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cover of episode Extended edition - Former CEO of Ukraine's state-owned energy company, Alexiy Kobolyev

Extended edition - Former CEO of Ukraine's state-owned energy company, Alexiy Kobolyev

2025/1/4
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World in 10

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Alexei Kobolyev: 乌克兰停止俄罗斯天然气通过其管道输往欧洲,此举具有重要的地缘政治意义。这不仅切断了俄罗斯利用能源影响欧洲政治的渠道,特别是对匈牙利和斯洛伐克等国的影响,也削弱了普京的政治影响力。虽然普京可能会寻求替代途径,例如通过土耳其输送天然气,但这并不能完全弥补损失。 匈牙利官员此前威胁性言论反而适得其反,暴露了他们对俄罗斯天然气的依赖,从而坚定了乌克兰停止输送天然气的决心。 这也表明,停止俄罗斯天然气过境对欧洲的影响并非完全是负面的,反而可以帮助欧洲减少对俄罗斯的能源依赖,并促进能源市场的多元化。 关于摩尔多瓦,Kobolyev认为将摩尔多瓦视为下一个乌克兰的目标是错误的。乌克兰的地位和西方世界的支持力度远超摩尔多瓦,普京更可能攻击风险更高的目标。然而,德涅斯特河沿岸地区(Transnistria)的控制权之争至关重要。如果普京获胜,将会加剧对欧洲的能源攻击;如果失败,则会迫使普京退步。因此,西方国家对摩尔多瓦的能源援助并非成本,而是对俄罗斯的防御性投资。一些欧洲国家将此视为不必要的支出是俄罗斯宣传的结果。 摩尔多瓦总统桑杜成功地将国家从廉价的俄罗斯天然气供应中脱离出来,并通过财政援助帮助民众应对能源价格上涨,她有能力应对未来的挑战。 普京已经转向中国,但中国利用俄罗斯在西方的弱势地位进行谈判,西方可以通过二次制裁来防止俄罗斯过度依赖中国。普京的下一步行动可能是尝试通过土耳其和亚塞拜疆向欧洲输送天然气,并可能试图修复北溪管道。西方需要保持统一立场以应对。

Deep Dive

Key Insights

Why did Ukraine decide to stop pumping Russian gas through its pipelines to Europe?

Ukraine stopped pumping Russian gas to Europe to cut off one of Russia's key tools of influence, which included bribery, corruption, and promoting the 'Russian world' concept. This decision weakens Vladimir Putin's ability to manipulate European politics through energy dependencies, particularly in countries like Hungary and Slovakia.

What impact will Ukraine's decision to halt Russian gas transit have on Russia's European allies?

The decision will significantly reduce Russia's leverage over European allies like Hungary and Slovakia, which have been politically influenced through cheap gas supplies. By cutting off this flow, Ukraine has disrupted Russia's ability to bribe or pressure these nations, forcing them to seek alternative energy sources.

How does Ukraine's decision affect Moldova, particularly Transnistria?

Moldova, especially Transnistria, which relies on Russian gas, will face challenges as it transitions to alternative energy sources. The pro-Western Moldovan government, led by President Maya Sandu, must now secure energy supplies without Russian support, potentially with Western financial assistance, to maintain stability and prevent Russian influence from growing.

What are the potential risks for Moldova if gas costs rise significantly?

Rising gas costs could strain Moldova's economy and political stability, particularly ahead of parliamentary elections. If the population turns against President Maya Sandu due to economic hardship, it could benefit Russia by weakening Moldova's pro-Western stance and increasing Russian influence in the region.

How might Russia respond to Ukraine's decision to cut off gas transit?

Russia is likely to seek alternative routes to supply gas to Europe, such as through Azerbaijan and Turkey, to circumvent Ukraine. Additionally, Vladimir Putin may attempt to revive the Nord Stream pipeline to regain influence in Europe, though this would require overcoming Western resistance and sanctions.

What role does China play in Russia's energy strategy following Ukraine's decision?

Russia has been increasingly aligning its energy exports with China due to Western sanctions. However, China has been leveraging Russia's weak position to negotiate lower gas prices. While Russia seeks closer ties with China, secondary sanctions from the West could limit this shift and prevent Russia from becoming economically subordinate to China.

Chapters
Alexei Kobolyev discusses the significant economic benefits Ukraine derived from Russian gas transit and how halting it negatively impacts Russia's influence on European politics, particularly in Hungary and Slovakia. He also explains how the actions of politicians like Mr. Fico backfired, highlighting Russia's dependence on gas transit.
  • Halting Russian gas transit through Ukraine cuts off Russia's leverage over European politics
  • Hungary and Slovakia's dependence on Russian gas is highlighted
  • Mr. Fico's actions are seen as counterproductive

Shownotes Transcript

In this extended World in 10, Alexiy Kobolyev, the former Chief Executive of Ukraine's state-owned energy company, Naftogaz, discusses Ukraine's decision to stop pumping Russian gas through its pipelines to mainland Europe, the damage it'll do to Vladimir Putin and his allies, and why Europe should see any energy cost increases as "an investment."

The World in 10 is the Times' daily podcast dedicated to global security. Expert analysis of war, diplomatic relations and cyber security from The Times' foreign correspondents and military specialists. 

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