Curb Your Conservatism
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This episode of I've Had It is brought to you by Booking.com. Booking.yeah. Every time I use Booking.com to find a place to stay in the U.S., I know they'll have exactly what I'm looking for. They have a huge variety of options from hotels to vacation rentals, and I'm

always able to find something that fits my specific needs. I found that Booking.com has something for everyone. Find exactly what you're booking for on Booking.com. Booking.yeah. So we're supposed to start the podcast. Ready? One, two, three.

I felt like that was a little bit off. I felt like you did a three and a clap at the same time. I did. Typically, it's one, two, three, clap. Here's what happened. So you've got the monitor behind us and the monitor on here, and I caught it, and I just, I was looking, and so I screwed it up. So ready? One, two, three. Okay, there you go. Now we're back. Patriots, gayatriots, theyatriots, blackatriots, brownatriots, all the cool people. Fuck off!

All right. Welcome to America's Top DEI Podcast Pumps. What have you had it with? Okay. What I've had it with is when people that you're talking to, they don't make eye contact. They look over your forehead or they look underneath or they look around. I mean, my number one biggest I've had it is when they look at the mirror or glass that shows the reflection behind. I mean, that is like, you are not so pretty. You can't take your eyes off yourself for two seconds. I've caught myself doing that. A million times. And it's always people that I'm like,

If you're that worried about your appearance, I would brush my hair. Have you ever caught yourself doing it? I have caught myself doing it, but not in a conversation. Like I'm very conscientious that if somebody's talking in front of like a mirror or a reflective glass, I am, I mean, I zone into those eyeballs because I don't ever want to get caught. What if they're a bad conversationalist?

I'd rather look at myself. At my advanced age, if it's a bad conversation, I'm just like, oh my gosh, I got to run. I'm so busy. That's my new thing. Oh, I've got to go. I would love to talk to you, but I got to run. Your new thing. I haven't been able to experience that with you yet. Well, it's because obviously I'm so interesting. Did you just launch that this morning? No, I have had it for a while. Like people that I meet in like the grocery store or whatever, be like, oh, I got to take this phone call on my phone. So not ringing.

A little fake out. Yeah. But you, I agree with you about the lack of eye contact. It just tells me something nefarious is going on. Like if you can't make eye contact with me while we're talking, I know you're lying about something or hiding something. Or maybe they're shy. Yeah.

Yeah, but the shy ones, you get the shy vibe well before the conversation. You know what I mean? You're talking about like darting eyes. No, I'm talking about like the eyes roll up and the eyes roll down. So it's almost like they're bored, but they won't get out of the conversation. That's why I think you just have to eject yourself. The eye contact is a huge thing for me. I agree with you. I like that.

direct eye contact as well. I agree. Yeah. I prefer that. Okay. I've had it with Cheryl Hines. This is the wife of RFK Jr. And for years and still currently my favorite television show of all time is Curb Your Enthusiasm starring written by Larry David. Cheryl Hines played Cheryl, his wife on the show. They, um,

Clearly progressives. They wrote progressive storylines into the show for all of the seasons. They're environmentalists, all the cool stuff that thinking open minded people are. And then Cheryl Hines marries RFK Jr., who at the time he was shopping both a cabinet position with Kamala Harris, who refused to return his phone call, or with Donald Trump.

And the fact that she I just saw her at the White House the other day at Trump's summer soiree where he walked out like he was Eva Peron on the balcony, like a goddamn drag queen. He walked out there with all his makeup on. And I love drag queens. But that's what he you know, he just comes out on stage and he doesn't have the swag. No, or the riz of a drag queen to pull it off. And anyway, she's there in a floral dress.

Running around the White House lawn. And I just thought, do you have no conviction? Is it just that like, and I get that people lose their identity in relationships. I get that that happens to both genders. But to lose your moral compass, I've just had it with her. I've had it. I've had it. I completely agree. And I almost feel like it's worse because on Curb Your Enthusiasm, I liked her character. I liked her. And so it felt like a double slap in the face.

But I am just like, how did Cheryl that I loved for all those years on Carbureth Enthusiasm end up with a guy that's a conspiracy theorist? The only thing I could think is part of her. I mean, there is something she likes about all that.

that she was hiding. And I think you're right. It's no conviction. RFK Jr. started off as a huge environmentalist. And Larry David and his ex-wife and all of the people that are on curb were members of the National Resources Defense Council, which is this big pro-environment organization

PAC institution, if you will. Remember the episode with the anonymous donor? That was for the NR, whatever it is, National Resources Defense Council. And so RFK Jr. initially was all about climate change. That was his big pitch. So that's how they met was in the umbrella of we are heating up the earth. It's going to kill us all. This is not sustainable for our species. We need to act and we need to act now.

Well, RFK Jr. continues his research and then he starts going into all of this autism and vaccines and all of this shit. And I have a theory. I think sometimes people that have a shit ton of money and no job – so he's got a trust fund that could choke a bull, right? He's a Kennedy. Right.

And he really didn't have a job. He's like reading academics about climate change. And then he starts reading about vaccines and autism. Well, then they start thinking they're smarter, writing the people who have devoted decades of their life in doing peer reviews and finding the most current available truth that they can prove at that place in time.

And you see with RFK Jr., and you see with a lot of other people, they start believing, like what's his name, the podcaster, Joe Rogan. They start believing that they're more intelligent than people that have decades worth of experience in that. And that's what I think happened to RFK Jr.,

I think it's so sad because it's like, remember like in college, you date somebody and it kind of changes your personality. Like I dated that guy and all of a sudden I was outdoorsy and a hiker. Of course. When you're young. I mean, I really don't like hiking. It's not my thing. I bought a bow and arrow and shot bows and arrows with him. I don't like any of that, but I did it because I liked him. And what's so sad about Cheryl Hines at probably in her mid-50s, maybe 60s,

is that she is changing her entire identity to support this quack RFK Jr. And I guess the thing is, is no matter what age you are, you're susceptible to being dumb in love. Absolutely. And I'll tell you one other thing that bugs me, and this isn't really about Cheryl, but it's about RFK. So

So during the campaign, it comes out he's having that affair with the female reporter, the digital affair. Oh, while he's married. Yeah. Yeah. Who I like her reporting. But what irritates the shit out of me is the man who was married, walked away with zero consequences in that situation. And she, the female reporter, has lost her job, has lost credibility. And again, it goes to show that.

you know, the old boys club is going to protect the guy. You're so right. And that every time I think about that whole thing, it irritates the shit out of me. And I think, Cheryl, that was your off ramp and you didn't take it. No, you are so right. That is such a good point, Pumps, because now we don't hear anything about her anymore. She was, remember, one of those courtroom reporters that we followed on Twitter? Yes, I loved following her. Yeah. Okay. So I have, wait,

Welcome to I've Had It. I'm Jennifer. I'm Angie. The HBIC had Beaver in charge. Kylie. Yes. How are things going in the lesbian sphere? They're pretty good. Pretty gay. Pretty lesbian. Things are gay. Yeah, we're keeping it gay. Okay. I've got two reviews for you really quick. Okay. This one is five stars titled A Little Much from Rachel. Okay.

She says, "Hello lesbians and the straight one. Despite being my favorite podcast of all time, my husband thinks you are a little much."

I too am a little much, so I'm not exactly sure what his point is. What I do know is that I put the podcast on anyway, as this is one of my key educational tools for my seven-month-old daughter, right? And he always tunes in. No matter how much he tries to pretend to be uninterested, there's always a, see, that's the thing. Or yeah, why do people do that? So from a woman who's a little much that's raising a daughter to be a little much, thank you for captivating all three of us despite the unwillingness of some.

Oh, that is just a gorgeous review. I love that. That's so well written. And I just, I love all the little nuggets and Easter eggs she left in there that her husband tries to poo-poo us, but then he's just, you know, right up next to her listening to it. And then the defensive women who are outspoken, it's just so well written. Rachel, I love that. And Rachel's husband, thank you for listening. Right. And we are a little too much. Some would even say a lot too much, but we dig it.

We're in on it. Yeah, that's a really good review, Kylie. Okay, who's next? Okay, this one is five stars titled My Husband's Other Women. I somehow only recently found your show and subsequently mainlined the last six months of episodes. I was explaining the premise of it to my husband, so I finally put on an episode for him in the car, and he too was hooked. He refers to you as our girls. Oh, my God.

And to the OKC Thunder as Pump's team. Oh. I think he just doesn't remember Jennifer's name. As he can't remember any of my actual friends' names or interests, this is impressive. Your podcast is cathartic and free group therapy in these trying times. Although I did pre-order the book. The only thing you could possibly do to make...

Like you guys more to make me like you guys more is to start referring to the evangelical megachurches as six flags over Jesus, because there's no better descriptor. That is so good. Six flags over Jesus. Okay. I just want to point out that that's too back to back.

heterosexual couples where we are in the knee deep in the center of their marriages. Right. We're in a thruple with these people. Quadruple. Quadruple. I mean, we're really like...

It's high times over here at I've Had It Podcast. We're swingers. We're swingers. We're swinging with gays, lesbians, queers, LGBTQ, heterosexual, straights. Straight. All the things. Okay. I have some news stories I'd like to share with the class today. The first one is...

Republican support for same-sex marriage is lowest in a decade, with only 41 percent of voters saying it should be legal. In the latest Gallup poll, 41 percent of Republicans and 88 percent of Democrats said marriages between same-sex couples should be recognized by the law as valid with the same rights as traditional marriages.

This 47-point gap is the largest it has been since Gallup first started asking the question in 1996. The report found 76% of independents and 68% of all U.S. adults surveyed backed marriage rights for same-sex couples.

So this is the lowest Republican support for gay marriage has been since 1996, only at 41%. And I'm going to tell you, they have been doing this on purpose. They have gone into religious schools and they make parents sign the anti-gay document. So you have a whole new generation of kids where one of the singular mission that these kids of these Christian private schools that are all over the United States,

One of their singular thing to do is to make these kids homophobic and bigoted assholes. They do it on purpose. Mega churches. They pretend like they're so cool. And look at our preacher. He wears true religion jeans. And when it gets right down to it, gay people, you're going to hell. Imagine Christian people. They get to go. If they really want to live their faith, could go to a homeless shelter.

They could go help marginalized communities. They could go into black neighborhoods and maybe learn some empathy and understand about generational racism. They would rather sit around and pick on gay people. And the support for gay marriage among Republicans has gone from, I think it was at a high of like 58 percent, now down to 41 percent. That is a disgrace.

I completely blame all of it on the right wing evangelical mega church, that whole thing. But when I see these numbers, I start like alarms start pounding in my head because they started with women.

They wanted women's reproductive health care, and they got it. Now they're going after the legal right of people to marry. They are repealing DEI, different names off ships, you know, Harriet Tubman, all of these things.

And that is why it incenses me that white women in my generation were so easy to vote for Trump because I'm like, you're under attack. Your daughter's under attack. Your son is under attack. Everybody but a rich white man is under attack because Christianity, by definition, is patriarchal.

And there is a place for a woman and that's in the home and that's submitting to her husband. And so that's why black women are such staunch supporters of everyone, because they know we have to support everybody's rights. Because they've always been picked on. Because they've always been picked on. And it is time for white women to wake the fuck up. They're coming for everybody. But do you think back when you were in these circles before you found Enlightenment,

I don't think these women want to be woken up. I think these women think that their husband is the head of the household. Right. They do everything. But what they don't understand, because I didn't understand that, is like this such a small percentage of the population lives in actually has a happy life in those circles.

Most of those circles are miserable, fraught with all the same kinds of problems everybody else has. You take somebody like me that voluntarily gave up their career, spectacular, disastrous relationship, has to start out new in their 40s. Like you are setting yourself up for failure if you believe this realistically.

Regardless... Women should submit... Women submitting to your husband. This is a big thing, listener. Women not having money. This is a big thing. This is connected right there with that gay issue. And Pumps and I were talking about this. Women in Oklahoma... And Pumps was in this when I first met her. I mean, she was the most conservative friend I had. Thank God she's not anymore. She's my most liberal friend. But...

She believed and all of her friends believed that women should submit to their husbands and said it out loud. I didn't think women should submit to their husband, but I was fine with the like, I wasn't like all of those moms at Crossings Christian School.

All of them. I don't think any of them would say, I submit to my husband. I think they might go around the edges, but I think they're willing to. I heard multiple times the Bible says women should submit to the husband. No, I've heard that, but I never thought that. But I abdicated all of my power because that was the mindset I grew up with. Because my mom would say women should submit. Men are the head of the household. So I was shocked when I hung out with you and your peers, because most of them had gay friends and...

when female friends, they were not religious or maybe a Christian light. So you were this, I mean, total evangelical. I was always shocked when we were at your house, when I hung out with your friends, because this was during the health care debate about Obamacare. This is when our kids were really little.

And I would say, how do you guys as Christians, I'm an atheist, but how do you guys as Christians vote against people receiving health care? I can't understand that. I can't reconcile that. Well, then we start getting in the discussions about existentialism and every single one of these women. I said, so at the end of the day, do you think you're supposed to submit to your husband? 100 percent of the class all said yes.

We believe you should submit to we should believe women should submit to their husbands in the Bible They said it clear as day and I remember just thinking holy shit I cannot believe that these women think this no wonder they all hang out together It shocked me that women would say that and believe that but they believe everything in the Bible including that gay people are going to hell well, it's just it's such a cancer and

Everybody in every minority class, every marginalized group, we have to stand up for each other. Because unless you are a white privileged man, you will never get anything right now in how the Trump administration is building America and these Christian nationalists. They're all for it because they're the ones that get all the power. Yeah. I just fucking incenses me to read this.

No, it's really bad. But when you think about where we are and you think about just all of the effort in your personal life, I was exposed to it kind of riding along with you, how anti-gay mainstream suburban like Oklahoma is. Right. It's jaw dropping. So it doesn't surprise me that it's declined because there has been an active movement

effort to make people anti-gay, to make people homophobic, to send their kids to homophobic schools. It's on purpose. They want that number to be even lower because they're that ambitious about their bigotry. Right. Look at Project 22. Look at Clarence Thomas in the Dobbs decision says, yeah, we should take a, uh,

same-sex marriage and interracial marriage, and he's a black man married to a white woman. I mean, these people have no shame. No shame.

All right. Next up, this is hilarious. So speaking of people that have no shame, this man posts this on the internet and he says, at 65 years of age, I am still scoring in the top 90%. This is what's possible if you don't vaccinate the way your brain sells folks. And then he posts a link to his test results and it says, results, your IQ is 80. Your IQ is in the top 90.88%.

percent. In a room of a thousand people, you would be smarter than 91 of them. And this idiot thinks that he's in the top 90 percent of smart people. Do you do you think that's satire or do you think that's real? It's real. Well, there you have it. Right. Like, there it is, folks. This is that triple Trump or 100 percent. My IQ is 80. And he thinks that makes him. I mean,

I don't know how you fix stupid. I don't. I don't think there's a cure for stupid. Well, this brings me up to the next one. Education is the cure for stupid. And here is the next chart I want everybody to look at. And I'll describe it for the listener. How white Americans voted by education in 2024. So they did an electoral map.

White people with a college degree and Kamala Harris would have won 294 electoral votes to Trump's 244 electoral votes. White people without a college degree.

Harris would have received 17 electoral votes and Trump would have received 521 electoral votes. And there's your answer as to why they are attacking universities and want to put the Department of Education out of business and send people to the hate academies that Pumps and I were just talking about, where they indoctrinate kids to not critically think, to be racist and to

be anti-gay, anti-gay marriage, anti-trans. And get this, at these schools, Pumps has an experience with this, a gay kid was bullied for being gay and these Christian schools take the side of the bullies making the gay kid leave the school. Right. Zero protection from the school. Okay. One thing I want to say about that is in the state of Oklahoma, we've got a nut state superintendent. We rank...

depending on where you look, 49th or 50th in education, it becomes overwhelming on how to fix that. When the secretary of the Department of Education in the state of Oklahoma wants kids to be done, that is the goal. Keep them done because then they'll continue down our flag. But put up that map. That's what I'm saying. Look at that. It's not in isolation. That's why Trump said in Trump 1.0,

I love the poorly educated. This is why people don't want women like Pumps or me to get educated. Because what happened to Pumps when she got educated? She became woke. She became America's top DEI podcaster. When you start critically thinking and you start using critical thinking skills, deduction skills, and you learn history and you learn facts...

You become a more open-minded, accepting person when you're told this is your worldview. It is this Bible. These two people started it. One Adam, one Eve, talking snake. If you believe that's really fucking real. I mean, you'd only have to be three or four to believe that genuinely happened. But then they keep telling you to believe that your whole life. And if you ever veer off the course, you're going to go to hell. And that's the devil.

So we have a real problem with the indoctrination of people into this crazy Christian shit. And then there's that component. And the other component is the people that maybe might not be that religious that are indoctrinated into the right wing ecosystem of conspiracy theories. That's a whole nother thing that I think is getting to be just as powerful as the religious indoctrination. The conspiracy theory? Yes. Well, I still I'm going to give the Christian...

They're the most fun to hate. Totally. There's so much more. I mean, they've been around for centuries, years, whatever. They've had it, yeah. But the conspiracy theories, like, as crazy as this sounds, like, you just can't...

Like this whole Pizzagate thing, you know, like the pedophile rings and all that. The crazy QAnon shit. It is so absurd on its face. And then you look and millions of people believe it. It goes back to I believe.

How did someone fix that? Make critical thinking a requirement in schools and education? Well, it's never going to fucking happen in Oklahoma. You know what I mean? Like, it goes back to, it becomes overwhelming. But that's by design. No, I agree.

And we're going to have as a guest soon one of my favorite historians to listen to right now. And her name is Ruth Bengate. Not this episode. We have a great senator coming up on this episode. But we have coming up one of my favorite historians, NYU professor Ruth Bengate. And she will talk about what you say. Where do you start? How do we do it? That is the intended consequence of fascism. You've fallen prey to exactly what they want you to feel. I know. Helpless and hopeless. Yes.

And so, and I feel it 25 times a day and then I back out of it. I'm in it. Right. You have to pull yourself out. Vacillate all the time. Like maybe we shouldn't do this podcast anymore. It's bad for my serenity, you know, blah, blah. But I think that the reason we have listeners and the reason if you study the course of civilization.

There's always been a lot of fuckery with our species. And we have to stay the course. And facts prevail. Justice prevails. There's that beautiful quote from Martin Luther King. I think it's the arc of the universe is long, but it slowly leads towards justice or something like that. What's that quote, Kylie? Will you look it up?

The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice. Yeah, I think that's so beautiful. I think that is such a beautiful quote. So you have to remember that it's a long arc, but it's always going to bend towards justice. And whether it's you and I doing this podcast or politicians trying to stand up and fight against fascism or, um,

You know, I don't, I don't know what else. Artists expressing themselves through art, through film, through music, all of the things that, you know, when you talk about the age of enlightenment, it was all art. Right. Learning. And now we're in the stage of unenlightenment. And so it's important to always promote arts and culture and all of these things because that's what keeps people free. Expression. Right. Well.

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Okay, we have a guest today. He is a senator from the state of California. You may remember him from Trump's many impeachment trials. Senator Adam Schiff. Senator, how are you today? I'm good. I'm good. How are you? We're great. You know, we are in the deep red state of Oklahoma, clinging on to our little basketball team that's going to be in the NBA Finals.

So that's super exciting for us. And pretty much we've had it with everything. How about you? I was in Tulsa a few years ago doing a book signing and there were like 500 people that showed up. I was amazed at how big a blue dot there was in Tulsa.

You know, when you're progressive in a red state, you have to fight for it. And so I think that progressives in red states are some of the fiercest, most convicted fighters the Democratic Party has. I'll give you an example. Pumps and I were in New York and we had had Governor Kathy Hochul on our podcast. We really liked her a lot. She was a great problem solver. We said to some friends of ours, some New Yorkers, like, oh, I said, oh, I really like your governor. And they were like,

Oh, she's OK. And I thought, what a luxury, what a luxury to be disappointed in a competent woman. Our governor is the biggest dipshit you could ever imagine on the planet. And so I can imagine quite a few these days. Yeah. All right. So what have you had it with, Senator?

Well, I've had it with a lot, but I do have a pet peeve. I've had it with flourless chocolate cake. I like chocolate cake, but I like it to have flour in it. And every time I seem to go to a restaurant and they have chocolate cake on the menu, it's flourless. Now I've got nothing against the gluten-free people, but can you pick a different dessert for gluten-free people? And what's more...

And what makes matters worse is I try to eat vegan. And because there's a market for vegan and a market for gluten-free people, and it's not a big market for either, they tend to make desserts that will work for both. So I go to the store to get a vegan dessert. It's all gluten-free. I'm like,

Let them have their own damn dessert. So that's one of my pet peeves. I completely agree. The whole gluten-free movement, with the exception of the people that have celiac disease, you're excluded from my grievance that I'm about to say.

But it makes me want to eat gluten just for spite. It's just like everything's gluten-free and people talk about, oh, I'm gluten intolerant. And then they get drunk at 2 a.m. They're ordering cheese pizzas with eating all the flour. And I'm just like, you're a lying liar. Right. Piggybacking on people who actually have celiac disease. So I am a believer in the bring back gluten and I want to eat gluten just for spite.

Excellent. And I've got a more serious, I've had it. And that is Republicans that I serve with who will express their concern about things. There are a lot of people I work with who are very concerned, but who damn well aren't willing to do a goddamn thing about it. I've had it with that. The private concerns, I'm not really interested in anymore. If you're not going to vote your conscience, not going to do the right thing, then whatever.

Just don't, don't even say it. Are we talking about Susan Collins? We're talking about a lot of people. It's a long list. It is a long list. We see them and we think, what a coward. What a coward that you are going to go along with what you know is abject corruption because you're so scared that you're going to lose your job. Like nothing is important enough to you to put your job on the line. And that is absolutely gross.

Well, and I would put at the top of my I've had it list, and you did ask the question. We may take the whole half hour talking about I've had it, but the people who started out or pretended to be moderate Republicans who then moved totally to MAGA because that's where all the power was. You know, the people like Elise Stefanik and others, even J.D. Vance, who once talked about Trump as a potential Hitler candidate.

I'm a believer in something the historian Robert Caro once said when he said the power doesn't corrupt as much as it reveals. It doesn't always reveal us for our best, but it says a lot about who we are. I think these people were always the same. It's just we didn't really know who they were until they got a taste of power, wanted more, and all of the things they once said they cared about, they don't.

turns out, really care about it all. They just care about maintaining their office or maybe getting higher office and nothing else matters. I think one of the things that Trump did is he exposed people for being the hypocrites that a lot of us suspected that they were.

And when you have like if you go back to 2016, everybody kind of knew that Trump was saying crazy stuff and sounded authoritarian, but they didn't think he would win. So you had little Marco and even Ted Cruz and all of these this cast of characters, some of your co-workers, you know, they were like, oh, he's terrible. He's this awful thing. He'll never be the Democratic nominee. Even Lindsey, you know, he was in on all that.

And then he gets power and then it exposes their hypocrisy that they had the entire time. Because the thing about the Republican movement, and we live around it, we live in this evangelical red state culture, is you kind of know that they're full of shit and you know they're hypocrites.

But they don't have conviction. It's like, oh, can I say this out loud today or can I not say this out loud today? Where, you know, we get up every day. I know you get up every day and it's like Donald Trump is a fascist, authoritarian. He's corrupt. He's a liar. He can't blend his makeup. And we can go from deep to shallow all across the board about how incompetent this guy is.

But the main thing about Trump is he always tends to make people worse. He's getting worse and everyone surrounding him is worse. And we're the collateral damage. I think that's exactly right. And I think you're right, too, that one thing that does separate out Donald Trump from some of the people you described, some of your neighbors who are only half-hearted in their right-wing enthusiasm, Trump has essentially the...

the conviction of being a top-notch grifter. He is able to say things with utter conviction, which are total lies, total fabrications, total invented out of, pulled out of his ass. But he says it with great authority and conviction. And I think this is one of the reasons why I believe that when he is gone, when he's finally walked off the political stage for good, there'll be a lot of Trump imitators coming

But none that will have his gifted grift, because I think his superpower is utter lack of shame and is willing to be completely shameless, whereas most of these other people, they have still a little bit of shame that nags at them when they're lying or they're completely betraying their constituents. What do you think happened to little Marco?

I mean, that is just he looks like a hostage situation. Like in the videos that I've seen, it looks like his soul has been drained from his body. I've never really agreed with him on anything, but I didn't think he was. I knew he was a right winger, but I didn't think he was, you know, full tilt, anti-constitution. Putin's not a war criminal and all the 180 that he's done.

Is it that people get so close to power they get intoxicated by it? Or is there just no conviction from the jump? If you're a Republican, you just worship money and power above everything and you've sold your soul and then you just pick what talking points are popular to get you elected. I mean, what is that?

You know, I've talked to a lot of these people that ended up joining the Trump administration who in the beginning were more or less serious. And they all think and I had this conversation with some of the nominees in this second round of Trump administration. They all think they're going to be the exception. Right.

They all think that, no, I'll be able to go run the State Department like a rational human being would. I'll be the exception. Or, no, I won't be asked to do anything immoral, unethical. Or if I do, I'll refuse and it will be perfectly fine. No. It's just a question of how much time it's going to take before you're asked to do something really awful. And what you decide at that moment will define your career for the rest of your life, will

will be those judgments. And they almost all end up betraying their ideas. Sometimes they're more often than not their values. There are only a few exceptions. One was Secretary Mattis.

the defense secretary in the first Trump administration, who got to the point where he's like, "Okay, I'm out of here. I can't, in good conscience, go along with what the president wants. He's entitled to have somebody who'll carry out his crazy ideas. That ain't gonna be me." - I have a question regarding all of these cabinet secretaries. I look at Pete Hegseth, Kristi Noem, profoundly incompetent, incompetent based on all their actions, their experience, all the things.

And I think is I know Donald Trump is incompetent, except at grifting, like you said.

But is this is he on purpose making the United States weak? I just read that Washington Post editorial that said the United States is committing suicide. And I look at these cabinet posts, Tulsi Gabbard. Now we have this new 22 year old landscaper who's going to be the terrorist prevention person. And I'm like, does he want us to be attacked or is it just such reckless disregard?

Yeah, it's a really good question, because if you were going to design a presidency to be most destructive of our standing in the world, of our excellence, our scientific capability, our economic well-being, you would design a Donald Trump presidency. So is it willful self-destruction? I think in terms of the president's part, he picked these bozos out.

for his administration because he didn't want someone like Secretary Mattis. He didn't want anyone of any independence or stature who could say no to him. He was done with that. It was going to be utter sycophants, no matter how bizarre, unqualified, etc. But I also think that among the people that are filling out this administration form,

In addition to just cutting everything to make room for tax cuts for rich people, there is an element of the arsonist glee in watching things burn. And they are just burning things to the ground. And I do think they're really burning the country to the ground. We are...

held now in horrible esteem around the world, which makes us less safe. Some of our closest allies now are infuriated with us. The Canadians are sending American goods back to us. They don't want them on their shelves. This was one of our closest trading partners. Our NATO allies feel like we've betrayed Ukraine. Ukraine feels like we've betrayed Ukraine because the administration is betraying Ukraine. And

And so, yeah, I mean, one thing that really in particular stands out among the horrors is

This just crusade against science. The attack on the NIH and all of the innovation and brilliance that comes out of NIH to help cure disease. The attacks on NASA, National Science Foundation, the attack on our universities. It's like they want to kill the goose that lays the golden egg. That really helps our economy and helps our people. It's so self-destructive.

Okay, let's shift gears and talk a little bit about the Democratic Party. Obviously, in disarray, it's just a huge black eye to get beat by Trump again. And you have the far left, you have the centrists, and there seems to be...

lacking of a unifying message. So my message for you, my question for you is moving forward, if we are to make a makeup ground for losing working class voters, the best argument I can see is that look at what happens when people are beholden to corporations. Donald Trump enabled Musk and Musk is now in the process of destroying Trump during, you know, via his

attack of the big, beautiful bill. And I hate calling it that. So I'll call it the big, beautiful bullshit. But can Democrats, when we are also beholden to corporations, make that claim to the American public? Because I believe in having credible messengers. I think you have to have credible messengers. And I think Democrats are held to a higher standard. Republicans are expected to be dipshits. Everybody just kind of lets them get away with a lot of stuff with impunity.

The burden of being the adults and being the party of moral clarity does fall on us. Fair or unfair, it is what it is. So how do you think the Democrats reconcile the corporate donors that we do have since Citizen United and taking an economic populist message to try to get these people back to the Democratic Party?

Well, I think your question is really at the heart of matters, which is if we want to win the Senate, if we want to become a durable majority in both houses, if we want to make sure we win the White House, it's not enough to rely on their failures and their corruption. The Democratic Party has to have a bold agenda of its own. It has to be seen as a positive force and most particularly on the economy. And I think the central challenge we're facing right now is that people are working harder than ever.

It's not that they're out of work. We have fairly low unemployment, but people are working, but they just can't make enough to get by. And a lot of that has been this phenomenal growth of corporate power in America, the marginalization of labor, the constant attack on the ability to collectively bargain.

And with the advent now of AI, this gap between those who are doing super well and all the rest of us is going to grow and grow and grow if we don't address it. And I think the Democratic Party

needs to be the champion of making the economy work for people, making housing affordable again, building a lot more housing, getting stuff done, taking on the big corporations to make sure that the little guy can earn a good living for themselves and their family. The question to me that's at the heart of our democracy right now is, if you're working hard in America, can you still earn a good living for yourself and your family? And for too many people, the answer is no.

Democrats need to be the party willing to take on any special interest, take on all that dark money, bring about campaign finance reform in order, I think, to regain the public trust. I have another idea of how we could regain the public trust. I think all of the donors that have donated to Democrats,

obviously maybe believe in democracy and stability. And the piece that's missing from this attack, defense of democracy. I see, you know, the Democrats are fighting. You have podcasters. You have kind of legacy media. Not really. They're kind of saying Washington. And you see the protests. You see the Bernie AOC rallies. The component that's missing is Fortune 500 CEO business.

businesses have not been standing up to Trump and applying pressure to your colleagues from across the aisle.

And I would like to see, as somebody who lives in literal MAGA experimentation petri dish, they try everything here first, I would like to see these businesses that have been so fortunate to be American businesses, that have made billions of dollars, that have the luxury of not paying their employees a livable wage and then get subsidized by the United States taxpayer when their employees are on Medicaid, need SNAP, need food stamps, etc.,

I think the Democratic Party needs to go to all of these people because they all say all the time, the stock market loves stability. The economy loves stability. Well, Donald Trump is not stable. He's a complete schizophrenic, whacked out nut job. I mean, needs a padded cell, straight jacket. It's very obvious. I feel like a collaboration from the Democrats...

And the corporate people who have donated to Democrats to say, hey, there's a big problem here and we've all been a part of it. But we're all going to start applying pressure to stop this authoritarian regime because he is draining into it looks like it appears as he's.

intentionally draining every pillar of power that the United States of America has. Our ability to defend ourselves, to defend against espionage, to have a stable economy, etc. So what do you think about that idea?

I like that idea. And to me, and I guess getting back to the Robert Carroll observation about power revealing, it reveals a lot about our institutions, too. And what we're seeing is we're seeing corporations go hat in hand to the president to get out from under the tariffs and essentially try to

ingratiate themselves, often with big donations to the inaugural fund or this fund or that. You've got Amazon paying $40 million for a docudrama about Melania. That's so gross. Oh, it's so gross. And then you've got, you talked about traditional legacy media, you've got ABC that paid off Trump over that frivolous litigation. You have CBS, Paramount, now considering making their own payment. And these payments are not to the Treasury. They're payments to Donald Trump.

in order to get a merger in the case of Paramount. And you've got law firms that essentially cowarded out and won't take on causes unpopular to the president. Now, we're starting to see happily some exceptions to that.

After there were universities capitulating, Harvard stepped up and is in a full life or death struggle with the administration. You've got law firms stepping up, but we haven't seen corporations stepping up to the degree we've seen corporations. They were on the inauguration stage, basically kissing up, not stepping up.

So I do think we need to try to—

And I feel like there's leverage. You hear Jamie Dimon kind of, you know, he's throwing a few, some shade there. And, you know, behind the scenes, they nicknamed him Taco. I mean, so these people are talking behind his back all the time. And I just feel like...

God, if we just keep going and keep going, is there going to be an economy left to save? I mean, it just I think the mistake of Democrats and the mistake of Americans is we operate under assumption politics. We assume Donald Trump won't win. We assume the economy is not going to crash. We assume people are going to do the right things.

And I feel like right now we need to say we need to start assuming the worst and react accordingly because you have people that watch the news and you're in the epicenter of it in the United States Senate who know what's going on. And then you have a lot of people who are like, I'm going to sit this out. I think I'm going to watch reality TV for a bit or watch cats on Instagram. And so I feel like those of us that are actively involved in this, I would love to see the private sector stand up to him because they have so much to lose.

you know i think you put your finger on one of the key levers that we really haven't utilized you know those of us in elective office we can urge corporations to do this or that they'll generally blow us off and do whatever they want to do that seems to be more my experience but consumers on the other hand they've got a lot of leverage over these companies and just to give you one example i remember years ago

a target, the company target made, I think, a $500 contribution to an anti-gay marriage initiative, I think, in Minnesota. And it went public because they gave money the wrong way. So it became public.

And as a result, Target customers were like, hey, this is not why we shop at Target. And if that's where you're coming from, we're going to stop shopping there. And I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall of the board of directors meeting at Target because undoubtedly someone said, OK, who's the genius that got us involved in this? They then made a $500 contribution on the other side of the ballot measure and said, OK, we're done. We're out.

And basically, if consumers make their voices heard, you know, essentially vote with their feet and with their wallet, then you're not going to have these corporations doing this right wing stuff if it's threatening their customer base. So I think that is a really untapped bit of important potential right there. This episode of I've Had It is brought to you by Progressive Insurance.

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One thing that we sit back in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, and see a lack of is like fiery democratic response. It seems to me that there could be hellfire damnation every single day for the crazy crap Trump does and his officials do, the things they do and say and the lies they tell.

And then, like, Chuck Schumer's going to write a very strongly worded letter to Harvard and Hakeem Jeffries after someone was, you know, arrested in the halls of the House. You know, he's going to respond in the right kind and moment. And I'm like, the moment's passed and you haven't responded. I see just a vacuum and we need action.

the Democrats to fight. And when I see the polls, that the Democrats approval rating is so low, it's because they have a layup every day to fight this. And it just seems very tepid. The response seems tepid. So how do we get leaders to meet the moment better than what they are now?

Yeah, no, I get the frustration. Look, I'm doing everything I can. Every day I get up and like, OK, how am I going to fight this this horror show today? And, you know, I organized one of the first shadow hearings. I brought in people who've been fired by the Justice Department to talk about the corruption in that department. You've got Cory Booker, you know, holding the floor for 25 hours. I want to say something. There's a problem right there.

Right now, credible messengers are so important. And I love Cory Booker. And we had Cory Booker on and he held the floor for 25 hours. But people are so sick of inauthentic lying politicians. And when he voted for Jared Kushner's dad, the credibility right now in this moment, our listeners, we have over three million, completely went sour on him because this is a time to have conviction. And Cory Booker in voting for Jared Kushner's dad completely erased that

all 25 of those hours with the Democratic base because we're like, seriously, Senator?

Seriously, you're voting for a felon to be with another felon because clearly he donated to your campaign at some time. And that's the shit that people are sick of. That's what Trump came in in 2016 and called them all out. He said, little Marco, you're a liar. Ted Cruz, you're a liar. And people were like, somebody's breaking it. And they liked it. And he filled that vacuum. He's a nut. He's a liar and all that. But when we see Democrats being duplicitous like Senator Booker,

It just people are not very forgiving of this in this moment right now. And I we had him on. I think he was a great guest. But now when I see when I see his Instagram post where he's fighting and I'm like, nice try. We know that when it comes to money, we know which way you're going to vote. And that's a real problem. Like, it's not that you have to be pure. We're not looking for purity, but we're looking for clarity. And there was ambiguity in that vote for Jared Kushner's dad, in my opinion, and lots of other people's opinions. Yeah.

Well, I'm no defender of Jared Kushner's dad. I think it was a horrible choice for ambassador or anything else for that matter. I never thought he should get pardon or whatever kind of clemency he got from Trump. I am a big fan of Cory Booker. And I'll tell you one of the things that I think Cory has done, and this is part of the point you're making, is

One of the things that we discovered after the last election was that we weren't talking to people in the way that many of them are getting their information, like on your show. And we were really neglecting the whole digital space. And you can have the best message in the world, which we didn't have, but even if you did,

If people don't hear it, it's not a much value. Corey has really been leading the effort in the Senate caucus to get Senate members to be using digital platforms much more effectively. It's one of the reasons why

I start a YouTube channel. I do a YouTube video just about every day. We now have the most watched YouTube channel on the Hill. That's a major investment of time, apart from Bernie. I think Bernie's in his own league. But anyway, I think...

I like him. I think his heart's in the right place. I'm just saying when we're looking when right now, the Democrats are just dying for somebody to fight for them. And then you see Cory Booker stand up for 25 hours. You're like, fuck, yes.

somebody gives a damn when we're out here in this mega hellscape. And then you see that, and he's the only Democrat that did it. You ask why, and then you get into chat GPT and on Google, and then you find out why that it's because of money. And that it,

Right now, I think that the Democratic senators need to be united. I think they need to be 100 percent united against fascism, Trump, authoritarian, pardoning criminals, hiring criminals, all this shit, no matter if they gave you a gajillion dollars last cycle or if they've been saved by Jesus Christ 95 times since their infraction. I think we have to be a hard no and credible messengers moving forward are so important to advance the party. And I hate it that Corey did that.

because that's what makes the whole thing. But it is a big thing out in the area where y'all are trying to get, you know, the base back intact. What he did is a very, very big thing. And I think, and it goes back to the standard that Democrats are held to a higher standard, but that's just where we are. And I'd rather be on that side of it. But,

I feel like that it goes to pump's question. I mean, with you about the leadership, like Schumer should have been like, no, we're all voting the same on this stuff. Moving forward. We did 99 to no for Rubio. That was a huge mistake. Look at what a piece of shit he's turned into. We're, we're,

We're all voting against this now. And that's what the citizens need to get behind the Democrats right now, I feel, just messaging this to you from the— Well, you are very much preaching to the choir. I have been a bit of a pest sometimes in our caucus meetings.

urging on, for example, on that continuing resolution that we took up a few months ago to fund the government that we should in a unified way vote that thing down. And we're going to have that fight again in September when the budget is due and

We, I think, darn well need to be united. When you're in the minority in both the House and the Senate and you've got a would-be tyrant in the White House, you don't have the luxury of being divided over things like how we fund the government. So I'm with you there. Okay. And we do appreciate your work. I want to play a fun game with you. It'll just take a minute or two. It's called Hat It or Hit It. Oh, my God. Welcome to Hat It or Hit It. I would hit it. Hat it.

I hit it every day, sometimes twice a day. Senator, had it or hit it coffee? Had it. I have never been a coffee drinker. I drink iced tea all the time. And in particular, I really don't like Starbucks. Sweet or unsweet iced tea? Unsweet. Unsweet. Do you put any sweetener in it?

No, I'm a purist. I am too. I like an unsweet iced tea, but I do like pharmaceutical strength coffee every single morning. But then I don't drink it the remainder of the day. Okay. Had it or hit it your coworkers?

Oh, totally hit it. It sounds wrong to say that, though. But they're wonderful. You know, we're only as good as our staff. My staff is great and my Democratic colleagues are great. If my co-workers, you're including some of my Republican colleagues, then definitely had it. Great answer. All right. Had it or hit it. Elon Musk.

Oh, totally had it. I am enjoying this is was my only guilty pleasure of the first Trump administration was watching all of them throw each other under the bus. Yeah. So I'm totally enjoying my ringside seat watching Elon trash that big, ugly bill. And now to see the fight between Trump and Leonard Leo, you know, just incredible.

Let's make some popcorn and enjoy it. It's delicious. I love it. Okay, last one, Senator. Hat it or hit it, the United States of America? I'll hit it. You know, we're going to get through this. We're a great country. We're a resilient country. There are wonderful, beautiful people in every state of the union. This too shall pass. What we do in this moment is going to determine, though, how quickly it passes and how much damage we suffer in the meantime. But I believe in this country, and we will get through it.

Senator, thank you so much for taking the time to come on. I've had it. Your staff has been great. We've been emailing with them for a month or two trying to make it happen. And we made it happen. Our listeners will love this. They really appreciate so much hearing from people working in the government, especially a senator like you, who I would call a Trump fan.

And I love how much you get under his skin. That is definitely a bonus point. All right. Have good luck at work. We heard the bell sounding that you got to go vote. That's what that was, listener. And we'll hope to see you later. Sounds great. You take care now. So it's crazy that listeners. So before he came on, he was telling us like.

And if you hear the bell, it's because they ring the bell. So he was in a Senate office and they ring the bell for them to go vote. But you know what? I really enjoyed that interview with him. I did, too, because I know he's been on the impeachment. He's made his thoughts about Trump known, yet he's thoughtful about how he says it. Like on the Elon Musk, I think Trump respects Trump.

Elon Musk's money? No, I think he's owned by Trump's money, but he's not going to say that. But I think he's a fighter. And I just wish people would be more vocal in the Democratic Party. I think he, you know, he said through that you're preaching to the choir. I think...

I understand where he is. I think Cory Booker is probably a phenomenal co-worker. He's one of my favorite guests we had on. He met with us on a Saturday, on a Sunday. No, he's great. And I wish that he would answer for that because it was just, I think credible messengers are super important. That doesn't mean that your track record has to be perfect. Like now they've all said they regret the vote for Marco Rubio. I just, I wish that he could look at that and say, you know what? I, I,

Here's why I did it. He donated to me. He was a personal friend of mine and I let that get in the way. And now that I have distance from it, that was fucking stupid. I was the only Democrat that did that.

Or just to triple down on it, I read that response that Cory Booker had was that Jared Kushner's dad was all about criminal justice reform. And I was just like, give me a break. They just pardoned all these freak show felons like it doesn't that boat doesn't float. And so I don't know. I just feel like we have to apply pressure to especially the Democratic Democratic Party leaders now.

Like that should have been a unanimous decision out of the United States Senate and that Cory Booker was that one. And I still follow him on Instagram and stuff. And I see him trying to go after and he's a good poster. They do good posts. But he the credible messenger aspect of it is diminished for me. He lost credibility with me. And I don't like.

I wish that they would stand up and fight and say we're not vote for any of these fuckers across the board period if that man is okay with working for a convicted felon that behaves the way Donald Trump behaves then clearly he's disqualified right all you have to know is that he runs with Trump that's enough for me to say no because nobody that had it has any morality ethical standards

It's going to run around with Trump. You don't see him surrounded by the best people. You see him surrounded by bottom feeders. Yeah, it's it's total flea bag. It's a flea market. Yeah, that's what the whole thing is. But one thing that Adam Schiff, I wish I would have

Probed a little bit more is how the Democratic Party reconciles its corporate donors He spoke about that and that that's a problem but you know Bernie's the only one in AOC that really have clarity on that and If it is that the Democrats need to be firm about the message like citizens united Open this up. So we're only going to take money from corporations that

that oppose fascism and support democracy, whatever it is. I wish that there was no private money in elections at all, that our politicians were beholden to no one, but Supreme Court

Court Justice John Roberts opened that up and he'll be he'll be known forever as the Supreme Court that started the United States on the road to fascism with his stupid Citizens United ruling. Right. Absolutely. And under George W. Bush. Absolutely. All right. Thanks for joining. We will see you next Tuesday and Thursday. I'll tell you what I've had it with.

Listen up, patriots, gay-triots, and natriots. We have a new podcast that has dropped. It's called IHIP News. It's Monday through Friday, every day, 15 to 20-minute hot takes on the political landscape of the United States of America, always served with a side of petty grievances.

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