective, I guess Israel wants to recover the remaining hostages while at the same time retaining the possibility of resuming the war.

So for Hamas, this is a life and death issue. This is a survival issue.

Though the initial phase of the ceasefire deal so far has been punctured by mutual acquisition of violation, that's undeniable, but ultimately it has seen some concrete temporary cessation in the fighting. Now Israel has raised the specter of resuming fighting in the territory, and this is alarming and unacceptable to Hamas.

Well, this rule attributed the new proposal to the work of the U.S. envoy to the region, Steve Witkoff. What do you think this tells us about the Trump administration's approach to ceasefire in Gaza? Well, this indicates that the Trump administration is absolutely siding with the Israeli side on this issue.

Earlier, we have heard very crazy ideas from Trump himself surrounding, for example, the U.S. takeover of Gaza and forced population relocation out of the territory, etc. Those crazy ideas have been globally condemned as a proposal for ethnic change.

cleansing. Now it seems Trump has walked back a little bit on his line here. Last week when he was asked by media outlets on this particular question, his answer was actually quite vague. He only said that there were some

"pretty good ongoing negotiations and we will see what's going to happen." That being said, his softened tone, rhetoric here does now change this very fundamental that the United States under Donald Trump is siding with the Israel, especially the Israeli far right on the Israel-Palestine conflict.

Well, the initial six-week phase of the original agreement between Israel and Hamas allowed for a significant increase of aid into Gaza. Now, with Israel immediately halting the flow of aid, what does that mean to the civilians in Gaza?

Well, the halt on goods and aid is likely to worsen conditions for the roughly 2 million inhabitants in the Gaza Strip. There is no question about that. Previously, for example, last year, we saw the United Nations and other aid organizations time and time again warning about a looming famine in Gaza.

While goods are becoming more available now in the Strip because of the initial phase of the deal since January the 19th, many Gazians actually still...

cannot afford those more available goods and many actually continue to depend on for example humanitarian aid, humanitarian assistance. Now the halting of aid means that some of those essential goods like vegetables, fruits, milk will once again become less available and the prices will once again skyrocket.

And Palestinians in Gaza will struggle to celebrate the holy month of Ramadan, which we know began over the past weekend. Okay, thank you, Ding Heng. You're listening to World Today. Stay with us.

Welcome back. You're listening to World Today. I'm Zhao Ying. China's Caixin manufacturing PMI peaked at 50.8 in February, marking the highest point in three months. The index shows steady expansion in the country's manufacturing sector.

Readings above 50 indicate expansion. This private survey reading on Monday followed the official manufacturing PMI released on Saturday. The official PMI for the manufacturing sector was 50.2 in February, which also showed that China's factory activity expanded at its fastest pace since November.

China's annual sessions of the top legislature and political advisory body, known as the Two Sessions, are held this week, with the economy as a central topic. With more, my colleague Zhao Yang spoke with Dr. Zhou Mi, senior research fellow with the Chinese Academy of International Trade and Economic Cooperation.

Dr. Zhou Mi, thank you very much for joining us. The February data show that China's three major indicators are all in the expansion range. So what do you think are the main factors behind this bounce back? And do you think China's new quality productive forces are key drivers for the economy right now?

We know that PMIs are really important indicators that shows the manufacturing's willingness, whether they want to expand their production or trying to improve their inventories or not. So the 50% is a really important data, I mean, all the indicators we can judge from the different trends. Well, if you are looking at the data, I think that the Chinese manufacturing are very strong in producing better and more products.

this year, I mean for the February, because there are several factors as you asked. The first one, I think that is coming from the market demands. We can find that data of last year,

I mean, for the international trade is pretty good. Like for China, the export has increased steadily and not only in some of our neighboring countries, we have become the largest or the main trading partners of more than 150 countries in the world.

And I think that a lot of countries are trying to import the products including the new energy vehicles, some of the machineries and other manufacturing products from China. So the markets are giving more, I mean, the confidence for the manufacturing here in China. And the second is because for this year, the Spring Festival, it's just around the last part of January and the earlier part of the February.

producers having more strength and time to prepare for the better allocation of the resources. And the third one is also very important. That is because of the policies of the government are giving more confidence to the factories here in China, and they are going to do more to try to develop more things. I think that no matter from the innovation products or some of other things like for the traditional ones, Chinese

Companies are really capable of doing all these areas and they are trying to discover better abilities in the more innovative products and also the methods. And some of the labor productivity growth is attributable to the investment in high-tech manufacturing, as you mentioned. So with China's focus on the new quality productive forces, how do you see the role of innovation in driving China's economic growth?

Well, the innovations are just a very broad idea. I think it's going to keep people always thinking what we are going to do. Like for the manufacturers, maybe in the past they are trying to improve their capital input and they are trying to have a better and larger land and to include more people.

but now they are thinking it differently. They're trying to introduce knowledge and also trying to cooperate with their counterparties in the supply chains. So in my understanding, the innovation is really one of the key areas for the enterprises to be different from each other. They want to be special. They want to provide the different products and services to the customers to benefit from better performance.

So I would say that is not only about the brand new innovation. Maybe it is also based on some kind of improvement on the efficiency and also the performance in different fields that give peoples of China more confidence if they are going to do that. I think that is also, you know, very welcoming.

in the world and many countries are also enjoying the benefits of Chinese companies doing that. And the role of innovation, as you mentioned, is more important than ever, especially after the deep sea sort of shake up the global landscape of AI modeling and AI application. So Dr. Zhoumi, so what's your assessment of China's AI ecosystem? Is China's economic expansion more efficiency driven with the development of AI and robotics?

Well, AI is very impressive, especially in the recent months. We see that deep-seekers are really very, I mean, it's not only for Chinese economy. A lot of experts and also the technicians in the world are amazing of that kind of technology. Because it's not only advancing, but also a little bit, I mean, to give the different people the open shot.

So the AI system, I mean, the ecosystem is coming from a lot of contribution by the enterprises, no matter bigger one or the small and the medium sized one. And in China, I think that most of the local governments are really curious about the

the application of using AI system. As the DeepSeq was launched, you can find that local governments like in Shenzhen, they have already evolved the use of the DeepSeq in their system and we can also see the ecosystems efficiency are improved a lot. So the efficiency, I think it's really very important for the market to respond. So the AI is not only just to provide us with a better efficiency, but also trying to expand the areas that we can touch.

So no matter from the traditional manufacturing efficiency of improved production and to the services sectors and also the ways that we collect

the data and information also deal with them. I think from all these areas, China is trying not to keep up ourselves in just the very limited areas. We are going to support the innovation in different fields and we also want to welcome the investment from other countries to enjoy such a big cake of the market.

We know that China is one of the largest consumer markets in the world. It's one of the largest markets when it comes to the consumption of goods and also the retail sale of services in this country. That also grew by 6.2% last year. So how do you see the growth potential of China's service sector?

The service is obviously to be found like the tourism and also a lot of things to do with education. People are trying to make them better, I mean, fit for the AI time. So they are trying to learn more. So actually, the services are wide covered. I can find that, you know, in Beijing, in Shanghai, they have their special advantages like in the transportation, telecommunication or something to do with the finance.

So the services are really a potential for not only develop themselves but also to support the manufacturing. I believe that is also one of the key areas because it will consume less energy and will have less impact on the environment. And what do you expect in terms of how policymakers will further support the domestic demand and consumption for this year?

Yeah, I think that is not just for this year. If you are looking at the policy that we have three years plans to support the consumption by several aspects. The first one is trying to give a more efficient supply of the consumption so the producers are better pushed or encouraged to have a better quality products for the consumers. And the second is trying to keep the orders

improved because we are going to make the consumers feel confident if they are going to buy something they can get repaid and order some things that produced not so good will be

And the third one, I think that will create more scenarios for the consumers to buy their goods. So it's not just a part of the supply chains. In the life cycle of the products, we should try not just to care about the consumption part. We are going to even improve the efficiency of the recycle of those products. And that is definitely good and important for the environment protection.

And for foreign direct investment, China removed all restrictions on foreign investment in the manufacturing sector last year. So what effect has it already had on our economy? I think that first of all, that the foreign investors have more confidence if they are coming here to invest here because China is really a big market. So we have a different kind of manufacturers.

the companies are going to put more efforts in China. Like we see, several of the big producers have already started to invest in China, in Shanghai and in other areas to benefit from the fully opening of the manufacturing. And the second, I think that the global supply chain and industrial chains are

under construction. So the FDIs are going to make the better use of China's local source to support their abilities in the global competition. And we are seeing a lot of small and medium-sized enterprises enter China, and the numbers are increased a lot. And the third one, I think it's not only from their ideas, but also from China's local companies. The manufacturers in China are getting more pressures, so they are going to improve their self-

better by the introduction of the artificial intelligence technology and also trying to improve the efficiency accordingly. So it's a very good thing, even for the Chinese manufacturing, because they have a better position to utilize the resources worldwide. That is Dr. Zhou Mi, Senior Research Fellow with the Chinese Academy of International Trade and Economic Cooperation, speaking with my colleague Zhao Yang. You're listening to World Today. Stay with us.

Welcome back. This is World Today. I'm Zhao Ying. China's space station will welcome its first foreign astronaut in the next few years. China and Pakistan signed a cooperation agreement in Islamabad on the selection and training of astronauts. The two countries will spend about a year selecting the Pakistani astronauts, who will be trained in China before joining Chinese counterparts on the Tiangong space station for short-term missions.

For more, we are joined by Jiang Fan, Associate Professor of Astronomy, Department of Beijing Normal University. Professor Jiang, thanks for joining us. Hello. So actually this marks the very first step of China selecting and training foreign astronauts to participate in China's space station flight missions. How significant is this? Right. So first of all, it signifies the fact that the Chinese space station is now entering into a very mature stage.

So the space station's basic configuration, the shape is in place, the equipment, they're almost all there. All the procedures have been streamlined and the efficiency increased. So everything has been fixed to a level where you can begin to do sort of odd

out of ordinary missions, for example, training foreign astronauts. And also that's from the operational side of things, from the intention side of things. This is making good on the promise to open up the Chinese space station as an international good that will serve humanity in general.

Obviously, it also benefits China because the scientific expertise that foreign scientists bring in. There's also the sharing of cost of training the astronauts. But generally, there's a philosophy in China that

You know, I feel like the businesses in China, they tend to bring up their other people together. So they form a community that helps each other. Everybody gets better in the end. So it's not relative wealth as compared to others that matters. It's the absolute level. And when the water rises, it raises all boats. That's kind of the general philosophy side of things.

Right. As you said, this is the opening up that has long been promised by China. But why do you think Pakistan is chosen as the first partner for Tenggo? So in a way, that's always...

I think it's kind of understood because the Pakistan has been involved quite actively in China's man program because the landing when the interest atmosphere it will spend a lot of time or Pakistan and they've always been very helpful in monitoring the Reentry and that's that's been really helpful and for example in 2022

The Pakistan delegation was the first to visit China's simulator for the space station. So that's an indication of things to come. So basically there's the reciprocity that just has to happen. So Pakistan will get priority. And also there's the maturity of the collaboration between Pakistan and China. So Pakistan...

especially in terms of lunar project, no less. So Chang'e 6 had a Pakistani CubeSat that took pictures of the moon and Chang'e 8 would take a Pakistani rover onto the moon. And Pakistan is also signed on to the International Lunar Research Station project that China's spearheading. So all of this collaboration through many years build up trust, build up

a working mechanism for people to exchange information. And that makes Pakistan a natural choice. Okay, so how will China adapt its training program, which is originally designed for Chinese taikonauts to kind of prepare a Pakistani astronaut for Tiangong systems?

Right, so according to the press release, there will be a year's time for the selection of the astronaut. That will happen mostly on the Pakistani side. And then once that happens, the Pakistani astronaut will join the Chinese astronaut's training program. And it goes through the same rigorous training. Likely it was the fourth batch of astronauts, the Chinese astronauts who were selected for

in August last year. So they'll probably train together and then

the fourth generation has already had in mind the possible future of foreign sort of peers, because especially with astronauts chosen from Hong Kong and Macau administrative regions, special administrative reasons, they had English and Portuguese language skills being specified on the requirements. So obviously the language barrier has already been taken into account.

Yeah, well, Pakistan has never sent an astronaut into orbit before. So how might this mission boost its space capabilities and its scientific community?

First of all, I think it would inspire. One thing that comes with seeing humans in space, seeing somebody who looks just like you and speaks your language, it's inspiring for young people. So if you can get young, talented people in Pakistan into the space,

to get interested in space adventures, then that would set the basic foundation for the Pakistani space program. And also, if you look at the involvement in the lunar program, they're heavily involved

very closely integrated into that program. So in the future, this would be the first step, you know, training astronauts will be useful for the lunar program as well. And then I fully expect there to be continued collaboration and so they basically become an equal and important partner in a major space adventure about

they'll not just raise their capabilities, they'll just leapfrog to the first tier. Okay, but what kind of scientific experiments or tasks might the Pakistani astronaut perform during their short stay on Tiangong? Right, so each rotation of the three astronauts going up there, they would take

take part in something like 90 different experiments. So the Pakistani astronauts will probably carry a similar load of experiments. But I think

this is not just a one-off, this is not just a publicity stunt, this is actually training a person to spearhead an entire Pakistani astronaut program. So I think

the most important thing he will be up there doing will be to learn in place the vital functions and the procedures that will be needed for operating a space station like that. And then also have some firsthand experience of going into space and, you know, in terms of physiology and psychology and pass that information on to other generations of future Pakistani astronauts.

Okay, thank you, Dr. Zhang Fan, Associate Professor of Astronomy Department of Beijing Normal University. And that's all the time we have for this edition of World Today. To listen to this episode again or to catch up on previous episodes, you can download our podcast by searching World Today. And for further discussion, you can follow us on X at CGTN Radio. I'm Zhao Ying. Thank you so much for listening. Bye for now.

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