Serial S02 - Ep. 2: The Golden Chicken
59:42 Share

This podcast is supported by the capital one quick server card earn unlimited one point five percent cash back on every purchase everywhere, plus there is no limit the amount of cash back you can earn and rewards don't expire for the life of the account. It's that simple. The capital one quick over card, what's in your wallet terms apply, see capital one not come for details.

These first two episodes of serial season too are free, but to hear the whole series, you'll need to subscribe to the new york times, where you'll get access to all the serial productions and new york times shows. And it's super easy. You can sign up through apple podcast or spotify.

And if you're already a time subscriber, just link your account and you're done. Before we get on with episode to some news, a few days ago, the army announced that IT will take bober doors, charges to court martial to trial. Basically, he charged with two crimes, desertion and something called misbehavior before the enemy.

That second one is not used very often. IT Carries the possibility of a life sentence, which IT doesn't seem likely that would happen that be so extreme, but IT does mean both could face some amount of prison time if he's convicted. The army's decision to go to court martial.

It's not that it's so surprising. I mean, this was always a strong possibility is just that for a lot of people watching both case, it's been hard to handicap. All outward signs have pointed to an army that is, have two minds about how to deal with what boat did, whether to throw the book at him, or whether to say, okay, yes, he screwed up in a huge way.

But five years with the taliban, enough is enough. On the one hand, the army leveled pretty severe charges against baw. But then in a military hearing in september, the two star general in charge of investigating bookers, a man, Kenneth doll, who took a three hundred and seven one page statement from boo, who assembled a twenty two person team who coordinated with twenty four government agencies, interviewed fifty six people.

He said he believed that boat told him the truth about why he did what he did. That bow was remorseful. That bow recognizes, quote, that he was Young and naive and inexperienced. Unquote, when asked on the stand whether he thought both should go to jail, major general doll said, quote, I think that would be inappropriate unquote.

Likewise, the officer in charge that hearing lootenant kernel, mark whisker, in his report and want to do about the charges, he apparently recommended a lesser proceedings called a special commercial, more like a mister minor trial. He also recommended no confined in response to which senator john mccain, arguably our country's most powerful former P. O, W, he was held for five years during a bit.

Now more, mccain told a reporter that if both got no punishment, he'd hold a congressional hearing to look into bird doll's case. And then this week, the announcement that the army will pursue the charges in the most serious way possible, a general court martial. It's almost as if those military officials who've come into close contact with bow are ready to forgive him.

The army, as an institution continues to be furious. A few months ago, film ker remark, boy was talking about both on the phone and they were discussing the possibility of a medial of whether boat would take an offer for, say, one, two, three years in prison, an exchange of pleading guilty. But I didn't think you would even though the basic facts of the case aren't in dispute, but admits he walked away from his post of his own volition.

But boon mark, he warned that if he took some plea offer, he'd never get to explain himself and people would continue to hate him. And it's true, a lot of people hate him without ever fully understanding his reasons for doing what he did. That was his fear that after all of this.

he'd end up misunderstood. It's exhausted as you, as scary as that is, go into all of IT. Well, I made IT to last five years as kind of seems student, this lose whatever IT is that then keep me going.

Yeah, I can respect that. I mean, I think that to give that up now, what I must be like kind of almost make the whole thing painless. Yeah, basically turn out on really stupid joke.

From this american life and W B, easy chicago. It's cereal. One story told week by week. I'm Sarah ic.

Good eating, everyone. Ordinarily, the released of american service men after .

five years in wartime captivity with pentagon sources tell nb vanier political smear campaign by raising and of fall .

and soldiers say their sons would be alive, but burg to all had not gone missing from this .

post in the old days.

The very last thing is just. I'm a prisoner. I want to go home. Bring me home, please. 敏 洪。

I was sucking on the phone recently to this taliban fighter. I'm calling him muji dromon not his real name. He told me that when they got both bergdoll, that when they caught him, the taliban knew they had scored.

Ramon said, quote, a dead soldier's is worth nothing, but he was captured alive and he was like a golden chicken. And quote, in the weeks and years, really following those captured during the tactical push and pull between the insurgents in the U. S.

Forces, each side would ask itself over and over what is both worth to us, what is both worth to our enemy? How much will we get? How much will we sacrifice?

Muji remand described one RAID by U. S. forces. Not long after boat disappeared, he said something like fifteen taliban were killed. An american special Operations commander I spoke to described a similar RAID, fifteen enemy killed, I osterman throw. An interpreter who was in next to me was IT worth IT fifteen of your guys .

in one RAID for burger, the other individuals.

and and he was what may be more than five thousand, the .

people, 对的， 辩护人 申请 退 的， 你看 能。

So exactly how did the taliban gettable in the first place? And what did they do with them once they realized to? He was mark bow looked into this too, and was his company page one that got in touch with a guy named sami.

You subside. Sam is affghan. He's a reporter, very brave reporter. He's based in islamabad, but he traveled around the levers work covering the war in afghanistan. He rates for news week in other publications.

And about a year and a half ago, page one hired sami to interview whom ever he could and report back what he found. And he did. He didn't record these interviews on tape, but sami found about a half dozen people who said the'd either been part of the kidnapping or had interacted with boat while he was being held.

One of the first people samy found was his guiding hello. Hello is a taliban fighter, part of a group that was running missions in pacifico province, where both battling was based. What hello w told sami is that the taliban had gotten word from the local people in the area that sometimes a westerner was coming close to the village taking photos, and also that we've seen a soldier sitting on top of a hill near A U.

S. checkpoint. So hello. And a few of his guys had come to the village to see if IT was true and if I was to work out a plan to grab them, kidnap being foreigners, journalists, aid workers, missionaries.

This was big business for the taliban at the time, and is still is. I interviewed Sammy about what hello told him, according to hello. They've just gotten to this village to mess, in fact, where both unit was manning and outpost, they're taking a rest of the mask.

Uh, at that time, suddenly somebody shocked to say there is a far farmers in a gucci tense.

a foreigner in a gucci tent. Gucci is a word for no mads. They keep plucks of animals and live in these big tents in summer. They open up the size of the tent for fresh air.

And he is .

asking .

about cobo, or asking about police. And the hills said, we were unexpected that find out to what is they send. Then we said, okay, let's go and find out.

So how long as guys go to this gucci and they drive up on their motorbikes and see this foreigner? Sami tells IT from hello .

perspective. And we told him that we are police, I mean, america, Normally working with the local malaysia, which is not necessarily to be where uniform, right? Police and look at, he jump behind our bike. So hello.

saying that, we said our local police sort of come with us or whatever, and bergdoll seem to believe that and .

think he was maybe in safe hand. Why told him that the this guy, we don't understand his language, but he is asking about police and couple that what they understand maybe he was asking about something else, you know, asking for a bus or something or rude, uh, and that's why they came and he said that he was and White dress and sandus and he had something in his a pocket. He said there was a pistol, a knife or something. But we do know really exactly OK.

This gucci tent thing comes up in various ways. The taliban say either bow walked into a gucci tent or near a attent. The americans got some intellect, the time to the same effect, and that no mad tipped off the taliban, for his part, both says he was never in a guccione.

He says he was only open when armed man wrote up on motorcycles and grabs him. This is one of those discrepancies, and there will be others where I feel it's worth mentioning because if both did walk into a gucci tennis, all is saying, well, then he makes his own explanation sound less solid. Maybe he wasn't really trying to cause a dust one by running from op meter fob, shona.

Maybe he was simply deserting. But I also can't tell how much weight I should really give this gucci ten story, because the taliban bring up all kinds of rumors, like that boy is in the village to meet up with a woman, or that he was looking for drugs. Rumors prety much anyone whose ever met ball can easily dismiss.

And maybe the truth is summer in between, it's possible. Bow was near a gucci camp and just didn't know IT, and that the no mad saw him out in the open and alerted the taliban. And bow was never the wiser.

Probably we're not gonna to the bottom IT because we can't fact check the stories these guys told sami. We can be sure everything they told him is true. And the details of what happened to shift around depending on who sam is talking to, which is an unusual in any kind of reporting.

What I can say is that the overall chain of events, the major plot points that the taliban describe, are pretty consistent person to person. In sam's interviews with these guys, they don't seem that interested in pinning down exactly how bow ended up in or near a gucci tent more. What they wanted talk about is how incredible IT was, that IT happened at all to remain and hood to everyone involved.

This was just maculate, that gucci no mats. People they consider unsophisticated and uneducated snagged this westerner, and not just any westerner, but in american, an enemy of the coran of the past two people, and not just any american, but a soldier. Romans said the whole thing, the way they ve got him, and just being up close with your adversary like that. IT was one of those lifetime strange experiences.

and to into our guest .

so easily in afghanistan amounts all the a provinces in the district we were.

We were blessed in sam's interviews. They uses expression. The carbo already made loaf a gift from god.

They felt so lucky that both came to them, that of all the desert joints in all the provinces, in all of afghanistan, he walked into theirs. Hello told sami that both fought at first, but they subdued him. And then once they got among one of their bikes, they took him back to the mosque. And one point all bow was again resisting throwing punches, or maybe his capture were. It's not clear.

he said that like, but godal was kind of resisting. Guy know he start like not giving. And he was a good punching goin. He was a box up in suddenly one pakistani taliban.

He came close to him and he sit down on his knees and and suddenly, you know, to kick him with his was Peter, because his Peter was open. And we would start joking with the that lets even this guy, I know you are. So yes.

i'm laughing here as if I get the joke. I don't. In some of sam's conversations, the taliban describe bo as strong and aggressive. Other times he's meat and pathetic. The adjectives they applied to the mythic captive changing to suit the scene.

Hello told sami that for them, for these couches who maybe never been up close with the western before, maybe not even with an infidel and non muslim, bow was exotic. Hill said. He was like an animal captured by kids.

His pale skin was weird. The way he spoke was weird. His eyes are blue, which says, he says, as somewhat suspicious. In afghanistan, there's a saying that you should keep away from blue eyes. People in the moscow also says people had gathered to discuss what to do with bob. I have said his notes from these interviews, and this one part, hell all talks about how bow was sitting in a dark corner of the mosque. And another talian fighter said to him, quote, see you look like a small cat baby with shining blue eyes and quote, I am Sammy with that man.

I think this is something explaining somebody weaknesses. But I think, um uh, I think he said there was he was very kind of weak. He was not like a big americans.

I like a big, hey, americans. They thought he was like a weak americans. Yeah.

i'm just looking in a note that you wrote that his burglary was weak and I think brainless yeah yeah.

But this there was a stupid that .

why he entered their hand.

yeah daming in their ends OK OK wise. You know, he would not. This was really something. You know, somebody coming and jumping in.

you are bike. Was he scared like that? He say.

well, when did he? He was scared is sometime he was crying, sometime he was smiling, and we thought was happened to this guy, but most of that he was silent. Anybody giving water, he was not drinking.

And they said he was like a budda budda. Like, as you know, the famous a istan ban buda, you know? So he look like.

so i'm not really .

reacting to what was going going around him. We thought his drunk so when yeah apparently the .

I mean they drive .

me in the water somewhere, you know to release his drank nesses data. He was drunk, but he was not drunk.

He also told sami that to be fair, he never actually seen a drunk person, but apparently they tend to think all .

westerners are drunk. From that point forward, that was, that was a survival mode. I knew I had to be extremely careful if I going to survive that. I knew I had to be extremely careful at what point in time I decided to push.

Yeah, that's boo. Talking to mark on the phone, of course, yes, boo was scared. I was only rational to be scared when the taliban guys explained to Sammy how they kidnapped bow.

They kind of wax a romantic. Sometimes are crack jokes. There's a swash bucking quality to sam, his notes from these interviews, but then you remember, bow himself. He's completely at their mercy, is terrified for excEllent reason. He's in the hands of people who conduct public executions, mass beheading, ings and often film them for propaganda.

Doesn't matter how many council movies you watch, doesn't matter how long you're a martial art fighter, whatever, you have to be realistic when you're facing those type of people. Yeah, these these people do they? They have no hesitation, have no problem killing you.

Yeah, they will kill you just for the amusement of being abused. Shot you. Yeah.

both. So there was one guy in the convoy who spoke a little english, and he asked questions, was bow, a big commander was an intelligence officer?

You said no. You said no, not, but no. Did you tell? Did you explain to them why you were out there? Like the exact tory and why I was author yeah yeah that that that came out more less in in an aversion that was more suitable for the situation.

What you what .

did you say?

But I think my basically he was set up with the the command to remember this is kind of going through. This is being filtered to the point that you i'm trying to get guys who barely speak english to understand what you .

saying yeah so.

Need to go on the lines that you eyes fed up for american commanders because they were like, disrespectful, but that in work, because they didn't understand what this respect for was. So I came up with, understand what rude was for .

some stranger than poses. His memories from that time are sort of thin, in large part because he says he was blind folded. He was focused on what was happening to him, minute to minute, trying to comprehend his circumstances and how he could possibly reverse them.

They show me around from a couple different plants, and they got me to, uh, small village. I S. You pull me off the, off the motorcycle and let me down on the ground.

And all the guys came up. I guess I don't know. I'm guess, you know, like a Younger brother is like Younger body or on my button yet his cell phone now me like taking a video of me and his body.

He was like sitting up to time. He was like, you didn't say anything else. Eat just like american yeah I just shot my head and then he flat me.

And um that a few times all they wanted with the video. um. And well after they're done, and they put the wine fall back on and they threw blanket over my head, and then they, I don't aware that, went. But then, like, little kids started during rocks at me and that kind of pretended to, like, flinch from on the rocky meeting head, which can allow mindshift my way, and like trying to, yet my hands from behind my back and poll around so I could get him in front of me.

That didn't work. So then both tried to lean forward so he could use his need to move the cloth off of his face.

I can't got IT to point where it's like half off my left eye, almost, are you. I start to blanket on my head. You know, nobody was really stopping me and I didn't hear any voices. So I just like you, this is the best thing, but is ably gonna. I just stood up and bolted both as I didn't .

get more than maybe twenty or thirty feet before he was tackled by what felt like the entire village that was day one of his captivity. By two thousand and nine in afghanistan, the U. S.

Forces in the taliban had been fighting for seven years. And in all that time, the'd never been a situation like this. An american soldier captured IT was a new kind of crisis.

But each side also knew who they were dealing with. They could cipher what each other other's moves would be. In those first few days. The U. S. Knew that whoever had both would be moving him constantly, because along you stay in one place, the more likely you are to get caught.

And they also knew that the taliban s goal would be to get bow to a hideout in the tribal region of western pakistan, because pakistan is like home base, or to put IT in town. And Jerry terms, pakistan is the hole in the baseboard where tom cannot go. Pakistan is a sovereign nation, are proportionally, we are not at war with pakistan.

So once boys in pakistan, we can do much about IT. In afghanistan, U. S.

Forces can go anywhere they want, can do almost anything they want. But in pakistan is much, much harder for the U. S.

Military to Operate. Here's the other thing that happens. One's bogus to pakistan. He becomes much more valuable because his capture don't have to get rid of him in a hurry.

They can take their sweet time making the deal they want to make. But of course, the taliban knew that the us. Knew they'd had for pakistan. So the taliban did the opposite. Instead of heading straight east to the pakistan border, the taliban guy sami talked, too, said they first took the west to gazi province, or emotion, he remained loved.

Sami, you subside, put us in contact with her.

Mon, he already interviewed him a year earlier for page one. For this interview, sam had car picked them up and they talked to me on a burn or cell phone from inside the car, which is parked in a residential neighborhood. Wn, to be fairly safe. disappear. The call .

dropped about a .

half dozen times during our interview. Mister hd romine told me, by the time berg dog came to him, the plane was already set. A taliban commander named Carried a smile. Suleman zai had taken charge of bow and had arranged to deliver him to a group known as a hacon I network in pakistan.

In the meantime, mujahid roman's orders were to keep bow alive and out of sight for a couple of days and nights until the pressure on the border eased a little and they could sneak bow across. By the time mom took charge of the motorcycle convoy, about eight people, he said he was obvious to the taliban that U. S. Forces were pouring into east n. Afghanistan to search for bow.

Music .

search and the ground surge and also the explains, and that was the reason, you know, were moving around the hour by hour. We were changing location, and we even changing both goals, dress. And we were even, we were changing our dress. And at one point we came in a close contact with american ground forces by five hundred and meters while broke on ones with this.

He law told sami that at one point his convoy had come within a kilometer of fob shona, where both own batan was based. But even if bow had wanted to scream or make a commotion, he couldn't have his hands were tied and romance said he had a large cw threat on his head, partly to disguise them, but partly just to keep the dust off his face.

They all wear them against the dust, raman says these were probably the most stressful two days of any mission he'd ever done. Carious mile stayed in constant contact with his guy in pakistan from the hacker I. network.

Romans said they used fake names and locations over the Walker talkies to confuse americans, but the U. S. Force is tracked him. Anyway.

there were locations, we stayed in location. And then two, three hours later, american forces came in a to that place, to that house, and search that house.

By this time, of course, word had spread all over the region that A U. S. Soldier had gone missing, the military airdrop leaflet saying, quote, one of our american guests missing and gave a phone number to call.

Another one handed out about two weeks after boat disappeared, was less gentle. That showed armed western forces kicking in a door. A news report translated the texas as quote, if you do not free the american soldier, you will be targeted.

The army claimed the leaflets had hunted, not targeted. We are actually some scary on me. They also dirigo ted chocolate. Sami u. Subside interviewed some of the people who lived in or near meston shorne at the time, and they remember the chocolate wrapped in shiny paper. They also remember helicopters all over the place, and that the americans were saying berg doll's name, or at least a word that had A B son.

在 让 他 下次 报 不。 The people sami talk .

to said they'd heard the missing .

soldier had been wandering around drunk when the taliban grab, just as he had suspected there was a common rumour that both was drunk or that he'd gone to a holy site or that he'd tried to fight off. The taliban was karadi in classified U. S.

Military communications released to the public by wicky leagues. There's all this chatter on the ground that first week after bowt missing on july first two thousand and nine, the day after boat disappears, an lvi traffic report. Lvi stands for low level voice intercept technology we use to eve drop on enemy voice or data communications.

IT picks up this conversation. Quote, is that true that they capture an american guy? Yes, they did.

He is alive. There's nowhere he can go. L O L. Asked a former soldier who regularly read such messages what L L.

Means in this context, and he said the only meaning that seemed plausible to him was laugh out loud. Then a few hours later, there's this intercept. We were attacking the post.

He was sitting, taking executives and had no gun with him. He was taking exported. He is not claimed as, but yet I think he's a big shot.

That's why they're looking for him. And quote muji, dromon, of course, understood bow was A U. S. Soldier but he didn't know precisely what kind he said the intensity of the search did suggest both was a big shot. Since why would they put all that effort and money into looking for him if he wasn't important? Roman said he had heard foreign soldiers were sometimes trained in martial arts, so at first he and his men were very careful around their prisoner, but pretty soon roman says his main impression of bow was that he was just really scared.

Sleep and then because, uh, he was thinking that what type of people we might be and what are we going to do with him? Or are we going to kill him? And what are we going to be him and what are we going to do with him? So that was his situation. He was very scared than that we can confuse.

Roman said he didn't feel sorry for him. He didn't think of him as innocent from his point of view, but was like all U. S. Soldiers, he'd travelled halfway around the world voluntarily to invade their country and kill muslims.

But roman and most of the guys semi interviewed, they also talk about, how about was their gas? How human they were with him was a little daring to here. I mean, tying your gust to the back of a motorcycle against this world doesn't sound like great host behavior. But I explain me, they're not being ironic that in pah tune culture, a guest is always treated with generosity in respect.

And so the fact that boat was labelled a gust in this situation made IT clear to the lower down guys under a curious miles command that they're not allowed to kill him or even beat the crap out of him, which roman said was a real concern that some alka a taliban fighters, especially if they'd had family members killed by americans, might try to cuba or a kidnapping for themselves. One of the L. V, I messages from july first, the day after bill left, reads on identified mail, says, quote, cut the head off unquote.

Roman himself had been a prisoner of the americans. He said he was held at by gram for about two years. And he said he made sure to treat bill Better than he'd been treated.

Quote someone who is in your custody, he said, you treat him nicely. unquote. At one point, romance says they stopped the convoy in what he calls a wine field like a grape orchard.

They've gone there to hide from U. S. helicopters. And round said while they were there, they tried to help bow .

out to make him feel Better and to, uh, cheating map. Uh, we stopped this a viny. And, uh, we did this little dance, traditional dance, called the time for him so he can start eating. And a time is an .

afghan n dance, where typically there's a drum and you move in a circle in unison. So yeah, apparently they did one for this frightened american soldier in a great orchard. Didn't work, didn't boost moron and get him to eat.

No, I think that friday worker.

And IT is even and had an adverse effect on him because um he did not know why we were doing that.

就是 我们在 great that's about no both as he has no memory .

of the event that he's .

never seen .

in a town except in a video the taliban showed him much later。 Kenneth wolf was command surgery major of the vivo first backman boat disappeared, the bottle an's highest drinking non commissioned officer, he said at first he felt the'd find well and I .

told the carney said, you know what, i'm going to stick around here for a few days because if we find him, I anna, beyond the the helicopter that picks him up and he was like, one, I know they're gonna WIP his s meaning both .

fellow soldiers are gna IP. As as more isn't wrong to worry about that if we would .

have found them, I think a lot of us would have shot him if that tells you .

anything that's deal handsome. One of both to mates.

I truly say that was sincere, that we had that towards them.

We hated .

him.

absolutely hated them.

That's mark mercury, a specialist in the final first but in different company from bow was like.

well, we see him. He's not going to last.

You like seriously, you're just kind of blustery like i'm really or do you really think like it's possible? Yeah and you .

do yeah.

Well.

I mean, I don't know what kind of like that shed does. Like shed on asp, he was one of those things where the conversation had come up. I found this .

shocking and disturbing that some of these guys were saying they might have killed, but if theyd found them. But now, after interviewing more than a dozen soldiers, I still don't sympathy with trying to kill him, but I do understand why their anger was so extreme. I get IT the dust one searching recovery Operations lasted officially for forty five days, and some people contend IT went on even longer.

But the most frantic time, the soldier said, was those first few weeks. They told me the search for boat started in the immediate vicinity. Y, A very went missing from op mass in eastern afghanistan.

Right away, a nine men foot patrol headed out from the op tower, a boy school in the lock. Luu, jp. Billings, bobo, une leader.

So they came across a boy who told billings, yes, he had seen an american in a field that morning. And he gave a specific time, six or two A M. He pulled up his sleeve to show his casio watch.

There are a bunch of reports like this of boys saying they have seen an american low crawling on the ground or nearly fainting from dehydration. A couple of reports noted that they were also giving out Candy to the kids. In one instance, the kid gets on pop arts, which is notable.

An army report on both disappearance suggests maybe IT was our initial search, maybe even this first patrol that LED to both capture that the soldiers handing out Candy and asking these questions tip the kids off, and ultimately the adults, and then the taliban, that an american was missing. And so they went out looking for him and grab them, which supports what poses that the taliban rode ride up to among motorbikes. Both as he hadn't told anyone what he planned to to do.

So no one in his unit or his batta has any idea why he laughed. How could they? All they have to go on is whatever early until is coming in.

I remember where I heard IT from, but I remember hearing that he was in the town asking if people spoke english, and then that's where he was nabbed. That's Austin linford, another of both fortune mates, a bunch people I spoke to. Remember a report like this coming over the transom.

M, here's what I think. They probably got IT in the wicky league released from the day we went missing. There's an entering.

They picked up L, V, I traffic indicating, quote, that an american soldier is talking and is looking for someone who speaks english. American soldier has camera unquote, which countries an image of both seeking contact or may be help. But several people who know how military until works told me these L V R reports can be tRicky.

The quick translations of over her chatter, nuance is lost. My translations are not uncommon. So for what is worth? The search for boat was enormous by the late afternoon of june thirty at two thousand nine, and had balloon work goes out that, quote, all Operations will cease until missing soldier is found. All assets will be focused on the dust one situation and sustainment Operations.

On quote, they would search all of practical province and newborn packet ia province, too, and into gazi province and coast, thousands of square miles. Anything they needed to make that happen. They got planes, helicopters, drones, interpreters, elite units, special forces.

Hundreds of people stopped what they were doing, even if your job was to look for osama bin laden. Now you are going to look for the dust. one. They were snapping into action because of a basic ground floor principal of the army. You do not leave anyone out there in a war zone.

The military knew that the first twenty, forty, forty eight hours would be the most critical period if they were going to find him based on some fancy intel. They understood pretty quickly that bow have been captured, and they knew whoever had him would be on the move, and therefore talking on radios or phones the whole time, trying to figure out their own next steps. So if you can intercept that chatter, you can maybe geo locate rebow might be so italian command request as much signals intelligence I can get.

And then, of course, needs more soldiers to check out all that intel. Five more patton's join the search than eight more play on the entire or gave gets. One commander told me he was like a mini surge.

Our Operational tempo went from sort of you know casual presence patrols, driving around, handing out stuff um cordoning ID till E O D came out. This is john theron.

He was in black foot company. Both company different .

bottle on to I mean nonce up IT was around the clock. Um we be kick in indoors one minute, setting up a blocking position and searching every single car. An hour later.

a blocking position was basically a road block. The official mission in afghanistan in two thousand nine was counterinsurgency coin. For short, american forces were were supposed to be containing the insurgents, but also training afghan security forces.

They were supposed to be engaging the locals, gaining their trust, improving infrastructure. All that pretty much stopped. Now here's mark mercury.

Sure, there had been fights that had had been going on, but they weren't flights that we were picking. Um the bad guys would come to us and we would fight him off. You know whether this was us going out every night looking for a guys mashed down the door, we were just looking and looking .

and looking john erman again.

I mean, towns I don't even know these towns had seen americans ever.

Okay, now now we're going to fly you into this bEdwin village and you're to you're going to go check every single building a room, check all the women's faces to make sure that they're not hiding him in women's clothing that spend events.

A specialist from charly company, he said they're been in telled that the'd dressed both as a woman which at times both as they did and so we you win into the house and and whenever ver you would go into a house to do a search, all the women would typically hudden into one corner together and Normally we wouldn't them any mind just just to leave them to be, you know um but at that point we can have to walk over. I had to, I mimic you, removing your veil, remove your bail, so we can see this kind of stuff. Making women lift their veils or kicking indoors doesn't exactly dear you to the local populous, but they didn't have time to worry about that right now.

Any little fragment of actionable intelligence, they're moving him in a White truck. They're handing him over to someone at this location. They didn't have a luxury to ignore any of IT.

You can see on paper in those wick ex releases all the scrambling that was going on those for a few days from june thirty dia, two thousand nine, the dab left. Update one forty cave has intellectualize an is planning to move the U. S.

packs. Packs, means person or passenger to guardeth next day, july first update delivered three, six reports. They have received intellect.

The body of the missing U. S. Soldier is due east of their current position. July forth update spot report missing U. S.

Soldier was last seen in a village at grid location, vb six, one one eight, one eight. A bag was covering his head and he was wearing dark caci a perl. And so on, day after day, here's mark mercury.

Apparently at at one point, these guys said they intercepted a phone 口 where IT was one member of the taliban being to another and they said， hey, the americans are right outside and we've got this guy with us and so is like, that goes all trickles all the way up and and all the way back down, everybody freeze, hold. Would you got, you know, stay where you are, set out an outer cord on in search wherever everybody is. But by the time the information had travelled all the way up the chain and all back down, IT was already too late.

Despite the massive resources at their disposal, the americans were at a certain disadvantages that landscape, because any movement of U. S. Forces, giant armour, trucks and helicopters, or whatever, makes a lot of noise, kick up a lot of dust. The taliban could be more nimble, skirting around on small roads or pass, often on motorcycles. As soon as they saw, heard that the enemy was coming their way.

I were charging in towns running out of our trucks, like his here, running to this cause that's dairy.

Hanson, again, a lot is a kind of compound.

Just what's guns? In fact, i'll never forget we ran in. And as we're running in, this fricking cow has a baby like right next time just out when was scared the hell out of the cow you know I just had a baby so yeah IT was IT was very intense yeah just you know we're always seem like one one day behind worries.

The americans were certain ly on the right track. The vital leadership met with a local afghan leader who reported that both had been turned over to the local taliban leader. Curry smile, just like a all told, sami and the U.

S. Was pretty sure those taliban guys would turn bow over to the cki is in pakistan in north was zero down to be precise. They'd also gotten in til that bow might be in gazi, just like musha a man said.

In fact, roman told me that a few days after he returned from delivering boto pakistan, he got rolled up by the americans detained and questioned about bow. Roman d. Said everyone was getting question about both people from downtown th and kahn and from our western hi.

But here the U. S. Had in front of them the very man who had shot pretty both to the cki is his.

your amount told them, I have not seen this person .

and I don't know this person, and I haven't heard of him. So that was my reply all the time to the americans pulling into towns you're unfamiliar .

with based on single source intelligence or conflicting intelligence, with almost no time to prepare your team for what's awaiting them is risky. In a more typical Operation, you mitigate the danger, maximize the chance for success by doing everything you can in advance to do is called shape the battle field. And you might take a few days to plan and prepare.

Now commanders were Lucy. If they got a few hours, sometimes they felt like they were winging in. A special Operations commander told me his team went on more than fifty missions looking for bow, and many of those were during the day rather than at night when his guys have the advantage.

Quote, we don't work in the day, he said. Major mike walls was commander of a special forces company. He was in charge of seven Green berry and one navy seal ld team. He took over the command on june thirty at the same day left while inventory soldiers were out searching. Cars are going house to house in villages while says his teams were conducting raids, usually at night, targeting specific compounds or houses where they had little bow either was or had .

been any thread of evidence that burger l had been there. We thought he was there. A A A citing IT wasn't really vented, uh, IT wasn't butters by other types of reporting there. There is just no time to check on that. We just went and I can't emphasize I can't over emphasize held dangerous that is.

Well, so there's one mission that still freak amount. His man went to gosse, he says most of his missions were ordered in gosse, and they had had information that a Young White male surrounded by fighters had been seen in a particular compound that day. So as fast as they could, they got the helicopter together. They head IT out there didn't have time to said anything. They arrive and walk into the compound to find the whole thing is booby dropped.

The team went in and looked up and saw the ceiling lined with c four. And then there was also a car bomb with with a trunk packed with explosive sitting in middle of compound. Now by the Grace of god, they evacuated before the thing could go off and I never did, but I would have easily lost twenty to thirty um american Green buried that night had that thing go off. And IT quickly became very apparent to us that the taliban knew, and our sources began telling us that the taliban and the colony network knew that we were pulling out all the stops to find him feeding false information into our .

informal networks.

All right, you've got the most advanced military in the world throwing all this effort, all this expertise and technology are trying to find one person. They do pull out all the stops just to get one soldier back as really something, but then they can't find them. And not only that, in some instances, they're being played by the enemy, learned into traps what is going on.

I don't quite understand if we should be impressed by this Operation or dismayed. I ask the guy name, Jason dam cy, to answer this question for me. At the time, boat disappeared. Jason was a major in the tenth mountain division and Operations officer, meaning he planned military Operations for biti based in logar province, just north of peacekeepers. Tia, i've you just in a couple of times now, and what i've learned is that he's very smart and that he can't stop fighting cancer .

down if we're insensibly conducting counter and certainty that are you washing.

are you washing dishes? Jason's got A P. H. D. In his taught at west point. He's done tories in both iraq and afghanistan, and he thought a lot about what we did and didn't accomplish in afghanistan. He is not surprised we didn't find boil when I think about what was happening. I just have this image of like this, this big machine, you know, that's like moving around in this region in afghanistan. And there's just like a mouse running through the legs of them, like or or like, I don't know, like an add on star wars, as you know, and then comes with little thing and these just like tied up the legs and IT falls over. I mean, I know that's not fair.

but but that absolutely true. It's a great energy, right? You've got this big lumbering machine moving through. They can destroy anything face on, but IT can't get IT has no idea on a granular level what below IT Jason says what's down .

there on the ground or towns. We don't understand where regular people in government officials in the taliban are impossibly in mashed, where civilians might hate the taliban, but they might hate the karzi government even more. So it's not clear at all that the U.

S. Is the to root for to help. It's not as simple as these people are loyal to our side and those people are loyal to their side is fluid. And at that time in that part of afghanistan, we just didn't understand the incredibly complicated .

politics of these towns. We can target or track individual networks, but we never really able to tie in, okay, which towns and villages and people who know their relatives were happy to give them safe passage, or they can walk through each even.

even after, even after seven years of war. At this point, we don't know. We don't know the networks well enough.

no. And remember when you say seven years of war IT means we rotated a few thousand dude through there every seven and twelve months. But there is no institutional knowledge with the U.

S. military. And I understand, right, nearly none. We never were. There are long enough actually get engaged with and the supplies unfortunate after two thousand and ten as well. We've never had anybody um fully engaged at all levels with the afgan politics.

But Jason said that the whole thing right there, the spider web of connections we never could untangle, we had come into afghanistan in two thousand and one and asked ted the taliban. And we did a pretty good job of that through two thousand and three. But then afterwards, Jason said, our mission, languaged and the taliban used the intervening years to refresh and regroup to learn how we Operate, how we track them.

Now they were pushing back into the country in a big way in exactly this region. Actio packed a coast, right? We're bogues missing. So that's what the soldiers of the vivo first were up against. There were total outsiders looking for their guy and knowing their chances of finding him were diminishing every day that passed.

Clint Baker, commander of the first balian of the fio, first said IT was as high risk in Operation as he's ever had, in part because there was no clear end point in a military hearing, he testified. Quote, and I mean, Franklin, I felt a bit at a loss on, you know what to do in my entire time in the army. I can't think of a time where I felt that kind of adversity just period and really do not know, wasn't able to overcome IT. And quote, the relentlessness was what was so crushing. Here's john theron and then darl hanson.

He got to the point or sleep, I mean, sort of became A A distant reality.

just twenty four hours a day, seven days a week, no sleep. No, nothing ah just ran out of you to all the guys are just miserable and it's just like hell on earth, you know.

Of course, afghanistan was dangerous and conditions were rough of for bo left also. But now, because Operation tempo was roughly doubled or even tripled, in some cases there is just more contact with the danger. Black for third platoon on, for instance, hit three ids.

In one day. Major slovo, a slovo testified that the battle ans m raps those huge armed trucks that are built to sustain I D explosions that about eighty percent of them were damaged during the search period and about half the damage was caused by ds. Therefore, mine rollers all destroyed. Those numbers are one way to quantify the danger and the damage, but a full reckoning of the consequences, including the enormous question of whether people were wounded or died looking for bow, would come publicly much later, after both came home.

I saw some pictures dell hanson took from that time. One shows him in another guide standing next to a circus on a spit. Is that a goat?

Yes.

that's a good. what? What was going on in that picture? What's going on is they were tired of mrs. So they would buy a goat of a local farmer, have some meat that wasn't back impact.

Some of these units couldn't go back to their fobs for what's called refit, where you clean and resupply equipment, you shower, you get a hot meal for weeks on end. Second platoon, bose platoon, they got sent out for nineteen days straight. So that's outside the wire.

Living in trucks are just on the ground for nearly three weeks doing non stop missions. Another platoon from charlie company was sent out for thirty seven days straight. You've got all your gear on full battle real and IT waves between sixty and one hundred pounds, depending on what kind of weapon you're Carrying or whether you are radio Operator who has extra batteries.

IT might be ninety degrees during the day or one hundred degrees at night. The temperature might drop as much as thirty degrees, major slovo said in a military hearing that the men would hudden together at night to keep warm. Quote, they would literally ucl.

Its spoon unquote J. P. Buildings was one of the people who was out for a one thousand straight. He testified that he gotten diary here early and quote, you know, I shit my pants on.

Quote, he did have an extra pair, but he had ripped up the inside leg on some concertinaed ire. Quote, so knowing that I was going out and talking to locals, potentially females and whatever villages, I couldn't necessarily have an exposed region like that on my pants on. Quote, so buildings were the ship pants.

For nineteen days, people's t shirts got shotted. Their socks rotted. People got sores on their skin. They could only wash with baby wipes, and maybe bottled .

water undergo falling off them.

Oh really yeah.

Cloth, you know, like something you you would think you, in malaysia or burma, you know, closed, just fAllen apart.

That can wolf the command search major. The hard part was they hadn't planned for this. No one knew how long the search was gona go on.

Yeah eventually because we had to start figuring that out, how we going to rote guys back in, how do we resupply them because they're everywhere. Our guys are everywhere. They're spread out everywhere.

I mean, just pete, just the logistics nightmare. And then also IT wasn't just arbitron, the other batons within the organization or looking for him to. And so what you know how does that make you feel when you walked for fifteen days straight looking for a guy who walked off and he's not even in your unit?

And so you see somebody and like, hey, man, fuck you. We're out here looking for this guy. Maybe you're .

thinking all this, complaining about how hard that time was crimea river, their soldiers and its war. And this is what they signed up for. Wow, isn't.

no. Their job was to go find and rescue one of their own. They knew that, and they accepted IT IT was the right thing to do to go look for him.

And they genuinely wanted to find him. But they also knew, or were at least pretty confident, the boat had left metal p voluntarily. And now they felt like they were going through hell on his behalf.

And I wasn't just both own cartoon doing IT, but other pottles from other petitions most of people I talk to about this time. They said the search inflicted such major damage on morale, which can be a delicate thing to maintain in the best of times. At the end of july, about a month in major, Larry glascock, the bottle an executive officer, went on leave back to for Richardson in alaska, where the baton is based. His boss had asked him to meet with a group of soldier's family members who knew that their soldiers were outlooking for burden.

The families knew that we were conducting significant Operations and that we were stepping up our community activities against insurgents to try and find him. So they knew that the risk in afghani, an for orbital, had increased and IT was IT was a tough, tough meeting. Um there was a lot of concern.

There were a lot of scared wives and for rightly so um they wanted answers and they wanted comfort. They wanted to know that their husband was going to be okay. And you know you know not an physician to make these counts promises.

Shame cross was in both platoon. He is friendly with bow. Yeah, still. I'm still I think I still angry about IT shame was out on that nineteen day stint with the pti on when they finally made IT back to the fob until I twenty eighth would be throwing a few hours I turned out, rather than the day to y'd hope for, shane shot themselves in the foot with his nine millimeter pistol while I was in the bathroom and got sent home. Shane said I was an accident, he said.

The army agreed, but the other guy saw as a statement about how beaten down they were, how they'd had enough. Commander said they could see in their faces how emotionally busted their soldiers were, how angry they were starting to bigger with each other. Major slovo testified that he'd given them pep talks.

But quote, I could hear, well, you mumbling, mumbling, grumbling, grumbling expertise. Ba, blab and quote, as the weeks went on, they started to hit more and more dry holes. They'd a assault in some village or target, and they d find nothing.

I asked, can wolf how I try to keep moral up? Can, to me, seems like the of guy who can scare the crap out of you and also hug you in the same encounter, can't tell me he tried whatever he could to get his soldiers through, including asking his wife to send over copenhagen snap from the states which he did. SHE bought roles and roles of IT and can passed IT around.

I remember talking to see a group of guys, and I we don't we don't know everything at this point. We don't know. You know, this is our mission. He's one of our guys. We got to find him. We're going to do IT so that was one way the other way, giving our cans of coben hag, telling dirty jokes, put in people in the head lock that's how you do IT and .

just being affectioned ate with them basically .

yeah and saying, and hey, what you're doing is good and honoring able and we just got ta keep .

looking yeah .

and no one in the back mama, this is bucking bull shit. In what .

way was IT bushed .

because he's in pakistan.

it's true. But wasn't pakistan .

in july fourteenth, two thousand and nine? This is the first .

hostage video, the talented release of .

both you. My .

name is vert.

But would spend the next year figuring out how to escape next time on cereal.

Syria is produced by july's natter data chip me in partnership with markable meghan ellison, hugo o. Linden, Justin whisper g page one and anaho a pictures hour glasses are editorial al adviser editing help this week from joe level and brian reid within danger field as our digital editor research by Kevin garnett, fact checking by macho Harris, copy editing by our music is composed by nick thorpe, orne mark phillips and fits mires.

The show is mixed by cable and ski Christian Taylor, our community editor. Production helps this week from Nancy uptake and na cage's or her stein, other serial staff setton Emily and Alice berger son and Kimberly henderson son. Special thanks this week to international mapping, Thomas barfield, ctr, conrad crane, bill marsh, leo Jones, JoNathan mark, David rafael and mark mercury, and special thanks to pan dora, where you can now also listen to serial seasons one and two.

Our website is serial podcast not work. We can listen to all our episodes, sign up for our newsletter, read articles by the serial staff, and check out maps, videos and more. You can also find a link to our tumblr page where you can submit questions to us, and we will answer them again.

That serial podcast at work. Stay tuned for a preview of the next episode of cereal. But first, this is saracenic host to the serial podcast.

If you are hooked on this show, and i'm guessing you are, then i'm hoping my job here is pretty easy to get you to subscribe to the new york times so you can listen to the rest of IT. My father was an ad man who taught me the best ads are declarative, no puffery. So here goes.

Serial shows are expertly reported and inventive. Nobody makes them like we make them. But syria's great serials aside, when you subscribe, you get all the times shows the daily as reclined wire cutters has a new podcast.

My voice, though, don't just get an audio subscription, go big, subscribe to the paper, all access the home. Magellan cereal is part of the time. So technically I work at the times, and honestly, i'm kind of cheap, but I subscribe from the news obviously, and the games and the cooking and the magazine and cereal.

I think of the times as a stable, even my kids who are not budding journalists and who don't even really listen to cereal, they both asked me for time subscriptions. All the ool kids are doing IT. So please sign up. You can do IT through spotify or apple podcast or if you're already a time subscriber sign in, it's worth IT.

It's another wild weeknight so you pick an easy new york times cooking sheep pen recipe but when you open the pantry, no onions and as usual, somehow you're low and olive oil with inter card, there's another way where quality ingredients don't require a road trip for the contents of your pantry. You don't define your meal where you can click shop ingredients ts on instincts on new york times cooking recipe for delivery and as fast as thirty minutes. Learn more A M I T cooking up com flash instant ard that's M I T cooking up com slash instincts.

This poggi is supported by made in cook ware. As a chef and a restaurant owner, i'm as meticulous about my cook wear as I am about my ingredients. That's why I love made in coke war.

Each pen they make isn't just designed to perform. It's crafted to last. As a mom, I love that I can trust made in.

It's made from the world's finance materials so I can feel good about what i'm feeding my family. I'm chef rick Williamson, and I use made in cocoa for full details. Visit made in coq dot com.

That's M A D E I N coquart dot com. Cereals are production of this american life and W B E Z chicago. Coming up on the next episode of .

cereal description, I could try to give you is literally madison an animal picture, someone taking that back into the class, showing the door, and just begetting about IT, right? Basically how they treat me.