Post Mortem | Deputy Spivey on Trial
22:15 Share

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to this podcast ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app today.

With a Spark Cash Plus card from Capital One, you earn unlimited 2% cash back on every purchase. Plus, no preset spending limit helps your purchasing power adapt to meet your business needs. Jorge Gaviria, founder of Masienda, reinvests his 2% cash back to help grow the business with new products. What could the Spark Cash Plus card from Capital One do for your business? Capital One, what's in your wallet? Find out more at CapitalOne.com slash Spark Cash Plus. Terms and conditions apply.

Ready to prioritize yourself in the new year? Your skin is a great place to start. Dime Beauty, founded by a master esthetician, is more than just a skincare company. With four skin-conscious categories—skincare, beauty, body care, and fragrance—Dime offers simple, spa-worthy products that will help you enter 2025 with confidence. Whether you're revitalizing your regimen with nourishing products or building one from scratch, Dime makes it

easy. The work system, our all-in-one best-selling routine, includes a cleanser of your choice, toner, serums, and moisturizers, taking the guesswork out of skincare for your healthiest, happiest skin yet. Dime's commitment to clean ingredients and sustainable packaging ensures every product is as gentle on your skin as it is on the planet.

With thousands of glowing five-star reviews and a loyal community, the results speak for themselves. Revive your skin and give yourself the routine refresh you deserve by visiting DimeBeautyCO.com. That's DimeBeautyCO.com. Your best skin awaits. Americans agree that everyone should be able to make their own health care decisions.

You and only you should control your health care decisions. But the truth is, attacks on reproductive health care, including abortion, are only intensifying. That's why your gift to Planned Parenthood is so important right now. No matter the battle, no matter the stakes, no matter what, Planned Parenthood is there. Protect our rights, protect our health care. Make your gift to Planned Parenthood at plannedparenthood.org slash protect. ♪

Welcome back to Postmortem. I'm your host, Anne-Marie Green, and today we are discussing the case of Patricia Spivey, whose husband, Renard, is a former sheriff's deputy. He was also known for playing a bailiff on TV. He

He was charged in 2019 with murdering Patricia in the home that they built together. So joining me now is CBS News correspondent Natalie Morales and 48 Hours producer Asena Bashak. Welcome. Thank you, Anne-Marie. Good to be with you. Thanks for having us. So I should point out to everyone that we're actually recording this at a pretty high stress time. For you, Natalie, there are several wildfires burning out of control in the Los Angeles area and not too far from where you are, Natalie.

Yes. And we're just a couple of towns over from the Palisades fire and all around me, a lot of people have lost a lot. So my thoughts are with them. If, you know, there are also some technical difficulties as well in recording this because with winds the way we've had them for the last couple of days, if I freeze every now and again, I apologize. Right. And you might hear the dogs barking in the background. And the dogs barking because there are a lot of people in the neighborhood making sure things are okay.

Well, we're glad you're safe. And let's cross our fingers that this gets under control and everyone else remains safe as well. Thank you. Just a reminder for everyone, you know, I say this every time. If you have not watched the episode yet, this episode of 48 Hours, you can find the full audio version of it just below this episode in your podcast feed. So go take a listen to it and then come on back and we will talk.

All right. What I think was really interesting about this episode is just how much security video you had from inside the home. I've always wondered who these people are that just run security cameras in their home all the time, in the kitchen of all places. So because of this, we can actually hear the shooting, but we don't see the shooting. Patricia's family, they believe that she was murdered, but Renard doesn't.

said that it was an accident. Was it a challenge for you all to make sure that you presented both sides of this story?

That's our job to do that, to present both sides of the story. I think what the challenge was for the authorities was to figure out who the real aggressor was in this situation, who had the finger on the trigger when the gun went off. And that camera, by the way, right over the refrigerator, that's because Patricia Spivey's father was living with them and he has onset dementia. So therefore, they always had the camera rolling just to keep track

His room was not far off from the kitchen. So that's why that camera was specifically placed there. But that footage gave us sort of a window into the moments leading up to what happened that night. And again, it comes down to we know when things happen because you even hear the shots based on that security footage. But what we don't know is

how that happened and who really had their finger on the trigger in those moments. There's another interesting fact about this case. So apparently in Texas, if you are acquitted of a crime, your complete record can be expunged. Once Renard was acquitted, he did ask for that. So we didn't really have any access to court transcripts, court testimony, which we usually do. Well,

to do these kind of programs. So that was a big challenge for us. And so you guys really studied the surveillance footage really closely. I know what sort of struck me, which has nothing necessarily to do with the case, was just how ordinary it seemed like the hours leading up to this were, you know, going to the fridge, grabbing a drink. It's like very ordinary. What was unusual about the footage leading up to the shooting?

Well, you know what Renard told us, because he did agree to an interview, you know, after he was acquitted, he thought that night there had been some tension building in the relationship. And also on that security footage, you can hear it sounds like at one point where Patricia, before she went to bed, you hear in the background, Patricia said over and over again as if she's upset with him about something.

but we don't know what exactly. And so in that time, something happened. Renard said,

He picked up her phone after she went to bed from her bed stand, went to the closet, looked at the phone, and that's when she confronted him. He says, with the gun at the front of the closet. And that's when he got very nervous because he knew it was fully charged and it doesn't have a safety mechanism on it. And if the finger is on the trigger, it's...

It can go off. So that's when he said he tussled with her to get control of the gun and the shots went off. But this is one of my the challenge that I had with his story is that it just seemed like there wasn't a lot of time. We see him go out to the kitchen to say goodnight to her. Then he according to him, he's sort of rebuffed and he goes back in and he says he waited for her to fall asleep.

It just didn't seem like enough time had gone by. Yes. So we hear Patricia at 3 or 1 a.m. when she says it's the same thing over and over again. So there's something going on, like Natalie said, between them and

And then 3.07 is when the gunshots are heard. So there's only six minutes from when we hear Patricia saying it's the same thing over and over again to the gunshots. So the prosecutors at trial raised this by saying you were having a fight with your husband and in six minutes you were able to sleep. That doesn't sound believable. Right. You can see why that would raise a little bit of suspicion.

And then the surveillance cameras, they also catch moments after the shooting when Renard has called 911. We see him take a break from CPR to unlock the garage door. I want to play a clip of that 911 call. It wasn't part of the show, so this is new for people. When the operator hears his home security system disarming. Are you in the bedroom? Yeah. System disarmed. Ready to arm. Okay.

I mean, did he explain that? So, Henry, yes, the operator is asking on the 911 call if he is in the bedroom. But

He replies with yes, even though we see in the security footage from their kitchen that he is now walking to the garage. And he said it was to open the door for the first responders. So he's now removed himself from doing CPR on Patricia at that moment. And he didn't tell the operator that at the time, you know, and it's important to remember he himself had been shot in the leg.

So we know that at that point, there was some trauma. And so he is giving her CPR.

And he said he felt he needed to go open the garage door to allow the first responders to enter. So that's how he explained it to us. He was like, I did what I thought I needed to do to best get the help that she would need. Yeah, that makes sense why he would be sort of groaning as much as he is because he's shot in the leg and now he's trying to walk, you know, to the garage.

This is what I'll say. I kind of went back and forth. And part of the reason why I went back and forth is because I actually found him very

Very believable. Have you interviewed people who've been accused of murder before? And was he sort of any different or the same or what jumped out at you guys? He genuinely seems to carry the burden of what happened on that night. And, you know, that he feels her loss. I mean, he says to this day, he still loves Patricia very deeply. And I think what, you know, is most troubling for him is knowing that it was his gun that was charged and on the nightstand that...

ultimately led to this tragic death. He did want to talk. He wanted to tell us his side of the story. And he wanted to, you know, I guess somewhat clear his name because with a lot of these cases, this happened right before COVID and COVID interrupted the legal process. So this case was put on hold for four years. So in the public eye, he was

looked at perhaps as being guilty, even though he hadn't had his day in court yet and he was eventually acquitted. I mean, it's a complicated case. Consultant Lisa Andrews told us she was a former prosecutor in Texas, and she did tell us that there was just not enough evidence clearly pointing to either side.

D.C., are you ready to start 2025 with incredible live entertainment at Capital One Arena? On February 22nd, comedy takes center stage at the hilarious Joe Coy. Then, on March 17th, feel the energy as Disturbed gets down with the sickness. On March 26th, it's all about the legendary Mary J. Blige bringing soul and power to the stage. And don't miss pop sensation Kylie Minogue on April 8th.

Tickets are going fast. Secure yours now at CapitalOneArena.com.

Hi, I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondery Show American Scandal. We bring to light some of the biggest controversies in U.S. history. Presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud. In our latest series, NASA embarks on an ambitious program to reinvent space exploration with the launch of its first reusable vehicle, the Space Shuttle. And in 1985, they announced they're sending teacher Krista McAuliffe into space aboard the Space Shuttle Challenger, along with six other astronauts, but less than two minutes after liftoff.

Hello.

Welcome back. Let us dig into some of the evidence in this case. The trigger of the gun that was used to fatally shoot Patricia, it was never swabbed for DNA. Why not? Dick DeGaran, who was Renard Spivey's attorney, told us that a crime scene technician at trial acknowledged that the trigger was not swabbed for DNA because she was

afraid that it would go off again. Now, Dick made a point that shows how dangerous this gun is. He also said the DNA swabbing was a bit sloppy, meaning the investigators used only one swab to swab the gun.

but they didn't specifically swab the trigger. And when they used one swab to swab the gun, two DNAs came up, which was Patricia and Renard's DNA. It seems like a basic necessity when it comes to figuring out whose finger was on the trigger. But it was his former service weapon. It was always right by the bed, charged, which in itself is the problem here.

You know, this was a Smith & Wesson service gun and the design of it, it doesn't have the typical safety mechanisms. And defense attorney Dick DeGaran showed us how it could go off over and over again because it automatically recharges.

Which, you know, is so scary when you think about that. But again, we don't know. The defense argued that the state never proved whose hand again was on the trigger. So that really came down to being crucial at trial and presented reasonable doubt for the jury. Yeah, I can definitely see that. So it was still unclear the amount of times that Patricia was shot, which I thought was surprising. Right.

We poured over the medical examiner's report with CBS News consultant Lisa Andrews. She looked it all over for us. That was key to this case. And the medical examiner's report ruled it was a homicide. But what was unclear was the number of, you know, entry and exit wounds. They couldn't determine the amount of shots fired. Was it two?

Was it two shots? Was it three shots? So Renard told us that he was shot first in the leg. The second shot, according to Renard, hit Patricia on the left side of her chest. And then the third shot would have gone through her arm, exiting her arm and going into her right torso. But the medical examiner can't tell us the order of the shots. So we need to go by accounts of people.

Dick DeGaran showed us with the actual weapon, that Smith & Wesson revolver,

He reenacted what Renard told him happened on that night and the trajectory of the bullets. He kind of did this whole demonstration with me showing how they fought over the gun, how he was holding her arm, and the way the trajectory of the bullet would have entered her arm into her side and then hit her chest. Also, the defense said,

The number of shots really didn't disprove that it was an accident, given that this is a gun that is charged and can continually...

be fired and keep going. The prosecution, though, was arguing that it's hard to believe that multiple shots are fired, that it is an accident. One more thing, though, what was interesting, what you mentioned in the hour, is there was a fourth sound as well on the surveillance footage. It was unclear if it was another shot. The question, according to the state, was could it have possibly been

Renard shooting his leg at that time, a fourth shot. But there was no proof of that. And the sound was so indistinct. Their theory was that he was in a different part of the house. That's why the sound is different. But we'll never know. The state couldn't prove that was a gunshot. So I want to talk about another person you interviewed, Patricia's friend, Ezra.

He took the stand, had pretty damning testimony about their relationship, but also Renard. He told you in an interview that he had multiple phone conversations with Renard in the hours before the shooting and that Renard admitted to taking steroids and said that Patricia wanted a divorce. But at trial, the prosecutor did not present phone records to prove this. How?

How did Ezra's testimony hold up at trial? Yeah, he did testify under oath to those phone calls. The phone calls were listed on the arrest warrants with Times. And the state based a lot of their case on Ezra's statements. And I think that was a big factor in the case.

During those conversations, Ezra tells Renard to get out of the house if things are that tense. And Renard says, I'm going to show her she's not getting the house. This is all based on statements from Ezra. So the prosecution's motive was the house, but they just couldn't show the phone records at trial. The phone calls were made over apps and

they told us that they don't have the records. We found this out on location when we were interviewing Renard and Dick DeGuerre. And I spent hours on the phone with Ezra prior to that. And I was surprised and I was taken back when I heard that this was news to me. So I arranged another meeting with Ezra and I asked him, I said, were you truthful about these phone calls? And he said, yes, I was truthful. I did not lie. I wanted

to tell them everything Renard told me that evening leading up to the shooting. So he told me he was telling the truth. So Ezra was the only one that I am aware of that spoke about steroid use. But

When you talked to her cousin and to her daughter, did they also indicate that, you know, there were problems in the relationship to this degree? The daughter talked about how Renard seemed to be controlling. Also, Patricia's cousin, Sybil Shepard, who she was very close with, talked about Renard's alleged crimes.

controlling behavior. Patricia had this annual cruise that she would do with Sybil. And after a time, Sybil said it became increasingly more difficult because Renard was always checking on them and just controlling and not letting them have their fun. And, um,

Renard denied that. You know, he said, I let her go on the cruise. I let her, you know, she went on multiple cruises after we got married. So he denied any controlling behavior. Also, in regards to the steroid use, I asked Renard point blank, were you using steroids or were you using anything that altered your moods? We hear so much about roid rage. And he said he

He went to a doctor to treat low testosterone. He was prescribed pills and shots that he wasn't on steroids. So he denied that. The jury deliberated for 12 hours over two days, found Renard Spivey not guilty.

Well, it certainly surprised me only because it doesn't often happen on 48 hours. Do you expect that viewers were also surprised? Usually there's a more clear cut finish or ending to the story. In this case, he was acquitted. And I think the reason is because, again, jurors found reasonable doubt. Consultant Lisa Andrews again told us this all came down to the prosecution not proving their case in court. They didn't have enough evidence.

And, you know, the jury paid attention. They did their jobs. They couldn't connect the dots in this case.

Lisa Andrews told us the defense in the end had two good arguments for the jurors, and those were self-defense and accidental shooting. So if somebody had a doubt about accidental shooting, self-defense was another explanation that Dick DeGaran and Michael DeGaran presented in court. And Dick was able to explain that there's no safety on the trigger, so it's really easy to fire this gun. I mean, I thought to myself, I'm not going to do this.

I'm going to take a look at how many other cases this particular type of gun is involved in, because it seems like a particularly dangerous design. If you're trained and he would have been, perhaps you can handle it. But I would think there's a lot of people who can't handle a gun like that. Yes. And it's interesting. I did. I did ask him, too, about that, because his training, you would think, is something that also would kick in that when you see somebody pointing a gun at you as a

officer, you know, law enforcement, you're trained to deescalate the situation. I asked him about that when he said his training kicked in because he saw her finger was right on the trigger and he knew he had to get the gun out of her fingers because he knew that if there was any sort of pressure on that trigger, it would go off. And in fact, that's what happened. Wow.

So you spoke to Renard's twin sister, Renee, and she said there are really no winners at all in this case. Renard's life will never be the same. Patricia, of course, lost her life. What was it like talking to Patricia's family and how are they coping considering not only are they dealing with

the loss of Patricia, but also this case did not turn out the way they believed it should have. Yeah, you know, it's always heartbreaking when you cover these stories. In this case, though, looking at Petrina, that's Patricia's daughter, and she looks just like her mother. I mean, they look like they could have been sisters. And they had such a close bond, such a close relationship. And Petrina talked about how much hope

Patricia had when she married Renard. Renard was her first true love, her first marriage, her first house that they bought together. I mean, she viewed this as sort of her happily ever after. So it's just such a senseless tragedy. And Petrina said she had not cried. And in the middle of doing the interview with us, she started to cry. And she was like, oh, my gosh, oh, my gosh, I'm crying. I think it was sort of

cathartic for her, you know, having the resolution, even though it didn't go the way she thought it would go. She at least was sort of dealing with the emotions finally. And she did say that she was numb. She became numb after the shooting and she wasn't feeling things the way maybe you would feel things after such a big loss. And she said, I was numb for such a long time. And I think

And that breakthrough for her did come through when Natalie was talking to her. It was heartbreaking. Well, you know, you always wonder why people are willing to talk to us here at 48 Hours. And I hope in her case, it was therapeutic.

that this is the beginning of some sort of journey towards healing for her. But I was quite struck by the fact that she was caught off guard, that there were tears. And then what about Renard? How is Renard doing today?

Trying to pick up the pieces of his life, too, as we said, he's mourning the loss of Patricia as well. He still says she was the love of his life. He's spending a lot of time with his grandkids, doing a lot with his church within his community. Renard is trying to turn what was a horrible tragedy now into doing positive work.

And he's volunteering most weekends for an organization that is near and dear to him called Hoodies of Healing. It's an organization that helps to feed the homeless. And so he's very involved with that. He's also trying to go back to acting, he told me. Really? Because he was on a reality show, Justice with Christina Perez, as a bailiff. So he's also, I think, trying to revive his career.

acting career. We'll see what happens. It was a really well told hour. You guys did an excellent job and thanks for joining us. Thanks, Anne-Marie. Thank you.

If you like this series, Postmortem, please rate and review 48 Hours on Apple Podcasts and follow 48 Hours wherever you get your podcasts. You can also listen ad-free on Amazon Music, Wondry Plus, and the Wondry app, or with a 48 Hours Plus subscription on Apple Podcasts. Thanks again for listening.

If you like this podcast, you can listen ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a quick survey at wondery.com slash survey.

Harvard is the oldest and richest university in America. But when a social media-fueled fight over Harvard and its new president broke out last fall, that was no protection. Claudine Gay is now gone. We've exposed the DEI regime, and there's much more to come. This is The Harvard Plan, a special series from the Boston Globe and WNYC's On the Media. To listen, subscribe to On the Media wherever you get your podcasts. You don't believe in ghosts?

I get it. Lots of people don't. I didn't either, until I came face to face with them. Ever since that moment, hauntings, spirits, and the unexplained have consumed my entire life. I'm Nadine Bailey. I've been a ghost tour guide for the past 20 years. I've taken people along with me into the shadows, uncovering the macabre tales that linger in the darkness.

and inside some of the most haunted houses, hospitals, prisons, and more. Join me every week on my podcast, Haunted Canada, as we journey through terrifying and bone-chilling stories of the unexplained. Search for Haunted Canada on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you find your favorite podcasts. ♪

He was hip-hop's biggest mogul, the man who redefined fame, fortune, and the music industry. The first male rapper to be honored on the Hollywood Walk of Fame, Sean Diddy Cone. Diddy built an empire and lived a life most people only dream about. Everybody know ain't no party like a Diddy party, so. Yeah, that's what's up.

But just as quickly as his empire rose, it came crashing down. Today I'm announcing the unsealing of a three-count indictment charging Sean Combs with racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, interstate transportation for prostitution. I was f***ed up. I hit rock bottom. But I made no excuses. I'm disgusted. I'm so sorry. Until you're wearing an orange jumpsuit, it's not real. Now it's real.

From his meteoric rise to his shocking fall from grace, from law and crime, this is The Rise and Fall of Diddy. Listen to The Rise and Fall of Diddy exclusively with Wondery Plus.