Ep505 - James Franco | The Disaster Artist
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Welcome to the Talks at Google podcast, where great minds meet. I'm James, bringing you this week's episode with actor James Franco. Talks at Google brings the world's most influential thinkers, creators, makers, and doers all to one place. Every episode is taken from a video that could be seen at youtube.com forward slash talks at Google.

James Franco visits Google to discuss writing, directing, producing, and starring in his film The Disaster Artist. The movie is based on Greg Sestero's best-selling tell-all book about the making of Tommy Wiseau's cult classic disaster piece The Room, often referred to as the greatest bad movie ever made.

In the film, Tommy Wiseau and Greg Sestero become friends after meeting each other in an acting class in San Francisco. Hoping to achieve Hollywood stardom, Sestero moves to Los Angeles and signs on to appear in Wiseau's project. Financed with his own money, Wiseau writes, directs, and stars In the Room, a critically maligned movie that becomes a cult classic. The film also stars Dave Franco, Seth Rogen, and Zac Efron.

Originally published in December of 2017, here is James Franco, the disaster artist. Wow, so good to be here. I grew up in Palo Alto long before Google existed. And then at Palo Alto High, I was in class. It was the same year as Lisa and Brenda Jobs, Steve Jobs' daughter. And we were on the newspaper together, the Campanile.

And my teacher, Esther Wojcicki-- we called her Waj-- then became the mother-in-law of Sergey Brin. So my teacher is like the mother-in-law of all of you. Or the ex-mother-- ex-mother-in-law. But I hear from the "New York Times" article that they're all good. They go to the Met Ball together still and all that. Well, welcome James Franco to Google.

I'm Kevin Vaughn with Talks at Google, and we'll get right into it. So thanks for being here. So your new film, The Disaster Artist, which is based on Tommy Wiseau's weird film, The Room. Yes. It's the making of it. That's an understatement, yeah. Yes. The Room is a cultural, just classic cult hit. It's really weird. When did you first see The Room? I was really late to The Room. It's been out for 14 and a half years now.

The story is he made it, came out in 2003. He intended it to be this great drama. He wrote on the poster, Tennessee Williams level drama, which kind of shows what he was aiming for. It cost $6 million of his own money. Where he got it is a big mystery. It's so weird. Oh, Lorena, do you have my phone?

Lorena and I were jogging this morning, just when we arrived here. We didn't go, we just like went in one direction. Just aimless sort of started at the Ritz and jogged all the way down to Beach Street. And he would always, Tommy would always say, "Well, I made my $6 million from selling Levi's jeans." And he actually got into the Screen Actors Guild by financing his own commercial.

for his denim jeans outlet called Street Fashions. And I know it 'cause we recreated it in the Disaster Artist, but we ended up not using it, but he,

You can find it online. Just Google it. He is wearing like a Renaissance hat and he's quoting Hamlet. He's like, to be or not to be, that is the question. Come to Street Fashions and get Levi's jeans, 555 B Street. And Lorena and I jogged and all of a sudden, we just went in a straight line. All of a sudden I look up

and there's this, this is just like three hours ago. I look up and there's this poster of him in the room. I'm like, oh look, what a great sign. And then I realized, oh my gosh, it was like 555 Beach Street. But we couldn't find the thing. All we could find is this poster and this big Levi's jeans thing. Anyway, yeah, so sorry, you asked me a whole other question. - No, no, no, that's just my interest. - You're gonna find out, I just ramble.

It cost $6 million. It made $1,800 its first run. People from the premiere on were laughing at it. And unlike other directors that have these movies that have become cult hits because they're so bad or because people like to laugh at them, like Troll 2, Tommy had the wherewithal to kind of capitalize on that and rewrite history. So where he was completely...

oblivious to how he was coming off to other people, as soon as people started laughing at the movie, he just became a maestro. Like as...

much as he lacked self-awareness before, he then was like a Kardashian with the way he could capitalize on publicity. And he put it in one theater in LA, the Sense F5, and it played at midnight, and it just sort of caught on with USC film students and then built from there. He paid, another bit of Tommy insanity is he paid for, or maybe genius, he paid for this billboard on Highland,

It was his face, and it was that same image with the lazy eyelid. And it said "The Room," and then there was a phone number. And he kept it up for five years. That's hundreds of dollars, thousands of dollars right there. And I must have driven past it hundreds of times and just thought it's a cult. I ran into a friend the other day. He's like, oh yeah, that thing. I thought it was a wanted poster or something.

So that's all I knew of the room for years and years. And then four years ago, the book came out that was written by one of the other actors, Greg Sestero, who my brother plays in the movie, and this really great journalist, Tom Bissell. And I was just blown away. It was just, you know, it was... I love Hollywood stories, and this was unlike any other. And just because it was so bizarro on the surface, but...

At the same time, it was, you know, it was the story of anyone, you know, with a dream. You know, the story of, I'm sure, the, you know, Sergei's story. I mean, the passion behind it. I'm sure, you know, they were, you know, at one point, people were like, why Google? What is that thing? You know what I mean? Like, and here he was, like anyone, with a dream. And, yeah.

He made it happen, albeit very ironically, but it still had sort of the underpinnings of a kind of Hollywood success story. - Yeah, and it was interesting watching the movie and then coming out of it and thinking about it, it's like, he came into it thinking this is gonna be the best movie ever made, but it was the worst movie.

Which made it the best movie and then you're making a movie. Yeah, it's a phenomenal film about a terrible film That's a really good film like it's very confusing how it kind of all come together I'm like it kind of blows your mind Seth's would say yeah very James Franco And I'm the only one that like came to the room through the book that's also very James Franco but

Yes, it was bizarre. We were talking about it over the past month. We couldn't come up with another example of a movie where...

the director of the movie was acting in it, playing a director who's acting in his own movie and then sort of stayed in character while he was directing. That was my next question. So you did stay in character while you're directing. Yes. But like, there's this great documentary out now, um, on Netflix called, uh, Jim and Andy and it's Andy Kaufman or it's Jim Carrey when he was playing Andy Kaufman. And, um,

It's an interview from recently with Jim, but it's also footage from 20 years ago when he was doing the movie. And he goes so far into Andy Kaufman and his alter ego, Tony Clifton, that Jim disappears. And Milos Forman, one of the greatest directors ever, who did Cuckoo's Nest and Amadeus, is like cowed by...

Like this Tony Clifton character who's like, you know, really gruff, kind of lounge singer type. And it's like, you can't talk to Jim. Like you see people like, hey, Jim, that was great today. And he's like, no, no, no, I'm Andy. I'm Andy, you know? And going so far that like, you know, ambulance was called and, you know, just like,

It's all this stuff going on behind the scenes that doesn't even make it into Man on the Moon. It's as if he was, like, doing all this stuff for this documentary 20 years later. Like, I didn't do that. You didn't do that. You know what I mean? You were in character to make the voice. I directed as James. It was just filtered through the funny voice and all the prosthetics. But, like, Tommy's direction was absurd. Like, we read it, you know, Greg would tell us, like, when he was auditioning people, he'd be like, okay, uh.

your sister lesbian and she just died go yay or no or like that's literally what he said so like i wasn't doing that you know what i mean i didn't go that far it was just sort of the voice i got you so can you describe your first meeting with tommy because he's very good direction your first meeting with tommy what was that like

- When did you first meet him? So you saw the book, right? You read the book, you were interested in the room, so then you, at what stage? - Tommy, here's the deal. I've played, I think about eight or nine characters that are based on real people. They all have their own requirements. I played James Dean, who was one of Tommy's heroes. I played Aaron Ralston, who in 127 Hours, who got trapped by the rock and cut his arm off.

And those have different requirements. James Dean, because he was an actor, people can go to see his movies and see what he looked like and moved, how he moved and how he sounded. The same with Tommy, right? But with Aaron Ralston, that's not the case. Nobody, you know, yeah, you can go online and look him up, but his character, the...

Priority with that character was capturing, with Aaron Ralston, was capturing an authentic experience to take the audience on a ride of really going through that. With James Dean and Tommy, half of the preparation is getting down all the physical behavior and all that, and then trying to sort of

dig up what's going on underneath. Now Tommy's a particular kind of mystery where he holds onto this facade, it's a very thinly veiled facade where you say he sound like this and he's saying from New Orleans and like nobody believes him. Last night I was on Jimmy Kimmel with Tommy which was, the universe should have just exploded right there. The fact that he was on there but

He strangely, for the first time maybe in his entire life, admitted, and he just tried to slip it in. My brain was exploding. Jimmy was like, where are you from, Tom? He was like, well, I came from Europe and then I go to New Orleans. I was like, wait, what? You're admitting it? And you never heard that before that. He never would say that. He had written reviews. Not only did he say when the movie came out, like,

Tennessee William level drama. He wrote these fake reviews from like 90210 Beverly Hills film review or whatever. Tommy Wiseau, the raging Cajun delivers a powerful thriller or something. And so no, he had never said anything like that before. Anyway, I had to kind of get underneath and figure out

Some of you know what maybe I could I could understand okay He's from Eastern Europe, and you know I could understand get some of that stuff I didn't need that from Tommy, but I couldn't go to Tommy Now and ask him you know what was motivating you when you're making the room because he is the master rewriter of history and now he claims that he intended the room to be a comedy and

So, you know, when and in fact, he was incredibly sincere when he made it. Right. So, you know, he says about the room now, you know,

The room is a safe place. You can laugh. You can cry. Do whatever you like. Just don't hurt yourself. So in that way, he can still take credit for being a comedy, but also that he's still greatest director around. So I couldn't go to him as a source. But what I had was he would drive around in his car. And I know he was in his car because I have...

the recordings, I can hear him like doing the turn signal and everything like, and he would talk to himself. This is the 90s. So it was like a mini tape recorder. He just talked to himself about all of his feelings about, you know, acting classes and being mistreated by, you know, acting teacher. And then, and it was amazing. It was like the guy's journal, audio book version, you know what I mean? And like, I could see how he would pump himself up

for the room. Like there was like one nugget in particular, like he'd be like, "Oh, this acting teacher, he don't, "he treat me like different than all the other students "and whatever, he want me to do, "he tell me to do scene in French, why he say that?" And then one time he sits on there and Tommy knows I have the tapes, he calls them the secret tapes, James, I know you have secret tapes. And he's like,

Yeah, and I say to myself, Pierre. And he called himself Pierre. And then on the tape, as if somebody else was going to listen to him someday. This is like 20 years ago, five years before he made The Room. So I say to myself, Pierre. And then he goes, yeah, well, sometimes I call myself Pierre. And then he goes...

He goes, teacher, treat me different. But you know what? I think he just sensed my power, and he intimidated. And so he'd do that. Whatever, I'd show him. Maybe I'd do my own movie, or maybe I'd start a rock band, and I'd make a rock album or something. One or the other. Yeah, exactly. And you could tell from the way he dresses, like pirate vampire, you know, Alice Cooper roadie or something. But yeah.

But there, right there, it was like that is the story of the room in a nutshell where it was like people telling him he's not going to make it, people telling him he's no good, and then turning around, pumping himself up, and saying, I will show them. And he sort of did. Like, get the lights on. It could have gone one or two directions. What's so bizarre is, I mean, I shouldn't talk about him because there are a lot of weird people that came out of the room.

But other people have come-- like when "The Room" became a cult hit for being so bad,

Other people came out of the woodwork and tried to take credit for it. And like, no, I'm the director of the room. No, I'm the director. And it's like, this isn't The Godfather. You know what I mean? Only this could come from top. Yeah, exactly. So you have these tapes. You have the book. You have access to, obviously, him and Greg. When you're talking to them and you're starting to develop the film and you're starting to write it and produce it and come up with it,

How much of it is in embellishment? How much of it was-- when you're trying to craft a story, you obviously have to make it into a two-hour film. DANNY RIMER: Yeah. We always knew from the beginning-- I didn't tell you I'm meeting Tommy. I can tell you that story in a second. But basically, I didn't go to him until later.

I'll get to your question. But he did have a scene in the film, and if you wait till the end of the credits, it's in there. That was in his contract. That was like the big thing. You're a Marvel post-credits film. I'll tell you about that. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But the book had this amazing tone where...

What could have been a series of just anecdotes about how ridiculous the making of that movie was turned out to be a very moving story about dreamers, as I was saying. And so that was always our approach. And so we didn't hire comedy writers. We hired Scott Neustadter and Mike Weber, who had done "500 Days of Summer" and "The Fault in Our Stars."

just basically were so good at capturing relationships and also adapting books. They were really good at that.

And we were lucky to get them, like "Fault of Our Stars" had just like beat the Tom Cruise movie at the box office that weekend. And they were like hot as hell. But they really liked the story. So that's sort of where it started. And that was always our approach. And we always, from all the script readings and rewrites and everything, we always hammered home like,

we need to create sympathetic characters. This needs to be about the relationship. This needs to be a universal story, even though

Tommy is unlike any other human that's ever existed. Well, you guys balance it so well. People who saw the film, you'll see, and I think there's, Mel Brooks had said something when he was making Young Frankenstein. I just watched that on the plane. It's so phenomenal. I love, it's one of my favorite films and I love Mel Brooks. And one of the things he said, he goes, if you're going to parody something, are you going to make

something kind of behind the scenes, you really have to, and this is a direct quote, but this is kind of the essence of what he was saying, was you really have to be passionate about the subject. And you have to be, you don't want to make fun of it. You just want to really keep, find the story. And because he didn't make fun of Frankenstein's story. He was pregnant, but he really, really cared about it, right? And he was able to make and find the heart there and stuff. And that's kind of what you did.

In a way, I mean, yeah. We can talk about Young Frankenstein. Gene Wilder is so amazing. I think also Gene is a huge part of that because he's got this weird uncanniness about him where you just want to laugh, but he's also taking it so seriously. He's a little scary, too, and that kind of thing. And, yeah, with Tommy, like, we didn't embellish. You know, we...

We even considered putting footage of the real Tommy at the beginning of the film because anybody that hadn't seen the room might see me come on screen and be like, yeah, Franco, wow, big swing there, bro. A little over the top. But tell them how you opened the film because that was really, really smart for people who have not seen the film. With the talking heads, yeah, yeah.

- Right. - It's like J.J. Abrams and a whole bunch of-- - Yeah, Keegan-Michael Key and Denny McBride. Yeah, a lot of real actors talking about their experience of watching The Room. And that was a way to sort of say, hey, this is real.

um real people like this and like yeah it's funny having jj abrams in there was like because there's a lot of comedians that actually are huge fans of the room but then having jj abrams in there we always know like when he gets that moment like if the audience is with us because they're like oh my god jj abrams is like talking about this thing um and it's it's amazing the people that love like

Lin-Manuel Miranda started emailing me like, "Oh, bro, I can't wait for your movie. I love 'The Room.'" Like, we were gonna have him at the beginning, but he was shooting "Mary Poppins" or something in London, so he didn't know. - As a director, what did you learn from previous directing experiences and from this that you learned, that you took to this film, that you learned on this film that you'll take to your next film?

Right. Got it. I got it. I did learn a lot on this film. This has been, these past two years working on this and on the HBO show The Deuce have been incredible learning experiences for me. And I'll say it's a very simple thing and can be applied to, I think, any character.

any profession, especially creative professions, but I basically had producers on both of those films that were better than I was or smarter than I was or more experienced in a certain kind of filmmaking or television producing than I was. And David Simon, I had, I guess you could say a certifiable genius. He's a MacArthur award winner. And

And having his writing, but also guidance and his team and everybody on that just made me incredibly responsible. I did have to have, I think, I've directed a lot and a lot of indie little weird things and some more successful than others. But I think that was my, in a way, apprenticeship. I don't think I would have been able to direct for HBO if I didn't kind of put that grind in.

But then melding that experience with a very smart and talented producer on both films really helped. And that was basically the big lesson for me, like work with people that are better than I am. And I'll continue to do that.

And I try to do that kind of pay it forward thing too. I mean, it was one of the reasons I taught, was to sort of give opportunities back that I had been given to people. - Yeah, great. - I wonder whether art is defined by the artist or the audience. I'd love to know your thoughts as an artist if, for example, your movie or anything you created were to be interpreted differently by the audience.

If, yeah, if something I, right, right, was interpreted differently than I intended. Yeah, exactly. I mean, that was the, there were two main aspects of this bizarre story or history of the room that really interested us. A, what I talked about where it was a strangely inspirational story of dreamers following their dream. But the second half is sort of what you're talking about where the room is,

is not good by any conventional standards. The acting's not good, the writing's not good. It's like as if a alien from another planet came down and tried to depict human life. It's like there, but everything's just off. And on the other hand,

It's still playing 14 and a half years later to sold out audiences in almost every major city. I mean, I was just in London. Like people love it in London. It plays in Paris and Tokyo. And it's like so there's undeniably something that people are getting from this movie. They keep coming back to it. And it's not just I don't I believe that it's not just that.

the bizarre, you know, creative decisions at every turn, that there's something underneath it. And I think it's partly, you know, Tommy's passion. I think that, you know, the magic sauce is that Tommy put his heart and soul into it. Now, whether it's that

it makes us feel a little superior that somebody tried so hard and fell on his face, and sort of that concept of comedy of like, why do we laugh at somebody that slips on the banana peel? Well, because it's not us. On the other hand--

When I go to the room screenings, and especially when Tommy's there, it's not a cruel atmosphere. It's a communal atmosphere. And Tommy is sort of a part of that. He's the weird magician that kind of gives permission for the laughter by putting on this very affable arrogance so that we can kind of laugh. I don't know whether he's aware of what he's doing or not, but I think that's one of the keys to it. And anyway...

I think it does, you know, the room does sort of challenge conventional criteria of success and artistic success. And that in a way, Tommy is a outsider artist, I guess. And I've watched The Room as much or more than any other movie, you know, in my life. And so there's value there. There's, you know, there's something there. And, yeah.

And if art is a way to reflect on ourselves and show us ourselves and all that, I think the room really does do that, albeit in an upside down cracked mirror that's like a funhouse mirror. But it still does that. Yeah. Thank you. We can only do two more. Sorry, guys. So what was it like acting in a movie with your brother? And do you have any favorite moments from this movie with him?

My brother is the best, Dave Franco. He's seven years younger than I am. We grew up in Palo Alto together. I went out to Hollywood to be an actor first, and then he came out. And when he got there-- we lived together for a while. He went to USC, and then he's like three credits short of graduating. And he lived with me, and then seduced my two cats and stole them away.

Anyway, that's not your question. He, for a while, for about seven years, wanted to get out from my shadow. And I guess a lot of people asked him, like, what's it like being James Franco's brother? And that's what he'd constantly hear. And so he wouldn't act with me a lot. We did some Funny or Die videos, in fact, in that apartment that we lived in together, where I played a ridiculous acting coach and he played my student. And that was actually...

When I read the book, that was kind of the seed for the relationship in the Disaster Artist. I knew just from making those videos that we had the right dynamic. In addition to having our brotherly connection that would be right for Greg and Tommy, we also had done those videos and I thought, "Man, that's basically Tommy and Greg in a way."

Anyway, I've asked him to do other movies and he said no. Sometimes because he, again, didn't want to be considered James Franco's little brother, but other times, I guess because my movies were too bizarre. So finally, I read that book and I was like, this is the one. He cannot say no to this one.

And he was smart enough to say yes. And it was great. I mean, it was incredible. On the other hand, he and I, we have not had a fight in probably 20 years. So we get along really well. And he's younger than I am, but he's pretty wise. And I defer to him a lot. So it works out.

- Thank you. - I should say a quick follow up to that. You recreated like 26 minutes, right? Of the room? - Yes, we recreated scenes in our movie and that kind of will connect to the Tommy scene. 'Cause we have a premiere scene in our film and we needed footage to go up on the screen while our characters are watching, right? And so we always knew we had to recreate some scenes from the room.

We threw ourselves into that. That was one of the most fun parts of it. And we, like, you know, everybody, all the department's heads threw themselves into it. The cinematographer, Brandon Trost, like, you know, spent more time, like, recreating the bad lighting than he did, you know, doing his good lighting. And, you know, the costume designer, Brenda Abandolo, like, found all the, you know, perfect materials for the costumes and...

Chris Spellman, production designer, studied the room and the behind the scenes of the room and got those sets exactly and all that. And then the actors would watch it shot by shot and mimic every movement. And Seth Rogen and I actually had practice unintentionally. We had done a recreation of Kanye West's Bound 2 video years before. Right.

And we realized on that, oh, you know, we just thought like, oh, we'll just do like a minute of it. And then we're like, oh, wait, we can do this whole thing. Like, it's just a motorcycle and a green screen. We can do this whole thing. And then started really getting into it. So we kind of had practice. And so...

It was sort of our dessert. Like we would, we would shoot our regular scenes in the main part of the day. And then if we got done early, it was like, oh, we can do more of the room recreations. Like, oh, which ones do we want to do now? Are you telling me a parley's all whatever. And so, um, so we did a ton of them and, and, and then we really, we were so proud of how close we, we got it. We're like, oh, we should do a side by side at the, in the credits. That's phenomenal.

That wasn't the original plan. And so we hadn't negotiated for Tommy's room footage, the actual room footage. And so we had shot this scene with Tommy, you know, because it was in his contract. He kept insisting that it be opposite me. And I tried to explain, Tommy, it's not going to make sense. You know, I'm playing you. What I couldn't say to him was like,

Tommy, I know you can't play anything other than yourself. He'd drawn on-- he sent me this photograph three days before he shot. And it was glasses. He was in "LensCrafters." I saw all the glasses behind. He's like, why do you think of glasses for character? I'm like, they're great, man. Nobody will know it's you.

had drawn on a mustache in Bic pen, right? And said, what?

If you like mustache, I draw it on better when we shoot. I'm like, dude, I'll give you a fake mustache. So he showed up. We did that scene. And then we're like, all right, let's get that out of there. But then when we were negotiating for the room footage, he's like, well, how am I seen? And somebody told him it's not in there. And he's like, well, you want footage, then you have to...

put my scene in the movie. And we're like, no. And then we were like, oh, it'll be perfect at the end of the credits because it won't be part of the main thing. It'll be this weird David Lynch thing. And he still says to me, he saw it for the first time at South by Southwest and then Toronto. And every time he'd be like,

Yeah, I think my scene should be a little earlier. I'm like, it's good, it's good, Tommy. It's perfect. Real quick, I'm sorry. Hey, James. So in 2013, you wrote this really great book review of The Disaster. Yes, yes. And in it, you described Tommy as being sort of part dreamer, part Ed Wood, and part ageless vampire. But you also talked about how you resonated with his story of

like struggling to have this creative vision and make it, you know, come through to fruition. Can you talk a little bit more about similarities between you and Tommy's journey? Totally. And at the end of the article, I said, Tommy Wiseau, c'est moi. And what...

In the article I said, and I wrote it before I even had the rights to the book, I just loved the book so much, and I said, "I totally respect Tommy because how many thousands or millions of people have come to Hollywood to make it?" And they don't. It's a really hard business, you know? And Tommy got his movie made against all the odds, and I respect him so much for that.

On the other hand, he went to work in what I consider a collaborative medium, and he did not know how to collaborate. Now, look, I totally understand it. Like, that guy was told no his whole life. I mean, not even, like, probably even before the movie business. Like, I'm sure that he just was, you know, just rejected his whole life. And so, I mean, especially if he looks like...

A pirate mixed with a vampire and he says, "Well, I'm the next James Dean." Most people are going to be like, "No, you ain't." And so he just learned through the experience of rejection that the only person he could ever depend on was himself and maybe his friend Greg. And so when he got on set, he didn't know how to shut that off, that self-will.

And so he did make a disaster of a movie, or he didn't make the movie that he intended. On the other hand, as we know, then the whole second chapter of his saga is that it became this ironic success. And so, in fact, he could never...

He never hit a wall. He's just in some weird trajectory into Tommy. He talks about Tommy's planet. He is on Tommy's planet because he never hit a wall. A normal artist would make something, and if he made all the wrong decisions, it wouldn't be what he intended, and then he'd be like, oh, shit.

Man, I didn't make what I wanted. I guess I should do it differently next time. Tommy never got that because it became this weird success. Anyway, I always, you know, when I wrote the review, I thought, okay, I can relate to Tommy's drive and, you know, wanting to get something done. But I like to consider myself a collaborative person. And I am, you know, I was...

Even up until these past couple of years to a certain extent. But in other ways, I too was very self-willed and blind to how I was proceeding. And it's funny, like, there are a lot of... I can Google, you know, my name if I wanted to. I had to...

I had to stop Googling my name years ago, about five years ago. That's a thing, by the way. Don't Google yourself. You're addicted to Googling yourself. I've been off it about five years now. But I could go do it and get a lot of headlines, like, what's James Franco doing now? What's he doing now? And I should have heard some sort of message a while ago. I did hear it finally. And it was like, all right, dude, just

Slow down, listen to the people around you that are smart and know how to do this thing in a different way. And so I guess what I learned later when I said Tommy Wiseau, c'est moi, he was c'est moi in a lot more ways than I had liked to look at or admit. Great, thank you. So we need to wrap. But in 10 seconds, how would Tommy explain Google?

You know what he said in the movie? He said, in the room, he said, you know, the computer business is very competitive. If you didn't know, or something like that, yeah. If you didn't know.

He would break in, but, you know, computer business, very competitive. Lisa might say it, but anyway, he wrote it. Gotcha. Okay, so Disaster Artist is out December 1st, limitedly, and December 8th, widely. So thank you so much for being here. All right, thank you. Thanks for listening. To discover more amazing content, you can always find us online at youtube.com forward slash toxicgoogle or via our Twitter handle at toxicgoogle. Talk soon.