Episode 653: Spooky Lakes (Volume 2)
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Hey weirdos, before we unleash today's macabre mystery, we were wondering, have you ever heard of Wondery Plus? It's like a secret passage to an ad-free lair with early access to episodes. You can join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or in Apple Podcasts or Spotify. You're listening to a Morbid Network podcast.

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The AT&T Guarantee means connectivity you can depend on, deals you want, and service you deserve. Or they'll make it right. Visit att.com slash guarantee to learn more. AT&T connecting changes everything. Terms and conditions apply. Visit att.com slash guarantee for details. Hey, weirdos. I'm Elena. I'm Ash. And this is Morbid. Morbid.

It's morbid and today I'm being bullied in the office, everybody. Honestly, I can't even like say that's not happening. I'm getting actively bullied by not only my sister, but also my employee and friend, Mikey. Um.

I burped and, you know, people burp, okay? And let me just... Hold on. She's saying it like she burped. Oh, I just burped once. No, I wasn't finished yet, but you're just still bullying me. No, we always burp a lot in here. It's kind of our thing. And Elena burps all the time and it literally feels like it sprays blood at people because they feel so sharp coming out of her fucking face. It's like, what?

And you're like, oh my god, duck and cover! Somebody call someone! She's bleeding out of every orifice! And then I burp, and you know, they're a little liquidy. They're not liquidy like I taste liquid. This is so gross, but it's fine. They sound a little yuckas. Elena has told me for all of my life that they sound like the bog of eternal stench, but today everyone decided to go deeper. It's like an episode of The Vile Files in here. We're going deeper. And

And Mikey said to me, Mikey said to me, you know, actually, I feel pity for, my mouth is, my jaw, unclicked from the top part, and it's on the floor. Pity? You pity me?

No, not you. He's a poppin'. He pities your burps. Which are part of me. Which are part of me. And so I got upset with him. And then he was like, no, no, no, let me backtrack except dig my hole even further. And he said, do you know what it is? And I looked at him and I said, don't fuck it up. Don't dig this hole. And this motherfucker got a power shovel. He said, I used to work in a hospital. What the fuck?

have to do with anything i sound like a hospital this is like mary cosby telling me that i smell like hospital so anyway i'm upset um here's the thing you guys didn't think this episode all of that was correct it's true what she says is true true true statement thank you um except what um

She sounds like she's going to vomit every time she burps. But we needed to really describe them. The reason is not like, oh, there's liquid involved. It's like, no, you're going to throw up. And so we all brace like, ah, she's going to puke. I'm not going to. Every time. And it's scary. Yours are scary. Yours come out of nowhere. And I agree. And sometimes they sound like a shot. Yeah. Like a bop. I'm like, ah! And herein lies the difference. I know.

I know too. I'm not dispelling. I'm not dispelling that description of my burps. I'm not dispelling it, but it hurts my feelings. You just don't have as many feelings as I do. Okay? And the pity I feel is because I love you. I don't want you to feel gross. You're making me feel gross.

Get out of here! Scram! She doesn't want to talk to you! I'm getting fired. Bye. I usually fire Mikey on the rewatch or listen to that, but today he's fired from every job. All of it.

No, just kidding. Please continue working for us. Don't leave. Don't leave. Oh my god. Please don't. Anyways, I bet you never thought when you turned on Morbid today that we'd be depicting each other's burps. Sorry, guys. You know, sometimes it'd just be like that. Yeah, today's a loosey-goosey episode anyway, so I feel like it's going to feel a lot like OG Morbid. It is today. I think we're feeling... Oh, now you're going to cough during my episode? I don't know.

I pity you. I pity you. Is that a little cough you have today? I'm screaming. I'm just kidding. Oh my god. I'm literally crying.

We have like a, like today's like a spooky episode, but also a true crime episode. Yeah, for both of us. There's full true crime in here. This isn't just spooky-ooky, but there's also spooky-ooky. Yeah, there's a little part of mine that I think, like I'm going to give you like a preview, like a brief overview of what happened, but I actually think...

I might cover part of mine on like a full blown out. Like in depth. Yeah. And mine is like, there's only so much information about it. So I got as much as I possibly could. And I told the whole story. It would have been a mini morbid had I not stepped up. It's true. It would have been a mini morbid. But you know what? But you know what?

Maybe they'll come back. Maybe. Maybe. Maybe wink wink nudge nudge. Maybe. 2025 is a wild year. So maybe we'll see Minnie Morbids again. Someday. Maybe the theme song will come back.

Maybe. I'm not making promises. I'm just saying. It's possible. We have to find the file. Do we have that file? Maybe you'll have to do it again. I'll do it again. An updated version. Oh, maybe I'll add a little flair onto it if that happens. We're just like, you know... I'm going to get back in the studio. Yeah, back in the stewed, you know? The stewed, really? I like that. I forgot the pod lab. I'm in the stewed. I'm in the stewed. Yeah, so maybe, I don't know, that's something to chew on. But...

But other than that, it's... We're trying to... Spring is almost here, everybody. It's like 20 days to spring. And in New England over here, it's been fucking awful this winter. It's been fucking freezing and so goddamn dry that I've been sick the entire winter. I just got the norovirus, in fact. Like, luckily, knock on everything, we were able to contain it to just me, which is always the goal. But...

But yeah, it hasn't been a banner season for me. So I'm getting on my supplement game and getting myself out of this. I'm telling you, you've got to start drinking our Miracle Ostrom. I think it has saved me this winter because I got neurovirus, but I didn't get any of the colds that you guys were all getting. No, you really didn't. I didn't get...

one cold this season. I know. Not one. Yeah, it's crazy. And it tastes like watermelon. Yeah, that's true. That's a win-win right there. No colds plus watermelon. Well, I've been drinking liquid IVs. Liquid IVs are also great. We love a liquid IV. We do. Um,

And I've just, you know, I've been doing some turmeric and elderberry and zinc and vitamin C. She got me on the turmeric. All the good things. Just trying to boost that immune, you know, immune system. You gotta. But going into, because I want to go into spring and summer and fall and all the fun seasons. Healthy. Healthy.

Healthy. Thriving. You know? But I've been reading a couple books that are really good. Yeah? And I figured I'd just like quickly share them with you guys in case you're looking for something to read. Do so. So I just read Fantastic Land by Mike Bokovan. It's really good. And the audio book is fucking phenomenal. Nice. It's super fast paced. It's like, it's basically about a bunch of people getting stranded in a...

um amusement park during a hurricane and having to survive and it gets super gnarly i said nice but nice you're like that's great that's great for them good for uh it was really good though i thought it was really fun if you're looking for something really fun really dark really fucked up hell yeah and right now i'm reading this wretched valley by jenny keifer and so far it's really good really spooky i'm very intrigued by it nice

And we're just, I'm trying to get more leisure reading in done this year. I'm also trying to do that. We'll try to share our recommendations. Yeah. I was, I told Elena about Storygraph. It's like where you can log all your books and it's woman owned, which I love. Love that. I read, what have I read so far? I did So Thirsty by,

Rachel Harrison. I thought it was pretty good. It's like a quick read. It's fun. Yeah. I love that. It's just like a fun vamp tale. And then I just started our book club book. Me and Alayna have a book club with the two girls, one ghost, girlies. Sabrina and Corrine. Our brother Colton Coven. Hell yeah. And we're reading God of the Woods. I just started it. I think you're going to like it. Yeah, I'm excited to start that one. It's really good. And I've heard really good things about it. Yeah. So yeah, I have a bunch on my to be read. Yeah. I have my entire book.

entire bookshelf is to be read. I have a whole space on my bookshelf that is. Yeah. Me and Drew went on a Barnes & Noble date the other day and I was like, damn, I'm just buying all these books when I already have like 400 that I haven't even read yet. Oh, I have a problem with books. But it's a fun thing to buy. It is. I love books. Yeah. I will never regret buying too many books. And something about Barnes & Noble, I'm like...

I just want to buy everything here. I just want to buy all the books. All the books. It's true. It's great. I'm also on a Yellow Jackets kick. Me and Drew have literally flown through each season within like, I think it took us maybe two weeks. Yeah, it was actually like very impressive. Yeah, there was. How quickly you were able to. We took some time off, you and I, for February vacation for the kids. And there was a couple nights that Drew and I just stayed up until like 3 a.m. Like, no.

Weren't tired, like just stayed up. Yeah. And so we watched like a ton of Yellow Jackets and now we're up to like current. You're caught up. Yeah, we're caught up. And we got John and Elena to start watching it. It's true. We're only on episode two because we can maybe only get one episode done a night. Like we have to skip nights in between and stuff. So we will get there eventually. It'll take us a while, but.

So far, I really, I like it. Yeah. I'm intrigued so far. I think it really pops off in like the middle to the end of the first season. Yeah. And then season three so far, I think it's only been three episodes. The fourth one, I think, comes out tomorrow. Fourth episode. Yeah.

It's season three is like, I'm like, oh, fuck. It really goes there. Yeah. I couldn't watch the plane crash scenes because it's a little too. Yeah. I told her. Too visceral. I was like, tell, tell John like the end. Yeah. He just told me when it was fine to watch again. And then they do like the flashback. That's a fucking scary ass plane crash. I'm sure. I'm going to be talking a lot about plane crashes today. Cool. Yeah. That's fun. Yeah. Yeah.

it's part of my lake it's part of your your lake lore in my lake lore uh correct yeah and honestly that brings us right to it that we're going to be talking about some spooky lakes today spooky lakes and like kind of for me like national park because my lake is in a national park yeah there you go go visit national parks and support them right now yeah support them yeah hell yeah and keep them clean because a lot of people just got fired who were keeping them clean yeah so go take care of them yeah and support them yep good call

Yeah. So, dude, I can start with mine if you want. You better. You better, bitch. I was going to say, you better start, bitch. You better start, bitch. You want a listener tale? Not a listener tale. You want a spooky lake? This is a spooky lake, but it's going to start with a very real and very tragic murder. Oh. From 1906. Okay. So...

This is the story of Grace Brown's murder, and it is a very tragic one. Let's start at a great place, which is the beginning. I love starting there. Grace grew up in South Otselek, I think it is, in Chenango County in New York.

When she was young, she grew up on a dairy farm and she attended school and graduated at 16 years old. She had a very like normal upbringing on a dairy farm. Very cute farm upbringing. Nice. All was well until she moved to Cortland and lived with her sister Ada. Now living with her sister, she needed to find a job and she found a good one. It turns out she ended up working at the Gillette Skirt Factory in Cortland.

And upon beginning her employment there, she quickly became acquainted with the owner's nephew, Chester Gillette. He also worked there with her. He was from a wealthy family, but he was kind of all over the place. Like he was a little bit of a mess.

He could never hold down anything steady and he was kind of just living the high life with no responsibilities. Fun. So, and he was also like very much like macking on all the girls there. But he really focused in on Grace. So...

His uncle had tried to get to help him on the straight and narrow and he offered him a job at the factory. That's how he got the job. It was good pay. It was full time. So he was fine to take it because also there was a lot of women working there. That's kind of his ideal sitch. It really is. And he also probably liked the power he got from being like the nephew of the owner. Oh, yeah. Like it's the Gillette skirt factory and he's Chester Gillette. And you don't have to do like anything probably. Yeah. Yeah.

So it wasn't long before 20-year-old Grace, and she was 19 when they met, but 20 when she died. Okay. 20-year-old Grace and 23-year-old Chester began dating. It was a torrid affair, as all workplace affairs tend to be. I love a torrid affair. But it was all secret.

Of course. It was all very secret, not just because they worked together, but because she was a dairy farm girl who came from a farm background. He was a wealthy man about town, socialite, who was sought after by every girl in the upper class in the area and every girl in every class in the area. He was essentially ashamed.

to be dating a young woman who is considered to be lower class, like lower social scale than he was. What a douchebag. He was a douchebag. He didn't want people knowing he was dating a factory farm girl. It's like, okay, then don't date a factory farm girl because she can probably do better than you anyway. So don't waste her fucking time. Oh, she could have done so much better than him. I guarantee it. He's scum. Between a troll's toes.

Not only was he keen to keep this thing under wraps, but he was also freely and openly dating and sleeping with other women right in front of Grace. Grace was not pleased about this and expressed this displeasure often, but he didn't give a shit. He just didn't care how she felt. And it devastated her because I think this was like she was young and she had grown up on a farm. You know, like this was her big first big job. And I think this was like the first time she had actually...

been in a big relationship well and also like you think about the this you know vibes here like it's like the big hot shot nephew of the owner of the company that you work for takes an interest in you like she must have felt so special but then he's acting like a dick yeah he also convinced her to be with him unchaperoned which was scandal at the time oh

Because he didn't want anyone knowing they were together, so they couldn't have a chaperone. Right. And honestly, this was a big deal. And obviously now you're like, woohoo. But back then, this risked her entire reputation. Yeah. Like he did not give a shit that he was putting her entire social reputation at stake here. Because he would have been fine. Yeah, he didn't care at all. And he just never took her in public, ever. Never.

He would never take her in public. And that's so sad that that's the treatment that she felt she like was supposed to be taking at the time. It must have felt so demeaning. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

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Simplify your kiddo's mealtime with 30% off your first order. Go to littlespoon.com slash morbid30 and enter our code morbid30 at checkout to get 30% off your first Little Spoon order. Things got worse, though, near the summer of 1906 when she told Chester she was pregnant. And it was definitely his because she was not seeing anyone else.

He panicked, and she was also very anxious simply because it was 1906. It's not like unwed young mothers were treated like magical beings creating life. They were treated like whores who were unfit to be in proper society. In fact, from all the things that I was reading and seeing about this, it was literally the amount of women, young women, who ended up killing themselves. Oh, yeah.

They felt it was a better outcome than the social ostracization.

Yeah, that's a hot one. Why did I like, I totally blanked on how to say the word. It's going from the T to the Z. That's what it is. It's hard. Ostracization. There you go. Good call. Ostracization. Oh, I was kind of saying it wrong. Ostracization. Ostracization. That's hard to say. Yeah. Okay. It was better than being ostracized by society is what I'm thinking here. I love that you're like, you know what, we're going to just say it completely different. I was like, that's hard to say. So, yeah.

So, yeah, so this was like a big deal. It's not great. So she knew she had to hide out. She couldn't be around everybody. She went back to her family's farm and she communicated with Chester through letters. It was Chester who encouraged this, in fact, telling her to go hang out with her family and everything was going to be fine. Basically, go away. Get out of my face. Like, you fucking dick. He's a total dick.

He was very negligent with her feelings, very much still sleeping around and very uninterested in the idea of being a good partner or father. But he was also a liar and a very good manipulator. He had to have been. It's that kind of guy. So he had to keep her on a leash a bit because he was a guy who wanted to have his cake and eat it too.

Before she left, he had been ignoring her and making her feel just awful. But when the letters began, she basically found herself desperately begging him for attention or any kind of hope or hint that they would be married. Because she was like... Well, it's also like he's got this, like all this money and everything. It's like she doesn't have any resources to figure this out. So she's relying 100% on him to figure out their situation that they got themselves into together. Exactly. That's the thing. And she's like,

So she's basically like, give me any hope that you're going to marry me so that I can go out into society again. Right. I can't go out with this child until we're married and like.

And so, you know, and she started getting the attention that she was looking for. He started telling her, yes, he would marry her and they would have a life together and just wait. It's going to be fine. Like he started promising what he knew she wanted. I feel like that's not going to happen. No. Then one letter changed that. He told her he wanted to whisk her away for a romantic getaway.

And she was probably so happy. Oh, yeah. He told her he wanted to take her to the Adirondacks in July. And this felt like the moment that he was going to propose. She thought this was the wedding trip. Of course. Either proposing or we're actually getting married. And sources say Grace was just over the moon excited. So they left in July and stopped at the Hotel Glenmore at Big Moose Lake. And they ate at Alta Cliff Cottage. And they checked in with him using an alias.

So that's fucking weird. He used the alias Carl Graham and she used her real name. So that was already. I'm surprised he didn't have her use a fake name. Well, I think he's also a fucking idiot. That's good. As we'll see. So I think that was part of it.

According to the Evening Courier, a waitress there named Grace Greenwood said she witnessed them having dinner the evening before Grace was killed. And she said Grace was, quote unquote, hysterical at dinner. Apparently, Chester was trying to console her, trying to tell her you have to eat. And she said she just couldn't.

Oh, God. I wonder what happened. Yes. What the conversation was. Exactly. Now, the next morning, this waitress saw her again and described her as, quote unquote, depressed. Like, she said she looked devastated. You wish that she was just able to, like, whisk her away. I know. That's the thing. Like, come here, girl. We'll get you in a separate room. Now, on the way to the hotel, they took a bus and the driver asked where they wanted to go. And this will just give you another little, like, insight into, like, Chester's way of, like, it sounds like he was just being a dick.

So the bus, the driver was like, where do you guys want to go? And Chester just gruffly answered, any old hotel. Oh, nice. Charming. Yeah. Your romantic getaway and you're just like, whatever dump you want to bring us to. Because he didn't care. That's so shitty. So the next day he told Grace he was going to bring her for a romantic picnic and they were going to take a boat ride. Oh, no. Despite her telling him in a letter that she didn't know how to swim. Oh, no. They rented a rowboat from a man named Robert Morrison. Oh, no.

They got on the boat and he brought them to, and apparently like Robert didn't come on the boat with them. He just rented it to them. But Chester brought them, like rode them to the deepest and most isolated part of the lake. She was probably getting more and more scared as this was happening. Exactly. Or even worse could be that she had no idea and just thought he was actually being like romantic. Right. Yeah.

And that's apparently the South Bay area is like the deepest point in the lake. Once there, nobody can really tell what exactly went down because it was only the two of them in the middle of the lake. Right. But once there, what did eventually happen was he beat Grace brutally with a horn-handled umbrella and a tennis racket. Jesus. And then threw her in the lake. His pregnant mistress. Yes. Wow. Yeah.

Robert Morrison, the guy who had rented them the boat, said when they didn't return the boat around dinner, he was suspicious. Of course. But the next morning, he and a few others went out to try to find them because he was like, I hope nothing happens. And they found the empty boat in her coat and then came across her body. Oh. And she was dead. He had fled. Believable. He hid out at the Arrowhead Hotel and Inlet. And meanwhile, during the three days he hid like the coward that he was.

He also called to get an advance on his pay and received one. So he was planning on taking off. Yeah, dipping. And I love that later this fucker will pretend and be like, oh, no, I'm innocent. I didn't do it. And it's like, why were you hiding? Nothing about how you acted said you were innocent. If this was an accident or something, which obviously it's not because she was beaten brutally. Like they can tell that you dumbass. But it's like even if it was an accident, why would you leave your pregnant baby?

girlfriend, like almost fiance, dead in a lake and leave the boat. And then just hide out and ask for an advance on payment. Yeah. None of that makes any sense. Now, when they came to, because they immediately, they talked to her family and they were like, oh, she's with this guy. So immediately they went to find him. And when they did find him, he actually tried to first claim he didn't even know Grace. Right.

Come on. He is the father of her unborn child. It's also... And he claimed he didn't even know her. Also, like, I'm sure if they went to her house, they would find a pile of letters exchanged between the two of them. Of course they would. When I say this guy is a fucking idiot, he's a fucking idiot. You also worked together. Yeah. Like, are you fucking serious? There's literally no way you can claim you don't know her. He was arrested and immediately charged with her murder.

She was covered in bruises and had a good head wound and lacerations to her forehead and her mouth when she was discovered. And she was also discovered to be four months pregnant. Four months. Four months. So she sat around for four months waiting for him just to like... Thinking he was going to come around. That's so awful. Because he was also making her believe that he was going to come around. Exactly. I know that's so sad to think that that long went on. Yeah. His claim was that first that she killed herself. But like...

after beating herself up? No one believed that. According to the Evening Courier, they found the broken, bloody tennis racket buried on the shore. Dude.

There was a lot to be made about whether she was dead before she hit the water during the trial. But the consensus did seem to be that she likely was. He had beaten her to death and thrown her in the water. He also claimed at one point that she jumped in willingly. Can't swim, remember. Well, she might have jumped in to get away from him. Yeah, exactly. And he said he tried to help her and the boat tipped over. But he arrived at the hotel he had out at with all dry clothing.

Huh. So. Imagine that. The trial was bonkers. Everyone was there. He's a big name. Right. I mean, a very wealthy family. Like, this is a well-known bachelor. The media went wild. No one even knew he was dating this woman because they had kept it so under wraps. Never mind that he was the father of her unborn child. And now he was a murderer of her and a child. His own child. Yeah.

On December 5th, 1906, the jury deliberated for five hours and found him guilty of first degree murder. Good. He was sentenced to die in the electric chair. Fantastic. He spent a couple of years at Auburn Correctional Facility and apparently got some spiritual guidance along the way. And sources say he confessed to the murder to many of them. Yeah, to clear his own conscience. Exactly.

He was executed March 30th, 1908. He did, he exhausted all his appeals. He tried to get out of it. I think his mother even wrote a letter to the governor trying to get a stay, but she couldn't. That's sad for his mom because he put her in that position. Of course it is. She didn't ask for that. She's a victim too. I'm pretty sure his grave, he was in an unmarked grave and I'm pretty sure it got paved over by a road. So there's that.

No comment. No comment on that. According to Adirondack.com, the murder of Grace Brown influenced the 1925 Adirondack folk song, The Ballad of Big Moose Lake. Oh. Because that is the lake that she was drowned in. And there's also a 1951 movie, A Place in the Sun, that is based on this story. I think I've heard of that.

And there's also a 1925 novel, An American Tragedy, that's based on it and a 1926 play about it and a 2005 opera by the same name. And that's just a few of things that have been influenced by this. That's crazy. Now, A Place in the Sun and An American Tragedy apparently take Chester's side a lot.

And basically say grace... And what side is that? They basically show grace to be what Robert Stack on Unsolved Mysteries said was they called her a woman of easy virtue. Basically a hoe. So we're slut shaming in the 20th century. And that she should be murdered while pregnant because of that. Oh, good. Fantastic. So like fuck those two things. Yeah, fuck them. Now, that isn't the end of the story because people...

Keep seeing Grace. Oh, that breaks my heart that she's at the lake. I hate that she's stuck there. Yeah, she's stuck at the lake. People keep seeing a complete apparition of a glowing woman walking the shores of Moose Lake or across the surface of the lake. That's really cool. Yeah, and also see her walking down the halls of the Big Moose Inn where she stayed.

If she's not wandering the shore, people will have seen her struggling in the lake trying to get help, like almost like a repeat of what's happening. Sometimes she's seen at the cottages along the lake and like the lodge there. And apparently she likes to turn off the lights all the time. She doesn't like lights on. And I wonder if that's because it's like the 1906 of it all. She doesn't understand it. She's like, I didn't live with electricity. What is this? Maybe it's too bright. I think it's too bright.

According to Weird New York, sometimes people recall feeling intense sadness around the lake, almost like an uncontrollable dread.

They theorize that she and her child being killed trapped her there and she's somehow unable to continue to move on. I want to go there and help her. Which makes me so sad. I know. Let's go. I want to. I hate that she's trapped there with all this like sadness around her. Yeah, she doesn't deserve that. Now, this was also featured on an episode of the OG Unsolved Mysteries. I heard you watching it the other day. That's right, with King Robert Stack. I heard that intro. I heard that smooth butter voice. Do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do.

They talked about a group of people in this episode that worked at the Covewood Lodge in 1988. That's near Big Moose Lake. One of them, Rhonda, said she stopped at the staff lodge to turn out the lights. And she was with like a group of three other people who worked at the lodge.

And as soon as she went in, she said she felt like someone was there. And she said she went up to, like, the top floor where, like, there's a balcony overlooking where her friends were in the lake. And she said she didn't see anything, but she said she just, like, knew someone was there. Like, felt a presence. Like, just felt that. And she said it was very strange, very unsettling. And outside, meanwhile, her friends saw a woman standing on the balcony glowing in white, like,

fully in like a 1906 garb and she just was standing there looking out onto the lake and then she and she just stood there and they all three of them said the same thing that they saw the same thing and they said she stood there and then all of a sudden just dissipated and was gone

The tinglys that are happening all over my bod. Imagine seeing that. I would. My goosebumps have goosebumps, bro. And they all say that she's like, has such a sad look on her face. And she's just looking out over the lake. Because she just loved him and he couldn't give a shit. And then killed her and their unborn child. Yeah.

We got to get her out of there. She deserves so much better. We got to get her out of there. Because she's got to move on to her next life, which is going to be like a million times better. She does. With her bebe. With her bebe. With a better man. Yeah. A better husband. Exactly. And the same episode tells the story of Linda Lee Mackin and her friend Bridget, who vacationed at the lake around the same time.

And they had flashlight issues because like I really don't think Grace likes this electricity business. Like they were going down to the lake and the flashlight kept dimming and then just shut off. But the batteries were like brand new. That would scare the shit out of me. And they said it kept happening. And one night they went down to the lake together just sitting there and it was like really dark out. And they saw mist coming close to them like over the top of the lake. And they were like, wow, that's so pretty, like so spooky. And then they said all of a sudden the mist formed into a woman.

And they said, who just looked at them and they literally said it with such extreme sadness. That's all they could get from her. And they said, and actually Linda said she felt extreme overwhelming sadness herself. Like she was like, it was literally like I immediately felt just like hopelessness and sadness. Oh, wow.

And she said it was overwhelming. And then the next day they were in the lodge and they were walking through like the lobby and there's memorabilia about this, like old newspapers and shit. And there's photos of Grace and Chester. And they said they, you could have knocked them over with a feather because they were like, we saw that picture of Grace and we were like, that is the woman that appeared to us last night. Can you imagine having an experience like that jarring? That would blow.

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And she just appears to you sad. I'd be like, what can I do to help you? I know. I would not say that in that moment because I would probably shit my pants. I'm not pretending. I'd be like, what can I do to help you? I would be so confident. My shit would not be rocked at all. I would just be like, what can I do to help you pass through? I would go into help mode. No, I would not. I'm not claiming that. But looking back on it, you want to be like, fuck, I want to stand in front. Now if she appears, you want to be like, what can we do to help you? Grace. How can I get you not here? I don't know.

I know. Because I don't want you to be on this lake. It's sad. Oh my God. Remember Ghost Whisperer? Yeah. I never watched that. Oh. It was Jennifer Love Hewitt, right? Yeah. Jennifer Love Hewitt. Yeah. J Love. J Love. She was so helpful. She was such an empath. Good for her, man. I'm sure she used to scare the shit out of me as a kid, though. I'm sure. You probably shouldn't have been watching it. Yeah, probably not. But I always loved the end, though, because she would help them like find the light and cross over. Yeah. I like that. I know. I want to help Grace find whatever she needs to find. I want to help Grace.

But that is the story of Grace Brown's tragic, tragic murder and her now at Big Moose Lake and now her haunting at Big Moose Lake.

Mine's a little more wily than that and a little more all over the place. All right, let's go. All right, we're heading out to Oregon. All right, let's go. I want Oregon. Let's go Oregon Trail. We're going to Oregon. I'm going to talk about Crater Lake, which is located inside of Crater Lake National Park, if you can believe it. I can't. It is the deepest lake in the United States. That's really scary and I don't like that. And one of the deepest actually in the world. No, I actually hate that.

Same. It has an average depth of about 1,500 feet. Shut the fuck up. But that's not even as deep as it goes. That's the average. The deepest parts are said to be close to 2,000 feet deep.

Like just think of everything that would be lurking underneath you as you treaded water. I had to say that to you. No. You actually really shouldn't swim in this lake. It's not very allowed. Don't do it. There's like certain parts where you can. It's not very allowed. I was waiting for that to hit you. It's not very allowed. It's not very allowed. It's not very allowed. There's certain places where you can, but overall it's too cold and too deep. Like they don't recommend it. It's way too deep. Don't do that. Yeah. Yeah. What's that?

It's like fucking cave diving. Don't do that. Well, yeah. Don't do that. Don't do it. No. Well, the formation of this lake is crazy. It formed over 7,700 years ago. Badass. Which is crazy. When Mount Mazama, the volcano, erupted. Now, the eruption was so large and so cray-cray that it weakened the structure of the volcano itself. Yeah.

The volcano emptied its entire magma reservoir, and then it all just collapsed in on itself. And that's what formed where the lake is. That's what happened to me when I had neurovirus. You got rid of your entire magma reservoir. My entire magma reservoir, and then I collapsed it on myself.

Iconic. It's literally, I've never, I didn't know how I felt in that moment. And that's exactly the description. Oh, wait, just picture that like happening to a landmass. No, that's actually the scariest thing I've ever heard. It literally created a five to six mile wide caldera. So like just like a, yeah, a crater essentially, which over time got filled with rainwater and like melted snow and shit. And that's Crater Lake.

The fact that it is just an exploded volcano that collapsed in on itself. Like a volcano that emptied its entire magma reservoir, which weakened the stability of it. And then it just like just in on itself. It did in fact. And then it's like, I just like looking up at a volcano. Yeah. Must be wild.

like unbelievable, like just the size. That would give me the chili willies. Just the massive like structure in front of you. And then to think of that the other way. Yeah. And filled with water. Yeah. Like that is just like my mind is like bending around that. Well, I looked it up because I was like, okay, so like could it erupt still? Technically it could still erupt. Oh, shit. But it wouldn't be like –

A typical volcano eruption, obviously. Yeah, it would be a weird-ass one. Yeah, I don't think anybody really knows exactly what would happen. My God, Crater Lake is scary, guys. It's so scary. It's so big. It's also surrounded by, like, all this, like, mountain area. Yeah. It's beautiful, but it's got a vibe. It is. It's gorgeous, but it is. It's a rough terrain. Knowing what that is is like, oh. Yeah. Yeah.

So I'm not even going to be able to hit like, I'm hitting like the tip of the iceberg here because so many different things have happened. We could honestly probably do a part two of Crater Lake. Cool. Let's do it. Because it's got all kinds of crazy stuff going on. There's some kind of water monster that people have reported seeing. Fun. Like small little tales, but they're fun. I love a Nessie situation. There's paranormal parts of this. Yep. The biggest thing that seems to be related to Crater Lake is disappearing planes. Ooh. And like, like disappearing planes.

Oh, just like there and then not. I don't love that. Seemingly inexplicable plane crashes have also taken place all around this area. And unfortunately, there have been murders. Oh, man. Now, some of this haunted slash morbid TM activity could have to do with the lake's origin story.

So according to the Klamath tribe, who lived on the land where Crater Lake National Park now stands, but like way before it became a national park. Yeah. The god of the underworld, who I believe is Lao. I looked it up. Some pronunciations say Yao, but I saw Lao more often. Okay.

So the god of the underworld fell in love with the chief's daughter. And when he couldn't take her back to the underworld as his bride, he promised he was going to do something real big to get back at this tribe. Uh-oh. It's giving Hades and Persephone. Very much. Yes. And that is when the volcano erupted, massively causing the giant caldera. Holy shit. But luckily, the sky spirit, Skel, stepped in to protect the tribe from what was happening and came face to face with Lau in a pretty heated battle.

The battle is said to have ended when Skel killed Lau and threw him into the lake. Whoa. According to journalist Sarah Crocker, who I got a lot of information from, she wrote an article for Grunge.com. It's called A Look at Crater Lake's Morbid History. Ooh, fun. But according to Sarah, Lau's body was eaten by monsters who were living at the time. Oh, it's kind of like the realm of monsters from Moana. Yes, exactly. Moana.

but they left his head untouched. They said, no, I don't want that. So it was just bobbing around the lake.

So people believe now, especially the people that belong to this tribe, that Lao still haunts the area and the lake specifically. That is so scary. It's the scariest. What a fascinating, like, origin story. I love that origin story. Yeah. They say that they don't think anybody should even look at the lake too long. Wow. Because it will, they believe it will cause, quote, death and lasting sorrow. Wow.

Holy shit. So deep and creepy and spooky. Damn. So let's flash forward to the spring of 1944 for our first bizarre instance.

During World War I, two, I think it's Grumman, TBF torpedo bombers were flying over the lake, most likely running a drill of some kind. There was a military base nearby. It was said to be a completely clear day as they were flying over the lake. Each pilot was keeping track of the other. The pilot who survived this drill said suddenly he looked over and just didn't see the plane that was supposed to be flying with him. He like looked back.

below him he didn't see it like falling out of the sky or anything like that it was just gone just disappeared into thin air now there's a lot of mystery surrounding this particular case but it's a story connected to the case that's been told for decades some people even say they saw a plane flying low that day and then disappear around the area of the lake really but the

Not real there's like never been any names associated with it. It's never been like confirmed or denied to have happened Yeah, it's just been like very hush-hush and a lot of people think it's so hush-hush Because the government didn't want to say much about it because we were still actively involved in World War two I mean that does make sense and it wouldn't have been like a great look for a yeah that were plane to just go Miss disappear over a lake

But it's entirely possible that this happened. Yeah. There is also a ton of other military planes that are said to have either crashed into or near Crater Lake throughout the years or just completely vanished in or around the lake. But there's no actual records to be found. So could be legends based on the lake's history, but could be a hush hush thing. Yeah.

Now, one plane in February of 1975 that did, in fact, disappear near Crater Lake wasn't found for seven years. Holy shit. Seven years. There were three people on that plane. And on the return flight, the pilot, Dave Nunn, and two student pilots, Jim Pryor and Matt Perkins, who were only 17 years old at the time. Oh, that's heartbreaking. So they were on the return flight. Jean Nunn had driven her husband, Dave, her daughter, and her grandchild to the airport that night.

And she said that she had a feeling for two weeks beforehand that something was going to happen in her family. She just had this weird feeling she couldn't shake. But she didn't know, obviously, what it was going to be. Yeah, what are you supposed to do? She didn't know who it was going to happen to. When it was going to happen. Yeah, she just had a feeling. But she didn't think it was going to be her husband.

Now this trip was supposed to be simple. They were going to fly to Salem, Oregon on Dave's private plane, a blue Cessna 182. And they were dropping off Jean and Dave's daughter and their grandchild. And then they were flying back to Klamath Falls, Oregon. Okay. This flight literally should have taken only 45 minutes. Like it's a super quick flight.

So after dropping everybody off at the airport, Jean went home and she said she felt a chill. So she cozied up under an electric blanket and just fell asleep. Because again, this isn't supposed to be, her husband's not supposed to be gone long. She's like, all right, I'm just going to take a little nap, go to sleep. But she said she woke up that night around 930 and she felt the sensation of a hand on her leg.

And she immediately knew that something had happened to Dave. I just got so many chills. She ended up writing a book about it, but she said the feeling just washed over her. Oh, God. And she immediately knew. So she called the airport and as soon as she got on the phone, she said, the plane must have gone down at 920 and Dave died at 930. I know it.

Holy shit. They confirmed that they had lost track of the plane on the radar at exactly 9.20 that night. What the fuck? It was exactly what she said. Now, weeks and weeks went by. Search parties were trying to find this plane anywhere they could find the wreckage.

weeks turned into months months turned into years and finally seven years later in july of 1982 a hiker ended up coming across the wreckage just outside of crater lake that must be the most horrifying thing to come in contact with truly plane crash like you're and you're just out hiking like you're supposed to have this great day with nature you just find a plane crash like what the fuck and

three people inside of it like he found three skeletons inside of it who are the two god 17 year old student pilots and gene's husband but she said she knew she knew all those years wow gene crazy holy shit i want to read her book it's really yeah let me tell you what it's called i'm like damn gene yeah her book is called we fly away oh gene i know there's a picture of her with like scrapbooks and one of these articles in the heralds

what is it the herald news or something um the herald news yeah she um it's a picture of like dave who was a stunner a stunner yeah that's so sad and just like how cool to be a pilot and just be able to like fly your daughter and your grandchild home and he was just trying to teach these two students about flying they were passionate about it so sad that makes me so sad

But also, like, so beautiful in a way that he was able to tell Jean that he had passed and she knew. Like, she was able to, like, understand what the sign meant. And in such a way that was, like, really comforting. Yeah, probably. Exactly. Yeah.

Now, another plane that crashed and then disappeared, unfortunately, took much longer to find. Back in December of 1945, there were seven Grumman Hellcat fighter planes that were taking flight over Crater Lake National Park. They were on their way to Washington. Now, it was really foggy this day. There was a lot of fog, especially lingering over the lake. And while they were going through it, some of the pilots couldn't clearly see others.

So they made it through the fog and they realized that there were not seven planes flying anymore. One plane, which was flown by 22-year-old Ensign Frank Lupo, was just completely gone. Holy shit. Like lost track of it. Now before they went through the fog, a couple of the other pilots did see him trying to change a gas tank, like while they were still flying, but obviously something had happened.

And a couple of the other planes pilots saw Lupo's plane start to descend slowly, which I can't even imagine seeing. That... Ugh. And that's your friend that you're out on this mission with. Like, you know something bad is happening. And you can't stop it. Yeah. So...

Flash forward to almost 25 years later in August of 1970 when a park ranger who was new, newly working at Crater Lake National Park. He was hiking through the park and he just casually stumbled upon a human skull.

Oh. Yep. Welcome to the job. So obviously he had to go report that to his head of department. Yep. He had an interesting way of doing so. He told the story and then just presented the head, taking it out of his backpack and putting the skull onto his boss's desk. I mean, none of us know. None of us know unless we've come across one. Definitely like don't move a skull that you find in the woods. Don't do it. Yeah, like we can say that with a...

with confidence definitely leave that there but i also understand again this is a 70 so we didn't have all that information and he was probably freaked out he was probably freaked out and he probably didn't think anyone was gonna believe him yeah and he probably didn't want to leave it there because an animal could get it yeah move it and then he's just this crazy new guy yeah and it's not like he has a cell phone to pop a picture really quick to be like here it is like let's go find it exactly so instead he brought it with him and he popped it on his boss's desk whoa i guess that leaves no doubts it does

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But after the discovery, investigators went out to where the skull was found, and they ended up finding the remains of the Hellcat plane. Holy shit. And they found a piece of equipment with a serial number on it, so they were able to determine that it was Lupo's missing plane. Holy shit. And in a bit of a happier ending, Lupo's remains ended up being sent to his family. Oh, that's nice. So he could get laid to rest, sort of. Good. Ugh.

So now on to something very sinister. In 1952, 55-year-old Charles Colhane and 56-year-old Albert Jones were found dead on Annie Creek in the National Park. The area where they were found is only about six miles from the lake. Both men worked for General Motors and were in Oregon for work. But while they were in the area, they planned to go on a fishing trip with these two other guys in the car business, Jack Vaughn and Frank Eberlein.

So Jack, Frank, and Frank's 13-year-old son, Alan, showed up to the park with plans to meet up with the guys. But they were surprised when they only found their car, keys still in the ignition, and the front doors both open. It was like a little bit weird. Yeah. But they were like, maybe they went to sightsee or something while they were waiting for us. Yeah, like strange, but not like... Yeah, not super alarming. Yeah.

So they waited a little bit to see if Albert and Charles would show back up, but they gave it 45 minutes and they still hadn't come back. No, it's alarming. No, it's alarming. So the two older men decided to drive down to a ranger station while Alan stayed behind in case the two men showed up.

Okay. Yeah. 13 year old Alan is just waiting in the back of his dad's car and he sees a dark sedan pull into the lot and kind of like slowly pass by and take up. He's looking like this driver takes a look at the the car that's parked that's empty and then speeds off onto the highway.

Huh. So he's like, okay. Like that was weird. Yeah, that was weird. So shortly after that, park rangers made it up that way and started the search for these two men. They enlisted trail, uh, trail crews to join the search effort as well. The search went on for a day and a half until finally the two men were found. And there's a lot of strange details about how they were found, but

They had both been shot in the back of the head at such close range that there was gunpowder residue and burn marks around the bullet. Holy shit. So it was execution style. They both were shot by a, quote, 7.6, I think it's 7.65 millimeter automatic pistol of foreign manufacture. Okay. Which was weird. And investigators also found two brass cartridges on the ground.

They were each missing their shoes, but it looked like the shoes were taken after they were killed because their socks were clean. Albert's shoes were found not too far from the scene, but Charles' shoes are still missing to this day. This case is unsolved. Though somebody did try to pawn a very similar pair of shoes after the bodies were found. Interesting. They both had also been gagged with their own neckties and part of Charles' undershirt.

Which is strange because they were both still wearing their dress shirts. So they had to have been like, like part of the shirt had to have been torn off and then like a struggle or he was redressed at some point. It's very strange. Yeah. And it's like, did they take the shoes off after they were killed or did they take them off after they got them down on their knees? Right. So they couldn't run. Who knows? I don't know. Possibly. Yeah. Maybe that's why their socks are clean. Yeah. Yeah.

Now, even stranger, both men's dentures were found in the pockets of their dress shirts. Huh. Like, what? Their wallets were emptied. They both were assumed to be carrying around $300 and that was gone. And lastly, they both were wearing watches previously that were gone now. Shit. So it looked somewhat like a robbery, but like a very... A bizarre one. Like an execution murder robbery. Right. Like...

So later an autopsy would show that Albert had a fractured skull and both men had been hit so hard in their groin areas that they were bruised. Oh, God. Yeah. So they put up a fight and they went through a lot before he died. It definitely seemed like there was more than one killer also to investigators. Yeah.

They were both pretty big guys too, so it was unlikely to investigators that one person alone took them out. Now, like I said, the case is technically unsolved, but there were some good leads that came in after the murders. I don't want to go into every single one, and I'm really giving you like a brief overview here. Because you want to cover it in depth. Because I do want to cover this. There's a little taste. There's a little taste.

But what I will tell you is that afterwards, after like this got out to the public, a couple reported seeing two, quote, dirty, unkempt men in an old car near the crime scene. Now, interestingly, another man who was working a delivery route in the area had also seen what he described as two scruffy looking men leading two nicely dressed men into the woods near Annie Creek on the day of the murders. Oh, shit.

And he said he noticed this and he also noticed one of the nicely dressed guys make a symbol to the other guy, like a hand symbol, like a gun. Yeah. So basically trying to tell the other guy like, fuck, they have a gun or something like that. Like trying to like subtly warn him. And he said he also saw a black Pontiac coupe parked on the shoulder around the corner from the scene. Which if you remember, Alan saw a dark sedan. So that's interesting. Yeah.

Now, this guy, this driver, was driving again in the area the next day, and he kept running into those same scruffy men that he saw before, and they were clearly making a point to intimidate him, he said. They stared him down. They ended up locking him in at a gas station at one point. The fuck? Driving that same black Pontiac that he had seen on the day of the murders. So now he saw the car near the scene, but now he knows they're the ones driving it. Yeah. And they just overall seem to be following him.

But obviously because of this, he was able to get a good look at them. One of the men who seemed to be the older one of the two, he said had quite a few distinguishable details that this guy remembered. And the witness's name is Lincoln. So the man who had all these like memorable characteristics said,

Was wearing a beaded belt that said Ralph. He had a tattoo of a woman in a bikini and he was also missing one of his fingers. Oh, sure. So you'll remember that. Yeah. You'll remember a nine fingered guy. You sure will. Unfortunately, the authorities didn't really take Lincoln's story too seriously. Like he kept...

He kept telling them all this information, but it seems like some of his reports weren't even recorded at all. What the fuck? Like there are some that are on record and some, like he was like, I also gave additional information. It was just nowhere? Yeah. He said that he thought the police thought he was a smart aleck. Because remember, this is the 50s. Yeah. So they did think he was a smart aleck. They definitely did. But weird. Almost 50 years after the murders and Lincoln's experience with two scruffy looking men, somebody new got eyes on the case.

A woman named Cheryl was taking a class at a local college when she heard the story about the murders all those years ago. And she just got deeply fascinated with this case and like started going down all these rabbit holes, getting every last detail together. And she ended up writing a paper about the murders for her class. And it was a really well done paper. So she ended up giving a presentation later on the paper at a local museum like in this area. Cheryl. Yeah, she's a queen.

So the presentation was attended by a ton of people who signed in before joining the discussion. And Cheryl's friend told her that the last man to walk into this whole presentation was suspicious looking. And while Cheryl was still presenting some of the paper, this man went down and started looking through the list of names of people who had signed in, like very into it, like studying this list.

Fuck that. The other thing that they noticed about this man, her friend, he was missing a finger. Shut up. Shut the fuck up. Yup. But that's all I'm going to give you because I want to cover it in its entirety. Oh my God. Weird though. Weird. What the fuck? Now what I will tell you is it's technically unsolved, but there is a good set of suspects for this murder. All right. Or these murders, I should say. Wow, that's fascinating. There's a lot of strange ones. Yeah.

Now on to the paranormal. Apparently park rangers in the Crater Lake National Park will see campfires burning in areas where they're restricted. Oh, that's spooky. Now they'll go all the way out and they'll say like, we see campfires, we see people around the campfires. And then they'll go out to confront the campers and be like, you can't have a fire here. And they'll get all the way out to where they saw this all happening. And there will be nobody there and no campfires lit.

That must be so maddening. And so fucking creepy because you're like, what was bidding me out here? What the fuck was I seeing? Yeah, exactly. Apparently this happens a lot around Wizard Island. Wizard Island? You heard me. Wizard Island was formed way back when the volcano erupted and is named that because it apparently resembles a wizard's hat, like from an overhead shot. Bitch. Yep.

There's also another island in the lake called Phantom Island. Phantom Island? Phantom Island. This lake is crazy. This lake is the tits. I love it. Phantom Island is named that because depending on what angle you're looking at it from, you'll see it. And then it's like this weird optical illusion where if you move slightly or like you see it at a different time of day, you'll see the island and then you won't suddenly. Yeah.

Like it like literally disappears in your line of vision. That's really spooky. And also Wizard Island does look like a wizard's hat. It does. Correct. And that's where a lot of the phantom fires are seen. Oh, shit. Yeah.

Now, finally, on to the water monster of it all. Yeah, absolutely. There have been at least two sightings of the monster. The monster. The monster. I was going to say the water monster. The water monster. The water monster. And people say it looks like a dragon, kind of like Nessie. Cool. Like the Loch Ness monster. We love Nessie here. In one instance, there was a group of friends...

Who saw the Crater Lake Dragons swim under their robot. My God. What's happening? I'm losing it.

Crater Lake is getting to you. In one instance, a group of friends saw the Crater Lake dragons swim under their rowboat and they were so terrified that they hauled ass back to land and were like flagging rangers down being like, we just saw a straight up creature in the lake. We just saw a dragon. Like, what is that? And they're like, there's fish in the lake. I don't know. Imagine if there's a straight up dragon in that lake. I am fully of the mindset that there is. At this point, yeah. Fully of the mindset. Probably.

basically nobody believed them. They were like, yeah, are you like high? Like, are you good? And they're like, no. I'm high on dragon sightings. That's what I'm high on. We saw what we saw. And yeah, now we are high on dragon sightings. Yeah.

But they're not the only group of people to have seen this monster. Of course they're not, because it's real. A woman who was visiting the area from Georgia also wanted to do a little rowboat day of her own. Yeah, you couldn't fucking pay me money, but go right ahead. You could pay me money and I would do it. I would do it probably without paying you money. Nope, I'll watch from the shore. Watch from Canto Island. But she said that she saw the giant sea creature swimming away from her boat.

Like she saw it herself too. What the fuck? And everybody describes it like a dragon-like creature. That's the coolest shit I've ever heard. I'm obsessed with it. You can also buy postcards of it if you want to because now they lean in. Hell yeah. If you got a Nessie, you better go full Nessie. Lean in. Yeah. Don't you dare try to dispel the Nessie. Exactly. Now I have a few honorable mentions. There wasn't like a ton of information on these things, but they happened. Worth mentioning. Yeah. Worth mentioning. Many Bigfoot sightings. Oh.

Oh, I love that. Rangers will smell something real bad, investigate it, and then just get a barrage of pine cones thrown at them. That's the funniest shit I've ever heard. I'm obsessed with it. I love that Bigfoot... I almost said Bigface. I love that Bigfoot is just like...

Get the fuck out of here. No, no, no, no. There was a bunch of people. Don't look at me. Get out of here. There was also a 1997 UFO sighting. Oh, hell yeah, there was. Three lights flashed across the sky. And then there was like a ton of weird flashes of lights. And then those three lights seemed to just disappear into the water. Oh. Yeah. Yeah. UFOs underwater, man. I mean...

It's happening a lot lately. And that thing's 2,000 feet deep in some spots. So many places to go. There's definitely UFOs down there. Oh, the places they'll go. Oh, the places they'll go. You know? Yeah. And finally, my favorite part of Crater Lake is the old man of the lake. It's my favorite part too, and I don't know anything about it. He's not a man. He's actually a giant 30-foot mountain hemlock that just floats around the lake upright.

Which, like, obviously doesn't make sense from a gravity standpoint. From a reality standpoint. From this life standpoint. He just floats upright in the lake with about three feet. It used to be four, but, you know, weather and global warming and all that. Now just three feet of him stick out of the lake surface. Oh, there he is. Isn't he so cute? There he is. He just floats around.

What the fuck? But there's more to him than that. Apparently, he controls the weather.

Yeah. Are you ready? Of course he does. He does. Because in 1988, there was a group of researchers who were going to survey the bottom of a lake, of the lake with like a submersible, which fuck that. Yeah. No, you couldn't ever have me do that. But they were worried that the submersible might run into the old man like and, you know, break or something. Yeah. So they took him over to Wizard Island, of course. Yeah, of course. And they tied him to the shore. And in no time, the weather took 180 degree turn.

They were not even able to launch their submersible because storm clouds rolled in and it got so bad that it started snowing. Like the weather was going insane. Because you can't hold him down. You can't hold him down. Don't you dare tether the old man of the goddamn lake. Not my man's. I too would make the weather go fucking lawless if you tied me to the side of it. Lawless. Yeah.

The old man is lawless. The old man of the lake is lawless. He really is. He follows no rules. And he doesn't have to. Well, listen. I'm not asking him to. I'm not either. No way. The second they untied him.

the weather went right back to beautiful. Yeah, that's all he wanted. Like almost instantly. That's all he asked for. He wants to be free. Yeah. Let him be free. You can't hold him down. Now there's a lot of theories as to how old man just like floats upright because again, it makes no sense. Personally, I think it's because he's the most magical thing that we've ever come across in life. Some people think his density has increased over time because he's been in the water for so long. Nah. But I don't think so. He's magic.

Yeah. He's a maverick. He is a maverick, but he's magic as well. He is. He's a magic maverick. He's a maverick. And that is the tip of the iceberg about Crater Lake. Holy shit. I might do a part two on Crater Lake. Part two's gotta come, yeah. Because there's some other disappearances that have taken place there. Oh, yeah, we gotta. I'm sure I could probably find some more plane crashes that have gone down. Oh, yeah, we gotta touch upon.

Crater Lake again. Yeah. And I'm very interested to hear more about that double murder. Yes.

because that was shocking yeah me and dave are gonna start working on that one real soon me and dave so keep a lookout for that hell yeah we hope you enjoyed my rant in the beginning about yeah being bullied i feel a little safer in the office now yeah you know now that we've talked about crater lake we got it out yeah the old man is there the old man is on my side he's on everyone's side i'll i'll use the old man to because we'll never hold him down we'll never hold him down i just want to i want to be one with him i just

I just want to like hold on to him and float around the lake. Just bob around the lake. Actually, I don't because it's too deep. No. Fuck that. But I do want to see the dragon. I want to see the dragon. Yeah. And I want to see Grace. Yeah. I want to help her. I know. I just want to send Grace home. I know. We have so many places we have to go. Oh, the places we'll go. Yeah. Yeah. Full circle. Well, we hope you keep listening. And we hope you... Keep. Yeah.

but not to worry that you don't check out these lakes man do it yay water bye bye

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