Reframing Your Small Business’s Relationship with Social Media
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I'm telling you, over 15 years doing this marketing stuff, Chels, and I have never in my life seen people act the way they do around one marketing channel.

Hey everyone, welcome to the SOB Marketing Podcast, where we celebrate the SOB that you are. And if you haven't figured it out yet, we mean small owned business. We don't mean SOB. Listen, we know that as a small business owner, you are working hard on the daily to keep your business fully operational while trying to promote it. And while some days it may feel like the business is owning you,

If we're being honest with each other, I bet you would admit that you wouldn't give up the insanity for anything. Our commitment here at the SOB Marketing Podcast is to give you the real talk, what works when it comes to advertising, marketing, promoting your business, and then what doesn't really work.

And Chelsea and I promise to always keep the conversation real. Chelsea, so far away. Doesn't anybody stay in one? You are not here with me today and I miss you. Miss you too. Yeah, I'm all the way in my actual home.

I know. This is a little unusual for us. I have been loving us being in the same room together because it just feels, I don't know, it feels good to, you know, to be able to talk about things face to face. Yes. So before we get started, why don't we go ahead and cue the PSA from our dad. Please do me a favor.

Leave them a review. They promised me a bottle of bourbon. Y'all, please help us get this man the bottle of bourbon we promised him. The only way we're going to do that is if you guys go and leave us a couple of reviews. One of the best ways that you could support this podcast is to just leave us a review. So that way we get it in front of other small business owners that could use this useful marketing tool.

you know, advice, discussion, all of that good stuff. So please go ahead and do that. Friendly reminder, another PSA on our part is we do have a TLDL section that's too long, didn't listen. If you guys are, you know, in a rush,

As you're listening to this, of course, we're going to always recommend that you come back and listen to the full-length episode. However, you can skip to the TLDL chapter. Chelsea's going to give you a quick rundown of what we talk about today. And so that way, you know, you can hear the snippet and then decide if this is an episode that you want to come in and listen to, you know, in its entirety.

So Chelsea, what topic are we covering today? Well, Vivian, we are revisiting our first ever episode and talking about taking back the keys to your kingdom and reframing your relationship with social media. So this conversation came about because this past weekend...

If you live in the United States, TikTok was essentially banned and then unbanned within a matter of hours. It was ridiculous. I think it was less than like 12 hours. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. But we bring this up because, you know, social media, these platforms, they can very easily go.

So figuring out and reframing the relationship you have with social media as a small business is really important because, you know, for a lot of small business owners, for a second there, you lost out on a lot of money because of the relationship you had with TikTok. Well, and I think I want to share something that's

It's been a little, I don't want to say private, but I don't want to walk around talking about this. I feel like I have a pretty messed up

I'll call it toxic relationship with social media. Yeah. And for this purpose, as a user, I love it. I love getting on there. I love being able to keep up with my friends all have kids now. You know, we get to keep up with family members. I like having that window into their life and being able to

feel like I am there with them sharing in some of these experiences, even though maybe I haven't seen them in the last 10 years. However, the business owner in me just feels like I don't enjoy social media as much. And it's because there's this...

weird pressure as a small business owner to use social media to grow your following to then hopefully turn around and increase your sales. And I'm just going to tell you, I kind of not that people have not figured out the secret sauce and not that social media is

isn't great at doing that, amplifying your message and being able to tap into a big market. It's wonderful for all of those things, but I also think that people are little liars. And I think that sometimes what happens is you don't get an accurate perspective of the trade-off between time and effort.

And then what's actually going on with building these large audiences? Like it looks like people are seemingly doing this overnight. And so then you kind of feel like, what am I doing wrong that my small business isn't getting the same type of traction? Yeah, I'm really glad you brought that up. I'm really glad you brought up your personal relationship because, yeah, a lot of people have a really unhealthy relationship with social media. I'll tell you right now, social media to me is jobs.

I don't get on there to enjoy seeing people that I know. The people that I want to know stuff about text me or message me. So for me, social media is completely about the seasoned marketer and not really about... Sometimes it's about memeing, like seeing funny things. But from a personal perspective, I don't enjoy social media anymore.

Yeah, I think for this discussion today, what I'm hoping we can offer you, listener, as a small business owner is a few tips or a discussion that makes you feel a little less alone if you're struggling to find where social media fits into your small business. And if you've just been feeling like it's janky.

If you're like me and you just feel like it's janky and something like, you don't know what it is, you're doing all the things and you're like, but something just isn't like connecting quite yet. Uh,

We feel it too, even as marketing professionals. And we want to offer you maybe a shift in perspective so that social media does have a place in the growth of your business and in the promotion of your business. However, it is not the only thing. Because if anything, I just want to remind you guys that

If you felt panicked this weekend when you could not access TikTok because you're thinking, man, I built some type of following and now I don't have a way to communicate with them. It is just what Chelsea said. It's like you are taking the keys to your small business and you're giving it to the platform. We don't want you to do that. So we want you to...

incorporate some guardrails so that you can really get the most out of social media, but yet you can still be in full control of your business and you can still have the only set of keys to your small business in your pocket. I want to start this discussion by saying that

How many of y'all and leave a comment, let us know how many of you small business owners are using social media because you have to, because everyone expects your small business to be on Instagram, to be on Facebook. Like it's required of you. We're not saying that social media is bad and that you shouldn't be on it, but.

This line of thinking is not going to be productive in the terms of your marketing. If you're investing all this time in social media marketing, even though you don't really believe in it and you don't want to be doing it, that's going to impact the type of results that you get. Yeah, because people can feel it, y'all. Chelsea and I just had this discussion because for...

If maybe you guys, this is your first time tuning in to us, okay, I still work in the corporate world, quote unquote, so I still have a corporate job that requires some polishing. And I get it. Some people are like, oh, well, that's not, you don't have to be like that. Yeah, you do. You got to be a little like, you have to put your best foot forward all the time. Vivian works in the corporate world in healthcare. Yeah. Like, yeah.

Yes. So there's definitely a switch. It's hard for me to turn off that switch. And especially in the role that I'm in, like when you're dealing with communication, whether that's internal or external, you need to read, reread, make sure you're using the right terminology. You want to like part, a big part of what I do on a daily basis is go in and look at how I can

make something sound better or more effective. And so I'm consistently going in and just double checking and figuring out ways to reframe stuff.

Social media, to some extent, especially because now Chelsea and I just had this discussion on a previous episode that we did where we talk about some of the trends that are coming up in social media. People are wanting a less polished version. They want more of the behind the scenes. I want you to show up as you. OK, well, that takes a lot out of me. Me showing up as me is it requires me letting down my, you know, just kind of.

I don't know, my everyday part of what I do. And so it's more difficult than I think maybe sometimes when we tell people, just do you, just show up as you, just represent your business as is. Well,

But then by same token, we're saying, hey, your branding's important. Hey, your messaging's important. Okay, well, if all that stuff is curated, if you're giving thought to that, well, then it also means that to some extent you can show up naturally, but you're incorporating things that you're trying to be super strategic about. So, yeah. I think not to get too...

off topic, but I think it's easier for small business owners because usually your branding relates to who you are. So for example, for us, yes, for Vivian, it is much harder for her to show up organically, naturally and, you know, less polished. But for me, because this is my full time job,

I'm used to it now because Vivian and I, the seasoned marketer, it's all about we're two sisters who have different personalities, different perspectives because we're 15 years apart, but we're still both marketers. It's easier for me to show up as me because that's part of our branding.

Well, and also, I just think personal opinion here. I think for some people, it's just easier. You, Chelsea, you don't give a flying flip. Like if you you're just going to say what you're going to say and then you're going to be like, sorry, that's just my opinion. That's my perspective. While me, on the other hand, sometimes I'm like.

I don't want to offend anybody. I don't want to like, did that person understand my motive in telling them that? Let me go back and remind them and just say like, hey, the reason I would. And so I think that's just how I'm wired. And I've been like that since I was a kid. And so for some people, I do think for you, it's a lot easier for you to just show up. For me, I'm a little more like,

You know, what's this doing to the other person? What's this, you know, and not to say you don't care about that stuff, but it's just not, it's different personalities. Yeah. Okay. That's a very good point. That's very valid. To loop it back around to what we're going to discuss today. Mm-hmm.

We're hoping that this whole TikTok ban, the discussion with it and everything that it's brought up is just going to be a nice reminder to everybody that, hey, you know, social media is one of the 19 marketing channels that's available to you. But it's just one. It's not the only one.

Yes. Okay, Vivian, for people who obviously still want to use social media as a marketing channel, one really important tip that, not to call anyone out, but that I know a majority of you are not doing is setting goals. You see, this is what I'm talking about, Chelsea. Ask me how I would have framed that. I would have said,

One of the biggest opportunities that most of you have out there to improve, and Chelsea's just going to tell you, one of the things I know for a fact you're not doing is, one of the things I know for a fact you're not doing that you need to be doing is you need to be setting goals.

You need to be strategic with these marketing strategies. Social media is just a marketing strategy. If you're not having a clear goal, a clear understanding of what you're trying to do with your social media and you're kind of just doing it, you're not going to get the most out of that strategy, out of that channel.

Yeah. And let us remind you that social media is not free. It is not void of cost. It costs you time. It costs you resources. And so even if you are not physically shelling out resources,

$5, $10 to run an ad on social media, whatever, you guys are still investing time, time that it's taking away from you doing something else in your small business. And so to Chelsea's point, we want you to have the approach to social media, the same as you would have the approach to like investing in a print ad. If you were going to put a

a full page ad in a magazine, how would you go about deciding if that ad was successful? You would say, this is how much I paid for the ad, right? This is how much business I got from the ad. Here's my delta.

It was either negative or it was positive, right? And so am I willing to try this and do this again? Is it worth me investing in this ad again? Same thing with social media. You can ask yourself the same questions. How much time, how many hours am I spending in posting on social media? Is it getting me engagement? Is it getting me followers? But more importantly, are those the right followers?

Am I connecting to the right target audience? Because y'all, if you're out there and you're going viral, that's fabulous. Except for the fact that those people that are now following you may want absolutely nothing to do with your product or your service. That's actually a big problem that a lot of businesses have when it comes to giveaways.

Giveaways are great on social media for gaining followers, getting more eyeballs on your content. Yes. But a lot of times small businesses will notice after they do the giveaway, all of those followers will unfollow you. Or they'll notice that, oh, these people are now hating in the comment section because the stuff that I have is not for them. And so they're letting people know, oh, I don't like this stuff like that.

I'm not saying don't do giveaways, but I'm saying that's a great example of, you know, not all eyeballs are the ones that you want. Good eyeballs. Yeah. Good eyeballs. There are some bad eyeballs out there. I should know. I wear glasses. You have them. Yeah. Well, actually, I don't wear glasses and that's the problem. You're straightening your eyes. I have glasses.

I have glasses. I just don't... I wear them to drive, okay? I'm not going to endanger anyone. But the rest of the time, I'm just kind of like, I can't see very well. It's fine. So the one...

comment I do want to say here is we noticeably are not talking about using social media to actually get paid for views. So we're not talking about monetizing on social media in this discussion. This discussion is going to be solely us reframing and saying, hey, the same way that you are going about making decisions about

marketing in other platforms or other channels, billboards, radio ads, you know, any of those other channels, community events, the same way you're approaching those, we want you to approach social media. So we're not going to, if you guys are content creators that are solely out there, you're

and you don't have a product or service, and you are solely just trying to get money from TikTok from your views, we're not talking to you. We're talking to small business owners who have a product, who have a service, who have a business to promote. Your priority is that business. Yeah. All right. It's not whether or not TikTok is paying you. And listen, if you are a business that is monetized on the platform, fabulous.

I mean, we want you to reinvest that money back into your business or take a vacation, do whatever you want for it because you work hard. But we want this discussion to be geared towards the business owners who are serious about growing their business and leveraging TikTok and all this stuff. Yes. Yeah. Love that. Okay. Going back to goals. Now, your goals can be tangible goals.

your goals can be a little broader, a little more intangible. So great example for us, we use Instagram specifically to build a community of small business owners who interact with us and each other. You know, we want to harbor that

relationship and build a place where they can feel comfortable asking marketing questions, talking about the struggles that they have when it comes to being a small business. That's one example of a goal. You could have an actual tangible goal. You could say, oh, I want my social media to convert my followers into subscribers on my community. Or I want

my social media to bring me this amount of sales every month. If you're going to have a tangible goal, really, if you're going to have any goal, but let's talk about tangible goals right now. If you're going to have a tangible goal, you need to be, you're never going to believe what I'm going to say, collect data.

I feel like we talk about this all the time. You're such a smart butt. I'm sorry. I know. Here's the thing, y'all. You have to actually collect the data to see if you're meeting your goals.

And it doesn't have to be difficult. For example, we use links.co, which is a link in bio tool, and it shows us analytics, how many clicks on each thing. And so then we're able to see if it clicks, like if we have a new YouTube video, and we create a reel referencing a YouTube video, and they go in there and then click on the YouTube portion of it, we know that

That reel has done what it's supposed to do, right? Yes. Yeah, you can absolutely track this type of stuff. Sometimes it requires that you get a little creative. We never mislead you guys by saying that tracking marketing data is easy. Yeah. It's some of the hardest things to do because, you know, take something...

Similar to social media, where you're trying to correlate the numbers, you're trying to show a correlation between YouTube subscribers or a correlation between product sales and what you're doing online. But you're doing so much different content online that it's hard to track specifically sometimes what it was. Same thing with billboards.

Okay, we have the same problem with like billboards. And so this is where you start to get a little creative with having links. One of the really great tools to not just a link in bio tool, Chelsea, where you can see the analytics, but another one that people are using quite a bit of now on Instagram is many chat. Not only does it...

allow them to automate, right? And for those of you that don't know what ManyChat is, it basically is the thing. If you've been on Instagram lately, you've noticed when people are like, instead of saying, click the link in bio, now they're saying, comment the word dirty, and I'll send you, you know, my recipe for a dirty martini. I didn't know where you were going with that.

I scared you there for a second. I love that. You didn't scare me. You confused me. That's something I would say, not you. So like using a word in the comment section, this tool is where you go in and on the back end, you create that automation. You say, this is the word I want

the automation to be set up for so it triggers it. This is the message I want you to send them in the DM. And then this is the link to whatever download, whatever YouTube video I have, whatever product I have that I'm promoting or selling. And so that is a really great way because they also have an analytics on the back end and

That is a very tangible way for you to tie a metric back to a particular reel because you can set it up to where it only applies to one reel or you could set it up to where it applies to all the reels. And so let's say you set it up to where it applies to all the reels. You're promoting your little, you know, martini glass that you're selling and you say comment the word, you know, martini.

And then I'm going to send you the link so that you could purchase these martini glasses. There's a very viable thing in the analytics now where you could correlate to content creation and the product sales. Vivian, I also want to bring up the fact that when it comes to social media marketing, your platforms may not have the same goals. So, for example...

I explained Instagram. Our Instagram is about harboring community. TikTok, the way that we use TikTok is a little different. We focus more on sharing valuable information in small snippets. It's more focused on here's the info that you're looking for. The type of content that we share on each platform is very different.

Because of that reason. Well, and to your point, I'm glad you brought this up because we are on YouTube, TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn. I'm just not, you know, I think I'm just overburdened with corporate. Like, I don't know. Give me the fun stuff. Give me animal videos and stuff. You don't find a lot of that on LinkedIn. But, yeah.

Okay, each of those platforms are very different. The content that we share on, they can all have very similar goals, right? So...

On YouTube, our goal is still to promote the small loan business SOB community. That's our membership community. But the videos are longer. They're long form content. And instead, what I'm doing there is as we're talking about, let's say, the 19 marketing channels, whenever there's an opportunity and it makes sense for us to say, for example,

one of the things that we did with community building was we actually launched our membership community, you know, blah, blah, blah. And then we talk a little bit about it. The goal is still the same to get people interested in it. We just are going about a different way of doing that because we also understand that in order for somebody to want to join a membership community of ours, they need to trust us. They need to, you know, they need to know that

spending $50 a month with us is worth it and that they're going to get the support that they need. And also, this is a great opportunity to remind you guys that part of the reason that you are showing up on social media is to find your people.

Chelsea and I, we were talking earlier how we have different personalities. Okay, well, we may not be everybody's cup of tea. And we understand that. And we don't want anybody in our community. We don't want anybody.

you know, following us on social media if they don't enjoy what we do. If they don't like the way we talk, if they don't like our faces, if they don't, I mean, whatever it is, we just don't want you there if you don't want to be there. We're not holding people hostage yet. No. Yet. Oh, okay. Yeah, maybe in 2026 that'll be part of our plan. You know what we keep hearing from you fellow SOBs?

Small-owned businesses. Yes, small-owned businesses. You guys are so overwhelmed with your marketing. And we totally get that.

You didn't start your bakery or your boutique store or your jewelry business to become full-time marketers or content creators or ad designers. Marketing can feel really overwhelming. Oh yeah, then you SOBs try to go figure it out because that's what you do. You Google stuff, watch videos, and end up spending hours trying to figure it out.

only to sometimes end up more confused. This is my full-time job and trust me, the way marketing is talked about in the worldwide web can be really misleading. And let's not even talk about trying to hire an agency for help. It's daunting. They don't know your small business like you do and so they're not as effective. And let's not even talk about the cost.

We understand why a lot of you SOBs feel ready to give up. And that's why we even bothered to create the Season Marketer. That's also why we started the SOB Community. We wanted to create something practical and affordable for people who can't or simply don't want to outsource their marketing. Right, so for $50 a month, members can get free downloads and templates, step-by-step tutorial videos,

a weekly live Q&A call with both of us, marketing professionals and other SOBs. You also become a part of a supportive community to bounce ideas off of. It's like having a boardroom of like-minded individuals and marketing professionals where you can talk through all of your marketing questions without having to pay boardroom marketing agency prices. So if you're tired of wasting time trying to figure it

all out on your own, or spending money on things that don't work, join us over at the SOB community. We'll help you turn your marketing stress into marketing success. And hey, it's just $50 a month. So click the link in the description to join, and we can't wait to see you in the SOB community. Now back to the episode. Social media can have a huge payoff if you're attracting the right people. You don't need to have

tens of thousands of followers, as long as you have followers that are actually interested in what you're offering, right? Like, sure, you went viral, but half of those people don't really care about what you have to offer them. Well, it's almost like, I don't know if

if you're listening to this, if you've ever had experience with this, they often tell you that sometimes it's the people that pay the least that are the biggest problems, right? So like they, coaches will tell you this. Coaches will say,

If I charge somebody $5,000 to do something, they are less likely to actually like complain about it or do whatever. But it's the person that's paying $5 that's going to come back and be like, you know, nickel and diming me and being like, hey, they become the problem, right? Yeah. And so I think...

Getting clear, just like we tell you guys to do with, I mean, this is just solid business practice. I don't care which marketing channel you do. And actually, I'm going to say that you shouldn't even start promoting on any marketing channel unless you know this. Who is your target audience? Who do you want to service? Who do you want to sell to? Because that is going to dictate

what you're sharing, what type of content you're sharing on social media and the people that you're trying to attract. If your product cost $5,000 and you go viral, but nobody's willing to pay $5,000 for it, you know, how like great you went viral.

But that's not converting to sales. It's much better for you to focus on like, what type of content do I need to be putting out there to attract the 20 people that will pay $5,000, right? And then grow it from there. So don't be, I know, our brains always like big numbers. We always think like, oh, that person's got $1 million.

you know, whatever, that person's got 500,000. Big numbers are great, y'all. But that doesn't necessarily mean that they, their sales are correlating with that. So you could easily have someone that's on social that has 200 followers, and they're highly

engaging. They're asking questions. They're in the DMs wanting to know more about stuff. And maybe of those 200, half of them are actually buying and putting money where, you know, where their mouth is. And so I think that's, I think that's, I said that right, money where their mouth is. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's correct. Vivian, I'm glad, I'm glad we're talking about converting to sales.

I want to switch gears a little bit. Let's look back at the TikTok ban.

the 12-hour TikTok ban, y'all as small business owners, you lost access to all of those followers. Let's say you've done everything correctly that Vivian and I are saying, and you've accumulated followers that actually are invested, that actually want to purchase from you. If TikTok is gone, how many of those followers are going to look for you?

after you're gone, after they don't have access to your page anymore on TikTok? Or do they even know where to look? Do they even know where to look? Let's say your Instagram gets hacked or taken down for whatever reason. You've lost all those followers. Do they know how to find you? Yeah. And there are simple ways if you're not doing this. So what's interesting, I think sometimes and

You know, Chelsea and I get caught up in this too. When you're sitting there thinking that you already have so much to do in a day, and you're like, Oh, I need to be active on Instagram. Okay, so you're like, what's a good topic for me to cover, right? For small business owners, because that's our target audience. Okay, great. I got a topic. I got an idea. Let me go ahead and shoot this real, real quick. How many times are you looping back in

in the content that you're sharing. Like, "Hey, by the way, I have a website.

I have my own website. My website is theseasonmarketer.com. If you guys want a resource hub for marketing stuff, information, go to theseasonmarketer.com. How many times are you remembering to let people know that you aren't just on TikTok or you're not just on Instagram, but God forbid TikTok goes dark, Instagram gets hacked.

You want them to be able to say, oh, you know, I need to get my coffee fix, right? I need to get my bag of coffee that I drink every morning. I know where to go to buy it, even though their Instagram got hacked. Also, if you try to rebuild your social media, like you're not going to get all those followers back, most likely. Yeah, just saying. Just a real quick little snippet. Yeah.

And it was interesting. I also have a little bit of beef to bring to the table, y'all. Oh, my goodness. All right. Yeah. Because I did think this was kind of funny. You know, when TikTok was like banned for all of like 12 hours. And then now I see that everybody or a lot of people decided to sign up for TikTok.

red note, this Chinese app. Yeah. And I can't get over the fact that you guys all, and I'm not making fun of you if this was you, but I kind of am. Okay. If you're on red note, you literally accepted terms and conditions that you had no clue what they said. Like, did you at least copy and paste it into like Google Translate?

I don't think it mattered. Yeah, I don't think it mattered. But I do love that now when I scroll through TikTok, people are like, I'm loving Red Note. I love Bingo for Red Note. We're just going to go right past that. You're not even going to give any credence? I don't feel like talking about Red Note.

I don't feel like talking about Red Note. I don't know anything about it. I guess at some point we might have to read up on this and figure it out. No, I don't think so. Because to be honest, Red Note, for me, it was a...

I know people were doing it for various reasons. I don't know the longevity of people actually utilizing Red Note for anything that's like business-related, growing businesses. I could be wrong, but I feel like it's just going to be a flash in the pan and that within a couple of weeks, it's going to die down. It was something that happened as a result of like the TikTok ban. Yeah.

and not having access to TikTok. But I feel like it's not something that I know for a fact, and y'all fight me on this. If you signed up for Red Note as a small business owner, don't tell me it was strategic on your part. Do not tell me that because I'm pretty sure you didn't know what the app offered or didn't offer. I feel like Vivian, you're being the controversial person.

controversial one today. You're really just going at it. I personally may get banned. Will you now? Okay. This is the Season Marketers. It's got to be the Chelsea show. That's fun. Vivian, thank you for the great example of ways that you can bring up and talk about how people can find you as a small business. I also want to talk about moving people around

off of social media platforms, period. And bringing them into your own community, whether that's, you know, for us, the SOB community, whether that's an email list or a text marketing list, finding ways to move people to a platform that you actually control is huge. Because then you're not worried about getting hacked. Well,

if you're controlling something, please have good privacy. So maybe you are still worried about being hacked, but you're not worried about being taken down. You're not worried about social media going dark or anything like that because you're the one in control. If you get hacked, it's your own fault. You know, like you're the reason why something went wrong. Are you victim blaming here? I'm not victim blaming. I'm saying that

Wouldn't you rather be the reason something went wrong instead of having it completely out of your control? Yeah. Let me use this as an opportunity. If you guys have not been amped up today, if you have not done your...

affirmations in front of the mirror. Let me do it for you right now. You guys built a freaking business. There was nothing, then you built it, then there was something, okay? The reason I want to remind you of that great power that you have is because the whole purpose of you having a small business is to try to bring people into your ecosystem. You have to

built this entire ecosystem. And so these channels, this social media, TikTok is a way for you to lure them to say, "Hey, these are my white flags. If this is you, if you relate, if you like this product, if you like the service, if you like the way I deliver this information to you, come over here, come into my world." Okay? And then

that's where you have full control, like Chelsea saying, okay, so yes, you have full control if you get hacked. But no, most importantly, you have full control there, that if anything were to happen, if TikTok went dark the next day, it doesn't matter. It doesn't impact you as much because you have them on your email list. And you could send them an email and say, Hey, by the way, yes, we know TikTok's down, but

Remember, I have a website. You guys can buy all my products on my website. It's up to date, okay? Oh, by the way, you love the information I have. I also have videos on YouTube or I have a blog or a vlog section on my website where you can find all the same type of content. Absolutely. Thank you for bringing up blogs. That's a really great point because you're still...

You're basically saying, "Oh, you don't have access to my Reels anymore. You don't have access to my little TikToks anymore. Well, guess what? I'm still sharing all the same information. It's just in a different format." I love that. That's a great example. Or it's in a different place. And so that's the whole thing that I think is important. I'm just going to spoiler alert, remind you guys, tell you guys right now,

Five years from now, all of these platforms are going to look different. Instagram is going to be very different. Hey, y'all remember when on Instagram we only shared photos?

Do you remember that? Do you remember when videos weren't even a thing? Oh, hey, do you remember on YouTube when it was only long form videos? They didn't have YouTube shorts. They didn't have a place where you could like, you know, take your content and create smaller snippets and then get more, you know, viral opportunities. Every single one of these is going to change. And I

If I were a betting lady, I would bet that good old Facebook is probably going to be 30 years out still kicking it because us older people love us on Facebook still. So the thing is, I'm just saying everything is going to change because people change over time. And that is the only thing we can bank on. So when you are sitting there sharing information or when you're

active on these social media channels, please use your powers for good and bring them into your ecosystem.

Okay, it's not fair to bring somebody onto your TikTok page and have them follow you without you actively reminding them consistently that you're available via email, that you're available on the website, that they can still access your products, your services, your information elsewhere. Mm-hmm.

You can also use lead magnets. Just pointing that out there too, to get people in your own ecosystem. So Vivian and I have personality quizzes, like what kind of marketing personality are you? To get the results, you need to share your email address. Well, I think for us, you don't have to share your email address.

Not the way the quiz is set up, but it is something that we can turn on if we've just chosen not to set it up like that right now. Like you were saying though, Chelsea, the thing is there are downloads, freebies, checklists, all of that that you can leverage to get people into your ecosystem no matter what. And so think of it this way. Great, you're using Instagram to draw people in. Why not promote your free checklist for

you know, whatever it is. And then that way, they transactionally, they give you an email address, you deliver that freebie to them. It's great content. They love it. So it's a win-win, right? They're like, great. Now I have a checklist I can do for whatever. And then now,

you're getting them onto your email list and you're able to continue to communicate no matter what happens on Instagram. So I think the important takeaway here, Chelsea, is that social media should be the tool

that people are using. So it is a tool. Don't get an emotional attachment to it. All right. Yeah. I mean, I'm not emotionally attached to postcards. I'm not emotionally attached to billboards. It's, you know, so it's very weird to me that people get emotionally attached to their TikTok or their, you know,

Well, we're talking small business. As a small business, don't get emotionally attached. I mean, if you're emotionally attached to social media, do whatever you want. It's not my problem. Yes, you are correct. I'm not giving personal advice. I'm giving... Yes. Small business marketing advice. We would never give you personal advice. Trust us. We're giving you small business marketing advice because that's what we know. If social media...

is negatively affecting your well-being, limit your use. It's just a marketing channel. Find other marketing channels to use to promote your small business. You're not required to use social media.

Yeah, I think that's the most important part of it. Yeah. Remember, 19 marketing channels. You guys have access to all 19 of them. And this is just one of them. And so... And I... Yeah, and it's personal preference, I think. Sometimes people just... Like, sometimes people... Some people would be terrified to have their...

big head on a billboard, right? But yet we see lawyers, state farm agents, all kinds of people don't have that hang up, right? It's a personal preference. They're like, hey, billboards work for me. It builds brand awareness. I don't mind if you take my picture and blow my head up 50 times and

put it, plaster it all over billboards, you know, throughout my city. Vivian, you've sold me. Let's get a billboard. But keep my head size normal and let's blow your head size up. What are you going to be like a little mini person next to me? Yeah, I could sit on your shoulder or something. Okay, sure. No, but a lot of people might be saying right now, well, social media is the free marketing channel.

It's not. It's not free. It's not free. Do you know Vivian and I create reels from conception to then having to plan out the angles, how I'm going to go about it? What am I going to say? Okay, I recorded it. Now I have to rerecord it because I shouldn't turn the microphone on. It's effort.

Yeah, and then you have to edit it. Well, I edited it, but now it's two minutes long instead of 130. So I can't post on Instagram. So now I need to find a way to make it even shorter. Like this is time. Yeah, this is a lot of time. It probably takes me two hours to create a reel like from start to finish. That's two hours that I could have been doing something else, which is mad respect. That's why I'm saying like,

I don't know...

why it is in our heads. We, I understand the correlation, like you just said, I understand. It's because people think it's the free thing. All right, let me tell you guys something else. You want another free marketing channel? PR. How many of you are out there doing public relations? Okay, it's preference. And that's fine. We want you to build the business that you want, which includes picking the right marketing channels for you, the ones you enjoy doing.

Is it work? Yes, all of the marketing channels are work. If you're doing it strategically to try to leverage and grow and promote your small business,

There's thought and effort that goes into all of them, all right? And in some channels, there's a lot more money that goes into it, right? For it to be effective. Television. Unless you're willing to get a good commercial done, that's going to cost you a little more money, right? Yeah. So there are just things that considerations you need to have and understand. But don't do this thing where you're not putting weight to social media.

Yeah. We've had this whole discussion for the sole purpose of reminding you guys, social media can be super effective. All right. It does require time. It does require effort. You're a small business owner. And I can tell you right now, your time is not cheap. All right. You guys have a ton of other stuff you could be doing and participating in. And so just be sure that

All of that effort is not for nothing, that you guys are tracking data, you are focusing on the right stuff, that you have the right mindset going in. I'm telling you, over 15 years doing this marketing stuff, Chels, and I have never in my life seen people act the way they do around one marketing channel. Yeah.

Like people don't treat television like this. People don't have these like, you know, I don't know. No, I completely understand. And again, we're not saying drop social media, but if it is negatively affecting your well-being,

You can still use that channel. Maybe just limit your use. Maybe only use Instagram instead of Instagram, TikTok and Facebook and Pinterest and Red Note and, you know. Or outsource. Yeah. Okay. Or outsource. We have a client that, Chelsea, you do all of the reels for.

Yes. She doesn't want to mess around with editing and doing all that. She'd rather just pay you a monthly fee to go do that. And so that's fine, too. You guys also have that option. So the thing is, get creative around it. Understand the biggest part for me is, you know, and I think this is because I'm 40 something and I'm always reflecting internally on myself. I'm like, I'm

I need to get real with myself about certain things because the thing is, that's the only way that you can accurately assess the situation and then go in and find the solutions that you want to do. All right? If you guys are saying, I'm not enjoying social media right now,

Maybe you just want to hire someone to record your videos. They'll come out with their iPhone. They'll record the videos. They'll bring a little light, make sure the mic is working great. They'll record it. They'll go back and edit it. They'll then send you the final. You get to tell them, hey, here are a few edits I want to make. Great. And then you pay them at the end of the month. That may be what you want to do. Yeah. Just find ways to...

Give yourself guidelines if that's what you need to do. Or you could just switch to different marketing channels. And I do because I feel like we've been pretty open with this entire conversation. Chelsea and I, just the other day, were talking about, you know, moving into 2025 as a person. One of my personal goals is I want to find that joy again in doing things.

And what I mean by that is, you know, sometimes I get so task-oriented that I'm like, oh, I just want to check this thing off the box. Okay, well, then my joy in doing that one task lasts all of three seconds because I check the box off. And then I'm like, maybe I should list it again on my to-do list just so I can recheck the box again. Right? So my...

My reason in bringing that up is when I told Chelsea, when we were talking about our content creation for 2025 moving forward, what we want to make videos on, what type of information we want to share, that was an important factor for me. And so what I understand about myself is that in order for me to be excited about something, it's got to be a little silly.

it's got to be a little fun. And so that's where Chelsea and I start pitching out ideas to each other. Hey, we can take this piece of content, this informational video, and we can put our own little twist on it. Listen, people may hate it. They may be like, that is the dumbest video I've ever seen. I do not. I'm going to actually unfollow you because that video was so dumb. But

But we're willing to try and just, I think, interject a little fun and joy back into that content creation. Because, y'all, I personally don't want to be a little monkey to this system. I'm not interested in having to pump out so much content just because I feel like it's what the algorithm wants.

Yeah. Like I personally did not sign up for those terms and conditions, even though everything was in Chinese, but whatever.

Okay, y'all, so let's go ahead and do the TLDL, Too Long, Didn't Listen. So if you skipped ahead to this chapter, I'm about to give you a little synopsis, but I also want to say that when you do have the time, go back and listen to this entire conversation because there's a lot of really good snippets in here to help you when it comes to

Fixing and Reframing Your Relationship with Social Media. Y'all, social media is one marketing channel out of 19.

You don't have to use it if you don't want to. If you have other marketing channels that would work best for your small business, do that. It's not required of you. Also, reframing your relationship with social media does mean that you need to actually set goals. What am I trying to achieve with this marketing channel? Remember, it's all about

actually using it as a marketing channel, setting goals, finding ways to increase your sales, increase, I don't want to say your followers, but

you need to give yourself goals. This also means that you need to be collecting data. You need to be tracking this and saying, you know, am I reaching my goals? Is this a return on investment? You know, is this worth my time? On another note, social media platforms can go dark, as we saw with TikTok. So finding ways to convert your followers, to move your followers onto your

own platforms is also really important. Informing people that you have a website, that you have an email list, that they have ways to find you in case social media is no more for some reason. And lastly,

Take a good look at how you're using social media and the relationship that you have with it. You know, is it negatively affecting you? Maybe the best thing for you is to outsource it. Or maybe the best thing for you is to limit the time that you're active on it. Whatever works best for you in your small business, just remember that it is a form of marketing. It's simply a marketing channel. It is not required of you.

Chelsea, thanks for wrapping that up for us. Friendly reminder, you guys, if you have not already subscribed to this podcast, please do so. Also share it with your business bestie. If you have a small business owner friend out there that's looking to promote their business and they could use some marketing advice, go ahead and share this episode with them. And lastly, please, please, please, please,

lose, leave us a review. We would certainly appreciate it. If you have any ideas for future topics that you want to hear us cover, go ahead and email us at help at theseasianmarketer.com or you can always just DM us on Instagram, Facebook, Tik Tok, all them things. Okay. And go be the best SOB you can be.

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