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When I'm on the road, Dana, I'm always pretty much staying in hotels, but there's been a shift to Airbnb and you hear about it all the time. Hotels are fine. They can be great, but Airbnb is a great alternative because you get a lot of choices of where you can stay. It's very practical. I mean, hotel can be like, oh, like when I go on the road, I go, that one's

The closest hotel is a half hour from the gig or something, but you say, Oh, Airbnb, just go, Oh, I want to go a little closer. I want to be in this area. I want a swimming pool and I want this. Yes. And I famously have said many times a place we used to go, my wife and I to get away and we stayed at some really nice hotels, but then we found this Airbnb, which we used, I think three times is always spotless. The keys are outside in a little padlock and they used to have a bottle of wine and a note. And, uh,

You have a kitchen and it was very, very nice. The benefits of Airbnb is that space, privacy, better locations compared to hotels. You get to pick how close you want to be to wherever you want to go. You're traveling with family, your friends, you're on your own. It's

It's great.

Play Chumba Casino today. No purchase necessary. VGW Group. Void where prohibited by law. 18 plus. TNCs apply. Our guest today is Kiwi Kwan. Ki has an amazing story. So you really want to listen to this podcast. And I never say that. I'm not a salesman, but he has an amazing story. He just was in school. His family came from Vietnam and he was just in school in L.A. And they said, hey, there's a movie auditions and boom, Indiana Jones, The Temple of Doom.

And then later on, he gets into Goonies. He has this nice little run. And then the story gets more dramatic there. David? It's very complicated. It's very... It's more of a story of a hard luck story, the way that happens in Hollywood. But this one has a happy ending. And it doesn't always happen that way, but it's a guy that's really persevered and tried and hung in there and had good people around him and really...

zero ego, lots of talent, and just a good dude to talk to. And he has...

Very inspiring to hear him talk about literally anything. Yes. And this episode will get into romance and the support of his spouse. It's pretty moving. And just about as nice a person it's ever been on our shows. He's got a new movie called Love Hurts. Love Hurts is out in theaters, actually. He was in Everything, Everywhere, All at Once, which was Academy Award bait.

And I think he won. We'll let them find out. I think. Yeah, we'll let them find out. Listen to this as you drive, garden, go to the gym, or if you're doing the dishes. Thank you. Anyway, here he is. What a great dude. And hope you have a nice listen. We sure had a nice time talking to him.

First of all, I gotta geek out a little bit. I cannot believe I'm talking to both of you. I've been a massive, massive fan of both of your work. In fact, talking to you right now, it's very intimidating. Because you guys are so funny.

You guys are so funny. I wish my Goonies brother, Jeff Cohen, a.k.a. Chuck, is here with me because he's very funny. You know it's funny. First of all, thank you very much for that. And you don't have to be funny. You don't have to be anything here. No, you don't have to be anything. The stakes are good.

over talking as one of our skill sets notice I'm doing it right now yeah if you get on a roll we will stop you so don't yeah we won't even put any there's no pressure for you to do it but you know Dana I didn't see Goonies when it came out this is so crazy and I the other night it was on and I'm like oh this is Goonies that literally every person in the world has seen and so I started watching it and they're in some underwater cave and there's some cave and they're trying to dig out of the mud is that Goonies that's it right

There's a cave. And how old were you when you saw it? You didn't say that as a kid. I'm old now. I'm 104. But when I saw it, it was one week ago. I was old in the 80s. So I saw it old. I was old then. So I saw it. It was great. Yeah.

And did you like it? Cause it's one of those movies where like you watch it as a kid and you grow up with it. And then you ended up like that being your favorite movie. I wonder like, what's it like to watch it as an adult? It's fun because it's nostalgic the way I used to like movies. So it just threw me back to being that age going, this is exactly what I would like. This is,

like a fun and all the kids are acting goofy and people are after them. And it just, yeah. How I missed it, I don't know, but I just thought, oh, this is why everyone likes it. You can tell in five minutes of watching it that it's got a good vibe. I think it's had resonance, you know, with Stranger Things. And it's an important movie. It's part of that zeitgeisty. And I think it was mimicked a lot, you know, but it's just fun. Kids on Adventure, caves, bad guys. I mean, it's just fun.

Yeah, it's the greatest story of all time for a kid. I mean, to find a treasure map and go on this incredible adventures with your friends where you go down water slides and

and you step on booby traps and, and, you know, and you come upon this like, you know, full size Irish ship. It was just, it was an incredible experience for me and for all the Goonies. And you're with your buddy. I mean, it's, it just shows kids together and that's your dream. Like you do something fun and you're with your friends and Steven Spielberg is the boss. Yeah. He's the head Goonie. And, and of course, you know, Dick Donner did an incredible job and,

allowing us to be kids. You know, if you watch that movie, we were constantly just talking over one another and that in the back thing, you don't do that. Sure. You're trained to like, wait until you, you know, the other actor finished talking before you say your line. But from day one, we were all hams.

well we could not wait to to to say our lines and uh and of course it drove the you know the sound guy crazy but dick donald was laughing the entire time uh behind the monitors because you know that's what kids are that's what they do yeah he had a moving master shot then a lot of the time with you guys i assume if you're all overlapping like a

Yeah, oh yeah, we did master shots, we did coverage, we did the whole thing. And Dick loves to shoot with multiple cameras. For example, when we did the pirate ship, the very first time we saw the pirate ship was captured on camera. You might have heard this story before, but when they were building the ship on stage 16 on the Warner Brothers lot, Spielberg and Donner

Placed a security camera right by the door and they closed that giant gate so nobody could see what was happening inside. Built the ship. And when it was ready to film it, they, you know, they blindfolded us and we were walking backwards being escorted by the crew. And Dick had seven cameras pointing at us.

And we got underwater. We hear action. We pop up and turned around. And what you see in the movie is the very first time that we saw the pirate ship. And it was incredible. It was an amazing sight. So smart. I think better of Richard Donner than I always did. You know, to not only land Superman, the last great Superman, although there's one coming out.

Brilliant movie with Brando and Christopher Reeves. So then he altered his shooting style to accommodate kids. And so that's probably a big reason why it just pops. It's not stilted. It flows. I'm fascinated. I never heard that. Lethal Weapon, too. And The Omen? Yeah, The Omen. Lethal Weapon, Scrooge with Bill Murray. Oh, I remember that. I remember that.

Yeah. He's just, he's such a versatile filmmaker. Yeah. I auditioned for him once. I don't know if you ever had any auditions where you didn't get the part. He, but I auditioned for Richard Donner for some movie in the early eighties.

and I had no experience. We were supposed to pretend we were crawling in a cave or something. Maybe it was Goonies. You do the audition and they're like, well, okay, that's good. You want me to do anything else? No, we're good. Thank you. What about the other five scenes? Nope, we're just, we're going to do one today. That's it. We got a good feel for you. You had Richard, you had Spielberg and then you had Richard Donner. That's a prelude.

a pretty good start yeah i i saw that i'll tell you the story about dick donner uh your love uh i did goonies with them and this was many years later maybe in 1990 uh most of the time i was just an unemployed actor uh and there was this role that came in it was it was a um

a role for an episode of Tales from the Crypt. Oh, yeah. It was a show that he produced. HBO. But he didn't direct, it was HBO. And this was like maybe like

And a year and a half, I haven't worked. And my agent called me and says, hey, you know, there's this role, Taylor Smith Cripp, you know, it's, you know, you're one of the guys. It's very Goonies-esque, but, you know, in the horror genre. And I said, yeah, I'd love to go on an audition. So I auditioned for the producer.

He wasn't there. He didn't know about it. I auditioned for the producer and the director at that time. And when he found out that I went in and auditioned, he told him, he says, give him the part. Give him the part. It doesn't matter whether he's right or not. What a sweetheart. Very sweet. And then sure enough, a week later, my agent told me I got the role and it had everything to do with Donner.

That's how nice he is. Wow. Yeah, I mean, it's good to have a good experience too. You know, like you get this Spielberg film. Did you have any experience or is it completely let's try out for a movie? Or had you done something before in Dan Jones?

No, no, nothing. I was, you know, this was 1983. I just immigrated to the United States. Four years, I can barely speak English. I was busy being a kid, you know, trying to acclimate, you know, into my new life. I was living in Chinatown, Los Angeles at that time. It was just a very small Chinese community. Yeah, and I was busy going to school and living out my new life. And then one day,

the casting director and his associate came to my elementary school.

To your school? How great. Yeah. They were just interviewing all the kids that the casting director thought might be right for the role of Short Rap. I knew nothing about it. I didn't even want... I mean, being an actor was the last thing I ever wanted. I was busy doing homework and learning English. Sure.

And I don't know what I did then. My brother went to audition. I tagged along and literally the very next day,

I got a call from Spielberg's office. What? And she said, you know, we would like you to come in and meet with Steve and George. I didn't know who they were. I didn't have a car back then. Who were those creeps? The entire family. We didn't have a car. We live in Chinatown. And we can get by just walking to everywhere. And when they heard that I couldn't go to their office, they said, don't worry. We're going to send you a driver.

A driver. You're 13 and the day before you were just in class. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're nervous. Like, am I short enough? Am I round enough? Yeah. And that's, and that's how it all started. Uh, it was, it was, it was crazy, but it was, it was the best thing that has ever happened. Oh my gosh. That was such a huge movie too. Can I just ask you a question? So when you're in the classroom and they go, okay, read for a movie, are you holding a script or are they just feeding you stuff and seeing your personality? I'm just curious. Did you,

how did that first reading go just well they they they had a setup in the gym okay with cameras and so all the kids were just like you know sitting and waiting for their name to be called uh i went into this little room where they had like a camera setup and person to read with us uh there was sites they gave us sites and and i can barely understand any of it i didn't know

What in India? I don't even know India's name or a person. This was a sequel to one of the biggest movies. You just thought it was a state, Indiana. Yeah. And then, you know, of course, I mean, I fumbled. I was bad at it. I didn't know what I was saying. But luckily, the casting director saw something.

and asked me to put the sides away and say, "Key, I just want to talk to you for a few minutes." - Yeah. That's more like it, to see what you're like. - Yeah, to see what I was like, ask me how old I was, how I got to the States, and what's my family like, what's my favorite subject. And so I answered everything. Little did I know, years later, the casting director told me that the minute I walked out the door,

He calls Steven Spielberg and says, "We don't have to look anymore. We found your kid." That was pretty amazing. Wow. I'm just curious. I don't know what economic strata your family was at at this point. What did they pay you for this movie? Did it change the dynamic? What was that like? Did you just get union scale? Any scale is huge for someone who doesn't have money, right?

Dana, that's a great question. We were broke. My parents literally gave everything they had to get all of us, the entire family. My family is a total of 11 people. My parents had nine kids. So they gave up everything they had to get all of us here in the United States. So by the time we got here, they lost everything and they were heavily in debt.

And here comes this movie. I didn't have an agent. I was not a member of Screen Actors Guild. I didn't have a lawyer to look after me. So whatever they gave me, whatever contract agreement they gave me to sign, we just signed it. Of course. Yeah. And it was not until later, one, I was paid a very generous salary.

But what was even more incredible was that they made me a profit participant. What? No. Without asking, without asking, without lawyers protecting me, without agents asking. It's never, you do, you know. You never get profit participant unless you really fight for it. And this is why I'm so grateful to them because

knowing that Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom is going to be the biggest movie in 1984, and yet they're still so generous and still so willing to make me a profit participant.

And when the movie came out, sure enough, that very first check that came in was big enough where I didn't have to, you know, our parents didn't have to rent a tiny homes for all of us. I was I was able to afford to buy a bigger house for all of us to live in. And sure enough, not only it changed my life, but it changed all of my family's life.

Unreal. So, I mean, this is sort of inside baseball, but you know that you get, sometimes you'll get net points on a movie, they call it, but the movie says we've never made a profit, but it's Spielberg, it's Indiana Jones at its peak. So I assume that, yeah, you got actual checks and they kept coming.

I got checks. I get statements sent to me every quarter. And what is it? 40 years later, 40 years later, I'm still getting a nice check every year. I mean, really, it's so incredible to think back. I was just a 12-year-old kid.

My God, you would have done it for a new baseball net. My first jobs when I was 20, I would do it for you. You don't even ask. You don't want to get fired. You're like, what are you paying me? I don't even ask. Just please. The thing I thought you were heading towards was not only do you get, let's say you get scale. Let's say you do something and it's back then. $1,500 a week. $1,500 a week. $800 a week. Fine. But the trick is you get residuals. Yeah.

If you don't know that, and I remember I did an old Police Academy movie. Oh, a couple of people remember? Thank you. I remember, David. I love that movie. I love Police Academy movies. So that was my first one. I played a skateboarder. And then I did it, and I got obviously enough money for me. I loved it, whatever it was. And then six months later, I was driving from L.A. to Arizona.

And I went to the little skinny mailbox with the key and you open it up at your apartments and check for like 2,800 bucks. I don't know where. And it was because it got sold to HBO or it was residual. I was like, wait, you get money after I could not believe it. And then I kept getting little dibs and dabs and then you do a sitcom and then you get a check. And I'm like, that's where actors kind of stay alive. So you got that. And.

profit participation. So what a, what a, that's the real treasure movie. I gotta say, you know, I mean, after Goonies, I,

I've been very open about this during those times when I couldn't get a job, when I couldn't get work as an actor and I was just struggling. I was either in school or those checks were huge. They were, you know, they were really, when, when they, when their check came in, I mean, it was such a big help economically. And I'm sure you don't sound like you live like a crazy life. Like if you're living, like,

Like most of it, just trying to live a normal life and just get by those checks really help cover almost everything. You don't need a lot because you're not spending a lot. So it's great to get that. Keep you afloat. I love it.

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Back in the day, just for a sec, because I came from not as big a family. There are five of us and stuff. And I just wondered if the dynamic of what happened to you, were you starting to get recognized? Or did your mom and dad say, okay, you can get a new bicycle? Was there anything? Or it just went to them and everything went along as usual? Or was there any change in the dynamic with your siblings? That you're a star. Yeah.

my, my, my parents are very strict, you know, the, the, the very traditional Chinese, uh, value parents. Um, and everybody treating me like, like, like, you know, I was not a star, not an actor. Um, um,

So I think, I think because of that, because of my upbringing, I was very grounded and I never allowed my fame to get to my head. But of course that time, I mean, those were big movies. So wherever I go, I go out, people will recognize me. People will come up for pictures, for autographs. And,

And my siblings would just, you know, smile and be proud. They're very proud of me. Yeah. That's so healthy. That's so nice. That's so great to hear. It was normal for horrible people. It is.

And the thing is, you know, there's no jealousy because they don't want to be actors. You know, the very, you know, all of them want to be in business. They're very business savvy, kind of like taking after my parents. My dad was a successful businessman. Yeah. That's why you moved out here. No one came to act, right? You didn't come out to act. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Nobody, none of us wanted to be actors. Yeah, just a happy accident.

Yeah. So that's why I feel like I'm adopted in some way. I'm so different from my siblings. Where is the premiere? I'm guessing it was at the Chinese theater because it's such a big place for a premiere. You know what's incredible? Or Westworld. Or the Dome. Okay. So 40 years ago, uh,

We premiered Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom at the Man Chinese Theater. Yeah. All right. And it was also on the same day that I witnessed the

Steven Spielberg and George Lucas got their very own hand and footprint ceremony. I was a kid. I was just blown away. I go, wow, what is this? Like they must be really special to have their still don't know in this theater. Yeah, that's nice. Come February 3rd.

I'm gonna be honored with my very own Hand and Footprint ceremony. Man Chinese Theater. And we're gonna be premiering Love Hurts at the same place.

Oh, it's such a it's such a full circle moment. It's so surreal. I cannot believe it. That is for people don't know about Hollywood and having your handprints and footprints. That's better than a star. I think it's it's for my age. I mean, it's Cary Grant. It's John Wayne. I mean, it's the greatest stars in the world.

in the world. So, and now here you are, um, you know, we're kind of going along with your resume here, but yeah, you do have a new movie coming out that you star in. And I watched the trailer. It's out February 7th. Love hurts. And, uh, it looks just great. It's the kind of movie I love. And in the trailer I noticed, cause I know that,

If you had a stunt double, maybe you did or not, but you're really moving well. And I love the notion of a movie of a reluctant hero. You know, it's not like you're Steven Seagal or something. Please don't make me do my thing. And then here it is without giving it away. That conceit is so much fun. But just for a second, did you study Taekwondo? Did you do all your own stunts or what was that like being that physical again now that you're not 13 anymore?

I did study Taekwondo. In fact, it was right after Temple of Doom. I was trained in Temple of Doom for a week to do that fight at the end of the movie. And I fell in love with it. And I came back to the States and my brother and I enrolled ourselves in Taekwondo classes. And I studied for many years. I got a black belt.

And during that entire time, I really loved watching those Hong Kong 80s action movies with Jackie Chan and Samuel Hall. That's what it reminded me of. The movements. And those movies, you can clearly see that it's the actors doing all the fights up on the screen. There's just something real and there's something at stake there.

that when you know that it's them and it's not just some stunt double. Yeah. So much easier to shoot too. And so for this movie, Love Hurts, I want to distinguish between stunts and fights. Stunts, I,

I don't do stunts. That is a very specific skill that these stunt guys trade heavily for. And to me, stunts is falling off buildings, getting hit by a car or being set on fire. Those are very dangerous stuff. Put their lives on the line to make us look good. What I can do well are fights and fights involve like punches and kicks.

falling off to the ground, selling a hit. It's not easy to sell a hit. It's much harder than it looks. You probably get hit a lot. Huh? You probably get hit a lot because it's so hard to get it perfectly right because you want it so close.

that it looks real, but I'm sure sometimes there's, there's mistakes. Yeah. It's scary to sell a hit. And also you have to snap your head back. That's hard for your neck. Over and over again. Over and over again. And then your body has to like, like, like being it, uh,

I remember the first fight we did with Marshawn Lynch. And, you know, he's a big guy. Marshawn Lynch. Oh, yeah. And the scene starts with him and Andre, the other actor. They're both killers. They come in and they take me and they just beat the shit out of me. I saw that. In the beginning, like for the first like half a day, all I did was just reacting to punches, you know, left and right, up and down. Shit. I woke up the next day, I can barely move my neck. Of course.

Of course. And I had to ask production to get me a physical therapist. But it's a lot of work. It's really demanding. But once when you said put together, it's also extremely satisfying. Did I read that you...

in some of the slower times between jobs, you were teaching fights or is that crazy? I was choreographing. I worked on a movie with Hugh Jackman called The X-Men. A Hong Kong director named Koi Yuan kind of took me under his wings when I graduated from film school. And all those skills that I acquired from martial arts, when I was young, I was like,

I was so excited because I thought I would be able to use those in movies. I thought, you know, Hollywood would hire me to be the next action hero. But, you know, that didn't happen. And I had to put my skills away for many years, never thinking that I would have to call upon them again. So this is it's been such a surreal experience.

uh, uh, uh, feeling for me to be able to do love hurts and especially to be the number one, uh, on the call sheet for this movie. Um, it's, it's fascinating. Your, your story. I just, I don't know if anyone quite has your story and, you know, getting the Oscar in 2022, uh,

and now becoming an action hero, just the arc of this is so fascinating. And just for a second, mentally for you, I know you kept busy and got your residual checks, but those 19 years wondering when it would happen again for you, how did you manage that? And was it difficult at times? Did you ever feel discouraged or did you sort of anticipate somewhere in your subconscious like,

It's coming for me because now you're headlining an action film that looks incredible and you've got the best supporting actor, Oscar. It's just such a story. How do you process this? You know, I wish I can say it was easy. I went through a range of emotions. I was frustrated. I was confused. I was sad. I was despondent. I was miserable. And of course, as the years went by,

any hope of like this happening just grows dimmer and dimmer. But I mean, honestly, I don't think I would be here without my wife. She is my lucky charm. She is my everything. She's the one for some reason, believe in me and saw all of this. She saw all of this happening and this, and we're talking about,

20, starting 20 years ago, we've been together 20, 22 years now. So for 22 years, she kept saying, you know, you're going to be successful again one day. And in the beginning, it was really, you know, it was really inspiring. It was really uplifting. I'm with this girl that I love and she believes that I'm going to be somebody one day.

And she has such a great eye. Over the years, every time she tells me that this person is going to be successful, it happens. But at the same time, it was frustrating for me is because she truly believed, she believed in me more than anybody. And yet it wasn't happening for me. It was happening for other people that she pointed out. It gives me anxiety just thinking about it. It's such a long story.

Yeah, it was it was hard. It was hard. And I and I felt like, man, if one day I don't.

You know, if this doesn't happen, I'm going to disappoint her. She's not going to love me anymore. She's going to leave me. She's going to say, oh, my gosh, I placed a bet on the wrong guy. I mean, of course, she's not that kind of person. But that's what was going through my head for a long time. And I was just scared. I was really scared. That's so fascinating. Here's the one word.

that it seems like just talking to you now, not something that's in your personality, but it's very common in show business. And that, and I met a lot of people with bitterness. I got screwed. The business let me down. It's not my fault. You know, and you didn't use that word a minute ago. You used despondent, discouraged, embarrassed, but not bitter. And I think because if you get bitter, uh,

you really lessen your chances of getting lucky because no one likes an ungrateful, bitter person. You have to really guard for that. So did you ever feel those emotions or you just stay kind of humble in a way? You know, it's how I was taught and how I grew up. I never once, believe it or not, never once did I feel bitter and never once did I blame anybody but myself.

I didn't blame the system. I didn't blame, oh, you know, there was just not enough

Rose for Asians to go around. I I didn't think any of that. I just felt that oh, maybe I was too short Maybe I was in you know, wasn't a good enough actor. That's why I was role You know the world went a better after than me. Uh, I never here's the thing who's I was talking about the difference between envy and jealousy and and tell me if you guys agree with this and

Like when I see somebody doing really well up on this screen or have tremendous talent, I always go, oh, wow, I wish I have that. So I envy them for having that talent or that success, but I'm never jealous of them. And I think jealousy brings you down versus envy encourages you to keep going and to not give up hope. I never, yeah, I never, I never...

felt better. I always have been from day one. And it's still my touchstone. I, my dream was to make as much doing standup in these little clubs as I made as a waiter. So my goal was really back then when I got to making an average of maybe 600 a month,

okay, I took off the waiter's apron and I felt gratitude ever since. I always go back to that because it's not promise for anyone. I call it, it can be an emotionally violent career as opposed to being a grade school teacher or whatever that's more consistent. But I think that's why when Everything Everywhere All at Once came up, you were just ready because you did not, and that's just a great lesson for anyone listening to this who's an aspiring actor is,

never, never go to that jealousy or bitterness. It'll just eat you alive and make you take your talent away. So it's hard though. It's hard not to sometimes human place. You don't know where to place the blame or what's going on. And you're like, I'm a good person. Everyone I think has gone through that. Yeah. It's not easy. That's why like during those times, you really need somebody who believes in you. Uh, I was very lucky. I had my wife, uh,

God knows if she was if I wasn't with her, where would I be today? I, you know, I don't even know if I if I would have the courage to continue. So that's why it's important to have, you know, friends who believe in your family. I have a great family. They've been they've been so supportive.

And also, you know, over the years too, they've tried to, they tried to get me to give up and go to Houston and do business with them. Get a real job. It's time to get out here. Can I ask you just a little bit? I saw you in the movie. Your relationship with your wife is one of the most also romantic things I've, I've heard. And then that is a movie in itself. Just,

Just for a second, was it love at first sight or how did you meet or what was the early courtship and when did you know this is the one for me? Was it pretty much thunderstruck or just talk to that a little bit if you would. It's fascinating. So we used to work for a Hong Kong filmmaker named Wong Kar-wai.

And she was in Shanghai at that time and Wong Kar Wai flew me there to work on a few projects and we met. And from day one, we just we have endless conversation. We never stop talking. We enjoy each other's company and

Yeah, we spent every day, every minute, every hour together during my time in Shanghai. And then when I had to come back to the States and we were separated, all I could think of was her.

And she we didn't have much money at that time. And it was at a time. This is 2002. So she couldn't get a visa to come to the States to visit me. I can only fly back to see her. And and we would talk on the phone all the time. We would you know, we would try to be in touch and I would fly back whenever it was possible. But it was during those times away that I go, God, I don't think I can live without her.

and two years into our dating, into our relationship, I post. The amount of it, whatever our female audience is right now, there's a collective thousands of women saying, aww. Yeah.

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It's just such a great story. I guess as we go forward here, I want to unpack this movie because I think that's what's currently right in front of you. And just how did that come about? What was the phone call like and what did it mean at that moment? Did your wife pick up the phone? I'll get him. Just a moment. It was right during the award season, right before the Oscars.

I think the Oscar nomination came out and then my agent said,

call me says there's a script that came in uh for you they would like to offer you the lead can you read it for the lead wow after 19 years after 19 years it was it was it was the first time i've heard it it was it was the first time i heard it those words those words obviously it's from 87 north from david leach and kelly mccormick now david leach is a big director

Big producer. So is Kelly. So I read it right away. And as I was reading it, I loved it. But then I was like kind of confused because I just don't see myself in this role.

I see actors like Schwarzenegger, Stallone, Jason Biggum, pretty much all your typical action shows except me. I just didn't see it. And so I called my agent the next day. I said, it's a great script, but I think they got the wrong person. So let's just pass very quickly without thinking much about it.

And then I was busy doing interviews and attending awards season. And then it was after I won the Oscar, they came back the second time and they said, can you please reconsider? And at that time I was mentally exhausted. I was just like, I had just gone through this six

six months of award season. I was mentally exhausted, but I did remember the script and I said, it's a great script, but then it's still a pass for me. What? What? Now for the second time. Come on. And it was at a time where it was at a time where like what was incredible was like people were calling and I was getting off. Yes.

And then all of a sudden I got really scared. One, because I've never been in a situation where people offer me roles without any audition. And second, there has been so much love and support that I was so afraid that whatever I was going to do next, I was going to disappoint them. And that was the last thing I wanted to do. And I was at an event with Steven Spielberg.

And we were chatting and he says, Keith, how are you doing? And I said, I'm not doing so good, Stephen. He says, why? And I said, well, I'm having trouble deciding what to do next because, you know, of the success of everything, everyone all at once. I'm really nervous. He says, okay, don't worry about it. Let's grab lunch when we get back to LA. And we did.

And we was doing lunch, and I pitched him the story, and I said, this is Universal Studios' picture. It's theatrical release. And I told him the story, and I told him my reservation, and he stopped me and says, Key, let me tell you, it's great. You should do it. And I go, huh? He says, don't think much. Just do it.

You it's going to turn out great and you're going to love it. And it's going to put you in the leading man category. And again, you know, he also gave me a lot of advice to like if you believe in it yourself, if you do it with with with all your heart and passion, the audience will appreciate for it, whether they like the movie or not. Left that lunch.

And asked my agent to set up a meeting. And I went in, I met with the entire producing team. And also our director, Jojo Eusebio, who is a veteran with action. And it was at that time I realized, wow, all these years I've been conditioned that guys that look like me

You know, cannot be an action hero. And they were also trying to do something different. They were they were trying to change the status quo and to create a new kind of action hero. And immediately I fell in love with it. And I said, yeah, right away, got myself trained. And it was I got to say, it was one of the best decisions I've made in my life.

Well, when you see the playbacks, I don't know, online or when you first started to see it work, you know, because in the trailer, you can really see that you totally believe your character just has this skill set, you know. And I think the one that seems a little bit familiar in the abstract is Bob Odenkirk doing Nobody. He was very, very surprised that he was tapped to be an action star, you know. But it makes sense to me. I think it is kind of cool.

That you're not really built up and stuff, but you just have speed and coordination and smarts with how to win a street fight in a kitchen or whatever with...

anything at your disposal, you know? And I love, I love watching movies where, you know, there is that element of surprise, you know, like if you go watch a movie and the rock beats up 10 guys, it's yeah, of course. I mean, you know, but there's something special about watching someone like me or, you know, or you, I like, you know, I've seen both of your work, you know, where you, you kick ass and go, wow, that's, that's, it's so nice to see that something different. Uh,

Yeah. And, you know, it's that element of surprise. Also that you can literally do it. I mean, it's very lucky that you get a guy that you can play it and you can act. And they're like, the benefit is also...

You don't need to be covered in stunts on every single fight. They're like, this guy can do a lot of it. And that's such a benefit. Helps the movie, helps everybody. And did they know you had a black belt in Taekwondo? They must have looked that up. Yes, they did. Yes, they did. They knew exactly what I was capable of. And even going in, I did tell them and I said, if I'm going to do this, can you let me do all the fights myself? Yeah.

And they say, yes. But of course, that was a big statement for me because I was great when I was 21 years old. Yeah. And nobody wants to put me in an action movie. And now, you know, I'm 54. So I did, you know, I trained with the guys. We had the best action team. We trained for three months getting myself ready. And, you know, and it's everything that I know about making action movies.

I put into this. It's not easy. And you get hurt. Jackie Chan, when he does those action movies, he gets hurt all the time. And in order for a fight to look real,

You can't fake it. You have to, the way I know it is, you know, you really have to go at it. And I went at it with Daniel Wu in the finale. I went at it with Sean Lynch and it was really tough. And every single day I would go back to my apartment and I would soak myself in salt bath, you know, in a salt bath for an hour. I was bruised everywhere. Wow.

And halfway through the movie, I told my wife, I said, you know, I don't think I can do another one. This is it. And then we saw the movie and I go, I call my agent. I said, come on, let's get another one. I can't wait to do it again. Well, it's like surgery once it's over. Did you ever get so excited in a fight scene that you kind of did some damage and then found yourself saying, take that bitch. Like,

Like yelling at the actor? Did you ever lose it? No, no, no. I never get joy from hurting people. Okay, I'm kidding. Dana does. I always make sure, and sometimes accidents do happen. And every time I hit somebody accidentally, my heart just drops. But we have a lot of tough guys. Our stunt guys are really tough. You know, I can...

Kick him all I want. I don't think I would do much damage. They're built for it. Yeah. I'm going to give you a compliment, Kay, real quick. Here we go. He never gives compliments. Never. Oh, wow. I'm so excited. I can't wait to hear it. I'm watching your trailer this morning for Love Hurts, which comes out in theaters, right? February 7th. Theaters. So I stop it about a third of the way through and I like it. I go, I don't want to know anymore.

because I want to go see it. I want to just go watch it happen. I don't want to guess ahead. Right when I'm hooked in, I go, okay. It's right when you're doing the cookies and then Marshawn comes in and I go, okay, I like it. Stop. Because I don't want to know one extra interesting thing. I just want to go see it all.

Oh, wow, David. Thank you. I'm so touched. Thank you so much for that. But that's a good trailer. That shows you. It's like, that's a fun movie. I watched the whole trailer. I watched the whole trailer. It's not a competition, David. I watched the whole thing and I clicked it and I said, that movie is going to do great. That was my blink on it.

And I'm just saying it, and we don't say it to everyone on here promoting the movie, but that is just going to be one of those movies you want to see. Yeah. You know? That's not your typical movie. In the theater.

David, Dana, you just made my month. Getting that compliment from both of you means the world to me. And knowing that you guys are going to go watch it in theater is even more incredible. Thank you. Well, after it hits 100 million, just pop. We have another podcast called Superfly. You could pop in for five minutes.

Yes. I'll tell you. With your wife, we'll say, has he gotten cocky finally? I'm going to beat Dana. I'm going to say I only saw four seconds of the trailer. I'm going backwards now. I only saw...

two seconds of the trailer. And I can name that hit in two seconds. No, I just like the vibe of it. I like you. I think people are coming off of the last one saying interesting. And it's a fun story and you're very sweet, charming, humble guy. And just like, Hey, it's not the rock. And a lot of those, most of those movies are the rock. And so John, I love John wick and I love a lot of this genre, but this is new and it felt new. Um, it,

I grew up watching movies in the 80s where they're like 90 minutes long and you go in and you just enjoy it. It kind of lets you escape reality for

for a little bit. You come out of it feeling a little bit refreshed. So this movie was made for that. One was made for, you know, the audience who love the action genre. And it's kind of an homage to those Hong Kong 80s action movie. And hopefully, yeah, people can just go on a date or with their friends and just have a really good time. Yes. And the job of that film is somewhere in the third act to make you suspend

that maybe the hero won't make it. Maybe he's going to lose this time. And that's the fun of how that's written and how that's made. That's just the fun of the genre, what you don't see coming and how he wins the day.

if he wins the day, I don't know. If he wins the day, we don't know. And I like any excuse to go to the movies again because I don't go enough and it's, you need one to go, oh, let me get out there again. I want to go see a movie out. Yeah, just it's, you don't have to think. You just sit there and enjoy the ride. Those are just really, really fun movies. Um,

The one thing I just wanted to mention was your Oscar acceptance speech, just that it's kind of gone up there, the Hall of Fame. I don't know if you probably answered every question about it. And we kind of know you now a little bit and what it, what it meant, of course, but, um, it really stood out that night in the Oscars, you know, it was like, wow, he's back. Uh, it was, it was one of the most memorable nights of my life. Uh,

It was a night. It was a moment that I dreamt about, I fantasized about for 40 years. Didn't whatever ever happen. I remember when Ariana DeBose and Troy Cutler walked out with the envelope and I'm in my seat. And it feels like you're not breathing. You're just holding your breath.

And I felt like I was holding my breath for not for that night, but for the entire six months since the award season started. 40 years. Yeah. For 40 years. Yeah. And you really don't know until they open the envelope. And when she opened the envelope and announced my name with so much emotion, I was.

I heard it and I couldn't believe it. I wanted to like, it's one of those where, wait, did she say my name? Like, did she say my name? Like, is this real? And once when I realized that it was, you know, this was reality, I fought really hard to fight back the emotions. It was like all those emotions that I had building up in the last 20 years, stepping away and just hoping, just hoping

hoping that someone would give me a chance just came flooding out. Wow. I hear the emotion in your voice. You know, I just wondered because it's success and things like this, you know, in terms of your relationship with your wife after you won the Oscar, was she sort of

more wanting to be more frisky with you, more affectionate when she drank all over you. I'm just kidding. She's, she's making love with an Oscar. It's gotta be different. Just kidding. Just kidding. I remember, I remember I woke up the next day and,

Thinking this was all a dream. I woke up next to her and we looked at each other for a long beat. It was the morning after. And I'm thinking, wait, was that all a dream? I looked at her and I said, honey, did yesterday happen? And she smiled and she says, honey, you are an Oscar winning actor.

And was she holding the Oscar in her arms? We did it. Honey, do we leave the Oscar in In-N-Out? Well, thank you for coming on, buddy. What a great story to talk about. Yeah, really, really enjoyed having you.

David, Dana, thank you so much. I love you guys. I mean, seriously, I love you guys. And this has been such a wonderful chat. Thank you. Thank you, buddy. I look forward to the movie. Yes, yes. Please watch it. And to all your listeners, please go watch it and support our movie in the theaters. It would mean the world to me. Love hurts. Love hurts. Love hurts. Love hurts. February 7th. February 7th. All right. See you, buddy. Nice to meet you. Take care. Enjoy.

This has been a presentation of Odyssey. Please follow, subscribe, leave a like, a review, all this stuff, smash that button, whatever it is, wherever you get your podcasts. Fly on the Wall is executive produced by Dana Carvey and David Spade, Jenna Weiss-Berman of Odyssey, and Heather Santoro. The show's lead producer is Greg Holtzman.