Matt Bronleewe
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First Person is produced in cooperation with the Far East Broadcasting Company, who rejoice in the stories of changed lives through the power of Jesus Christ. Learn more at febc.org. I just thought that was so interesting, too, whenever it was posed this question, what are you going to do, that it was posed as a need and opportunity. You know, these difficulties that we come across in life, that they're actually opportunities, that's something that really can hit me hard. ♪

On this edition of First Person, we're going to tell the story of the founder of Compassion International, the Christian organization which helps suffering children around the world. Welcome, I'm Wayne Shepherd. Before we hear from our guests, we always have additional information and links to each of these interviews online at FirstPersonInterview.com. So anytime you'd like to follow up on what you hear or even go back and listen again, just visit FirstPersonInterview.com. We also have a free smartphone app.

Matt Brown-Louis is our guest today. He's the author of What Are You Going to Do?, which tells the story of Everett Swanson, the founder of what is now known as Compassion International.

Beginning with the spiritual, Compassion's ministry is to deliver whole-life care to disadvantaged children around the world. Through sponsorships, Christians are able to help these children. But how did Compassion come about in the first place? That's why we invited Matt to join us from his home. I was introduced to Everett actually by my wife's folks. They were in town visiting.

And they had brought with them a compassion book. It was actually like a 50th anniversary book or something like that. And my father-in-law, George, he was flipping through the book and there were some pictures in the beginning, these black and white photos. And he'd point and he'd say, Uncle Everett this and Uncle Everett that.

And I stopped him at one point and I was like, wait a second, are you telling me that the founder of Compassion International was your uncle? And he was like, yeah. He's like, I thought you knew and everything. And then I started putting it together at Swanson. My wife's maiden name is Swanson. And so I began to kind of puzzle together, you know, the connections. And my wife's dad is like, he's a fabulous storyteller.

he began to tell me some of the stories he knew about Everett and

that the beginning of compassion was during the Korean War. I was absolutely fascinated. So that was kind of my first entry point into just learning about Everett and who he was. And then it was through getting to know some family members in the Swanson family that I began to learn a lot more about who he was and how things got started. Okay. So was it the Korean War that got him in Korea in the first place or did it start before then?

Yeah, he was preaching. He was a pastor at a church in Chicago.

he decided to step down from that what he was kind of planning to do and what he did do for a while was he would do these tent revivals kind of a classic thing from you know 40s and 50s and and earlier um where they'd pop up the tent and he'd preach to a crowd and all of that uh so he was a really tremendous speaker he was a noted speaker in the chicago area um

And there was a man who was doing like a worldwide tour, putting together a worldwide tour. It was Bob Cook, known for his involvement with Youth for Christ and all of that. So Everett went on this worldwide tour. The Korean War had already started. And Everett had this desire to go to Korea. He knew that there would be some really unique speaking opportunities there. His wife Miriam was actually, I guess, praying for him not to get into the country. Is that right? Yeah.

Uh, so, so I guess, you know, I guess it was Everett's prayers that were eventually favored in that struggle. Um,

So what happened is Everett was in a washroom in Tokyo and there was a guy that was only in town for a day in the washroom and he was whistling. Everett heard him whistling and was like, hey man, you're whistling my tune. Got to talking and this guy had a connection to be able to get Everett into Korea, which happened a short time later. So Everett goes to Korea. He's on the front lines for six weeks and

So he's seeing what's going on and he's seeing the destruction. He's seeing the atrocities of the war. He's getting to speak to all kinds of people. But he begins to see some of the troubles that are happening with the children there. It's actually on his second trip to Korea that things really begin to move forward. He's actually in the streets of Korea.

It was a very chilly day, but he's got his coat kind of hung over his arm. And a kid runs by and snatches his coat and takes off. Everett's used these kind of little petty crimes being from Chicago. And so he dashes. He's wanting his coat. It's chilly outside. So they're kind of like they end up in what he called like a little shantytown. The kid ditches the coat.

Everett walks over, peels up the coat, and finds underneath the coat this shivering little child. He runs, he gets soup, he gets blankets, he comes back, tries to comfort this child, and then dozens more children arrive in the place. And he's seeing that this is, you know, not a thing, but this is all over the city. This is all over Seoul.

And so, that's kind of the beginning of him coming to some awareness of this. It actually snowed that night. He was continuing to pray for these children.

He goes back to the same location the next day, and he finds that some of these children had actually passed away, were being put on trucks and taken away. And it's just this, I mean, it's just blowing his mind in the worst way, seeing all of this. He's about to travel back to America, and a Korean pastor stops him and says,

Now that you've seen the tremendous need and opportunity, what are you going to do? Oh, yes. And that's where we get the title of the book. What are you going to do? This becomes the question that changes the course of Everett's life. Mm-hmm.

And this all began then in his heart and with those trips there. It didn't begin as Compassion, though. That wasn't the name of the organization to begin with. Yeah, it started as the Everett Swanson Evangelistic Association, which, you know, Billy Graham had the Billy Graham Evangelistic Association. So there's clearly kind of a model that Everett's using kind of early. Yeah, it's not until 1963 that

Actually, very close to the end of Everett's life when he takes that name off and they change it to Compassion. Compassion was something that he had used at the top of these letters that would go out, these pamphlets and different things. So Compassion was already becoming synonymous kind of with the work they were doing.

And he realized, too, that in order for this organization to go long beyond him, it probably needed to have his name stripped of it. And it was really kind of a show of how humble a character he is. He was not somebody who trumpeted what he was doing or any accomplishments. So it's very fitting that he took his name off and that it became Compassionate. Did he immediately begin asking Americans for support the way that Compassionate asks for support today, sponsoring children today?

Did that start out that way? There was a little bit of an evolution to that. After he was asked this, what are you going to do? You know, he's flying back to America. He's got that rolling in his head. What are you going to do? What are you going to do? Lands in Seattle and he goes to see his brother, Ray, who's working for Moody at the time.

And he goes to a local church, he speaks there, and instead of giving one of his traditional sermons, he tells everybody about these atrocities that he's seen in Korea. At the end of the day, you know, after he's spoken and talked to people, the pastor walks up to him with this check, hands him this check, and says,

And he's like, Everett, a woman came to me a couple weeks ago. She'd written out this check for $50 and said that it needed to go to be able to help in Korea. That becomes the first $50 to ever go to Compassion.

He gets home, his wife Miriam is waiting, and she says, Everett, a check just came for $1,000 from a couple farmers in Nebraska who want to be able to help with what's going on in Korea. So there's some early money there, but it's not too long after that the sponsorship model comes into effect. Everett had seen it being used in very limited effect in other places before.

And so Compassion is one of the first organizations to use it. And that really does help Compassion to flourish and also just to create this deep connection between people in the United States, you know, couples and families together.

And a child overseas where they're able to have pictures go back and forth and letters go back and forth. And even presents, you know, people were able to send presents directly to their children. In fact, I had the opportunity to meet with a woman here in Tennessee who grew up in one of these orphanages.

Her sponsor family was here in the U.S., and they would send gifts. And she had these. She had small little dresses and little presents. I mean, they were just treasures to her. They were, like, so precious. So, yeah, it's this sponsorship model that begins to make these deep connections between people in the U.S. and these children in Korea. Well, it really is a story of faith, the way this all began with Everett Swanson. Yeah.

As you research the book, what were some of the early obstacles that he faced either on this side of the world or in Korea itself?

Um, it's mind blowing to me that he was able to get this operation off the ground and, and nothing short of miraculous the way things came together. Um, this was, there was no social media, there were no podcasts, there were no kind of easy, simple ways for him to effectively get out the word about what was happening in, in a mass kind of way. Um, we see that he is going from church to church. He, he became a filmmaker. He was a photographer. He was able to take pictures.

these photos, this film, and

things like that and able to show them in all these different churches. Interesting. Yeah, that's kind of what Compassion does now, isn't it? Oh, totally. I mean, you know, as you probably have been to a concert where, you know, there's maybe something kind of at the intermission time where they show some photos and you have the ability to sponsor a show. That's really exactly how Everett started with everything. And we're just getting started with this conversation, which will continue with Matt Brown-Louis coming up on this edition of First Persons.

Here's Ed Cannon on the Vision for FEBC's weekly podcast. The primary purpose of Until All Have Heard, of course, is to share the experience that FEBC has because we have staff on the ground in so many oppressive places. But in addition to that, we're trying to speak to you in a way that only the kind of testimonies you'll hear from around the globe can do. Discover how the gospel is making a difference around the world.

Search for Until All Have Heard on your favorite podcast platform or hear it online at febc.org.

My guest is Matt Bronley-Whee. Matt is, by the way, not so trivial trivia is that Matt was one of the founders of Jars of Clay. That's true. The Christian band. Goes back a few years now, Matt, but congratulations on the start of that. And you've become an author since then as well, a producer, songwriter. So you've got quite a resume. Yeah, yeah. Jars started in college, which was really fun. It was my roommate was Charlie Lowell, who's the keyboard player.

And Dan Hasseltine and Steve Mason were in the room next door. So, yeah, that was a really special time getting to start that. And it was really the very, very beginning of my music career. But you've never written a biography like this before, have you? Yeah, writing a biography was really different for me. This took a tremendous amount of research and investigation to find out more about

the Compassion Office here in the US and the Compassion Office in Korea were both tremendously helpful in providing access to their archives,

access to their photos that they had, to film that they had, all these different things. So, you know, going through these old letters and getting to open up his old journals and all these things were just tremendous resources to be able to begin to put this together. I should also note, too, I had a researcher in Korea. You know, when I was doing a lot of this, this was during COVID, I couldn't go over to Korea. Right.

So I was very reliant upon the people there in order to help me. In fact, in some ways it kind of felt to me like it was mimicking a little bit of Everett's early story. You know, Everett was gathering funds here in the United States, but the,

the work was happening in Korea. You know, the people, the people of Korea were helping these children. He was being able to bring over funds, uh, doing whatever he could in order to help them. So it was interesting because it's like, I just had a touch of that in that I was reliant upon, um, these very sweet and kind Korean people in order to gather research for me and interviews for me, um, to learn more about what had happened back then. Yeah.

Well, as the years have gone by, I know there have been several presidents of Compassion International. Wes Stafford is well known to us. I know he's retired now and Jim is the president currently. But was it under Everett that Compassion branched out then to other parts of the world or did that come later?

Yeah. So during Everett's days, everything was very focused on Korea. However, we do see in the 60s, he's beginning to look at some different places. I believe India was one of the places he was looking at. There were a few other countries that they were beginning to look at.

But it's really not until Everett's passing in 1965 and after that that we see Compassion begin to operate in these different countries. Now, you know, today they're actually in 29 countries. There's like 14 field offices and over 2.3 million children a year are being helped. So it's just...

amazing to see from this little fledgling company back in 1952 to where it is today is just an astounding and miraculous growth. Yeah. Well, we typically focus on personal testimonies and calling on this program, but I do enjoy going back into history and retelling the stories of some of these wonderful Christians from the past who did such remarkable things. And he's

Everett Swanson is certainly one of them, and I'm glad you've brought the book to us today. Did he receive much cooperation from the government of Korea, or was it primarily the churches that cooperated? What was the level of cooperation?

We see that later as the operation is going along, in the late 50s and early 60s, he's getting medals. He got an honorary doctorate from a university in Korea. And we see on the governmental level, there's so much admiration and appreciation for what he's doing. I think it grew over the years. Like most things,

I'm sure there was a certain amount of suspicion in the beginning. What is this American doing? What is he doing trying to bring over money and help people? There's some motivation here that is unseemly or whatever. But I think it just became apparent over the years as so many children are being helped and getting into these better situations.

And that appreciation for Everett carries on today. I know that in Korea, there's a lot of respect for what Everett did in partnership with the Korean people. Mm-hmm.

Well, let's spend a few minutes with your personal reactions to what you've learned through all this research and this familiar family connection you've had that you discovered with Everett Swanson. Give me some of your personal reactions and challenges that maybe you draw from this man's life. You know, it's interesting. The book's title is What Are You Going to Do?

that wasn't the first thing that stood out. I mean, it took a while digging into the story and finding out more that this question began to really emerge. And it's interesting too in its connection to at Compassion headquarters, Compassion International here, they'll talk about both Big C Compassion and Little C Compassion. Big C Compassion being the

the organization and their connection to sponsorship for children and everything. Little c compassion, meaning just what are the ways that compassion intersects with our daily lives? What opportunities do we have? And so I think this question of what are you going to do just was the fact that Everett came across this and reacted in a way that wasn't small, that redirected the entire course of his life.

you know, I, I couldn't help but wonder like, would I do the same? Would I not like, what would I have done in that situation? And then also though, to look at like my daily life and say like, well, what are the little things that happen that where I do have, uh, as was put then like, uh,

There's a need and an opportunity. I just thought that was so interesting, too, whenever it was posed this question, what are you going to do, that it was posed as a need and opportunity. You know, these difficulties that we come across in life, that they're actually opportunities, that's something that really can hit me hard. You know, do I, when a friend reaches out and needs something, what's my reaction? You know, do I just want to get on with my day? Right?

So I think I've been really challenged, but also more than that, inspired by Everett and what happened. So through this process, I've gotten to know David Swanson, who was Everett's eldest son. He's 85. I talk to him often still, and it's just been amazing to see...

this journey to go on this journey with him. I mean, obviously he had all kinds of stories about his dad and little things that he noticed about his dad, funny stories. Uh, like he had a funny story about Everett. Everett was, um,

talking to one of the people that went to his church and this man had some cigarettes or something and Everett wasn't quite sure about that. And he said, well, Everett, you're addicted to something too. He was talking about the nicotine. And Everett was like, well, what are you talking about? He's like, well, you drink coffee. You're a coffee drinker. You're addicted to caffeine. And

And Everett stopped drinking coffee just to like, kind of like prove up, like kind of send a message. Sure. Yeah. And so he began to drink post them, which was like a coffee substitute. That's right. Yeah. So,

So there were just kind of these funny stories that David had. But just, I think the opportunity for him to talk about this man that he just dearly loved and dearly appreciated. And, you know, sadly, like I think most of our time is swallowed up with

information about celebrities that maybe aren't so admirable. You know, that's oftentimes what we're reading about. And I think as Eric and I were talking kind of in the early talks about this and then with David as well, just the opportunity to talk about someone who really did something good. You know, the exit of his life is like ushering forth this organization, Compassion, that is going to have a tremendous influence years and years and years later.

Would you or any of the other researchers behind this book have had much contact with the children who benefited from Everett Swanson International Ministries or later Compassion? We did have some interaction. It was limited. There's not...

Even though they do have some names and things like that, not all the information has been able to be capped in terms of being able to reach out to these people again. However, in the book we have some amazing stories of some of the people who were either involved with helping at an orphanage or were brought to an orphanage. Again, there was this woman here in the States

um, Kathy Carey, who was able to talk all about her time. She actually was a really interesting one in that she was at an orphanage, uh, had the opportunity to see Everett one time as he came and walked through the orphanage. Um,

But then she became part of a Korean orphan singing group that Compassion brought over to the United States. I see. Okay. Eventually, she was actually adopted by a family here, ended up in the United States. But yeah, we were very lucky in that. I mean, I will say, though...

I think one of the reasons this book and this story needed to happen now was that we're losing these people. You know, a tremendous amount of people who were alive then and knew things have already passed away. So I just felt this... I don't want to say pressure, but just like I was working as fast as I could to try and get a hold of stories, to try and connect with people. Because it just seemed like...

in not too long, all this information would be lost. That's true, and I often think of that myself as we occasionally reach back here on First Person to tell at least a few of those stories. You've been listening to guest Matt Brown-Louis talk about the life of Evangelist Everett Swanson, whose heart was moved by the plight of the world's children to start the ministry now known as Compassion International.

There's more information on our webpage, firstpersoninterview.com. There you can also re-listen to this interview or hundreds of previous conversations, all at firstpersoninterview.com. Another international ministry that has a long history of reaching souls for Christ is the Far East Broadcasting Company. FEBC's history of faithfulness to the gospel is also an inspiring story, and you can read about it when you visit febc.org.

Now, with thanks to my friend and producer, Joe Carlson, I'm Wayne Shepherd. Thanks for listening to First Person. First Person.