Creative AI: Should we be Worried?
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What is going on, people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're really back this time. We're your hosts. I'm Marques. And I'm Andrew. And today we've got kind of a mixed bag, but it's a fun one. A bunch of the strangest, in my opinion, dumbest EV features we've seen in a long time.

Also, possibly some of the strangest, dumbest smartwatch features we've seen in a long time. And then a whole bunch of the AI stuff that we've seen over the past couple weeks and months sort of building up. One of those things where like, I think we're going to end up making a video on the main channel about this. And this is one of those times where we kind of use the podcast to have the conversation that turns into the video. Jump off, yeah. We sort of figure it out as we go. So we're doing it live. We're doing it live. But first...

We just want to say thanks for sticking with us. We're all good. We're back. We're in the studio. And we're also, if you're watching the video version, wearing some pieces that you probably are going to want to get. If you're interested for the holiday season, you're probably going to want to check out shop.mcbhd.com. I'm wearing the holiday sweater that is...

No doubt by the time you see this almost sold out, just a warning. This is a limited edition thing. I think it's only like bigger sizes left and it's baggy too. Yep. So check it out if you're interested. Andrew's got the Chevron sweater. Chevron, the OG. I'm being Marquez for today. Personal favorite. Yeah, we just wanted to throw them on real quick because if you want them by holiday season, probably should order them quick. We don't shout out merch too often here, so please give us a quick minute to do it. But yeah,

Thank you so much for all the kind words last week. We all feel great now. And just big shout out to Adam who, while we were sick, we really thought we would get back in on time and we didn't. So last minute, threw an idea at Adam and he made a two hour long podcast episode. I didn't know we had such a streak going until we checked. I think that was our 144th episode. That's almost three years.

It's pretty crazy. And the funniest thing is the closest we've ever come to missing an episode was episode one because we got messed up on when we were supposed to release it. And you were in California. You flew back from California, recorded an episode on Thursday,

And then flew back to California. Yeah, flew back like two hours later. Yeah, good time. So yeah, Streak is alive, episode 145 today. Yeah. Keep it going. Let's keep it going. We'll see how it goes. This is the longest relationship I have with anything in my life. Same. Marques has been through like 14 different project apps since we started. How many phones have we used? The first phone we were using was probably very different when we started the podcast, but...

You want to talk about these ear... What is this? Earbuds or watch? Which would you call it? Let's do earbuds. Yeah, that's a good point. Is it a watch? I think it's a smart watch. Smart watch. Okay, so Huawei...

I don't know if this was a leak or Huawei posted it. I saw it on The Verge, but essentially it's a new Huawei smartwatch that then pops open and has two Huawei earbuds inside it. And when I first saw this, my immediate thought was, cool, the

The two things I want in a smartwatch are for it to be thicker and for it to have worse battery life. So I don't understand this at all. And surprisingly, when I said that on Twitter, a lot of people disagreed with me and thought this was really cool. And I'm just baffled by that aspect. It's... I'll tell you what it is, which is...

an interesting gadget and we don't get that many interesting gadgets aren't all the smartwatches kind of the same looking at this point you can get the square one i don't think this looks any different i think this just looks worse than other ones because it's thicker right but how many of them also let you hold and charge your earbuds like functionally okay

Functionally, that's kind of cool. I would love to hear this argument. No, I just mean like, okay, in the future someday when battery life isn't dramatically compromised in this tiny amount of space, wouldn't it be cool to also be able to have your earbuds just like in your smartwatch? Just as an idea. As a hypothetical. Yeah. A hypothetical hypothetical. Sure. The thing here is like...

wireless truly wireless earbuds like this are the absolute easiest thing to carry out of anything else in the tech world like these are the smallest carrying cases possible they're super easy to bring with you literally anywhere even like I know a lot of women say that they don't have pockets like they have enough of a pocket to fit an earbud case in generally like this I think this is one of the things that's

underrated about some wireless earbuds that actually have a small case because a lot of them have a surprisingly unwieldy case. And I think the smartwatch would be the smallest

case possible. Do you know why they're unwieldy? Because they have good battery life. Yeah, they put a big battery in them and then they need like the shape around them and they need a nice clamp and some magnets and the clasp and they put it all together. But like the Beats have like a giant case for no reason. Like they don't need it to be that big, I don't think. AirPods are like literally one of the smallest cases for wireless earbuds.

They do. Yeah, AirPods are weird. When you look at them next to other ones, they look about the same size, but because of the shape and the thinness of it, it's usually much easier. I've found them to be some of the easier ones to carry around. New Galaxy Buds are pretty good, but this just to me, I mean like,

One of the arguments I saw was, no, now your watch has more batteries because the earbuds have batteries in it and it can take from the earbuds. And I was like, but then your earbuds have no batteries. Yeah, that's weird. You're just saying that there's space in there that could have just been a battery. So one of these things has to have a terrible battery life. I mean, with today's technology. I would argue both of them have a terrible battery life. Probably, yeah. But, you know, the idea, the future possibility. The thing is, I'm wearing the Galaxy Watch 5 right now. Mm-hmm.

Do you think a pair of wireless earbuds could fit in this? No. How much bigger do you think this would have to be? I'm using the 40 millimeter also, so this is the smaller one. Yeah, I mean, I have the Watch Ultra, and there's no way anything could fit in there. There's no way earbuds would fit in that, and that is gigantic. There are a lot of people saying the Watch Ultra is really cool, but they could never wear it every day because it's way too big.

This thing is going to be gigantic. Look at how small the leather band on it looks. It's minuscule. I guess on the other hand, and Adam can probably back me up, there's a lot of people who wear much bigger watches than the smart watches that we're wearing right now.

I don't know if those are the same people that want earbuds in their watch, but I'm just saying it's out there. Do you know what's funny is in that situation, the company that I would probably believe this to be better, I think wouldn't make good earbuds, which is like Garmin. Like Garmin are big watches, insane battery life. So I don't think that's an issue already. That's exactly what I was going to say. Yeah, like the new Epix just came out and has like a standard

16 day battery life or something and I actually believe that it has a 16 day battery life so cut it in half and throw some you still have eight days of battery but I don't think Garmin earbuds would be good maybe if they collabed I mean I'm sure Harman Kardon would love to throw their name on literally anything so they could probably collab with Garmin but maybe in that scenario I

I could see it. I just can't imagine how many times this is going to get knocked into a wall. Because of how big it is? Like, it's so big. There's a thing, like, in watches when you're wearing them. It's how many times you could just knock them into, like, the door frame as you're walking through it. And you're not paying attention. And will the watch survive? And every time you do that, two earbuds fall down on the floor and roll across. And things are just... Just, like, imagine being at the mall or something and just, like...

Now all of a sudden your earbuds are rolling away in a group of crowded people because you accidentally knocked into like a mannequin or a clothes rack or something like that. It all seems crazy. I agree with all of this. It's just that there's something about consolidating two things that you'd have to charge and carry separately into one thing. And that general idea I like.

I don't know if you'd put like your earbuds in your phone. There's probably a phone case with earbuds in there. I think there has been, there's at least been concepts of that. I almost feel like that makes more sense because phones at this point are already almost unwieldy to put in pockets. So what's another a hundred million powers for earbuds? I don't know. Like, I don't know how regular Huawei watches are. Have you tested one? I never have. I have not. I would assume they're similar to a galaxy watch, a pixel watch, just kind of like the standard you

You barely, you have about a day, a little more than a day. So putting this in there, even if it's using the battery from the headphones on a day that you don't use it, there's still gaps of where it all has to fit and extra connectors that have to pair to it. Like you're losing battery space no matter what. Dude, if Apple did this, the world would be on fire.

You know, someone said that. I don't think I agree with that. I think they love this. I don't think they obviously want. I don't think Apple would ever do this. No, no, no. Of course. But well, maybe not ever. But if you tried to fit current earbuds, Apple AirPods or whatever inside of an Apple watch, it wouldn't work. But.

but tiny, tiny earbuds inside of a watch, people would go, oh, that's genius. That's beautiful. I still think people would think it's stupid. Well, what's funny? It needs an amazing magnet. I think the people who think this is cool would hate the Apple version of it. And I think the people who hate this would think the Apple version is cool or the sane people like me because I'm perfect.

Would think this is stupid all around and I disapprove of whoever did that. We're going to have a talk after work. I'm going to try to get my hands on this watch. Okay. I'm going to try. Good luck. I'm going to try. Speaking of watches really quick. A lot of people liked this last time, but do you see my, um, my Alpine loop for my galaxy watch? Isn't that weird? Isn't this an Apple band? No. No.

- No. - Didn't you say somebody was like, "Nice watch," before you showed them the watch? - I went to a Taco Bell, my natural habitat, and the guy at the drive-thru was like, "Yo, sick watch," because I would kinda have my arm resting on my window. And then I turned it over and went, "Wait, what?"

a galaxy watch and not an apple watch ultra and that's amazing i was like that was amazing but dude there are so many good knockoff watch bands on amazon i have a trail loop knockoff and an alpine watch knockoff and they were ten dollars each so and they're probably very close in actual material and quality to the real like i would call them seven to eight out of ten in comparison

When you're a tenth of the price, yeah, I think that's pretty awesome. That's pretty good. All right. Another kind of ridiculous thing that I know you want to talk about. I want to talk about maybe one of the...

This might not even be a hot take one of the dumbest things I've ever seen is funny because I get to play devil's advocate for this time and you get to be mad at me okay, so Lexus there's a video on Evo magazines Twitter of Lexus developing a manual transmission for electric cars in the form of like the you know a stick shift in between full-blown stick shift and there's a video of this guy driving around for 45 seconds and

shifting like a normal stick shift car but it's like adding noise adding all this extra oh i didn't notice the noise yeah there's noise it's terrible we'll play a little clip of the video for you guys but yeah this this seems uh this seems like the one of the dumbest things i've ever seen does it have a boost gauge it seems like it's got like an rpm counter and yeah i don't know what that maybe that's a just a way of knowing when to shift but like

I quote tweeted this with an older tweet of mine, and I think we've probably talked about this on the show at some point. We 100% have, yeah. Which is like, we're going to look back at the transition period where you're trying to convince people to get an electric car and look at all the weird things they do to imitate gas cars as hilarious because, look, electric cars are just fundamentally easier to use and to add back...

All of the clunky and inefficient and engaging of a manual gas car is just a waste of time. Get over it. Ignore the... Like, just drive. Just drive. You'll be fine. I'm going to play devil's advocate, but I also...

Yeah.

And we have talked about it a little bit before in the sense of there is still driving scenarios that require, that skill-based is more fun. And like maybe you're racing or something like that where if you're just putting pedal to the floor, you're losing a lot of different variables that would... Just get a gas car. I mean, eventually we would like to go everything to EV, right? Yeah. I mean, the enthusiast fun car, I imagine that will stay the gas car the longest. There is no sense in making the electric...

That's my thing. It's like 90% of the comments are agreeing with me, like this is dumb. And then 10% are like, wait, I like manual cars. This is cool. But that person's still not buying this. They're just going to buy an older gas car to do this. I think there's potentially an area in where...

We get to the point where EV is the performance you're getting out of an EV is so much cheaper than the performance you would get out of like a gas car. Like let's like it already is at that point. So let's go even cheaper now. Like now you're racing something that's $30,000, but has a zero to 60. That's equivalent to something that is like 70 to $80,000. That's very normal right now. Yeah. And then, but now you can add the skill based aspect of it. So if you're doing a track day to get slower, you still,

To add variable. The thing is, if now you're racing on track day and the only aspect is pressing the pedal forward, you're losing out on so much of the actual skill part of it. There's so many other things

that are still skill related with driving. Like even when you just play, when you go-kart race, which is just like, oh, you just hit the pedal and go. There's all the driving lines, acceleration, braking, handling the weight of the kart. Like all those things still matter. You just don't have to, like there's lots of,

arguments in the gas car world now about like, oh man, Porsche's PDK is so fast, but I still want the manual version because it's more engaging and I'll just be slower. And there's lots of cars that are literally too fast for a manual gearbox. And it's like, we don't do manual gearboxes anymore because that's not safe. I mean, the biggest argument to this is F1.

F1 still has shifting. F1 has shifting and is there... It's part of the sport. There is a skill gap between people who are shifting better and cars that are built that are shifting differently. I think for the sport of professional driving on a track, that's cool. Yeah, but there's still a hobbyist sport aspect of things. I...

Yeah. It's niche and you're going to be paying a lot extra for this. I think the other thing is people, I saw a lot of comments that were saying, why would I want this? Why would I want to drive every day like this? Manual sucks in everyday driving. Like if it's electric, it's not going to be stuck in manual. It's going to be a mode. I guarantee you, you can drive this car with just a pedal and not having to shift. There's a lot of cars out there that have, even gas cars that have this like

like fake shifting or stuff like that. Like my Forester is a CVT, which doesn't have gears and still has fake shifting on it for... I think it's really stupid, but that's still... So what happens when it fake shifts? You fake shift and it just creates what would be similar to a gear. I think the only real scenario is like if you wanted lower gear in like snow or mud or something like that, but...

If you even in that scenario, if you fuck it up, it'll just be like, nope, you're wrong. And then go past it. Yeah. Yeah. This is like I there's I think this is extremely small. Yeah. I feel like F1 is a thing, but we've been driving cars for 100 something years and we still have horse races.

Yeah. It's like there will always be like the people that take that older thing and continue doing it no matter what. I think when you reach a like moment of peak performance, you need to add more variables into things to create larger skill gaps of stuff like that. So in the sport obvious aspect of this, like shifting is still going to be one of those variables that will make the difference between drivers. On a track? Yeah. I'm only talking about track. If you do this on the road, it's just for fun. This is like a regular Lexus thing.

I don't even know, maybe a car, maybe an SUV. And it's like, you're adding inefficiency. You're adding distraction. You're adding engagement. Sure. But for what?

If you want that feeling, just get a gas car. They're also driving on the wrong side of the road. Morons, who would ever do that? Driver on the right side of the car. Geez, we can't take them seriously. Wild. Anyway. I want to say I've enjoyed both of us playing devil's advocate because I saw moments where both of us legitimately got mad at the other person. I'm so mad. And I love it. Can I throw one more wrench in here? Do it. Do it.

Formula E cars have transmissions. Of course they do. I actually didn't know that. Also, no one cares about Formula E. Well, at the highest level, I expect... They also have speed boosts. I still think there's so many variables. I think with Formula E, there are way more regulations, so all the cars are more similar. So the gearbox is an actual variable. I've always heard that it's an efficiency thing. Like, you can actually pull more efficiency out of the electric motors by running them through a transmission.

Yes. But I don't know. So most electric cars today have one gear.

And that's because they can run at an extremely high range of RPMs from zero, having all their torque up to say 20,000 RPM or whatever. Tesla Model S is one of those. Lots of electric cars do that. There's a couple that have two gears and they'll say they do that because they have a high performance lower gear for like getting off the line, quick acceleration, and then a lower RPM, higher gear for efficiency. So when you're cruising along the highway, when you're going at higher speeds, you're

you use that higher gear. That's why gas cars have so many gears is because they're extremely inefficient outside of their like peak power band, which is several hundred RPM. So yes, adding more gears can make you more efficient theoretically.

It's just a matter of whether you want that complexity in a gearbox and do you want to add all those parts to your car when you can probably get away with having one gear and doing great things with several motors instead of several gears. Yeah, I think we're both in agreeance that everyday driving. Yeah, everyday driving. I hate this with all my heart. I think there's a sport hobbyist aspect of it that is kind of. I'll admit that. Yeah, if someone were to buy this for everyday driving, I bet they would use it for like a week and then probably never touch it again. Like you would just drive the car normally. It'd be so annoying.

All right, let's take a break. We've got to come back and talk about all this AI stuff that's been on Twitter lately. BRB.

Oh, wait. I saw Ellis go for the microphone. It's been so long. We had the Hassan interview. We had the week off. We completely fell out of our rhythm. We have to do trivia. We have to do trivia. Oh, yeah. And I think there's going to be a pretty trivia-tastic episode coming up pretty soon. Oh, I knew about that. I knew about that. So, you know, we're making up for it. We'll make up for it. But yes, trivia. Yes, of course. How could I forget? All right. So...

Across the Atlantic, far, far away, there's a magical realm called Europe. And in Europe... I've heard of that. Crazy, right? In Europe, there's a science center. And at this science center, both the Higgs boson particle was discovered and the World Wide Web was invented. Do you know the name of this science center? Oh, man.

I thought I was going to be able to guess the country at least. And then you're like, no, let's be more specific. I know the name of the facility. Honestly, I'll take the country. Oh, well, now it's going to be bad when I get this wrong. I also half know that. That's a good one. Okay. We'll come back. We'll be back.

Support for Waveform comes from AT&T. What does it feel like to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with AT&T next up anytime? It's like when you first pick up those tongs and you know you're the one running the grill. It's indescribable. It's like something you've never felt before. All the mouthwatering anticipation of new possibilities, whether that's making the perfect cheeseburger or treating your family to a grilled baked potato, which you know will forever change the way they look at potatoes.

With AT&T NextUp Anytime, you can feel this way again and again. Learn how to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on them and the latest iPhone every year with AT&T NextUp Anytime. AT&T, connecting changes everything. Apple Intelligence coming fall 2024 with Siri and device language set to US English. Some features and languages will be coming over the next year. Zero dollar offer may not be available on future iPhones. NextUp Anytime features may be discontinued at any time. Subject to change, additional fees, terms and restrictions apply. See att.com slash iPhone for details.

It's a new year. Maybe you're taking a month off from drinking, you know, dry January, and maybe you're replacing it with something else. Puff, puff, puff.

Some like one in five people who do dry January say they're smoking weed instead. And more Americans are now smoking weed daily than drinking daily. Current president is into it. No one should be in jail merely for using or possessing marijuana, period. Future president is into it. I've had friends and I've had others and doctors telling me that it's been absolutely amazing, the medical marijuana.

Marijuana. Failed president and former prosecutor was down to clown. People shouldn't have to go to jail for smoking weed. Even health conscious brain worm guy likes it. My position on marijuana is that it should be federally legalized. Everyone's getting down with pot, but legislatively, we're still stuck with a hot mess in the United States. Today Explained. Wherever you listen, come find us. All right, welcome back to the AI podcast. I'm your AI host, Marques.

oh no he's real he's real don't worry no what am i one of my biggest pet peeves though low-key is when companies say that they're using ai to do something and they clearly not this morning i really get annoyed by this like there are companies who say they have ai autofocus and uh the difference between that and eye recognition is very faint

I don't know why they feel any... Actually, I know why. AI is very futuristic. It's in the news a lot. It seems like this black box of mystery and wonder that kicks out amazing results, and so people like to lean into AI whenever they have anything smart in their product. It's AI. It's AI.

But I want to talk about actual AI for a little bit because it has actually made the rounds on, you've seen it on Twitter, right? Yeah. Chat GTP conversations. It's just nice to have Twitter about something else blowing up besides just Twitter. I'm tired of reading about Twitter for the last month. Yeah, this is why I like Twitter. Moments like this where we all get this little taste of the future through a open AI research project that is basically a chat bot

But that draws from a gigantic catalog of the world's information and is able to do amazing things. And it's kind of terrifying some of the things it's been able to do. It is fun to collectively gawk and be terrified together. Yeah. So like I said earlier, this is one of those things where I want to make a video about this because I have some thoughts about this.

all of the AI stuff how it's used what we can use it for how it might evolve into the future and this is you know just me like thinking out loud on some of that stuff but you have a so I want to talk about two of them the two big ones we're talking about chat GPT which is like a chat and then we're also seeing a bunch of like avatar AI so we're going to talk about both of them quickly like you said we haven't discussed this too far we're going to use the podcast as kind of our yeah our first dive into this and I think we've

toyed around with it a little bit. So I have a couple examples here. ChatGPT though is like people are online, we're already getting people sending to us like creating full MKBHD videos through ChatGPT and it does a pretty dang good job. - So basically what it is is it's a text box. You can type in any chat and just have a conversation with it. You can ask it questions.

You can give it lines of code and ask for it to find what's wrong with the code for you. You can ask it to write a poem for you. You can have a conversation back and forth about something you learned and it will further educate you on the topic. Like it has all this information to have realistic, meaningful thought and response conversations. Like we talked about when Google AI, Google IO came around and

Google Assistant got more conversational. It would remember context. What was that one project? They had like a conversation bot project. They did. And that was like more research project like this. But even in the consumer product we use now, Google Assistant, when you ask,

How tall is Barack Obama? It'll tell you. And then your next question can be, ah, when's his birthday? And you don't have to say, when is Barack Obama's birthday? You're in a conversation flow. This is like the ultimate highest end AI version of that in research form. And we've been asking it for all kinds of things. Hey, give me a script for an MKBHD video about...

you know, art and AI. And it will actually give me a script for an MKBHD video. Like, it's pretty good. And the best part about it is like,

What I really loved about that, I don't want to spoil too much because we have some fun examples saved for the video later. But like when you talk about when you say write it for a YouTube video, it ends with like, don't forget to subscribe and hit that like button. Or like if you ask it to write you a tweet, it'll put hashtags at the end of it. Like it understands the context of even the social media. I get that it can do poems and stuff, but seeing that it's doing this like

new age ways of posting almost and finding that context is really cool. I made a couple examples for Waveform though today. The first one I did, I'd like for you to read it. I asked it to write an intro for the Waveform podcast hosted by Marques and Andrew. And I'm going to have Marques read this like a regular intro and maybe we'll switch ours up. This is what it came up with.

Welcome to the waveform podcast where hosts Marques and Andrew explore the latest in technology and science join us as we delve into the fascinating world of cutting-edge innovation and discover how it's shaping our future from the latest advancements in artificial intelligence to the frontiers of space exploration we cover it all tune in every week for engaging discussions and thought-provoking insights so like right off the bat that seems kind of simple but if you really think that all i put in there was waveform podcast and both of our names

It hits stuff like technology, science, AI, space exploration, that it's weekly and we're doing a discussion. That's pretty good.

Pretty impressive. Okay, so I gotta admit something. Okay, when I first started seeing these I was very unimpressed Okay, because I felt like it was basically taking a few keywords and then just copying and pasting examples of popular versions of that often from maybe just Wikipedia articles so I had people send me like a

what is an armadillo or what is ultimate frisbee? And then it would just tell me what ultimate frisbee is. And it would read exactly like the, like the Wikipedia article. And I was like, that's not impressive at all. Like I could ask Google that and it would tell me the same thing.

So it really became much more impressive when the prompts got more creative, I think. It's similar to Dali where like Dali was impressive but clearly kind of messed up. But the more intense you got with the prompts and how it still was continued to be messed up, like errors here and there, but it still...

could contextually figure out this two to three sentence long prompt and still create something that made sense. It's wild. It's a really good point. So there's a normal accepted error rate. Let's just call it like 10%. And when you just ask Dolly, give me a cat, and it gives you a cat, but 10% of the things look kind of weird, you're like not impressed. Yeah.

But when you ask Dolly, give me a cat with 12 legs in the style of Monet or

on canvas with robots fighting in the background, and it actually does 90% of that, it's really impressive. So I feel like it's kind of along the same lines here. ChatGTP, I've had a number of conversations with it. I've asked it lots of things. I even tweeted what I asked for a iOS versus Android essay. I loved that. Android versus iOS essay. And previous versions of that, it got some things wrong. It was telling me some things that weren't actually true.

But the fact that I was that detailed with my prompt and I was like, give me the style of the YouTube video, give me Android better than iOS, give me these things. I was like pretty impressed that it was actually able to generate that much. Even though a lot of it still kind of does read like it's taking from the top line of an article it found or the second paragraph of the Wikipedia about Android.

It's sort of throwing together a structure based on things that I asked for, which is cool. It's blending them very well. I mean, it pretty much is doing that. I guess the argument would be how much is it just copy and pasting from the exact things it finds or how much is it

analyzing X amount of data and then just through all of that data creating something. 'Cause if you search your name, Wikipedia's not gonna be the only one. There's gonna be 400 pages that say like Marques is an American tech YouTuber with 16 million followers. And then it's gonna be like, oh, 500 articles have said that. That's gotta be important. I wanna take that and put that in there, some form of that in there. But yeah, the way it contextualizes different things and actually makes sure that

it's using them all correctly in like a story for the most part you're right there is still an error there is still an error rate yeah for sure and some of them you read and you're like that's awesome and then i think david was saying something about fastest sea mammal it's like oh that's so cool and then looked it up it's like wait it's not that like that's not what it is yeah yeah and i also have like uh and this will also i think be in the video there are some errors that are more

common than others like when you ask for these like ai paintings or portraits or dolly yeah hands we're gonna get into the the paintings in a minute the art i guess can i do i i wrote i got it made a story in chat gpt that can i read this and then we'll get into uh the more art version of it all right um in the holiday spirit i asked

In the holiday spirit, I asked ChatGPT to write a story about how tech YouTuber Marques Brownlee had to take over the role of Santa Claus. Would you like to hear? I would love to hear what it came up with. All right.

It was the night before Christmas, and Marques Brownlee, better known as MKBHD on YouTube, was feeling more than a little stressed. As a tech YouTuber, he's used to filming and editing videos, not delivering presents to children all over the world. But that's exactly what he had to do. Thanks to a mix-up at the North Pole, apparently Santa Claus had come down with a terrible cold and was able to make the rounds. And since Marques has been so good this year, the elves had chosen him to take over the job.

Marques was a bit hesitant at first, but he knew that it was his duty to help out. So he quickly put on the red suit and hopped into Santa's sleigh which was powered by the latest and greatest technology. The sleigh was equipped with a GPS system that showed Marques exactly where children lived and it even had built-in cameras so that he could capture all the reactions as he delivered the presents. As Marques flew from house to house he couldn't help but smile. He loved seeing the excitement on the faces of the children as they opened their gifts and he even got to try out some of the new tech toys that he had helped design.

Before he knew it, it was time to return to the North Pole. Marquez was exhausted, but he felt a sense of satisfaction knowing that he helped to make Christmas special for so many kids. As he handed the reins back to Santa, Marquez couldn't help but joke, I think I might have to retire from tech and become a full-time Santa. Santa just chuckled in reply, I think we might have to make you an elf.

Whoa. You got burned at the end. Whoa. That was so good. That was really good. It wasn't really good. What was the prompt again? Give me that one more time. It was write a story about how tech YouTuber Marques Brownlee had to take over the role of Santa Claus. That was. I kind of missed the music already. Yeah, that was really good. It had a punchline at the end. So. Whoa. Yeah. It's a lot of fun to play with.

I'm very interested to see where this goes. I can't wait for like in five years. You just called this before. This is kind of like the highest form of conversational AI that we're seeing. And in five years, when we look back on this and think about how terrible it was, it's going to be really impressive to see where we go. Yeah, for real. Okay. Now we should talk a little bit about the...

the visual versions too. - The visuals, yes. - There's been, we did a whole video about DALI, we've talked about DALI. It's using, you know, obviously diffusion and creating images from scratch using a natural language text prompt, which is sick.

There's another one that's generating AI avatars of people. There's a couple, yeah. And I think with this one, basically you feed it several images, is that right? So you give it some images of yourself and it can spit out some cartoon version of you with different situations. It's very Dolly-like, except this time focusing on humans, although humans that are consenting by giving you their pictures. Prisma Labs did one for you and you have

a million photos of yourself online. And it did a very, very good job. Like yours are insanely impressive. And I think what it's doing is similar to Dali where it knows what a general person looks like. But the really cool thing is that it can find the stylization of other things and make you into it. Like this is you. It looks like you're in a Chevron hoodie astronaut suit. And like...

cool more like Miami Vice. Here's you in a purple suit, which is really awesome. Yeah. A lot of it is really cool. And yours are super impressive. They're pretty good. One thing I've noticed that it never really does well, just like Dolly.

hands and text. So anytime there's supposed to be text in it, like the one with the astronaut suit, supposed to have some text on it right there, doesn't really make a real word. If you ask Dolly to make a stop sign, seven out of 10 times, it just says some weird random. - It just says Matt Mad. - Yeah, some weird word. And then I think if you, there's some other YouTube friends that have done this with hands, but even look at the one of me in a purple suit, like those hands don't quite match up. There's like a floating thumb on the top of my hands there that isn't connected to either hand.

That just happens when you have hands and photos with AI.

So hands are tough. Other than that, pretty good. Yeah, yours is very good. Sara Dietschy did one with Avatar AI. That was incredible. I mean, but again, then there's like Justine who did one on, I forget if it was Prisma or Avatar. Hers was bad. Yeah. And she has a lot of really good pictures out there and her face looks nothing like her in some. Some of them, her eye is like almost off to the side, like off the side of her head. It's,

seems to really like some people and really dislike some people. Myself, who doesn't have a lot of good photos online, tried Avatar AI. It is rough. Really? I'm going to show you some. I disagree. These are fantastic. I want to see these. So, I think these are really bad. To be fair, the photos I fed into it were not great. Although, it still took about 30 photos. And...

If you would like, I guess you can pull them up on yours as well. There's a link in the doc. Oh, okay. I'm clicking on it now.

Some of these are very good. Some of these are very bad. I also totally don't approve of all the categories it put me in. It shows Dominatrix as the first category. There's also like Jim and for whatever reason, Sunflowerfield. None of them look like me. I look like Dr. House in some of them, which I'm not opposed to. It's funny. Andrew, you did not tell me that you starred in a Marac movie.

Wait, what? The text? The gym one. I don't think we can show the gym one. The gym ones are incredible. So there's a varying amount of resemblance to your face because you can tell it's picking which photo it's going to use and trying to make it look like you. The Picasso one looks less like a...

- A photo realistic version. - I would argue the ones that look the most like me are just the most standard ones that felt like it's pretty much just pasting the photo that I put in there onto it. - The race car driver. - It just kind of looks, the race car driver one, you can just tell in specific ones, it is just my face on Michael Schumacher's face. - The fashion model one of you in a turtleneck is very good. - This is just a young Michael Schumacher with kind of my facial details. - Yeah.

So like you can tell where it's pulling from on some of these things. And I don't, this might be one of those things where you should watch the clip later if you can't see all of it. Cause it's a little hard to explain. I think, I think the thing is, is it's, it's nailing,

very normal photos of me. The fashion model one, the one of just like in a business suit or the passport versions of these are all just kind of normal where photos I fed into this, a lot of them were from weddings, which I had a suit on. So it's basically just making kind of a drawing version. This side profile of me as a fashion model is like I posted a side profile picture that was exactly like this. And it just feels like...

the photo of me. Okay. So that's a good, this is a really good transition point because there's a tough question behind all of these, which is,

How do you credit what it's taking inspiration from? Yes. And so for the ones that you gave it the pictures of, it's fairly straightforward. You gave it a certain set of pictures, so you know what it's drawing inspiration from. And if you ever see any similarities, it's pretty obvious where it got that stuff from. I think my whole thing is actually pretty obvious in a lot of theirs as where the ones that nailed it

It's mostly taking it from the pictures I fed it. The ones that didn't nail it, you can kind of tell the photos it's grabbing from. And that's, like you said, it's a discussion that I think we need to have because the discussion on Twitter now is...

What part of where it's scraping from is okay, I guess. And that is a tough question. So you mentioned that other one is clearly a picture of young Michael Schumacher. It's definitely just Michael Schumacher. That photo, where did that come from? And we don't know the artist or the photographer or any of that behind that image. And I think that comes back to even like, so Dolly, Dolly...

from open AI is taking from an unknown giant database of like all of the information that they've fed into it. And then if I ask it for a picture of a cat in space or whatever, it'll give me a picture of a cat in space. And maybe it's taken some photos from artists about cats and some photos from NASA about space. But if I ask it for a photo of a cat in space in the style of

an MKBHD video, it might be taking frames from an MKBHD video that it has in its database. And should it be able to do that? Yes. And that is a tougher question. I think that is a very tough question. And I'm going to preface this by saying, we're just going to say our opinions very quickly on this and we're looking at it. So I don't want anyone to... Yeah, I'm not a copyright lawyer. I just want to preface this. We're not copyright lawyers. But there's also just like

I don't know. It's a tough, tough subject. Yeah. And I think there's a lot of conversation to be had about it. But there are a lot of artists out there who seem to be seeing this and saying that a lot of things look far, far too similar to art that is not consenting into being part of these AI databases. And we just don't know how much is a coincidence versus how much is it literally drawing inspiration. It's very, very hard. So the way... Here, the way...

Dollyworks is really interesting. And you can sort of go back and watch the video again and hear the explanations, and there's other explainers of this. But it has all this information. It has all this database. It uses diffusion. It has an image of-- you can listen to David explain this on a previous episode. But it has just a static image of just black and white grain. And then it has a final image.

And it tries to use diffusion to like add structure to this static image on its way to the thing that you described, to learn what you're making. So if you ask it for a picture, I'm just gonna go with a cat again, it knows because it's learned from its database what a picture of a cat looks like. And then it tries to create a picture of a cat from nothing essentially.

And so it's not just like taking a piece of someone else's art and pasting it into this new creation and calling it a new creation. That would be a lot more obvious. What it's more doing is learning from all these different sources what it thinks you are trying to ask it for and then creating a new version of that from scratch. And sometimes the level of variation from that new thing is pretty tough. Like there's probably not that many pictures, let's say, of...

a cat with a purple sky behind it or something. So if you're an artist that made a picture of a cat with a purple sky behind it, and then I ask Dolly for a picture of a cat with a purple sky behind it, it'll probably resemble

little bit more of that artists photo because it doesn't have as many examples to draw from if that makes any sense so it's it's like if I make more specific more nuanced art I am more likely to find issue with

my art being drawn from rather than if I just made like general pictures of cats, you know, it's tough. I also think depending on which AI you're using, there's probably ones that are doing a better job because I have seen people post that. Like some of these avatars they're getting have old artists signatures on them, which means it's definitely taking a little more than just completely learning. And it's more melding things together, which feels like,

Yeah, if it literally has a signature, then it's definitely not using diffusion. I think the hardest aspect of this is you've mentioned, we were talking about this a little bit before the show, and you mentioned how in humanity, we take inspiration from people. And there's no fine line of what is pure copying and what is inspiration. And I think it's very hard to...

To compare that to a machine and AI learning and like I don't know where that line is at all. And I think the more we try and find a line, the more is the harder it gets. It's fuzzy because basically you could argue that AI, if we're trying to make it as close to a human experience as possible, is literally doing what humans do. It's taking inspiration from things and then making its own thing.

And so when you think about like copyright and stealing, you're like, all right, well, if you make the conscious decision to try to make your own version of that thing, you're going to find yourself copying parts of that thing. But if you sort of subconsciously might not remember where you remember it from, but you kind of have this idea of what you want something to look like and then you create it. You were inspired by all of your previous life's experiences. Everything in your life up to that point has led you to what you are painting.

how do you give credit to all those parts of your life and maybe some pieces of art you might have seen along the way that might have inspired you? That, to me, is just as complicated as the AI creating something new from all of the sources it has to draw from. My one pushback on that would be, and again, this is super hard to define. If you can't tell, we want to be very specific with how we talk about this because I think we both understand that

We are not artists making physical paintings and stuff like this, so we maybe don't understand. The other thing was when ChatGPT makes...

a script in the style of an MKBHD video, how much is it actually drawing from things that I have actually said? And I asked it for like script in the style of a MrBeast YouTube video. And I think it's just like has a general thing where for a YouTube video, it adds an intro and the style of a YouTuber.

And an outro. It didn't say peace at the end of mine. It didn't have an alliteration. It didn't say, what's up, MKBHD here. It just did like the general YouTube thing. So I don't know how specific or what it's actually drawing from there, but it didn't seem incredibly derivative. Not to get all conspiratorial, but when Andrew was like, I'm pretty sure that's just Mick Schumacher. I was like, oh, I bet I could find that photo of Mick Schumacher. So I've been digging around. Is it Mick or Michael? Because he's wearing a red...

So I'm assuming it's a Ferrari, Michael Schumacher? I've found closer photos of Mick than Michael. But the thing that I wanted to throw out there is that when I run a bunch of the other photos in that race car driver bunch through it, through Google Lens specifically, it brings me a ton of pictures of Haas NASCAR drivers.

Interesting. And the suit you're wearing is almost identical to the Haas NASCAR suit. And I was wondering that's what I'm wondering if somewhere in the metadata of the world, there's like a tweet that's like, I definitely tweet about Haas. And you have the Haas shirt that you wear and people tweet at you about Haas. I don't like this anymore. Yeah.

Is that a coincidence or did it get scraped? I do want to go into that really quick. And what I was going to say before is the comparison, I think, is a gray area of...

I, as a human, take inspiration from this, and I, as an AI, have a set database with a physically pointing to a thing on the internet that belongs to somebody and where that ownership and copyright part stands. You can choose to add things or remove things from the source. Yeah, there's a physical link to a specific thing. I think ultimately, in a perfect world where the AI would suck on this is that the database is voluntary or paid for, but I think that database is...

a fraction fraction fraction of the size of what the database potentially is I also don't know what these databases are pulling from this is we're all speculating but I would just I'm going to go off the assumption of it's just the internet

everything. It's some collection that they put together because they've taken a lot of things out because obviously Dolly doesn't want it to create certain things. So it's taken a lot of things out of the inspiration and it's taken a lot of things out of things that it'll hopefully create. So they have some curation or control over the sources. They just don't like tell us what that is. Yeah, it's all, it's,

It's a weird area. I think my ultimate... Do you have anything else more you want to say? I kind of have like a closing thought on my... Yeah, I guess I just think... I like to draw the line towards the future and see how far forward I can look at it. And it feels like as AI gets more and more complicated and nuanced and impressive, it will become more and more feeling like human brain type of thing. Oh, that scares the shit out of me.

then you really kind of do compare it to like how humans draw inspiration from things. There will be more explicit inspiration where it's like, oh, if I'm going to draw a picture of Andrew with a NASCAR jersey on, I'm going to give him the Haas one because that seems like it would work. But I think there will be more subtle inspiration like what fabrics you use or what colors that are just like, I kind of like this color because I grew up liking red like that. How do you even...

examine what to give credit to, that will always be, I think, a fuzzy line. Yeah, I definitely agree. I would say my final thought maybe is a bit different than yours. And I want to go back to something Hasan said, which is just in this AI world,

one thing we're losing is the human aspect of it, which is just kind of more of a passion and a feeling behind things. And I think all this AI stuff is really, really cool. And I see it as a tool for the future. A lot of things, there are people who aren't as artistically talented and still want to be able to get a vision out there sometimes. And I think that could help with this to then pass off

to the designers and artists that are good at stuff like that. That's what I see. And ultimately, when I see these, I think they're cool, and then I forget about them, whereas

Like, I love buying prints and stuff from artists that I find all over the place because I think they're super talented and really beautiful. And there's just something behind it that gives me a much more interested feeling. And I enjoy looking at it over and over again. I would never buy anything from any of these AI things and hang them on my wall because there's no journey behind it. Yeah. You have to know that it came from a human. Exactly. Like, there's so much more to that in just...

the overall enjoyment of a piece. So that's why I see this as a tool. And I don't know if, I hope that, I think that feeling is for a lot of people, but I don't know if that's good enough for art. Like I think artists still rightfully should be worried about this and how it's handling things. But that's why I don't see it as as big of a threat

To art in general. Okay. Two things on that. Yeah. One, I do agree with a lot of that. And whenever I have a feeling that is like, I don't think humans will want X. I always have to think, is that a generational thing? I always just run. I always just run it through that filter because I always think like, do humans want to spend all day in VR? No.

But my nine-year-old cousin doesn't really care that much. Sometimes I do. Like there's like always a generational question. So I always just toss that in there. Like will younger generations like buy AI art and think it's totally cool? Maybe. But the other thing is, yeah, it is a tool. And I think that's kind of where I want to go with the video, which is like,

As far as us as creators using AI to do things and make things, it's always a great beginning for brainstorming and coming up with the base of an idea. And then you edit it to create what you want. So every example I have of useful AI is using AI as a tool just like that. Whether it's like...

running a picture through the AI sharpening filter in Pixelmator. And then it's not perfect, but then you finish it up to look just the way you want. Or you use the magic eraser tool in the Pixel, which it uses AI to like fill in the background. And then there's a couple extra things you want and you finish the edit on your own.

All the way up to like, I don't know, I just have chat GTP and I just say, give me a bunch of video ideas. And I look through that list and I go, oh, here's some good ideas. And then I pick on my own what I think makes a good idea. I could see like a perfect example would be we want to step up smartphone awards set.

and you want to show Brandon something cool, you can then quickly create some sort of visual that's 90% accurate and then Brandon can actually do it. Whereas trying to sometimes explain what you picture in your mind is very hard and I am not talented to be able to show that at all. So something like that is how I see this folding out, at least in what I would plan to. - So one of my favorite examples is the combo where someone wanted some inspiration for something.

So they asked ChatGPT for some descriptions of interesting sets, and then they took what the chat spit out and put it into DALI and had DALI mock up those sets. So out of completely nowhere, this person just wanted some feelings for some inspirations for some sets, and they got like a bunch of high-resolution images of some sets just completely come up with from AI. Technically inspired by humans, but like...

That person will go on to create their own set using the tools of AI as the baseline for their inspiration. That's the basic thing that I think I find most useful with all these AI tools. Isn't that kind of limiting though? Like you're limiting yourself to what the AI can picture? I don't think so. I think it's more of a beginning to the rest, especially when I'm asking for help like that. I'm already like...

pulling for my own and not really finding something. So I'm like, all right, I want a couple inspirations for like modern sets. I've seen some modern sets, but let's see some modern sets with quasar tubes. And I just type that into DALI and then I get, oh, what if we put all the lights like horizontal? Just like giving us ideas. And then we take it from there.

And I think that's like a legitimate use for it. So I think that's probably what I'm gonna use it for. - Yeah, I can see it. I think this is a complicated topic that I'm excited to see the video on. And if anyone else would like to chime in here, I would love to hear what other people think. - Comments. - Our Discord channel or comments on YouTube, both of them, great places to chat about this. And we'd love to read that before we dive into this video, I think. - Yeah, yeah. - So we'd appreciate that. - Before we take a quick break, we do have to do another trivia question.

All right. So Adam has bestowed me with the enormous privilege of doing two trivia questions today. So let's kick it off. In 2017, Dara Khosrowshahi became Uber's second CEO. What was he the CEO of before? All right. Into the break.

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All right, we're back. I got one last little quick thing I want to do, which is the last video that I put up, which was my tech hot takes video. I inevitably knew I would be ruffling some feathers with my different levels of hot takes. What I wanted to do was rank how hot it turns out my takes were based on the reactions I saw. I had four.

You had four? Okay. Four hot takes. I'll give them a ranking after you. You're ranking them one through four or you're just going to give it like a zero to 100, a Scoville score? Let's do that. Yeah, Scoville score. Zero to 100, I'll agree. Okay. So my first take was that TikTok and YouTube will coexist. This is not my first take. This is my least hot take. TikTok and YouTube will coexist because there's such different use cases that people will just spend their time on each platform and it's fine.

This met a tiny bit of pushback because people said that they're spending a little bit less time on YouTube and more on TikTok, but I generally still stand by the fact that they will coexist. I'm giving this a ranking of 35 out of 100. - This is a cold take, I think. I think this is, yeah, I think that's totally reasonable. I would argue shorts almost feel different than TikTok while still being short form content.

TikTok to me feels more meme-y and quick hits where YouTube Shorts feels a little more like a good discoverability platform for main channels. Main channels are still the focus on Shorts, I believe. Yeah, TikTok, you don't have that other extra thing behind like what people are trying to help you find on TikTok.

Yeah, I'm giving it a 35. Not that high. 10 Scovilles? 35 Scovilles? 35 out of 100 Scovilles possible. All right, that puts us in between a bell pepper and a banana pepper. So let's turn up the heat here. Okay, if we want to use a real Scoville scale, let's go 0 to 100,000.

I have the Scoville's whole chart in front of me. It gets to like absurd like million plus Scoville. A hundred's less than a jalapeno, right? Like a hundred's nothing. Yes. A hundred thousand, I mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry. A hundred thousand's a pretty good. A hundred thousand? That's pretty high. That's scotch bonnet. Exactly scotch bonnet. Well played. Thank you, Sean Evans. So let's go zero to a hundred thousand. Okay. That was a 35. Okay.

Cool. That was a 35. Okay, bell pepper. Yeah, that was a piece of paper. Yeah, not that hot. Okay, my next hottest take was that 5G sucks, mostly because most people agreed with me. 5G is just not good. I think there was like one use case that I saw it in, and I believe New York has pretty decent 5G apparently. So if you live in a developed city near a tower...

It's not millimeter wave, though. It's C-band? Yeah, mid-band. Yeah, mid-band is pretty solid. And that is so niche. And yeah, I guess if you're in a city, that's awesome. So if you are a podcast listener in one of the 100 countries that's not New York City, you probably would agree that 5G is pretty bad. Would you argue that if I change that sentence to...

If your parents ask you if they should upgrade to 5G, you should say no. Is that just not is that the coldest take ever now? Yes. It's just a fact. It's just a fact. Yeah. If you if they're if your parents are like, hi, I'm choosing between these two phones and I'm deciding if I should pick the one of 5G or not. You could just say, yeah, save your money, mom and dad. Not worth it right now. Alice looks mad at me saying what do any phones not have 5G?

Thanks to carriers, that's actually a really good point. Thanks to carriers, most phones have 5G and they're all more expensive and all the plans are more expensive and all the battery lives are all worse. And they get hotter. And they get hotter and it's like, for what? For what? I get worse speeds on 5G. You might be right. There was a moment though where

I know like Verizon was trying to upgrade people into the 5G plan and like whether they had a 5G phone or not. I know my mom texted me asking if she should do that. I was like, no. Yeah, don't do it. So on the Scoville scale, I'm putting 5G sucks only because there are people in New York who would disagree. I'm putting this at a 1000. Yeah, I'll go like,

sure i will go there because i know there are people who disagree i no point of me is excited about 5g every time for another five years at least same every time i see a new 5g denomination in my status bar i do a speed test and it's like 600 kilobits per second and i'm like what is that you've lost five percent battery no no this is good all right puts us at a uh poblano poblano so a tiny little bit of spice that's a good i like that number okay

I had two more. Second to highest, nobody cares about panel gaps. Real people don't care about panel gaps. Customers who are buying Teslas are not actually asking or caring about panel gaps. This is something we've talked about a hundred times on this episode. This one got real pushback. I think the wording of it makes sense. I think it makes it seem just like

It's like people don't notice it or like that they can't be like, it feels like you're telling them they're not allowed to be upset. I know that's not what you're saying, but that's what it sounds like when you put that. Therefore, I think the take is hot. Interesting. I do agree with you that it is on a bottom of the list aspect of things. And I think that happens in a lot of things. And I just, when I hear that sentence,

it makes it feel like we can just forget about panel gaps. And I think it's still something that Tesla needs to severely improve on. Yeah, I had to break that down in the video, of course. After the title of the hot take, I'm like, here's what I'm actually saying. But I did sort of end it with like, all right, you could have a car dropped in your driveway tomorrow, a Tesla Model Y or a Mustang Mach-E, and you can trade the panel gaps on the Model Y for something from the Mach-E. What do you pick?

What do you want from the Mach-E? Anything. The software, the performance, the tires, the sunroof, anything. The CEO. And like, it's pretty far down the list. So I'm like, yeah, most people who are buying a Model Y or a Model 3 or a Model S, it's pretty low on the list. But there are plenty of people whose pushback was simply,

I care about panel gaps. I mean, we individually care. And a lot of people who work actually for Tesla did chime in and say a surprising amount of people actually refuse delivery or at least bring up the panel gap. I think the thing that also is, is they're variable. The funny thing about it, the worst panel gap I've ever seen on a Tesla was the Model Y that they lent us for a video as a review unit. That was in terrible shape. It was, the hood felt like

half an inch underneath the gap to the front bumper it looked like it had an underbite and you could see it from every single angle and i and the spoiler was half falling off the spoiler was yeah i don't even know if that's a panel gap or just like a glue issue but well there was also parts inside the car that were like the the headliner was kind of peeling off it was just a poorly early model y so yeah yeah that was one where like i kept thinking to myself

If I wanted to buy a nice car, the best part about a nice car is that like parking it to

taking 10 steps and turning around and being like, oh, I own that. That's really cool. I will only adjust your statement a little bit. Buying an expensive car. Yeah, sorry. Well, my impresa, I wasn't doing that very often. The number one piece of feedback I heard was if I spent that much money on a car, I would care about panel caps. That's the main argument. I think that's a solid argument. And I still think your argument

rings true to it as in there's so many other things in it that are better than other cars in comparison but like if you were to buy an $80,000 Mercedes and saw that you'd be much more upset for whatever reason the stigma behind it is very different. It would just depend on why you're buying that car. If I'm buying an $80,000 Mercedes I'm probably looking for certain luxury things certain comfort things and I don't care about performance as much so I'm not mad when it's the slowest one. How about this?

Then all of the people though who like to as well say like well Tesla is just as nice as a Mercedes or Tesla is just as nice to that They need to wake up and realize that in the quality control aspect of things. They're dead. It's worse. It's just worse I'm just saying like make your argument realistically Yeah, if you line up a bunch of cars for the same price I might decide to buy a Land Rover because I want to off-road I'm not mad that it's slow

And people are like, well, for $80,000, it should be fast. Well, that's your opinion on what you want in a car. So again, you line up your priorities. I'm giving my take, Tesla customers don't care about panel gaps. I'm giving that a 24,000. Not even that. I'll go 40,000.

I think it's a bit hotter just because of the fact that we had to explain it that much in turn means it was hotter. The hotness of the initial take. Yeah, trying not to get dumped on by everybody. Can I just say, Ellis has like 1,500 tabs open just now. So as you guys are wrapping up, he's like frantically switching tabs looking for this skull build.

Have you found the Scoville scale? I did, yeah. Okay. You know, I'm constantly like researching and Googling and fact-checking and stuff while we're doing this, but it gets a little out of hand. What was the Scoville number? It was between like 25 and 40. 25 to 40,000. Like habanero?

No, no, no, no. We're nowhere close. That puts us sort of in the cayenne pepper, Thai pepper range. Or if you have enough of it, it's hot. No, no, no. I take that back. Tabasco cayenne is where that puts us. The real aspect might be what makes that hot as well because then people who do care about it feel like,

It feels like the truth about or the contrarian take of, well, everyone else is lying to you and I'm going to tell you the real deal about it. So I think that's what also creates the hotness. Yeah, I guess the longer and more detailed take is people who choose to buy Teslas aren't buying it for the build quality. That's the longer version of it.

It doesn't quite ring a bell quite as well. Yeah, not as hot, not as spicy for sure. The number one hottest take is that crypto is just gambling.

I agree 100%. A shocking amount of people found massive offense to this. Now, I wouldn't say it's a majority. I still think most people would agree, and especially in the wake of what happened with FTX and what happens with Bitcoin every couple of months, we kind of are on the same page that most of the time when people are talking about crypto, they're talking about investing to try to make money.

And that's, to me, mostly gambling.

because the difference between investing in a company that is public, that has value, that makes products, who you can assess based on those products. Like if I see Apple comes out with a new product and then I go, that's a good product. They're offering more value to the world. They're more valuable. I will buy their stock. Their stock price goes up because of it. That makes sense. That is not gambling to me. It makes sense. When someone buys crypto, a

especially when it's not Bitcoin. And there's just like a rampant speculation about the price might go up because who knows? And it doesn't really ever present any utility other than it's a new crypto and it maybe has some new fringe feature, but no one's ever going to adopt it. And then the price goes up or down. Hey, you should put your money in. To me, that is just a slot machine. And I have no problems leaning on that take pretty heavily because it just keeps getting proved true.

But a lot of people in the crypto space, I think, generally take issue with any negative sentiment about crypto because they want it to be the future. I will...

Listen, I do not know. I don't want to get this one. I'll be honest. A lot of times I feel like the stock market is gambling as well. I don't even, but I don't know. I don't, whatever. I mean, I have a 401k, I guess. But like other than that, I don't invest really in anything, which I'm sure a lot of people will tell me I'm a moron for, but whatever. I think my only, I do think crypto, and we've talked about this with NFTs also, is like,

the gambling aspect of it is the most headline grabbing because somebody's people selling an NFT for $69 million is a headline. Like people making tons of money when they invested $30 in Bitcoin in 2007 and now they're multimillionaires because of what it's done is a headline. There is stuff on the blockchain that's actually interesting and we've talked about it before and just like there is some technology there that's really cool but I would argue the majority of cryptocurrencies

crypto stuff that gets flooded into my Twitter that I still haven't muted somehow is probably more gambling aspect stuff. So like, listen, there's some stuff back there, but most of the stuff I see feels like gambling for sure. It feels similar to the 5G take in some ways because there is a subset of people who are like, I pay for things with Bitcoin. I use crypto all the time. It has real application.

Well, I'm sure. I mean, there are some companies who accept Bitcoin and there are some bodegas in New York City that accept Bitcoin. I am not one of those people who has ever bought anything with Bitcoin ever. I think that's most people. And I think most people who do buy Bitcoin never intend to buy anything with the Bitcoin.

Most people who buy crypto, Ethereum, Dogecoin, any other random coins or tokens that seem to have some random spur of the moment flash in the pan value are not intending to use it for anything other than to sell it later to some sucker and make some money off of it.

And it's insanely more prevalent right now with just all the rug pull schemes that happen. And I don't want to discredit maybe some of the better ones, but there are so many things staining the atmosphere. And crypto in general just has a permanent stain on it that I don't think you'll ever be able to shake, whether that's it's

the creator's fault of that or not it's happened even nfts like get looped into crypto because of obviously what they're based on but like i love artists being able to be properly credited for their work long after they make the piece of art that also makes a lot of sense i also think it would be cool if the deed of my house one day was actually an nft and after i made that video i got a company that reached out and said you can actually do that now and i was like cool

but i'm not going to do it no i'm not going to do it no like i agree i i was thinking this morning like i don't know where my birth certificate is if it was on the blockchain that would be way easier and that's the boring stuff in there somewhere in the future will happen future generations maybe

Yeah, so cool. Thanks for listening to the cancel the waveform host episode. The comments are going to be spicy here. I have to give this one closer to like an 80,000 on the spice scale because of the veracity that I was disagreed with. If we're judging by veracity, I think you've broken the scale. I'll go, yeah, 90. 90K, yeah. That's pretty good. We're firmly in Thai pepper range now. Yeah, spicy.

Spicy. Cool. I like it. Sweet. What does a ghost pepper out of curiosity? Like 300,000 or something? 800, 900,000. It can go up to a million. Damn. Yeah, I didn't have any takes that spicy. It's hard to make a taste that spicy. Giannis is the best power forward of all time. I think that isn't... I've said more insane things about basketball in this room. We'll figure it out. Yeah, I think that's true. It might be true. My hottest take is Google Chrome is going to be gone soon.

Soon? Yep. I say five years. You said five years, right? Five years. That I have a hard time seeing. That's my hottest. What's taking over, Internet Explorer? It's not out yet. Whatever's taking over is not out yet. Something new is coming and will kill Chrome. That is a spicy take. Someone's investing in something over there. There's a lot of moms and dads who just fire up whatever their kids tell them, which is just going to take forever to kill.

There's also a lot of moms and dads who don't have any available RAM. That's fair. That's fair. And with that, we'll move on to trivia. Oh, do you want to be red? Trivia time. Look at my camera. Usually I'm the Chevron. Oh. So now we swapped. Boom. All right.

What's the question? I forgot. Oh, right. That's my job. Yeah. So question number one, what is the name of the European Science Center where both the Higgs boson was discovered and the World Wide Web was invented? And I'll accept the name of the center or the country it's in. And if you want to go for both, I'll give you a little two-pointer. You'll get two, okay. Just to make David even more behind you guys. Oh, man. Who wants to reveal first? I'm...

This was very gut feeling. I just wrote down what I felt in my gut. I think I might have overcooked the questions this week a little bit. That second one is tough. All right. Yeah. I got an answer. You got an answer? Oh, I think you're right. I think you're right on... I think you're right on Switzerland. I think I'm right on Switzerland. I just wrote Large Hadron Collider. Same. But I don't think that's the name of the science center. Same. Yeah. And I wrote CERN because I think it's at...

or around CERN, and I don't remember what CERN stands for. That name sounds correct. Is that it? So, okay. So it's called CERN, not the Large Hadron Collider. Sorry, Andrew. I was pretty sure. That's fine. It is on the border of France and Switzerland. Okay. I'll give you that. Each of you guys get one point. Okay. That's fair. Together, we are scientists. Together, we overcome David.

All right, on the border. That's solid. CERN, good job with that. The minute you turned that, I was like, yeah, that sounds familiar. I saw CERN, and I was like, yeah. Do you know what CERN stands for? No. I was trying to think. I don't remember. It's in French. There's no reason you would know. Oh, is E for European at all? Yeah, but the French word for European, which is still kind of European. What does it stand for? I'm really asking a lot of these things. It's French. It's more French. There we go.

I'm not even going to go for it. I'll Google it. I'll try it. I'll try to cancel myself live on there. My girlfriend speaks pretty fluent French, so if she ever listens to this, I would never live it down. So I'm just going to pass it on to you. CERN. The European... Conseil Européen pour la Recherche Nucléaire. That is the weirdest pronunciation. The Center for European Research of Nuclear, basically. That makes sense. I'm glad...

This video is so scary. Comments will be spicy. All right. The second one, I don't think I know the answer to. All right. Question number two. In 2017, Dara Khosrowshahi became Uber's second CEO. What was he the CEO of before? He? He. Does that change your answer? I remember the first guy really messed up.

Yeah, I do remember listening to that podcast about the start of Uber, but I don't think they got into the secondary aspects of it. Yeah, because it was like the founder that made it all the way to the point where he became the villain. Yeah. All right, ready? Yeah. Turn. Lyft felt like the obvious one, but it like, I don't know. I wrote hotels.com.

Weirdly, Hotels.com is kind of close. He was the CEO of Expedia. If you were going to say... I was thinking Airbnb first because it just felt similar. And then Expedia Travel. I was in the hospitality range, but I didn't want to go straight to Lyft. Uber just poaching the CEO of Lyft and him swapping over feels...

Like it would have been a bigger story and I would have known that. Yeah. Wow. All right. I'm proud of hotels.com. Pretty close. No points. No points. But pretty close. So final score. Respectable. Marquez Andrew tied at 15. David has nine. Let's give him eight. Okay. David has eight. David's very competitive. So we like to mess with him.

Well, that's been a, we went over for sure, but that's a long, excellent episode of Waveform. Welcoming everyone back by just talking our faces off. Yep. Thanks for sticking with us. Thanks for listening. Thanks for watching. Thanks for subscribing. Thanks for watching the clips. Thanks for hanging around. Catch you guys very soon in the next one. Peace. Waveform was produced by Ellis Roven and Adam Molina. We are partnered with Vox Media Podcast Network and our intro outro music was created by Vayne Sill. That outro may have been AI.

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