Record-Breaking Signings, March Madness Mayhem & A Severance Waffle Party with Ben Stiller | Ep 130
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Okay, check this. Deli boys on Hulu. Two brothers, Raj and Mir, are living the high life. Not a care in the world. When their old man dies, it all vanishes. Poof! And they find out he didn't just own a deli, but was a drug kingpin. And they're like, what the? Throw in their ruthless aunt, some guys who just want to kill them, God knows why, and keeping dad's drug business going.

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It's my favorite scene in the movie. How you doing, little Tony? Bad? Well, everything's falling down around me. There's nothing I can do about it. I'm sorry, I don't want to do your part. No, no, do it. Please, please. Everything's falling down around me. There's nothing I can do about it. Whose fault is it? It's their fault. It's not my fault. It's their fault. That's right, it's their fault. You have failed! You have failed!

Let's do this thing. Welcome back to New Heights, ladies and gentlemen. A Wondery Show produced by Wave Sports and Entertainment and brought to you by Nike. When the world says you can't win, Nike says, so when? We're your hosts. I'm Travis. This is my big brother, Jason. Out of the University of Cincinnati. Unfortunately, the Natty didn't make it in the fucking bracket, man. But still proud of the gang. Is the other bracket still a thing? They still do the second? The NIT? Yeah. Yeah.

The second tier bracket? You're fucking hilarious, Jason. What am I? I'm just being honest. What else is it? I don't know. Yeah. No, I think they do. You're still doing the loser's bracket? I think.

Dude, I used to hate that when we were little in like baseball, like travel baseball, if you didn't make it into like the final four or something, you went to a loser's bracket just to play on Sundays. Exactly. I used to be like, man, I'm not trying to be in this fucking loser's bracket. Fucking losers. Pretty sure that's how everybody feels in the NIT. Ha ha ha ha!

Subscribe on YouTube, where? One Dream Plus, wherever you get your podcasts. Follow the show on all social media. Add New Heights Show with one S for fun clips throughout the week. Jason, tell the people what we got coming up. Oh, we got an incredible episode for you guys. First of all, we're going to look into some of the biggest news around the NFL, including free agency, which is pretty much the only news happening right now in the NFL. We're also going to kick off our first ever New Heights March Madness Bracket Challenge. That's right.

You guys will be playing for the coveted New Heights Golden Cup. That's right. The winner is going to receive this 14-carat Golden Cup. Look at that. That thing's pretty. Why is Jason the only one that has one of these? We've got a bunch of them. Do you want one? Can I fucking have one, Jason?

Why are you asking me? Just get them all sent to your house? I don't control these. I want a fucking Golden Cup. Who's in charge of the Golden Cup shipments? Everybody just sends all the trophies to Jason. You get the Stanley Cup, the Larry O'Brien, the fucking New Heights Cup. Yeah, I don't know who controls the Golden Cup shipments, but we can get you a Golden Cup.

We also are going to be getting the winner of our March Madness Bracket Challenge Gold Cup. I think there's going to be two Gold Cups. There's going to be a Gold Cup for the men's NCAA bracket and a Gold Cup for the women's NCAA bracket, but we'll get into that in a second. We've also got an amazing conversation with the one, the only. Oh, yeah. The Audi of Ben Stiller is coming on our podcast. That's right.

The director of the hit show Severance is coming on New Heights to talk about that among all of his other career accolades that we enjoyed growing up and since then. We talk about heavyweights, Tropic Thunder, pretty much everything that you'd want to know from Ben Siller. We're going to get into it. Hell yeah. Also, happy St. Patrick's Day for those of you that weren't here at the top of the show, tuned in a little bit late. It is Monday, so we are filming this on St. Patrick's Day.

although it will be releasing, I guess, while you're watching this this Wednesday. Let's get it started, Trev. Let's get it going, baby. Time for news. New news. New news is brought to you by American Express. Yeah. Well, let's get to the biggest piece of new news, which is that we are once again an award-winning podcast. That's right. We are the iHeartRadio 2025 Best Sports Podcast Award winners.

Thanks a lot. I heart. Yeah, baby. And most of all, thank you to all United two percenters for tuning in each week and getting us to win this award. This word is really just a representation of all you people that tune in each week to listen to us. Two idiots talk about nonsense. Thank you for tuning in. We sure love doing this podcast and, uh,

The only reason we're able to do it is because all you guys listen. So very much appreciate it. And it's an honor, I heart that to receive this award on behalf of the 92 percenters.

Who make this podcast happen. As well as our amazing production crew, Wondery, Wave, everyone involved in actually making this thing watchable. Well done, guys. So yeah, let's move on to some free agency news. What do you think, Trav? Yeah, let's dive into it, big dog. All righty. First week in NFL free agency in the books.

Again, this is being recorded Monday. So if something were to happen perhaps Tuesday or even Wednesday when the show comes out, we will not be talking about it in the show. And really, it's Wednesday at about 1230. So something is that or this is Monday. A lot of shit is Monday, 1230 Eastern. So there could be something happens later today that we don't want to know about. But either way, to date, there have been some interesting things. We have a fan question about free agency from Jenna.

X KC. I think that's Jenna at KC. Okay. So I've wondered this. Do players not go to their new teams and tell their old teams plans for

Like, how does that work? Actually, is there a rule or just common knowledge to respect the situation and nothing is discussed? I don't know if there's a rule that you're not allowed to disclose information, but I can tell you that everyone does disclose. And this is absolutely something that happens in the NFL, Jenna. Yes. Actually, a lot of the times you will see teams sign rules.

practice squad players one to two weeks before they play an opponent for this very reason they want to get code words they want to get information on uh no huddle plays coverage signals all of these things are being tried to figure out keywords that are set at the line there's always information that they're trying to get out of players that have been in other organizations yeah i

I don't know if it gets to the point of like you're sharing all your notes that you took. It probably does. It probably does get to that. So I bet guys will bring in binders. I've never, I've never seen it to that point. Yeah. I've never seen any of it, to be honest with you. Yeah. This all happens.

behind closed doors or something like that where like a coach or the player is going to meet with somebody. I've talked to certain guys on other teams like, hey, like I noticed that they do this blitz. Like what happens? You know, is there a tell when you guys are doing this game or they're

Nine times out of ten, it's not that useful what the defensive player is trying to give me. I will say this. I was playing – I forget who it was, and I think Chase Daniel was on the sideline. I think he was Chicago. We might have been playing in Chicago. Nagy was there. Maybe Tyler Bray might have been on the sideline as well. I'm trying to remember who it was that called it out, but either Alex Smith or –

or Pat Mahomes was up at the line of scrimmage and he, he signaled a quick route to me. I like a hot route to me essentially, or, or verbally said something to me to, to tell me to like break off my route differently. And on the sideline, I see both of the quarterbacks screaming what that route was going to be. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm just, and I, in my head, I'm like, you, you son of a buck.

I think it was preseason, but at the same time, you're going to do whatever you have to do to win in your current situation. And if that's finding a tick here and there from your previous situation and helping out your teammates in that regard, you're going to fucking do it, man. And I don't think there's any like...

Bush leagues, like I don't think it's like going behind someone's back or doing it like. I don't think. Yeah, I'm with you. Like, I don't know. I don't think it's wrong. If you hand over the entire playbook. Yeah, that's different. I think that's a little weird. Yeah. But if you're just talking ball and you're trying to give your guys a heads up on like an audible or something like that, I think that's all fair game.

I think stuff that happens – I think I'm with you, Trav. Stuff that happens at the line of scrimmage, verbiage, signals, all of that stuff is usually fair game. That does happen in the NFL. Good question, and glad we got into it. All right. We also got some Cowboys Twitter fighting. Love when people fight on Twitter. Just out in the open. It's the best, isn't it? Demarcus Lawrence signs with Seattle, shits on Dallas on his way out the door. Nice. He's just kind of being honest. Clearly –

A little bit unhappy with the way things ended. I believe he was quoted as saying, Dallas is my home. My kids are in Dallas. My family's in Dallas. But I know for sure I'm not going to win a Super Bowl in Dallas. Yeah. Strong words. Strong words. I mean, I think he's just being honest. But Micah Parsons clearly didn't appreciate that. This is what rejection and envy look like. This is some clown shit. Perfect. Perfect. That's a good way to respond.

The Marcus Lords. Calling me a clown won't change the fact that I told the truth. Maybe if you spent less time tweeting and more time winning, I wouldn't have left. Oh, man. Yeah, that's the old Twitter beef. Let me get you going. What is the point of fighting on Twitter? Like, just out in the open for everybody to see. Well, you know, Jason, you're a professional.

Nobody fights on Twitter, right? It's like when we were in high school and the kids would pull the fire alarm just so they could go out in the street and fight in front of all the students. Do you remember that? They're the best. In front of the entire city. Yeah. Cleveland Heights is on Cedar and Lee, two of the biggest streets on the east side of Cleveland. You guys could just go fight. You don't need to do this. No, I need an audience. I want everybody to see me whoop his ass. Everybody's...

And they would do it in the middle of the street. Not just any street, Cedar. Like the biggest, like one of the biggest ways into downtown Cleveland is just completely blocked off. It got so bad they had to put the cops at the intersection. Yeah. Well, it was stopping traffic.

People were trying to just, you know, do their daily errands. Cars lined up blocks down trying to do things. There's 4,000 kids out front watching a fight unfold in the middle of Cedar Road.

Gosh, man. And then we just go across the street over to Wendy's and get a Frosty and some five-piece nugget. Then they had to close Wendy's. They went and let kids walk into the Wendy's. You had to go through the drive-thru. Oh, better times. Better times. Love Cleveland Heights. Gotta love the Heights, baby. Gotta love the Heights. We got a breaking contract news. We got some news in the contract world. The Bengals have...

Fucking unloaded Brinks trucks. Love it. And have signed both Jamar Chase and Tee Higgins. So four-year deals. Jamar getting 161 with 112 guaranteed. Nice. Making him the highest paid non-quarterback in NFL history. And then Tee Higgins getting...

115 mil respectfully for his first two years guaranteed, fully guaranteed. Good for the Bengals. I did not think they were going to be able to keep both these guys and

They're paying a hefty price tag to do it. For those who are wondering, yes, Joe Burrow making $55 million per year, Jamar Chase making just over 40 mil a year, and T. Higgins making close to 30 mil a year. That's over $125 million per year in new money on just three offensive players. When you say it like that...

That is fucking... It's bonkers. I'm not going to say it shouldn't be done. It's just never been done. Yeah, but all of these things, there's going to be a never been done in a year or two years after this. The salary cap keeps going up. I think people don't realize often how much these...

The contracts continue to go up for players over time. When I first got into the league, league minimum was $375,000. That's still a lot of money. Now it's over $700,000 is league minimum. Yeah. The average per year for the highest paid centers when I was getting my first deal done, my third year in the league, was like $6 million a year.

Now the average of all the top centers is over 12. So in 10 years, it's doubled. Newsflash, this is going to get broken in another year or two just on how the salary cap keeps going. I've never heard of this much of the salary cap being allocated to three offensive players. The Cowboys did it with CeeDee Lamb, Dak Prescott, and they're going to do it with Micah Parsons.

That's not three offensive players. Okay, three offensive players. Sorry. I'm sorry. Yeah. Well, the Eagles got to be pretty dang close with A.J. Brown. Devontae Smith is going to be up for a contract soon. And Jalen Hurts, get ready to see that one. Or they're going to let Devontae Smith go. I don't think that's happening. Yeah. Devontae Smith isn't making –

50 mil. You don't think Devontae is going to get close to what T Higgins is making? The only reason AJ isn't making 55 is because AJ got redone a couple years ago or last year. I hear you. All right. He's still only making 30. They're going to be up again here in another year or two, and I bet it gets close to this. Find out. Yeah, we're going to find out. I don't think they stay. It all happens like this, dude. I'm telling you.

I bet this very metric gets broken within three years. I bet you it never gets close that 125 mil per year –

To three offensive players. No. And that percentage of what the cap is right now. Well, we don't know. That percentage. And this is another thing. Will never be just three players ever. Well, and this is another thing that I would like to stipulate. We don't even know what the percentage is for this year. These are the numbers of this arbitrary tweet that Brandon and Jake have decided to put into average per years.

Nobody right here knows what they're actually being accounted for for the cap. Nobody knows what the cash is. Nobody knows what the guarantee is. Somebody can figure that out. It's all going to be on paper. But I hear what you're saying. I'm just saying that

All I'm saying is there's a huge disservice to the NFL free agency. Every I, it, it pisses me off so much listening to all of these people just say the average per year is this when all they did is divide the total money by three. Look at this. Look at this.

By extending Jamar Chase to the Bengals, Bengals will actually lower both players' cap hits this season. Okay? So this is my whole point. People have no fucking clue what these numbers mean, and they just launch into these arbitrary things of, like, how much money –

Anyways, just saying. Don't be misguided, people. You got me. You got me. It sounds pretty ridiculous, but you got me. I really do. And Trav, we talked about this. I think it'd be good to bring on somebody who really understands the salary cap and all because I want to know it.

I want to hear like what all these structures mean, because I was talking to somebody the other day and they said it's all about cash and like how much eventually that cash comes due and whatever you're paying. But there's ways to manipulate it and it gets manipulated and signing bonus and roster bonuses. Every team does it. Some teams have more cash to divvy out up front.

I don't really know all the ins and outs of it, but I would love to have somebody on to explain to me, you, and the 92%ers what all these numbers mean. Should we do the NFL salary cap educational episode? Or should we go and find somebody else? Or should we just have a fun conversation with a former player?

And just dick around like always. Yeah. All right. You guys let us know if you guys want to learn this stuff. All right. Cool. All right. Last bit of new news. Shout out Kyle Frazier, the kid who puked working out with Aaron Donald, but still finished a workout. According to him, he tweeted referencing the social clip that we released about Aaron Donald and him working out. He said, definitely a workout I'll never forget, but you forget the part where I got back and finished.

Yeah. That's what I'm fucking talking about, big dog. I fucking love that, Kyle. That boy, Kyle. Apparently, this guy, he's got a freaking place, college football now. Nice. That's pretty awesome. Where's he at? I don't know. Brandon, do we have that information? Georgia Southern. Playing college football down there. That's hot. Tell you what, I don't want to be in a Georgia Southern training camp. That's for damn sure. No, sir. I'll be puking a lot.

Well, he had some experience about fighting through the pukage. That boy Kyle. And that does it for new news brought to you by American Express. Yeah, baby.

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I think it's time to check out this interview you guys have been waiting for. Let's do it. Just so you know, this interview was taped before Episode 9 came out of Severance. So we won't have anything from the most recent episode, but we do have some nice talking points and show references as well as a whole lot of other Ben Stiller anecdotes in this episode. So you're going to want to watch this. Enjoy. All right now.

Our guest today is from New York City. He's a 12-time Teen Choice Award, 13-time MTV Movie Award, MTV Generational Award, and Emmy winner. You know him from...

know him from heavyweight zoolander tropic thunder dodgeball and now the executive producer director of apple tv's hit show severance please welcome to new heights mr ben stiller let's go thank you thank you thanks welcome to the show ben appreciate you jumping all the great to be with you guys it is so hard to figure out these intros when you have as much of a like

Yeah. As much of an inventory of just hit movies after hit movies. Those are some pretty heavy awards credits there. MTV Awards. Those are big ones. Not screwing around there. Yeah, you guys...

You guys are doing good with this podcast. You're having fun? Oh, that for sure. Yeah. We started this thing up just trying to get our brotherhood out there. A lot of people see us as complete opposites, but you get us in a room, you'll see we're a lot more similar than what we are. And

And you're a little bit older? What's the age difference? Two years. Two years. Almost exactly. Okay. October 5th, November 5th. All right. I'm November 30th. Nice. Scorpio. Yeah. We just talked about we're big astrology guys. Oh yeah. No? Okay. Yeah. I don't understand the astrology thing because it's like you have your sun sign but then there's the rising sign and the moon and it can - right? So, there's - You got like really three signs or something like that you could be -

And I don't know - and how does it really - I mean, let's not get into it. My sister is really into it. Oh, okay. Yeah. I guess we can move on from astrology and move over to - we are going to give a - at some point, we will talk about severance. Yeah, we got to. So, we might have some - so, if you're - when we get to that section, we'll give you a warning.

because we don't want to ruin anything. The show is absolutely fantastic and there's tons of things going on. We don't want to spoil anything for anybody who might be just getting into it or isn't all the way caught up. But before we get into that, we're going to talk about your first bit of cinematic excellence, which maybe it's not, but it's definitely the one that sticks with us the most.

And we quote nonstop, which is heavyweights. Yeah. Did you know? First of all, before I said the movie, did you know I was going to say heavyweights? I had seen, I think I saw you had like a Perkis Power shirt. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And I'd heard some, you know, rumblings that you guys were into it, which was

pretty cool. Into it. It was my life. Listen, I was a heavyweight growing up. Jason, he didn't get fat until he went to office. We switched places. We switched places growing up. So Jason's more newly founded into it. So seriously, you were dealing with weight issues. You were chubby. I think I was just, yeah, I was dealing with my love for honey buns. I think that's what I was kind of dealing with more. But no, I saw heavyweights and was like, oh man.

Camp Hope is like, if there's a camp out there like that, I want to go to it. Just kids that can be fat together and hide candy in their beds and - Yeah, and be terrorized. Yeah, kids that never like really lived up to the excellence of their brother and just the expectations that their parents set for themselves. Yeah, yeah. Are you kidding? The Blob? Was it Go-Kart? Like, that was everything a kid wanted to do it. It was sort of, yeah, like a dream camp but then, you know, this guy comes in who -

It's never really dealt with children before. Yeah. That's one of the funniest intros. It was really fun to do. We had a great time. I mean, I remember the summer shooting the movie very well. We shot it down in near Asheville, North Carolina. Okay. I'm still buddies with the guy who was my trainer when I was doing the movie. So good. Mickey Marino. Shout out to Mickey. You're bigger. Who's down in East Hendersonville. Yeah. It was just... But like, yeah. Today...

First of all, the fact that that was a Disney movie. Is it? It is kind of crazy. Yeah. That was. I chuckle at every time I see Disney across the top. Yeah. It's an edgy Disney movie for sure. It's not Little Mermaid. And I don't even think they were aware of it at the time. It was a different time. Right. It was pre social media. It was. I think there was less of a sort of a moment to moment awareness of.

you know if you're doing something right or wrong and all that so it was you know and and Judd Apatow and was producing it Judd and I were friends and had been working together on a show we had done and had gotten cancelled and

and I had gone and directed a movie, my first movie. And he said, "Hey, we're gonna go down." Steve Brill's the director, really funny guy. "We're gonna go down to Asheville and do this fun, you know, this camp company. You can play this like mean guy who, you know, is mean to these kids who are overweight." And it seemed fun and funny. - In, I'm in. - Yeah, it's right there. - And it was like, and it happens to be Disney, whatever. And I think they went off and they made the movie and Disney looked at it and was like, "Uh."

This isn't quite, you know, this is down the middle for the Disney brand. And they kind of put it out there or whatever. And then that was it. You must have seen it on video, right? Oh, 100%. A few years after it came out or something. Because it's 30 years old. Exactly. Yeah. But then it's had this life. I saw it later in the 90s for sure. But yeah, it never would have gotten made today. Why do you say that? I think just because the characters being so mean to these kids who are dealing with weight issues that I don't think...

I just don't think that's getting off the drawing board. I understand. But I feel like the movie also inspired more people that were overweight. It really ends up being something that most of the people that I knew that were overweight or –

It was like a healthy relationship with that at the end of the day. I do agree that Tony was not the nicest to the kids. No, I think Tony is dealing with his own weight issues. Oh, for sure. Yeah. And his own feelings towards his parents and also that he's a kid who never interacted with other kids and he wants to be famous. And I feel for Tony. I feel like he's the most sympathetic character. I was like, where did Tony come, like, where did you find him? Is there any inspiration?

There was a little bit of Tony Robbins in there. Tony Robbins, the motivational guy, just in terms of the voice and how he talks and his kind of weird sort of like he, you know, Tony Robbins had this thing where he gets sort of like, yeah, he could kind of like hypnotize you with his eyes. And I don't know. And then we just sort of like played around. And it's funny because I look back at clips. I saw a clip like behind the scenes on it and

And I was like, God, we were so young back then too. Just like kind of just doing it, you know what I mean? And just kind of going for it and you don't really think about it that much. And the kids were so much fun and it was kind of like every day we're just - and my folks were in it playing my parents. That's so cool, man. We had just had the best time. Don't let somebody sign your checks. Oh yeah, don't let anybody sign your checks. Best advice I ever got.

How much of that movie was, of Tony, was being scripted and how much of that is you off the cuff? Just riffing it. Yeah. I don't remember. I think like we were, we were improvising all the time. Yeah.

It's sort of I feel like there were some improv moments there. I think like that little moment where Tony goes and talks to himself what he's weighing the kids Everything's falling down around me there's nothing I can do about it You know whose fault is it?

It's not my fault. It's their fault. That's right. It's their fault. It's their fault. You have failed. Yeah. The thing that's kind of funny to me about that scene is it was improvised. But you know, if you've ever been in therapy or gone to therapy, that's, you know, a lot of people talk about talking to your inner child, you know, and finding your inner child and connecting with your inner child. And over the years, I have

I've been in a therapy session where the therapist says like you should go like let's talk to your inner child and I literally feel like I'm just doing a scene from heavyweights. I always feel like it's just this is kind of silly because I've literally done this in a movie where it actually made sense that Tony was able to talk himself into understanding that he is not the problem. They are the problem.

himself. So in a way, it's a very healthy connection that he's having, you know, with himself. 100%. Maybe not with the kids, but with himself. And I think, you know, the kids also, like, you know, let's face it, the kids were cheating. They should have been following the rules. Right? It's an interesting way to reevaluate this movie. They were the problem.

Everyone's hiding candy and not hustling. If you go to a camp where you want to lose weight, you got to play by the rules, right? It's like if you guys show up at training camp, right? If you're not going to put the work in, right? Nobody's going to be able to force you to do it, right? You got to have the mindset. Yeah. I definitely go to Chick-fil-A during camp though. I'm not going to lie. I don't go to the meal room.

I know some guys that are probably hitting some stuff in their beds. So, it is kind of like being at camp when you go to camp. Oh, 100%. It is a little bit like that. 100%, well, he still goes away for camp. Right. Those teams don't go, like, we just don't go away anymore. I'm living in a dorm room. Yeah. Cement wall, white cement brick walls. You get a single or a double or you- They actually put the double together. Two singles together to make- That's what I mean, two singles together. So, I'm like, it's kind of a bit of a, it's a bit of like a-

it's an experience like back in time and i'm not like a super football guy but um i know you guys plays you have to like learn all the plays at training camp and then those can be the plays for the rest of the season for the majority for the majority of it yeah you learn like the base installs so that everybody can get brought up to speed and from there you still create plays based off of the team that you're playing yeah and what they've been doing you try and scheme them up week by week so

the uh the playbook definitely expands after the after training camp but for the most part you get all the the verbiage and all the you get the understanding of like formations and stuff and then from there all the plays kind of just get is it different every year like the coach will come in with a new yeah i joke about coach reed coming in with like a index like stack like this big just like a rubber band around and you just see plays drawn up on him and he's just like

I got some good stuff, guys. But there is a lot of carryover. The majority of your staples are still the same. And the way the football coaches do, they have to teach it to all the new guys as well. So especially when you've been there for a long time, you start from square one in the offseason and during training camp. So at two different times of the year, you'll learn –

what we call this gap, what we call this technique, what we call this play in every minor deep. So he's had inside zone installed to him. I could go up there. Over 35 times. You know what I mean? What is inside zone? Inside zone is when you give it to the running back at a more steep angle downhilly, reads the front side B gap to the backside A gap, reads the really, they're trying to run it towards a three technique to where we can get a double team up to the mic backer. Hopefully you're- Yeah, no, no, no. I knew that. I was just saying-

For this kind of inside zone. Yeah, for me, I'm typically on the backside of the inside zone. And you definitely double back every time to the... There we go. That's right. There's always a double back. There we go. It's incredibly complicated, isn't it? I think it's...

Or is it? We're still football players. Listen to a lot of football players talk. It's not that complicated. No, no. But honestly, I did once when we were doing Zoolander 2, Aaron Rodgers came to Italy. That's a complicated man. Yeah. He's a complicated guy. That's a guy that knows a lot. But I asked him like, okay, how do you do that on the line when you're having to make those split second decisions? And he said like, it's really not...

it's not as complicated as they make it sound on TV. And I was like, yeah, but you're Aaron Rodgers. So it's probably- This is true. It's a little bit, but it sounds like the same thing you're saying, which is kind of like you guys just have it for so many years instinctually, you know it. Yeah. There's a lot of carry over. You learn it over and over again. So it becomes second nature, especially the verbiage aspect of it. But it's a speed. Aaron is another level of the intellectual ability for the game. So obviously it's very much easier for him than a lot of other guys.

But I do think that at the end of the day, a lot of there's carryover, the plays, you've run them a long time now, whether you start in college or high school or high school or even before that. So you tend to retain all that knowledge. So it sounds complex to somebody who doesn't understand it. But I mean, a lot of it's just

common sense though like you're if you're running a play where there's too many guys around a play it's like yeah we shouldn't run the ball over here right let's go around the ball over here it's like numbers and leverage ultimately come down to like what makes it and surprise of it right yeah i mean that's a huge aspect of it catching the defense off guard not being predictable uh can i ask you one other question about football are you kidding me keep going this is one no this is as a fan it's the

the pain aspect. Okay. As we watch numbed out, watching our TV sets being entertained all across America and the world.

you guys are just like smashing into each other and you just take it for granted as an audience member but when you really look at it enjoy it but like what is i mean like what is the reality of that in a game because you know you see it when you see the play where a guy gets twisted around and you see god forbid an awful you know and you're like oh my god this is horrific yeah but first of all like what does that feel like and second of all could a normal human being in you know

guy like me. Yeah.

I don't even mind posing it. There's only one way to find out, man. I don't know if you could do that, but Tony Perkis could definitely get on there too. He has the insecurities necessary to achieve his football dreams. Yeah. But like seriously, what is the level of like what's happening there? Well, I like, like especially when you get the ball, it's like you're like, you ever seen the bird scooters that go like 15, 17 miles an hour and you're just kind of flying around town. It's like riding one of those and then jumping off.

And it's just like you take little collisions like that throughout the day and it's just fun. It's fun. And I feel like when you have pads on and you have the excitement of like,

the team and everything you don't really think of like the camaraderie of the team and doing something for a bigger purpose of other than yourself like you find like fun in competing with guys doing this and i um i don't know i think when i when i when i was playing quarterback growing up i didn't really have that much love for it but once i moved to tight end obviously my skill set was more suited for that but i had more fun

catching the ball and like kind of enjoying those moments where I could be physical, I could kind of like hit a guy because you don't get to just walk down the street and blindside a guy, right? You get to have fun assaulting somebody, you know? It's encouraged. Yeah, it's encouraged. So, it's like you don't really think of it as like pain.

Although you do feel the discomfort after a game and after like a season, you feel the wear and tear for sure. So the adrenaline is taking over? That's what I'm saying. In the middle of a game, the adrenaline is so intense. You'll feel a little bit of pain but it's not something that's going to be like that. But you're like on the line. You're just every play. Oh yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Look at this guy's neck. I don't have any joy. You see this guy's neck? What's wrong with it? It's pretty thick. It's barely there. Oh, yeah. That is just...

Oh, James Riddick. You showing off right now? Well, I also think about the concentration that it takes to catch the ball knowing there's a guy coming. I think that's more intimidating than anything O'Lyman do. I like to make them think that I don't know he's coming. Oh,

Okay. Interesting. I reverse it on them. Yeah. But I'm also known for like not even running my route. So I always like to keep them second guessing. Keep the surprise. That's right. Keep the surprise. Did you ever want to play football? You know, I grew up in New York on the Upper West Side of Manhattan, not in a sports oriented environment. I used to love to play basketball. Nice. You've had some pretty iconic basketball scenes. Yeah. Yeah. I love basketball, but I didn't have the height or the, you know,

I'm Jewish, I can't jump. We're just not allowed. Yeah, I mean, so I wasn't like in that kind of environment, small Upper West Side private school, didn't even have a football team. Had a basketball team, I didn't make the basketball team. I think 14 kids tried out and 12 kids made it and I didn't make it. But it's okay.

I've been cut before too. Jason's never been cut. He doesn't understand this. I've never been cut? But then Owen Wilson's a buddy of mine and he played sports growing up and he always said I could have been like a little scat back type of guy. Do you think you could get a yard in the NFL? I could not. No. I literally wonder what would happen if I could survive a play. Well, I think we could get you a yard. The only way we could get you a yard. I think so. You got enough athleticism. You guys couldn't get Judge Jake a yard? How?

After that yard, I don't know what's happening here. If I'm behind you, all right, man, do tush push with me? Tush push, we'll get that. We'll get that. I was about to say. That's a for sure yard. It's got to secure the snap. You could probably like tush push me, just pick me up and throw me into the end zone. Tush throw. Push tush throw over the top. Just turn Ben into the football. We might have just invented a new version of the tush push. Yeah.

Stiller tush push. Okay. So, we talked about heavyweights and you said it couldn't be made today? Well, it could - yeah, I don't think it would be made by Disney today. You know what I mean? But I think it could be made independently, sure, if somebody wanted to go out and do it. Bob Iger's not backing that? I don't know, man. We should go and see. Yeah. What about Tropic Thunder?

Tropic Thunder, yeah. I've been asked this question before. I think it would have a tougher time getting made today for sure. Yeah, just because first of all, like big comedies with big budgets like that aren't really being made as much if at all. And Tropic Thunder did have some pretty edgy elements to it. At the time, it was edgy. Edgy is a great word. But did anybody complain? I don't ever remember anybody complaining.

Oh yeah. Oh really? Yeah. Nevermind. I'm going to go back over here. No, no, no, no. You didn't think that? No, no, no. In a different way, it was again, this is, what is it? 15 years ago or something? It was 2008 or something. It was like a different sort of reaction to things that wasn't as in the moment and as much of a kind of a waterfall of, you know, reaction immediately. Yeah. No, I mean, my character,

that I played, Tug was playing this character of Simple Jack. That was, you know. Yeah, that won't be tough. That got some blowback from people. You know, I showed the movie to the NAACP in L.A. before we released the movie because of Robert's character. Of course. And to me, the joke in the movie always was that these actors are trying to do anything they can to win an award.

and be taken seriously. So to me, that was why it was always clear to me that's the joke of the movie. And I think people who get the movie get that. But you definitely want to get a sense of how people are reacting to it. So we did. But that's what comedy is. You got to take chances. You got to put it out there. And yeah, we got a little bit of blowback. But as long as you're clear, you

you know, where the joke is and that you're clear about your intention, you can, you know, then I think you can hear criticism and it can be valid, but you know where you're coming from and you can stand by it, which I do. I still stand by the movie and I would hope that we could make another Tropic Thunder. Oh my gosh, it's so good. I tried to show it to my kids.

My oldest is five. Jesus. I wasn't trying to show it to her. I was just putting it on. The girls walked into the room. What was the review? It was not good. It was during the talk. He just lost his hands. Oh, my God. It was early on. Intestines are all over the place. I forget Kylie's exactly. Do you remember what Kylie said other than turn this off right now?

You'll be getting the therapy bill from your kids in about 15 years. No doubt. Do you have a favorite comedy movie you've made? Oh, that I've made? I mean, Tropic Thunder for me was like one of the most fun experiences just because we were all together. It was such an amazing cast just to be with those guys. And it was an idea that I had had

from back in like 1987. - Yeah, that's so cool. - And then we finally made the movie in 2007. So literally had been sort of gestating that long. So to actually be making it was sort of surreal that we were finally doing it. So for me, that experience was one of my favorites. And yeah, but like,

you know, doing meet the parents with Robert De Niro is all, will always be an incredibly exciting thing that happened, you know, to just, and kind of surreal. Cause I just love him so much. Yeah. And yeah. And then getting to, yeah. I mean, I don't know. It's, it's every time you're in it, it's always different. I don't know if you guys are like this when you're,

you know, when you're doing your thing, but like you're in it and it's sometimes it's hard to appreciate it when you're in it. Cause you have to be focusing on what you're doing. Yeah. Yeah. I'm right there with you. Cause they always say like football players or even any athletes say like, go out there and have fun. Is that, is that a real thing? I feel like I play my best when I'm out there just enjoying the moments with the guys. And it's 100%. I don't like to kind of look at things as it's complete or like I'm,

I'm more in the moment trying to think about the next play, trying to think about the next like way we're going to attack them, how I'm going to handle this situation and think about that than I am like, man,

this is sweet. I do think though, that's why they tell you to have fun because it's so easy to lose track of the fact that we're all playing a game and this should be fun. You get bogged down in where you're at and trying to remember the play or the moment, what's it down in distance, all these things. You lose track of the fact that like, if you guys are genuinely enjoying being out there and having fun, there's an enthusiasm and an energy that permeates and makes everybody usually perform better. And I think that's one thing that I watched Trav, I've always been like,

For some reason, it always looks like he brings that out on the field. And there's certain guys that have a tendency, you just watch a game and people gravitate towards them. It makes them feel like they're kids again. And as a player, for me, I oftentimes wasn't that. I always appreciated playing with those guys because it made me feel like I was playing in the backyard with my buddies again. Right, yeah. Even though we're in front of this huge stadium, right?

- Right, and you see the joy that you have when like, I mean, obviously end zone celebrations or just when first down or something like that. But I think, you know, that enjoyment of connecting with your teammates and doing the work in the moment and like it working when you like, you know, complete a play that works.

I have that same appreciation when I'm working on a movie that the enjoyment of the process. Heck yeah. And actually for me, that's my favorite part of all of this is being in process with something or sitting in the editing room and cutting together a sequence, putting some music on it and feeling it come together. That to me is the best. And that is important, I think, to have that appreciation of the process because it's

you know, with a movie or something like that, it comes out and then people either like it or they don't like it and you have no control over that, right? It's just going out into the world. But the process is what you experienced and what you own. And so, you have to enjoy that because the rest of it is sort of then you're at the whim of like, you know, what people thought. And that's - by the way, that's like trial and error for me over the years. Oh, 100%. I've learned that

Throughout the course of my career, I came in wanting to have all the stats, wanting to have all the acknowledgement of he's a great player. And I mean, I've been fortunate to like get a lot of those stats and have successful years and win Super Bowls. But at the same time, when I'm like kind of like in it, like I find more love in.

building that piece than I am just kind of looking back like, oh man, that's awesome. Like it was more just like the feeling of doing it with them in the moment that just like really that's where it's most enjoyable for me. I actually remember when we were doing Tropic Thunder talking to Robert Downey about it.

because at that point i think he had just done iron man but he it hadn't come out yet you know and he had this interesting trajectory to his career where you know he had a lot of acclaim and he went through a lot of challenges and then you know and then iron man came out and kind of like revitalized his career yeah um but as an actor he's always been like one of the best actors ever uh and i remember talking when we were doing the movie about this sense of sort of like we've worked

You and I, we've all worked really hard over the years because this is, you know, we'd already been doing it for whatever, like 25 years probably or whatever. And so the enjoyment of knowing that you put in a lot of work and then having a freedom to then go and put something out there and try things and do your thing.

with a sense of... Oh, man. That had to be such a relief to just be able to cut it loose like that. Yeah. An appreciation of that. Say like, yeah, I have put this work in. And it's not like an ego thing. It's more like, hey, okay, we're here and we've done this a lot. And it's what you were saying about putting those work in on those plays your whole life. Then you kind of can go out there and let go in a way and appreciate the fun of that too, right? While you still are locked in and trying to do something new and...

hit the next level. And I think that's an important thing in the process to appreciate. - You fucking hit it, dude. 'Cause that movie is classic. How did you get Tom Cruise to jump in on this, dude? I mean, the star-studded line up. - This is a crazy one. I mean, Tom and I knew each other a little bit 'cause we had done,

of fan my whole life yeah uh you know just watching his movies forever and i'd met him a few times over the years and we did a little short for mtv movie awards this is like 25 years ago i think

because I was on my honeymoon. We came back from our honeymoon in Australia to do this thing with Tom where I was a stuntman. I pretended I was a stuntman. Oh, yeah. I remember this. It was so good. And Mission Impossible 2. And we had so much fun doing that. And then a few years - Finish your own sentences. Yeah, it was so fun and weird doing that. And then we stayed in touch

And this was again, a few years go by and actually, we'd been talking about trying to figure out something to do but hadn't figured it out. And then I was working on the Tropic Thunder script and I had actually done -

a home movie for my wife for her birthday that was a takeoff on the show 24 and it was called 17 or 17 minutes long and it started my brother-in-law Brian Taylor who happens to be here today who's not an actor Brian is the worst actor ever

- Which can also be really good at times. - They have an alarm company in Allentown, Pennsylvania. He's not a professional actor. So the fun of the joke was let's put him in a movie with like real actors. And he was obsessed with Tom's speech from "A Few Good Men."

You know, or the Jack Nicholson speech from A Few Good Men that he gives to Tom Cruise where he says, you know, you can't handle the truth. Right. I said, Tom, we're doing this whole movie for Christine. Would you maybe come and do like a scene in it where my brother-in-law is going to recite the Jack Nicholson speech to you? And he said, yes.

And there's video evidence of this. Yes, there is video evidence. And he came down and he was so professional and like it blew my mind. He was so good. And Brian did the speech to him. And then we had so much fun doing that that the Tropic Thunder came up. I called him. I said, look, let's maybe –

"Are you interested in this movie?" And he looked and he said, "You know, you make fun of the actors, you make fun of everybody in the agents and all that, but you don't make fun of the studio heads. You should have a studio head." So, it was his idea. Oh my gosh. That character. What? That character did not exist before he suggested it. I feel like it is such a good- And then it became such an important part of the story. And this was three months before we started shooting the movie.

And we rewrote, Justin Theroux and I were working on it, Etan Cohen, and Justin and I rewrote these scenes and put them in. And then Tom said, "Also, I feel like I want to dance in the movie. I just want to dance." So, this was purely like his instinct. I'm going to have a bodysuit on. Yeah. And then we did a makeup test. A bald cap and go crazy. Yeah. And we put him in the makeup and he started dancing in the makeup test. We gave him some Diet Cokes to crush.

And then we put - and then I think I put Get Back by Ludacris in the makeup test and I was like this could be really fun. So good. And yeah, he came in and just - yeah, so it was pretty crazy how that happened. That's awesome. That is crazy. How did Brian do in his speech? Brian - well, he was perfectly bad as he should have been.

Head of White Brunt. God damn, that's good stuff. I got to ask you more about your basketball love or your sports love. So, you were at the Oscars not too long ago, getting hype about the Knicks win. Yeah. Let's go. Not sure if it was even an important game. It was just like, you watch every game like that? I do watch every game. No.

I do, yeah. You know, the last few years, like my whole life I've been a Knicks fan. Last few years have been pretty exciting. Heck yeah. So many years in the wilderness, especially like the last like 10 years before this. Yeah. Yeah. I try to watch every game and I now have realized I have to actually put the games into my schedule.

even if I'm not going to them just to watch them on to not like plan a dinner or something. Because I start to resent that I'm at dinner. So I knew that the game was happening during the Oscars and then I, but I was focused on doing the thing at the Oscars and then like once it was done I was leaving and after

After I'd done my thing, I was going back to my hotel and I realized, oh my God, the Knicks game is on. So, then I like checked it because I hadn't checked it the whole day or been aware of it as much to be honest. I wasn't - but I knew it was happening. And then I saw the Knicks had won. I was like, oh, this is great. I just finished my - the Oscars and the Knicks won. I'm happy. Knicks win. Yeah. And then I guess somebody picked up the fact that I had been like at the Oscars. Oh, you're backstage right now. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But I mean, I genuinely do. You know, I went to the Lakers game where Brunson got injured. And, you know, I genuinely love going to the games. I feel like I've always told myself I want to go to a game in Madison Square Garden. It was actually a big reason why we went to or I went to Cincinnati because the Big East championship is in the garden. I've always imagined the garden as like

obviously the Mecca, but it is like the top of like the basketball culture where it gets right. No, I haven't been to a game yet. Oh, okay. And I've been telling myself I'm going to go when the Knicks are good and it's rocking and it's just been like, you have to come to a game. I have to, I know. Why don't you come to a game? I'm going to, I'll tell you what, the Cavs meet the Knicks in the playoffs. Cause that thing, I want it to be like the Knicks. I don't know if it's like that every single game, but I know when it's an important game, that thing is like,

madness. You can see it on TV. Honestly, any game, if it's a good game, it goes crazy. It's just so intense. But the playoffs, there's nothing. When they beat Philadelphia in the playoffs last season and Dante DiVincenzo hit that shot. I don't know if you remember that play, but it was just...

I never felt anything like it. Yeah. Me and Jason talk about it all the time. There's no better ticket in sports than courtside at an NBA game. There's nothing better, right? It's so close to it. Yeah, you're right. That was the first time I ever – I went back. Travis had courtside tickets at the Cavs for the second half of the season every year. When Brown was there. Yeah, when the Browns. So he lets me borrow a couple of the tickets. I go there. And that was my first time realizing, oh, my God, these guys are like –

So much better players like they're moving so fast like they have springs on their feet Yeah, it was just in the sides. Yeah, like I think it's easy It's harder when you're brought back from it to really realize how big an athletic you don't yeah for sure But when you're on the court, it's like oh that guy is hot

Yeah, yeah, yeah. For sure. I mean, even just seeing LeBron in person, you know, like I was watching the other night. I mean, it's just, he's just so big. Yeah. And he's so strong. And he gets the ball and all of a sudden, it's just like the tension level goes up and the defender gets up on whoever it is because it's like LeBron's got the ball and he's like, he can impose his will still. And he's 40 years old doing it, which is insane. He did a spin move and a dunk and I was like, I've never seen that.

I've seen that before. Yeah, it's very impressive. Would you rather win an Academy Award or Knicks win the NBA championship? I don't know. I mean, I think the Knicks, you know, realistically, I think the Knicks winning a championship-

It's in the cards. All right. All right. So, I'm definitely down for that. Yeah. But if I was forced - like if I was forced - like definitely and I've heard - Jon Stewart was asked this question and he said Knicks too so I'm not gonna not say Knicks. All right. But I also feel like I really think like at the end of the day, if I knew that I had the choice,

I would give it to the Knicks because I knew at least I had the choice in this weird - This weird hypothetical - This weird non-real situation. But it means a lot to a lot of people too. It's like you're - It's like this - I don't care. Yeah, the Knicks winning a champion - like it's so - it's still a little bit like - it seems a little bit like oh my god, I can't imagine that but we're just starting to feel like it. But then always something happens where - Yeah. You know.

Yeah. I mean, Cleveland was there for forever too, so I get it. Cleveland is having an incredible year. Oh, I'm fired up. Yeah, incredible year. We're just talking about it. Jason's kind of like here right now with basketball and I'm just like, dude, just watch the Cavs. Donovan Mitchell is a New York guy too. He's just incredible. Yeah. So, they've got a great thing going on. See, we kind of got on the basketball kick. I got to talk about one of my favorite scenes that you directed in Cable Guy with Jim Carrey. Mm-hmm.

Him coming into the gym. The basketball? Yeah, the basketball scene with him coming into the gym. I don't know if you understand. You had everybody trying to jump off of their friend's back to dunk the basketball. And I just remember it never working. It's not like...

In the movie, he was like a trampoline. I was like, oh my gosh, if I could do that. I was a little bit heavier. I was always like twice the size of all my friends. And I was like, dude, just get on all fours. I'm going to jump off your back. It really makes no sense, that move. But it was so funny. I remember we...

We had well we were like, you know, like Jim we wanted to come up with like some insane set piece where Jim would just be you know The just the biggest kind of asshole guy comes in to play a pickup basketball game Yeah, and Jack Black I guess is like he's like he runs up on Jack Black But I remember we put like an Apple box or something next to Jack. It was very low-tech There was no like if we did it today there would be like CG and it would be like it probably it was just a very like

kind of like a simplistic way of doing it where he's like on an Apple box right behind him when he jumps up. But then, yeah. And then he shatters the backboard. But we had such a good time making that movie. And Matthew Broderick is so funny in it. Yeah. Yeah. And Jim is just insane. Have you ever had him on the podcast?

He's so funny. I mean, he's like one of those guys who'll just do something to make you laugh and then he'll just keep doing it until you stop laughing. It was fun to just be working with him at that moment where he was just sort of like

willing to like take, you know, any chance and just do whatever, you know, he thought could be funny. And we were just having a great time together. Hell yeah. We kind of touched on it before in terms of writing for, for yourself or for guys, they kind of just have like those instincts of like,

improv, how much of it is hard as a director to control that, to try and keep the script the script, you know? How much do you juggle with that as a director? I did a movie once, Mystery Men. Dude, are you kidding? I just did it, yeah, just one time. I forgot about that movie, but it's great. It was not a blockbuster at the time. But one of the actors was not as into improv.

and a lot of the other actors were and we were kind of figuring it out as we went along and that ended up sometimes being a thing. - Okay, gotcha. - Yeah, where that actor would want to just like, "Hey, can we just stick to the script?" - Hey, can we just do what we planned? - And by the way, a great actor, just it wasn't his process as much. - Yeah. - You'd be surprised. You do it on the football field too. - Really? - Yeah. - Oh yeah. - Like you said, you go dictum improv. - Oh, I'll improv. - Does the coach get mad or not? - Oh yeah. - Sometimes. - You get that look, he gives you the eyebrow look.

But then he gets happy sometimes. Never do that again. When it works. When it works. He's happy when it works, right? I'll come to the sideline. Little lateral on the side. Oh, yeah. Just don't ever do that again, Travis. Got it. He's got a good commercial career going too. Yes, he does. He's a Hollywood guy right there. You know what I mean? He gets it. He gets the entertainment aspect of it. The nuggies. Sure. Nuggies, man. No, he's killing it. Speaking of severance, it is time that we put this disclaimer out. All right. We're at the point of the show where we're going to talk about severance, folks. We're

We're going to do it in a segment called We Gotta Ask. You don't have to answer, which I think there's going to be a lot of these you probably aren't going to answer. Basically, we're going to ask you a bunch of questions. You tell us whether...

What you think of it, you can toss the fuck off, whatever you want. Okay. And since you've been a great guest, we're going to get to this section while having our very own waffle party. Oh, yeah. What was the inspiration behind the waffle party? This is a Dan Erickson who wrote the pilot and is the creator of the show. And we've been working on it together over the years. He has a brilliant mind and waffle party being some, I don't know where that came from his mind as the, you know, the celebration when you have the reward.

when you get to a certain point. It's not a pizza party. It's a waffle party. These might be a little raspberry. But for a long time in season one, you know, we didn't know what the waffle party actually was. Eventually we defined it

in the second to last episode. But it was fun to think about what is a waffle party? What's the metaphor? What does that mean? What does it mean? Well, I mean, I think it's more than just waffles is what I feel. Okay. What would be the best reward you could have if you're working in this place every day and you don't get to leave?

And you know, you're a human being and so somewhat party aspect, I don't know. Yeah? Yeah. I mean, I love it. I'm about to start having waffle parties all the time now with no underline here. Great, wow. It was just so funny because it felt like childlike. Yes. And these are grown adults who are subjected to in some ways slave labor as innies. Well, they're kind of like kids because they've only had consciousness for a short amount of time. Right. And they don't really have any freedom.

And they're told, yeah, a waffle party is like the best thing. This is it. These are good though. I'm just going to butter it up just a little bit. Are waffles on your training camp menu? I'll tell you what, there was a waffle house next to Lehigh Valley where we had training camp back when it was remote. That was our Chick-fil-A. That's where we would go. Now, a lot of the shots in Severson, we're talking about symmetry. That's, I mean, the opening episode, everything is just so like...

I just feel like it was so thought out in the colors that you chose. The building blows my mind. Is that a real? How much was it was of of it was like a studio set and how much of it was like an actual building that you guys found? Because the inside of that building was so big, the shots seemed so massive and it seemed so epic.

Yeah, that building is a real building. It's and it is huge. It even is bigger in real life when you go there than it feels. I think when you see it on the show, because it's just ceilings are so free. It's in New Jersey. It's in Holmdel, New Jersey. And it's it was it.

It's now kind of like an office complex and a mall, but it used to be the headquarters of Bell Labs. And they developed the transistor chip there, I think in the 60s. So, that's why the water tower there has that interesting shape where it kind of looks like a transistor. Yeah.

When we found it, Jessica Lee Gagne, who's our cinematographer, we were Googling stuff and she found this place. And we looked at it from above and it looked like this giant sort of like almost like an egg shape with this. The building was there and then the parking lot was like an egg shape all around it. And we're like, this is so crazy, this view and this shape. And then we went there and it was just gigantic.

and kind of empty. So, and nobody had filmed anything there. That was the, that's, so when you're making movies and you find a location, you get so excited when you find a really cool location that nobody's ever filmed at because you don't want to have something that's been in another movie. Yeah. And so when we found that, that was the first thing we found. And then we designed the sets and all the interiors and everything are on sound stages that we shot up in the Bronx. But, um, but that was like the design sort of

the first sort of inspiration for the rest of the show. Yeah. And it was a guy named Eero Saarinen, who's an architect in the 50s who made that building. Did you always imagine the characters having that fun kind of comedy banter? Or like, because it's such a, it's a very serious show, or at least it feels very like... No, you're right, though. Like in the...

When I read the script that Dan wrote, it was a pilot. He wrote a spec pilot on his own that he brought to our company. When I read that banter, it reminded me of shows I love like The Office or Parks and Rec, this back and forth thing that they had. And what was so fascinating to me was, oh, these guys are like doing this kind of funny office humor, but yet funny.

They don't know who they are, why they're there, what they're doing. It's so good. Yeah, they don't know anything. It's like so that's like this weird sort of Twilight Zone aspect to it. And it's very surreal and kind of abstract in a way. Like, well, what is going on here? So that humor and that office workplace thing is actually for me always been sort of the core of what the show is. And then it's definitely developed into. Oh, yeah. Into what it is. That's awesome. Are you surprised by the fan base the show has built up?

Sorry. I do not want to take away from the waffles. Yeah. That raspberry butter. Sweet check. Delicious. Strawberry butter. I haven't had a waffle in...

I think since we shot the waffle party. I was about to say, yeah, you had to jump in there at least one time, right? When we shot the waffle party, we had these waffles. And I was like, I got to have a taste of one of those waffles. And that was like three years ago. For old time's sake. Yeah, it's crazy because we were off the air for three years. Oh, I remember. Yeah. It was incredibly infuriating as a fan of the show. Well, I appreciate that you were a fan from the first season because a lot of people didn't discover it until now. I told so many people, have you guys seen this show on Apple TV? It was like

all i could think about thanks you know you did a great job of leaving on that cliffhanger with mark yeah the birthing yeah yeah yeah he's at seven and rick and he's like she's alive yeah that's right yeah and the um when is this next episode going to come out when it's the next season i know

I know when we got hit with the the strike there was a writer as an actor strike and it took us a little bit while a while to kind of like regroup after that and the show which I think we shot for 186 days on season two yes there's a lot of shooting and editing and editing takes a while but thank goodness that the audience was like was there when we came back on and I mean almost built the suspense up even more yeah and everybody just kept talking about

Yeah, and the challenge was just to get people who hadn't seen the show to watch the first season. So Apple did a really good job, I think, of getting the word out. And we did as much press as we could. But also three years later, Apple TV Plus is actually a different –

It's a different situation there now because they have more viewers too because when we started out we were one of the first shows Talking about a kind of doing some promo for it was the the art museum set up wasn't it even at an art museum It was like a pop-up like office set up. Oh, yeah, I like the weirdest promo you've ever done for a show Yeah, that was really crazy. We set up the office cubicle in a glass cube and

in Grand Central Station. - That's where it was, Grand Central Station. - And it was an idea that they had and Adam Scott said, "Well, if the actors, the real actors can go in there and do it." And the fact that they were willing to go in there, and I said, "They have to do it for like at least three hours." 'Cause like, it just has to be enough time that people can be walking by and just go, "What's that?" - Yeah. - Oh my God, people going home from work. Like, wait a minute. Like people who knew the show, people who didn't know the show. And of course people started filming with their phones and stuff. And it became, it did become a viral thing. And that, I think,

Ended up probably getting more attention than if we had just done a premiere. Press run or something. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Because it was so organic. And it was so much fun to watch them just in this cube because the actors just started improvising and doing stuff. I was going to say, was there a script? Were they even told to talk about it? Could they even be heard? They couldn't be heard. So they knew that. So they had that freedom. And they knew that they were going to be in character.

So, they're actually doing Dylan and Mark. Yes. And Patricia came in as Miss Cobell and she started throwing stuff at Adam and made him stand in the corner. And there's just like so many funny moments. But I knew as actors, I knew they were just going to sort of fall into it because it's like what you do. So, it's like for them, it's like, okay, this is like a performance art piece and they had so much fun with it. And I was just like watching, taking pictures. And yeah, it was awesome. What's it like directing something as complicated in some...

I mean, it just becomes, you know, I've been directing for like a lot, for most of my life, I guess. And I love it so much. It's such a collaborative experience. You're working with cinematographers, you know, the production designer, costume designer, actors, editor, all these people, it's a group effort.

And I just, I love the process, what we were talking about earlier. So for something like this, when you have everybody who's sort of like focused on this vision that Dan laid out in his script,

Everybody's working sort of like towards the same goal and And you want to get people to just be as creative as possible and work with people who you want to bring as much of their own Personal sort of inspiration to it sure so I think that's like a big part of it and then it's become it's basically been my full-time job for the last five years and I've loved it it's just You go to work every day, you know, and you have your you know, whatever scene you're gonna approach I think acting is

is harder honestly you know when you have to get in front of a camera and like show up in the morning and do an emotional scene where you're going to break down crying in your car or whatever it is that's you know that's challenging yeah as a director you can come set up the camera try to help the actor as much as possible create an environment but they have to do that thing and so for me using that part of my brain as a director i really enjoy because in a way i feel like

you know, every day I kind of know what I'm going to be doing. Acting stresses me out a little more because, you know, it's like, oh shit, I have that scene today where I have to pull that up. And I really admire, it made me, it's made me admire actors so much more as a director, just working with them, you know, because I just see when you're doing both, because a lot of over the years I did it, I acted and directed in a lot of movies. I mean, when you're really just directing, I think you can just

focus on what you're doing, be there for the other actors more and be connected to the crew and sort of adjust things. And I love the process of it. And by the way, I just have to say we have other great directors, Jessica Lee Gunye, our cinematographer directed our episode seven that just came out. There's so many cool shots in this. Like I'm just blown away by some of the shots. We have amazing people working on the show. Come back to Harmony Clavel.

Yeah, Patricia Arquette. Oh my gosh. That was... I don't know if anybody saw that portion of it coming because there wasn't a lot of hints to that. Oh, to her going back to her last episode? Yeah. I don't know what... But yeah. What is...

I don't know. I feel like there's more questions now than there were before. Exactly. But that's how - that's kind of the fun of - and I can only imagine how fun that is trying to keep that question in the air. Like the underlying meaning of everything and the theories. Have you heard of any like fan theories that you're like, "Oh, that's a good one. Didn't even think of that." Yeah, there are - there's so many on this show. People - and people put out - there's so much fan art and fan edits and

and theorizing and podcasts about it that I don't, I try not to get into it. - I consume a lot of that. - Yeah, I try not to because we have to focus on what we want it to be. But of course you hear ideas that are like really interesting and you go, oh yeah, that could actually be something. But you don't want it to really influence like what we're doing.

But yet you are aware of the audience. You want the audience to enjoy the show. But everybody seems to have a different way into the show too and different things that they love the Mark Helly relationship. They love the Mark Gemma relationship. They love Miss Cabell or Milchick, you know? So what's interesting is you make the show. We made the season. We basically locked the season and finished in, I'd say, like,

September, October, and I was doing some mixing and visual effects stuff through the fall, but it's done. So, you know, as you're watching people react in real time, it's not like, you know, like, oh, you're watching a sports team where you go, you know, they really should have this guy play that position or, you know, you can't make any changes. It's all set in stone. So, I'm watching people react and they go, oh, this episode was the best episode or I really didn't like that episode or I wonder what's going to happen, you know, or they should do this or that. I'm like, well, it's just

It is what it's gonna be. Next week is gonna come out. You're gonna find out. I mean, that has been something like, especially you go knee deep in the theories each week. Yeah. And it's fun to watch. Oh, well, that didn't end up panning out. Now we're on to the next theory, right? Exactly, yeah. And so we know what it is and like what we've done for the season. And I'm just watching in real time because it's not a binge show too. It's coming out week to week.

So that's very different too, as opposed to, you know, if you're watching something where you can watch every single episode, people can then go like, oh, that frustrated me. I'm going to watch the next episode and I get the answer I wanted. But here you get people for like a whole week going like, oh, you know, that's, is it going to go this way? Is it going to go that way? Or that frustrated me. So it plays out differently than I think once the show's out in a couple of weeks, then people will be able to binge the whole thing. And that'll be a different experience for them watching it too. Yeah.

I have two people - three people who I show the show to when we're in process which is my wife, my son and my daughter. Nice. So, they - Just get the family, yeah. So, they - They have all the answers. Well, they see it as like I'll show them a rough cut. Oh, Brian too. Brian I've showed, right? Yeah. And so, I'll get feedback from them but you can't show everybody the whole series so you can only pick a few people who you go, "Okay, do you want to watch cuts as we go along?" Yeah. Oh, that's going to be exciting. Yeah. Talking about some characters.

Adam Scott. Yes. Absolutely kills it. He's amazing. Was he always kind of the first - I don't want to bring that - he was always the first choice for you or? He was always the first choice for me from the second I read the pilot script that Dan gave me and I think Dan had been thinking about him too and I reached out to him immediately and then Apple had some other ideas about casting it and I was very

Firm like I really felt Adam was the guy and Adam luckily stuck with it and stuck through with me and and ended up

doing it and I'm so happy because I do and again for that same reason of like the office workplace comedy vibe that he brings but I also know he has this deeper thing underneath oh yeah and to watch him really embrace that over the course of making the show and even just the way he approached playing Audi Mark and any Mark his voice his physicality it's all so different you know and he really works so hard to do that and he's also like this crazy like

robot actor guy who can do anything like he and I mean that a good way because like somebody say robot actor But like he is so specific and so precision in terms of being able to make an adjustment Yeah, you know like he can make an adjustment. That's sort of just like a little you know a thing where he like, you know if you could just like lean a little to the right because the camera sees this behind you and still do the moment or you know, Just he's amazing. Yeah, that's awesome. All of the actors are fantastic

Yeah. And John Turturro and never worked with him before. And he's just an intense, great guy. The outdoor episode. Oh, yeah. The Catskills. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That moment with Helly. And speaking of like even Helly and Helena. Yeah. The facial expression change. No, Brit this year. Like, oh my gosh. Yeah. This year, Brit having to play Helena and Helly. Yeah.

And again, the same thing Adam has been doing. But these actors are thinking about the characters so deeply that they always come in with so many great ideas. And I really listen to them, even just on story level, you know, just tone, everything. They understand it so well. So, you know, we'll be talking about an idea for a scene and Adam will say like, you know, I don't know if that really feels like

severance to me, you know? And it's hard to define it sometimes, but it's that kind of thing. Also, when you're trying to push the boundary a little bit and take some chances like we've done in season two, you know, you're trying to define like, okay, does this still feel like the show? And I think when you trust your actors and you know that they have a sense of who they are in the show, you know, I really rely on that a lot. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, let's ask the biggest question maybe, would you get severed? Would I get severed? You have potentially more information for where this goes than we do. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The idea of it does not seem like a great idea. No. It's a lot of control you're giving up. Yeah. I feel like, you know, yeah. So, for me, it's no because like I want to experience my life, the life that I have left with, right? Because like we're here for not so long. Yeah.

Like I want to feel it all. I feel like there's so many metaphors for severance in life though, right? In terms of how we suppress or cut off, you know? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, exactly. And I feel like, you know, people do that in all different sorts of ways. And, you know, I probably do that in my life in a lot of different ways. I had a great text from a really good buddy of mine who played in the NFL, also served the United States Army. He said, you won't accomplish anything

worth having in life unless it was hard getting it. And it's kind of like, you know, I feel like severance, a lot of the themes are like, and it seems where it's going is being severed from all of these painful traumatic things, but you lose sight of the fact that these painful traumatic things are part of living life and they're necessary to have. And it's,

It's an undoubtedly no answer for that reason. But yeah, I think that's very much about what the show is. You know, like it's this life, you know, pain is such a big part of our experience. And of course, there's that duality thing of like, well, you can't have, you know,

pain and enjoying life, these things are separate, right? Yeah. Pleasure and pain, but you can't have pleasure without pain. What is pleasure without pain? Yeah. What is it, Jason? I don't know. Please tell me. I believed you when you said that. Is Cobell officially...

a character we're rooting for now or is this still a part of the evil? I mean, that's the fun. Again, I think that's the fun of the show is that you have people like Milchick and Cobell. For sure. And Helena and all these people that you don't quite know, right? Yeah. And I like that she's always kind of had her own severed version of, even though she's not severed, that she's Miss Selvig and playing his... She's kind of imagining a life as a normal person too when she's living next door to

Yeah, Mark. So, yeah, the duality thing is a big part of the of the characters. And I think that's fun for the audience to sit in. OK, can I ask you one more is is Irv? Is there more to the Irv and Bert relationship that hasn't been? I'm assuming. Yes.

Okay. I'm sorry. I don't want to push you. I don't want to push you. I really don't. Because you- When is this thing going to be on? It'll be on the day the last or the week the last episode comes out. Oh, yeah. Okay. We will have answers by Wednesday. Yeah. Yes. All shall be revealed. Okay. Fair enough. Nice. That is good. That is good. Yeah. Because it feels- Well, I feel like where we are now- The elevator painting with the Gemma episode all of a sudden reveals more like, oh, there's another floor to this that-

All right. All right. I'll stop. I'll stop. I'll stop. I'll stop. Listen, I'm telling you, I'm all over this thing. I can't tell you. The spoiler thing, but I would be, yeah, I have, I just had an idea, but I'll tell you that later. Okay. Perfect. I will tune in regardless. Yeah. Are we going to have to wait for a...

Three years for season three to come out or? No, no, the plan is not. Definitely not. Let's go! Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, the plan is not and hopefully we'll be announcing what the plan is very soon. That will not be that. All right, well, I'll be at Grand Central Station for it. Let's go sit in a cube together and see what happens. Don't you threaten me with a good time. I'm just gonna have it courtside at the Knicks game. By the way, I went to a Knicks game with Taylor. She was there like this was like 10 years ago

And I was there with my son and she literally, we FaceTimed my daughter who's a huge Swiftie. - Oh nice. - She's 23 now. And we had the best time. She was incredible. - Oh yeah, I appreciate that. I think the same thing, so it's perfect. - Yeah. - You're right, maybe we can get Taylor to another Knicks game. - Yeah, well, this is the time. You should definitely come though if you wanna, I mean,

I can hook that up. Say no more. Say no more. I'm sure you would need help getting it. I mean, it's always a little smoother when you get... All right. Well, let's do it. Come on. I'm in, dude. Dude, thank you so much. Thanks, man. It's so great talking to you guys. I am...

This is a dream come true, man. You've been one of the idols of everyone from the 90s growing up and all the amazing movies you did. But now it's just so cool to see that you're every bit of a great dude as you are a great actor and director. Thanks, man. Well, it's fun for us. I was talking to Sam, we were working on Happy Gilmore. It's crazy, man. It's a kick because you guys, when you were kids watching this stuff and it resonated and we enjoy watching you guys do your thing. Super cool.

I can't wait to see what Hal's got in store for us. Yeah, it's a little insane. It's insane. I can't wait, dude. Well, thanks again, brother, man. Thanks, Ben. Yeah, great talking to you. Great talking to you. Thanks for the waffles. Nice. Yeah, great waffle party. My first one. Look forward to that. Next time we'll have a cantaloupe with your face on it. Exactly. No one will.

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Man, what a guy, man. There's just some people that it's just, it's fun as hell to talk to and the whole time you're talking to them, like, I can't believe I'm talking to fucking Ben Stitt. It's amazing. Dude, I love how he brought up Mystery Men right at the end there. I forgot all about that movie. I even told him, I forgot you did that. But that was a funny movie. That one's actually on, it's on cable TV a lot more than you would expect. Really? I'll just be searching the guide on like a

cable network and I'll come across Mystery Men every now and then and just fucking press, press, I'll just click on it. You know, this isn't a Ben Stiller movie, but whenever I think of like the superhero movies, the ones that are like off the beaten trail, like it's like,

Clearly, they were kind of poking fun at the superhero movies. Is it Mr. Blank Man? What's the one with Doug? Do you know which one I'm talking about? That's my favorite superhero movie of all time. Wayne's brother, dude. I'm sorry to segue out of... Blank Man was fucking hilarious. Dude, that movie is fucking amazing. Yeah.

Now, that's one I'd have to re-watch. I know we're on Ben Stiller. I know we're on Ben Stiller. No, I'd have to re-watch Blank Man. I haven't seen that one in fucking forever. What's Blank Man on Rotten Tomatoes? Oh, it's got to be Through the Roof. 12%! Critic review! It's only funny because I didn't expect it to have a high rating.

like Rotten Tomato review, but still a classic. I don't care what the critics say. That movie's fucking great. Undeniable classic. Anyways, Mystery Men, great movie. Ben Stiller is a

The best. All righty. Let's get in some March Madness. The March Madness Brackets brought to you by Reese's Peanut Butter Cups. That's a Kelsey favorite right there. I definitely did get my Reese's backpacks and my Reese's varsity jacket. I am not in Kansas City, though, right now. I really like the seasonal Reese's cups that are the egg version. Yeah.

Yeah. Oh, I don't like white chocolate. These. Oh, no. These. There they are. There they are. Yeah. Any of the... They're a little bit thicker, a little bit more protein, a little more peanut butter to chocolate ratio. Yeah.

Have you tried these? Have you tried these? I have not. I didn't see that one in there. I'm going to try that one out. All right. If there was a bracket of Reese's, Jason, what's in your final four? Final four of Reese's. Everybody keeps saying, like, why do they say Reese's? I was like, I don't know, guys. That's how we fucking say it. I don't know which one we say. This is how I've always said it. Everybody knows what we're talking about, so can we stop acting like it's that big of a deal? Yes. I'm sorry, Reese's, that I'm saying it incorrectly sometimes. I'm not sorry. I'm not sorry at all.

Obviously, original Reese's peanut butter cups have to be in it. Yeah, I think they're the number one and they win it. I don't think they win it. Reese's...

pieces or as we would call it Reese's Pieces. Reese's Pieces. Do not sleep on Reese's Pieces. I like Reese's Pieces better. I love Reese's Pieces. I like Reese's Pieces and like ice cream and shit. I can't just do them just straight up. You're fucking out of your mind. Go eat some Reese's Pieces. You'll fucking be able to eat them. I know. I'm in my mind and my mind is telling me that's not how I want to enjoy my

my Reese's Pieces. I mean, it's great as an additive as well, but it's also great on its own. They're fantastic. Reese's Pieces, Fast Break, are you putting that up there? No. No? Take 5? Is Take 5 a Reese's? I think it is, right? Yeah, but it's not up there. Take 5 is great. You guys are out of your mind if you're not putting Take 5 up there. I'm not saying... It's not a Reese's product. I think it got switched. I think Reese's bought it. Yeah, Reese's bought it, but it's not a Reese's. I think it's Reese's Take 5 now. Yeah, now, but that's just because they...

Own the market. It literally says Reese's take five. Yeah. Reese's take five in my top four. Cause the take five is fantastic. You're out of your mind. If you don't have it up there, you put Reese's Reese's take five. You're right. You're correct. I'm just going off what the nice people at Reese's sent me as a document. God damn it. Jesus. I know my Reese's.

I know my Reese's. Have you said eggs yet? Have you said eggs yet? Not yet. That was going to be my fourth one. All right, all right, all right. I was going to say Reese's eggs, not like the actual egg. I'm talking about like the Reese's cup. The one thing you ate the most of Reese's was Reese's Puffs. So you have to put Reese's Puffs in there. That was the only cereal you ate, Jason. No, you're right. In my brain, I did not equate Reese's...

peanut butter puffs as the candy bracket for

But I think you're right. We didn't say it was a candy bracket. You're right. We said it's a Reese's bracket. So I think you're right. All right. So I got Reese's original, Reese's pieces, take five and Reese's peanut butter puffs. Dang. But I would like the specialty holiday Reese's. The egg is, is nostalgic and it's the best. The egg or the Christmas tree, any of that stuff where it's like a new, because it becomes a little bit thicker and I just like the ratio better.

But I can't take out the original, and I'm definitely not taking out. I guess I'll take out take five. Gosh, I like to take five, though. Back to basketball. March Madness is coming up. Man, us sports fans, we love filling out these brackets, baby. And as we said last week, we're doing it for the first time ever.

New Heights Bracket Challenge. That's right. It is brought to you by Reese's or Reese's for those who want to fucking get mad at us. The men's bracket deadline is this Thursday, March 20th at noon Eastern. And the women's bracket deadline is Friday, March 21st at 1130 Eastern. I don't know why we didn't just make them both the same time on two different days, but fill those fuckers out.

Have some fun, ladies and gents. I think we've limited it to one person per bracket.

Or one bracket per person. So this isn't just you fill out 100 brackets and... Yeah, improve your odds. Yeah, improve the odds. Yeah, just put in fucking one bracket, guys. Don't be weirdos. Jason, have you filled out your bracket yet? I have not yet. Good. Well, you have until Thursday. Yeah, I got time. But I would like to go over it. Do we have a bracket? Yeah, we got some brackets. How do you make your picks since you don't watch any college basketball? Well, as you know, playoffs always come down to...

the same things like it's all, you know, taking care of the basketball. You gotta like, you know, how well do you operate end of game situation? Two minute drill. Like this is what it comes down to in playoff basketball. So you're going, you're going turnover margin. I go physicality. All right. Toughness height, physicality, toughness. You look at the height of the roster.

Like I already know where's Michigan state at. Where's Michigan state. I'm putting them all the way through to the final four. I don't even need to see where they're at. I don't even need to see. Cause I know Tom Izzo is going to have those guys playing hard and physical. I saw that they aren't the best three point shooting team. So I was like, they're in cause every, all college basketball wants now is to fucking shoot these three pointers. And Tom, Tom is going to come. They're going to undercutting their legs. Like,

Dude, you know how you stop a three-point shooting team? You foul the fuck out of them on that first three-point. Yeah, give them a couple free throws. It's going to throw off the rhythm, and it's going to make them nervous every time you come out there. Right? Yeah, it's a good, yeah. You got to make these guys pay. You just need to make people pay in the paint. You got to impose your will on finesse players. This is true. Don't let these small shooting guards beat you in the tournament. How physical the fuck out of these dudes? Jason, you're the three-point guy.

equivalent to an offensive lineman though yeah that's what you might think i'm not though i am the i am the undersized center i'm the dennis rodman of offensive line football that's right

I'm the Draymond Green of offensive line. Nice. Michigan State. Yeah, that's right. I'm not the biggest guy, but I'm going to get in a mental capacity, and I'm going to impose my will on you in a weird way.

J Mon green. Who else we got? We got a bunch. Uh, all right. So this is the East East. Okay. So obviously Duke. Yeah. I mean, well, you got the four, uh, playing games too. So can't, can't forget about those. Uh, I never, I never worry about the playing games. Uh, if you got to make it into the tournament on a playing game, I'm not interested. Go back up. Go back up. We're going to start in the East. It's,

The play-ins are like 11 seeds. They're like, they're not just the worst seeds. If you gotta be a play-in, you're out. I'm not talking to you. There shouldn't even be play-in games. All the play-ins get eliminated in my bracket round one after they get in. Well, Texas and Xavier might have something to say about that. Damn it, Texas is in there. I like Texas a lot. Fuck!

Rules are rules. Rules are rules. I don't make them. They just are what they are. Texas is out in round one. All right. We got Duke against American. Doesn't even have a logo in there. It's just an NCAA. This is a playing game. That's why there's a playing game, Jason. All right. I don't even need to see who they're playing in. Duke's advancing. All right.

It's all matchups. I'm going to have to fill out a bracket and figure it out. But I will make sure that you guys know I'm a big fan of the SEC games or SEC teams. We're doing it right now, Travis. No, we're not. That's what this is. No, this is us just kind of going over our bracket.

I'm telling you who I like in these. I'm not going to tell you exactly who I have coming out, though. Okay, fine. All right. I'm not going to let you fucking just copy my bracket, Jason, because you know nothing. I don't want to copy your bracket. I know more about mentality and physicality, and that's all that comes down. Basketball is all about physicality. Whoa.

Well, physicality, Florida is one of the most, is one of the biggest teams in terms of height. Florida's back. The Gators are back. Memphis,

Colorado State. Memphis is solid. I think the West has one of my favorite teams in the NCAA right now, and that's Drake. Drake. Drake University. Yeah, Drake. They have a fun story. Their coach is and really four or at least four of their players are from Division Two.

I think it was Northwest Missouri. Yeah. Northwest Missouri state coach brought them all with them. Yeah. They're, they had a lot of transfers. Uh, when, um, the Drake coach from last year went to West Virginia, a lot of the players that were on that team kind of went on their own or did their own thing. And then the new head coach was looking for players to, to bring in. So he brought in, uh, his D two guys and a couple of guys from Wyoming. They got some guys that could play. Um, although I think Missouri is a really good team and it's going to be a tough game for him. Um,

I mean, I got a lot of – that's like my Cinderella team this year. They're also older, right? I'm rooting for them. They're also older for a lot of the better teams in NCAA. Is that correct? Yeah. Yeah. And then on top of that, watching Texas Tech, I know Patty Mahomes is going to love hearing this. If they can stay healthy and if they can – I think they got a fucking great coach. They got great players, a lot of athletes. Yeah.

They can make a run at it. What about them Jayhawks down there? They're usually pretty good. Yeah, Hunter Dickinson. I think, you know, Kansas, Bill Self, they're always going to be a team that you got to account for, man. They can pull it together and make a run against anybody. So you got to keep that in mind. Illinois, Kentucky versus Troy, UCLA, Utah State, Tennessee. Woof it.

Wofford. Dude, you'd love this. Wofford has a guy that shoots the ball, shoots free throws underhand. No way! I knew you were going to love this. I mean, I love that, but for that alone, I'm picking Tennessee. They're going against the trend too hard for me to go with them. They're a little bit too gimmicky. Got to pick Tennessee in that matchup. Oh, man, you're hilarious, dude. Texas A&M versus Yale.

Listen, as a rule, I might almost fill out my bracket based on GPA. If a team has a higher GPA, I'm picking them to lose. And I might do that all the way through to the championship game. Jason, we know that GPAs don't reflect actual intelligence. Oh, no. I think GPAs reflect athleticism. And typically speaking, it takes – listen.

If you're too smart, you're too hesitant to do stupid things. And you have to be willing to do stupid things. You have to be willing. You got to be willing to take a risk and take a chance and do something. You got to be stupid enough to believe it. There's no way that guy's going to try that move. Oh, my God, that shit just worked. What the fuck?

And that's how I got to the NFL. Well, I'm picking Texas A&M versus them Silver Spoon fucks at Yale. That was so uncalled for. What is Yale's mascot? Is it just like a pencil? I think so. The Yale 2%. The Yale Bears? I think it's a bulldog. What is a Yale? It's a bulldog. Bulldog? Handsome Dan. Georgia. Handsome Dan. All right.

Texas A&M. That's enough shitting on Yale. All right. Texas A&M. That was just so cool. They're going to be just fine. I think those Yale people are going to be just fine. Yeah. Okay. Ole Miss. Iowa State. Lipscomb. I'm going to go with Iowa State. Lipscomb, baby. Lipscomb. Iowa State is sneaky. They're the ones that kick the Bearcats out of the Big 12 tourney. I tell you what. I always fill out my bracket based on what school I think would win in a fight.

Like if I think Iowa State would beat Lipscomb, I'm going to go Iowa State. In a fight? Yeah. I just think at the end of the day, the like mentality of the university rubs off on the mentality of the team a lot of the times. And I just like the mentality approach because I don't know shit about basketball. So that's my only thing I can go off of. Marquette versus New Mexico. New Mexico is a tough one because New Mexico is probably pretty squirrely. Strikes me as a squirrely team.

group marquette strikes me as marquette's got one of the best basketball players in the country marquette strikes me as a little bit of a silver spoon this where's marquette at what's what's chicago i believe chicago no no no is it it's outside of chicago right wisconsin there's it's close close i don't know why i said chicago

All right. I kind of, I respect Marquette if they're out of Wisconsin. One of our favorite actors ever went to Marquette, played rugby there. Denzel Washington. Oh God. What?

The answer is Chris Farley. Oh, shit. I should have known that one. I should have known that one. Now I got to know where Denzel go. I don't think he played rugby, though. I'm pretty sure. Oh, man. Denzel went to Fordham. Fordham. Fordham is Patriot League.

Oh, man. That's fucking hilarious. I know. This is so fucking funny. He was a hooper at Fordham. He was a hooper. He didn't play rugby. He was a hooper. I don't know. Pinky says he played football.

Yeah, you've seen that, Pinky. Wait, so Jason, we've only talked about the men's bracket. Do you use the same metric system to figure out who's going to win the women's bracket? Like, do you just look at who would win the brawl? Oh, wow. I haven't thought about it that way. No, I don't use the same metric. Women's, I just go with, I just put UConn as the winner every single year.

I don't know if they're the same anymore. I put UConn as the winner every single year, and that'll be until Gino retires. And then I just go based on overall team height average. Whoever's the taller team. Then I just fill it out that way. You're fucking hilarious. I haven't even, I haven't peeked at the women's as much. Where's K-State? I know they won the Big 12. Nice. They're up there. Five seed? Solid, solid five seed. We do know that Juju Watkins is,

is at the top of her game. Texas is, god damn, they're number one seed. I think it's kind of fair to say they're

the number one seeds are, I feel like there's less upsets in the women's bracket usually than there are in like the men's bracket. Is that fair to say? I think it's fair to say at least for the number one seeds, you don't see the number one seeds get kicked as much as you do in the men's brackets. In my extensive knowledge of both men's basketball and women's NCAA brackets, I like to make broad sweeping generalizations. Yeah. Can't forget South Carolina. They've been at the top for quite a while now. They're kind of like the Yukon of, uh,

of the modern day. They have a lot of talent there year in, year out. Who's the tallest team women's college team?

Jason, this is supposed to be 45 minutes. He did 45 minutes. Well, there's no single team in women's college basketball. Duke and Florida State are often cited as having some of the tallest players. Both teams average 6'7 1⁄2". While there is no definitive tallest team in women's college basketball, Duke and Florida State are often cited as having some of the tallest players. Both teams averaging around 6'7 1⁄2".

Six foot seven and a half per player. Putting Duke and Florida State, where are they at? Those are my top two teams in women's college basketball outside of UConn. Where the fuck is Duke? I think they're a two seed. Yeah, Duke's a two seed. No, they're one seed in my bracket. Okay, great. Who's your other team? Florida State? Florida State. Florida State's a six. Dude, I feel really good about this.

I don't know. Jason's going with height. I'm going to pick the stars. I'm putting Juju in the final four. I'm going to pick the stars as well. I'm picking the stars. There's like five or six real bonafide stars in that women's bracket. I'm going to go ahead and slide them on forward. They're going to be a star until they meet that height. Unless you know that right now. Get that shot swatted. Juju's going to go in for that layup. Paige is going to be just fine. Paige is going to be just fine. No. All right, now that does it for...

For March Madness Bracket Challenge, brought to you by Reese's, or Reese's, whatever one you want to call it. Winning never tasted so good. Whether you're watching the games or filling out your brackets, feed your fandom with Reese's this March Madness.

Hey-o! Again, to enter, go to the link in the description of the episode, fill out your bracket, and you can win a new Heights Golden Cup! Man, who knows? Maybe I can fucking win one or get one one of these days. And it will be filled with Reese's Peanut Butter Cups. It's filled with...

Mine's filled with playing cards. I think they threw in some Reese's eggs, too. Who knows? Maybe you'll get some puffs, some Reese's pieces. But, yeah, make sure you guys fill those brackets out. Men's bracket again Thursday by noon. Women's bracket Friday by 1130. All Eastern time. Yeah, good luck to the crew.

to the 92 percenters. That wraps up another episode of New Heights. Thank you to Ben Stiller. Make sure you're subscribed on YouTube to the New Heights channel and follow New Heights on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Please go check out our incredible guest episodes from last week, Matthew Stafford and Jason Sudeikis.

You can also listen to new episodes of New Heights early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Once again, New Heights, a Wondery show produced by Wave Sports and Entertainment and brought to you by Nike. When the world says you can't win...

Nike says, so when? Follow the show on all social media. Add to hype show with 1F for fun clips throughout the week. Ben Stiller, thank you, dude. That was a fucking blast. Thanks to our production and crew for making us all look great like we actually know what we're doing. And to the 92 percenters, we'll see you guys next week. Appreciate you tuning in.

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