Mike Rowe
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So the current debate over A I artificial intelligence is about whether the technology will become sentient and autonomous and enslave us all. Of course, that will probably happen. But in the meantime, we thought to be interesting revisiting the original debate about AI, which is about how IT affects work, where the rest of is going to do for a living when machines can do IT for us. And there's nobody who thought or deeply about this thing, about work in general, its centrality, humidity that might grow. And we are, as always, honoured to have studios.

Thank you for coming out. First of all, you win the desk. It's what are you kidding? I mean, how old is this? I don't know.

It's iron, wooden and it's actually it's unna the the person you'd this i've asked him to go on IT down because I I like the only right ring in the world who loved Julie, a butterfly hill who lived in a red wood to but I just think trees are really important and I think being rounded by wood brings a residents to your life.

What happened after the hurricane down here because I know I know that was a big deal, and I know you love trees and I know that couldn't been great.

yes, but most of the trees in for our fake trees, actually, they're not real there. I don't think a palm trees is actually tree. I mean, a tree is a White pine, a tree as a sqa, a know all the various hardwoods um oak beach locust locust exactly cuts low summer um anyways sorry.

shop your own wood it'll warn me to .

what yes that's exactly three times can to stack IT and then split IT. So what the A I so like seven years ago， I remember talking to the things about seven years ago about what A I was going to do to working class amErica the truck drivers, the most common job for high educated men um and you are a lot of thoughts about that, but the conversation progressed so dramatically since then. And so is the technology, right? So where are you thinking about?

So there was a time when the big conversation, at least in my lane anyway, was really more about robotics and tech, right? The robots are going to come and you're going to display a lot of blue color jobs. And how do we stop that? How do we think about that? And I remember you and I talked about the rebellion.

Talk about all like and and and the disruption theory in this idea that real replacement is is going to happen IT almost never happens. As I understand IT, i've seen IT in our industry to know there's a lot of talk about you know what was going to happen, when was going to happen to newspapers when film came along, what was going to happen? The film when TV came along was going to have to music and dvds.

And I mean, none of IT really goes away, but IT all shifts at all impact. yes. So I was struck up by the fact that all of a sudden we weren't talking about the impact of robots on blue collar jobs, but the impact of A I on White collar jobs, right? That's what interested me.

which I enjoyed.

Well, I mean, sorry.

am a bad person.

But look, IT is super creepy. I made, I got a link from a body who said, hey, man, not for nothing. But I went on to one of these sites and I said, narrow for me in the style of mike row, these two paragraphs, right? And he sent me a link to this.

And basically, IT was two paragraphs from an old episode of deadly catch. And I had play, and I listened to me. Now, had I not known IT was not me, I would have thought, well, that's something I narrated, you know.

for. Just tell the different.

Couldn't tell what I listen for IT. I heard some things that maybe go maybe maybe not quite, but that was two months ago, which this will be two years ago or twenty years ago. So the speed with which artificial intelligence, something about more law, something fast and faster. And thanks, sorry, faster. So I I part of me wants to say, don't forget the lesson from validate don't feel it's not going to completely up and everything unless IT does and I don't know because this does feel different.

I don't know. I had a motorcar one, the crack in the intake manual that I didn't see and IT made IT obviously run lean, and icons show great, fast and fast and ter and faster, until little this sport put burned a hole through the piston. I used, as is a pen holder on my desk today. But there's something about speed and acceleration that has a natural limit, doesn't IT.

Well, I mean, I dad said, right, do you can stand this close to another person and then disclose half IT and half IT and half IT and never ever stop having IT, which my brain doesn't know understand because this seems like surely, surely you're going to collide and then be on the other side of each other? Yes, it's that doesn't work.

Or at least I was .

sexual counter of the person. But here's how jacked up at this for me. I my entire career is actually based on A, I early on in dirty jobs. There was this big conversation at the network when they were like, look, this show is IT was a nightmare for them because he was writing really, really well, but was off. Perhaps jerrie jobs was not supposed to be the show that people went to discovery to love.

No, IT was that those were still the days of adam, borrow and shock who to and jane all was to this of me a smart under rocks making poop show that's not supposed to be that i'm more no. So they're like, can you smart that up a little bit? And I said, well, i've been looking at some science type jobs and they're like, like what I like well, i'd like to take a deep dive in the A I.

And they're like, that's great. That's great. If you can find dirty jobs in A I.

We were golden. Now they think I was talking about artificial insemination. Probably not. Probably not.

Did you do that? And so four days later.

I was at the circle x range somewhere outside of houston, with my ARM up to my shoulder inside a couple of dozen cows, taking instructions from a cowboy named Steve IT was walking me through the process of artificial insemination. S, I also had a remarkable encounter with a bull called hn.

Sucker commander, and the process whereby the sperm is extracted from this meditation, right? And then put back into these unsuspecting boll vines, giving us basically a Brown pool and an Angus cow. Could you branding s meet? The point is.

did you, without getting specific, did you go through the entire process?

Extraction is, oh, extraction? Oh yeah. no. I gathered. I A starre phone cup. There were probe.

There was insertion into the bull like current stimulated the prostate. The White gold flus is there. I captured as much of IT as I could.

And I put the whole thing on the air a week later, and I got cold to the principles. The question was, you promised us to show on artificial intelligence, and I said, did I then we have a big conversation about science. And the moral of the story is there's more science and artificial examination than there is an AI, or at least as much.

And in a much deeper, much more meaning way, we are so disconnected from our food, were disconnected from our energy and dirty jobs, on the surface was just a rop IT was exploding toilets and misinformation and artificial or animal husband rear, whatever was. But in reality, IT was a pretty thought ful. Look what keeps us connected and what we become disconnected from.

And so ultimately, the show stayed on the air, and that episode air to ridiculous ratings, by the way, which is why i've violated every other barnyard creature and on demand rings gold. But the thing is, there's no co aldous, there's no carls junior. There's no fast food, there's no slow food. There's no need industry as we understand IT without the other A I yes. So that's got a long way of saying i'm most interested to see how artificial intelligence and artificial insemination are going to somehow hopefully come together.

But so how does know that such a such a smart point? How does IT, how does quantum increase in computing power, which is really what the artificial does, just Better computation? How does that affect the real economy, like the actual physical stuff that keeps us alive?

Well, I don't know, but I do think what's going on in the real economy and what's going on in the in the real country is this this unravelling of connectivity people. And I upon myself in this, in this group, we've become really disconnected from some very primary thanks. Yes, I commit on your desk right away.

It's primal. It's fundament love IT IT looks like what IT is. Yes, you know, and and I don't know, it's to to reconnect with basic things is is to be around fundamental. I like what you have done with the place.

Oh, well, I like to sniff IT you do if .

you're gona sell t shirt to do me a favor and put that on IT the thing .

I like about the digital experiences IT doesn't smell like anything.

This is not real .

so like on weed yes so sounds like on we itself featured um yeah .

you're but anyway so helping to be reconnected to where our food comes from, to where energy comes from, what our what our history is and to do with humor. That was the goal of that show uh today not sell too high mind but it's it's one of the goals of of my foundation and you know I don't really have permission to talk about A I that's not really my lane.

I don't yes, quite know what i'm doing, but on a personal level, when somebody sends you a link that sounds so much like you, you can tell the difference. Then then you you, you start to connect to a because you get to personal. So I I think what I think what's going to happen is this stuff is going to stop being the femoral theoretical. And people are gonna find real, real, real personal stuff. With regard to AI.

Tucker says its best, their credit card companies are ripping americans off, and enough is enough. This is senator Roger martial of kansas, our legislation that credit card competition act would help in the grip VISA and mastercard have on us. Every time you use your credit card, they charge you a hidden fee called a swipe fee, and they're been raising IT without even telling you this hurts consumers and every small business owner.

In fact, american families are paying eleven hundred dollars in hidden White busy cheer. The fees, VISA and mastered card charge americans are the highest in the world, double canada and eight times more than europe. That's why i'd take an action.

But I need your help to help get this past. I M asking you to call your senator today. And the man, they passed the credit card competition act painful by .

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When when you go on twitter and there's a video of you praising hitler, it's not really you deep.

deep fakes come on, that's going to happen. That's going to happen. And and porn, you know horn is on the leading edge of every new tech all the time. And what does that what does that mean for the next generation?

But I noticed IT with its rise. Never talk about .

really instance.

Thank you. Um fewer people have sex with human beings and that no one ever says that and only like doing topic. This is stories on because it's too embarrassing, but it's true.

But here we are.

You make me very good.

I just look, I just confessed an encounter with a all .

end up a but IT does seem like a castle .

calls by way definite when .

you come a back fascine .

man with your imposer thongs and what not to .

a and beauty calls what do you do um is excuse me.

this you so much .

what are you wearing so um IT doesn't m like the that effective almost all digital or even maybe technological advance is to separate us from each other to a greate degree of.

So do you remember faith popcorn? Yes, very well. So the popcorn report this this thing published every couple leaders. That was a futures right?

A trend spotter, correct? And a relentless self promoter. And I think I had around about fifteen times in the, of course, come on, I work to cable news .

all right no short term recall SHE talked about um a borrowing yes right this idea that as technology advances, we're going to have an easier time making our world smaller yes. And we we're going to borrow into our homes and eventually we're going to be able to movies on very intelligent tvs. And so far, she'd kind of predict that all that of course, they all came true.

And then SHE wrote about something called uh, cocooning. So after you borrow, you just cocoon. So it's deeper and deeper and our our homes become smarter and the tech becomes more on the present.

And anything we want can be brought to us by giant company that owns all of the vans and every, every so in a way where we're connected V, V, vivo optics and relationships. And so fourth and we've ever been but on the other hand, I think he was right. We are we are so deeply born in our space that um yeah A I is going to take us to whatever that next level is. And and sex is gonna a topic we're probably going to have to talk about because I I mean, i've read that i've read these studies that say Young men in particular are not it's not having sex away.

They what that means is are not having like deeper levels of of human connection.

I can I don't have an a great insight to IT. My first, my person believe, is people are having as much sex as live they ve ever had maybe more. They're just alone. Yeah well.

that's but no, I don't know why that's not like describe as a tragedy. That seems like a tragedy to me, is the whole point of life. As you arrive alone and depart alone in the interview, you try to contest with other people. Yes.

it's this. And we are slowly arbitraging the wood out of the death. We are slowly getting rid of all the human.

This, yes, it's just, you can feel that happening. My favorite author, actually, you probably know him very, very famous in south florida. Jd auto, yes, the travis mic e mysteries as pulp fiction ever written.

And that stuff today reads like a propac's. Mcgee talked all of the time about this slow unraveling, and he was so wary of of so much of what he predicted was coming. And of course, IT IT did. He looked off the grid on a house boat called the busted flush that he wanted a poker game. He solve crimes essentially he helped people recover that .

which so he's not the the only one and i'm not him. There is some very controversial, very bad people actually, but who live very isolated lives, who were able maybe therefore, to see the future more clearly. Why is IT that solitude, silence, removal from the bustle of human society allows some people this extraordinary vision into the future? You .

wouldn't think that, yeah, but it's sort of the virtue of boredom. Michael easter writes about this. We'll all the comfort crisis that I like the lot where we've we've identified boredom as a great enemy and we're surrounded by things to make sure we're never bored is why we can do this and why do this? And it's why our attention spans get smaller, smaller, smaller.

Because we've waged the war against boredom. But it's it's the process of not doing anything, all the devices down, and being alone with yourself that lets your brain wander. And pretty soon you'll just far as a ump, your way through a bunch of things you didn't even know you were gonna think about. And then you arrive at conclusions you you didn't know you wanted to arrive at what you're glad you did, what ideas come from, if if you're never born, if you're always stimulate, then then you've made a trade, you have made a bargain. And it's probably a bad one, fought with unintended consequences.

And for a guy who does artificial insemination, ation shows deeper spot on. I would say I did .

IT very well.

So let me, the other I wanted put up of a clip from former president barack obama talking about the other A I, the digital ai, and his idea for how this can bring us together or solve economic crises at set areas.

If you are interested in help in the shape, all these amazing questions that I would be coming up um go to A I D go and see if there are opportunities for you. I fresh out of school or you might be an experience, the tech coder is done fine. You want the house, got everything set up and says, you know what I want to do something for, for the common good sign up.

So here we have a former president saying, the government is gonna to say, I, for what the common good you know, I don't want to be skeptical or cynical at all, but that does sort of make me wonder what's going on here. Any idea?

Again, it's a bit outside my lane. I think i'm .

sure .

there's some some validity in the in the message and there's probably real opportunity in the in the vertical, as they say. But we have eleven million open jobs right now that we're struggling to fill. None of them require understanding .

of A I million.

Well, at ten point eight was the last time I saw.

And what are they exactly?

Well, speaking broadly, yeah, most of them don't require for your degree. They require training. Yes, most of them require willingness to roll up your leaves and sometimes get your hand dirty.

Welders, plumbers, steam fitters, pipe fitters, electricians, heating, air conditioning so forth for the last twenty years or so, for a very five who retire over the course of year to replace them. Troubling math, terrible arithmetic is linking. Yeah, we've said.

And so the skills gap is a real thing. And that part of our workforce has been wilfully a neglected beginning, really around the time we took shop class out of high school. And we've had our thumb on the scale of education in a very specific way.

For a long time. We have we've made a very persuasive case for higher red and the four presence, making a pretty persuasive case for careers and artificial intelligence. Fine, we can all do two things at the same time, I hope, but the things right in front of us.

But if we changed the emphasis in a her education, I mean, it's entirely possible we could run sociologists some point and then what .

there's something thing about.

So I mean, you've been said this for a long time, pretty much a one voice, but i've never had anybody disagree with .

you because you .

would like on work grounds. Can someone .

disagree with you?

no. But I mean in a substantive way.

well, what people disagree with is the idea that you can promote one thing without tearing down another. That's the traps that we're in. That's what happened to us.

We we hire ed, needed Better P, R. And in the seventies and eighties we got IT. In fact, got we needed more engineers.

We needed more sciences, don't know about societal logic, but but the higher education need to shop. They ARM. Unfortunately, we weren't content ent to simply make the case for higher red.

We had to do IT at the expense of everything else. And so trade schools took in the neck. Community colleges were relegated to something your kid did if they couldn't. Here is, yes, but of course, those forms of education are also attached to a big shock of our our workforce.

And so we kind of waged the war on alternative education, or call IT lower education, if you want, because if it's higher over here is by definition, has to be lower over here. So we draw a real clear line. And we told people that if you don't get the most expensive degree that you can, if you don't take the most expensive path, there is you going to wind up doing something ordinary.

The result is this idea that all these great jobs are essentially vocational consolation Price. Meanwhile, the opportunities that exist tucker, I mean, look, I appreciate the kind words. I haven't beat the drum for fifteen years.

Foundation turned fifteen on labor day. We felt about two thousand people yet trained in these areas. And i'm telling IT, most of my soap box stuff in the early days was anecdotal.

IT was what I thought, and I was what I saw on dirty jobs. And IT was this feeling that we were permanently neglecting A A whole lot of opportunity now. Now the stats have have bolster red, that the headlines have caught up to my own smack.

But most importantly, the people we've helped five, six years ago are sitting down with me today and answering questions like, well, how's IT going? And i'll say, and I say, i'll tell you how it's going. You helpme get a welding degree six years ago today, I three vans and mechanical contract in company.

I've got a plummer and i've got an electric to work with me every day. We're all making six figures a year. We work when we want.

And I hear these stories day after day after day after day. And I look around and I am not asking the friends to do anything I did. I went to congress three times over the years and I said, guys, we need a Better P.

R. Campaign for this chunk of the workforce. A math is awful. And we're not gonna having a conversation about, oh my god, you mean a plumber can really make that much.

We're going to be having a conversation about, what do you mean? I have to wait four days a plummer, and that's what's happening now. So with great respect to rocket obama, find, make the case for opportunities at A I but who hell is making the case for the opportunity to make this table totally?

Ray.

who's met? Where is the passion or the prosperity that will surely follow? If you take the time to learn a skill, it's in demand and work your ass off.

That's still for sale. It's still real. And I can't find anybody I real and i've looked.

Tucker says its best, their credit card companies are ripping americans off, and enough is enough. This is senator Roger martial of kansas, our legislation that credit card competition act would help in the grip VISA and mastercard have on us. Every time you use your credit card, they charge you a hidden fee called a swipe fee, and they're been raising IT without even telling you this hurts consumers and every small business owner.

In fact, american families are paying eleven hundred dollars in hidden White busy cheer. The fees, VISA and mastered card charge americans are the highest in the world, double canada and eight times more than europe. That's why i'd take an action. But I need your help to help get this past. I M asking you to call your senator today and demand they passed the credit card competition act painful by the merchants .

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You make such a rational, logical fact base case, that is, they suggested as become into beautiful with time, arguing at this point. But there's also something that I am having trouble describing. But there is something morally or spiritually different in elevated about making things over arranging things, are being a parasite in the real economy. It's Better for you as a person to run a saw mill than IT is to be, say, a high speed trader.

You know.

I just think that I mean, am I being crazy? And I don't think i've just been like stupid populist. Oh, the working men is always Better, all the working and sometimes drunk.

Okay, in the morning I get IT. But I just think the nature of the work matters. If i'm a pornographer is probably not good for me but if i'm you know really skilled dwell hanger .

maybe IT is of course yes but I would only say that it's the it's the trap of the binary again there that's the trap.

Do you remember .

I guess was twenty sixteen public ican debates? All seventeen are up there.

right twenty seven like amazing.

Um I forget the exact question, but marco rubio answer was, let me tell you what we need in this country um are fewer philosophers and more wheldon. So the crowd collapse biga laws line. There was a lot of true.

I love your comment about sociologists earlier. IT fine, I get IT. But what was interesting was like my social channels blew up with people go and hey, this guys, this guys really singing and you're so on.

I said, actually, no, no, that's not my point. My point would be what our country needs are more wilders who can talk intelligently about nature or right right to guard. And we need more philosophers who can run and even beat.

Okay, yes, it's this idea that a wilder is somehow unsigned. But look, I I don't know where my cell phone is. Now there's yours weet you and I, with this internet connection, we've got access to something we didn't when we were in school, just ninety eight percent of the known information.

So in my foundation, I try make the point to the people who apply for our, for our work of scholarships. I say, look, this is, learn the skill. Be great at IT, but for god sakes, go get your liberal arts education, not at Brown.

You don't have to borrow all that money to do that. Be interested. Be curious.

I watched the lecture four nights ago from M. I, T. On my phone.

For free, for free. Now i'm not saying it's the same experience, but it's the same information. It's all available.

And if that doesn't like fire you up as a curious person to not be completely engaged by the undeniable fact that most of the known information on the planet is in your pocket and accessible, right? It's a very liberal arts kind of thing to save. But i'm not saying IT to your basic liberal art student. I'm saying IT to the wilders and the steam fitters and the pipe fires and the mechanics that have come through our foundation, because the most interesting people on the planet, and I don't preach the quire, do you know, do you know the person who made this desk?

I don't. I wish I did.

I do too, because I guarantee that .

I got a story and friends runs to, no, I am all about.

i'm all about some. It's it's the, i'm all about sam mills too, but i'm all about them. A well rounded propriety. I I really think that the thing that's most missing today is that baLance you ever .

read winder berry.

yeah.

Last for and from .

north calling this mom. Yes, one after the next time. Next.

sure to. Do you see any evidence that I know people are listened to you and and I get would argue, haven't seen anyone kind of review what you're saying, but you have any sense that is that is changing.

that is moving? Do yes. So there's this guy runs of thinking tech oculus. They is tod rose.

You become a friend of mine in in fact, I had him on my podcast not long, long ago. And they do really, really important research that has to do. I'm merely with collective volumes.

In fact, he has a book called the collective volume. And one of the things that personally really struck me was the eighty percent of the information on on twitter is created by ten percent the people on twitter. And so it's really easy to look at that platform and many others too, and assume a consensus. And so once we as humans realized that there is a consensus or a majority who believe a certain thing, then will buy a large fall in line many times, supporting things that we personally don't really support like for this is right now there is.

i've seen this man.

all right. Well, and if you look for IT, you'll see IT everywhere. It's mind bugling. So, and, and, and this was kind of a wake up call for me, because for fifteen years i've been talking about this, this deeply held belief.

The parents and guidance councillors are truly believe that the best path for their kids is this most expensive path. But the latest research, when you really sit people down and and take a deep, deep dive, gz right now is ranking the importance of a college education at a fifty different things. At forty seven, ah, I see.

is high. Well.

IT used to be three, right? But in the course of the last five or six years, like a lot of people IT made me wonder, has something shifted IT in that generation that I just haven't seen? And i'm hopeful that IT has people are starting to get the message that just because you've got two hundred thousand dollars in that and a diploma doesn't mean the world's gonna be a pathway to your door IT doesn't mean you're going to get a hired in your chosen field .

dos mean you were educated.

doesn't mean anything at all except for the fact that you owe two hundred thousand. Now that's what this means that the PLA is a receipt .

as .

surely as IT is anything else, right? IT? And and the information you got in exchange for, well, that that's a tool and how you use IT is none of my business and people are starting.

I think I think to realize at least this research indicates that our our fascination with the golden ticket that's always been a college diplomat is starting to weigh. And honestly, I think that's a good thing. Yes.

one of our many postwar assumptions that probably be updated after eighty years yeah how what's the state of farm vocational education in the united states like is an in engineering programs just so really .

good um but like welding.

plumbing, electrical and in some of the highest electrical engineering and that are we still adding the world in our stuff?

I don't know of any company in this country who doesn't have some sort of internal training program to try and get those skills taught. Certainly nobody's coming out of high school with those skills of people are coming out of trade schools with the basics. But the actual finishing almost always happens within the company.

So a lot of that work is being gotten ten privately. It's back to shop class. You know, IT starts with interest.

IT starts like if you're if you're fourteen year old kid with no real clear idea of what you want to do and you're walking down the corner or of your high school and you stick your head in the whitlock, you stick your head in the metal shop and you stick your head in any number of occasions PS, you can at least optically see what the work looks like or might look like. And for a lot of people who got into the trades, that's where IT began. They they saw something that resonated with them, a and a switch fly you don't see.

You mean what what more persuasive thing could you say to a kid regarding the skill trades? Then don't even look at which is going to a remove all proof of their existence from site that what we did when we took shop class at a high school. And it's not a coincidence that I mean, I think I can draw a pretty straight line in that event in one point seven trillion dollars about standing student loans and point eight million open jobs and maybe even seven point two million able bodied men and the prime of their life, according to Nicholas, ever stand in a book called man without work, great book.

We're sitting, oh, not only not working, but a farmable vely, not looking for work, spending an excess of two thousand hours a year, White pick, and looking at screens that never happened before, that on peace time anyway but we are in peacetime um all of that stuff together I can walk back and i'll be IT a fairly circuit IT is round. But we took shop class at our high schools and we didn't think anything was going to happen as a result. Everything happened.

Everything right? People lost their digi. So you um I got to ask you, you were an upper singer.

Well, I sang in the up. I also ski down mountains, but very few people say us. My grow, the skier.

i've skewed down any mountain. I ve never sung Opera, but deep. I mean, is there over the time when you do IT still weddings, funerals for real? I seeing all .

the on my podcast, I write unauthorized jingles for all the sponsors, and signal for part, harming does IT amuses me.

Do you ever seen in italian install? So the .

first thing I learned, I got to the Opera when I was twenty two, I couldn't get an a gyt. I couldn't get an agent because I couldn't get my sag card. So I couldn't not addition for commercials and roles and TV, which is what I wanted to do.

And so is this weird circle. You can ata sad gardenless. You've done your work, can in an agent, unless you have a side card, you can get a anyhow, if you ve got to the Opera, that you become a member of the american guilty of musical artists.

And as such, you can buy a sad card. You pay your dues because they're all sister units, of course, loophole. So anyway, twenty two years old, I can't get in the great actors guild when I had a buddy, i'll be about the slow ople sang in the Opera.

And the Opera had these open auditions every thursday. Last thursday a lot. I went the library and, uh, I ask the library for the shortest italian area ever written. You know, such a thing.

And you said, you want the code area of chinese lab? I M alright. So I took on as a record, and I recorded IT on a tape, and I walked out with these things called walk. Man, IT is this time. And eighty two, I guess.

And so I listen to sam rai saying the code area for, like a month and ball to more know what words, man, I just wanted to get the sounds in my head and memorized the tone, and I did. And so I went to the lyric Opera. On a, on a thursday and I and I sign IT for the course master at a couple swill. Still remember IT.

Let me get your rich v singly I think it's a radar for saying IT saying goodbye to his coat very cold and made me of course is dying of tubercular course consumption as as everybody did .

at one point as they do ah and um .

he gives her his coat so SHE can live a little longer and he loved this coat because he kept him warm in the pockets, held his poetry and he was a true about so he sings a love song to his coat and then gives IT to the girl with berkeley is and what did he die? Die 嗯。

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But here's a crazy here's a moral story. Not that there has to be one, but I stayed in three years, right? I got a unique card, the libyan um and that was the music.

The music was amazing. Like like world I i'd never heard a world class workers to play and I I couldn't believe I was given access just to be around this level of this level talent was mind boggling. And the girls, yeah.

what are the days of Opera? Like.

well, i'll tell you something.

probably a little high, strong. I would .

think i'm twenty two. I'm dresses of biking herit. I'm singing and real out of languages I don't really understand. There are eighty people in the rap company. Forty five of them are women yeah thirty five people are men um thirty of the men had zero interest in one hundred percent of the world.

sure.

The remaining five guys, three, they were married. The only other single street. Basically you're the straight hair dresser. IT was this is done fair was me of one of the guy and he had a mall on his idle as my fmb with thick black hair. I'm twenty two dresses apparent, and the girls are all dressed up like french courtesans plunging neck lines and ods a for eight years.

Believe you know, is anyone who is in the company is still there?

No, the upper company folded. The world were upper folded about six years ago. I was invited back um no, because dirty jobs had been a thing in the list of people who sign Opera, crawl through a sore parents.

Pretty short, the union said.

pretty small. Yeah so I I I went back for a funded raiser or two. Um couldn't save IT you know there's a lot and ball to more that's tough to save right now but dia, I did go back and I did a one man show in baltimore or the dirty truth and uh sold tickets and sold out the Opera house and not on stage for about two hours um in my own town telling stories about dirty jobs and answering questions and telling the story I just told you and I was one of those moments where was like, you know what I don't know a full circle but mad IT was super strange and funding gratifying to go back and do that because for me, you know.

And this is just the cognitive distant in one of the things that people always asked if there I was surprised by the Opera because they saw twenty years of dirty jobs and violating barnyards animals and including through sores, and that those two things aren't supposed to exist in the same said they are. The going to make this table is supposed to be able to, quote Robert frost and the guy who writes poetry, supposed to be able to, right? And so I I didn't really give IT much thought until later in life.

But my time in the Opera, my time on the Q B C cable shopping channel in middle of the night, trying to figure out how to talk about product that I could neither explain or justify for eight minutes of live T. V, that those are the best times of my life and, and, and the training. No, I didn't realize I was getting the second best education of my life.

The best education started with episode lot of dirty jobs and went on for twenty years. And the third best was the community college that I attended at a high school, which changed everything for me. So today, yeah, if I met off a lot about this is because I really do believe.

But when I get criticized for being anti college or being anti education, I I really only think it's because people, people must think, if i'm going to try and make a persuasive case for this kind of work, I must be against this kind of work. I'm not alright. I like the Opera. I'd like to sing. I crawl through source for a living.

I run a foundation that is completely admitted to making a more persuasive case for the opportunities that exist in this country, and to aggressively, but good, humorous, hopefully debunk the stigmas stereotypes smythes in this perceptions that are keeping millions of kids from expLoring real opportunities that are just sitting right in front, as I, I wish the former president all the luck in the world, in his pitch, to bring more people into the fascinating future of artifical. elegist. I I really do with that. I got.

I got ta asked with a sheep castration story because IT, now that we .

you you've don a deep dive.

have any year we've done a very we do .

so sheep castration. Yeah, that that was a bee.

That if you set the table first, like what role is sheep castration play in agriculture? Like why would one be castrating sheep?

You know, basically in here to the essential rules of animal husband, dry your herds out of control. The flock is out of control. Everything's out of control. This is in virtually every species, the males um need to be controlled in this way.

Yeah like I was at a hetchy one time murray murray up and was, uh you know they they ship like one hundred thousand little chicks out every day in the us. mail. People get, people order.

You can order chickens through the mail. Oh yeah, I do this solve time. If if it's a girl chicken, if it's a boy chicken, well. You're good. That's called feriz er their ground up really o yeah yeah the me that's why how many restart do you see in the barnyard?

You're usually like water to yeah and it's like a bunch hance or for that reason you know if you not castrating, you're getting rid them somehow or any other. What happened in two thousand and eight actually turned into a ted talk. But IT didn't start that way. IT started with me trying very hard not to run a file of the network because after the first few season, the show .

something really .

crazy up IT IT became a phenomenology. The network had no choice really, but to enthusiastically get behind IT because I was launching all kinds of other shows as well. But dirty jobs broke a lot of eggs. Um there was what we called an army of angry acronyms.

Does everybody watches TV? And if you're an expert and a chosen field and and you see me doing something wrong, whether it's ocean, where the E P A or the A S P C A, where the humane society, you write a letter, right, of course. And my boss had many letters and many files from lots of angry acronis.

So when I went to do the sheet casteran story, I want to to be very careful to do IT right, because I didn't want to get thrown off the air. And I and I called first to know, make sure I understood what was going to be happening. And then I called Peter, and I said, look, i'm going to be going to be castrating.

Is there improved method? And they said, all absolutely. And they described the rubber band.

A thick rubber band is placed over the scrotum of the animal. The flow of blood is slowly retarded. And eventually the business just falls off.

A couple days, right? It's going to be amazing. TV sounds good.

We get there. Crate glora o i'm on horses right into the mouths. It's beautiful. We get all the sheep gathered up, we separate and get the lambs there. I got the raza, I got his wife and a the first lam is put up on the fence, and the legs are spread.

And the rancher reaches and IT was pocket to pull out one of the rubber bands to put around, grow and accept it's not a rubber band, is a knife. The knife flicks open, and you can see the sudden glinting off the steel blade. And very quickly, he he leaned dad when he pulls discrown on towards, and when he cuts off tip rops tip in a bucket, then he cuts off the lamps tail called ducking, yeah, that goes in the bucket.

Then he pushes the scroll of back, revealing two testicles like this. And any leans down, and he bite them. The axis head back, and testicles come out of the scrotum, and he spits them into the barrel.

All have is very quickly studying remark. I said something i've never said on dirty job before, because we never do second take start thing. But I said, stop, stop.

I said, what are you doing? And he explained what he was doing, and that's how IT had had been done for many years and and that's just kind of the way I was and and I said, you don't understand because what I think is going on is what happens a reality T. V.

The guide seen the show and he wanted to do something spectacular. Of course, i'm like, we can be. It's a family show.

okay? Well, I don't care what you say. We, we can do this.

And this is, well, what do you want to do? And I like, I want to do with the proper way I want to put the rubber band on. So for the song is like, well, we could do that.

It's not very nice for the the lamb. Like, not very nice for the lamb also also, then what are we talking about? So cameras fire back up.

He goes over to the tackle box and he comes out with the rubber band and he gives IT to me and I put IT over the screw them over the next lamb and we put a little lamb down on the on the ground that is trembling on account of the rubber band around. yeah. And that kind of walks over into the corners and kind of turns around and lies down and is is clear to stress.

I'm look at the land I am. You know how I want you gonna be like, this is the two, three days. Meanwhile, the land that he had just at this thing, walk around, not a care in the world, already had forgotten IT on.

Yeah, you just .

get over this life now now. Balls, okay, no blood. He's just off pursuing the life of, you know, whatever religious fulfillment alan would do without a tesco's that point.

And this poor thing is curled up in the in the corner. So we skipped filming and I castrated probably thirty lambs that day. Did you feel any .

guilt at all? No.

no. IT was actually very quick. IT was it's a way more efficient .

way to do IT we you castrate them early. Oh.

google at lam. Castration micro heck of .

think with your teeth.

yeah. What else you're going to bite them with?

IT feels like you're crossing some important barrier into a whole new world. We uploaded.

you buy an animals balls.

All there are moments in dirty inside you. I mean.

you can be the same menu where that morning it's like a german. You see IT like, good grief. Yes, I felt very strongly that we that that that something extraordinary had happened on the show.

But I also felt very strongly that something more important had happened prior the show. I've been given bad information by experts. I had called the expert authority.

I had called pda, I called the humane society as well, the best minds in the business. The people who live to write disappointing emails to my boss instructed me on the proper way to remove the testicle les from a creature. And they were wrong.

Now optically IT might have looked a little Better in their minds. I think they like the idea of a rubber band instead of a knife and teeth. But they were wrong. That lam caste rated the proper way was the very embodiment of object mystery. And I saw thirty or forty more that .

last question of, like, I just obviously feel starry for the limes, but IT does have more, he main, just to bite them off much more. But for you is a man like how hard was IT mean the first oral castration? Probably the hardest. I think people say that again.

if you're onna make t shirts, put that on to .

to me was IT like skydiving, like i'm talk going to think about IT .

about the door you know yes in a way but there's also a thing that happens with cameras that that um well sometimes IT makes you foolish. Sometimes that makes you brave yeah sometimes it's really hard to know what the differences but i've done a lot of things on that show because I was aware that we were making a show and and it's my job.

My job on dirty jobs is to try and it's maybe the greatest sm of all time that I pulled off, not even knowing I was trying to pulled IT off. But i'm not judged on that show by my ability to, successfully to. No, of course, i'm judged by my willingness to try.

You're willingness, and of course you're going to bite. You are try, you know. But really, how are you gonna be? I mean, I got the guy right there.

Albert was his name. I can still see his mustache. Traces of best defines day from. So, yeah, I mean, to talk of thing. So I know, I know i'm making an extraordinary moment in television. I know at a gLance that looks salacious and probably unjustifiable, but I also know these to be the trembling creature in the quarter of the pen. I also know that there's some weird greater truth, like a thrown .

on actly.

And so I built them off and I spit them in the bucket, and then I took the knife and I removed the tail from the next one, and then the tip of the school. And then I got a pretty good rythm felt pretty good about my by castration abilities when the sun finally SAT in crag, colorado, over the rocky mountains, and the last lamb had been taken care of. Yes, there were rocky mountain isters.

We fried them up, and yet we ate. That was dirty jobs. Two thousand.

eight. I'm united for amy that the great micro p, thank you. Yes, don't mention IT.