Noor Murad | Dishes & Stories From My Middle East
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Welcome to the Talks at Google podcast, where great minds meet. I'm Emma, bringing you this episode with chef and author Noor Murad. Talks at Google brings the world's most influential thinkers, creators, makers, and doers all to one place. You can watch every episode at youtube.com slash talks at google.

There's a building in North London built from equal parts brick and tahini, with walls coated in olive oil and floors stained with spice. This is the Ottolenghi Test Kitchen, where a group of individuals meet and eat, cook and write, tear and share, and gather with just one motive: to create good food with good ingredients, and to share it with the world.

Chef and author Noor Murad joined the Ottolenghi Test Kitchen in 2018, eventually becoming its head and the writer of its books, Shelf Love and Extra Good Things. Bahrain-born, London-based, and New York-trained, Noor's own recipes have been featured in The New York Times, and she cooked on BBC's Saturday Kitchen.

Her Middle Eastern roots have a strong influence on her cooking, with Arabic, Indian, and Persian flavors making a prominent appearance in her recipes. Noor joins Google to discuss her book, Lughma. Lughma is an Arabic word that means "a bite." The book offers over 100 recipes as an ode to the food she grew up eating, traditional flavors and modern dishes from Bahrain, and the surrounding Middle East and beyond.

Here is Nurmurad, Lugma, abundant dishes and stories from my Middle East.

- Noor, it is an absolute pleasure to welcome you to Talks at Google. - Oh, thank you. - Huge congratulations. - Thank you. - Huge congratulations on the book. So yeah, I will kick it off. I read the book. It is fascinating. And I am Middle Eastern myself, so I could understand some of the dynamics and some of the nuances. I think what makes your book

so interesting that it's not just about the food. It's not only about the recipes. It's also about the stories that you tell. The book is clearly a mashup of foods from Bahrain, from the Middle East with a Westernized take. And it's also very fascinating how you straddle that line between the traditional and the reimagined food.

But the book is also a very personal account. It's a very personal story, your story through recipes and food. Can you tell us a little bit more about the book, why you wrote it and how you cultivated those stories and recipes to be like that?

You know, it's always been my dream to write a cookbook since I was little. My mom had all the classics, like she had Madhur Jaffrey's India, she had Ken Hom, she had Anisa Helo's Lebanese Cooking, and obviously like Delia Smith, Nigella Lawson, like all the classics. And, you know, back then the recipe books weren't so like picture heavy. So you had to like really use your imagination, like read through a whole recipe, see how you thought it was going to look.

And I just found it so exciting. But then obviously I got into the food industry and just got swept up in the chaos that is hospitality. And I didn't actually start working in publishing until I started working at Off-Languie Test Kitchen. And that's when I finally got into the world of books. And I felt like that's where I belong.

And so Luqma, I feel like it's like a lifetime in the making. It really is like my story about my upbringing in Bahrain. I think it's a part of the Middle East that not enough people know much about. And I wanted to bring it to life through food and different stories and different accounts because I think that's how people can connect to a part of the world that they might not know enough about. I do also want to note that April marks Arabic Heritage Month.

And this year at Google, we are marking this occasion with a theme, which is "Diverse Branches, Shared Roots." And really the goal of this is to demonstrate the diversity and really the rich tapestry of the region of Arabic-speaking countries or the Middle East.

And there's just so much diversity across ethnicities, lived experiences, religions, that it's really hard to paint the region with one stroke.

What is also fascinating about the book is that you managed to so effortlessly showcase that diversity and celebrate it. And I don't know whether this was an intended outcome. Was it a purpose? Or maybe it was your actual lived experience in Bahrain. Yeah, you know, Bahraini food is quite unique because throughout history, it was a really important like seaport and center of trade. So a lot of influences kind of came through the islands.

And I always say that the three big flavors are Indian, Persian, and Arabic flavors coming all together. So you have the big rice platters and the slow-cooked meats that are more like Arabian flavors. But then you also have food that's super herb heavy, lots of sour flavors, dried limes. That's the influence of Iran. And then it is also super spice heavy, and that is the influence of India. And all these things come together to create this super unique cuisine.

And there's also just the more known foods of Levant that also are there as well. So, you know, of course, you have your shawarmas and your falafels and your man'aif.

And so I wanted to kind of show all of this through the book. And so I think, I mean, obviously, it was well, it was sought out the recipes, but like, I feel like our food, our Middle Eastern food kind of speaks for itself. I don't need to do much to it. It's already the flavors and are already there and they're just so beautiful. So all I have to do is like combine them in ways that that that comes out in the recipes.

Amazing. I want to go back to the book. The title is Lughma. As we said, that means a bite or maybe a mouthful even. And, you know, Lughma is a Bahraini dialect. I'm from the Levant. I'm Palestinian. I wouldn't say it the same way. I would say it differently. So I found it fascinating, the use of language.

in your book. I think there was a lot of Bahraini dialect that was used to really bring out the story. But also there was a lot of very beautiful calligraphy throughout at the introduction of every section. And if you look very closely, I also found calligraphy hidden on the front cover. Can you tell us a little bit about Arabic, Bahraini dialect, language and how that is, the significance of that in recipes and food and writing? Yeah, of course.

So I might be a bit biased, but I think that Arabic is perhaps one of the most beautiful languages in the world.

Actually, when we were coming up for the calligraphy for this book, obviously my editor didn't know how to read Arabic, but she just said, like, it looks like really pretty swizzles. And I was like, yeah, that's about, it looks good to you, it looks good to me. So yeah, but I really wanted to, you know, I'm bilingual. My dad is Arab, he's Bahraini, and my mom is English, actually. She's from Northampton. But yeah, she moved to the Middle East,

over 40 years ago, so she's an honorary Bahraini at this point. And, you know, they always kind of kept my two worlds very much alive in my upbringing. I went to an Arabic school and Arabic was my first language. So it was really important to me to showcase that in the book. But I always say that, like, dialect is very interesting in the Middle East because at school they teach us Fusha, which is classical Arabic, but nobody speaks Fusha. It would be like

people speaking Shakespearean English to each other. It'd be like really weird. So every single country has its own like slang and its own dialect.

And so the Khaliji countries, the Gulf, also have their own slang. And each country then has its unique way of speaking. So Bahraini Arabic is quite casual, I'd say. It's quite a casual approach in comparison to, I'd say, the Levant Arabic, which I always say that your Arabic is a bit more sing-songy. It sounds that way to me. But whereas ours, I think, is a bit harsh. So, like, for example, Lugma, the...

classical Arabic is "luqma" because it's "qa" but we would never say that, we just drop it, we soften it. So it's "luqma" and it was really important to me to kind of introduce that into the book in different ways and conversation because I just find it so fascinating and so interesting how we're all so different even though we have one language.

Absolutely. Let's go back to the flavors and I want to talk about black lime, also known as Lume and I believe it has other names. It is on the table over there, right? Yes, it is. It is right here.

So, Noor has been credited for taking this spice to the international stage. It's gone global. You can find it in Waitrose here in London. You can find it all over the world. So, I want you to tell us a little bit more about what it is to begin with. And then, why are you so passionate about it? And why have you been on a mission to make sure everybody knows what Lume is? So, these are dried limes.

They come in two different colors. So this one is the natural one. They're both sun-dried, and they're both exactly the same thing. Just the black limes have been heat-treated to give them that dark color. But really, they're interchangeable in flavor. They're really earthy and bitter. It's the backbone of cooking in the Gulf, Iran, Iraq. And you could throw them into stews, soups, rice dishes,

You can even grind it up and use it as a marinade for meats. It almost acts as a tenderizer. And I just think it is such a magical ingredient because you can do so much with it. And in the book, there's just loads of recipes. You can even make a tea out of it. I use it in a dessert as like a...

in a flan, like, stirred into the base of the caramel. So kind of like cuts through that like rich creaminess otherwise. So yeah, I mean, they've obviously been around for years and years and years. So I, you know, I can't claim them. But I am on a mission to kind of spread them and popularize them in the West because I just think they're so versatile and they're so amazing and what they can do to a dish.

and transform it in such a beautiful way, I think is really special and worth celebrating. Amazing. Can you tell us again about food? I want to know what is the most iconic Bahraini dishes and

In general, what would you also tell us more about the flavors, Bahraini dishes, and how has life in the history impacted the recipes and the food? Honestly, anything you want us to know about Bahraini, it's fascinating. It is an island and it's the only island in the region. So tell us more about it, more about how the recipes, the location of it has influenced the recipes as well.

Yeah, I'd say that Bahraini food is super rustic. It's very, very comforting. There's no faff about it, but some of the recipes have an extremely long ingredient list, so many spices. And it's one of those countries that I think we share this throughout the Middle East, I think, is that every household has its own way. So you make it and then someone else be like, well, my mom does it this way, and so it's better. So you kind of are always bickering about the true way to do things.

But yeah, it is an island, so it's pretty heavy on the seafood as well. We love our fish, usually very heavily spiced. Yeah, Bahraini seafood is like, I really love it because it's very salty. Even the prawns are just amazing. And, you know, you have anything from slow cooked stews, things that take a very long time, need a bit of patience, to like cooking on charcoal and you've got like smoky grills and that kind of stuff.

But generally, part of the land is quite fertile and there's natural springs

So you do have your local veg, but a lot of stuff has been introduced through trade. So for example, rice is the main carb in Bahrain and it's one of those carbs that like you don't sit down at the table if there's no rice on the table, it has to appear. So that's why there's a whole rice chapter in Lugma. And I know I'm in a potato loving nation, but I want to argue that rice is so much better. But

So yeah, so there's a lot of rice dishes and that was introduced through trade and has now become like such a staple. So I mean, one of the dishes I'm making today is called madruba. It's quite unusual, which is why I chose it. But it means beaten in Arabic. And it is a rice dish. And it's kind of like if you were going to make like a spice rice, but then add too much water and you let it cook. And then you kind of like shred the chicken and you beat it really nicely. And then

Another dish that I love, people always ask me what's your favorite dish in the book. It's called fagata.

It's a really unique dish and it's truly, truly Bahraini. So Qaa in Arabic means the bottom of something. So in Bahrain, often fishermen will say Qaa al-Bahar, so the very bottom of the sea. So that name was used for the bottom of the pot. So Fagaa, Fagaa, so in the bottom. And that's where all the good stuff happens, obviously. So you add chicken and loads of onions,

tomato, potato, ghee, loads of spices, black lime, obviously, and you just leave it at the bottom of the pot, and then you top it with parboiled rice, and then you pour it over some saffron rose water, so it's super fragrant. You put a lid on, and you just let it cook for like an hour and 45 minutes, and your whole kitchen smells amazing and super, super fragrant. And then you invert it, so then bottom is top, top is bottom,

And it's just so wonderful. It's like this amazing dish that you can just dig into and it's really, really comforting. But it's so intricate. And that's what I say that our food, it is like the layering of flavors is so unique. And yet you eat it and it just feels like a warm hug. So yeah, that is Bahraini food, I think, in a very long way.

Thank you. Fascinating. I did mention that the book had a lot of personal storytelling and a lot of, I would say maybe even stories that bring out vulnerability and growth. And there is something to be said that food is beyond sustenance, the making of food, the eating of food. And there were stories about how food helped you find home.

almost. Can you talk a little bit about the relationship with food? Obviously, also food is a passion for you that has also become your job. Can you talk a little bit about those dynamics? Yeah, absolutely. I think, you know, when I moved to London, I moved here almost nine years ago now. And I

You know, I didn't really think much about black lines and these kind of things. So they just existed in my life. But it wasn't until I moved here in my late 20s that I really kind of felt this sense of like loss of like who I was and where I belong. And oftentimes you just find that identity in in the kitchen and in cooking.

And yeah, I just became quite lost in this cooking like my rice dishes and my slow cooks and, you know, and my lentils and everything like that. And it brought like the flavors of home because even though I was working on Thalengi and there was like quite a few Middle Eastern dishes, it wasn't my Middle East. It was the Levant, which is completely different and beautiful and amazing in its own right. But there was no representation of the food that I knew and I loved.

So yeah, I often turn to food when I don't really know where to turn at all. But at the same time, when you work in recipe developing and you're constantly cooking and you're constantly tasting, like any chef will tell you, you just want to go home and just have a bowl of soup or have a bowl of cereal and just be like done with it. So like I often say, like our relationships to food are so unique, you know. Oftentimes it's not really about like feeding your stomach. It's more about feeding your heart.

And yeah, I think I really channeled that energy when I created the recipes for Lugma. I really kind of questioned myself when I was making it. I was like, is this just a recipe? Because like, I need to fill in the blanks. I really need a potato recipe. So I'll just put it in the book. Or is this generally a recipe that I really, really, really want to cook for my friends and my loved ones? And yeah, I just had to have those conversations with myself when I really thought about how to put Lugma together.

And you also talk a little bit in the book about how Luqma was inspired from the way you develop recipes, right? So you had to take a bite of things and then figure out how to improve them. Was that also part of the story?

Yeah, definitely. I mean, as you explained, lugma means a bite in Arabic and I always say it's the ultimate form of love because in the Middle East we're feeders. We love to feed people almost to the point of discomfort sometimes. And yeah, we'll often offer them a bite from our plates. So my grandfather always used to say like, and he would offer me a bite from his plate with his hands.

So that is the ultimate form of love, I say. So if anyone tries to feed you, you know that that is just like a good sign. So yeah, and I think also in developing recipes, I'm constantly having to take just like bites out of things because all you really need is one bite and you just have to sit with it and be like,

What does this do? Is it right? And so the name of the book came very naturally because I was like, oh, actually, this is the ultimate form of love. And it's also what I do on a day-to-day basis.

Amazing. Switching gears a bit, social media. I actually came across your amazing cooking during COVID. So that's five years ago now. And it's been life changing for me. I finally do cook. So it's been really life changing. What can you tell us about as a chef and having been in this industry for quite some time? What can you tell us about the impact of social media and how do you manage and work with it?

I mean, like many people, I think I have a love-hate relationship with social media. Sometimes I'm like, "This is a monster and we created it." And other times I'm like, "Well, this is the way to reach people on a global level."

So yeah, I think social media definitely went through like a complete boom during lockdown, which is probably how you found me because everybody was home cooking sourdough apparently. I was making madruba and chickpeas. But yeah, but it really helped people to connect at a time when nobody could.

So I think it can be used as a very powerful tool. It's just sometimes to our own detriment, I think, with the Doom scroll. And yeah, so I think it's just like learning that balance and knowing when to...

to put it down and like kind of disconnect. Because like I feel like social media, especially in the food world, is just so intense. It's like video after video after video of content creators doing all these like amazing, like very, very polished things. But almost it just doesn't feel like real life.

And I think sometimes we just have to remind ourselves of that and bring ourselves back to the cooking of our childhoods, of what we grew up eating and what your grandma would make for you or your parents would make for you because that's more real and that's real food. So yeah, I think, yes, social media is a, you know, it's got its good side and its bad side, I think.

Absolutely. Before we jump into the cooking, I do want to ask you, since we're in the UK, your mom is British. What can you tell us about the influences of British cuisine in your cooking and what can we expect in the book? So my mom, she clung on to her English roots quite a lot when we were growing up, which

which is hard to do when you're in an island in the Persian Gulf. But she was really big on Christmas and Pancake Day. Like, those are the two things that she absolutely was like, my children need to have this. So, yeah, you know, sunny day, 18 degrees on December 25th, fake tree, but we would do it all.

And I think she also did cook. My mom's a very adventurous cook. She loved to cook from all parts of the world, but never the Gulf food because I think she was quite intimidated by it. It's very different.

But yeah, you can kind of see that reflected in the book. There is an ode to my mom's pancakes in the book, but mom always went with the classic like lemon and sugar, which I can't beat. It is a great combo. So in the book, I've done it with like a burnt honey lime syrup with pistachios and sugar and lime zest.

There's my take on a tuna jacket potato, which I know is like, you know, quite a favorite here in the UK, but there's no mayonnaise and no tinned sweet corn, I'm afraid. But it's got this really lovely like Middle Eastern spice tuna sauce with lime yogurt and herbs. So it kind of like takes this jacket potato to different heights.

And there's a Middle Eastern bolognese as well because, you know, every house has to have like a good spag bol. But in the Middle East, we cook it with lamb and we are not shy in our spices. So we call it like macaroni. So you have it with like, yeah, macaroni and this like very spiced lamb, lamby bolognese, which is just so delicious. So, yeah, I urge people to give it a try. But yeah, that's kind of how I bridge my two worlds.

And I think that's how, yeah, where I belong kind of has made sense to me in the kitchen, really. Incredible. Thank you so much, Noor. We will jump into the cooking right now. So as we said, there will be a demo. And from there, the audience will get to sample some of the food. Yes. Can you remind us, what are we cooking? What are we making?

So I chose two completely different dishes. One of them is very traditional and one of them is just completely out there. And I just kind of want to show how you can still make the very traditional dishes and then also use what you know and the flavors that you know to create something completely unique and different. So I'm starting with madruba, which as I said is the beaten chicken and rice. And it's quite a laborious dish. There's lots of different steps.

But what you want to start with is a really great base of onions, sautéed. You know, you've got ginger, garlic, you've got your bone-in chicken, and then loads of spices. And that's how you start the base. So, yeah, if you start with a good foundation, you know that the end is going to be a good result. So, yeah, I'm just going to get in. Amazing. I'm going to hold this for now. Let me tell you a strong thing here. We're going to hang around the fire to eat this.

So is it going to be like a 15 minute probably? Yeah, I'd say roughly about that. While we're cooking, I was actually thinking about, there's obviously, as you mentioned, a lot of spices. Yeah.

For somebody who is not familiar with Middle Eastern cooking, who would like to start, what would you say is the accessibility these days for these kinds of spices? I know lumi is on the market now, but what about the other recipes in your book? Do you feel that the ingredients are accessible and available? Yeah, I do think they are. Besides lumi,

I don't really think there's anything that's not accessible. As long as you have a very well-stocked spice cupboard, that's all that really matters. And then you can make all the dishes. Also, I can see that you're currently tasting the second dish, which I can talk about. So these are...

This is my completely out there dish of butter beans. So we love our beans, especially in Bahrain. And we love our dairy. So they're tossed in just like a very simple yogurt sauce. And then they're topped with a Middle Eastern chili crisp. So this is not a condiment that my grandma ever made. But I kind of just was so inspired. I love chili crisps and like kind of oily chili based sauces. So this one has...

fried shallots and garlic and pine nuts and then really lovely spices. So you've got caraway and fennel and coriander seeds mixed with loads of different chili. So that's kind of what makes the dish. You kind of pour it on top so you've got like creamy soft bean. Then you've got this lovely textured chili crisp on top. And this is how you can kind of introduce Middle Eastern flavors into dishes in a way that is super fun and different, I think.

Let me know if I can help in any way. Yeah, that's fine. Speed up the process. So I got the chicken gone in and now I'm going to throw in the loomis because these are really hard but they're going to soften in time.

Can you remind us, Nora, between the dark one and the lighter one? Yeah. One is just... Why is it darker? So it is heat-treated in a factory. That's what makes it black. But they are kind of the same, so you can use them interchangeably, except, like, in Bahrain, we tend to use the black ones more. They're just more dramatic. We love a bit of drama. And also, if you, like, if you grind them up, we have this very traditional dish called tikka.

which is basically like beef or lamb skewered with like lamb fat in between. And the marinade is ground black lime. And it's like, yeah, some people add yogurt or a bit of oil, but it's just very heavy on the ground black lime. And then you cook it on charcoal. And yeah, you just need the black lime because it's just, yeah, it kind of is like a lot more attractive. It gives it that really, really dramatic look as well. It feels like a lot of the...

of, in general, Middle Eastern food. You really need a lot of people around the table. It's actually more challenging to do a meal for like a one person, one person kind of thing. Would you agree? Yeah, definitely. I'm a batch cook kind of girl. I don't really know when you say like one portion, I'm like...

I don't know what that means. So yeah, I'd rather just do something like a big pot of rice or, you know, a big pot of like majadara or something like that. And then you can have it for a few days. That makes a lot more sense to me. Yeah, so kind of like cook once, eat four times. Absolutely. In the book, you mentioned that you have a date for you at home in Bahrain. Is that still there? And I'm very jealous, by the way. Are you?

Yeah, so my dad in his retirement, one of his big retirement projects is the date harvest. So we've got four palm trees in our garden and my dad takes this very seriously. So every August kind of is the time for the harvest.

And yeah, he gets the dates. He has this guy who comes in to hack at the dates when they're ready. And then he used to put out these sun beds, like sun tanning beds. So then you put all the dates on them and dry them out in the sun. And these variety of dates called khalas. And for me, they're the best kind of dates. I love majdool, but khalas is just so delicious. It's kind of like stickier and fudgier and chewier. Yeah.

And my dad like backpacks it and even like has a little label and everything like with nutritional value on it. Honestly, there's no one getting it like just for him and his mates and like me. But he brings them to London every year and I like savor them. I have them every morning. I have three dates.

And I just, you know, it's kind of around this time of the year that it starts to run out. And then I have to patiently wait until the next August where I can have my beloved dates. But I guess they're just so special because they're from my dad's hands, you know? Yeah. All right. So I'm going to add the spices now and the ginger and garlic. I've got chili, turmeric. I know this sounds like a lot, but I have actually reduced the spices.

Believe it or not. We don't, you know. So I've got cumin, coriander seeds, and garam masala. So kind of everything. What was the last one? What did you call it? Garam masala. Oh, got it. Yeah, so yeah, just like a mixed spice. Indian. So, you know, in Bahrain, you'll be like, okay, so what did you put? And they say, like, you know. So I find it quite funny because in the stores here, they say like,

They call it baharat, spice mix. But baharat in Arabic means spices. So for me, I'm like, well, that doesn't mean anything. It could be anything. And in Bahrain, you know, you have like baharat for fish and you have one for chicken, you have one for meat and you and then, you know, and you have one for the veggie dish. And there's like all different spice mixes.

but no one will tell you what's in them. Like every house is different. They don't want to share. And so you'll get like a khalta, you know, your own like mix and then you can use it as you want to. So yeah, I've kind of had to come up with my own mixes based on like my memory and taste and flavor and just like hope that I've done it justice. Incredible. I can tell you those spices really smell incredible. Thank you. Much better than whatever I use at home.

at home, it's very strong. You'll probably never have, you never buy anything round. You grind everything at home just before using it? - Yeah, I think Bahainis are pretty, like, they're, yeah, they're very pedantic with their spices. So they buy the whole spice and then they wash it to get any like dust

off of it, and then they dry it in the sun, like, separately, and then they make their own spice mixes that way. So, yeah, any time I've tried to dry anything in the sun in England, it hasn't gone very well for me. So, you know, I just kind of have to, like, not do that.

But yeah, I always say buy your spices in the whole form. And then it's not only cheaper, but it's just so much more fragrant. And then you can use it as and when you want it and just get a pestle and mortar. And it's just like, you can smell it, it just smells so much better. So yeah, you know, that's what I say in the book. Invest in a pestle and mortar. We're going to serve up the dish now. Yeah, go ahead. On a Jeeves.

if anyone's veggie, it's not veggie, but otherwise it doesn't have any nuts or anything else in there. - The dairy guys, right? - The dairy, yeah. So in the base of this, I've got loads of herbs going in. So like coriander and dill. Yeah, people always do herbs as like a finishing touch, but in Bahrain, it really is like the base of a meal, the base of a rice, the base of a curry. And like when you cook herbs, they just become so earthy and fragrant and they just kind of completely change in their flavor.

So yeah, that's gone in with some tomato paste. And then I'm going to add the water and let it simmer. And that cooks for a very long time. So you've got like 80 minutes of like slow cook. And meanwhile, I'm going to do a little switcheroo. Here's one I made earlier. Would you say most of the recipes are time consuming or I'm guessing in the book, you just mix it up?

I think when you're writing a cookbook, you really have to think about your audience. So like some of the recipes are a bit more time consuming, but those are usually the traditional ones that I didn't want to deviate too much from.

And then you have to have a healthy mix of like things that are a bit more approachable, like one pan dishes, like meze dishes, easier things. And then the more adventurous dishes. And then people can kind of choose what they want. You know, you might start with something easy and then get the hang of it and then go from there. But yeah, I am quite like precise in my directions and in my measurements. And I think that's just from working at Otolenghi Test Kitchen, like, you know, just like weighing everything the way I never used to be like that. I used to be one of the

we call it in the Middle East, you use your nefes, just a bit of your soul, of your spirit to cook and it's all about the eye. You go to any mom or grandma and you're like, "How much did you add?" And they go like, "This much." You're like, "Okay." But when you want to translate that to a global audience and you want them to really get the flavor that you're looking for, you can

you kind of have to be like a bit more precise with your measurements and really kind of put those in because it's a food that no one knows. So yeah, you want them to kind of measure it and then once they get hang of it, then they can like measure with your heart, you know? Yeah, totally makes sense. Sorry. So...

This is going to be covered in simmer for a very long time, but I really wanted to show you what the dish actually looks like. So the reason this dish is called madruba is because it's traditionally cooked in these cylindrical pots.

that kind of had like a tall spout. And the women will sit on a chair and put this pot in between their legs and then they use a long wooden paddle and they beat the dish, so the rice and the chicken, and they kind of like scrape it against the side of the pot to give it this like really interesting consistency. So it's almost like a porridge...

a kanji kind of thing. And that is where the name comes from. Madhrooba means beaten. Obviously, I'm not going to ask anyone to do that because you probably couldn't find the pot or the paddle here, but a whisk...

and a bit of arm work. The lovely chef here, he got his arm session in. Only one side though. And you just want to beat it and beat it and beat it until it kind of looks like this and it has this really porridge-like consistency. So after it's beaten, you get it to the consistency that you want and you kind of taste for salt, for lemon. That's when you start plating. Sorry, I'm just going to grab this. Yeah.

So there was no blender used here at all? No, no, no. That would be cheating. That would be cheating. You have to work for your food, you know, so you gotta... So yeah, you just kind of want to like... The way it's traditionally used in a really big pot, but you basically just kind of spread it out into a bowl, kind of like, you know, and you make a little well in the center, just how you would like with hummus or something. And then you want to add loads of fried onions.

are caramelized onions. And how much is honestly to your heart's content. I'm one of those people that's like, there's never enough fried onion really. These have just been fried with oil, right? Yeah, olive oil. Yeah. So there's no dairy in here, but you could finish it off with a bit of brown butter if you wanted to, and just to make it a bit more naughty. And yeah, and then you just finish it with some really good olive oil.

And yeah, it's got loads and loads of herbs in, but obviously I'll never say no to more herbs. Would you scoop it with bread or would you just eat it with a spoon? With a spoon? Yeah, you eat it with a spoon. I mean, you could. You could definitely do bread because I'll never say no to a double carb. But yeah, and that's it. That really is madruba. And for me, it's such a special dish. Traditionally served in Ramadan. So if you've been fasting all day,

It's really easy on the stomach to digest the rice. And because it's rice and because it's beaten in this way, you can eat quite a lot of it. And it just makes you feel really, really full up and good. It looks and smells incredible. I've never heard of this before reading your book. So it's been very fascinating to learn about it. Thank you. Noor, I think you're going to be doing something else now with the recipes. Yeah, absolutely.

So this is kind of simmering. I also have to add the rice and let that cook in there. It's only 200 grams, but the pot, it cooks down and it just makes loads and loads. But now that we're kind of done with that, I'm going to move on to the butter beans to show you some of that as well.

Chef Dan, you have another pot for your left hand here. Do you want to... Sorry, if you could just pass it. Absolutely. Thank you so much. And the yogurt and the lime juice. Absolutely. Thank you so much. Yogurt. So this recipe, as I explained, is completely different and it's a bit of like a modern twist on something that I love to eat.

So yeah, it's as simple as mixing yogurt with garlic, lime juice and the salt to taste. And then adding in some really good quality butter beans. I think we're quite lucky in the UK because you can get some really lovely like jarred beans that are like so lovely and soft, the Spanish kind. And the jarred is always better than the canned, isn't it? Yeah, I think so. Like, I don't know, when I moved here, the first time I tried like a...

Sainsbury's tinned bean and they're a bit al dente and I wasn't ready for it because back home like we really make them quite soft especially when you use them for like hummus and stuff like that you really want to have like a really nice soft bean

But yeah, so for me, I really prefer the jarred ones because they're salty and they're soft and they're really nice. And the work is done for you. So all you really have to do is kind of mix it with whatever you want and you have a really lovely nourishing lunch to have at like, yeah, at El Desco. So what makes this so special is this chili crisp that I have here.

And that's going to add the textural element, the smokiness from the chilies and, you know, your crunchy shallots and your garlic. And you can pour as much as you want to your heart's content, which for me is quite a lot. Is it marinated in olive oil? Yeah, so you fry it in olive oil.

And then it keeps in the cupboard for as long as you want. And you can mix, you can actually add it to like, you know, stir fries, you can add it to eggs. It's just so, it's so lovely and so, so different, I think.

It's very versatile. Is it a traditional Bahraini or is it one of the reimagined creations? This is definitely like a Noor exclusive, I'd say. I have to get it patented. But yeah, I actually was making it. I was making a Christmas hamper for a friend and...

I was just like, he's obsessed with all different kinds of like chili based sauces. So I thought, oh, it'd be cool if I just made all these different hot sauces. And then I made this chili crisp. And he was like, this is amazing. Like you need to you need to jar it up and sell it. And I was like, I think I'll just put it in my book. And then which is, you know, so, yeah, now all of you have access to it.

It's a good idea though I must say. Thank you. Drawing it up. Thank you. And selling it. Don't tell anyone. But yeah. So there you go. And that is just like a really lovely thing to have. You can have it as like a meze with some like pizza bread to kind of like scoop up all the oily goodness or...

Yeah, you could serve it just with lunch, for lunch, with a bit of salad on the side. And there you go. Easy. Looks absolutely incredible. Do you have time for one more thing? Yeah. How much time would it take? Five? Two minutes. Yeah, do it. Okay. So last thing, as you said, I'm obsessed with dates. So there's this thing called...

So just dates with tahini that we have all the time back home because our coffee, our Arabic coffee, is very, very, very strong, especially in Bahrain. It's infused with saffron and cardamom. And you kind of have it almost like in a little a little cup called the finial. And it's like almost like a shot. But because it's so strong, we always have it with dates.

and sometimes dates with tahini. So I've kind of like dressed it up a little in my own way. And so what you want to do is you have some dates here and you can stuff it with whatever you want, any kind of nuts. So I use pistachios, but you could use like walnuts or almonds or pine nuts, even whatever you fancy really. It just gives it a nice texture. These dates are massive, so I kind of halve them.

Are they from the garden? Sorry, we're going to hand out the dates as well now. It's obviously nut allergies, guys. Sorry for the nut allergy people. And then, yeah, you basically just want to take some tahini and pour enough to your heart's content. And some date molasses as well. So it gives it this lovely molassesy flavour. And then lastly, I top it with some toasted sesame seeds.

and some Aleppo chili, which is a bit milder than regular chili flakes.

And of course some salt because you've got all that sweetness. So you want a bit of salt. And dates with salt is so nice because you get this caramelly flavor. You have the nuttiness of the tahini, the molasses-y flavor of the date molasses. And you've got some nuts, some texture, some heat, some salt. So it all kind of is like a little party in your mouth. And that's a great way to end dates.

end of night when you've had something heavy like madruba and butter beans. You can't even find room in your second stomach for dessert. So you just give your guests some of this and a nice strong cup of kahwa or coffee and send them out the door.

They know it's time to leave by then. Yeah, yeah. Ma'a salameh. Ma'a salameh. Sahteen ma'a salameh. Nora, this was unbelievable. Absolutely incredible. I could feel all the smells are just absolutely amazing. Thank you. So for the last segment now, we will open it up to questions from the audience. And I believe there is also a Dory question.

So let's take live questions to begin with and then we will turn it over to the Dory. I guess if you have a question, please just raise your hand. Hi, thank you so much. This looks delicious. I'm just wondering about the rice for the madruba. Is it a specific type of rice that you recommend? And also for the chili sauce, did you add the pine nuts in there beforehand within the jar or do you add it later?

Yeah, so for the madruba and most of the rice dishes in the book, I use basmati rice because that's the main rice that we use in Bahrain. Except sometimes we use Egyptian rice, especially for like stuffing veg and stuff because it's a bit like starchier. But yeah, for the madruba, basmati rice is the best.

And then for the chili oil, so I fry all the components separately. So you fry the shallots till they're crispy, you fry the garlic till it's crispy, and you also fry the pine nuts using the same oil. And then you heat that oil and you pour it over all of the spices and the sesame and the chili and it kind of like sizzles. And then when it cools down, that's when you add in all your crunchy components. And yeah, and that's how you make it.

Thanks so much. Thank you. Yeah, thank you so much. I was wondering, you said that you had cut down the amount of spice for the dish. How much would you traditionally be putting in? Honestly, it really depends on the household and who's making it. But people have their own way, you know. People will add other things like maybe some cardamom. And it's really up to you on the flavor. So for me, I kind of...

you know, you look at a spice mix or traditional, like I said, the baharas, like the bahraini masalas. And it's like, you're thinking that there's like 20 odd spices in there. So for me, I'll always try to just like think of the predominant ones. I have a rule when I'm testing recipes. If I can't taste it, I either have to increase it or I have to lose it. And that's what I kind of do. And yeah, that's kind of how I've led in Ligma. Hi, thank you so much. Everything's really delicious. Thank you.

I really resonated with what you had said about how all of the grandmothers would answer when you're asking them recipes of like, oh, this is like how much. That's what my Lebanese teta does all the time. And it really just bothers me. How much trial and error did you have to do to get the spices right for some of these traditional recipes?

So I think for me, I usually have a rule with recipes, unless it's something that I've made many times and I just know it. I usually test the recipe around three times. It could be more, especially if it's like a baking one, because baking is not my forte. But I mean, I get the hang of it, but I need a bit more trials.

But yeah, and I just try it until I'm really, really happy with it. And then there's also a cross-testing process for me. So I work with a cross-tester, this lovely lady, Claudine in Wales, and I send her all my recipes. So she kind of cooks it blind, so she just reads it

and cooks it as the directions say and she would come back to me and what's great is that you know she's I think she's like French living in Wales so like you know her palate is not Bahraini food but she has a really strong palate so for me

it was great sending her the recipes because it's something completely different. And if someone Western can be like, this is such a delicious dish, I would totally make it again. For me, I'm like, oh, that's great because it's something so different. And I know it can work with a Western audience. So yeah, it goes quite a few tests on my end and then a further test by the lovely Claudine.

We've got a Dory question from Melissa and first they say that they're very hungry watching this and they ask where do you source your spices, rice etc in London? Where do I source them? Well I mean we're very lucky in London there's just so many great Middle Eastern stores. When I first moved to London one of the first places I lived was Kentish Town which isn't too far from here

And I literally just strategically chose it because I was working in Camden and I didn't want to have to go on the tube in the mornings. And I could just walk to work. And when I was kind of, you know, I was quite new to London, quite homesick. And I started discovering the city and I found Phoenicia, this little shop on Kentish Town Road. And it's run by a lovely family. I think they're Lebanese.

and they import all the things that I need. So it was, and when I went in, it was like, I felt like I'd walked home. Like, because everyone was speaking Arabic as well, maybe not my dialect, but it was so comforting to hear. And yeah, that's where I get most of my spices. Yeah, my tahini, za'atar, sumac, everything I need.

is very close by. But otherwise, there's so many amazing Middle Eastern stores all throughout London, especially in North Finchley, you have all of the Iranian stores, so you can definitely get the dried limes and the barberries and the pistachios. So I haven't had to go very far. The only thing that comes is my dad's dates. That's packed into the suitcase.

I think it was really delicious, amazing. Thank you. I had no idea about Bahraini food, but it inspires me to try it out more. Were the dates from your father's garden? No. These dates are from Chef Dan. Thank you so much. Everything is so delicious. Thank you. I have a question about like cooking with pulses and beans. You mentioned sort of

how, as an Indian person, we also like to cook from scratch, but it takes a long time. So do you have any tips or tricks on how to sort of gauge cooking time? And is the pressure cooker the only way to go to cook sauces and beans? Thank you.

To be honest, I have yet to invest in a pressure cooker, believe it or not. But I do kind of plan my meals ahead. So I think planning ahead is probably your best bet because they do require soaking and all that kind of stuff.

And yeah, it does take a long time, but I think some of the best foods do. And it's crazy because I think our world is like so fast and everything is like convenience food and we're constantly moving. But there's something about just slowing down to cook that I think makes it worth it in a really lovely way.

And yeah, but I do think, I mean, everyone who's from Indian culture or Middle Eastern culture of like, you need to invest in that pressure cooker. It will save you a lot of time. So yeah, I think you've done the right thing. We've got another question on Dory. Melanie asks, where would you recommend to go eat proper Bahraini food in London? Well, I haven't tried it yet, but there is a Bahraini restaurant in London. I think it's called the Lammama's.

But to be honest, Bahrain is one of those places that even when you go to Bahrain, the best food you're going to find is either hole-in-the-wall street food or at someone's home. So I always say if you really, really want a taste of Bahraini food, you have to have a Bahraini friend invite you over for lunch.

Or you can cook it yourself from Lugwa. Noor, it was an absolute pleasure to have you here with us. Thank you so much. Thank you for teaching us so many new things, for the amazing flavors. It's been absolutely delightful to have you with us here at Google. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thanks for listening. You can watch this episode and tons of other great content at youtube.com slash talks at Google. Talk soon.