You Don’t Need a Raise, You Need a Plan
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Win with your money. Win in your profession and win in your relationships. Thrilled to have you with us. 888-825-5225 is the phone number. Rachel Cruz joins me today. I'm Ken Coleman, and let's get right to it. Are you ready to roll? Let's do it. Answer these questions. Christy is up first in Kansas City. Christy, how can we help today?

So I was just wondering how you guys would handle this. My husband and I are newly married, about six months. We were both previously married. I was married for 26 years, and he was married for seven. And both of us, through our relationships, it's like we both had financial infidelity by our partners. So I found out that my ex-husband had been lying to me about money for years,

well over 15 years. And, and then his ex wife, she left him and then try, he's a farmer. So if they have a large farm and she tried to take the whole farm. So there's been a lot of infidelity there on the financial side. So both of us have these deep fears of combining finances and,

from, you know, previous relationship. We don't know how to handle moving forward financially together, biblically speaking. What do you mean, biblically speaking? Well, I know from listening to your guys' podcast, you say the two shall become one, and that includes finances.

And there is just a lot of fear there with combining and afraid that you're going to get what you got before and that you're going to find out, oh my gosh, this person who I was supposed to be able to trust was lying to me. And then his side of the fence is, well, if I open up to her and I tell her what's actually going on with finances, she's going to mess me over and take me to the cleaners again. Yeah. Okay. I get what you're saying. Here's what I would say right out of the gate.

I actually think if I were in your shoes, and I understand the trust issues, so what's going on with both of you is very natural. It's very normal. I think you guys got to get with a therapist without question and work through this. But I would tell you that just practically speaking, I think that the fact that you have your finances merged and shared is

actually creates greater accountability for both, right? So that the trust at least has some type of transparency. Now, just because you share accounts doesn't mean that financial infidelity isn't happening. However, one big step going forward to me is, okay, there are no separate accounts and we both see what's in there. And even just getting into an every dollar budget and beginning to look where every dollar is being spent, all of that begins to create so much transparency that

that trust is in some way a byproduct. I'm not in any way saying that therapy doesn't still need to happen because, Rachel, I want to get your thoughts on this because I do think we need a good therapist to help us both heal because they've both had this trauma. Yeah, I mean, you've both been burned by the exact same issue from an ex-spouse. So, yeah, Christy, I mean, you're not crazy by any means for this to be –

so heightened and so aware. Um, but I would also just challenge you that the man you chose to marry and that you chose at the altar and, and said those vowels, you know, what, what, um,

What caused you to say yes to him? What were those things? He loves Jesus big. And I respected his walk with Christ and who he was. His character was so good. And he was different than anybody else I had met. Yeah.

So I think what can happen is our emotions and from our past, it's almost like a neuropathway in our brains, right? It has been formed for you that with money, it's like, don't trust, don't trust, don't trust.

And over time, you are going to have to build a new way of trusting. And I think even leaning on kind of just those facts of what you just told me, Christy, like this man is not your ex-husband. And I know me just saying that doesn't wipe away all the emotion, but just you have to trust yourself as well. And I think when people get blindsided by a spouse, whether it's

financial infidelity in an affair or something, there's almost that fear of, I can't even trust myself. How did I miss it? You're probably asking yourself, how did I miss it for 15 years? You're thinking about that. I would say trust yourself, Christy, because you chose someone to do life with. Again, I would talk to a therapist because that trust

That string isn't going to just be tied to money. It's going to come out in other parts of your marriage where you probably have a level of that wall. And why we say, too, to combine finances, yeah, I would say from a spiritual perspective, I think it's wise. But it's also, again, whether you're spiritual or not, it's

The data shows couples that combine finances not only have a higher level of happiness, but there's also a depth of complete intimacy that when you say, I said yes to this person and I chose to lock arms with them and take on the world together. When you do that in just this like fullness together,

you enjoy life together more than trying to keep everything separate and compartmentalized, if you will. So again, from a spiritual aspect, yes, but I would say it's even bigger than a spiritual aspect. I think people that aren't spiritual find this level of depth in their marriage when they choose to work as a team. Well, because, and you're right, because of, again, the word we've been talking about, which is trust. Christy, I want to dig a little bit. We've kind of told you what we thought. You've been listening. I'm curious.

Are you both, would you say you both are at the same level of distrust of each other, even though you're probably happily married in every other area? Describe for us where you are and where he is on the particular issue of trust of each other and money right now. How would you describe that? Well, on his side of the fence, he farms with his dad. So that's a family business, generally.

generational. And so we also have a mix on his side of the fence of fear from the whole family. Yeah. Yes. You know what I get? So that makes us even. Can I jump in here, Christy? Christy, can I jump in? Okay. This is, we never talk about prenups. You know, we like our, it's almost a, almost never conversation. I feel like around here with prenups, unless there's a few caveats. One of them is if there is an excessive amount of wealth,

You know, there's a level of just protection there. But then the other one is kind of what you're talking about, Christy, for him at least. If there is some level of a family business, because we've talked to people like this where they get divorced and the ex still has voting stock in the company and then he gets remarried to someone crazy and now all of them are still speaking into the ex's family and it's affecting other people. So,

This may be a conversation that you have with him of that specifically, that farm, because it is tied to other people in the family. That domino effect is very real for those, for them to be protected in that sense with a farm, you know, with through through some level of prenup. So, again, we say almost never a prenup, but there are situations that make sense because it's protecting other people as well.

So that may be something on his side towards you, right? So it would be for you to sign. We did sign a prenuptial agreement. So I actually volunteered to sign one. I said, when we were dating, I said, I'm feeling like that

there's something here. And I said, I just, I said, if you need a piece of paper, then give it to me and I'll find it because I don't want anything from you. Oh, well, that's huge. That had to, that had to create a lot of trust for him. That had to be huge. Well, there's still, there's still some walls there. You know, I can, I can sense that he doesn't want to open up to me too much yet. And from my perspective of having, um,

that been violated on my side of the fence, I completely understand it. I'm like, as you should be. You should be worried. I got to say, Christy, I think you guys are on the way. I believe...

marital counseling here because neither one of you were the bad guys. You're both victims. That's an interesting combination and a professional will get you guys the tools that you can heal. I think you commit big time to some serious therapy, one time a week maybe. And let's dive into this and come out on the other side and then I think you guys will get there. Really, really interesting call. Thanks for trusting us.

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Hi there. So I am in a bit of a pickle right now. I'm a stay-at-home mom, a new stay-at-home mom. So I was working previously, but now my husband provides all the income for our family. We have an eight-month-old son. But our biggest issue right now is that our vehicles are taking up way too much of our budget. And before we got married, my husband bought this really nice truck that...

he could afford or he thought he could afford then and that was before we met before we got married and now it's costing us almost as much as our mortgage and we owe about $25,000 more than the car is worth right now. $25,000 more than it's worth? $25,000 more than it's worth. Oh my. Okay how much do you guys owe on it?

About $55,000. $55,000. Okay. And you're thinking you can only Kelly Blue Book it for what, $25,000? About $30,000. $30,000. $25,000, $30,000. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is your husband willing to get rid of it? He is.

Um, and he's actually making, um, a big chunk of, um, change right now. He's working up in Alaska, so he's making about four times as much as he normally would. Oh, wow. So I've been trying to convince him to throw all this extra income at the truck, but he's saying, no, let's just get to the snowball plan and go smallest to largest. Well,

It's a lot of money that we could be using for other bills if we could get rid of the truck. Well, why don't you walk us through where you are on the snowball right now? Walk that out for us. Smallest to largest. Yes, we pay off. The mortgage is $1,400. No, no, no. Tell me your current debts, smallest to largest. Oh, I see. Okay. So we have a credit card that's about $600 left. His credit card, which is about $5,000.

We have, I'm sorry, that wasn't small solar just, but my credit card, which is about 600. I have a personal loan for 2000. We have a joint loan together for 3000. He's got a credit card for five, his own personal loan for 7,000. And then I have student loans for about 8,000. Okay.

Right up, it's like two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight. It's like stair-step kids. Okay, so then the $8,000 student loan and then the truck, or is there another one? And then my car, which is about $22,000. Okay. Now, what's that worth? His truck. What's the $22,000 car worth? About $20,000. Okay. And how much are you guys making a month now that his income is up? What...

What is he bringing in? Right now, he's bringing in about $16,000 a month. $16,000 a month. Golly, that's amazing. How much surplus is that? If you do your full budget, sorry, Rachel, if you got all your expenses, including the minimum payments on debt, how much extra do you have now that he's making this $16,000 a month? Yes, so our expenses right now are about $1,500 a week, so that's about...

$6,000 a month, so that's about $8,000 surplus. Okay. And how long has he been doing this? I'm just asking these questions for Rachel because she's running numbers here for you. So how long has he been making that extra money and how much longer will he make that in Alaska?

So he's been doing it for about four weeks. He's going to continue to do it for about three more. Oh, three more weeks. So it's very short. Yeah. Okay. Is that because of his, is that because he's choosing to make it shorter or is it because of what he's doing? There's only like that much contract or whatever it is. It's just seasonal. It's like a contract. He's a crane operator. Okay. Gotcha. Gotcha. Gotcha.

Well, what I would say is, yeah, I mean, I'm on his team with going ahead and just because you would not you guys would knock out one to, you know, close to three of these debts using the debt snowball with this extra money coming in, being able to knock those out with the surplus. And if he's going to be working for three more weeks doing that, it's like, yeah. So I would stick to the snowball method. And then I would challenge you guys and just say, you know, yeah.

You guys can keep the cars and keep trucking down the debt snowball, but run the math and just say...

What if we did sell them at a loss, right? So you would have to take out a personal loan. So for yours and for you to have a car, you'll have to take out to probably $7,000 loan for you to get a crappy car and pay the $2,000 that you owe on yours that you're underwater. And then for him, what if you guys took a $30,000 loan versus a $55,000 loan, right? I mean, you're shortening the life of this.

so significantly because of two cars. You know what I mean? Like, it hurts so bad to say that it's upside down and it's like, I mean, it's just, it's sickening, right? I mean, how much you guys are paying per month for this stuff, I get it.

But I think if you can get a credit union to give you guys two other personal loans, I think that's what I would do. And then Kelly blue book these individually. Because this is an expensive truck. We're talking 55 grand. After he's been driving it for two to three years. I mean, like, yeah. I think I would take the hit too. And just, you know, you're also going to get a real raise here after you start knocking out some of these debts. So I agree with Hubs, but I want to make sure you hear what we're saying.

Work the snowball, okay? And he's right about that with the extra income. However, take the hit and get rid of both cars. Yeah, what were you doing before, Shelby, before you went home as a stay-at-home mom? Yeah, I was a court clerk. Okay, okay. Because I'm just trying to think. I just know a family right now personally, and she was a stay-at-home mom for years, and she's working three days a week now to get them moving and going. So I'm like, I just wonder for a season –

If there is something that's... And I don't know what that looks like. I don't know if you... You probably can't do that virtually. Well, I was going to... I have a photography business on the side, too. Oh, you do? How many hours a week are you spending on that? It's not super regular that way, but I'd say it's probably...

Maybe $1,000 a month. Okay, that's great. But I'm with Rachel on this. I wonder if we take that skill set and experience of being a court clerk. So we're talking about details, right? Good listener. You're administrative in nature. Is that right? You enjoy that and you're good at it? Dotting the I's, crossing the T's. I wonder if you don't look into maybe doing virtual executive assistant or something like that. Even if it's 20 hours a week, 30 hours a week.

Because you can do that in your sleep. Something like that. Yeah, because I'm just thinking, how much do you guys make a year when he goes back to his normal salary? Normally about $100,000. $100,000 a year. And what was your previous salary as a court clerk?

About $55,000. Oh, I wonder if you can't get $40,000, even $50,000 as an executive assistant and you do it all virtual. I'm just running really fast math here, but I'm like, if you guys are using all this extra as I'm going down my list, and if you go and get that loan for $30,000 and $7,000 and pay the cars, it's basically right at $50,000 that you guys have left with those cars and then the other student loan and personal loan.

So that's kind of what it goes down to, to say after all the smoke clears, we're going to have about 50 grand left to pay off. We make 100 grand. That's doable. Yeah. That's very doable. I mean, what if we, yeah, what if there was something for six months? You know, it doesn't have to be long, that there's just something to bring in. Just because the whole goal here, which you know, but-

is just to fast forward this process. Do this as fast as possible. We call it gazelle intensity, but just get through it as fast as possible. And there's going to be some sacrifices, things you don't want to do, but it's for such a short amount of time. It's six months to a year and be done with all of this, right? And then save up for the emergency fund and replacing your cars because you guys are going to want new cars after the beaters that you buy.

that are crappy but it's just this idea of this progress really fast so yeah the photography stuff's great I mean a thousand bucks is usually what we see a side hustle people bring in if they can bring in a thousand dollars a month that's great and that's great by the way Shelby I didn't want to sneeze at that no but I do think there's something even more yeah you have a lot to offer so I'm just like man I wonder for you know and I know it's not ideal and I know as a mom too you know when you

decide, because I even pulled back from work a lot when my third was born. And you kind of have this mindset of like, okay, I'm going to be more present as a mom. I'm here. And so to kind of rewind that a little bit and plug work back in, that's a hard mental obstacle, Shelby. So I get that. But my only hope in all of it is that it's for such a short period of time. And I really, I think you guys can do this and work as a team, but

To answer your original call, Shelby, I think we agree with the husband. Throw it at the debt snowball, but Ken and I both agree. Sell those cars, take a loan for the difference, and keep on going. Make no mistake. It's going to be painful to drive a piece of crap for a while, but if you've got your mindset on where this gets us, then you can drive anything, and here's the deal. Park around the corner and walk a little bit. ♪ music playing ♪

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Hi, thank you so much for taking my call, you guys. You bet. What's going on? So my question is, I have a studio that I would like to renovate and it's going to cost about 10 grand. And would it be a bad idea to rent it out to my parents?

I'm going to go ahead without any information and say yes. But I'm going to admit early on, Rachel, that that might be a snap reaction. That was a snap reaction, Ken. I'm owning that. Tell us more. Yeah, give us more of the why. Why would we do that?

Okay, so I got this idea and I got the sense of urgency because my father shared with me his retirement plan in January. And he has very bad spending habits. He did say that his plan is to retire in Mexico, be a gold miner with $30,000 that he has, and basically leave my mom here with his Social Security check so she can keep paying their rent.

And their rent is $1,200. And that's the same exact amount that he gets for Social Security. So I'm kind of freaking out here and thinking, you know, my mom won't be able to keep up with that payment on her own anymore.

So I know my dad is going to splurge and spend his money in about one or two years and he's going to come back and want to also move in with my mother in the back studio I have. So in order

in order to maybe not enable his bad spending habits, that's where I was like, okay, what if I charge them rent? And part of it would be to pay me back for the renovations I've done. But the other part is to secretly fund for their retirement and any future bills that that's going to fall on me. But you're not going to get paid. Do you realize that Rachel? They're not going to pay you. They're not gonna have any money. Yeah. This is a disaster. Okay. So Rachel, you can't stop. I want to know how you, how are you financially? How much debt do you have? How much savings do you have?

Um, thankfully my husband and I are almost debt free. We have a paid off mortgage and savings. We both have about a hundred thousand for retirement and 5,000 for emergency. 5,000 for emergencies. How much debt do you have left? $500. Oh, okay. So you'll pay that off this month. I mean, you'll, that'll be done. That's amazing. Okay. So, um, how much do you guys make a year?

We make $120,000. $120,000. Okay. So, man. Okay. I have so many thoughts. I have lots of thoughts. I know. Do you want to go first? You have what? We have two boys that are four and six years from going to college, so we're trying to hurry up and pay for a college fund. Yeah. Okay. So I got to jump in real quick with a question then.

I'm with Rachel. I don't think you can expect any money from them. So for this moment, let's suspend this idea that they're going to pay you and help pay this thing off and whatever, whatever. My question is, if they live with you in this studio, how much money are they going to cost you? Assuming they don't pay you rent, is it going to be any kind of a utility suck or something? Is it minimal as to what they'll actually cost you and your husband? Yeah.

Yeah, I'll say it's minimal. Maybe combined with electricity and whatnot, it would be like $300. Okay. I just wanted to know that. I also wanted Rachel to hear that, too. So it's going to be a minimal increase because we have to assume, I think Rachel's right, that dad's going to go do something really dumb, and boy, oh, boy. Is gold mining like a thing in Mexico? Is that like a – That was a question I had. No.

I don't hear a lot about it. So I don't know what video he's watching. Is he being for real, Rachel, or is he kind of just saying, like, I'm just going to leave? Well, no, he really wants to be Yosemite Sam because he did it in his teenage years, and he has a friend who has a golden son. How old are your parents? Dance, varmint! Sorry, I just had to say that for everybody who knows who Yosemite Sam is. It's an older demographic, I've got to point out. All the boomers are laughing. How old are your parents, Rachel?

My dad is 71 and my mother is 61. Oh, geez. Okay. And how old are you guys? We're 35. Oh, man. Okay. Yeah, this is a challenge. So, I mean, here's the reality, and this is what's always so difficult about family relationships when you're the parent.

That's what's happening, Rachel. You are flipping and that's not fair to you. So I just need to say first and foremost, this is not your responsibility. It's not. Like, you can only control you. They are going to dig themselves into whatever hole, finding gold or doing whatever they're going to do. Literally, he's going to dig himself in a hole. So like...

Like you can't stop that, right? And so there is one side of the coin and some people are like this where they're like, we are putting up a boundary. It would be like if your husband was like, we are absolutely not funding your crazy parents. No, we're not doing this. Like some people put a hard boundary and it's like mom and dad, y'all have to grow up at some point and I'm not going to be the safety and I'm not gonna be the parent. So that's one side of the coin. Ken may lean more on that side. Oh, I promise you. You know me well. I know. But then there's another part, Rachel, a human part with a heart. Yeah.

I have a heart. I also have a brain. That does say to a point, like, am I really going to let my parents be on the side of the road? If I have the ability. They're not going to be on the side of the road. You know why? Because Rachel's mom is going to look at, if I went to Stacy, my wife of almost 27. But you're not her parents. You're not her parents. But Rachel, your mom at some point is going to tell your dad to wake up and smell the coffee. Is she not?

She has, and we've had the pastor intervene and family members with the spending habits, and that's why they are where they are right now. Does your mom work?

She works 12 hours a week. Okay. Well, if I were her, if she was calling this show, Rachel, right now, I would tell her as much as we talk about combining finances and being one as a team, he is the most risk possible for her not to retire. So if I were her, I would be working 40 hours a week and I would be creating my own retirement. I mean, honestly, because he's a child. Like, this is crazy. You know what I mean? Like, it's just...

But here's something I want to point out. Rachel, please speak up to this, okay? You, Rachel. Rachel and Phoenix, Rachel. Rachel and Phoenix. I believe that this is kind of like a teenager. I think your dad needs to be treated like a teenager. And that's why I agree with my partner here, Rachel's advice on this. Have mom take care of mom for a bit. Because I don't think anybody's going to get through to this guy. The only thing that's going to get through to him, as Dave has said this for decades, when you land so hard, you bounce. And I think this guy...

I hate this, what I'm about to say. But I think the family, including your mom's going to go, all right, pal, go to Mexico. Please, for the love of God, be safe. But let the guy go digging and let him go gold mining. And when he doesn't find any gold and he runs out of all money,

He's a bit of the prodigal here. Yeah. And I think it's the only shot you have. Hitting rock bottom. Is to let this guy get this out of his system. He's 71. I think this is his last hurrah. And I think he probably doesn't even realize it. I think to get his attention. But I think mom protects herself. I agree so much with Rachel Cruz on this. Rachel, your thoughts on that? I mean, where's mom at on this deal? Because you're trying to help. And I don't think, by the way, I want to make sure we come back to this point.

I don't think this is your problem, even though it feels like it. I don't think it's your problem. So my mom opened up her own secret account for $20,000, and she's afraid that she has to speak on it when they file their taxes together. And he's going to find out. Not for a savings account. No, for high-yield savings. She doesn't need to report to taxes. No, just earned income, right? I don't think so.

I don't think so. Here's the deal. I'm not a tax pro. I was certain about it until you looked at me sideways, and I was like, then I started thinking. I don't think that's going to be an issue. But again, I would have her consult with a tax pro. Go to ramsaysolutions.com. He'll know what she earned, so that he will see. But listen, that's okay.

yeah i'm okay with that conversation i'm not suggesting by the way this is a secret that's right don't even make it i think she needs to be bold and go hey yosemite sam i got to take care of me because there's a good chance this is really going to be harsh but i'm going to say it there's a chance this guy goes down there and and and falls into something bad i mean i gold mining in mexico you might as well get on a roller coaster without the seat belt

I don't think this is a wise decision. I'm not in any way making light of that, but she's got to protect herself. And I would say to her, she looks at him and goes, you're putting us at risk with this crazy venture. So the renting the studio thing, I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't do it. And the only way I would do it is that it's a ministry to mom and dad and we don't need the income as rental and we're going to fix it up for them and it's there for them if they need a landing. And you're just going to be a good daughter.

But I would expect zero, zero money from them. But if you guys need this as rental income for your life to fund your kid's college, sorry, Mom and Dad. We're renting to someone else. I'll tell you one thing I am going to do. I am going to see what the gold mining situation is in Mexico. She's got my intrigue up. If Ken doesn't show back up to the show, we know where he's gone. Ken went to Home Depot to get a bunch of pickaxes.

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Today's question comes from Antonio in Indiana. I'm 22 years old and getting married this year. Once we combine finances, we will have no debt and we'll be making $205,000 a year. While we feel extremely blessed, we just recently started earning this much, so it's a little intimidating.

In the next two years, we could easily save for a 20% down payment in addition to an emergency fund. Do you have any tips on how we should remain content with renting during that time? The longing to reach my goals often clouds the journey it took to get there. And I don't want that to be the case for the first two years of marriage. Oh, that's good. Very good question. What say you? You're the contentment queen. I don't know.

preaching to myself all the time, Ken. Okay. I don't, this may be a little Pollyanna, but I also think when you get married, that's such a newness in life.

that this whole thing of like, oh gosh, I gotta like do the next thing money-wise, the intensity kind of changes in a sense because your whole life has changed. Like you're starting this new life with a new partner and you're like, you're doing all of this. So there's almost this element of life that changes that's exciting that may kind of help naturally kind of loosen this like discontentment you may feel towards a money goal. It's like when you have a baby, right? Like it's just something just changes naturally

and you kind of have like this new thing in life. And then once you kind of get the rhythm of that, if we ever get the rhythm of marriage, let's be honest, it's like then from there, you guys, I mean, then you'll be like, okay, we have 12 months and we'll be good. So I think being as present as possible, I've learned this, Ken, recently,

with some stuff I've been reading because staying completely present is so difficult because we're always thinking forward or thinking backwards of like, oh gosh, even at lunch today. I mean, you're just where our minds go. It's rarely in the present. So it's almost a practice to be present. I mean, it really is because we just, we're either forward and back all the time. So I think it's hard for a lot of people, but also, I don't know, Antonio, I think you'll be okay. I think that

there's a fun new element of your life that's about to change with marriage and you're going to enjoy that and i don't know there'll be enough distractions i think when i was 14 adopted i had an old pastor tell me looked me in the eye and i'll never forget he took he had his bible in his hand and he kind of thumped me on the shoulder he says young man hear me on this don't sacrifice the future on the altar of the immediate

That's a lot of old man speak. But what that statement says is don't risk or sacrifice your future on how you're feeling in the now. And so to Antonio, I would say, how do you stick with renting while you're accumulating that down payment? You start looking towards the future and you say, if I wait and I get that 20% down payment and I do it the right way and I buy that way when I'm ready, I'm

my future is so much better. But if I don't wait right now and I go in and I become house poor, what is that going to do to my mind, my wife's mind? So just look out to the future and go, what do I want that future to be? And that's going to require me to sacrifice now. You want to go lose weight. You want to lose 30 pounds by summer. Well, now we start to go, I have got to win the now.

And I've got to be disciplined in the now or else I don't get where I want to be. You can pick any category of life. So that would be my encouragement there. Two things I want to get to really quick. I want to go back. You and I did a little research. You did the research. Oh, yes. I want to cover that tax question. For the interest, yes. So the interest earned on the high-yield savings, if it's over $125 in 2024, it is considered earned income. So if she, which depending on how long she's had that 20 grand in the high yield. That's right. Yep, there will be.

taxes on that. But we'll circle back to that call again. Who cares if he learns about it? It didn't change our advice. He should be learning about it. He should know about it. Regardless of taxes or not. But we did want to clarify that. By the way, that's what we would call a simple tax situation. So if you have a simple tax situation, I want to make you aware of Ramsey Smart Tax. We're really excited about this.

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dot com slash smart tax. All right. I think you call that Worcester. We'll find out. Is it Worcester or is it Worcester? I have a fun fact about Worcester. Oh, you want to get her on it? Okay. So let's go to Jessica. Jessica, is it Worcester, Mass? It's Worcester. Worcester. Worcester. Oh, I should have known. Jessica, do you know Holy Cross that's there? I know Holy Cross very well. My best friend graduated from Holy Cross. Okay. My brother-in-law played basketball there.

Fun connection. Yes, I know. And I went to an American versus Holy Cross basketball game in D.C. Did you really? And watched it happen. So anyways, that's my fun fact about that. Did you get a funnel cake while you were there? No. All right. How can we help you, Jessica?

Well, first, thank you guys for what you do. I'm really grateful to be speaking with you. And my question is a little bit of context really quick. My husband and I are currently working Baby Step 2. We've been working it since July of last year. We are on pace to complete Baby Step 2 at the end of April, so next month. And then we will be at Baby Steps, thank you, 4 and 5 biweekly.

by this August. So saving for our kids' college fund this August. But at that time, our twins will be 15 and heading into their sophomore year of high school. And while I wish we found you guys sooner, we didn't. So we will be starting from scratch. And my question is, what is the best way to go approach saving for their college fund, knowing that we're going to need to dip into it within three years?

Does it still make sense to invest in a 529? Is there something else that you would recommend is my question. Honestly, I would recommend a 529 more to you guys than even others. We always recommend a 529 because it grows tax-free for educational purposes. So the money in there...

The big fear around 529s, especially people that have young kids, is that they're going to overfund it and or college is going to change so much between now and 18 years that who knows if that money gets stuck. So there's some caution around it with people with younger kids.

But for you guys, I mean, yeah, I would for sure. I would sit down with a SmartVestor Pro because they're going to be able to look at what the market's doing. They're actually, a lot of these financial advisors who are great, they're going to be able to run these numbers to know, okay, should they go in more aggressive funds?

more conservative funds and they're going to do the best to really work with you guys but i yeah i mean if i were you i would i would i would go ahead and invest into a 529 for them um are they what's what's expectation of college for them is it state school community college where where are they are they scholarships in the future what are you thinking

Great question. So it's a little bit up in the air. There's definitely the possibility of, you know, college. So I've got a boy and a girl. My daughter is considering, you know, being a vet. They're in an agricultural high school right now. But they both are also talking about potentially joining the military to help fund their college. Oh, that's smart. So there's so much up in the air. Okay. Love that. The GI Bill would be an answer to prayer for you, wouldn't it? Mm-hmm.

Absolutely. And we've learned that, I guess, the Army ROTC paid for vet school as well. Yeah. How much do you guys make a year, Jessica, you and your husband? Combined, we make $240,000. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So a follow-up. Let's go right where you left us off in the actual question. 10, 11, 12, those high school years, how much do you anticipate you could sock away in each child's 529? What do you think that would be?

So I'm projecting that once we get into August and we're at that step five, we'll have approximately $5,000 to $6,000 each month of extra, you know, what was previously our snowball. So split it up, let's say $2,500 each maybe a month? Yeah.

Potentially, but then there's also things, you know, I'm the nerd in the relationship, so I'm thinking, all right, we're both going to need new cars in about two years. Yeah, you can't take all of that surplus and split it to the 529. Right, yeah. So what do you think is more realistic? Yeah.

I was, I don't know if, you know, a thousand each makes sense. So it's like half of it is going to 529 and half of it going towards others. Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Yeah. And I think too, Jessica, number one, communicating with the kids. You guys all need to be on the same page of what's happening here.

No debt. Debt is just off the table. So what other options do we have besides that? Is it community college? Is it not? And you guys are in the Northeast and they love their education up there. So that may be a humble pill to swallow too, that they may not go to the college they want. I'm going to say this though. If my kids were thinking about the military, what a great growing up experience, not to mention the financial benefits.

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This is the Ramsey Show, where America hangs out to talk about your money, your profession, and your relationships. Alongside Rachel Cruz, I'm Ken Coleman. Excited that you're with us. The phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225. Billings, Montana is where we're going to go. Christy is there. Christy, how can we help? So I have been in a relationship for about 10 years, and I am very much in love with

um, secure in my assets and my boyfriend is not. And I wanted to know if there's anything that I could do to avoid or to protect my assets from what could possibly be common law marriage.

Well, okay. So when you say could be possibly, Rachel and I are not common law marriage experts. We certainly don't know the law in Montana. So what do you know? Because it sounds like you're uncertain. Well, I don't know. I think there's a seven... He's not living with me right now. We're talking about it, but I think there's a seven-year living together. And you guys have been sharing a residence...

For seven plus years? No, no, no. We have not as of yet, and I don't want to get there. I don't want to be put in the position that it becomes a common law marriage. What's up with the relationship? Yeah, that's what I want to know. What are you guys doing? Why aren't you married? Do you love him? We've both been married. We're older. But what does that have to do with anything?

Why aren't we married? Because we live in different cities, and we didn't see a reason to. Like, we've had kids. We've done the whole thing. You still live in separate cities? Yep.

How far away? It's great. You should try it. Okay. Wow. That's a little awkward. I think I'm good. I'm very happily married. I think I'm good. I'm rolling into 27 years, and I actually, this is going to freak you out, Christy. I sleep in the same bed as Stacey. It's wonderful. You should try that. That is totally fine.

Now, I will tell you, mouth tape has really helped. It's helped. I use the mouth tape now, Rachel. I haven't told you this. You're like an old man. That's an old man move. It's a great marriage move. It's a great move. Stacey's happy about it. Okay, so how far apart do you all live? A couple hours. Okay, so how often do you get together? Why are you worried about the common law marriage if you guys aren't living together? Yeah. Because we're now looking to, so now my daughter's in college, so we're now looking to what does the future look like? How old are you guys?

I'm 56. Okay, you're not too old. Okay, so according to what I'm seeing here, a common-law marriage in Montana is recognized if the parties are competent to marry. I don't know if you're competent to marry. After that little comment you made. Mutually agree to a... Hold on, hold on. I don't know, Christy. You're a little saucy today, and I can be saucy back. You have to mutually agree to the marital relationship and then cohabit.

Well, you guys aren't cohabiting. For how long? Does it give a time frame? What? Does it give a time frame at all? No, no, it just says cohabit. We know what cohabiting is. Well, I know, but usually there's a time frame with common law marriage if you have been together for, you know, 12 years or whatever it is per se. But again, have you guys ever lived in the same house? Well, for what period of time? Just answer the question. Yes, we have. How long? How long?

A couple weeks. That's not a common law marriage. I might as well have a judge's report. She's going to, though. She's going to. You won't like it. You're going to have to do it for a long period of time on that deal. I'm not sure we can answer your question because I don't think you guys actually... The definition of it's not going to happen unless you guys are living together for a long period of time. And I, in this case, would say common law marriage, I don't think...

Under our Ramsey way of thinking, I don't think I'd combine finances. I don't think I'd think you're keep your assets separately. Your question was how do I protect my assets? I don't think you guys are combining them because I don't think this is a real marriage. I think you guys get together for conjugal visits, if I can be very blunt. That's what I think this is. It's more than that. You don't care as long as we've been doing for conjugal visits. I'm just saying you live two hours apart. For 10 years. How often do you guys see each other in a year?

We see each other every weekend. My point exactly. Okay. I'm just saying. This isn't a marriage. I'm not judging her. I'm so sorry you called today. I'm not judging you. I swear I'm not judging you. Okay, Christy, our advice would be you are 56. Keep the assets separate. You still have a good 30, 35 years together. You could have a longer marriage than what Ken has today from when he married St. Exactly. I don't buy it. That's not a marriage. No, what's not a marriage?

But they could have if they got married. They're not going to. That's what I'm telling her. She called our show. She doesn't want to get married. And my advice is that I would get married. Oh, okay. I see what you're saying. And you have...

Another 30, 35 great years. Maybe my papaw is 96. So that's what? 45. I mean, I love your sweet papaw. You've got a long way to go, Christy. And so all of this would be summed up if you're like, yeah, we want to be in a committed. If not, then don't have a permanent residence together. And the common law marriage isn't even an issue. And keep assets separate. And keep assets separate. That was my whole point. But I think some people won't go to court if they break up, though. I think that it can feel like a marriage where it's 50-50 regardless of, I don't know. Anyways.

Christy, now after all of that, and I tried to answer your question honestly, I'm having fun with you, but I'm dead serious. Everything I said, I completely stand behind. No judgment, by the way. Zero judgment. You do what you want to with your life. I'm a libertarian on that deal. What I am saying is that I would keep the assets separately because I don't think you guys actually want to even do the common law marriage. Am I missing that or is that what you're saying you're thinking about doing?

Well, if we're thinking about marriage possibly, we're thinking about moving in together, we're thinking about a lot of different options. Well, if you move in together, I agree with Rachel, you should get married. The statistics are absolutely undeniable that it is better for you. And Rachel's right, you're going to have a greater quality of life. Now, if you don't love him and he's not marriage material, then I wouldn't be living with him anyways. Right.

Do what? Yeah. I wouldn't be having this conversation if that wasn't the case. Yeah, that's right. Exactly. Exactly. I don't know. I don't know. If you love this guy so much. Why are you so hesitant in this? Because I, here's why. I'll tell you why I'm hesitant. And I'm on your team. He didn't call. So underneath this snappy sweater here, I've got a Team Christy shirt on. Okay? So I'm cheering for you. I mean this. Okay? Here's what I'm telling you. And you're better off financially, Christy. Yeah. So what I'm hearing is,

If you were my sister, Christy, I'd be like, sis, what are you doing? You don't love this guy that much. If you did, you couldn't stand to be away from him. My wife left town last week with my daughter for a trip with her sister, and they were gone for four nights. I really, truly missed my wife.

I could not do what you're doing. So maybe, and I'm honest about this, maybe it's just me, but I don't see enough evidence that you really want to commit to this guy and truly marry this guy based on one of the first comments you said. You're like, well, I said why? And you went, well, we're just older now. And I think you've rationalized it. And I also don't think that you can, I think you can live without this guy. And this is not my opinion. You see this guy once a week and you live a couple hours away.

That ain't leave and cleave, in my opinion. Now, I'm old school, and I don't mind when you push back on me. But, Christy, that's why I'm a little bit cynical. I think if you would have said, you know what, we've done it this way for a long time, but now I just can't live without him, and I want us to have our life completely intertwined, for better or for worse, rich or poor, bad Tuesday night, great Thursday morning, whatever. I don't hear that from you.

So therefore, I don't want you to do it. Is there any fact, Christy, that there's a level of you that you've handled money well, you're successful and he hasn't? That's a little bit of a deterrent?

That's a huge turn. Ah. Oh, you buried the lead. There we go. That would have been nice to know five minutes ago. I definitely stand by what I think. Do not move in with this dude. Yeah, don't move in. Do not marry this dude until you guys are on the same page. Yeah, don't marry him unless you're on the same page. And don't combine your finances. Keep them separate. What are we doing on the weekends, Christy? What are you doing? This guy's not like values.

I stand by what I said. I wasn't trying to be salty. I like Christy. But there's a guy in the lobby that agrees with me. This is adult conjugal visits. We're playing house. I got head shaking all throughout the lobby. I stand by what I say, Rachel. Stand firm, Ken. Stand firm. It's tough being a Puritan.

Statistics show that half of Americans don't have enough life insurance or they don't have any at all. I don't understand this, John. Why don't people want to take care of their family? They think they're not going to die or something? Well, I used to be one of those guys. I didn't even think about it. And one of my buddies said, hey, the only reason to not have life insurance is if you hate your wife and kids. And

And I immediately went and got term life insurance. That's a gut punch. For decades, Dave, I've sat across people who've lost a spouse. They've lost somebody important to them. Me too. And they don't know what to do next. Terrifying. You're going to have a crisis here. You know, you got two options while you're sitting and talking to a young widow. She's concerned about how she's going to invest all this money properly and not mess this up. Or she's concerned how she's going to eat tomorrow. That's exactly right. These are the two options. Yeah.

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That's the hack. And if you ask me, I think you're way above average and you'll save even more. So what are you doing still listening to me? Go download the EveryDollar app for free and start saving more money right now. Let's go to Sue in Sacramento. Sue, how can we help today?

Hi, thanks for taking my call. Yes, we have baby number seven on the way and we are considering a move to Texas. My husband and I have been talking about it and I wanted to bring it by to you guys and see what you thought. We're coming into some money. We don't have a lot of savings, but we're trying to decide if we want to pay off debt first.

and sticking out here or move to Texas for lower cost of living. And so my kids can go to school. Wow. Sounds like there's two really good positives. Is this also a good professional move for both of you?

It could be. There's definitely jobs in the same price range as what we're earning now. So it's going to be about the same earning. But just different taxes. But if we combine that with the other two issues, it sounds like this is a real big win. So when somebody calls in this situation and it sounds like there's a lot of positives here, what are you considering? What are you worried about that you want to get our take on? What do we not know that's giving you pause?

Right. Well, the main thing is just that, you know, we've outgrown our house here. We've outgrown our car here. We're always in the, you know, falling into the negative and we do still have debt to pay off. So it's like when we do come into this money, you know, are we going to be spending at

on making a move because obviously it's going to cost a lot to move seven kids out to Texas. Oh, okay. Or are we going to try to get our situation looking a little better? Okay, so let's go into that. So let's paint the picture here for Rachel. All right, so tell us how much money you're going to get or that you believe you're going to get, and then let's walk through your debt. So how much money are you getting first? About $10,000 is what we get in our tax return, something like that. Okay, and then tell us your debt situation.

So we owe $13,000 on the car, and then we have $23,000 that we're not currently paying in charge of in collection. From credit cards? Basically, yeah, some medical stuff and, yeah, credit cards. Okay. Now, what do you think the move is going to cost? Okay.

Oh, I mean, I was thinking it might take somewhere around $8,000. I don't think that's unreasonable. What I would tell you to do is get about three or four quotes, and let's come down to a pretty concrete number. And so let's just play off the $8,000, Rachel. Let's say the move costs about $8,000.

But it does lower your cost of living. I'm curious, do you know or can you ballpark what your new budget would be with the lower cost of living so that we know how much more we're going to keep if we're going to have the same jobs? And you said similar jobs, so I'm assuming similar pay. So what's the analysis there? How much more money would you have at the end of a month, if you will, that we could put towards the debt if we move?

I haven't calculated it exactly, but I know the cost of living is going to be a lot less in terms of everything across the board. Right now we're about $650 over budget every month, and that's because of how much we pay in California. And I know Texas would probably give us a lot more wiggle room. For sure. I would do it based on this because I think what's not mentioned in this is I think you guys are going to have a better quality of life. Is that what you think?

Absolutely. Yeah, right now my kids have no religious freedom to go to school, so I'm not able to work. I work per diem because I'm home with them. Could you work in Texas full-time? I do think I could work, yes, yeah. What kind of income are we talking about there? Well, I'm a nurse, so I make a good income.

But I make around $40 an hour. That's great. There's some Texas jobs that pay more, you know, out there. Rachel, I think it's a no-brainer because it's not that much debt and they can tackle it. And Sue, I'll just encourage you. I feel like we've heard more and more over the last probably three years or so of people making this move. People, and I hate to pick on California, but it's just true. They're leaving California and they're going to Florida. This is an extreme example, but you and I have a friend. I will not mention his name because he's a public figure. We have a good friend, mutual friend. Yes, yes.

who essentially bought a house in Nashville on the savings from his taxes in California. Yes, exactly. Now he's very successful, but that's real. But genuinely, yes. That's crazy. So for that reason, I think,

This is not, that's the only debt you have. And there's a, you know, and for the kids' school, I mean, you think about that, right? You add on all these layers. The kids get to go to school. She can work. Yeah, of what life can look like. And then you may guys get in a situation soon and you don't have to work in three years, you know, because you guys are ahead and you've paid off debt and everything. Sue, what do you think now? And you think about the housing even. I mean, again, housing is expensive everywhere, but compared to California. I feel like this is a no-brainer. Sue, do you feel better, worse, the same?

I feel better. Yeah, I'm excited. What does your husband want to do? Well, it's hard to talk to money, money talk with him. He always thinks I'm coming down on him about his income, you know, and it's not that, you know, I respect him and I appreciate his hard work. I try to calm a lot. I appreciate him working hard, but I just, you know, does he want to do the move? Has the move, has he, have you guys talked about this together as a couple?

We have. And he's pondering and he's looking and he's, you know, he has his eyes peeled and he's actually open to it a little bit more these days since things have gotten pretty bad. So I think he's open to it, but it is hard to talk to money about money. I mean, we end up just walking away from the conversation. And it's him you're saying when you approach it, he gets defensive, right?

Right. Yeah. Like he just doesn't want to be told what to do or, you know, talk about our earnings or. Okay. I got a thought. Why? What is it? I'm curious.

It's just kind of always been that way. I've always been kind of the breadwinner in a way, so I've always made more. And now that I'm a stay-at-home mom and he's doing it, you know, we've cut down so many things that I become honestly a little bitter. And I probably have been not the nicest about it. I mean, I don't yell at him or anything, but, you know, it's probably not nice to hear that, you know, he's really not making enough to...

to provide out here in California. That's exactly right now. You just self-diagnosed the man, a man put so much self-worth in his ability to provide. And with the dynamics you just shared with us, I think there's some potential healing there. And I think you got to defrost the situation a little bit. I'm not saying it's all on you, but you acknowledge some things. And I think the dynamics have changed dramatically.

And where you were the breadwinner, now you come home, he's not making enough. This is a tough situation. I wonder if we don't pivot this move to a non-money conversation and the move is about life. And I'm curious with that being said, does he agree with you that a move to Texas would be better for the kids' school, schooling situation?

He didn't for the longest, and even a few weeks ago, he didn't agree that Texas has a lower cost of living. I mean, he's completely in denial. It's like a family thing, like wanting to stay by family, as you understand. So there's family in Sacramento. Yes, yeah. His family, your family?

They're all the way in Monterey. They're far away. But, yeah, they're in California. So it's kind of a whole California. We're born and raised here. Got it. So it's a mentality. A lot of people deal with this. It's hard to leave here. Sure, sure. But let me get back to where we were. He's opening his eyes. Does he now agree with you that cost of living is significantly less in Texas? He's on board with that. He does. He now agrees, yeah. What about the schooling? Yeah.

The schooling is, you know, it's a hit or miss with him because he does like that we homeschool. He doesn't love the school year, but I think in Texas he would be okay with them going to school because it's a lot safer. Yeah. So Sue, I think you all need to take a weekend trip. Yeah. Well, visit and let him see it. You guys need to pick an area. I'm going to suggest that. Yeah. And I think Sue, you guys need to press into this. I'm just hearing enough. I understand what Kent said.

that so much is tied. I mean, so much of America, let's be honest, of our self-worth is tied to our money, what we make, how much is in our account, what kind of car we drive. I mean, so much is attached to that. And so I understand why he can get defensive, but I also, if I'm being the female in the chair,

I'm like, I'm sorry your ego hurts a little bit, but the math shows we are $650 behind. I agree. He needs to get over it. Yeah, we have to do... Something has to change. So that change either, Sue, is you earning extra money, him earning extra money, you guys moving to a cheaper area. I mean, something has to change. But your dynamic within marriage, I don't like the tiptoeing or we can't talk about this because there's usually no resolution. We end up walking away. Like...

Like that kind of stuff will follow you guys to Texas as well. And it'll come up. Its head will pop up in a different issue as well. So I want you guys to be so unified on this decision and it doesn't need to come out of strife or fine. Sue just wants to do it. So we're going to like, it needs to be, we have run the numbers and we are in full agreement for our life and our money that this is what we're doing.

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Hey, have you heard about the Money and Relationships Tour? Dave Ramsey and Dr. John Delaney are hitting the road, and this is going to be a fun, fun night. They're going to be talking about everything from raising kids to handling money fights to making friends and so much more. Here are the cities. Louisville on April 21, Durham on April 23, Atlanta April 25, Phoenix May 5, Fort Worth May 7, and Kansas City May 9th if you want to get your seats.

To see Dave and John live, go to ramsaysolutions.com slash tour. That's ramsaysolutions.com slash tour and is with everything on the show. If we mention anything and you didn't catch the link, you can get the link in the show notes if you're watching on YouTube and podcast. Did you know that James Childs, our fearless producer, he tells me all the time, the show notes are just chock full of goodness. So much stuff in there. So anything we discuss...

James wants you to know if you miss it because I garble it or I say it too fast. The show notes. It's all there. You can find it there. Boy, it's the show of Rachel's today. I know. Is it our third Rachel? Oh, it's very exciting. Rachel, number three in Lexington. How can we help?

Hi. So my husband and I bought an investment property next door about two years ago, and we would like to know if we should, A, move into it and renovate it ourselves, or just sell the property and, you know, take the money. Give us the reasons why we would do either of those. So go with option A. Why do you think you should do that?

So we currently have our home paid off that we live in. The property that is the investment property is actually next door to us. So combined, it's six acres. Hillside is really pretty. It shares an easement. And it's the only two houses on the hillside. It's just, it's a really pretty location. And so we are very attached to it. But the home we live in currently, we have it paid off. And so that's a bonus. So we could either

That's kind of where we're stuck. So what I'm trying to understand is why would you want to move to this other house next door?

Okay. So I have four children. There are six of us in the house and it is a, we currently live in a two bedroom single life. So it's getting really tight and we are needing a solution. And so that's why we're calling. Um, we do the only debt that we have is the investment property and we got it at a really good deal. We got it at 75,000 and we paid it down to around 60,000. And so that is the, the question of, of,

of the day, do we sell it because it's worth more? Do we take that money and we just, you know, what do we do? Okay. I would sell the current house that you're in. Okay. And what would you make on that? Any idea?

We have had people come look at it and realtors and people who know what they're doing. So a really cool fact is we purchased it nine years ago for $32,000 and it was livable. It was actually really nice. And we bought our little single wide trailer on two acres for $32,000. And now we can sell it for at least $120,000.

Oh my gosh. I would sell that and then go ahead and pay off the other house and that becomes your primary residence because it's got the space you need and you love the little hill. 100% and take the extra money, the 60 grand because you owe 60, you're going to make 120, pay it off, means you got 60 left and use that for renovations, cash flow the renovations. Do you guys know what you're doing when it comes to renovations or have you ever done that?

We have not. We don't know what we're doing. So I probably, I would not recommend doing it yourself. I would get a contractor in there and having someone and they can do what they need to do. And you may have to live in a construction zone for a little bit, but I would do that just in order to cash flow it, you know? Okay. How much work does it need? Is it terrible? It's,

It is not in good shape. I will tell you that. It is an old house. It's a really cute old farmhouse. However, to give you insight, it doesn't have any doors inside. It doesn't have closets. It's a really old house. We have gotten it looked at by contractors and they say that the bones are good, that we would be losing money if we completely demolish it.

But we're kind of just stuck because we- Have they given you a number of what it would take? I mean, I'm sure you guys haven't picked. I mean, that would be a ballpark, but I'm curious. They said it would take at least $50,000, and we have $40,000 in our savings. So we just are really stuck. We just don't know. No, you're not stuck. You've got a great option, Rachel. With that cash set aside, plus the profit that Rachel's talking about, after you pay off this little house-

You stay on the hill that you love. You got the room for the kids. You make it your own. You don't have to get it all done right away, but you got the cash. It sounds like to do it all. You know what you could do, Rachel? Sell the trailer, pocket the money, and you guys go rent somewhere for six months. It's not going to be a fun six months, but to get the house all fixed up and stuff. I like that better. Rent somewhere for six months and then you guys move in and you're cash flowing all of this as you're doing it. And you're not in a construction zone. Yeah. Yeah.

Mm hmm. OK, it's going to be a headache. So hear me say that. That's a headache. You're moving twice. But but in my I mean, all day. Right. To be able to do our next door neighbors, the investment property and the home we live in are technically next door neighbors. So we really do you think we could just live in the home we have or move into the investment property and fix it up?

You think we should completely get off of the property, correct? Well, in order to get the cash is what I'm saying. But you guys have $40,000. How much do you guys make a year? So this year on taxes, we're going to be bringing home about $110,000. Okay. But you have $40,000 saved.

So you could cash flow it without selling the current house you live in. Well, cash flow the rent. Yeah, but you still got the mortgage on it and stuff. I don't know. You guys run some numbers and just say, okay, what would our, how would we feel? What would our emotional state be? What gives us the most peace? Is it to sell the current home?

pocket the 120, sell off the house. You got 60 left. You guys put 60, 70,000 of cash into it and go rent somewhere. Or is it less stressful for you guys to say, okay, we're going to pump the brakes a little bit. We're not in a rush. We're going to take some of this 40. We're going to start chunking, paying it off.

I don't like that because then you're going to have to save up all this. But it's your option. We're giving you multiple options. Yes, thank you. It's all sounding really good. I think Rachel's option is cleaner. I do too. You get rid of the current house. You get all the cash. You go rent. You get the whole thing renovated. That's a little easier. It is a pain to move twice. But she'll be fine. But again, I think what I'm hearing you say is you guys could cash flow the renovations while staying in the existing house.

Correct. And then paying the mortgage off later. Yeah. Or at least get it to a point that you can move into it and then whatever's left is not a complete construction zone. I think they got options. Yeah, that's true.

I guess one more question. I'm so sorry. One more question I have for you is I've heard people say that it's smart to have rental properties. In this situation, would you suggest having both houses and living in one and renting the other? Would that be a good option? I don't think that's enough money. Yeah, not in your financial situation, I wouldn't. And having renters next door to you, not a fun option.

And it's just not a lot of money. You guys, I don't even know where you live, by the way. When you're buying a house for $32,000, that's mind-blowing to me, or the other one for $60,000. So I just don't think it's going to spit off enough rental income that it's worth the hassle. To make a difference, yeah.

Okay. So we're going to say no to renting. Those numbers are not common where we're at. Oh, I know. So it was a blessing. Trust me, I knew that much. I'm no real estate baron, but I was like, wow. But I think y'all go to the house on the hill, Rachel, and whether you guys cash flow renovations, then move in, then sell or sell, and then sell.

and then move in. I think either way, you're great, but cash flow the whole thing, and yeah, go live on six acres. Because how many kids do you have? We have four little children. What a dream. You know what I'm picturing? In Kentucky. I'm picturing wildflowers. Do you have wildflowers on that property? We absolutely do. And that's another thing, we're so attached to the property. How do I know these things? I'll do you. It's the spirit.

I got to say, I'm also picturing a little, I think you should get the troop together. How old are the kids? Their ages? So we have a three, four, five, and nine. This is perfect. Good. Have you ever seen? Three, four, five. Yeah. God bless you. She's a busy lady. God bless you. Have you ever seen The Sound of Music? No.

I had, yeah. I put the little kids together and it gets to that point, the hills are alive with the sound of music. Von Trapp children. The Von Trapps, the wildflowers. Get some of the old curtains. I got such a great vibe about this place on the hill. I'm going to go with my partner's recommendation. Sell the current place, go all in, go rent, go all in and fix the other little place up and then we watch the sound of music and we run through the wildflowers. I think it's going to be great. I like everything about it. I hope you're not allergic to pollen. So magical. So magical.

I talk to people every day who want to know how to do better in two areas, money and relationships. That's why I'm pumped to bring the Money and Relationships Tour to a city near you. Join me and Dr. John Deloney for a night that will challenge the way you think about this stuff and possibly change how you live forever.

Starting April 21st, we'll be in Louisville, then on to Durham, Atlanta, Phoenix, Fort Worth, and Kansas City. Grab your tickets at ramseysolutions.com slash tour before they're gone.

So, how are you folks doing with the Baby Steps? Some of you are brand new to it. Some of you are test driving it. Some of you are in the middle of it. You know, we've got a fun little quiz online that will allow you to check your progress in just a few minutes and get a personalized plan. And this is really valuable because you kind of see, okay, this is where I am. And now I've got some help, some action steps to keep going. Because remember this about the Baby Steps. It is about momentum, pure and simple.

and there are times where you need that little boost. So if that's you, you can head to the show notes, click on the link titled Are You On Track With The Baby Steps, and complete the quiz. It's really encouraging, and it will actually equip you as well. All right, we're going to go to Portland, Oregon now, and Karen is there. Karen, how can we help? Hi, I'm 68 years old, and I probably, put it all together, have about $75,000 that I

I don't know if I could or should invest. About four years ago, a financial advisor told me, and my situation had totally changed at that point, and he just told me I was too old to get 401Ks or buy any property or anything like that and to just live as frugally as I could and try to get as much income as I could within that point. So now, fast forward four years, and I...

I still have, I may at some point need to live off that money if my income changes, my income stream. So I don't know if I, and I've been doing like little CDs with my bank, you know, three months and six months and that kind of thing and making a little bit of money there. But I'm really a novice on how to invest anything or if I should or if I could. Yeah. How much are you making a year, Karen?

Um, I, let's see, I wrote this down, uh, about $53,000 a year. 53,000. Okay. And how much per month are your expenses? Uh, I'm living under them all the time. So, cause I've been tracking for years now. I track compulsively. So, um, I'll sometimes live, you know, a thousand dollars a

um, a month underneath what I, my income is. So I don't have the exact number, but it's not, um, but you're not, you're not in the red necessarily. Not at all. Not at all. Okay. Yeah. So you're coming up even a thousand. Okay. And you're how old again? I'm sorry. I know you said that at the beginning of the call, 70, 68, 68. Okay. I'm so sorry. Um, in a critical health situation too. You are what's going on there. Um, I have to have a, um,

very serious surgery that is considered critical but stable. Gosh, Karen, I'm sorry. So I can't work. Okay. When is that surgery happening? They don't know for sure yet. It depends on, it's very metabolically stable.

And so metabolically, I have to be strong enough to be able to withstand it. Okay. And that's basically what I feel like is my job right now is to stay healthy, eat healthy, get healthy. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah, for sure. Did I understand you're unable to work right now because of this preparation or you would be unable to work after the surgery? I think both. Oh, okay. So how are you? I haven't been prepared.

How are you living right now? Right now, I have, since four years ago, have alimony. And see, that's unstable. I consider that unstable. Well, has he been consistent on his alimony payments? Relatively. And is that the $53,000 a year? What was that number you gave me? Yeah, $53,000. It's coming all from alimony. Yeah. Okay. How long will that go? That's not perpetuity, is it?

I don't know. What do you mean you don't know? It doesn't say specifically. Our divorcer doesn't say specifically when it ends. Well, as long as he's working, I guess is what it says. As long as he's working and making an income, he'll be paying you alimony. How old is he? He's a little bit younger than me. Will he be? Do you talk to him ever? Do you know what his plans are?

Well, that's one of the reasons for divorce. Yeah. Yeah. I'm with you on it's being unstable because you don't, you never know. He'd sign up to work next year, you know, and this is done. So you have $75,000 in savings. Do you have any other savings?

Yes. And that I just, I didn't include that in the amount that I, because I didn't know how much you wanted, but just that's for. That was in like the CVs. In my checking account. Yeah. We need to know your total financial. Yeah. What's your, what's like in retire, do you have any other money saved in retirement or investments or anything?

No. No. So the $75,000 is pretty much it. That's everything. In checking, in CDs, all of it. Okay. Right. Well, I think...

from a mathematical standpoint, I know that you are living below your means, but I want to know what your means are. So I would give you homework to say, okay, you know, figuring out, do you rent, own a home? What's your housing situation? Yes, I rent and that's my biggest expense. I rent in the least expensive place in the, where I live. Yeah. But of course, rents are all high. So, there's nowhere I could go that's cheaper. Yeah, I hear you. And I, you know, I,

I put my grandkids through your book, too. I'm doing all the right things. I just feel like there's this money there. Should I be doing something with it? My answer is yes, you should be. And what I would do, Karen, I would recommend you sitting down with a SmartVestor Pro. And if you go on RamseySolutions.com and look up SmartVestor Pros, there should be a couple in your area there in Portland. And if you go to RamseySolutions.com,

and talk to a couple of them and sit down with one that you, interview two or three of them, find one that you like, and sit down and lay out the whole situation because some of the 75,000, yes, should be invested. Now, should it be invested within...

A retirement account, like a Roth IRA, not necessarily. I mean, a lot of that stuff is to grow tax-free till you're 59 and a half and if you start pulling from it, but you can invest into those past 59 and a half, right? So I would sit down with them and honestly let them run some of these numbers because I wanna make sure that you have enough

to live off of. And on top of that, knowing, and again, the health thing puts a whole other spin factor to your situation, which is just terrible. But to know for yourself of like, okay, this money eventually, if I just, if alimony stops, and if this is the only money I have, eventually it will run out. So what do I need to do to kind of safeguard that?

How much do I need to be living on a month with the amount of interest that we can be getting? Because that's the crazy thing about the market. In 2023 and four, it was like up at like the S&P was around 20%. Like we had crazy returns this year, not looking so great, right? So there is a level of this roller coaster ride that we talk to people, Karen, to ride out. Now, again, at your age at 68, you are on the...

latter end, if I'm kind of the ride. No, that's right. So the aggressiveness of it may look different because of your age and situation. And that's why I would want you to sit down with an actual investment professional for them to look at some of this because they probably will have a good game plan for you on how to get the most out of this money.

without losing a bunch of it if you need it, right? Because the market game, if you're living off of that, you wanna make sure that there's a level of it that principle-wise is still there making you the money you need

but yet you're still able to pull money and live off of it, even if you have to pay taxes, if it's a standard investment. So there's kind of a lot there, Karen, but I would, I hate to hand you off to someone else, but I don't think I can answer this in a five minute call. This is tough. The only thing I would add is if I were you, I would be trying to find another golden girl or two in your life.

in your area and let's see if we can roommate. I'm not kidding you. I really think you got to slash your expenses as much as you can because you're in such a

This whole health thing is just limiting you and your ability to work. And hoping the alimony payments keep coming in. But in the meantime, I'm going to be pinching like I have nothing coming in. And I would really truly consider a roommate situation. Getting yourself in that. Let's see if we can cut your rent in half. My goodness. Don't tell me there aren't other ladies out there like you that wouldn't mind having a roommate. Somebody around the house. I would at least look into that. I've joked for years about starting the Golden Girl Arms program.

See, I had no idea. I think it's meant to be. I do think there's some golden girls out there that would love to have a Karen in the house, and I would consider that. The good Karen, by the way. That's right. Be careful how you use that these days. She's a great Karen. She's a great Karen.

You're still here? What are you doing? You do know that the rest of today's show is playing right now over on the Ramsey Network app, right? All you got to do to finish the episode is search Ramsey Network in the App Store, Google Play Store, or just click the link in the show notes to download the app for free. Yep, you heard me right, for free. Then right there on the home screen, you can watch the rest of today's show. Bada bing, bada boom. All right, I'm getting out of here. Enjoy. We'll see you on the app.