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cover of episode Postgame: Olympic Boxing

Postgame: Olympic Boxing

2024/8/1
logo of podcast The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz

The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz

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Mike Ryan: 本期节目讨论了在世界拳击锦标赛中被禁赛,但在奥运会上获得参赛资格的两位拳击手。许多人对这两位拳击手的禁赛和复赛发表评论,但他们并未了解事情的全部经过,仅仅根据社交媒体上的信息就形成了自己的观点。这两位拳击手的睾酮水平升高,曾因性别测试失败而被禁赛,但由于奥运会接管了管理机构,她们被允许参加奥运会比赛。这与她们的生物性别无关。这是一个复杂的问题,与其说是生物学问题,不如说是测试问题。许多人只看了推文就形成了自己的观点,这变成了一个伪政治观点。其中一位拳击手在比赛中获胜,这使得事件被广泛关注。人们对女性运动员的体型和肌肉力量的关注与对男性运动员的关注不同。部分责任在于奥运会没有沿用之前的协议,以及没有为这两位拳击手辩护。这两位拳击手利用了规则漏洞。我们需要更了解情况,不能仅仅根据推文就断定事实。另一位拳击手林雨婷将于次日比赛。这些拳击手出生为女性,她们的性别测试失败,这才是事件被关注的原因。除了睾酮水平升高外,没有证据表明这些运动员是跨性别运动员。她们此前曾参加过比赛,没有引起争议。这是一个体育问题,而不是政治问题。目前没有证据证明这些运动员是跨性别运动员。性别测试并不能代表一个人的性别。

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There's a lot of people whose opinion I shouldn't really care all that much for is like, where's Dan on this when they're not themselves educated on what had actually happened? And also, they are probably just learning if they're actually listening to this or just living in my mentions. And I'm pretty sure it's the latter, not actually listening to what it is that we do. So me actually saying that these two fighters in particular also competed in the 2021 games, no one cared about

and they didn't win anything. So there's a different, we talked about this, seeing this aggregation the way that it was coming down the pike. We saw it a few days ago and we mentioned it casually. Basically, two fighters have elevated levels of testosterone and have failed gender tests. There's a different governing body.

Now, that is not to say these boxers were born genetically male. That is, in fact, not the case here. They have elevated levels of testosterone that have been deemed appropriate for this edition of the Summer Games because the Olympics has taken over as a governing body. Now, I've applied a lot of context, and I've tried to read a bunch of this because...

as, as you are, I'm seeing it on social media and trying to figure out, can this be so? Because for combat sports, I think that there is a biological threshold in terms of safety that you need to look out for. So I was trying to see all this because people were speaking with authority on the matter. And, and,

I'm really just kind of puzzled at how fast misinformation spreads, how there are allegedly safeguards on social media platforms against misinformation, something that the CEO of one specific social media site seems to really care about, invented community notes, and it hasn't stopped him from perpetuating a lot of misinformation himself.

So what I would say is this is a very complicated story. These fighters have been around for a little bit. This has more to do with testing than it does biology. And you probably don't care because you've just read the tweet and you've gone on about your day and formed your opinion, which has now become a pseudo-political opinion when this is so much more complicated than that. Pies.

Hold on. One of those fighters actually fought today. Imani Khalif, welterweight, beat Angela Carini in 46 seconds in the first round. Yeah, well, that's why it's getting aggregated. There was one of these fighters was in a fight in which the other fighter just quit. And you're seeing a lot of that being aggregated. Now, that fighter that you mentioned also lost in 2021. Yeah. And we're in a unique...

I'm going to tie this Victor Wimpanyama take from last year. There are athletes that are bigger, stronger, have more muscle mass. And in men's sports, it's celebrated. And in women's sports, now it's becoming, well, it's obvious because they have a penis. And that is something that we need to take a hard look at. These are very complicated situations.

You have to dig into people's past, how they've tested before. There's always going to be, especially in Olympic sports, blood dopers that try to gain an advantage. And I would put some of the blame on the Olympics for not mirroring previous protocols. I would also blame the Olympics for not defending these two boxers in particular, who we should...

they tested for higher levels of testosterone. So it's not like they're innocent victims in all of this because they took advantage of what is maybe perceived to be a loophole, certainly from other fighters, maybe by fighters that are leaving the boxing ring. But this is complicated. It's been really complicated to talk about here. It's less complicated for an account with a blue verified checkmark to just put some shit out there and have the author of the Harry Potter novels decide to weigh in on it. So I would say...

This era more than any other era. And I did not want to read everything that I had to read on this to get educated, but it requires people to read more. And I think, unfortunately, a lot of people that are coming up with a narrative and we saw this with the Olympic opening ceremonies where people just got religions wrong.

or like couldn't separate the Last Supper from Greek mythology and made something that was overtly French, something that had anything to do with American politics. We need to be more well-read. We need to be smarter about this. We can't just see a tweet and run with it as fact, no matter what allegedly they have in place with community notes, because we are in a whole new frontier of misinformation. And so far we are failing the test.

By the way, the other transgender fighter, Lin Yu Ting, who's a featherweight, will be fighting tomorrow. You just called her transgender. Those are allegations. By all accounts that we've seen, these fighters were born female, are female. They failed gender tests, which is how it's getting aggregated over there. They are females.

By all inclination, by everybody doing reporting on this, and they have competed previously and lost. It is always sexy for people, for bad faith aggregators, to seize on the success of these athletes that have been questioned. Okay, let me rephrase that. The other fighter in question, Lin Yu Ting, will fight tomorrow against Satoru Iida.

to the Bokova from Uzbekistan that we find tomorrow. She's also an Olympian. Yeah, we have no proof outside of elevated testosterone levels. We have zero proof that these are trans athletes. Both fighters have long claimed they were born women, are women, and have

previously competed in this very same event with zero attention, zero fanfare, zero controversy, zero elevated levels of testosterone apparently because it was a different governing body. So all this stuff is important and there's a lot of bad facts

faith aggregators out there that are proudly spreading misinformation because we are now in the world of identity politics where things like this that aren't political enter the political sphere and you have to be armed to defend it. This is not a political discussion whatsoever. It's more a sports discussion. And I think

You listening to this, if you disagree with my tone or my tenor or anything that I'm saying right now, I think if you and I privately had a conversation, we'd find more common ground than you're aware of when it comes to combat sports on this very issue. But you are not armed with all the information here. I'm barely armed with the information. I'm not comfortable with the amount of information that I have right now on this show. And I've done two days of reading on it.

There is a lot of unknown, but one thing that isn't known is whether or not these people are indeed trans athletes, because that has not been proven. That has not been proven whatsoever. A gender test is not someone's gender. We should really, really seize on the important aspects of this story instead of, you know, 140 characters. Pies?

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