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cover of episode ‘Russia is now but China is the long-term threat’ - reporter roundtable

‘Russia is now but China is the long-term threat’ - reporter roundtable

2025/5/5
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Battle Lines

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A
Adelie Pojzman-Pontay
D
Danielle Sheridan
S
Sophia Yan
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Danielle Sheridan: 我作为国防编辑,日常工作从清晨查看手机信息和新闻开始,需要与国防部等机构保持联系,获取新闻线索。我最近报道了英国陆军新成立的廓尔喀炮兵部队,这与军队中存在的征兵和人员保留危机有关。此外,工党政府迟迟未发布国防评估报告,这让我对他们的国防计划是否过于犹豫不决感到担忧。虽然乌克兰战争是当前的紧迫威胁,但中国构成了长期的战略威胁,我们需要关注国防评估报告中关于印太地区倾斜战略的长期规划。 我曾前往华盛顿与美国国防部长会面,亲身感受到美英特殊关系的复杂性以及特朗普政府对国际局势的影响。此外,我怀孕期间,国防部不允许我登上某些军舰,这限制了我的工作选择,但也让我重新思考了工作与个人生活的平衡。 我认为我们需要更多地关注英国国防工业的创新和成就,这有助于提升国家形象并增强威慑力。我最近报道了一家美国科技公司在英国研发的先进声呐技术,这在应对俄罗斯在英国水域附近的活动方面具有重要意义。 Adelie Pojzman-Pontay: 我作为乌克兰战争报道的音频制作人和主持人,日常工作包括查看新闻、制作播客脚本、协调采访以及参与其他音频项目。我的工作内容涵盖日常新闻和长篇报道,需要快速反应和灵活应对不断变化的国际局势。特朗普上任后,乌克兰局势的新闻量显著增加,国际关系和联盟关系也发生了快速变化,这使得新闻报道需要更加及时和灵活。 我关注乌克兰战争中的人文故事,并制作了关于俄罗斯绑架儿童的系列报道。我认为,了解社会如何应对战争以及普通民众的经历,对于全面理解战争至关重要。作为一名女性记者,有时我的温和形象反而更有利于获取信息,尤其是在涉及女性和儿童人权问题的报道中。 我认为我们应该更多地关注与俄罗斯接壤的国家,因为它们在当前地缘政治格局中扮演着重要角色,而这些国家往往被忽视。 Sophia Yan: 我作为资深驻外记者,主要关注宏观视角的分析和深度报道。我的一天始于阅读新闻,关注全球事件以及竞争对手的报道,并思考不同事件之间的关联性。我目前正在调查人口走私背后的犯罪组织,这涉及到政府腐败、战争影响以及难民问题等多个方面。 尽管当前有很多紧迫的冲突需要关注,但我认为中国崛起是需要长期关注的一个重要故事,因为它关乎未来。我仍然密切关注中国,因为中国在权力和影响力方面不断增长,并且在技术方面遥遥领先。 特朗普的当选加剧了全球的威权主义趋势,并增强了其他强人的信心,这使得国际局势更加复杂和动荡。作为一名女性记者,我能够接触到男性记者难以接触的信息和人群,这为我的报道增加了价值。我能够更好地识别和处理与性别歧视和暴力相关的问题,这得益于我自身的经历。

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To the Middle East now and more than 50,000 people have been killed in the Gaza Strip since the war began. That's according to the territory's Hamas-run health ministry.

I'm Venetia Rainey and this is Battlelines. It's Monday, 5th of May, 2025. Welcome to another bank holiday edition of the show. Today I'll be chatting to some of The Telegraph's best journalists about what it's like to be a war reporter, the life of a foreign correspondent and the challenges of covering the era-defining geopolitical shifts underway at the moment.

I'm joined in the studio by defence editor Daniel Sheridan. Hello. Ukraine, the latest host Adli Pojmanponte. Hi, Venetia. And joining us down the line from Istanbul, senior foreign correspondent Sophia Yan. Hi. Welcome to Battle Lines, everyone. By way of introduction, and also just to give our listeners a peek behind the scenes of the newsroom,

Can you start by running us through what a typical day looks like for each of you? Danielle, do you want to kick us off? Work starts from the minute you wake up. All of my top contacts are on my personal mobile phone. So the first thing I do once I've, you know, woken up before I read the news is literally look at my phone and see who's WhatsApp me. Quite often stuff has come in overnight or I've sent a late night WhatsApp and then I've got a response and it's a lead, a thread to work on when I get in.

I read the Telegraph, the Times, the New York Times on my phone, walk my dog and then I come into work. Then obviously I work with the news desk so there might be something that's really interested them and they'll be getting in touch with me and saying, we want you to follow this, putting calls on that. I speak to the MOD most days or people within the MOD trying to make sense of if something is a legitimate story or not.

My focus is, I think, more domestic, what's going on with the British military in country as opposed to foreign aspects of it. But saying that I do have a lot of interest in foreign reporting and I do touch base with the foreign desk throughout.

I guess the story of the British Army has become a European global story in a sense over the last few months and we'll be getting into that a bit more. But I want to quickly talk about an exclusive that you had in today's paper about the Gurkhas. Can you tell us a bit more about that and how that came about? I was able to reveal in today's newspaper that the British Army have established a new unit.

It's going to be made up of Gurkhas, so Nepalese soldiers, and it will be called the King's Gurkha Artillery. It was really interesting to dip into the history of the Gurkhas. You know, they have a relationship spanning two centuries, and it began...

with the Brits and the Gurkhas fighting against each other only to realise that they worked better together than against one another. And since then, there's been this real long-standing relationship and it's hugely competitive to get into the Gurkhas. I was reading, this new book has come out all about the Gurkha mindset and how...

They are just deemed as some of the top soldiers that we have in the British Army because of their resilience, their work ethic and just their mental capacity to keep going in the face of adversity. So it's really interesting that this is the unit that they've decided to expand. So there's going to be around 400 new troops, one third of which will be new hires. And then

the remaining two-thirds will come from brigades already existing in the army. But it also comes against a backdrop of a real retention and recruitment crisis within the military.

It's not great, but apparently things are looking up. But for years, there's been a real problem with people not wanting to join the military across all forces, not just the army. And then also those that have joined don't want to stay because of, you know, lack of progression, poor accommodation, strain on family life, not enough money for, you know, the arduous tasks that they do. So this is

of a way of showing that the army is growing. Adelaide, what does a day look like for you? A bit different, I imagine, but perhaps you also start by waking up and checking the news. Yes, very much so. I also wake up, check the news, go across the Telegraph. Pretty much the same thing you do, really. We're news hounds. We wake up, that's our breakfast. But also I check the Kyiv Independent and the BBC and also the French newspaper Le Monde, which has really, really good coverage of the Ukraine war.

As you hear, I am French. So always good to keep an eye on what's going on in the domestic front. But as an audio person, then the next thing I do is listen to the BBC newscast.

Because how am I going to get my news if not by listening to it? So that's always very useful. My days are very different because basically my job is twofold. I'm both a narrative producer here at The Telegraph on the audio team, as well as one of the co-hosts of Ukraine The Latest. So I'm not hosting every day. When I do, it means first thing in the morning is to create the script for the day, liaise with everyone. It's Francis and Dom who are the other two co-hosts of the podcast.

Thank you.

So that's an added layer that happens after the live show. The rest of my week usually is divided in recording interviews for Ukraine the latest that will be added into the show and also working on other narrative projects that happen in the newsroom on the audio desk. It can be a very long

long-form series like the investigation of my colleague Cara McGugan, Bed of Lies, that just got released in the last couple of months and that Venetia, you also worked on. Also working with the Daily Tea on shorter narrative series like the Jan Marsalek story that Hayley Dixon did a couple of months ago. And then also working on long-form series for Ukraine the Latest, which is kind of like my long-form projects. You started working semi-full-time, as you just described, on Ukraine the Latest earlier this year.

How did you find being immersed in the world of daily Ukraine news? Is it overwhelming, the amount of detail that there is out there that you could pick up on and the amount of detail that a lot of your listeners expect from you? I did find it very overwhelming for a couple of reasons. First, because throughout my career, I've always been an audio producer and I've often been a one-woman band doing the reporting, the producing, the scripting.

and everything. But what that means is I'm often not behind the mic. I'm often kind of in the shadows. You don't hear me. Also, whenever I have done hosting in my career, it was in French and it was not in a live show. So two new things to adapt to because I have mostly done narrative and documentary stuff in my career. It happens over maybe six months, a year, sometimes two years. So

time is very elastic. I've actually found it both a bit daunting, but also really nice to be able to get stuff out really quickly and to be able to balance these like long form projects with something that you can just record on the day and then it's out and you don't really need to think about it. And then you can move on to what the next bit of information is. But it's also the first time in my career where I really have a beat. So I really have a circumscribed top

topic to look into. And obviously, the war in Ukraine is super wide, but it helps that Dom

is doing more of the military stuff, that Frances is doing more of the diplomacy, politics stuff. And I'm doing more of the human stories, what we call the heart of things. Sophia, what does your day look like? Well, like most journalists, like Dani and Adele, I start by reading the news. I start, I wake up, I have coffee, and I take a look at what's happening in the world. I look at what the Telegraph's got. I look at what all our competitors have done.

just to have a sense of what might have happened overnight, especially if there was any major breaking news that's developing. And even if I'm not covering it, it's still important for me to be aware of what's going on everywhere in the world to have some sense of how things might move. Because I am often looking at a very high level, 30,000 foot level, big picture stories, analysis features. So I really have to understand how different pieces all around the world fit together like a puzzle.

If something happens in Ukraine, what does that mean for the US? What does that mean for Russia and China? What does that mean for Iran? These are the kinds of questions I'm always thinking about when I'm looking through the news. And in terms of the projects I'm working on now, I've been investigating the organized crime behind migration.

So looking at the smugglers that help move hundreds of thousands of people across borders illegally every year. Some of these people are economic migrants. Others are fleeing war, famine, persecution. I mean, they're coming from Afghanistan, Iran, Sudan, Pakistan, even China.

So I've talked to smugglers from the Americas across Europe and the Middle East all the way to Asia. I'm looking at how people move, how the money flows, and in some cases, just tracking down the kingpins that make it all happen. And it's really tough for obvious reasons. I keep joking that our foreign editor wants me to find the folks that Interpol can't find.

I mean, yeah, that is an extraordinarily difficult beat. Your latest story was about Chinese companies selling inflatable boats for refugees online and how they're advertising them to people smugglers. That pulls in some aspects of your previous beat. You were our China correspondent for many years. And before that, you were based in China and Hong Kong for CNN and CNBC.

How much do you keep an eye on China? I still follow it every day. The rise of China is one of the biggest stories in the world, and it's the story of the future. There are conflicts and concerns that are very immediate today. It's important, of course, to cover what's happening in the U.S.,

Under Trump for a second term, of course, Ukraine's still going, Gaza's still going. I mean, there are so many global stories that are taking our attention for journalists and for the general public. But China is this long, slow burn story, and that's something we've talked about before on Battlelines. I think it's very important to still to continue to understand what's happening in China because that is the future. China's growing in power and influence now.

And they're so much ahead of the game in terms of technology. So understanding what's happening there is very, very important. And for me, it's something I've covered my whole career. It's something I will always be interested in. Can you give us a brief glimpse into what your day used to be like back when you were based in Beijing? Well, I was always under a lot of surveillance and it was very stressful. So I had to do my best to keep track.

as much of my plans for reporting under wraps as much as possible. It is kind of impossible, right? Because our editors, my editors are in London and you have to have some sort of discussion. But I would often have a lot of very coded emails to try to explain what I was going to do. But often I had to just go and do it and hope for the best and then produce something because I didn't want to give...

minders that would follow me around, whether it was digitally or physically. I didn't want to give them a chance to stop my reporting before I could even start it. All the things that I did then are still things I do now because that is the way the world is moving in terms of the hostility towards journalists from a general public sentiment. I mean, there's a lot of vitriol against the media and then also this growing general public distrust of journalists of what we do.

So it's I would say that the risk is becoming much more complicated. And I do worry about that in the long run. So the kinds of things I set in place to safeguard my sources and my processes as a reporter are.

I have continued to use them even outside of China. I was going to say Turkey is not exactly known for protecting journalists either. Do you feel a level of risk there too or is it nothing compared to China? This is really interesting about Turkey. So when I first came, I spent a lot of time trying to understand the political situation here because it has gone through ups and downs in terms of press freedom. And the thing that I realized, which, you know, for me was fascinating, was that it's

that Istanbul and Turkey felt like what Hong Kong was like some 15 years ago when I first arrived as a journalist. And what I mean by that is that it's a cosmopolitan city, tons of people here, super international, very exciting. But you can feel that there's something in the air politically. Things could literally fall off a cliff or it could maybe be okay. And when I got here, I realized with Istanbul and Turkey that I was like, you know, I've felt this before. I've seen this before. I know what this is. I think I know what this is.

So it's been really interesting to observe that. And of course, Turkey has had a lot of political upheaval lately. I want to pick up on something you said, Adelie, and that's that you read the French press every morning because you're French. One of the reasons that I think this is such a wonderful group of journalists to bring together is that you all bring very unique perspectives to your reporting.

How does reading the French press inform your reporting on Ukraine? What's the different elements that that brings in there that you think we might miss if we're only reading the English press here? France has a very different...

recent history in terms of involvement in the war in Ukraine. It has also very specific defence history relative to NATO, relative to nuclear deterrence, but also very specific relationship to Russia. France has been a bit...

in taking a stance in favour of Ukraine and against Russia since the beginning of the war. And that has rapidly changed over the last year. And it's completely radically different now with the coalition of the willing. So I think these changes have happened really, really fast. But I think the UK and France are within the same political arena, but coming with very, very different policies.

backgrounds into it. And it has been very fascinating to discover since I moved to the UK two and a half years ago, the kind of British position on this. I was really, really baffled. And that's probably because I was going as a quote unquote, British journalist when I went to Ukraine for the first time, is how excited people were to see British journalists, and also the number of

Union Jacks that we could see across Ukraine. And I did not see the tricolour fly in many, many, many places. And that did strike me. And I think these differences that I've kind of learned as I've been reporting on this have been really, really fascinating. I also think that the French press, and especially Le Monde, Le Monde has dedicated, since the very beginning of the war, a lot of resources to covering Ukraine. They have a lot of correspondence. And I

I really appreciate the fact, and this is maybe more of like a French journalism...

But they have a lot of more magazine-y pieces kind of taking the temperature of society over there. Soft news. Soft news. But like, you know, like quite long pieces. One person I really, really love to read is Ariane Chemin. You know, she's written recently a piece about what happens to psychiatric wards in Ukraine during the war. I've seen several pieces on war widows.

What is their relationship to the state, to the army, to the war? What is their relationship with the rest of society? And all of these things are kind of like a step away from daily news, are not about the day-to-day developments, but really tell you about how a society is coping. And I think they do that very, very, very well. Now that a lot of my reporting is centering society.

human stories in the show and in the long form narrative series that I do. I think it's really important for me to keep an eye on that. I think the different journalistic traditions really kind of just widen my scope in covering that. Earlier when we were talking, Adelie, you said something about focusing on the heart and society issues.

And I wondered, as a woman, do you feel like you are suggested to take on the softer things? Because I think you could certainly report on diplomacy and the military. And it's something I've found in my career that there's often been a, oh, you're a woman. So can you write the emotional stuff? And I do that really well. I back myself on it. But I can also do the really tough stuff.

And I know a lot about the politics and the diplomacy. And I speak to top politicians.

sources in the military and I can bring that hard news. It's just something I'm so acutely aware of that people will often just associate what I do with the softer, more emotional side of things. And I do think that is a distinct trait of being a female reporter. And I wondered if you felt the same. That's a really interesting question. And I think you make a really good point. I've often felt that. And I've often in my career kind of

limited myself to that I think that's true like being a bit afraid of going for the harder stuff and that's definitely something that I want to develop now that I am working on a beat that has a lot of hard stuff and I think you're completely right and I think it is very much a thing that you get given as a woman however I don't think I got given this as a woman covering the hard stuff

Ukraine was David's beat and the way the boys had divided the different areas amongst themselves. And obviously I stepped into co-hosting the show after David. So I've kind of inherited his beat really. And just to explain to our listeners, you're referring to David Knowles, who is the creator of Ukraine the Latest, as well as Battle Lines, our colleague who sadly passed away last September. And you've done a brilliant job of

taking on his care for the humanity and the human side of the Ukraine war, which was really a hallmark of his journalism. I want to pick up on something you guys were discussing, and Sofia, I'd love to hear your point of view here.

When we talk about hard and soft journalism, our listeners may or may not know that we're referring to, you know, really sharp news, which has a very clear news line. Kemi Badenoch said this and now she's under fire for this. And it's all sort of fact, fact, fact, fact, quote, quote, quote. And soft news is what we call a drop intro. There's like some nice colourful paragraph of description and then you slowly get into the story. I wonder if that is...

construct that we've sort of built to suggest that hard news is good and soft news is weaker or has less value for some reason in the same way that we hold up war reporting is really idealized within journalism I think and other forms of reporting is seen as less ambitious, less brave. Sophia what do you think? I feel like a lot of the work I do fall somewhere in between because a lot of my stories do have an anecdotal lead, a drop lead on

But I look at things like war crimes, human rights abuses, government corruption. So that in itself is very, very, very newsy as a topic. But the investigations I do often are diving into these realms, these like very murky realms. I mean, right now I'm looking at basically a mix of government corruption, the impact of war, why refugees have to leave where they are, if they ever really find a new place that they can call home.

And all the black, dark underworlds. I mean, the gangs, the criminality that's involved is incredible. And it's not just one crime, not just the illegal migration part, but a lot of these gangs are also involved in drug trafficking, weapons trafficking. It's really dark stuff. So I think it's interesting that there is that distinction and that there still continues to be. I mean, I like to think that what I do is somewhere kind of a mix of both, I guess. Yeah.

How do you find smuggling is obviously a story that is largely focused around, as you say, these male smugglers based largely in the Middle East. How do you find dealing with that story as a woman? Do you find ever that people are more or less willing to talk to you or do you think it doesn't make a difference? It really depends on the context and where they sit on the food chain. So some of the lower level street agents, the ones who would be potentially out there recruiting, like the ones that you might actually see

walking around recruiting people. Sometimes they can be a little bit more cagey because they don't, they're so worried about being caught. Often they're migrants themselves. I found that in the times that I've interviewed very high level, like the kingpin types, the guys who run the whole show. I mean, I've talked to these guys who have a global network. They've got agents even on the U.S. border.

They are very different. And some of them feel that they're providing a service. They're very proud of what they do. I mean, they realize what they do is not exactly by the book per se, but they also believe that they're providing a service for people who really need it. You know, for instance, dissidents who would otherwise be killed or very severely persecuted at home in countries like Iran, even Turkey.

They think that the more the world is closed off in terms of borders, the more that they've got a business to run. And actually, they do end up making more money in a way because they can charge more when it's hard to cross. It's really interesting. So it depends partly on the context of where they're from and at what level they are. And you can think of it as like a company. It's like interviewing the CEO of a bank, for instance, is very different than interviewing a bank teller.

We're going to take a little pause there. Coming up after the break, we'll be talking about Trump's impact on everyone's beats.

As many of our listeners know, our beloved colleague and friend David Knowles passed away suddenly last September, aged 32, from an undiagnosed heart condition. As the creator of Ukraine the Latest and Battle Lines, many of you were familiar with his voice and passion for covering conflict with a keen sense of humanity. But you may not know that David was a man of many passions. Music, theatre, ancient languages, comedy, Warhammer, Napoleonic history and above all else, cricket.

A late starter, he showed the true zeal of the convert and even founded his own team, Larkhall Wanderers CC. Last weekend, the Larkhall Wanderers played a memorial game to fundraise for the British Heart Foundation. Their goal is to raise £6,000 to help fund life-saving research to tackle heart diseases. If you'd like to donate in his memory, please follow the link to the show notes. Thank you in advance for your support.

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Welcome back. We're all speaking in the same week that we're marking 100 days of Trump. I'd be really interested to hear about how Trump has changed all of your respective beats. Who wants to kick us off? I'll go first. I got to go to Washington for the first time. And that was because of Pete Hexerth, the new defense secretary, was having a bilat with John Healy. And he was like, I'm going to go to Washington.

It was fascinating really to be in the room with him. Trump's cabinet is made up of such intense characters and he really took issue with the question one of the other reporters put to him, basically saying, you know, America is just kowtowing to Russia.

And he got so animated and said, you know, that's garbage. And he was so defensive on it. It was also interesting to be in the room because this special relationship between the US and the UK. I've been to many a press conference, but they had teapots and cups and sauces and cookies with, you know, like artichokes.

our flag and their flag next to each other. And it was like they were trying to have an afternoon tea come press conference. It was totally bizarre. Then obviously Hegseth has been one of the people involved in these leaked messages revealing how they were going to strike Houthis. And it's just been kind of bonkers really to see the...

defence playing out under Trump and also seeing how the MOD and John Healey, the Defence Secretary, work with someone like Hegseth as his counterpart is very interesting to watch. We've got the Strategic Defence Review, which we believe is going to come out in a few weeks. I remember speaking to you before Labour was elected and you were very scathing about Labour's defence plans. You thought they were going to be very wishy-washy. Yeah, interesting that I said it was wishy-washy because I still think it is going to be

be such I mean it's late spring now

This should have come out. They gave themselves wriggle room because they said the SDR will come out in spring. They didn't say when in spring. But, I mean, we're sat here in a heat wave. It's almost summer. I will have given birth, I think, by the time the SDR comes out. It is just being dragged out. And there's no reason. They could have published it now. There was a Defence Select Committee yesterday with Admiral Tony Radican, who's the chief of the Defence staff.

they were talking about the SDR and still no one could put a date on it. Just saying, oh, you know, spring, late spring. Well, it's certainly late spring now. So when it comes out, I don't know. But I think it's somewhat worrying, given the geopolitical situation we're in right now, that they aren't being more forthright with this because they're

The whole point of the SDR was to show how defence is going to be transformed under Labour. Well, Labour have been in government almost a year now and we still don't exactly know how defence is being transformed other than the fact that Keir Starmer has got them more money, that they are going to reach 2.5% by 2027, 3% by the end of the decade. But everyone says it's not enough anyway. And I had a front page story a couple of months ago saying, you know, 2.5% won't touch the sides.

What are the figures? What does this translate to? What new equipment are we going to see? Are Labour going to reverse troop cuts? How are you going to improve the situation on the ground so that people stop leaving the military? How are you going to entice more people in? How are we going to fight the future war? As Sophia was saying, Ukraine is immediate, but China is the long-term threat. And back in 2021, when we had the original integrated defence review under Ben Wallace, the former defence secretary,

It was all about the Indo-Pacific tilt. That hasn't gone away. China is still a massive threat. And as carrier strike group has sailed and is making its way towards Japan,

Japan over the next eight months, you know, the big question was whether or not they're going to transit through the Taiwan Strait, which would be seen as incredibly antagonistic towards China. That's why this SDR needs to come out, because we need to see also what's the long term plan? You know, what are we still facing on the Indo-Pacific tilt? Is that still a priority for our government? They just haven't made their position clear. And there's now a concern that they might

in the next couple of weeks, release a sort of brief essay, as it were, of the SDR, not put in any hard facts and figures, but give an overview, like a soft launch, and then put the actual SDR. This is hearsay, by the way. I haven't stood this up with the MOD. But even that 2.5% and the ultimate goal of 3%, that feels very...

expedited by Trump, right? Yeah, I think you're right. And that when I went to Washington with Healey to see this bilat, that was something that Healey was kind of using as a way to promote the Brits. He said, you know, you asked us to stand up and we've delivered, we've pushed up our defence spending to 2.5%. You know, they weren't committing to it before Trump said Europe needs to pull its finger out. And

and take more of the burden of Ukraine and do more on defence. And they were then able to really weaponise it as a way to show strength

But it's still not as much as other countries in Europe spend on defence anyway. Adelie, how has Trump affected? It's a big question. It's a big question. But OK, over the last three months, how have you noticed that things have changed? I think the main change is the amount of news, really. I can't remember exactly, but I think over the last few months, ever since he was sworn into office, we have put out three emergency podcasts.

diplomatic developments that have happened by the end of the afternoon when the day's pod was already coming out and we keep on having breaking news during the pod, just before, just after. So it's just the amount of

monitoring the amount of like how reactive we have to be and also how something that happens at 11 o'clock in the morning can very well be out of date by two. Every single day has major diplomatic developments and we're in very historic times where the ground below us is shifting in terms of who's allied with who and how are we allied with the people we thought we were allied with. Are we still allied with the United States?

probably. How so? That is shifting. And I think...

The geopolitical design of the world is very much being redrawn at the moment. And it is laying the groundwork for what will happen over there, what we'll see unfolding over the next decades. It will shape the rest of our lives and the rest of our careers, I think. And Danny, as you said very well, China as well coming into and becoming a diplomatic force and also a military force and a military threat. And how is it aligning? How are the alliances realigning?

between Russia, China, North Korea, the United States, because all of that is shifting. And because of the ongoing talks and conversations and, and rows that are happening left and right. It's, it's, it's just been a very intense three months and it's been a very intense moment to join the team. Do you think we'll see a peace deal this year? Well, I think that this year is a crucial part of the question. Uh, obviously Trump said he would sort that in 24 hours, I think. Um,

It's a long 24 hours, but I don't think anyone ever believed that. It seems like there's a lot of talk. There's not a lot of walk. Yes, people are talking. I've yet to see news that look even...

in the remotest way promising in terms of Ukraine and Russia being able to agree on something and Russia letting go of something in order to see peace at the horizon. And then the question becomes always, what is peace? And what is freedom? And what is liberation? And what is justice? And a ceasefire, a truce,

And stopping the fighting is one thing. Does that lead to peace? If Ukraine has to let go of its territories in order for there to be peace, is that a long lasting peace? Is that satisfying? Is that justice? That means that you have territories that remain under occupation. Is that peace for them? So whose peace, I think, is the real question.

I think we'll definitely see some interesting developments by the end of the year. That's as far as I can tell you. And I'm aware I'm not giving you much. But I think also some of the elements in the negotiations, one of the projects that I'm starting to work on for a narrative series is looking at

kidnapped children by Russia. And that's typically in that space that Sophia, I think, was talking about, which is, is it soft news? Is it hard news? I mean, it is going to be one of the key stakes of the negotiations, which is why I want to start looking at it from more of a documentary and long form point of view, because I think

the raw voices of the people to whom it's happening are incredibly important and need to be centered. But at the same time, it really taps into the hard news, the negotiations, because this is going to be one of the key elements of what's being agreed on. Sophia, you're an American living abroad. What's Trump's impact been like on your beat? I cover, of course, a lot of the authoritarian trends of the world.

China, Russia, North Korea, Iran, you know, this movement that we've had toward this multipolar world. This is language that China loves to use. And under the first term, we saw it already, the beginning of the dismantling of democracy. And it has in a very scary way sped up so much with Trump 2.0. It's not a good look at America. The bastion of democracy is in shambles, right? It does not look good.

And what that does, as we've already seen in just a few months' time, it's emboldened other strongmen around the world. I mean, Trump said before that he really admired Turkey's president, Recep Tayyip Erdogan. And just in these last few weeks, there's been a huge domestic political crisis. The mayor of Istanbul, Ekrem İmamoğlu, was arrested. And it sparked the biggest mass nationwide protests in more than a decade. İmamoğlu still detained this president.

This man was seen as the number one political opponent to Erdogan. So this is something that was covered in global headlines, but not so much attention paid and not as much criticism as it may have otherwise drawn from other countries, because it's coming at a time of so much political turmoil globally. Just yesterday, I saw a headline from China. Beijing denied that a call had taken place between China

Chinese President Xi Jinping and Trump, which apparently Trump had said it had taken place.

that a call had occurred. And this is in the context of the ongoing US-China trade war, both sides hiking tariffs to over 100%. But what's interesting about this is that China is saying that America is putting out disinformation. And this is at a time where that might actually be true. There might actually be quite a lot of disinformation. And that has already been the case coming from the White House. So this world is changing. The world in which we operate is changing so much. It's very murky. The scales are tipping and it's

unclear where things go from here. And I think that's just been so interesting to observe this sort of impact that Trump has had around the world. I mean, it's just been so bewildering. The news flow, as Adelie said, it's like been completely nuts. There's just so much going on all the time that you start to miss things because he's doing so much every day. And in the long term, I mean, who really knows what will happen? I think this really will change

what the world looks like. You know, this idea that funding cuts would happen, for instance, to Sudan. Well, Sudanese refugees are coming to the UK. In fact, they were coming, a lot of them are coming for free. I spoke to a bunch of them along the coast of France, in and around Calais. They're stowaways. They're not even paying the smugglers because they don't have the money to pay the smugglers. I mean, there's so many impacts of

of this from a geopolitical perspective, from a diplomatic perspective, from this question that Danny was talking about. How does the UK handle itself now if the special relationship with the US can't be relied on? What does Europe do? You know, there's so many questions. You know, it's both fascinating as a journalist, but also, I would say, kind of terrifying.

I want to pick up on something you mentioned, Safiya, there, and that's the stories that we're missing. I'd love to hear from all three of you a story or a conflict, an issue that you think we should be talking about more. Something interesting that happened in Turkey, which is that last week there was an earthquake. It was a magnitude 6.2. The context behind this is that Turkey is a place where earthquakes do happen, but Istanbul itself sits on two very fractious fault lines. And so, you know, there's a lot of talk about how Turkey is a place where earthquakes do happen.

And about every 250 years, a very devastating quake of over seven magnitude has hit the city. The last one was in 1766 at that level. And it caused a tsunami. So we're overdue, Istanbul is anyway, for a big quake. And this one last week really has shaken everyone. What was interesting is that because on the day of the quake, everybody went outside.

to be in a big open space in case of aftershocks. And there have been hundreds of aftershocks. Some of them you can feel, some of them actually a magnitude four and five. So they're not small, but we've got the quake people in public spaces. And also we're still in this political environment where there were all those protests. There's still boycotts and demonstrations here and there. And so in a lot of the big parks of Istanbul, you see riot police. I mean, people are out trying to enjoy the nice spring weather and,

They were trying to find safety because of the quakes. Some people were camping outside and still are because of the concern that something might happen overnight. But then you've got riot police. And so that tells you a lot about the political situation here in Turkey. And I do think even though the initial arrest of the Istanbul mayor was covered in his detention, the bigger picture right now is not so well understood. And

You know, I do think it's because there's so much news going on right now. Covering the Ministry of Defence, there's actually so many stories that I don't get to write about because they're so secretive. It's really difficult to get access. And something that does fascinate me is the new weapons that they're making. Some of the engineering is absolutely extraordinary. And if only we could be granted this access to showcase it,

you know, what message that would send to adversaries to say, look how capable the UK is. Look at, you know, the little money we do have in defence. Look at what we're able to do with it. And to get this access, I can't really go through the MOD. I have to go to, you know, the individual companies and say, let me write about this. So I recently wrote with Andrel this...

a US-based tech firm that have opened up in the UK and they do a lot of work with the MOD and they created this amazing sonar that can sit at the bottom of the sea and track submarines and do it completely quietly and they will go unmissed so

We're seeing lots of Russian activity near British water. Our critical national infrastructure is all below sea level. And there are companies out there creating these secretive devices that can track our adversaries without tipping them off that we're there. Traditionally, sonar is noisy and you can gauge whether something is in the vicinity. So

being able to see what waters they're traversing in is amazing. And I only know about this because this company was able to invite me in and talk to me about that piece of kit. And there's such a, I think Sophia talked about it earlier, but like a hostility towards media, towards journalists, governments not trusting them and not thinking how there might be an opportunity to actually work together sometimes.

Rather than always seeing us as the opposition, you know, we also do want to write about the incredible feats of engineering that are taking place in this country. And I only wish that there was more access to that kind of kit and equipment to really showcase it. And, you know, also give ourselves a pat on the back every so often and say, wow, you know, we created this. We have some of the best scientific equipment.

minds in the country. And it's a shame that we don't do more to, you know, honour the work that they do. With the war in Ukraine, I feel like it's opened everyone's eyes on the threat that Russia is and the longstanding history of imperialism and how the West has really reckoned with it in the aftermath of World War II. But more and more so, I'm becoming, well, very curious, but a lot more aware about the

We should be paying attention to these border countries to Russia. And obviously, they're countries that are either small, like the Baltic countries, or not very much talked about, not necessarily strong players on the diplomatic scene, all the stand countries, Azerbaijan, Turkmenistan, Armenia. I'm just more and more aware of Central Asia, the Caucasus. And I just think generally...

As we're seeing this invasion in Ukraine, this war continue and drag on it as we are coming to grasp with Russia as an enemy and as a military force.

We should be paying more attention to these countries and starting to look at them now rather than when something happens and start getting an understanding of what's going on locally now. And obviously, journalism is always in a state of crisis, so we can't create more bureaus. That time has long, long passed. It was way before all of our careers. But I just think we could maybe be a bit more proactive when it comes to the Russian sphere.

sphere of influence in these border countries. Before we wrap up, I feel like we just need to quickly hear about what it's like to be a reporter while pregnant and not to be allowed on certain ships by the Ministry of Defence. I mean, obviously everyone's experience is different, but just as a wider kind of point, it has been interesting for me because I didn't used to think twice about going to Ukraine, putting myself in a dangerous position. And now I am

am pregnant it has given me pause for thought because I feel like oh I can't be completely selfish now I have to think about the other person that I'm looking out for so it's become more of like a moral thing in my mind that I'm trying to weigh up and also I'm not ruling out going there again but I am you know heavily pregnant now so it does limit my options but

You know, I had a difficult time in December because I was invited to Ukraine with the defence secretary and I couldn't go because I was so unwell in my first trimester. Any women that have been pregnant listening to this know that the first trimester was absolutely horrific. Yeah, the sympathy nod, like you're just being sick all the time. And I, you know, had so desperately wanted to go. I've been asking John Healy's people for months, please can I come with him? I want to accompany him when he goes. And I had to turn...

the trip down because I was too unwell. That was a real bummer for me professionally. But, you know, I had to put my health first and that of my unborn child. And then...

Recently, Carrier Strike Group is the big story happening this year in defence. So that's HMF Prince of Wales, massive aircraft carrier, £3 billion. We'll be travelling with a huge escort all the way to the Indo-Pacific and beyond. When you're pregnant, you're not allowed...

on a vessel at sea and so when I was recently I pitched for an interview with the Commodore I assumed I do it in an office or something and they said okay well you can actually come on on board while she's alongside that was great that I got to go on the ship it made me laugh that I'm not allowed at sea because I can't you know personally I'm still flying I don't see why I can't be at sea but

Actually, it was quite difficult being on board because it's so gigantic and just getting around the vessel, you know, your up and down ladders, really steep staircases. Yeah.

And at one point, there was basically just like a vertical ladder that I had to kind of climb up. And my body's obviously changed. My center of gravity is different. And it was really hard. And I did think, oh, OK, I feel like maybe they had a point and I shouldn't have pushed myself. But I'm also, you know, want to prove that, oh, I can do whatever the boys can do. And actually, maybe biology comes into it. And I'm just going to have to accept that I can't.

I think I can do whatever the boys can do has definitely been a driving philosophy behind most of my career. Yeah. Perhaps for all of the women gathered with me here today. Adelie, Sophia, is there anything that you guys want to add? The only thing I was going to say is when we were talking about the, you asked if we had a different perspective or you asked how we, you know, how we might approach things differently. I think the only thing I wanted to add is that I think sometimes as a woman, it can be, you can be more disarming than you realize.

Because people don't expect so much, I think. I've definitely experienced that before. And in times when I've done stories about women and children,

for instance, with human rights abuses, of course, they will open up to me in a way that they probably wouldn't to a male reporter. And so it can work in your advantage. Yeah, I think that's 100% true. And particularly in my time working in the Middle East, you get to interview the women and the men, whereas the men can't go into certain spaces, can't speak to certain people. And that definitely, I think, added a lot of

value to my reporting. I've also worked in the Middle East and that's definitely been my experience as well. I'm doing an interview later today, the misogyny at the heart of Putin's regime and how that's being used in war crimes in Ukraine and elsewhere. And one of the points that the person I'm interviewing later today makes in her book, that's Sophie Oksanen on Putin's war on women, is that

not only do we get access to people and to topics that men will not necessarily have access to, but also we know how to spot signs and we know how to ask questions that they would not know to ask, especially when it comes to sexual violence and especially when it comes to discrimination and gendered violence. And I had never thought of that, that as a woman, my quite, you know, annoying experience of misogyny and gender violence would actually be

make me more skilled at asking the right questions, at recognising the shift in someone's gaze, the shift in someone's attitude or body language in order to pick up on that. And I think that's really made me think about how we cover these type of stories and maybe the sort of

unlikely and very sad advantage that we've got there. Thank you so much for joining us on Battlelines. Thank you for having us. Thank you for having us. Great to talk to you all. That's all for this episode of Battlelines. A big thank you to one of our long-time listeners, Maffei Shovar, I really hope I've pronounced that name correctly, who suggested this panel of female Telegraph reporters. I really hope you enjoyed this episode. If you have topics that you'd like us to cover, let us know. You can email us on battlelines at telegraph.co.uk.

We'll be back again on Friday. Until then, goodbye. Battle Lines is an original podcast from The Telegraph created by David Knowles and hosted by me, Venetia Rainey and Roland Oliphant. If you appreciated this podcast, please consider following Battle Lines on your preferred podcast app. And if you have a moment, leave a review as it really helps others find the show.

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