Is Real Madrid Right for Trent & What’s Up with Foden? | Stick to Football EP 76
01:08:57 Share

Just before we get started, I just wanted to say a big thank you to our partner Skybet and please don't forget to subscribe if you like. I hope you enjoy this episode. BetterHelp Online Therapy bought this 30 second ad to remind you right now, wherever you are, to unclench your jaw, relax your shoulders, take a deep breath in and out.

Feels better, right? That's 15 seconds of self-care. Imagine what you could do with more. Visit BetterHelp.com slash Random Podcast for 10% off your first month of therapy. No pressure, just help. But for now, just relax.

Visit Verizon.com today.

Additional terms apply. Service plan required for Apple Watch and iPad. Up to $2,000 value based on iPhone, iPad, and Apple Watch. If you're a parent or share a fridge with someone, Instacart is about to make grocery shopping so much easier. Because with family carts, you can share a cart with your partner and each add the items you want. Since between the two of you, odds are you'll both remember everything you need.

And this way, you'll never have to eat milkless cereal again. So, minimize the stress of the weekly shop with Family Carts. Download the Instacart app and get delivery in as fast as 30 minutes. Plus, enjoy $0 delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees apply for three orders in 14 days. Excludes restaurants.

What are you doing there, sat down quiet? I'm not going to be loud, am I? Another award for you? Yeah, not for me, for you, for us. For the team. For the team. For the team. It's a team, Kieran. Who'd have thought it, eh? I know, come a long way. Come a long way, but we're not too sure. You won that last year, didn't you, for Monday Night Football? Yeah, was it? Yeah.

Which one? This award. Yeah, yeah. Cara won it last year. The team won it. The team won it. Congratulations, everybody. Yeah, well done. Okay. Roy, well done. I'll win him. Yeah, yeah, I'm bringing it now. Yeah, yeah, Roy. Did you go to the awards? We were doing the game. Oh, the game, England game. Ian Wright presented it to him. Yeah, righty. Because

All the morning. Oh, on the night? Was it one of them on the night where they can't be with us? I can't be with you. I sent a video, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'd love to be there with you tonight. No, you wouldn't. Sorry I got naked, yeah. Right.

And then Roy, it's all funny and then he turned all like serious like, yeah, well, we don't do it for awards. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, tank the team. The team behind the team. The team. A bit like a Dutch Barnard, basically, Roy. It's not that hard. Oh, you run about tattoos. Them lads, you've got them legacy caps. That's a good one for you to get your number. Yeah. You know what number were you, England player? Do you know what number you is? 1,022 I was.

What? To have played... The number, like, the caps. You get a number when you get the caps. I was a 1,022nd player that played for... I saw that the other day. Viv Anderson and...

Luther Blissett, yeah. But the number of... Before the England game, they get presented. They got legacy cap for that. What player when they made their debut? Maybe the 1,022. Yeah, something like that. Have you had one? No, I haven't had one. But would you get that number? That's the number I'd get, 1,022. Can you please get us a legacy cap, FA? No, I think they're obviously going to do it when they get their own chip. I think everybody, yeah. So every player now, the next one on the...

I'm guessing so, however they do it. And it's anyone who's represented England, isn't it? It's not like you need to have 100 cats. Do you get a cat or a chef? Why don't they just send it to you? So send everyone together. How many of them go to Wembley?

to Wembley Viv Anderson and Ludovic they were absolutely there must be like if Ludovic was 1,000 we must be at nearly 1,600, 700 now there's only like to have six a lot of them would have passed away older players Gary my number's 1,064 I've just been told what's mine what's Cara's

But would you get that tattooed now? That's what I'm saying, Joe. That's a good tattoo, girl. I like it. I like it, Roy. I'm not sure that's... No? No, I'm not feeling that a little bit. No, that's not something that a lot of people can do, though. You're 1,092.

2,000 wouldn't mean a lot for you, wouldn't it? No, 1,092. 1,092. Oh, shoddy, yeah, it would have been 1,100. What was mine? See if mine was 1,022. What's carrot? What's righties? I'm going to get up my accountant. Hi, guys. You're 1,022. Thank you. Hi, Jim. Jim, I'm going to get it here. 3,000.

1,000 and what? 1,022. What number were you? Do you know? Number what? International player for the women's team. Jill, I love that shirt. It's gorgeous, isn't it? It is. I thought it was a Man City one. Brilliant. Brilliant, that shirt. Nike. Yeah. She's a designer. You look great, Jill. But me on this show is selling something. I'm not selling Nike. I don't think you're relying on me to sell Nike. There's definitely a brand deal going on. Look at your face. Who knows a little brand deal going on? The hoodie, the glasses and the hat.

A brand led. No, they're not. I don't even know who these are. I can sell by that dirty laugh. No, no, no. Is it Vincent at the moment or what is he? I am M&S at the moment, but obviously I'm aware of that. You're a brand. Righty. You're like, you're a brand. I'm not. Righty. Uncle Righty. Yeah. You should bring out your own clothing range. No, no, no, no. That's not a good idea. You tried that. No, no, no, no. You know, you get too many people. I'm buying that from him.

This guy buying his gear. Yeah, but for everyone that wouldn't, someone would. Who would say that, Ryder? About you? Maybe it's me just being negative. Just being in the car for four hours. You're the national treasure. No chance. Yeah, but why are you so popular? I know. There's nothing special about you. Obviously. No, no, Roy, I just... But people like you, don't they? Just level, innit? You like... You know what it is? No, no, no, not mad at people.

No, no, I'm just like... I'm just very... No, no, no, I'm just trying to say. I'm just very chilled about it. I'm very fortunate to be where I am. I know that. I think you and Jill are the most liked on this show. Do you think? No. People love Roy. Honestly, people come up with us in the street and they go, I love Roy. People love you. No, I don't feel it. Yeah, because it's amplified more, isn't it, the negativity? People love you. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm still doing it. How many times people say things like, where's Jamie? Where's Jamie back? Where's Jill? Where's Roy? Well, Roy's always there. He's never going to miss one. When you're missing from the court, you get loads of people at the right underneath. Where's Jamie? Where's Jamie? Everyone thinks they missed this show. I don't know. I was there yesterday.

You got Pundit of the Year. Does it actually mean a lot to you to win that? And don't be all like, no, no, no. Because it's a good award, isn't it? But you're part of a team, aren't you? You're always part of a team. When you do the games, when we're here today, there's people in the... So you don't...

I can't go on an ego trip thinking it's just about you. You like that one, though, you know when they... Do you ever win manager of the month and the manager gets all the staff there? Oh, yeah. But not the masseurs. All the staff, but not the masseurs. Yeah, but listen, managers then go overboard with that, don't they? They have hundreds in the picture. Because it's a team game, isn't it? It's a team. When we do the games on Sundays, I would ITV, which guy, long days, so it's the people in the background...

Keep you going. Keep you going. Oh, well, congrats. Do you enjoy the international match? Obviously you don't work.

Did you go away? I'm struggling. You went to Malta to watch, how was it? Every year I went, I was saying, tell Gary I was asking about him. I love it over there. I know. You seem like you know everyone over there. I do, I do. I tried to get you a hotel. I booked him a hotel and he cancelled it. Was it the Dragonal? No, no, no. This did not happen. This sums Gary Neville up right. We're at Wembley for the cup final.

I've told him I'm going to my... The trip's booked. Me family are going. We're staying. Everything's OK. And he went, you know what? I'll send you the... What's the fella's name? Mark. Yeah. This text is brilliant. So he's telling me... It's a nice hotel now. Is it the Dragon Normal one? I'm staying in a lovely hotel in Cynthia. It's a lovely hotel. Right. Right.

Mark Maltzer, yeah. Mark Maltzer. He's always going to be Mark Maltzer. So he's saying, Cara, no, you're doing this, you're doing this. I'm like, oh, my God, it's booked. Stay out of it. We'll go again, don't worry. So look what the fella says. It's a lot of conversation. So after the game, I'm not in the greatest mood anyway after the game. Why? LAUGHTER

Mark, Motor Hotel. Looking forward to hosting you, Jamie. We will organise pick-up at the airport and make sure you and your family have a great time. I can put my hotel team in touch with you via email or WhatsApp. I've said, no, take no notice of them. I've booked it all now, but in the summer we'll come back. You know, I'm done. And he's put, Jamie, I am ignoring you. Gary's the boss. LAUGHTER He's put the wrong hotel, so I said to him, I'll sort you out. I didn't book the wrong hotel! LAUGHTER

Happy wife, happy life. Happy, what was he put there? Oh, that was at the inn. Oh, keep the missus happy. Yeah, but I'm like, we went and had a look, we had a drink there, it's a lovely hotel, don't get me wrong, it might be too nice. No, but it was like, well, did you change then? No, I just went for a drink just to be... I couldn't change even if I wanted to, I'm getting bullied by him. You know what I mean? You just go just to like, say, yeah, we came, so... We had a little drink, had a look, it was a really nice hotel, probably...

it's like a big sea hotel yeah yeah nice very nice yeah yeah yeah and what was the games like that must have been so proud of him did he say he started right yeah started both games wasn't sure he would obviously it's the first time he's been there but the first game he played played Finland should have got something out of it I mean like played really well second half

Got beat 1-0 and then went to Poland away. How did he play when you were watching him? What was it like? Did you go to Poland as well? Oh, yeah. Oh, we had a proper trip. Like, yeah, the Carragher's on tour, yeah. It's like the old England game. Was it OK watching him? I wasn't nervous. What was the score against Poland? They got beat 2-0. I wasn't nervous, but I could see my dad was a bit nervous before the games. It was a big game, 50, whatever, 50,000 there. And what do you do when you're nervous?

Have a drink? Do you have a drink? I was going to say go to the toilet. But no, it was good. I wanted Lewandowski to start. You know what you think? But he came on. He came on, but he did all right. Did you get his shirt? He did, actually. He was up against him at the end in the last 20 minutes, yeah. My big thing has always been, don't put yourself before the team or the club this season. This is too important. He is a level with Bellingham. That's where I see it. What? He knows that's right. He just said 4-3-3 before that.

That team you just put out there. Not a bad team, is it? Great team. Glenn Odden's team. I'm not sure. That team? No, goalkeeper. He's not an out-and-out winger, but I do agree in them two advanced positions. He is technically on the half-turn with his through balls. Yeah, but wherever he's playing, he's not playing well. I've explained this. I've explained this. Stop it. He's got a big mural outside. Oh, you've all got murals. You haven't got a mural in Liverpool. You can do that.

We've got a little surprise coming up. So, in you come, Cara. Hi, Cara. Hello. Hi. Hello. This is a surprise. I didn't know you were coming. Hey, surprise. I'll give you my seat. Thank you. I'm the only gentleman here. Tell us about this. Tell us what you've been up to. So, yeah, I started...

about four years ago and I'd been really poorly and yeah it was kind of something I started researching because I was really struggling with my health and I was diagnosed with lupus so it kind of came out of the blue and I just was about to start my dream teaching job

And so, yeah, I started looking into my diet because I really didn't want to just rely on, like, steroids and immunosuppressants. So I started researching about gut health and all the things about wellness and then realised how little there were, you know, in stores that were kind of not processed and had nasties in. And so I started thinking about, what if I created a food that everyone could reach for and enjoy? And I started eating, you know...

really gut-friendly whole foods and yeah, it was amazing to see kind of my health returning because yeah, I'd been really, really poorly. Obviously my family had played a massive role in this and helped me out so much but yeah, it's been incredible because now it's finally on shelves. So when you weren't well enough, there was nothing out there for you in respects of

that can make you feel better? Yeah, so it was a real struggle for me. What kind of things you was going for? Yeah, so, well, I was trying to eat kind of like when I was covering really gut-friendly, like whole foods, like healthy fats, things like that. But yeah, even cereals on shelves, I realised that there was such a need for kind of products that...

that didn't have processed ingredients, that didn't have artificial additives. And being a schoolteacher as well, it was so clear to me that many children started the day off with such horrible cereals that had so many ingredients. It's unbelievable how bad cereal is for you. It's cereal that we all grew up eating, ice cream or corn. It was ultra-processed. Yeah, so bad.

There's so much sugar, isn't there, in normal cereals? Do you want to do... Is that why you pick cereal, like breakfast and all the other things? Cereals just are, like, renowned for how awful they are. That's so tasty, though. Thank you. It is good for you for the mouth.

I wouldn't expect you to say that. It helps with hair loss. This is like trying dragons. I know. It's the food, isn't it? I'm following you on Instagram, but you've actually got into some stores, haven't you, already? Yes, so we're in Whole Foods, Selfridges and Pan Organic.

and hopefully more to come. But, yeah, this last week we were just in Kensington Whole Foods and we sold out, which I was really emotional about because it was honestly, yeah, really... You sold out in a day, though, when you were there? Yeah, so we sold out, like, in the space of a few days. People come and ask you your story as well, Cara. Yeah. Tell them the story. Well, I just love hearing from people and so many people have reached out about their own kind of health journeys. Yeah.

And that, for me, if I can share that and help someone, that's the main goal with it. And what was it affecting your body, your skin? Yeah, so I get, when I have a flare-up, yeah, so with lupus, your autoimmune system kind of attacks its own tissue. So, for me, it attacks my skin, and so that includes, like, my hair. At the moment, I'm having a bit of a flare-up, but...

Have you got a picture of how it goes when you're doing it? Yeah, so I have, gosh, like, I had lots of hair loss. I had alopecia, and the joint pain was so bad, I was, like, bed-bound for two months. It was really scary. So, yeah, I feel like hopefully I can help people because so many people are reaching out on the back of this. So, yeah, and everyone kind of goes on their own health journey, and, like, talking to people about it is really lovely. So, yeah, hopefully I can help people. Oh, that's amazing. Thank you. So amazing. Thank you.

Roy, are you proud? Yeah, of course. I'm proud of all my kids, yeah. Good stuff. Do you like it? It must have been a good question. Do you like it? I like the original, yeah, beautiful. I like the cinnamon. That is so nice. Oh, I actually like it. What's your most popular one? Do you know, shockingly, the cinnamon one. Is it? Yeah. See, I think...

Children like the chocolate one as well because it's like a healthier Cocoa Pops or Nesquik chocolate balls without all the nasties. But yeah, the cinnamon's... I was going to ask you, so when Cara's going through all that and you're seeing what she's going through, you must have been worried yourself. Of course, yeah. Because she's obviously taken it upon herself to find something. What was it like for you? Not easy, but you try and help them and support them and...

Your mother was more hands-on than me, maybe. Yeah. Oh, she's amazing. You have to be honest. I had a feeling. Your mum is amazing. Oh, she is. Your dad's nice too, but your mum's not. Yeah, yeah. Oh, no. And even this last week, we've been in the Whole Foods in Kensington and me and mum were just at the front of Kensington like,

giving out cereal but she helps with everything so yeah I'm very lucky that's so lovely are you going to do more I was at home by myself wasn't I going downhill fast wasting away I know living on bananas do you know what we did get I had a missed call and I was saying oh god you know what's happening here and he's like how can I reheat this stew it's 3 I thought it was an emergency he was like how do I reheat this stew I was like oh my god yeah

You actually, when he leaves the house, you can't cook, can you? No, I survive. I survive, but I miss him when they're away. Yeah, and you like your breakfast and things. You go out for a bit of food. A little routine, yeah.

Yeah, that's good stuff. That's great stuff. That's really good. Are you going to do more food? I would love to. And hopefully do more cereal flavours, but I'd love to do a no-nut-nut butter for anyone with allergies so they can reach for it. And, yeah, just take away the worry of people reaching for food and having that anxiety about ingredients. Because I know I definitely feel that. So, yeah, just hopefully people can just think they can reach for it. You know what you're teaching then? You...

Can you sort of try and educate the kids on this type of thing? Is that part of, like, the curriculum? I'd love to. I feel like that should be a big thing in schools, just, you know, what to be, you know, fueling your body with. Because, yeah, I think that's something that definitely should be a bigger focus. And, yeah, I'm not teaching at the moment, but I love teaching, and, yeah, this is kind of the sole focus. But hopefully I'd love to go back into it.

But when you started, you asked me, you said, will you support me with a... I was like, yeah, you go for it, girl. Yeah, whatever. Then we started having business meetings, you know. Can I have some money, Daddy? That was all the business meetings. I've got my business line. Don't worry. They were really strong. I just go, yeah, take it, whatever you need. Nice. Well, thanks for the hoodie. Oh, yeah, you're rocking it. It was more than what I thought, you know, to get a company up and running and it's...

It's been hard rock, hasn't it? Oh, do you know what? The ups and downs. It's been such a rollercoaster. And I suppose, like, the highs are really high, but it's more... It definitely is more of the lows. And, like...

Gosh, even with pitching, oh, my gosh. Like, last year, I'd be pitching to Whole Foods, and I had, like, an empty box at that time, but you just kind of put yourself out there. I was like, oh, my God, when I think back, I'm like, what was I doing? But, no, the feedback's been incredible, so I just need to remember, like, you know, hopefully this will be helpful to a lot of children and adults out there. So what shops are these in now, then? So Selfridges, um...

and Whole Foods and Planet Organic. So, yeah, those at the moment and some more kind of coming up soon. So, yeah, it's exciting. Did he make you pitch to him? Did you have to pitch it? No, you've done a few kind of presentations. Yeah. Genuinely, yeah. Yeah, like practice. Yeah, practice, yeah. Yeah, it's like a bit of a plan, yeah.

That's really good, that is, because no-one's going to be that stone-faced. No, no, no, seriously, can you imagine pitching in front of him? That's quite intimidating. If you can do him, you can do anyone. It is. Everyone sees him. Everyone sees him as he is, obviously, here on camera. But what's he like at home? Oh, God. Come on! Here we go! Come on! Do you know what? He is, like, the most supportive person...

He definitely loves his routine. Like, if that is off-kilter, we know about it. Like, if there's a delivery coming that he's not kind of aware of... But Amazon... Oh, my God. The poor Amazon delivery man. You would not believe how much we get delivered to our house. It's... Closed. No, but...

But, oh, no, he is great. Yeah. You have been funny moments, Jamie. We are. Yeah. So it's good, though. It's been a good drive up to this point. Yeah, it's been so good, yeah. What's the next step? What's next? Getting you to invest. Can we all invest? Oh, my God, get on board. I will. I will.

I'll be like, you know the woman that gives the nectarine because that's all she's got. So I'll give more than these. No. We'll have our little ones in the cafe. Oh, yes. We'll do a little collab. Yeah. We could do that. Various hotels. There we go. Yes. Oh, my gosh. I know. Yes. Matrix. Yeah.

Definitely. I hope you liked it. It was so nice. Chocolate one's the best. Chocolate one's the best. You have to go now. I know, I got some... Yeah. Thank you. Brilliant, Cara. Thank you, Cara. This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Skybest.

Your old or broken phone can let you down when you need it most. Perfect. But at Verizon, trade in any old phone from our top brands and get the most for it. Up to $2,000 in value for an amazing new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence and a new line on MyPlan. And iPad and Apple Watch Series 10. That's like a three for one. And you can get it on any plan. At Verizon, trade in your old phone for a brand new iPhone 16 Pro, iPad, and Apple Watch. The other guys won't give you that. Visit Verizon.com today.

Additional terms apply. Service plan required for Apple Watch and iPad. Up to $2,000 value based on iPhone, iPad, and Apple Watch. If you're a parent or share a fridge with someone, Instacart is about to make grocery shopping so much easier. Because with family carts, you can share a cart with your partner and each add the items you want. Since between the two of you, odds are you'll both remember everything you need.

And this way, you'll never have to eat milkless cereal again. So, minimize the stress of the weekly shop with Family Carts. Download the Instacart app and get delivery in as fast as 30 minutes. Plus, enjoy $0 delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees apply for three orders in 14 days. Excludes restaurants.

Worried about what ingredients are hiding in your groceries? Let us take the guesswork out. We're Thrive Market, the online grocery store with the highest quality standards in the industry. We restrict 1,000 plus ingredients, so you can trust that you'll only find the best high-quality organic and sustainable brands all free of the junk. With savings up to 30% off and fast carbon neutral shipping, you get top trusted groceries at your door.

And you can stop worrying about what your kids get their hands on. Start shopping at thrivemarket.com slash podcast for 30% off your first order and a free gift. I never used to talk to anyone before the game. Like my own family. You open the paper and it's rugby's on its knees. You're like, is it? It was the most hated man in Wales. If I've got something to say, I'll say it.

What's the worst injury you've all had? I broke my nose in New Zealand. Broke it on Saturday and played on the Wednesday. Breaking your nose is the worst thing ever. You can't not play. I had 14 stitches down the front there. I said, I don't need anaesthetic, just do it. And they're like, legend. You're hard-ass, mate, hard-ass. Are we excited? Oh, yeah. Vicious rumour is we're recording a podcast called Stick to... Rugby. Stick to Rugby, that's it, not football. Not football.

I couldn't think of a better group of old men that I'd like to hang out with. A brand new podcast that dives into the game we love like never before. Stick to rugby. We'll talk rugby, but not the usual chat. Mike Johnson, hard as ****. Get out of it. We'll cover the big talking points, but we'll share the great stories too. I lost once to Scotland, it was the worst day of my life. And then I appeared on the front page of the News of World of Folling Week. LAUGHTER

Look at Flats there, holding a ball. He won man of the match once and didn't touch the ball. Big opinions. The number of people playing rugby is going down and down, and that needs to change. And some wicked guests. You need to widen the audience a bit. Who have you got in your phone book? Jude Law, Ray Winston, Daniel Craig, Madonna. And that's a wrap. This is the one rugby podcast you can't miss. Make sure you subscribe to Stick to Rugby, brought to you by Defender. So, where are we going?

From serial to... International football, no. We know we're going to Trent Alexander-Arnold. And the noise that's coming out, I don't know where the noise is coming from, but it looks like there's a bit of, I suppose, traction building around him going to Real Madrid. I mean, it's been going for a bit, but it feels like it's getting quite serious this week. Yeah, but I always think this international break, when you think about it, everything stops at football. I think it probably is a time when every club are getting a...

you know, the things in order, Andy, for the summer. You know, speaking to agents, who's coming, who's going. So it was always going to blow up at some stage with this. Uh,

The right time? The right time to blow up? Feels like he's been dropped in and it's all... I'm amazed a player like Trent and his top players haven't already agreed with a club. You probably haven't even... Do you reckon it's all done and already signed? This feels like the first step of sort of getting probably Liverpool fans used to the fact that he's probably going to leave. It's almost like a...

Well, you're thinking, probably... No, but I was going to say, it probably feels like it's a... Right. Yeah, I mean, when you look at it, people say the reaction, and people always look at social media now, but it's like, social media's that toxic and that...

you know, oh, he shouldn't play for the club again or Slott shouldn't play him or things like that. No, what I'm saying is that's not... People use that now as the barometer of like, oh, the fans... But it's just a mad place, isn't it? It's not what... But you know, in other sports, a lot of players and managers make announcements in loads of other sports that they're leaving at the end of the season. It happens, loads of sports. What club did they last year? Yeah, but soccer teams, when the players' contracts... Obviously, I know there's more to it, he's a local. I get all that a little bit, but...

What is the big issue? Why would you want to hold that against him? I think when you look at... His brother's getting a bit as well, apparently. Who is? Trent's brother. He's his agent, isn't he? So that's going to be... Yeah, yeah. But the way I'm at with it is...

It seems like people have... There's not one thing people are sort of really... It's like someone's... Because it's on a free or he hasn't come out and told the club earlier or, you know, when they put the bid in Real Madrid. You know, people are sort of angry at maybe, say, three or four different things. I'm not angry about this thing about him going on a free. Really. I mean, in an ideal way, Liverpool get £70 million, £80 million, they can go and reinvest, but...

I always feel that you can't have it both ways as a supporter because if Liverpool sign someone on a free in the summer we'd all be delighted does that mean his former club should absolutely hate him and I always think as well when you're a local player you don't cost anything so Trent Alexander-Arnold going on a free is like Virgil van Dijk leaving for 75 million Virgil van Dijk we'd still break even so I'm not angry with him going on a free transfer would love money to replace him if he moves on

Where I'm at is that I just think as a local player and a Liverpool fan, Liverpool are in a position, they have been the last five or six years, where they're competing for the league and the European Cup every year. So if you're a Liverpool fan and a local player, I'm just disappointed that he doesn't think this is it. In terms of like, you could... I'm putting myself in his position where I'd be thinking we could go level with United here in the leagues. I've got another seven or eight years left at Liverpool. I want to get up to three or four.

ahead of them can we get another couple of European Cups you know because I said to you before we always talk about rivalries and Liverpool's rivalry is United or Everton or whatever we never think of rivalry as like European in some ways and in some ways Real Madrid is a rival now no one's ever going to catch Real Madrid in terms of European Cups they are the biggest team most famous team the biggest club in the world

But I'd be thinking, I'm desperate for Liverpool to get second on that list. AC Milan are on seven European Cups. Liverpool are on, Jesus Christ, I forgot that. Liverpool are on six, aren't they? Six. If I was them, I'd be thinking, we've got a great opportunity, going to win the league probably this year. Could do this, could do that. And at the end of his time, put Liverpool in a position. But that's just me. I'm disappointed as a Liverpool fan. That's the only thing I look at with it. I'm thinking, you know, Stevie didn't have that. Why do you think he's leaving?

I think Trent is a player who definitely looks at himself almost like a brand. And I think that's not just him. I think a lot of players do now. And I go back to an interview he gave on Sky before Christmas and he said something that didn't go down particularly well with Liverpool supporters. But he was asked, he was given sort of five options. Which would you pick as the most important one for you? Be the captain of Liverpool...

win the Champions League with Liverpool, win the World Cup with England, or win the Ballon d'Or. And he chose the Ballon d'Or. And I was like, wow. You know, OK, well, you know, he wanted to be the first full-back that won the Ballon d'Or. So, OK, Maldini's never won the Ballon d'Or, and no full-back. So there's nothing wrong with having ambition and wanting to be the best you can be.

But that didn't go down particularly well because... But can't you look at that and say he wants to do so well for himself? If he wins the Ballon d'Or, his team's probably going to be winning. Yeah. Or the other way around. He could say, I'd like to win something like...

some of them big prizes that we mentioned and then you get the individual rewards on the back of it not the other way around right? Yeah but this is what people are not used to in respects of somebody having that kind of Isn't he lucky though a little bit over the next few months because the Liverpool look they have the league wrapped up imagine if it was tight in the league and he was playing and he was making the odd mistake I think that's where the trouble could be in the last month or two Well that's where it kicked off wasn't it when the Man United game and the reason it kicked off there was because of

Raymond, you put it in. That weekend, wasn't it? That's where people think I've, you know, people this season maybe think Toto has a problem with Salah or Trent. If you actually look at what I've said, my problem has been don't think about yourself when the team are going for the league. Now, we've been players. You have things with contracts and clubs. I never move. But, you know, things go on and clubs are not always angels. We all know that.

But my big thing has always been, don't put yourself before the team or the club this season. This is too important. Slot's first season, going for the league. You think he has done? No, my point being, where I was upset with Trent then was about Raymond Jib putting a bit in. It's like...

everyone knows Liverpool aren't going to sell them now they're going for the league we all know that let's not pretend and just have this big dance about oh Raymour did offer you 20 million you went for free yeah but we offered you 20 million Trentoners people would have known Raymour did have put a bid in they don't put the bid in so my thing was a bit like stop all the nonsense

If you want to go for free, fine, I've got no problem with that. I'm just disappointed because Liverpool are in a great position in terms of being successful in the future. Michael Owen didn't have that. Stevie never had that. Matt Mannerman never had the situation Liverpool are with. They're seeing almost like, let's say, the best team. Yeah. Like this second. And I have been, along with City in the last few years, we've been always like,

desperate to be winning what yous were winning all the leagues. So you'd understand, McManaman never played in the Champions League before or Michael Owen, you know, are we ever going to win the league? What about anything to do with FSG and the fact that they let it get to a place where it's like... Because that's what...

You have to think she's a freak. No, please. No, no, no. I've explained this. I've explained this. Stop it. I've explained this a million times. I've explained this a million times. Liverpool are the only club that are allowed to run a player's contract down to zero, but they're still doing okay. Three. He's explained it, so we're all right. Because from Liverpool, he's explained it. Three of the best players in the world. Three of the best players in the world have got contracts running out, but Liverpool have still done a great job managing that. I'm sorry, I can't accept that. Okay.

So let me explain it. So in a normal circumstance, in a normal circumstance, yes, I get it. The hierarchy at Liverpool, who were a big part of Jürgen Klopp, being really successful, Jürgen Klopp, one more stuff, got more power, those people moved away. The last summer of Jürgen Klopp, do you know who Liverpool's sporting director was?

I have a clue. So when you're doing all this for the cameras and you'll go, you vibe, you haven't actually got a clue. It was Jürgen Klopp's mate. Basically, my point being is, there was a vacuum. You haven't got a clue, you son of a bitch. There was a vacuum. No, no, no. Listen, you've done your face. That'll go on, make it go big.

So what you've got is... Let's get back to the beautiful energy. So basically, Jurgen Klopp has got that much power. Everybody has left. Michael Edwards, not just Michael Edwards, everybody has left. The guy who comes after him, who was Michael Edwards' number two, was in the job for six months and walked away. So what is that telling you what's going on at the top end of the club? That basically there's a vacuum there.

They needed to bring a guy in from Germany who did the job in Germany for a lot of... What are you shaking it at?

Middle range Klopp's agent knew him. He's out of work. He's not a sporting agent. He basically came in for the summer for Liverpool to sign the players that they signed. So the players then are in a situation... And don't forget, Klopp's then, a few months later, announces he's leaving. So the players... Number one, I think the older players, Van Dijk and Salah, probably would have been left because they were getting older anyway. But the Trent situation, he's definitely...

as we all would, he's used that situation to his own advantage where, how can I sign? Don't know what the new manager's like, how successful are you going to be in the future? So I get that. He has to use it. So when we're talking about the actual club, Michael Edwards and Richard Hughes and the people who are there now, they've been sort of left that. Do you understand what I mean? I'm not going to go to the current people who are there now.

I'm having a go at the club over the last three years, not seeing three of the best players in Europe and in the world being signed up. You could have been the tea lady, the kit man at Liverpool, and made the decision to keep those three players and give them a contract. You didn't have to be a sporting director. So what I'm saying is, when you've got players who are 33, 34, did the club come to us with three years to go or two years to go? No, they didn't. We all know they didn't. So Trent Alexander-Arnold will have been spoken about with the contract. There's no way FSG said, we're 12 months to go, should we go? He's used the situation to his own advantage and said,

I'm not signing him. I don't know how successful the club's going to be. What's the new manager going to be? And he's used that to his advantage. And Liverpool find themselves in this situation. You've been a young player at a club that's come through the ranks. You're also not usually treated as well as you should be on contracts. And to be fair, there's probably going to be a lot of that going on as well, I suspect, with Trent.

Listen, we've all been in that situation. You talk about them getting older, but that's different to when we played, wasn't it? Usually people are thinking about retirement when they're 30. These modern lads will be fine for the next two. I know you still have to negotiate, of course. Roy, your contract run down at United. You were one of the first ones. In fact, the only one I ever remember. Yeah, but again, sorry, but that was accidentally. No, I'd done my cruise ship. Exactly, so I'm going to make the point. So when the club could, of when you first did your cruise ship, they could have come to you and offered you a healthy contract at that point and probably got you cheaper.

through believing at that point 100% right so what I'm saying to you the club I reckon probably a couple of years ago it might have been the time where Van Dijk was probably going through that patch where he looked a little bit like he might be just teetering a little bit there was a point I can't remember when it was you'll know more than me and Salah thought well maybe so they've looked at him and thought yeah we'll wait with you

And the players are probably holding that against them a little bit now. I think, hang on a minute, when you could have come to me 18 months ago... That's a gambler's backfire, definitely. Yeah, and I think with Trent, it's unforgivable. I mean, let's be clear, whether you're going through a turbulence in the ballroom or not, if you're the owner of the club and you look at Trent two years ago, even if you've got disruption in your sporting department, you're looking at it and thinking, we've got to sign him up, he's one of our own. But over the last 12 to 24 months, over the last 12, all the power then is with the player. Absolutely. So this thing about people criticising, and I've said this before, not just about Liverpool,

People say, oh, you can't let him go on a free... If a player wants to leave on a free transfer, nobody can stop him. You can't.

For a transfer to happen, this thing, if he doesn't sign, we'll sell him. So, will Liverpool really going to sell Trent Alexander-Arnold this summer and just sell him? Real Madrid might even want to them if it was going to cost them £60-70 million. And a new manager's going to come in and he's got to fill that right-back position. There was no way in the way Liverpool this summer were going to say, if you don't sign, we'll sell you. Cara, take us back through Trent then. Let's focus on Trent. What was the length of this contract that Trent signed when he signed it? Well, this was interesting. I saw this on social media. I don't know too much about it, but there was a...

People are saying that, not Trent engineered this, but when he signed a contract, Alisson signed a six-year one, someone else signed a five-year one, it may have been Andy Robertson or somebody else, and Trent in the same summer, I think, signed a four-year deal. And it was just Liverpool fans looking at it thinking, listen, why has he signed a four-year deal but they've signed longer? You put yourself in a position when you're 26, right?

You can leave on it almost like that's the actual... And good luck to him. That's probably clever for him. We hammered Harry Kane, if you remember, for signing that seven-year, eight-year deal and he couldn't get out of Spurs to get to Sinc, could he? You remember? Yeah. And we said that was naive. To be fair, Trent signed a four-year deal. I think he used to sign four-year deals because we always used to sign five and sixes. I remember at the time, we were always locked in, me, Scolzi. The longest one I signed a year was when I was 29. I signed a five-year deal. Oh, OK. That's good to get a five-year deal with a 29, isn't it? Yeah, but I was doing OK, Jill, you know what I mean?

No, but usually it's 30. Of course, that's why Trent, when you're a bit younger, you don't want the five, six-year deal. You want, obviously, a bit shorter. But as you get a bit older, obviously, you want a bit more security. He's planned it well for it to coincide with him being 26. I'm sure he didn't plan for the management side of Liverpool to be in disarray at that time. But he's in a position now where... I think... And it's not easy, actually. It's easy sitting there going, it's not easy because when you're playing and you're getting...

offered loads of money by the club I'm sure they have offered him stuff and then you know there is that you could break your leg tomorrow you could get a bad injury so it's not easy does he feel underappreciated I'm not saying by Liverpool I don't think you could say that because to be fair Jurgen Klopp always played him and to be fair when we were questioning his defending at times he still continued to play and he actually changed the system at one point to put him into midfield and stuff like that or change the way of playing him but does he feel underappreciated in this country

Because people do slate his defending a lot. We've all been there. The League Cup final against Newcastle, I think they really missed him. They did. In the attacks and stuff like that. Obviously, we all talk about his defensive, but maybe he does. Does he go down as a hero at Liverpool? Does he get a good send-off? When you say underappreciated...

I don't think we've ever spoke about a full-back more than him. No, but I tell you what, it's not always been positive, though, let's be clear. So was that wrong? No, but when we talk about... You've been one of the biggest ones. Were you wrong to say that? No, I said I thought he had to get more serious about his defending. I've said that constantly or else it'll cause him a problem. I think it'll cause him a problem at Real Madrid because Valverde, who's playing right-back currently in Carvajal when he's back...

he's got some serious competition people underestimate what good defenders they are they are brilliant players by the way everyone thinks you've got Real Madrid and Tottenham he's going to find it tough there do you think they're better players than him I think Carvajal to be honest with you from a balance of going forward and back the problem is his age he's 32 years of age and he's had a bad injury I think Carvajal for me is an all round better full back than Trent because of what he gives to the team I think he's unbelievable

I think Valverde, what he's doing at the moment, it's unbelievable what he's doing for Real Madrid. So he's got some competition there when he goes, but coming back to Trent, I've said he needed to get more serious about his defending. That was proven by the fact he couldn't get in the England team for many, many years. And he's, to be fair, he gets subbed for Liverpool a lot. I've never known a right-back get subbed as many times in important periods of the matches at the end. I've never known that. So he has got his challenges, Trent, with the way he plays. But, but,

I think it's right that Liverpool fans can feel let down about him leaving. I do think that's right because as a fan, as a local kid, fans have a right to feel that way. But I also, thinking about it with my David Beckham hat on, thinking about what career Beck's had when he went to Madrid and then he went to play for Milan and he had the experiences that have led to what he's done since. He wouldn't have had that if he'd have stayed at United. So part of me thinks, since I've finished playing football...

I feel differently about it. That experience of going to Madrid and having played there is incredible for him. And would he regret it if he didn't take it? He may. I know you were obviously so loyal to United, but do you look back and think, I do regret that a little bit? There's always that balancing act for a player at a big club. You're going, do you stay local or whatever? Is the grass always greener?

But they are amazing experiences for a player. He's going to Real Madrid. He will be competing. He'll be living in a brilliant city. He'll be getting well paid. I think the biggest... Has Drew Billingham had a big impact on that, do you think? The mate on that? He's probably chatting to me, of course. But the biggest compliment we can give Trent is we're all sitting here talking about going to Real Madrid. Not one of us has said...

like we're amazed he's going to Real Madrid we're thinking yeah he can go there and hold his own at Real Madrid there's bits of his game he'd still want to improve but you could say that for every player on the planet I'd love to watch him play so that's the biggest compliment we're not saying what he's going to Real Madrid Real Madrid are taking him I know I gave him a bit of a stick a few months ago but what we'll learn I'd love to watch him play what we'll learn very quickly with him at Real Madrid is that when he gets there he'll realise the levels because then like you say if the defending is something that we all know that it's one of his weakest points if that's the case he won't play there

You know, whatever we're saying here, it just won't happen because if you look at Valverde in respect of his passing range and what he can do, Carvajal and his defending and what he can do, you don't need to actually have a player who's there who can do great stuff going forward. Right, you're right. Because like Tuchelmany goes back to centre-back, Kamovic goes to left-back. You play these players that literally have got, they're just great energy. Are you saying he won't play? No. I'm saying that, no, no, no. If he goes, can I just say, Gareth? He'll play well.

This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Skybest. This is a PSA, or Public Sock Announcement. Experts have declared Bombas socks as the best way to warm up chilly feet. These pairs are super cushy, soft, and designed for maximum coziness. Plus, for every pair purchased, another pair will be donated, so someone in need of essential clothing can stay warm this winter.

They say opposites attract. That's right.

That's why the Sleep Number Smart Bed is the best bed for couples. You can each choose what's right for you, whenever you like. You like a bed that feels firm, but they want soft? Sleep Number does that. You want to sleep cooler, while they like to feel warm? Sleep Number does that too. Why choose a Sleep Number Smart Bed? So you can choose your ideal comfort on either side. Sleep Number Smart Beds start at $999.

Prices higher in Alaska and Hawaii. Exclusively at a Sleep Number store near you. See store or sleepnumber.com for details.

If you want to know more about the game's greatest characters, matches that changed football forever and the stories behind the bribes, the bans and the on-pitch battles, listen to It Was What It Was. It's the Overlaps Football History podcast presented by two of the world's best football journalists, Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper. Each week we dive deep into the key moments in football history that have shaped the game as we know it.

From notorious managers to pivotal matches, we go behind the scenes to bring you the best tales the game has to tell. Stories including one of football's most infamous match fixes, its first global superstar, or the rise and fall of Sir Al Francis England. Join us at Football University. Take a journey through football's amazing history. Subscribe to It Was What It Was Now. I didn't ever listen to you when you come back with, obviously, the Valencia stuff, and you spoke to me about...

how tough some of these away games are. I think sometimes there's a feeling in this country that Real Madrid...

in La Liga I know they win the league or they go second every year that they just go to these away games and win four or five it doesn't happen so this idea that Trent's going to not be asked questions defensively like he is in the Premier League it's like honestly this is a top league and also remember you'd expect to win the Champions League every season if you go to Bayern Munich in a quarter final and let your team down with a couple of goals the heat's going to be on you know that type of thing but I would have loved to have seen him play in a few weeks over inside Lederko Madrid

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

playing it toughly at Real Madrid and all his family we're sitting here questioning his defensive abilities and what will happen he'll be thinking that as well but that's a new challenge for him I admire players I go listen if I was sitting with a player now and he's a champ I'd be like and I had these opportunities I'd be saying go for it but the thing about Liverpool supporters being disappointed

Right now, as you said, you can get all that. But, as I said, the disappointment thing for me is, like, everything's there. If you're a Liverpool fan, if you're a Liverpool player, to, like, go on. But I've got no... OK, he wants to do something different. But what I don't hope happens is that this resentment carries on in terms of, like, oh, we hope he doesn't do that at Real Madrid. Because I love...

people from my own city doing well and to see someone playing for like they are the biggest club in the world so I'm disappointed from a Liverpool point of view but once he's gone I wouldn't want it to be like oh I hope he has a nightmare I hope he does this I'd love it if he's a bad game over the next few months Jamie that would be my issue with Liverpool fans turning him very very we always talk about Liverpool fans having a bit of class with the away teams when they win over the years and they'd have clawed them off or whatever all that type but you'd hate for them to because that game it was against United yeah yeah yeah yeah

They turned on him that day. You could say they turned on most players after having a bad game. Obviously, they're going to get on his back, but you'd hate for it to get a real resentment towards the lad over the next few months. I think they turned on him in that game, Roy, because I think they felt it was almost a... It wasn't so much a poor performance. It looked like a lack of energy and giving it... You remember one of the goals where it was like, oh, he was walking back in. It wasn't so much, oh, he's given a few balls away. It was more a case of actually...

Are you fighting for the league here with those type of things? You haven't already checked out, have you? He looked to me like he was struggling that game. I don't know. I think mentally... There was definitely something. But that's why I never get turned on your own players because you want your team to win, don't you? But there was definitely something that game. And I thought in that moment, if you're a football person, something's not right. Like, get behind him. Like, why then hammer him even more? I want him to go...

and see the levels. I remember listening to Becks when Becks said when he got in the dressing room, he got there early and the first people that came in, one was Ronaldo and then Zidane. That's what I want Trent to realise. Then he realises where he is and then he's got to go somewhere else because this is what this is about.

He wants to go, because Jamie, I hear what you're saying about, you know, being at Liverpool, wanting to beat the United Premier Leagues, wanting to try and catch Real Madrid, but he's thinking, I want to win the Ballon d'Or. The Ballon d'Or. So he has to go in this dressing room and he has to make an impression. And this is what the challenge is for him. And this is why I think he wants it so badly.

I think the bit about underappreciating before about there's definitely an underappreciation of him I think probably from an England perspective because he doesn't play hardly at all he's got good competition because of Kyle Walker he keeps saying this Gary Wright no I'm not trying to argue but what I'm saying is do you think he should play what I'm saying is he's the most talked about fullback we've ever spoke about we rave about him on the board I've got this thing that to be fair you only sometimes realise when their career's finished or when you look back

And I look back at some of the players that England have, to be fair, abused and ruined over a period of 25 years that would have played for every other country that basically win tournaments. When I think about England winning a tournament, which we haven't done for...

70 years whatever it is right we have to have great players on the ball in every single position there's no other country would not play Trent Alexander-Arnold in my opinion now we are a country that have got good right backs let's be clear but we will pick a defensively strong right back and we've probably fuelled that as well around this table over a lad that can pass a ball better than any player you've ever seen at that position so my point is I do feel like and we'll come on to Foden shortly who's another one that I

can see going down the Scholes route of basically now being he doesn't play the same for his club when we're saying all the same things these are players who to be fair should probably be appreciated more than they are they're not and only England can do that only England could do that you've consistently said you've consistently said Kyle Walker should be right back for England

What did we have consistently? I think over the last ten years... I've said we fuel the problem around this table. Who's wrong then? My point is that obviously Gareth wanted to pick Kyle Walker. I think we would probably all pick Kyle Walker around the table but I think England are a country that do abuse players who have got unbelievable talent that other countries would even... They just get them in straight away. What about Glen Odo?

Glenn Hoddle Paul Scholes Paul Scholes was my foreign manager wasn't even an English manager but England team I won't talk about who was the manager at that time the point is we do have a habit of shooting ourselves in the foot with these talented players the new England manager said already he's about having the best team not about the best players exactly he's obviously going to leave out a lot of talented players and then you say about Liverpool fans I think Liverpool fans maybe are a little bit quicker on him than they would be on someone like say Cara or Stevie Gerrard or one of the other lads similarly

No, but my point is, is that, to be fair... Is that maybe his running style? You think the crowds are quicker on Trent than they were on me? No. Cara, my point is, I think there's a greater love towards you, Stevie, Robbie Fowler, than there is towards...

You know this, by the way. Are you denying this? You don't think there's a... Jamie, it's your point. Michael's probably in the same... Michael's in the same sort of sphere as Trent, that basically those two players don't get the same level of love from Liverpool fans. Where are you getting this from? You've said it's come from me. No, Jamie, sorry. Can I just... Are you trying to make out that the lads didn't get to stick when they appreciated them? When you retired me... He's got a big mural outside. Oh, you've all got fucking murals. Fuck it, if you haven't got a mural in Liverpool, you fucking do now.

Honestly. The song for the Scouser in our team, I had to get to 27 before I got a song. My point is, I think... You're talking so long, you don't know. You don't think... I think you've been ignorant there now, because you don't think Liverpool... If I put up

poll up tomorrow of Trent Alexander-Arnold Michael Owen you Stevie Robbie Fowler I know who'd come in the bottom two it'd be Trent Alexander-Arnold and Michael Owen explain to me where you're getting this from you don't live in Liverpool you don't know am I wrong I think you're wrong ok there's nobody let's do a poll no no no no

Do the poll before the Real Madrid stuff started. Let's do that poll before the Real Madrid stuff started. They were at him in January against United. He's been playing for Liverpool for eight years. It is the loyalty. I'm not saying they don't like him. I'm saying there's a little bit less love than there is for you. I'm not saying they don't like him.

You're misreading this. I'm saying... I can assure you, the love for Trent Alexander-Arnold as a player for Liverpool from the age of 18 to 26 was ten times what it was for me from my age of 18 to 26. I can absolutely assure you of that one. OK. Jesus. We all dream of a team like that. I got that when I was 28. We won the European Cup. That's what it took for me. No, that's fine. If he left for big money, the fans wouldn't be so bad. Isn't that a weird kind of concept to look at? Because he's leaving on a free. There's a bit more anger towards him. Fucking hell.

Most hated man in Liverpool knows everything about Liverpool. Go on. I don't think I'm wrong in anything that I've just said. Stick by what you're saying, girl. Coming on to it, at the end of the season, it will leave Liverpool with a huge hole if those three players leave the club on a free. Right? Because they won't have the money that they would get from to be able to replace them. I reckon there's probably minimum...

You could actually, there's probably a quarter of a billion pounds worth of talent in those three. You're talking about the best striker in Europe, you're talking about the best centre-half in Europe, and you're talking about probably one of the best... Surely they'll have players lined up? No, but my point is though, Roy, I'm just saying, even for Liverpool, as good as they've been with recruitment, that is a quarter of a billion pounds of hole with those three players. Now, obviously, they've been good in recruitment, so they could replace them, but that is a hell of a thing for Arne Slott to have to deal with. They're going to have a great time in the next few months...

but there will be a thing of what we're going to do with these three. But is that not exciting with these lads leaving? Brilliant players, but come the summer, Liverpool must have players lined up. They must have deals lined up. I think if they were all staggered leaving one year after another, but to lose three at once... It's huge. Absolutely. Salah's goals. Who comes in, do you think? I mean, listen...

The team they've got there now, they're almost like this mythical sort of people. Even from the support, we've got Michael Edwards back and all this stuff. They should have a lot of money to spend because they haven't spent, basically, in the last couple of years, really. But, I mean...

Gary goes through these spells at this time of the season every season where he has to make himself feel like a Liverpooler on the down where you know Klopp's gone you should have seen him when we were skiing when Klopp had gone oh my god when Klopp had gone he was crying the Paraguayans were crying on the slopes he was like he was like he was in trouble

I did a black slope that day he bought a big Don Julio bottle of tequila right they were feeding shots in a bar they were absolutely blathered and they were literally crying the lot of them the right eight of them honestly but he was like I just bumped into him

you's a don't you's a don't you's a don't in Courchevel honestly he's been thinking it for years he can't get his head around now half Liverpool being still this successful and they haven't just spent it under 200 million like man you're right it's the Salah Van Dijk control I know you's a don't you's a necid you's a never come back Salah Van Dijk okay well that's two so narrow it down they have to go and get two yeah two

What about the League Cup? Were you disappointed with that, Liverpool? I thought I won't mention the League Cup. It was a great day for Newcastle. Yeah, I could tell on commentary. Take her to the corner, take her to the corner. What are you doing? Fucking hell, honestly. Good job I was at the side of the pitch because I had to fucking punch you. What are they doing? Take her to the corner, take her to the corner. What's he doing? Get her to the corner. He's on commentary. He's going... Honestly. Take her to the corner. What are they doing? What are they doing?

what are they doing what else did you see I've never felt a cheek like that before it was unbelievable the atmosphere was brilliant Newcastle fans to be fair you knew on the day that apart from if you were a Liverpool fan it was a pretty special day I think everyone in the country felt good about that Newcastle won a trophy for 17 years in this country it was unbelievable it was the same as West Ham winning that conference it was a slight exaggeration for everyone in the country but

Sorry. The fans up behind us there to the left, Newcastle, honestly, if you just see their face, they're screaming, their veins in their necks are pulling. It's like they've never felt like that in their lives. People have said about this season, you know, sometimes people start saying, oh, the league's not that good or it's not being this or different things. But, you know, if you started the season, you probably said, what do you want? We wanted a different winner, didn't we? The City, something different. Yeah.

just not this one no but you want you want clubs who haven't if you just said Newcastle are going to win 70 years and I think the FA Cups in a situation where like I know you'll think we're having a go at City but if City don't win it I think there's three or four clubs who've never won the FA Cup before and then you've got Villa Villa haven't won a trophy I think for 30 years so what I'm saying is if you could have a you'd have a

A different Premier League winner and then you'd have the two domestic cups are won by teams who've not... Like it used to be. Football's the winner. Yes, no, but it is. It's like... Football's the winner. I say that all the time. Teams go too long without winning things. It's not good for the game. Who do you think will win it? Who do you think? Like Bournemouth. I'd love a Bournemouth or a Fulham. I want Villa to win it. I'd like... I want Villa to win the trophy. For who I am, it's such a good shot. I want Villa to win the trophy. To take City on, you're probably going to have to be a Villa. I mean, I can't...

But City have got Bournemouth away at the week. That's a difficult one. Are you doing that? Where are you at weekend? Bournemouth. Oh, that's a long trip together. Oh, no. I'll meet you down there. Road trips? You use all his work. Make a few quid out of that. It's a brand. Right, he's got his contract. He's got to walk with me. We're like Ant and Dec.

I did see something though, seeing, because obviously the fixtures resumed, weren't they, on the Wednesday and they were like, will the rest people? I'm like, how can you talk about resting people for the FA Cup? I know obviously Forrest are going for Champions League and stuff, but your legacy when you finish, it's not qualified for Champions League in 2006, it's you won the FA Cup. It's a bit of a pull-up.

Everton coming up is that next week next week well that's a good game for Liverpool to get back up and running good atmosphere good night game good you'd think it'd be great after the last game yeah it's just it's just it'd be bonking just a farewell trip for Van Dijk Salah and Trent just enjoy it that'd be a tough one that'd be a tough game Everton have kind of like yeah Moisey's done brilliant hasn't he

I made up with David Moyes going back to heaven he feels like it is Claude but just you know he's new stadium for Everton next year yeah yeah it looks amazing does it yeah it's cool I mean I think Liverpool will win next Wednesday and they absolutely will win the league but but just let it go let it go if Everton were to win it won't happen I don't know

Oh, you're right. Hang on. I think Liverpool are going to win the league. Relax. And I think you'll win it well and it'll be an unbelievable achievement. OK, you've given him enough. Would there be a bit of a... Of course. Of course. This keeps him going. I think Everton might do something. I'm trying to. You've got to think that Everton are going to do something. This episode of Stick to Football is brought to you by Skybest.

We're going to do a little bit on Thomas Tuchel's England. You two were there in midweek. I'm going to ask a simple question. His first games, who were the winners and who were the losers in terms of the players? Who were the winners and who were the losers? Obviously the big plus tonight was James, you think? James, do you want to build it? The fullback?

Yeah, I think Mars was a great kick. Yeah, of course. The two full-backs done well, yeah. I didn't see anything too different, but that's because the games were easy. That's the problem for indoor group games. Serbia might be obviously a tough game, but the games are going to be like that. They're going to be dead easy. But he

Even the friendlies have got lined up. I think when they... I'm not playing no disrespect, but Wales in a friendly. I think we need to be playing against the Germany, the Spain. Even then, it's a friendly, Gillis. I know, but I'll go back. When we won the Euros, not to mention it, but...

that year don't mention it it's massive is that when you swore yeah yeah but like we played against top opposition that year and like you beat say the likes of Germany and then you go into the tournament you've got the belief you're like girls let's just go and do what we did a month ago you need to be tested and remember this new manager's come in on the back of England getting

to a final of a tournament he's not come in where he's going to be disarrayed he's just about he's got to tweak things over the next obviously year and a half and his first tough game would be a knuckle game at the World Cup did the centre-backs worry you a little bit in the centre-backs I know they didn't concede a goal but it was a bit scabby at times that can happen when you're playing lesser teams you can I think that's that concentration level isn't it if you pick for Dussault that's exactly right I think it's just

Because I think you could look at someone like Konsa and Mark Gahee, I'd be quite confident with them two. Yeah, I don't know, I'm not sure. You know what I mean? I think Gahee, the way he can play... I like him, yeah. I mean, I think that if it came down to it and them two had to play, I wouldn't be like, oh no, what are we going to do? I had defence...

especially if like we say Miles Lewis he's playing on the left he inverts it looks kind of solid against top opposition we'll have to see yeah but we'll have to see because what else we got do you think it's harsh leaving Foden out no

The Fordham one frustrates us so much. He's not an out-and-out winger. Can I just say, at City, at City though, only English people ask that about these players. Where would you play him? Oh,

Oh my God. Oh no, stop saying oh my God for Tinkerton. What I'm saying to you is... Where would you put him? No, what I'm saying to you is... He's played every position for England. He hasn't done it. We all love him. He's amazing for Man City. He hasn't done it for England. Stop saying oh my God every time I speak. We treat him like a used car. He's not a used car. He hasn't done enough for England. He got picked ahead of Saka.

before Saka he was in the England team before Saka he was in the England team before Bellingham those two grabbed their chance and took it and there's no way they're getting left out so tell me where he's playing you're the England manager you've been on the coaching staff tell me where he's playing what happens with players like Phil Foden is because they're more flexible and a bit more versatile because Bellingham

Bellingham has to play where he plays. How can he be a flexible guy when he can't, he's not doing it for England? He hasn't done it for England. How can he be more flexible? What I'm saying is because he basically is flexible, he does get moved around. You play him number 10, then you play him left wing, then you play him right wing and you move him around. It happens with players like that. He's lucky they're moving him around because if he'd been just judged in one position, he wouldn't play or have as many caps. We all love Phil Fogarty. Phil Fogarty's a brilliant player. You can't play him in 10 for England in front of two. Yeah, but he,

That's why I'm asking him. If you're playing three in midfield, you could play with Foden and Bellingham. Why could against Latvia or whoever they're playing the other day, before that, why could not play Bellingham and Foden in there?

He could have done with the manager something different. You've asked me where I would play him. I'm saying in those games... A second ten? Yeah, two. It's a normal system. It's 4-3-3. I'm not coming up with a system here that's wild. It's two players in front of the deck on the right. Don't say 2-10. It's two number eights or tens, whatever you want to call it. Why can't Foden and Bellingham play here?

David Silva in De Bruyne did it for years at City. No one said, and Fernandinho was behind him, no one said, oh, they're shit. That's a bad system. We're open. So would you play that in a big game in a tournament, would you? Oh, you just said to me where I'd play him. I've told you where I'd play him. Yeah, but Gal, what's he done in, like, we're talking about 20 games. When he gets to run a game in a 10, he's a great player. He's not playing for City at

People like Morgan Stibbs-White is waiting for an opportunity. Even Morgan from... Morgan Rogers. Morgan Rogers. I think I would want to try them in that position. If we demean and rubbish Phil Foden into someone that basically is in the same level as the players that you just mentioned, I think that's where we're going with this. No, no, no. It's about Gary. We're not picking the best players. What about Foden?

It's the age-old thing with England. Some players have to be informed to play. Other players will get played irrespective of the club form. So managers with England for the years have been to eight tournaments and I know how they think is that ultimately Harry Kane doesn't matter what he's scored in his last five games for his club he's going to play for England. Fact. Fact.

Shearer didn't score all the way up to the Euros Les was never going to play Fowler was never going to play it's going to be Shearer because he's just Shearer right Foden should be that player for me what are you talking about I agree with him in front of Bellingham in front of South not in front of Bellingham so tell me I just told you where he'd play I just told you where

So he's going to play as a number eight. A position he doesn't even play for Man City. He plays off the front for City quite a lot. He doesn't. He plays wide. He plays wide all the time. He plays lots of different positions. He played off Haaland in the week. Let me finish. You're saying he keeps moving around. He gets moved around for City. He plays on the left. He plays on the right. He plays on the middle. So stop talking about this. He gets moved around. He's lucky he gets moved around. Because in the summer... I haven't stopped talking. In the summer...

basically, Gareth Southgate looked at Foden and was like, he's the best player in the Premier League. I've got to find a place for him. But he's not done enough in an English year better than Saka to play there. He's not done enough more than Bellingham in an English year to play there. So everyone's saying, why are they playing Phil Foden on the left? They're playing him there because they're trying to get him in somewhere. No, no. What do you mean? No, he did. They did. Honestly, look, I believe...

You've been an England coach. You played Eric Dierchold midfield. Who were these fantastic players at the time that you didn't play? And England players didn't play. In the summer, the context of Foden, having been at the tournament and watched him, was that he was playing on the left. He was told to play wide at one point and the next time he was coming inside. However, he had no left back. So basically what happened in the summer, he kept basically playing with Trippier at left back and Trippier kept coming inside and it

he never got any service the balls into him was shit right honestly the context of how you fit him into a team in my opinion I maybe have a higher opinion of Phil Foden than people around this table with City you've got some of the best players in the world to be honest with you so I can see why he sort of gets moved around a bit for City City are a lot better than England by the way let's be clear for him to get in that City team as he does is an absolute feat in itself because of how good they've been for five years winning trebles and all the rest of it

So for England, in my opinion, he is a level with Bellingham. That's where I see it. What? I do think Phil Foden, when I watch him play, he seems like a shy lad, which is fine. Everyone is different. I don't think he's almost got that arrogance on the pitch for England that I see Bellingham have. I think that holds him back a little bit. But this thing about him, he's been tried in every position. I saw England do this with Paul Scholes. We're doing exactly the same with Phil Foden. Can I just say, though, with City... Who should Scholes have played for England then? Pardon? So...

People always say this about him. Do you want me to give you a position for him as well? Paul Scholes has been on this show and sat here. Paul Scholes himself said it. He said, I played there a lot. He said it wasn't a problem. I played there a lot for Man United. I wasn't playing well enough at the time.

That's why Lampard and Gerrard come in. Maybe he's being really humble. He is being humble. Let me just fill you in on Paul Scholes. So when Paul Scholes played with Glenn Hoddle and we played with three at the back, two wing-backs and we played with three in midfield and two up top, Paul Scholes was perfect in that three in midfield. He had three centre-backs behind him. He played his best football for England because he had a position to play in. We played with Sven. We were rigid 4-4-2. Absolute rigid. You know that and that's a fact.

right if we'd have played 4-3-3 right Paul Scholes wouldn't have been the holding player at that point in his career but he would have been one of the ones in front so Stephen Gerrard might have been there Lampard might have been there and Scholes might have been there and that might have been a three in midfield with Scholes in it so that's where he would have played and we abused we abused him for years and ended up retiring him to the point whereby because the system 4-4-2 was rigid and we weren't going to change it if Glenn Hoddle had stayed as manager Paul Scholes would have played 100 times for England okay so

you know this, we always talk about this, the golden, this team of 2004, 2006 and stuff like that. So 4-3-3. Who's the other front three? Who's the front three? Oh my goodness gracious. I just want to know, guys. So is David Beckham, so if you're playing 4-3-3, is David Beckham a right winger? I've given you my, I've given you my system. So Wayne Rooney, who was the player of the tournament in 2004, is he going on the left or does Michael Owen go on the left? I've given you my system before, Cara. Cara, I've given you my system before. Well tell me who's going on the left wing. Okay.

Karen do you want me to go back through with this now you'll tell me so you're taking Wayne Rooney out of the middle I'm not taking Wayne out of the middle do you want me to give you the team yes please so you put Mike Lowe on the left you're the goal scorer I can't have Mike Lowe on the left I can't I can't right I'll give you the team go on give us the team right it's Owen and Rooney up front it's Gerrard, Scholes and Lampard in midfield it's

it's Ashley Cole at left wing back it's David Beckham at right wing back and then you've got Saul Campbell John Terry and Rio Ferdinand that's the team I would have picked and maybe I might have suffered I might have gone in on the odd time as right centre back instead of one of those three lads to go out behind Becks the reality is that's the system we should have played with that squad because we had the two best players up front we had the three best players in midfield and we had three unbelievable centre backs and we had good wing backs we had unbelievable he's gone fucking quiet hasn't he because he knows that's right he just said 43 before that

You said about Scholes and Ericsson. I'm just talking about Foden and Bellingham now, not talking about the system for the goal generation to get Scholes. Can I be honest? That team you just put out there. Not a bad team, is it? Great team. Glenn Odden's team. I think so. I'm not sure. That team? No goalkeeper. Oh, yeah. He didn't bring a goalkeeper. He didn't bring a goalkeeper.

I'm finishing this episode. Who's in goal? Obviously it would be David James or Paul Robinson. Exactly. You're not winning any tournament, do you? Can I just say, I do agree with Gary. I do agree with Gary. I think Foden, in a 10, is one of the best technical players. I agree with him. Two 10s, two 8s, whatever you want to call it. The way City play, everything is operated...

towards the winger coming inside. So that's why he shines in that position. If you're in the eight, you make a corner run when the winger comes inside. You step inside so that the winger comes inside. He's not an out-and-out winger, but I do agree in them two advanced positions. He is technically on the half turn with his three balls. Whatever he's playing, he's not playing well. But he's not a winger. I love Phil Fould. He should still host something on the game. No, no, no. Phil Fould in this season...

He was player of the year last year. We all voted for him as player of the year. City, we know, have dropped off. For City? For City, yeah. And that's unbelievable. That's City playing at their best. City have dropped off this season because players who have been legends there are not the same players. So say like Bernardo Silva, Gundogan, Kevin De Bruyne. I've been waiting for a long time. I go back to when David Silva left. I thought, I've been disappointed with Foden this year. Not because he hasn't played. We all have seasons where he doesn't play as well or different games.

the personality of going this is my team now De Bruyne's leaving in the summer Bernardo Silva it's like this is your year it's like okay the team but I'm going to lift it but I'm the man I'm the guy that's the right that's the field photo we need to see now it's not about playing the best player

players either you've got to get the right team you've got to get the balance right so it's a simple question for you all are you happy that you think Phil Foden shouldn't play for England at this moment in time I don't think he should be in the team at this moment in time so if England were playing tomorrow in the first game of a World Cup Phil Foden wouldn't play is that what you're saying not in the current climate no I'd start him in midfield of course you would I would

I can't wait to look at it. I think he's great, lad. What England team did Gary pick with, Roy? Right, no, seriously, he's gone quiet since. He said, where would you get Scholes into the team and how would you fit in? You said 4-3-3. No, hang on a minute. You said 4-3-3. Slow down. Slow down. I said 4-3-3 for Phil Foden to get in this England team. You asked them about the golden generation, how Scholes would get in. I said that team with the three centre-backs we had, Campbell, Terry and Ferdinand, with Ashley Cole at left wing back, David Beckham at right wing back and then you've got Gerrard, Lampard, Scholes and you've got Owen and Rooney. That's fine.

That, to me, would have been a team that I think would have had a great chance and a better chance of winning the tournament and getting the best out of Scholes. That's what I think. But that's on reflection. I didn't think that at the time, but that's on reflection. Looking back now, I think Glenn Hoddle had it right with the squad that we had. He would have been better off keeping that type of system. That was a great team that you named, to be fair. It's only obvious 20 years later, 15 years later, that that's what we should have done with these players that we had at that time.

We had other good centre-backs like Cara. I could have played right centre-back. There was other players that could have fit into that system. Kieran Dyer was a great right wing-back at that time, by the way. Really good. There was another good left-back behind Ashley Cole. Phil Neville. You say about... And I think it's a little bit arrogant. No, no.

No, I think we always say, if Sven would have done this or this... No, I'm not saying it's arrogant. This idea that we would have won something. On reflection. No, no, no. We wouldn't have won something, but the team... His name near Jamie. I know, but the France team was well better. The Brazil team was better. Yeah, but that team would have been good. Sorry, sorry. Can I just pick you up on a statement he's just said there? He said the France team was a lot better, right? 2004, right, we tore absolute France to shreds for most of the game. Who did you throw them to shreds? Oh.

he wasn't part of our team he was lost there so you know so so so France in 2004 to be honest with you we were the equal of them there's no doubt about that at that time so I don't believe at that time France were a better team than us so that tournament was there for the taking let's be clear we didn't do enough to win we didn't do enough but

it's not arrogance to say I think we could have won that tournament I know when you were in 96 in that tournament we could have done something in that tournament I know what we're playing against I just think sometimes when I hear players who were in the squad at the time they always say they're always blaming the manager and I say sometimes look at yourself as a player there's no blame

No, but I think it's easy. We played against France and Portugal in that tournament in 2004. And in Euro 96, we played against good teams as well. I know we were the equal of the winners of that tournament. We played against Germany, the eventual winners. You were lucky in 96. Against Spain.

0-0 but one on penalties hey lucky I mean a bit of luck thank you of course you're making me better than every team in the tournament right that's the episode of football this week finish off sorry you've got something else to say sorry go on no go on go on James I'll finish off the two good teams we played in the tournament in Euro 2001 France beat us and we didn't beat Portugal and the other teams we played who were they exactly so

So I think this idea that we would have won. I say we've got a great chance of winning. We're playing into two good teams, too, one and lost one. Well done, everybody. Well done.

Your old or broken phone can let you down when you need it most. Perfect. But at Verizon, trade in any old phone from our top brands and get the most for it. Up to $2,000 in value for an amazing new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence and a new line on MyPlan. And iPad and Apple Watch Series 10. That's like a three for one. And you can get it on any plan. At Verizon, trade in your old phone for a brand new iPhone 16 Pro, iPad, and Apple Watch. The other guys won't give you that. Visit Verizon.com today.

Additional terms apply. Service plan required for Apple Watch and iPad. Up to $2,000 value based on iPhone, iPad, and Apple Watch. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever think about switching insurance companies to see if you could save some cash? Progressive makes it easy to see if you could save when you bundle your home and auto policies. Try it at Progressive.com. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states.

Imagine waking up to breathtaking landscapes, vibrant culture, and a welcoming community. New Zealand is calling. If you are a passionate early childhood, primary, or secondary school teacher, New Zealand says, come teach us. With up to 10,000 New Zealand dollars in relocation support, now is the time to make your move. Find out more about moving to New Zealand to teach at workforce.education.govt.nz.

open to existing qualified primary, secondary and ECE teachers. Note that this grant is only dispersed after a teacher has arrived in New Zealand and meets the other accompanying criteria. Thanks for listening and thanks to our partner Skybet. If you want more, please subscribe and you won't miss an episode.