Talking Dateline: Losing Faith
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Hello everyone, this is Andrew a. canning. This is another episode talking date line, and I have the honor today of interviewing josh monkey z or bank as you may know him for his episode called losing faith.

Hi, Andrea. hi.

So this story .

losing faith is if you haven't heard IT or seen IT yet, it's right below this one in the list of podcast. So you can go there and listen to IT and then come right back here.

Yes, I am very excited to talk about this episode because I was so wild. And also I am coming to you right now from a shot. So anyone who who may end up seeing this on video, maybe not if you do I look like a man of black hole because all the lights off, because they're setting .

up for our next in area. Let me just say i'm at home now, but i'm just back from crime. Kn.

oh yeah.

where you and Dennis and what's his name were really missed .

that key guy?

Yes, that's his name. I could not remember. yes.

Well, that's so nice to know.

Was IT fun. IT was great. There was a lot of people good.

That's wonderful. Let's go。 Let's go on to losing faith. And the title is losing faith because of the last name of this couple.

and because because .

we lost jme faith.

because Jennifer lost faith in, you know, I guess, her marriage, and because darren, the killer lost faith in the woman that he had, that was sort of the one that got away all those years to go, who he thought he had another shot at. And he turned out now SHE was manipulating him all the way. Yeah.

there's a lot of lot of meaning to losing faith. A lot of meaning in the title know the .

thing that's great about this episode and the thing I like about all stories that are like this is that there's a point where you think to yourself, you know, if you're a regular date line view, you think like I I know what's going on here, right? And then you, oh, wait, I didn't realize that and then you think, okay, now I understand what's going on and you like, wow, one minute.

really you know, this was a wild one, really. I mean, I just, this is like the kind of date line that makes you lose faith in humanity for a moment.

I agree, IT is astonishing. A lot of questions are answered in our story, and a lot of questions were answered you in the investigation. Like what really happened? Okay, now we know what really happened, but why SHE wanted to do IT that way, and why this is some kind of like lifelong thing of hers.

You know what he did with her x husband, which, you know, one of things that came out the trial that not in our story is that SHE SHE did this kind of thing in high school didn't try to anybody kill, but I think got persuaded. One boyfriend, like, you know, beat up the the old, the new boyfriend beat up the old boyfriend. I mean.

there's this is her. Mo.

this is yeah. And it's it's not just that he wanted her husband dead. It's that SHE wanted to manipulate someone else into doing IT and thinking that they were on the side of the Angels for doing that. And that is a weird, creepy thing that I can't remember seeing before.

And also, I thought to myself, how does SHE get these men to just do what he wants or consider doing what he wants? What is IT about her that they seem to be .

under her spell? I mean, she's clearly very smart because SHE new exactly sort of what what buttons to push with their in Lopez to get him to think, not only i'm gona drive six hundred, forty miles, ten hours, whatever IT is to dallas for my home and kill this guy, but i'm going to feel good about doing that because i'm protecting someone not, you know, that I might be technically breaking the law is thinking themselves but I got to the defense er, which is this get is a horrible, horrible guy who's who's bringing an other men to rape his wife and he completely bought into that that play and only worth because he knew what to say to him and how to say IT.

yeah and and I think she's prayed on his vulnerability that, you know, this is a guy who's so highly decorated in the military and you know the poor guy clearly and I say, poor guy, I don't know. I don't want to make him a victim because he did do something incredibly horrible.

However, I do feel like SHE prayed on, you know, that that P, T, S, D, or the the trauma that he had likely experienced from all those years in war and all those horrible things that he would have seen over over there. So, you know, well, yes, he did a very bad thing and and there's no excuses for that. SHE found the right kind of guy to Carry out, you know, her evil D I .

don't think there's any question that this wouldn't have happened without her lying to him about what Jamie e did mean. The prosecution made a couple of arguments. One is they argued, no, he didn't think he was on the side of the Angels.

He just wanted her after all these years. And he had so much misery his own life. And he thought, like the universe owes me a dead, and the dead is I get to finally be with this woman that I been thinking about a versus high school, right?

Because he had been thinking about in the military, there's a form you have to fill out, which tells them the military, our military, is some secret things about you that that won't be on your dog tags and that you won't reveal like not like your middle name or your hometown, but like something like, you know, like the security questions your bank asks you, right? And he was one of his security questions, like, who is your first girlfriend? General faith? You know, right? I mean, he was SHE was a part of his life.

He was on his mind.

And this yet for many, many years, this wouldn't have happened if he had known exactly. So how to apply that pressure? So you know, one of the prosecution argument was he wanted her back. This wasn't about anything he did this, his seizing an opportunity, killing me guy killing Jamie and that now he's going to be in. But the other argument is sort of the the SHE twist ted him into her sort of remotely controlled weapon and ah I think that's accurate I mean like he's the gun but you know it's her hand on the trigger even though you know dan's holder yeah .

highly manipulative. Their argument .

was even if you believe everything that Jennifer said, even if IT turns out that he is true, right, that James was gonna bring in, other people are raper and maybe you know, kill her in the process that that was he's planted and how happened before and the Bruce in the the cut lip and all the stuff that will turn out to me so utterly, totally funny even that is true. There's a million steps between not doing anything and calling the police like this is how 的 是 有一个 just because Jennifer says don't call the cops a it'll get worse that doesn't mean you don't call the cops the argument could be you call the cops and you say， look, he says don't call the cops and he says, i'll get worse and essential deny and so got to be ready when you .

go over there yeah absolutely.

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Deadline, of course, the very serious, serious content. But occasionally we do get moments of .

humor that bring .

some levity in a very dark and serious situation. And there were there were actually quite a few in this episode. First of all, there's party favors at the funeral that was very bizarre was bit .

IT was that book that SHE made?

And then one of the ladies that you interviewed who was quite funny, SHE said, like, however, a long they'd been married, SHE was like, yeah, i'm not doing a valentine book for my husband. And at that point, and I thought to myself, yeah, I probably wouldn't do when I love my husband, but I probably wouldn't do. One of that was either. Now you realized you IT was very likely all for show, for all of her friends and family to see. Look how much I Carried about him.

you know because it's not like the kind of thing announced on the day .

to my house. And your other funny line was, um yeah, how do you arrest rambo? W, yeah because this is he's got to be the most decorated. I feel like person suspect that we've had on date line. He was .

fearless and he was going to great on the battle field. And he was, you know, he he took care of of injured iraqi is as well as injured, you know, american soldiers. And he was a guy with a big heart, which is one of the things that kind of got used against him.

And you know, he had had this miserable time. His marriage broke up. He was really isolated during pandemic. So SHE comes along and exactly the right time. Now that was certain distance. I don't think SHE, I don't think he knew his previous situation, but once he figured that out, SHE definitely used all of that against him and yeah, he he's exactly the last kind of guy that you want to approach on ground and walk up to the door of his place and knock on the door yeah .

and it's on that property. I mean, this was one of the matheus houses i've ever seen on a date line. And I and I wondered if it's sort of yeah goes to like his, his, his mental state almost way .

I looked before the search more and the will look after the search more weren't terribly different Normally like after after law enforcement execute to search for IT, you can definitely tell stuff moved all over the place. But in this case, yeah, I mean, that house was a look like a bomb he did and made that I think that was a huge, huge relief.

Law enforcement that he happened to leave his property in a truck with one of his daughters know and clearly wasn't expecting anything. And then he gets stopped and and ended up being. He was taken in a custody without without any issue, without any any shot fired, which was a great good for everybody. Yes, but yeah, I mean that that house, I mean, that tells you a little bit about how he was living, about sort of how how much he how much he'd let himself go during that time and you i'm so a surprise because yeah you know daughter is living .

with him yeah which is sad so I mean.

i'm wondering what they yeah some points to him like, know they saw that as a sign that something was wrong with him. You know.

I think something was .

wrong with him. He had no question. He had a traumatic brain injury, which he suffered overseas, and he suffered from B, T, S, D.

I mean, those things are not an issue. He was an injured vet that ended up getting used against him. definitely. no. I mean, should you have made different choices prosecution, you would say yes. As I said before, there's a lot of stops on that train between doing nothing and killing Jamie and he he didn't take .

any of them yeah one of the interesting things about the story too is no, he goes out to walk his dog jammy with Jenny and you know he's gone down and there are so many uh, witness accounts of because this is a busy neighbourhood, you know people are out starting, you know, going about their day and one of the the clues that was that really just stood out that was so misleading in the beginning was the tea in the back window because you're in texas, you're in dallas, you're thinking texas rangers. But IT IT was like, IT was so wrong. Yeah IT IT was leading them in the wrong direction.

That was one of the things like that made us like like pay attention to the story right away was that, you know, look like IT IT was tea for texas, but IT was tea for tanto. Say, you know, now all you sort of need to know about what kind of neighborhood Cliff is is that people heard the shots and they didn't, you know, light down on the floor and cover their ears. Uh, they came outside immediately, you know, and they like like one of the neighbors, like took a picture of the truck driving away with this camera now and they have .

the neighbors you want.

the neighbors want and they stayed with Jennifer until the ambuLance, the cops out there and then afterwards they made all this food for the family and then they set up that go fund me. Um you know, could chunk a wich ended up going to the actual killer. But the neighbor's hearts were absolutely in .

the right place. In the beginning they were great. And wasn't Jennifer one of the SHE was one .

of the ones who was saying .

that there was the texas .

ranger sticker right? Moments was the the, you know the T. V interview, which he goes on with maria, girl from abc five and dallas and he says, you, i'm afraid this isn't onna, get solved this truck with the texas anger sticker, you know, let's all find IT and you I in the enforcement needs out and then like that day she's calling there that take IT down.

Take the sticker off I think there's a part of her too that just loves and i'm just guessing here loves the attention you know that you get from from what like her being the victim quote and quote victim.

you know I yes, clearly there's something going on there. IT wasn't just a wanted her husband dead or SHE wanted out of the marriage. IT was that he wanted in dead in some violent way that involved somebody standing up for her, even though that turned out to be absolutely one hundred percent on true.

like her White night or something that was coming. yeah. And someone, you know, someone in your story, they really said exactly what I was thinking, you know.

And IT goes to what we've been talking about, Jennifer, just dump ed the guy, get divorce. You know what is this is so traumatic and convoluted and, you know, and evil, and he doesn't have to die. You can just you.

but in one senses that that clearly wasn't the agenda. This wasn't about getting out of the mars. This was about whatever IT is some kind of way that he feels when somebody stands up and defends her even if the reason that she's think you're being defended for done really exist and you know, darn, tried to make that his defense and the prosecutors rebuttal of that was okay.

Yes, you can kill someone if somebody else, if that third party's death or significant injury is imminent. Not the next day, not hours or now, not, you know, tomorrow, like imminent, like it's happening right now. Yes, you can shoot another person. But this case, the argument that didn't qualify yeah .

and and just when I thought I had heard all the, you know, here SHE could light up a room yeah, you know, we got a new one. Yeah, put up the bowling. Ali, yeah.

that's right. That's right. yeah. I mean, no, IT turns out the Jimmy face was exactly the guy that everybody thought he was. He was this, like, sweet guy, kind of goofy love wine shirts.

wine shirts, dog tracks, gold chains.

Yeah, you know, was friends with these two very attractive women. But like, like, nothing is not a chance in the world that anything what happened between them because he just wasn't that kind of guy and yeah, was like this sweet, nice, faithful guy, which you almost certainly faithful.

There you go again. yeah. Well, this one, I mean, this was, this was a crazy one.

This is I can't think of too many others which are this crazy. It's this kind of thinking, you know, the the instead of divorce, let's come up with an insane plot to get out of this marriage.

And you know what, it's one of those episodes that really makes you think you know about like there's so many layers to IT about, yeah, why SHE doing this? You know what's wrong with her? Did SHE have personality disorder?

Even after SHE was convicted, SHE wrote family a letter from the slam saying, no matter what you hear, I had to agree to certain things. I took this play to protect my daughter, so I am not really admit naming. You know, I love Jimmy. I could never heard IT in that kind of .

thing like you. Okay, you so much appreciated that letter. Not, yeah. Well, losing faith was a gosh, an interesting one. Thank you so much, josh, for um giving us your insight into this incredibly twisted story.

Thank you for taking time away from a shoot to talk daylight .

with me always. Don't forget date line air thursdays at ten nine central and fridays at nine, eight central N, N, B, C. And each week, come back here for a new talking deadline. Until then, thanks for listening.

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