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Welcome back to Postmortem. I'm your host, Anne-Marie Green. And today we are speaking with 48 Hours correspondent Erin Moriarty about the case of Katina Rose Salerno. In 1979, Katina was shot on campus at the University of the Pacific in California. It was the first day of her freshman year. And the assailant was her high school boyfriend, Stephen Burns. Katina was just 18 years old at the time.
Burns was convicted of second degree murder in 1980, and he's been in prison for four decades. Katina's family wants to keep it that way. They have attended every single parole board hearing, 13 in total, to advocate against his release. So,
Erin is joining us now. Erin, thank you so much. Well, I'm very happy to be here. Thank you, Anne-Marie, because this case, as you're going to hear, was eye-opening on so many different levels. I've seen it all, but I hadn't seen this, and so I want to talk about it. Yeah, we don't talk often about this sort of component of the criminal justice system, the parole system, so I'm
Looking forward to digging into it. I do want to remind everyone that if you haven't already listened to this episode of 48 Hours, you can find it in your podcast stream just above this one. Go ahead, go listen and then come on back. Katina Solano and Stephen Burns, they were high school sweethearts. They lived across the street from each other. But when Katina tried to break up with him, Burns threatened to kill her.
She left and she went to college and she was absolutely shocked when he turned up at the same college as her. They had discussed this before and he was supposed to be going to another college. They go off to their separate dorms to settle in, but he asks to speak with her and she agrees to do so. She tells her roommate, I'll be back. She never comes back. So what I found just as a journalist, very, very interesting.
impressive is the sheer number of people you all were able to track down from decades ago. We're talking about Katina's roommate, the then young student who stumbled upon Katina fighting for her life in the middle of campus, the patrol officer who stayed in her hospital room because he did not want her to be alone.
Talk to me about how you all managed to get in contact with all of these people and convince them to participate. It wasn't me. I'm as impressed as you are. We have these amazing producers, people who are willing to dig. And as you point out, they didn't go back 45 years.
And they managed to find so many people from that time. And what that allowed us to do with this story was bring the past alive in a way that is remarkable, but also heartbreaking. And as you mentioned, Randy Haight, who was the patrol officer young back then, 45 years ago,
And it's so moving to hear, you know, when he gets to the hospital, he's wondering why no one in the family is there. But that's because they're in San Francisco. She's a student at the college and her parents can't get there yet. And so he doesn't leave her.
He and another officer stay there until she dies and until the coroner gets there. And it's so moving. He's still friends with the family and even went to the very last parole hearing. Wow. And then to be able to talk to these now grown up roommates of both Katina and Stephen Burns. And I think what really hit me was that.
That event so struck Stephen Byrne's roommate, Les, who really only knew him for a day, realized this was the first day of college, really.
And he comes back with two really interesting stories. One, of course, is that Stephen had already come into that room and set up a shrine to Katina. And so I had asked him and I said, well, did he happen to mention that she had broken up with him? And he goes, no. He said, I saw more pictures than I'd ever seen. And also I was struck by the fact that Les...
had told us that he had been watching Monday Night Football when Stephen came back. But Stephen told the police he had been there all night. So that gives you a real sense right away from the beginning who Stephen Burns was.
Absolutely. The other thing that kind of was really brought home to me by seeing all these people is the amount of time that has passed and like who Katina could have been, you know, because like here they are. They're all grown up. They've lived whole lives, whole careers. Like, wow, who would she have been if she had been allowed to sort of live these next four decades, you know? Right. But Emery, there is something really special, even though she never got a chance to live her life.
She lives on in these people's lives. What was so interesting to me is they hadn't forgotten her. That one act by Stephen Burns wasn't just, didn't mean just the end of her life or affect her family. It affected so many people's lives. And Les was talking as if it
had happened yesterday. And Randy Haight, the officer who sat there, is still, you could see him thinking back to that night. So she never got a chance to live her life, but she certainly made an impact. Indeed. So this is not the first time that 48 Hours has actually covered this case. And I love it when we can kind of go into the archives.
The first report on the case was done in 1990 by correspondent Bernard Goldberg. Yes, it was. Bernard Goldberg was the very first correspondent with 48 Hours. And I've been around long enough to remember Bernard Goldberg. And I actually joined as a full-time correspondent three years later. But he was the very first and really was a terrific correspondent at the time.
And that was a time when 48 Hours, where we got the name, was we would spend 48 hours or more on a story. And so you really see it even when you see Bernard talking to the family during our hour of how much time he was spending with them because he was spending a lot of time with them on the fly as they were going to the very first parole hearing. Yeah, I mean, he's sort of talking...
Very comfortably. Yeah, we would go everywhere with people. We would joke that they would be so tired of us. And I could tell when someone I was interviewing would say, yes, Erin, because I've been there for 48 hours. So Bernard Goldberg spent a lot of time with his family to see what would happen at that very first parole hearing. Mm hmm.
So then why did 48 Hours decide to update viewers on this case? Was it because there was another parole hearing coming up? I mean, I guess who would have thought that there would have been so many parole hearings between then and now?
Anne-Marie, we stay on stories for a long time. And yes, it was because there was the 13th parole hearing. And I have to tell you, remember I said this was eye-opening? In my mind, he was finally going to get out. I mean, I didn't realize all the elements that really go in to determine whether someone should get parole or not.
I thought it was really good that you explored that idea. You know, asking, listen, like, what is justice? What is the system for? Are you sure that you're in the pursuit of justice? Or is this just like a personal thing? Because, you know, it's hard to get over someone taking someone you loved. I thought you, the way you explored it was just,
was delicate but direct. Well, and the California law does allow for parole when somebody is judged to be suitable for parole. So you had to wonder what was the motive behind the family keeping him in. And so I did think we had to raise it. But they said he stalked her and he would never admit at these parole hearings that he had stalked her. And so their concern was that if he was ever out,
out, he could still hurt somebody by stalking or controlling behavior, even if he didn't kill someone. I didn't understand that until I worked on this story. We're going to dig in a little bit more to that, but I just want to ask you something about the court case, which
was really surprising to me. I know it was back in 1980, but Katina's two sisters, Regina and Nina, they testified in Burns' trial, but Nina was just 14 years old, and she
She had to testify without her parents in the courtroom. They were not allowed. Why? She was a minor. Well, it's really interesting. The Solano said that when they first went to this trial, they thought that there was more attention and more concern for the defendant's rights than victims' rights. Harriet and Michael were not allowed into the trial because they were on the witness list. And back then...
That was the thought that if you're going to testify at a trial, you can't be at the trial because it could affect your own testimony. Nina, who was only 14, had to testify against Stephen Burns, the young man who had been her friend. She saw him as a brother.
No one else was allowed to go in with her. Her parents weren't in the court. And so they did not want to have other victims go through what they did. So Harriet made it her life's work to help other victims. And so now, because of Harriet's group, now a young person who has to testify goes in with a support person. So they've made a difference for other victims. ♪
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Welcome back. In 1980, Stephen Burns was found guilty of second degree murder and he was sentenced to 17 years to life with the possibility of parole. The Salarnos have attended 13 parole hearings for Burns since that time.
Erin, I don't think I knew exactly how the parole system works, but 13 sounds like a lot. Why was he up for parole so many times? Well, every state is different. But what happens is at a parole hearing, the commissioners don't just decide whether you are suitable or unsuitable for parole. They also decide whether
how much time they're going to give you to clean up your act. And so it could be two years, it could be five years. And that's what happened. And so the Salernos, I mean, they didn't have to come back each time, but they did come back every single time. So this is really interesting because you interviewed Kevin Anderson, right?
who was once a pediatrician and formerly incarcerated with Burns. He now counsels, or he's a counselor, and he worked with Burns in mock hearing sessions to prep him for his last parole hearing. Very interesting. Kevin told you that he felt that Burns did deserve to be released?
How did you connect to Kevin and how does he feel now? So, of course, we asked Stephen Burns to speak with us. And I was hopeful he might, but he did not. What he did instead was suggest that we talk to Kevin Anderson. And Kevin Anderson did give us a lot of insight into Stephen Burns. And when I first met him, which was right before the 13th parole hearing,
He said that he had worked with him while he was still in prison. He had gotten out on parole and thought that Stephen Burns had finally come to accept the behaviors that had led to the shooting. He even described what Stephen had told him about how he had looked at Katina and seen the fear in her eyes. And
And another big question in this, which is almost as troubling as the fact that he shot his girlfriend yesterday.
she didn't die immediately. He didn't call 911. So it wasn't just that he shot her, he let her die. He goes back to his dorm and starts watching Monday Night Football and never says a word. When I talked to Les, Les said he didn't even look nervous. So Kevin Anderson said to us, this time he actually admitted what a coward he had been. So Kevin thought,
This is what he's going to tell the parole board, this 13th parole board, and that he's finally going to admit to the behaviors that led to him thinking it was okay to kill his girlfriend if she didn't want to be with him anymore. But he didn't. No, he did not. So how does Kevin feel about him now? I've got to give a lot of credit to Kevin Anderson. I was very impressed with him because when he...
the transcript from that 13th parole hearing, he was shocked. And so he wrote Liza Finley, who was the producer of this show. And God bless him. He said, oh my gosh, I was wrong. This guy is not
ready for parole. Wow. Can you believe this? You know, Kevin Anderson said. And so I had to be back in San Francisco anyway, which is where Kevin Anderson is. And I went back to have him explain. And he's the one who said to me, you know, he might never shoot someone again, but he has not come to terms with his controlling behavior. And he could still hurt somebody without killing them. He could still cause damage. Hmm.
I want to talk a little bit about filming the day of that most recent parole hearing. This is in 2025. There's this really sort of tender moment with you, Erin, that you're driving in the backseat. You're with Harriet, who's Katina's mom, and you sort of reach out to touch her hand. Can you tell me about what was happening in that moment?
Well, we all know, Anne-Marie, that we're not supposed to ever become part of a story. And I try really hard not to. But I've worked at 48 Hours for such a long time, and you spend so much time with people. It wasn't that I just reached out to touch her. She said to me that she was shaking. She's a 92-year-old woman.
who was going to her 13th parole hearing, was very worried that the man who killed her daughter could get out and hurt someone else. And I just put my hand on hers, and she was shaking. And it was just the right thing to do at that moment. But it really lets you know that it never gets easier. You would think by 13, you would...
I don't know, know exactly what to expect, know exactly what you want the board members to hear. But it's still like this emotional upheaval of,
to yet to go there again. Yes, this was, she said, as tough almost as the first one. Yeah. Wow. Wow. In fact, you sat with Harriet and the family in the conference room and watched the parole hearing. 48 hours couldn't bring cameras in there. So it was just kind of you and there with the family. But tell me what that was like.
Well, I felt very blessed to be able to sit in there because we were not allowed to record any of it. But they did. Commissioners allowed me to sit in. And so, of course, I was dying of curiosity to get a sense of who Stephen Burns was. You know, there were other people that he had encountered during prison. According to a complaint brought up at previous parole hearings, a couple of instructors said
said that he made them uncomfortable. Were they women, the instructors? Women, women, yes. Both instructors, sorry, both instructors were women. One, when she wouldn't allow him into a class that he wanted to get into, and another, when he did not think he got the grade he deserved. And
It wasn't so much that he said something to them. That wasn't the problem. But the way he said it and the way he felt entitled, and I think you could hear it from the commissioner, that the commissioners believed the same thing, that he just could not hear himself. He could not see his own behavior as troubling as it was. And so they found him unsuitable. It's just he has not...
He acknowledged, accepted what he did back then. That's what the family is concerned about. Yeah. You know, just as an aside, this is a family who opened their doors and their heart to a young man and like that level of betrayal to welcome him into your home. Because Katina's father sort of took him a little bit under his wing, right? Oh, my gosh, yes. And Nina, Nina saw him as...
You know, the sports, the athletes. She was an athlete. And so he was like a brother and she trusted him. And the girls felt so betrayed by the guy across the street that took away their big sister and changed their lives forever. Right. It was a betrayal to every person in that family. And you had mentioned a little bit earlier that, like...
that it kind of changed the trajectory of their lives in certain ways. Again, that was eye-opening to me, too, just how much this one act affected this family forever. Harriet, with her victims group, where she helped change the loss, and still goes to work every day at age 92.
And then you have Nina, who had to testify by herself and that because of that awful experience, became a prosecutor, focusing on victims of abuse so that other people don't have to go through that. And then Regina, who...
remembering that her sister died in a hospital, became a nurse. So it was an awful thing that this family went through, but every member of that family made their tragedy better for other people.
Absolutely. You know, Erin, like every once in a while people ask me, isn't it sort of depressing to work on these sort of stories? And I always say no, because for every story, there's heroes. And here you have an entire family that are heroic heroes.
in their efforts to make sure that no one else becomes a victim the way that their loved one became, you know? Anne-Marie, I'm just like you. People say, how can you deal with this after all these years, Erin? And I go, because I don't think about the horror. I think about the heroes.
I love that. I absolutely love that. Erin, another great hour. It was really an interesting way to sort of delve into the story. We don't talk enough about the parole system, what's great about it, but also what's really challenging about it, especially for the families of the victims. So thank you so much. Thank you, Anne-Marie. I'll be back, as you know. I know you will.
And if you like this series, Postmortem, please rate and review 48 Hours on Apple Podcasts and follow 48 Hours wherever you get your podcasts. And you can also listen ad-free with a 48 Hours plus subscription on Apple Podcasts. Thanks for listening. Now streaming. When everything's on the line, real heroes rise to the occasion. TV's hottest show is Fire Country. We're firefighters. We're going to find a way to get you out of here.
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It's not just music. This is family. We call them music legends. To be great, there are sacrifices that need to take place. They call them mom and dad. My mom is literally calling me right now. The Global Music Docu-Series returns to Paramount+.
Nobody can hype the world up like my dad. With rare family stories from the children of Lil Wayne, Busta Rhymes, Salt-N-Pepa, and more. Parents just don't understand. Don't miss the new season of Family Legacy. All episodes now streaming exclusively on Paramount+.