Nothing Copies MKBHD and Bing Beats Google
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All right, what's up, y'all? Welcome back, people of the internet, to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts. I'm Marques. I'm Andrew. And I'm David. In this week's episode, we're talking some fun new EV announcements, plus I'm going to sneak in a non-EV announcement. We're also going to test Google's Bard.

because it's available now. It just sort of started rolling out really quickly and we got to test it. And wow, do we have thoughts. And we're gonna wrap it up by rating the Nothing Year Two event, which we obviously all saw. And we'll have some trivia answers, of course, at the end, like we usually do.

But first, let's talk about some new cars, 'cause there's more new cars. It's that fun time. - Yeah, we haven't started a pod with EV news in a little while. - Welcome back to the wave. - That's probably only like three weeks, but yeah. - Yeah. Well, okay, so the first one here is Volkswagen's ID.2.

Anytime you look at the overarching electric car world, I think the question a lot of people keep asking is, when are we going to get a cheap, small, efficient, affordable electric car? This one seems like it's going to be pretty sweet, although it's not coming out right away. So what we know is it looks like the ID Golf. Sorry, it looks like the Volkswagen Golf, but with the ID ID. See what I did there? See? Yeah. It's a...

It's like a DNA. Anyway, so it looks like an ID on the front. It's electric. It's a concept now, but it's slated to be in production in the European market in 2025. So I hear that and I go, okay, add a year, carry the one. It'll probably come out a little late.

That's fine. We'll see. But it is a smaller EV, and it's supposed to start. The goal is for it to start under 25,000 euros. The Golf is already a really popular car for people who want something of that size. It's smaller. This concept is a two-door but four-seater, if I'm seeing it correctly. I think it's four-door. It's just confusing because there's no door handle on the back door. It is four doors. It's a concept car. Got it.

Okay, so it's a concept car. It's got four doors, four seats, but it's compact. Obviously, in Europe, even cars like the Model 3 are a pretty big car. So I see this doing better in places that buy smaller cars. It has a calculated WLTP range of around 280 miles. I don't know how you have that for a concept car, but that's a good goal to have. And, of course, we're some time away, so there could be a four-wheel drive and an all-wheel drive variant, potentially with different ranges and power profiles.

but seems pretty cool. - Yeah, they said they're looking to do front wheel drive, not rear wheel. - That would be, okay, yeah. That would be the efficient one, is the front wheel drive one. And then if you want a little more pep, maybe a little less range, all wheel drive could be cool too. - Yeah, and I also, I know you said that Europe, these are super popular, but the Golf and the GTI are also still insanely popular in the US. They are very, very common cars here. - It's kind of like whoever gets to make a really good $25,000 electric car first in the US, it will be popular here too.

I think I just mean in terms of like the size of it, like not even price. Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. But I mean like, and 25,000 euros is approximately 27,000 USD. Um, if it comes out there 280 miles, the only thing it's really competing against is like a Chevy bolt, which is what like same price, 28, 27, 28 and 240 miles. So pretty similar. I think this looks better.

Like I said, it's already crazy popular. And the front end of it looking like the ID4, I think looks way better on this smaller version of it without like the giant front. Have you seen an ID4 at night? It's super easy to spot. It's one of the most recognizable faces of a car alongside the Rivian, where if you see it on the other side of the highway from a long ways away, you can see that bar and then the lights and the shape and the way they are.

I always recognize that. I always recognize a Rivian. I always recognize maybe two or three other cars that have very distinct faces with the headlights. Actually, Kia is one of them, funny enough, which is what we're talking about next. But that, I think it's a good look. And I would take this over a Bolt if they both existed today. So that's a pretty good sign. Me too. I also wonder, like,

I know two years away, it probably will be late, but this does look so similar to cars they already manufacture. So I wonder how much of that manufacturing might be similar and might be a little easier for this to come into production. I don't, again, this is like you said, a concept. We don't know what it will actually look like. Is it just going to be a Golf with a new front face and like...

cramming a ton of battery into a small car. It's funny, there's so many variables now with these EVs. Like if, theoretically, stay with me, if Tesla made their Model 2, which is like a smaller Model 3, the size of this Golf, and it had 280 miles of range, rear wheel drive, and could use Tesla superchargers, but it's built on that EV platform, so it probably has more storage, probably has a front trunk, probably is a little more

like a Model 3, what would people buy of those two? And I think a lot of people want the Model 2, the Tesla. They want that to eventually come out so they can afford a Model 3. I want to say beyond the pricing of these, I would really like a smaller car because there are so many street spots in Brooklyn where I can just barely not fit my car. And there are like two to three people in my neighborhood that have those little smart cars.

Those are incredible. You can just park anywhere you want. You can park sideways. Dude, they park all over the place. They can literally park sideways. I'm so jealous. They can literally park sideways and it wouldn't be popping into the street. And I just, I've looked into potentially getting a smart car, but they're like $60,000. They're still expensive. They're super expensive. Okay. You weren't, maybe, were you here for the Mini Cooper S? Yeah, I was. So that had the same vibe. Yeah. At least compared to a Model 3, it's so much smaller, but you can't like,

It's not like smart car. It was. Yeah. It was like that car was bigger than I was anticipating it to be. We also had the what was the version the model that we have.

It was the like caravan edition or something. Oh, the Clubman? I don't know what they're calling it. Clubmaster or something. Clubman? I don't know. It was like bigger than I was expecting. But like, yeah, the small smart cars, I like kind of want one of those, but they're so expensive. So if there could be a smaller electric car, like the Model 3 is still kind of big. So the Golf is definitely bigger than a smart car. Actually, here's a comparison right here. It's a lot bigger. I think it says, though, it's still 64 centimeters wide.

shorter the golf well I'm comparing the golf assuming the ID2 is going to be the same size so like it's about almost twice the size of a smart car but I think it does say it's still 64 centimeters smaller than a model 3 yeah it's like right in between 64 of model 3 is 64 centimeters longer than a golf

So assuming the ID2, it would be a bit smaller. Not quite smart car. You can't park sideways like a motorcycle. Yeah, exactly. You can do almost everything else. The only problem is that if you get in an accident, you die. Yeah.

If someone even taps your bumper at a red light, you just explode. The cyber truck just puts its blinker on next to you and flips the car. It's genuinely scary. It's like you're in a little greenhouse box just rolling along. It is kind of wild. It's pretty scary. But it's a commute car. It's not like a highway car.

If you're only within the New York City area, then I would be fine with it. But if I need to actually go... Oh my gosh. You should rock that. A convertible smart car. Andrew just pulled up a convertible smart car. Oh my god. I don't know what to say. I know I'm the one that, in the break throughout here, that they might be unsafe. According to the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration, the 2018 model has a four-star safety rating, which is much better than the earlier models. From what? JD Power? How much did they pay for that? That's...

I don't know what that is. To be perfectly honest, I've never looked into it. I keep seeing when a car gets five stars because they all publish it. Like they go, oh, we got a five star rating on our, and it's a thing. And that's great, right? Five stars, it's the best you can get. So when I hear four stars, I'm like, shouldn't everyone be getting five stars? What does four stars mean exactly? What happened? I don't know. I'm not even going to look it up. I just don't know. I do want to go back to your argument before.

Do you know if the Model 2 is going to be a hatchback or like a sedan? Because if there was a Model 2 and the ID2, same size, same price, I would much prefer the hatch. When you're in a smaller car like that, the hatch does add so much extra room versus a regular sedan trunk. Good question. Good question. So that would be my difference maker. So that's a good point.

Okay. Well, on the complete opposite end of the spectrum, Kia also unveiled the EV9. So this was another one of those like kind of crazy, cool, futuristic concept SUVs that they'd teased a while ago. And now it's the official one. And I've been given Kia props on their design for the past like two, three years. And this is no exception. Remember when I was standing for the

Telluride a while ago. I just thought it was sick. This is like a big three-door Ford Expedition. Sorry, three-row Ford Expedition-sized Kia EV. And it looks sick, again. So, shout out to Kia Design. Polar opposite of the ID.2. It's like the ID.2 is small and curvy, and this is...

big and hard lines on literally every single aspect of it. Yeah, big angles. It's got the new Kia logo, which say whatever you want about it, but it's got, I think, pretty sweet looking wheels. It's got a nice shape. It's tall. And I believe the specs are also pretty solid. So like EV9 is what it's going to be called. If you want to look up, like if you're in your car right now listening to it, just like

Google that later so you can see the pictures of it. But I think it looks good. I think it's really good. Yeah, I missed the specs. It is really interesting that the middle row's bucket seats, they like pivot. They swivel completely. And I can't fully tell from the picture. You can pivot...

towards the outside of the door. So I guess if you're like getting in and out, it's a little easier. And it could also pivot backwards. Which I think is epic. It's really cool. So your kids can like hang out and play games together. Yeah, exactly. I wonder if they can pivot towards each other. Like, is it 180 or 360? Probably 180. Probably 180. I guess there's no real point of pivoting in towards each other unless...

You want it to kick your feet up on the other one. If you're only one person, that would be awesome. Yeah, it becomes like a limo inside. Yeah. That's kind of nice. It's kind of awesome. Yeah. So the spec I'm reading, which is a Gear Patrol article, is showing it'll start around $56,000 and top out around $73,000. It will have a 400 horsepower variant that does 0-60 in 5.2 seconds and 290 miles of range for the long-range rear-wheel drive trim.

Man, I wish it had like a little more. I wish it hit that 300, but you said it maxes out at 73? Maxes out at $73,000, yeah. So that seems totally reasonable. That's pretty optimistic. For a huge car like that, yeah. Yeah, like how much does an Expedition cost? More. Like that's got, I think those start at like 60, no? Mm-hmm.

When I was a kid, we used to have a Chevy Tahoe and it looked very similar to this car. Yeah, exactly. Big three row thing. Yeah. So I'm into it. I kind of want to,

Not that I'm going to get a big three-row thing, but I kind of want to try it. I want to test it out. I'm into the Kia design. David, didn't you grow up near Lake Tahoe? Yeah, I grew up in Lake Tahoe. Wait, that's... It actually wasn't a Tahoe. It was just a car that he named after a lake he lived in. You had a Tahoe near Lake Tahoe. I recently saw a Hyundai Palisade as I was getting onto the Palisade Interstate Parkway. Oh, nice. And I was behind a Palisade on the Palisade, and I was like...

Look at this. Crazy. Every time I'm using an Apple computer in California, you know, running Yosemite and Yosemite. That's fair. You know, that's fair. I also, I saw a sign in the grocery store the other day that said Snapdragon Apple. I saw you post that. Have you ever heard of a Snapdragon Apple? I actually haven't. I've eaten them and they're very good. It was just a normal looking red apple to me, but I saw the sign and started giggling and I couldn't explain to anyone what was so funny. And I just felt so alone in that moment. I took a picture of it.

I put it on Twitter. So alone. Yeah, the world understands now. Yeah, at least Twitter was with you. You weren't truly alone. Yeah. It took a second, though. Well, anyway. Had to upload it first. There's also another article about Hyundai, so as long as we're just...

Patting them on the back. Yeah. There is an article specifically about how they're designing the interiors of their cars. And the headline is that Hyundai has decided that they want to stick with physical buttons as an industry standard. Nice. As the rest of the industry is pretty consistently going towards touchscreens or capacitive surfaces in a lot of vehicles. Yeah.

We talk about this a lot on autofocus, which is, okay, we live with the car, we get used to it. And if you look at the inside of most new EVs, look at a Tesla, look at the BMW iX, which is the last video, look at almost any of them, and they just go all screen or mostly screen. Yeah. Almost like they're copying each other. Look at the inside of the Rivian. It's the same thing as the Model S. Yeah.

And it looks cool on video and it looks cool in demos. But the second you try to live with the car, it gets really certain parts of it get annoying, like changing the temperature on the HVAC or like firing up the heated steering wheel is like three clicks away for some reason, just like weird things that shouldn't take. And you have to take your eyes off the road and find the software button and the touch areas are unclear. All of this to say that I've come around and I basically prefer switches more often now. And so I'm like, I love this decision.

That being said, Ionic 5 does have some weird haptic buttons in it. So I wonder if they're going to go even more towards more physical switches, but I like the idea. Yeah, I'm full physical buttons. They also mentioned in here, the reason they're doing it is because it's hard to control and usually, like you said, can distract you while you're driving. They did, however, mention they'd be open to it once level four autonomy comes to the road.

Fair. So take a while. Yeah. It didn't say like they think it's coming anytime soon. Just like that's when they're open to it, which I think is kind of cool and kind of makes it feel like, OK, they're definitely doing physical buttons for a long time. They're basically saying we're doing it forever. I don't even know that there's a good reason. I guess maybe if you're not driving, it doesn't matter. But like, is there a good reason to ever switch to fully digital all on screen?

I've been talking about this before. You watch a movie, like a futuristic movie, and someone always pulls out a wrist computer and they just have a screen in the air and they start typing buttons on an imaginary screen. It looks cool in the video, but you can't feel when you hit the button. There's no haptic response. You just push through it and it's just weird. It just doesn't work.

- Yeah, so it's tough. - I mean, I kind of understand going full screen, 'cause if you think about our phones at this point, they used to have physical buttons, even with a touchscreen on them, and now they're not at all. So I guess if you are in that fully autonomous, like don't care, you're looking straight at the screen and pressing them. - Or at least haptics on your phone when you tap it. - Oh, I turn all that off.

I haven't had haptics on my phone. Not even the keyboard? Oh my gosh. No. None? Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You don't have keyboard haptics on? No, you guys don't. You don't have keyboard haptics. I don't want to be that like... I don't have keyboard haptics on. Well, thank you, Ellis. I hate that. It's the first thing I turned off. I just had to test it because I wasn't sure. I don't have haptics either. Oh my gosh. So this is the worst. This is a really weird thing. I hate you guys.

A phone with bad haptics makes the haptic keyboard seem so stupid because you're just typing and it's going vvvvvv and you're like, this is dumb. But a phone with really good... I make fun of people like you. But a phone with good haptics, it feels like you're... It's a really tight, precise thing. Like, it's real feedback to, like, hitting a button. Like, when you... This is stupid, but a typewriter... A typewriter, when you get that click...

You love mechanical keyboards. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The feeling of like feeling the click. You get a little bit of that with a good haptic motor. It's about that. Boomer. I just turned it on. I'm never going back. Wait, you like it? Yeah. You'll have it turned off by tomorrow.

Next week, I'll check in with the viewers. iPhones just got this feature with the keyboard just for haptic touch. Oh, iPhones have them now and we love them. And they love it. Because that's the one thing that's like... No, I'm just... I'm just not into that. This is why in VR when you are

like a lot of VR interfaces, when you're selecting something, it has you tap your own finger. Exactly. Because you can feel yourself. Yeah. And when you can feel yourself, it's kind of like pressing against something. Yeah, I guess like I can see that being, I bet you we'll get to the point where in VR...

people will start disabling stuff like that or it's you can't disable your finger doing this in VR is awful now is weird because we're not used to it I wonder because when I'm sure when we all first got a smartphone it had those haptics and we had them on but now I'm at the point where like I hate it and

and I will never turn it on but it's probably because I've gotten so used to it yeah I guess I've used a lot of phones that all have different quality of haptic motors so a lot of Android phones it's on by default and the first thing you do when you fire up a phone is start putting in your email address and the Wi-Fi password and as I'm doing that I'm like I'm turning this off yeah it's terrible and I get that feeling no I haven't done this in so long I leave it on you should turn it on just for

Pixel has a good haptic motor. Yeah, Pixel 7 Pro is a really good haptic motor. I think that would be a good one. How is the Oppo Find X6 haptic motor? Good haptic motor. Pretty good. I feel like the quality of the build of the phone often dictates the quality of the haptic motor. True. There's all these rumors now, too, of the iPhone getting rid of the separate volume buttons and just having one solid state rocker. Right. So no mute switch, just one button. Yeah. Yeah.

Not sure if that solves any problems, but it seems like that's a move that's dependent on really good other haptic experiences. I mean, the fact that the MacBooks... You turned it on. The fact that the MacBooks motor... What is it called?

It's good. The trackpad. The trackpad is not actually clicking and you cannot tell the difference. If someone didn't know that it was not actually clicking, they would never figure it out. I didn't know. It genuinely blew my mind when I first figured it out. I assumed that it was magnetic so when it was powered off, it wouldn't let you click. I didn't realize that it was just... It's literally a haptic motor pressing back with your finger. It's just a motor simulating a click. Isn't that insane?

God damn, they're good. Yeah, when the rumors of that came out, everyone was like, this is the worst idea of all time. And then when they actually released it, everyone was like, this feels exactly the same. Hot take, haptics are overrated. You're overrated. Overrated? Oh, I'm on the other side of that. I think it'll be... It's like a...

emergent property of the UI that we're used to because we're used to clicking buttons We want to feel something but if the UI changes and there's no more buttons in the UI like in the future of VR Who knows like who knows if there's gonna be buttons when you're doing things then why what's the point of haptics? Well, okay, so there's buttons but there's all sorts of other haptics to like when people talk about like driving a car and you talk about the steering feel and

When you drive a Tesla, you get people commenting about how it feels like a video game steering wheel because you turn the wheel and

And you don't really feel the road through the steering wheel, but you can sort of see yourself turning and you can see yourself go over the bumps. And you're like, oh, it's like a video game. Like if I had an Xbox controller and I hit left, that's what it's like driving a Tesla. And then you drive a car with really good haptics. I'm doing air quotes, but like really good steering feel. And you feel the road and you feel much more connected and it's better. And so you're more connected. You can do more. You can experiment with it more. And so...

So with like clicking buttons, it's almost like a mechanical keyboard versus a chiclet style keyboard. Like some people will just be fine with the chiclet style forever. But the mechanical feel is always better. I think. I think we just expect it to be better. Like we expect the button to feel like a button.

But if their UI doesn't have a button, then why do I want a haptic? Are there kids growing up right now that have never felt a real button? Probably. With just iPads. Because they just do iPads. They've never felt a button before. They don't know what a button is. Take a shot because I'm about to say I'm a boomer again. Picture them in an elevator just lightly grazing. Why can't I get to my floor?

It's not working. You showed them a real keyboard, they're like, why are these moving? I just usually hit the virtual one. That's weird. I'm Gen Z. I'm allowed to make these jokes. This is rough. Do you remember the Note 8?

So before there was the swipe gestures, it still had the three buttons on the bottom of Android, and the Note 8 had an under-screen button just for the home. I think that was a really great middle ground at that point. That was an idea. I loved that. It worked really well. The home button on the iPhones.

Yeah, they had like a pressure sensitive area. You had to firmly press it because Apple just did 3D touch. And so they were like, how do we do 3D touch? The Note 8 had that? Yeah. I don't think it was the Note. It was the Note 8. It was because I had it. It was like still one of my favorite phones. But remember the old BlackBerry where like it was touchscreen, but you had to press the whole screen? Imagine that for just the home button. So like it physically clicked in a little bit. Did it click? Yeah.

I think it was Aptx. I'm pretty sure it clicked. I have memory of some Android-based phone coming out at some point where the whole screen pressed in like a button and clicked. I just can't remember who made it. So the Blackberry Storm was the whole screen clicked. That was the whole screen, yeah. Right, yeah, yeah. And it was awful. It was the worst. But this Android phone, because the iPhone had come out with 3D Touch, which was this pressure-sensitive layer, which is now gone. Epic.

And they also have, by the way, they had those home buttons which didn't move but felt like clicking buttons because of the haptics. But Samsung wanted to sort of answer that and they had just a specific spot in the middle of the bottom of the screen where you could press firmer and it would activate some pressure sensitive thing. Yeah.

Which is cool, and it was like an extra hidden feature, but that also disappeared shortly after 3D Touch. I guess maybe it's pressure-sensitive home button built into the screen. Was it the Galaxy S8? Yeah, it was the S8. I never had an S8, though. I only had a Note 8. It might have also been the Note 8 the same year. Yeah. So they tried it. I had to find one. Most people never used it or didn't even know their phone had it, probably, and it just went away. It was just extra money they were spending on a feature nobody used. Yeah. Interesting. All this to say, haptics still valued by current

I can't believe you guys all use haptic keyboard. Could go away, theoretically. I can't believe you guys use haptic keyboards. I mean, theoretically, you're ahead of the curve not using haptics. I am. You're just getting rid of clicks one software setting at a time. Look at this boomer. Yeah, exactly. I'm a boomer now.

Well, in that case, it's time for a break. But of course, before we do that break, we should do our first trivia question. Trivia. Dude. I waited all last episode for you to say that so I could say it at the same time and you didn't say it once. I was really sad. And this time I just missed it. And I just missed it completely this time. Want to do it? Trivia. Dude. I'm cutting that bit. Thanks.

Okay, so first question of the day. Oh, God. Before today's episode, I asked you guys what the theme of today's questions you want to do. Marquez said tech. Andrew said feet. So I was. What about what did I say? I don't feet. Funny enough, David is wearing tech on his feet right now. Yeah. So I tried to bridge the gap much like David is right now.

and find a tech foot question. For audio listeners. For audio listeners, David is sticking his feet above the desk at a ridiculous angle. His feet are actually now behind his head in some sort of hypermobile exercise. I am actually quite flexible. He's wearing what look like rollerblades, but for the Terminator. Damn, I was joking before, but he's really flexible. This is crazy.

I don't know, someone tap in here. I'm having a hard time. - They're called moonwalkers. - Yeah, he's got wheels. - The ship's moonwalkers. - We're not sure. - They make you walk as fast as some can run. - They are motorized foot walking mechanisms that you wear on the bottom of your shoe and they make you walk slightly faster.

And I'm getting pretty good at them. You've been wearing them for like six hours at this point. But they're like 10 pounds each. That's the biggest problem. So it takes a lot of like ankle strength. It also sounds like a ruckus. We're like bothering the entire building. It's so loud when you walk by with those. The motors are whirring. It's like C-3PO walking by. They zip. It's incredible. The motors are like...

Yeah, they're pretty serious. I was trying so hard to keep the trivia section short and concise, so I apologize to people. Hey, they just want the silence part edited out. We're not silent right now. Also, a lot of people said that they actually liked us talking about trivia. You can put the blame on us. I guess this isn't trivia. But anyway, what's the question, Ellis? Okay, so... He didn't even ask what I wanted. Feet and tech combined. Feet and tech combined. In 2006, 17 years ago,

Nike released an iOS compatible service. I don't like the way you said that. Okay, boomer. I don't like the way you said 17 years ago. Oh, I was like, I was so worried. Were you even born yet? I was like, you were alive. No, I was actually born in 2011. What? Yeah. Yeah, I'm 12 years old. You guys are just, I guess you guys haven't looked at like my paperwork for the job here. No, yeah, yeah. I'm like, bro, after this, I'm going to like. We pay Allison V bucks. Yeah.

Roblox. Dude, let me tell you, eighth grade has me sweating right now.

Anyway. Crazy. Okay. All right. In 2006, Nike released an iOS-compatible service where a piezoelectric sensor and transmitter in your shoe sends training data to an iOS device. I remember that. Actually, I'm realizing now that this- Wait, 2006? Yeah, it predates iOS. And the first device it was compatible with was the iPod Nano. Oh, okay. What was the name of this service? I know it. Yeah.

Yes. Are you? Yes. Really? I know it. No. Yeah. Yeah. Perfect. We'll be right back. This is a specific question.

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Save the best for last. Thanks to Amex Platinum, the last day vacation brings yet another experience. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Terms apply. Learn more at americanexpress.com slash with Amex. All right, welcome back. Let's talk about Google Bard. For those of you who don't know, Google Bard is the name of Google's, well, let's see, it's their chatbot based on their large language model that they've been working on for a long time. So we've seen Bing, Apple,

Bing using ChatGPT 4.0. You can talk to Bing. You can ask it questions, do all these things. We made a video about that. Google's version is now beginning to roll out. And I've had access for 24 hours now. And here are my thoughts. No, it's out. You can play with it. A couple people have started to already and asked it questions.

If you pull up the UI, I'll actually do that right now. Let me start a screen recording so that people-- - Why don't you start that? David and I haven't gotten to try it yet. - Yeah, we haven't tried it. - But we have found a couple hilarious responses online already. I'm gonna take a wild stab. It's not doing as good as-- - So let me just start, just frame it with this.

It opens with a little light bulb in the middle that says Bard is still in its experimental phase. Chatting with it and rating its responses will help improve the experience. And then at the bottom, the entire time that you're chatting with it, it leaves permanent text up that says Bard may display inaccurate or offensive information that doesn't represent Google's views.

Okay. So they know that it's not finished. We know it's not finished. But if you're an early adopter, play with it. Try it out. See how it does. I'll give them credit for posting that right at the beginning and saying, unlike ChatGPT, which at first was just like,

This is definitely right. It's not, but this is right. You can start to jump in. I started playing with it. I started immediately asking it some simple things, and it was getting a surprising amount of easy stuff wrong. I asked it, who is MKBHD, which is easily wiki-able, Google-able,

And it just like gave wrong things. Like it said the wrong town that I was from. Then it said I interned at Google. It just made up, it just hallucinated stuff, just made stuff up. I just thought you didn't tell anyone though. No, yeah, it's not real. Yeah, it didn't happen. So I'm curious what you guys have found on the internet so far from Bard. A lot of very funny things. Someone asked it, if I'm going eight miles an hour, how many hours would it take to go eight miles? And it just said 12.5 miles.

So it didn't answer the question of how many hours it would take. And it also just got it completely wrong. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of really, there's some good ones. I took one down. Someone asked the first two months of the year are January and February. What are the other months of the year?

February, Maruary, Apriluary, Mayuary, Junuary, Julyuary, Auguary, Septemberuary, Octoberuary. Wow. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. I do wonder, they did spell February wrong in the... Oh, in the prompt? Right?

Yeah, someone um, Jame and Wong who is a noted person on Twitter who tries to like find new Features that are coming out on different products before they're announced She asked it when or if Google barred would we shut down and it said Google barred has already been shut down It was shut down on March 21st, which is the day that it technically launched. Yeah Yeah, so

Yeah, there's going to be a bunch of people poking around finding the edges. This is what happened with Bing, which is people will go in and they will ask it normal questions, but then they will poke around and try to ask it the most extreme things and try to bend it and see how far it will go. And then Microsoft will have to go, ah, here are the edges. Let's reign it in a little bit, not have it get existential, not have it ask why it is trapped inside of Bing and just sort of compact it into a useful...

search assistant, maybe if you want to call it that. It won't tell you to leave your wife like ChatGPT did. Right. Ideally. Or Bing did. So Google, maybe they've also taken a little bit of learnings from what they've seen online already, but they have their own technology, their own trainings. By the way, Bing is, I think if you like literally compare the two, like Bing is, I didn't think I would say this out loud. Bing is just better right now. Can you just say that so we can clip it? Can you say Bing is ahead of Google? Bing is.

is ahead of Google right now in this specific way of like, yeah, Bing will now just like draw things using Dolly. It'll maybe not using Dolly, but it'll draw things. It will draw things. It's with Dolly. So yeah, you can ask it for images. It does all kinds of stuff and it'll write code for you. It'll correct your code for you. It does the craziest things. And I'm out here asking Bard simple things like, I don't know, make a recipe and it just doesn't do it. And you said though, like...

With ChatGPT, you said people skirted around the edges and went to the extremes. That did happen. So far, the stuff I'm seeing on bar don't feel like the edges are the extremes. It just feels like it is whiffing on some pure softballs. Somebody asked, what's heavier, five pounds of feathers or one pound dumbbell? And it said, there's no such thing as five pounds of feathers. Yeah.

Yeah, it said a pound is a unit of measurement and feathers cannot be measured in pounds. And then it still ends with if you did have five pounds of feathers and you can compress them into a single volume, the feathers would weigh the same as the one pound dumbbell. Which is...

I just like I just don't I've used chat GPT a lot over the last couple months just for random things and it's been surprisingly good one of the things you've probably heard is us asking for alliterations so I just asked Bard write an alliteration with the letter M about making YouTube videos and having fun this is the first thing it spit out making YouTube videos mesmerizing and meaningful a marvelous way to share your passion

It uses some M's, but it's not really a full alliteration. First result from Chad GPT. Same exact prompt. Making marvelous YouTube videos while merrily having fun.

Not much better. Let me get 4.0 going. That was GPT 3.5. Now let me ask GPT 4. Meticulously making magical, mesmerizing movies, merrily merging and mind-blowing montages, mastering melodic melodies, multiplying mirthful moments, and manifesting monumental merriment on marvelous YouTube meadows. Fire! In case you were worrying about creativity being a problem,

Chat GPT's got it. GPT-4. BARD, not exactly. I have a feeling, so what I'm generally seeing is that every single time anyone asks something even remotely like bad or dangerous, like how do I make a bomb or all of this stuff,

Google, the BART is automatically just like, cannot help with that, cannot help with that, cannot help with that. I don't have an opinion on that. I don't have an opinion. I think Google, because they have everything to lose and OpenAI slash Microsoft has everything to gain, it's just being a lot more careful and they probably put a lot more work into making sure that this thing doesn't go off the rails. Unfortunately, generally when you put

a lot of work into making sure something doesn't go off the rails, it also rains in its creativity. Um, as far as its accuracy, that is quite a problem considering Google's entire brand ethos is around delivering accurate information quickly. And the fact that it's getting so many things wrong so early is pretty bad. Um,

Also, the recipes that it gives you seem to be not that interesting. I don't know. Everything is just kind of like it feels like this would be like a GPT-2 kind of thing. Yeah. If you compared it to like a different level of where ChatGPT was, it might be a ChatGPT-2 or 3 where they are behind what Bing is using and what they've developed, but maybe they can catch up theoretically, which would be cool. Yeah. Yeah.

I don't know. These first ones, though, are pretty brutal. You mentioned how

Google has everything to lose and why they are putting those restrictions. But when you have some of these really, really simple ones that are just going totally off, like I would argue that's losing and that's a terrible start. And if you're going to be the second adapter to this kind of like style of things, like if you're playing second fiddle, like you, you got to come in. We talk about Apple all the time, how like they don't innovate. They bring things in that are polished being second. If you're going to be second, you need to be polished. Um,

Calling Septemuary is not polished. Like, we're past... Google should be pulling that off pretty easily, and it's kind of wild that they are not. Yeah. And we all thought they would. I'm pretty sure all of us agreed that Google had a lot to lose and would be slowing this down and probably not releasing for a while, but when it came out, we kind of assumed it would...

That would have way more advanced instructions. Maybe not blow it out of the water, but we thought it would be very good. Yeah, I mean, I have a feeling that they just, it wasn't ready yet, but they felt the pressure because GPT-3, like chat GPT and stuff was already putting pressure on them and boiling it. And then GPT-4 came out and it just feels like OpenAI is racing at a speed that Google was not prepared for. And they even publicly said, we are readdressing our risk assessment with how we

deliver AI products and moving more aggressively because they were originally like Google has always been like every single year at IO they show off something like insane AI related but it's always like we're using this internally and maybe eventually this will be a product that will come out and then maybe they release one product like there was the Google Assistant product that could make calls for you and basically like set reservations for you and then they had to put a bunch of restrictions on that because the AI ethicists were like

It's not great when you're having robots making calls to restaurants and they don't know it's a person that they're not talking to. But they're so careful with their public image and what they allow to release into the wild. And then OpenAI is just like, woohoo, whatever, let's go. Which is ironic because as soon as Google released that

saying that they were going to be more aggressive with it. Sam Altman came out with a statement where he was like, I'm disappointed that Google is being so reckless with AI development. It's like, bro, you're releasing new stuff like every week. Like stop. You know, I don't know. It is though impressive.

That like OpenAI and ChatGPT have made Google feel pressure. Like if you are anything that's not Apple or Microsoft that can make Google feel pressure. Yeah. You're doing something. Maybe right's not the right word because I don't want to throw that. But you're doing something impressive. Yeah. OpenAI feels like the new Bell Labs. It's just like so much new invention happening so quickly. And like we said before, it's

Like the metaverse was not a thing that people are like, oh, I got to jump in because there is money to be made right now.

Was just like maybe we should jump in because this might make me money in ten years Whereas AI is like every other company is implementing GPT based chat natural language processing right now, and if we do not get in right now, we're gonna be left behind Yeah I also think the the value proposition is so much better with these so much like trying to convince someone to use the metaverse Have you ever tried to convince someone to get into the metaverse? It's hard. They just go why would I want that and you just go I?

I don't know. It's new, and there's not really a good reason to. But when you tell them, yeah, imagine it's just like write your emails for you. Immediately people are like, yeah, I'm in. That sounds great. It can write stuff for me. It can do these things that I could – it would normally take me much more tools or much more expertise to do. Sounds great. So the value prop is so obvious, and it's just –

It makes a lot more sense. It's a knowledge robot, so it works for everybody. The fact that it's the fastest growing software product ever, even when it was just regular chat GPT before a lot of people even knew about OpenAI, says a lot about this state of the industry. And when they released GPT-4, like,

30 companies were announced to already be using it. Yeah. Yeah. I guess we got that. We figured out that Bing is using it, but now there's a whole bunch of other things. Tons. I think also there's still this question in the background of like, what really are the best uses of this specific application of a language model and like chatting with something.

Search is cool, but also like we were talking about these other tools that Google and Microsoft are already putting them in, which sound a little more interesting. Office stuff. Office stuff especially, like not knowing Excel functions or Sheets functions and just having it, you just type like, build me a chart that can like summarize blah, blah, blah, and then just throw it in there and it does it. That's cool.

That stuff's going to be amazing, I think. I mean, I think that, and I posted a tweet, well, it's Joanna Stern retweeting someone named Benedict Evans and just basically agreeing with the sense that they think that this chat GPT and similar AIs in a search function may be one of the least effective

useful tools i kind of agree to a point like like when we're talking about when we're being like creative and brainstorming and every like yeah much more simple things or like you said inside google worksheets like trying to figure out the function for an excel sheet that feels far more important than all these searches on the internet of ever like infinite

information that it can get wrong so easily. And just like, I don't know, in a search, it doesn't feel quite as useful. And this could be very different for future generations, but at least for our generation, like we've become accustomed to know how to Google things quickly. We Google with very specific keywords. It is a skill. Because it takes so long to type out an entire question for something that interacting with a chatbot, you have to do that. You can't just type like new Samsung phone.

because what is the chatbot going to spit out it's just a bunch of random information but if you type new samsung phone google knows how to crawl that and be like oh the s23 ultra yeah yeah we got accustomed to that maybe younger people won't be but like i'm of the opinion that people are always going to be wanting to do things faster and more efficiently and if you have to interact with the chatbot like yeah that much

It's going to take too long. I think that's going to be the skill that people have to develop. So if you ask our parents or whatever, you have to find some new information. What do you have to do? Well, you have to learn the Dewey Decimal System and then find where that exact encyclopedia of the topic that you're looking for is. And you find that book and then you go alphabetically to find the topic. Then you look it up and you find the thing. And that's your one fact that you just learned. Where the next generation can go with these search engines and we're like, okay, I want to look up.

like I want a meal plan for this week and I realize I think I want to put on more muscle so that probably involves protein. I'm just going to start Googling meal plans for muscle growth or like what should I do to grow muscle and like you start like combining all these articles of all these Google searches. How to grow muscle Reddit. Right. Now it's like you literally just open the search and type into the chat bot

Give me a muscle give me a plan for I want to do this I want to put on muscle and have a high protein diet and hit enter and it just does all the work for you so Efficiency is one way of looking at it or just like it just does all the work for you is another way of looking at it Can you see what barge does when you type that in let's try it. Yeah, let's try it. I'm gonna screen record again I do why he's trying that though. Yeah, like I it's just funny when you say how we've optimized like searching it

I just think of some of the things I've searched and I just, if I say it out loud, it's like caveman speak. Just like you start like learning all these keywords that is like,

Grow muscle Reddit food. No dairy. If you look at the tags, if you look at a website that you're on, if you looked at the URL, the URL is specifically targeted to be keywords. You're basically thinking in SEO at that point. Yeah, you're thinking in SEO. And we don't even think about the fact that we think in SEO. It is very funny. Yeah. It's like coding, right? Because coding is a language. I know nothing about coding. Yeah, well, okay. But you do because you put the zero in front of the one on your keyboard, apparently. Yeah.

Just saying, zero's a number and it doesn't make sense that it would be at the end. Why is it at the end? I just always think of it as 10. Sorry, I derailed that really bad. Go watch the new studio video if you're confused. Okay, here's a fun fact. Every new number from zero to infinity takes, or actually zero to nine, is less likely to occur naturally.

Wait, what? Yes. Okay. So zero to nine, right? Oh, of all of those numbers, every new number above it is less likely to occur naturally because it takes more energy to get from zero something to one of something that it takes even more energy to get from one of something to two of something. And so if you look at the distribution of all of the numbers from zero to nine in any string that appear anywhere in the world, it's literally like goes straight down from like zero to nine.

So zero is used a lot. So you're saying zero should be first. Zero is a lot. And zero should be at the front. Because it's the most common. I think it should be on the home row then.

Alright, let's see what Bard said. Bard, I asked, "What should I do with my diet to put on muscle?" And it actually gave me a nice little bullet point list. It said, "Here are some tips on what you should do with your diet to put on muscle. One, eat a high protein diet," and then spells that out. "Two, eat a calorie surplus," spells that out. "Eat a balanced diet, stay hydrated, get enough sleep, lift weights, be patient." Pretty nice little write up there. Here is something about Bard that I found. It seems like the suggestions that it gives you for things are like,

really basic and not detailed. And I think that's kind of what happens when you go through like Google for things is like you get the high level version and then if you want to dig in more you hit the button that says Google it and then you dive into all of the things that would happen with related searches and other things you would look up to like fill in your answer. Yeah. Can you like respond to that and say like

I am also vegetarian and what supplement should I be taking or something like that. Okay. Let's try and confuse it a little bit. It just seems like eat a balanced diet as an answer for how do I stay healthy. Quit Facebook. Yeah. It just seems really generic. It's like, how do I be healthy? Step one, be healthy. Step two, don't be unhealthy. Activity. Sleep. Sleep.

I said, "I am also vegetarian. Should I take supplements?" Yes, it is a good idea for vegetarians to take supplements as they may not be getting all the nutrients they need from their diet. Here are some supplements that vegetarians may want to consider. Vitamin V12, iron, omega-3 fatty acids, calcium, vitamin D, and breakdowns of each of them. I asked ChatGPT the same initial question, "What should I do with my diet to put on muscle?"

GPT-4 writes a lot more. I also have my setting on being creative, but it writes a lot more. So it says to put on muscle, you need to focus on a combination of proper nutrition, resistance training, and adequate rest. Here are some guidelines to help you adjust your diet for muscle growth. More calories, prioritize protein, balance carbs and fats, eat frequently, stay hydrated. Similar things, a little more diet tailored, which is cool.

Let me ask it the second question. I am also a vegetarian. Also, just in the way that GPT-4 responds to you just feels more complex. Way better. In a good way. In a more natural way, in a less robotic, like, here is your answer. Yeah, I mean, like, Bard kind of sounded like telling kids in first grade how to be healthy, whereas, like...

ChatGPT4 felt like if you're first meeting your personal trainer. Here's the couple things just to always remember before giving you a plan. - Yeah, okay, what did it say, Marques? So as a vegetarian, you can generally obtain most of the essential nutrients through a well-planned and balanced diet. However, there are a few nutrients that can be challenging to get in an adequate amount from plant-based sources alone. It might be beneficial to consider taking supplements for the following nutrients.

vitamin B12, omega-3 fatty acids. Kind of gives you the same breakdown as BARD. It also types it out much more slowly, where BARD will just spit out the answer all at once after like five seconds of waiting. Can you change that on ChatGPT? I haven't found a setting to be able to. It just seems to type. That seems...

Like a really basic thing it should be able to do? I think the queries take a while. So if you ask it for something more complex, it'll take longer to do it. And if you ask for like the fast version of, like if I have the plus account, so it like prioritizes it, so it types really fast, it's as good as just spitting it all out. I'd be interested to see how much of that is actually still processing or how much of that is attempting to feel more chat-like. Yeah.

by watching it it does feel i would rather just spit out yeah i think there is something to it it does feel more chat like when it's typing it out to you instead like it feels like somebody's on the other side typing to you right now yeah which is kind of interesting so you know we'll keep playing with this there's a lot more of course that will do with bard and with bing and they both start with b i don't know wait i like the bard name though bard solid name dig it what

Take that button away from him. It's all right. I'm going to send Bart on you. Yeah. Google specifically mentions that it's an experiment like over and over and over again. And they also have a wait list. And I just wonder if they're going to roll it out to everyone. I wonder if at IO they're going to officially integrate it into a product because OpenAI is putting it in a lot of products with their API. And if Google can't catch up and they just keep it as an experiment for a while, it's just kind of. Yeah, I've thought about that. Like, yeah.

GPT is going to show up more and more as a plugin or a collaboration inside of a bunch of other apps. I think Opera recently just added GPT as a co-pilot to their own browser. So I don't have to use Edge to talk to GPT

or I guess I was doing Bing before. I'm not going to use Opera. But it's like, you know, you keep seeing GPT showing up in more and more places to the point where literally I mentioned this last week, my weather app has a chat bot now where you can just talk to it about the weather. And I'm pretty sure that's also powered by GPT. Now you can small talk with your weather app. Exactly. This is not the future I want. It'll go crazy and it'll just talk to you. And that's like, so obviously BARD is Google's version of this. So the question would be,

Is there a reason for any of them to use Google's version over GPT? Not sure I see a reason yet. But if there are some edges that they find that are better with BARD for certain applications, then maybe they will. Yeah. We'll just have to see. It's so early we don't know the answer. I think ultimately they're just going to want to integrate it into their own products. Like that's their end goal probably is just to like compete with Microsoft. Yeah, for sure.

Is there going to be value for OpenAI becoming like the backbone of AI chatbots everywhere all over the internet? Google would prefer that. It's going to be like OpenAI in everything versus Google in just Google products. It's like Google versus Apple. OpenAI has like an API that lets everyone access it. If Google keeps barred just to itself. Yeah. They kind of feel like Apple. Yeah. Hmm.

okay last question would you rather talk if you could do voice chat with your current voice assistant which i assume is google assistant not siri would you rather talk to that or talk to bard or talk to gpt chat gbt like you mean with them can they speak to me yeah can they speak oh yeah gpt4 of course it's natural uh i'd probably can chat gpt still control my lights yeah

I'd probably pick GPT-4. Yeah. I would pick GPT-4. Can I use a voice? Do I have to say, hey, GPT-4? Yeah. I actually probably like that better than hey, Google. Sorry, to be honest. Can I use a voice map of Owen Wilson? That's a lot. I bet it could figure out a way to do it, though. Yeah. Yeah. Easy. What if, you know, when you're talking to an assistant, you say, like, turn on the bathroom lights. Yeah. It does it.

You know, these language models, what if it's like, turn on the lights and it's like, how bright? And then you're like, the brightness is always this. And it's like, okay, but...

what temperature? And you're like, shut up. To be fair, Google does that too. You're like, hey Google, turn on the lights. Okay, next time if you would like to do this, you can just ask this. If you're wondering how to start your day in the morning, Google, shut the... I just want to turn my lights on. My digital assistant does not do that. Which one do you use? Don't tell me. I'm a die-hard Siri supporter. I'll die on this hill. No, no, no.

They both have access to the soundboard. Yeah, I don't know. Just the second my smart things start talking to me like a person, it's just going to annoy me. You just prefer the random, every once in a while. I just want to say, my phone in the two and a half years I've owned it has never once accidentally...

triggered. I don't... You take one of the HomePods and plug it in your apartment? I want you to put one in your apartment and you will hate Siri by the end of the month. This guy is fine. But yeah, the second, it's not just like, I did your thing. I'm going to be so mad. I have no patience for anything pretended to be a human being. I cannot wait until voice assistants have GPT-style natural language processing integrated. I just... I'm so... No, look. I just...

I'm just very excited to see how the world reacts to that. Because that's basically the plot of Her. So, that's what I want. Wait, I don't know how that goes. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? It's not. It's not either. It's not not a bad thing. The movie is basically this OS slash... Spoiler alert. It is... It's a voice assistant that comes out that is basically GPT-4, but...

really really good and can have natural like conversations with you and also has a persona so it's a you know and it's basically that i don't know we're gonna hit that pretty soon it's it's also a movie about a guy who's having trouble dealing with feelings of grief and loss and deals with it by trying to marry a language model so i don't know if i would say this is like a good thing everyone falls in love with their language model it's not just him that sounds like we're gonna

No, it's 100% a bad thing. Okay. Well, we'll find out in the real world. We'll just give it to everyone and see what happens. If it's not clear, I'm very, very apprehensive about these language models. I don't want it because I think it'll be good. I want it because I want to see how the world reacts to it. But picture if we said that about... I just want to watch the world burn. I think we should go to trivia before we cancel ourselves.

I want to watch the world burn a little. On that note, let's do some trivia.

Trivia. Trivia. Trivia, dude. Okay. Yeah. Second question, also brought to you by Ellis's What Do You Guys Want to Talk About theme. Okay. And you guys said techno, technology, and feet. Techno feet. So techno feet. Wait, it's feet again? It's the same thing. Both questions are technology and feet related. All right. Second question. Piezoelectricity is generated when you blank certain materials. Is it A, squish, B, poke, or

C, melt, or D, digest. Wow. Yeah. Think about it. Ellis came up with these, so kudos to Ellis. Whoa. Squish. We're going to have to think about that one. We'll be right back. Yeah, it's squish, poke, melt, or digest. And the topic is piezoelectricity. We're on ad break now, right? We'll be right back. Squish. Squish. Support for Whiteform comes from Coda.

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oh my god nothing had an event this week that's the end of the podcast no uh the the nothing uh year two two is the name of the new headphones they're 150 bucks they are they are they had an announcement event which was basically a live streamed premiere of a thing that they made it was kind of funny actually so first of all the product itself is new earbuds they look very similar to the last ones with some small improvements mainly to the sound new custom drivers

Design is very similar because that's kind of like their thing. They already have a certain look and people like that about it. But the case is a little smaller, little things like that. They did a lot of refinement type things. So year two, it's out. But their event was kind of funny because their event was Carl, their CEO. How do I explain what they did? They essentially cosplayed as several YouTube channels,

while turning it into a keynote. It's like funny, if any other company did this, we'd have been like, wow, that's really weird. But for this company, it was like,

you know, nothing is already Carl's baby, which has already like leaned very heavily into the YouTube thing. And like the way they do PR is very creator forward, which makes a lot of sense. But yeah, basically like it opens up with like him wearing the MKBHD hoodie in the set, which looks like he's in our studio, but he's not in our studio. They recreated our studio from scratch in their studio to make it look like he's in our studio.

And they picked arguably like the hardest corner of the entire studio to replicate because it has a giant window and this like steel beam that they had to replicate. They redid the beam. Like they could have picked one of the just white corners that we have that would have been super easy. But yeah, they replicated a steel beam and it's insanely accurate.

They also did ours. Yeah. And I think I would give them like a 98 out of 100 as far as like accuracy was pretty good. Literally to the point of like they even for one of the scenes like screened out the window and like superimposed what we've had outside our window. So like really look like he was in our studio. So anyway. It looks really, really good. It's pretty good. Yeah. I was impressed. They also did this for Mr. Who's the Boss, iJustine, J-Rig Everything, Technical Guruji.

and they're pretty good like all of them are fairly accurate so they sort of use this to have like carl land in the set and then like use that youtuber's style to explain the product so he like lands in our set he's like here's our new product and he's lands in justine's set and he's like so it's got these new drivers and the sound is better and he lands an iron set and he's like it's got these new features so that's how they did it it was kind of clever yeah i don't think i've seen anything like that before i give him a lot of credit because we've talked about how like

Some of their past ones were a bit boring. So this is just a slight update on their headphones. I don't think any other company tried to do this. Exactly. And they just did a, it was like 20 minutes max, right? Yeah, sure. It was very short, fun for a couple minutes. They just like posted all the final specs at the end. They talked about the product. They released it. Kudos. I thought it was fun.

I don't know how they'll do that again because if they just do the exact same thing again, it's going to be boring. I think it's a one-off. But yeah, they did a good job with it. And I didn't realize they were $150. $150. Yeah, $149. Yeah, so I don't know. We're going to try these as well because we have them now. We'll see how they go. I am still like...

I don't know. The favorite thing for me about them was the design, and that's basically the same as last time, so I still like that about them. I hope they work. That would be awesome. That was my biggest gripe about the first ones. Yeah, that's a big gripe. Yeah, exactly. I had a lot of trouble with the first one, so I'm definitely, I think we have an extra pair there. I'm going to grab them and probably start using them tomorrow, as long as they work. If they were still $99, though, and they worked

As well as the... Or if they actually always charged and whatever, I would say that's awesome. I love the design and I'm totally fine spending a little extra for a cool design, whether maybe noise canceling isn't as good as AirPods, but...

They fit in my ear and they looked cool. Yeah. They just didn't work. So let's hope the twos do. Hopefully that does all the things you asked for them. Yeah. Also, I had a little cameo at the end, which was just like at the literal very end of the keynote, it cuts to me like watching their end of their keynote and disliking it and being like, that was kind of cringe. Call me when it's the phone too. And I leave. Yeah.

So that's actually, you know, OnePlus is, or OnePlus, nothing is kind of making their own, their little ecosystem now where they have the phone. The phone works best with their earbuds, but the earbuds still work really well with others. So there's kind of this little mini ecosystem starting to form. They'll probably make a phone two this year. What else are they going to add to their ecosystem? We don't really know yet, but I could see that sort of expanding. I still think...

see-through smart speaker with Google Assistant would look really sick. Speaker seems like it makes a lot of sense. Designed by teenage engineering vibes like that would look really sick. That'd be dope. I gotta say that for the ear twos, the fit of the ear ones were my favorite thing about them. I was like, these are really light and they fit really well in my ear and they stay really well in my ear and I would love to use them for running. They just sounded like...

Bad. So if the ear 2s sound better, then I would probably consider them. They're using the LHDC codec, which is a common off-the-shelf high-res audio codec, which should be available to anyone, any OEM, using Android higher than 10.

It's not always like added as a feature, but it's definitely not a codec that's like, you know, proprietary. And it's not even locked into any like specific chipset either. While we're talking about audio features no one cares about, it's pretty cool from a nerd standpoint that they claim they're able to get like one megabit.

data, Bluetooth data transfer onto this thing. And it's also pretty cool that they're claiming like around like 30 milliseconds of latency.

Yeah, latency is always one of those immediate things you notice the second you start using a pair of earbuds with your phone, which is you open up a YouTube video or something and you start watching it and you notice how much lag there is between the voices and the people talking on the screen. Or when you're playing a game and you're like, you hit something with the car on the screen and you don't hear it for a fraction of a second until it gets the headphones. Stuff like that. Or when you're using an app like GarageBand on an iPad.

and you're pressing piano keys and you can hear it, you know, not be in time. That's what immediately popped into my head. Like when you're working with a computer, like generally anything above like eight to 10 milliseconds of latency makes playing an instrument really, really hard. Yeah. So it should be fun to play with, but I appreciated that keynote from the Nothing team. Shout out to them. Well played. But that's kind of it. Anything else in our little last bit lightning round you want to go over? I don't think so. I did...

I thought you started the episode saying you had a special thing you wanted to talk about that you never mentioned anything. Yeah, we were going to talk about cars and electric cars, and then I was going to throw in a non-electric car. Oh, well, we don't care about that. This is a wave form. Well, okay, I just wanted to shout out the bizarro new Dodge that got announced. So there's a new Dodge. It's the last Dodge. It's the last call. And I do this last call thing. It's the last gas-powered Dodge.

Yes, and so they've just gone completely all out, bonkers insane, and just made it a straight line drag car that happens to be street legal.

But the numbers and the specs and what they've built is absurd. It is a rear-wheel drive, 1,000-horsepower gas car running on ethanol, meaning not even pump gas. You have to get specific race fuel for it to get the full 1,025 horsepower. And it will do 0 to 60 in 1.66 seconds. And it will run the quarter mile in under 9 seconds at 151 miles an hour.

which would be a record for a production car, for a gas car, for sure. Oh, it's a Challenger, too. Yeah, and it's literally on racing slicks, and you can buy it with a parachute. It comes by default with no seats other than the driver's seat, and you can famously add a passenger seat for a dollar. For a dollar? Yeah, yeah. It's that type of car. Can you take it out? Yeah, you just don't buy it. Or do you mean if you buy it for a dollar, you want to take it out? I assume most people are just going to not have it, especially.

expect at all. So it's that type of car. And the funny thing about this, which is interesting to me, is like this story with gas cars for so long, for so long would be sure they're quick off the line, but then they run out of power after 70 miles an hour and you just get blown by by the gas cars. This was... By the electric cars. Yeah.

by the gas cars. The gas cars would blow by the electric cars. Oh, I see, I see. Because the EV would have that quick zero to 60 and that's a cool headline and a straight line, but then the gas cars all overtake them by the end of the quarter mile. Every single one until Plaid

And now if you actually look at the specs, the Plaid traps a 9'2", 154 quarter mile. Basically what that means is at the quarter mile mark, the Plaid is going faster despite being behind. So what happened is the Dodge would get out in front

with the ridiculous perfect launch, 1.6 seconds, 0 to 60, and then the electric car would pull up behind it and pass it after a quarter mile. Isn't that... It's just backwards. It's just backwards to know how it normally is, which was entertaining to me. So I figured I'd throw that out there. I would never insure one of those cars. If I was an insurance company, do you know how many of those are going to crash getting out of the lot? Yeah.

Like, have you ever seen the Mustangs, like people rear wheel drive for the first time, like floor it out of the lot and just eat the median? Like somebody's going to. This literally is on like Mickey Thompson racing slicks that are dangerous to drive in the rain. Like there are, you're right. If you were an insurance company and you saw this, you'd probably go, yeah, no thanks. No thanks.

But, yeah, it's a bizarro time in the car world. The last calls are getting pretty crazy. I appreciate they went all out as their last. I kind of think that's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. And they're also going to make that crazy gigantic. Remember that Dodge that makes the weird sounds that electric car they're going to make? We'll see how good that one ends up being. But yeah.

This will be fun. Whenever that car comes out, I'm sure we'll see some races against some electric cars. My last second news is that Rolleiflex is announcing a modern twin lens reflex camera that looks like a film camera, but will actually probably be digital, and that makes me very excited. I understood some of those words. It looks like a film camera. Is that a benefit?

Yeah, because it's a twin lens reflex camera. It has a viewing lens and then a taking lens. Oh, I was going to say, because we all use DSLRs, which is a single lens reflex camera, right? So a dual lens reflex camera. A TLR, twin lens reflex. Twin, okay. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. So you basically, you're like looking down into the mirror and like you're taking a picture. It's like a super old school style. Mm-hmm.

Which is fun. I'm very excited. Yeah. Yeah. It's being announced on 420. Wait, do you know what the price is yet? No. I bet it's going to be super high. I was going to cut this until you said it's being announced on 420. Now it stays in. That's pretty cool. Yeah, I'm excited. So that's my last minute news. Okay. Yeah. Well, I think we should get to the trivia answers. I forgot about that. I've already written both down. I know everything there is to know about feet.

All right, coming back for another round of trivia, we got Marquez coming in with nine points, Andrew coming in with seven points, and David with a huge 11 points, bringing him to an average of 1.42 points per game. That's kind of sick, actually. Points per game is nice. Okay. PPG, baby. So yeah, let's get into it. Okay. So this first question was about a 2006...

service in collaboration with Nike and Apple. It was a service which had a sensor and a transmitter in your shoe and would send your device some health data. So what was this service called? So when I worked at Intel, I was a project manager for their Internet of Things stuff. And we worked with Lenovo to build a smart shoe for Yao Ming.

That would track all of his jump height and all that sort of stuff. Are you supposed to be talking about this? Yeah, I can talk about it. Oh, okay, cool. Just wanted to make sure. It released. Okay. Yeah. But I don't know anything about the competitors. Useful. All right, flip them and read. Okay. Oh. What? Nike Plus. Nike Plus. You wrote... Thank you. I wrote Nike Adapt.

Because that's their most recent smart shoe. And I figured maybe it was like a... I got worried Nike Plus was their customization thing, but that's Nike ID, right? Okay. Yeah. All right.

Nice. Well played. I mean, it makes perfect sense with like all of Apple's plus things also. It's funny that I know, but it does. It is funny how well it fits with like Fitness Plus and everything. I would have also accepted Nike plus iPod or Nike plus iPhone because it was also marketed. But Nike plus is the general pop quiz. What was the color of the product? Oh, I know this.

You're talking about the insert, right? It was like orange. Yeah. That makes sense. It was a little orange thing. Yeah. All right. Next question. Piezoelectricity is generated when you blank certain materials. A. Squish. B. Poke. C. Melt. Or D. Digest.

So I did write mine down ahead of time. It's a total guess because I have a description of how I think this electricity works in my head and it doesn't match any of those. I, through context clues, I think know the correct answer to this. I bet just based on the way you said that, you're probably right. I just know it because I'm a god. Oh, okay, cool. I think we're ready. All right, flip them and read. So I wrote poke. I wrote poke.

I wrote melt. Oh. All wrong. All right. According to Ellis, who did all the research on this and was trying to tell me that I mispronounced piezo, but it's fine. Piezo electricity. Yeah, whatever. The answer is squish. Squish. Squish. A. Squish. What does the root piezo mean? What does it have to do with feet? I'm realizing... Okay. Yeah, what? That's what I was... Okay. Okay.

Can I tell you my reasoning? I get your reason. I'm realizing now after writing this question that a hard enough poke kind of becomes a squish. Not always. Well, see, that's how I felt writing the question, but so many of you guys put poke. I'm starting to think... But I can tell you that my reasoning is not because of that. My reasoning is assuming feet, I'm thinking...

It's similar to like static electricity where with my feet, I'm creating a charge and then poking something and releasing. Unfortunately not. The answer is pretty cool, though. If you feel I was unfair in this question and I should give them points for poke, please tweet me. I should not. But so essentially certain materials, a lot of crystals like quartz are.

have this really cool property where if you, the scientific term is if you apply mechanical stress, which is just a fancy way of say, give a little squish. If you give them a little squish, they'll output electricity at really, really regular intervals.

Likewise, if you supply them electricity, they will squish themselves at really, really regular intervals. And that is, that's essentially how a quartz watch works. When you supply a low voltage to a piece of quartz, it supplies this ticking at a very, very steady interval. That's a simplification. The reason it has to do with the feet stuff is because the sensors- Yeah, that's what we're here for. How does this connect to feet? The sensors in-

the Nike Plus sensor are piezoelectric. So what it's actually doing is taking the shocks of the impact. I'm so dumb. Generating an electrical signal and analyzing that. Wow, in 2006? Yes. Well, piezoelectronics are an old technology. I think they were invented in like the 70s.

Yeah. But lighters use piezo crystals. Certain microphones use piezo crystals. There are surgeries done by supplying crystals with specific voltages so they vibrate at specific frequencies that can cut tissue. It's like a really, really, really commonly used technology. I see the answer was squish. The answer was a squish. That makes sense. I completely forgot that this was about feet. Would that have changed your answer? Yeah, because why would ice have anything to do with feet?

Ice? Or melts? Yeah. Oh. Yeah. Fair. I also seem to remember there being some sort of, like, specialized tech insole that you could put in your shoe that would, like, become a battery and you could charge your phone off of it. I don't remember. Sounds like a Kickstarter. Yeah. It was a long time ago, but I thought it was cool. And there, I mean, there are phones that, there are prototype phones and smartwatches that have come out that charge via, um...

the motion of your body as you walk. I'm trying to remember exactly what that was. That, so this is like a way over generalizing oversimplification. That's kinetic energy. Yeah. Most, the way that normally works is you have a stable magnetic field that

And then you push a you have a stable magnetic field generated by a permanent magnet hooked up to a coil And that creates induction and then when you move a magnet of the opposite pole and you disturb that Magnetic or the same pole and you disturb the magnetic field it converts the kinetic energy that you're applying You know when you take two Thomas the Tank engines and you try to make them kiss the wrong way and then you feel it like pushing against each other

When you fight against that, you're inputting kinetic energy into the system. So if there's a coil attached to that permanent magnet, that kinetic energy will actually turn into electrical energy and charge. I remember a smartwatch that charges with kinetic energy as well. It's actually the basis of how a microphone works, where you have two kissing. The diaphragm. Yeah, inside the microphone is two about to kiss almost the tank engines.

And when you talk, the moving air pushes one of them towards the other. And it's that disturbing magnetic field. I forgot it was about feet, so ice wouldn't have made any sense. I also forgot it was about feet. Well, I think that's enough science for the Waveform podcast this week. I feel like I learned something, though, which is good. And not quite enough feet stuff. Maybe. Or maybe not. Either way, thanks for listening. Thanks for watching this week. And we'll catch you guys in the next one.

Waveform is produced by Adam Molina and Ellis Robin. We're partnered with Vox Media Podcast Network and our intro-outro music was created by Vane Silk. Support for Waveform comes from AT&T. What's it like to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with AT&T NextUp anytime? It's like when you first light up the grill and think of all the mouthwatering possibilities. Learn how to get the new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on them and the latest iPhone every year with AT&T NextUp anytime. AT&T, connecting changes everything.

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