#706 - Douglas Murray - We Need To Stop Listening To These People
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Hello everybody, welcome back to the show. My yesterday is Douglas murray is a journalist, author and associate editor of the spectrum. Or as the turmoil of global events dominates the media, IT can feel as though the world is spiring into chaos if we can't agree on what's happening, how can we make sense of the world and what's the solution? In a post truth existence, expect to learn how Victoria secret betrayed the body positivity movement, why people are struggling to agree on what's true anymore, how the gaze for gaza movement will get on, whether we pass peak weakens, why there is such a huge increase in the spiritual al thinking, what the most recent south park episode has to say about our culture, and much more. But now, ladies and gentleman, please welcome Douglas murry.

You've spent a lot of time studying history and writing about current events at the moment. How would you rate your predictive ability given the current state of the world with the things that you for so coming or things that you ve been particularly surprised by?

Um well, nobody gets to predict with hundred percent accuracy anything because among other things, all the time things happen that you could never seem calling. I could never seen covered coming. I just didn't.

Um so whenever anyone sort boasts about their predictive capabilities, I always think you have to do with a certain amount humility because I mean, things happen all the time. You couldn't see. You gona see round the bend of the road you're coming to.

You can't around the corner. Yeah I mean, some things i've written about for years, particularly in my book, is strange death of europe that came out in twenty seventeen, which I think are sadly uh, coming to position. I say sad because people think that if you predicted something got IT right, you would feel any pleasure.

And that would only be if the thing you are predicting with something you look forward to and what I was predicting with somebody something I was dreading and um that was the transformation of our country of birth, uh, and many other countries in the west due to demographic change. And I mean, every day now, pretty much somebody says to me, gosh, I used to think, what you are saying in the strange death are there now? I right. But IT gives me no pleasure for to say, could I always think, well, if you have agreed back then, some things might not have happened, but so didn't know what they knows, Markstein said, you know, demographics is destiny. So it's one of the things you can predict with the most ease you did.

You have Victoria secrets plan to sexy back on your twenty twenty three bingo card.

Why are vict secrets bring sexy back after .

experimenting with three hundred pound mankins size models, disabled models, trands models, a mail model in a thirty eight year old football player, Victoria secrets have made the controversial decision to switch strategy and start using hot women to model that are underway. Again.

makes commercial sense to my mind. Yeah, that is quite E I, I always mazed vertie complex stuff. Sexy guides. Ff, xy, you sell merchandise is pretty right itself. yeah. I'm not particularly surprised that if fume stick liza in a bikini, it's not as appealing as a bit of sales merchandise. But you know, living, learn, listen, learn.

listen, learn. One of my friends owns a very big clothing company, and for a while they tried. Plus zed models. Yeah, mostly for women, does not much of a body positivity movement for men.

I know I got beer, got skinny.

fat revolution. And he said, we've split us to this into a oblivion big girls on sell clothes. So when you see that when you see a company, you know and summer are making double plus size dildos or whatever.

the the company is .

actively hurting the top line in bottom line to be able to send the right message. And that's all very good up until some shareholder meeting. Well, some seventy year old guy looks at the far right column of an excel sheet and goes, what the fuck this? Yes, and they got known.

You don't understand. It's this really cool new movements. Uh, IT, it's very progressive and he goes, I don't care.

right?

I want more money than we had last year and this is less money than we .

had last year. Yeah I mean, I believe IT all starts off from a good place like some or many things. But look, if you you might agree that no is not a good thing to sell anorexic looking models to Young women and that, yeah okay, let's agree.

But you can you can stop somewhere before more friendly obese. You know, that's where the thought whole thing thing goes wrong of the body positivity thing plus says a place where the body positivity shouldn't occur to be. I mean, if somebody is so morbid obese, there is a significant risk of heart failure.

You shouldn't celebrate them. You should say hanging on a minute, steady on the donuts. But they don't say that they just they they run all away. I wish you could just have sort of healthy looking women are on the ad, and I just draw the line there. But as ever, sort of line until you say something, branches and back and I think branches and back is Normally, as you say.

the bottom line. Yeah i've been thinking about this kind of performative ama thy point for a while got this idea. I need to mean IT Better. But I think something like um short term empathy or the shallow pond empathy have been thinking about what is most popular in culture at the moment is something that optimism for. It's immediately to signal that you are a good guy to a good girl no, even if that at the expense of the ultimate outcome for the person.

So let's say you're able to do something giving the child ice cream IT may be what IT wants right now IT may be bad for IT long term but if you're the ice cream promoted for the Young children, you will be seen as a good person uh and if you're the person who saying, hang on a second, that's not what you want long term. Maybe responsibility in Petersen language, maybe not casual sex in Lewis Perry language, maybe you not as much food as you want. In body positivity language, you're seen as judical because .

is no countervAiling ce in the culture, the unlimited empathy people have run a long way very fast because as you say, there's a short term gain to be seen to be being ampthill celebrate self um but ordinary you would have some other counterforce in the society in different different forces provided that in history including a church. But if there is no account force to save for incense, you know long long term gratification, badly short term or you know whatever IT then then yeah and and then that's a sort of unappealing position in our society.

Now there is plenty of room for people to be in that space but is still you're still on offensive we still have in a society where effectively to own an ice cream truck you know in the sort of language a child would seem to be a great thing have a short term thing um yeah not many people want that role is sort of uncool in some way. You might become cool at someone in the future when more people realised that the short term gratification thing was leading to diabetes. Or everyone is .

the same as one of the justifications, I think, for why people are having children. The upfront children, you just see a very, very large cost on all of the joy and and stuff .

the economist put is the child tax the amount of money you have less if you have a child. We weird way around to look at the future of the species, isn't the that if only I died with more money in my bank account, life of regret.

Death regret yeah yeah. Well, you know, it's kind of the as well the the mexican Fisherman story you familiar without the marable of the mexican Fishermen? I don't think I am.

This is cool. You like this. So an american businessman goes on holiday to mexico, and while he's there is a true story, is a parable, got IT fucking.

He goes on holiday. He gets taken out fishing by a local mexican. And he asked the mexican how he spent his time.

The mexican says, I fish a little on the morning. I catch enough for my family. We go back, we cook, we laughter around the fire.

And I spend time with my children and the american business. We goes that stupid. Here's a Better idea. What you should do is actually spend most of your day fishing.

And then with the surplus fish, you could sell them at the market, the best convention says, why would I do that so? Well, once you've got the additional money, you could start to employee some of your friends, and they could come out fishing with you too. And you could catch more fish, which you could sell the market for more money.

Why would I do that? Says, well, once you've done that, you would able to incorporate in amErica and you would maybe able to start a canning factory so that you could own the entire reduction process, and you could then sell the company for a lot of money. So why would I do that? He said, because once you do not, you'd be able to fish a little on the morning and then go back and spend time with your children around the fire. good. And I often think about that is a much more direct route to to happiness you know yeah um well that's .

that's the classic thing that even the place you will end up there is the place you started from but yes, um there were there lotteries about people are having children um and a lot of them are simple economic things. I mean all of the western countries that have terrible replacement birthrate figures are because of very easy things to solve like cost of housing and things like that. And it's not hard to build a foodful housing.

We just proved to be capable of doing so. So Young people both get on the property loud and have and start a family, think they have to do either all and they're entirely wrong. But that's something the governments could have sorted out and none of them do that.

They so hopeless at IT and they have you in for years under consecutive government. They never build enough housing. So Young people don't see a future, don't feel hopeless, and then then have kids. And then everyone wonder, why is the demographic crisis?

Intergenerational competition theory is something I learned about a couple of weeks ago. You familiar with this I didn't know about before, but IT makes complete sense. There is always this talk of millennia of the first generation to have done worse than their parents.

And IT seems not the first little. Yes, first in generation. And IT seems .

like millennium OS actually probably just about manage to get over on average. But jena materially difficulty in getting in the property ladder. The most common living arrangement for men under thirty five is still at home with their parents awful. And yeah, you know, IT IT makes in a sort of intergenerational competitiveness and dissatisfaction, when you look at where your parents were in this world, felt sense that your parents got advantages that you never did.

which is usually not true. I mean, they didn't suffer inflation in the same rates, but they suffer very high taxation. The postal period, we haven't had taxation as the levels that was out in the nineteen sixties and seventies.

For instance, in the U K. The time when people top rate taxpayers are paying ninety nine percent tax, friend who once in that paid paid over one percent tax is IT will be back tax and that sort of things. I mean, there's a tendency, particular on millennia ls and after, to think their parents had IT very easier.

And my experience of people from that generation, the book generation IT didn't feel easier the time. And yeah, there were certain things getting on the property housing ladder was a little more easier than a significant easier. Once you have what is IT five times average journals are being that you know inadequate to get to the average property prize.

You see them this a split go on. But you you always have to factor. I feel like if you saying that the milenio of the first one, or deny of the first one said, whoever, to have a Better standards living, you have to bake in things like, oh yeah, they had a world war, you know.

So that's quite a big P S. As a big foot note. Um so yeah, everyone everyone has their chAllenges. I just to to identity them, know the way out of them to do.

I was talking to mutual friend eric kidston about this. I also spoke to sam about this. I was spoken to a bunch of people. Why, in your opinion, you think everybody struggles to agree on the truth now?

Oh, let's quite straight, fool. We can't degree what has happened. So uh, broadly speaking and event happens now and some people believe that has happened and other people think IT hasn't.

Um I mean, we've been through the number of draining years since we first spoke in which when they said global and which some people believe was something which killed millions, millions of people in their own country and think they were just about safe from dying themselves. Another people think that was a fake, and the other people think we passively reacted, and other people think IT was all planned and we no degrees. What happened?

Uh, that's just to take one example, america. You have the fact nobody agrees who an election as a problem. And so you just have basic things nobody going to be on that just happened.

I would say in america, you know, nice if we could just agree that one thing that just happened happened. But then nobody wants to, as you must be A W. F. Shill, if you, if you, if you believe that. So I think IT is the problem and not always the underneath.

That is just the problem, in fact, that uh, the trade milk of social media has totally changed away in which we communicate the way in which we learn things, absorb things and we don't know what the consequences that I was so early into. IT and IT seems to be, among other things, that allowed people to have their own version of recent events, recent history, past few days. And so when you sit down to talk to somebody, you can fairly swiftly work out whether that somebody who's open to the idea things that having happen, and or whether or not they will fight you all away.

And that just makes everything much harder than I used to be, then that isn't a sort of particularly pain for the era of a mono arraid if if that era ever particularly existed. You read this is not clear that I did um but it's just massively worse. And news is coming at us such a pace these days.

So it's just like you know every day feels like you know a month worth of news in the past, things just fly by you so fast. You don't even have time to absorb IT IT before it's happened. So I think that's part of the reason.

Um and in any case, the whole concept of truth is being a desirable thing in the society seems to have eroded ed from both the right in the left. Well, truth for instance used by the basis for a university uh education and the basis of the university inquiry that you thought the truth wherever IT LED you that was a point of academia for politics was different. Politics was always about having to find a way around truth and deal with IT an address, convenience, yeah, dress IT where you could, but, you know, get round.

This was too working ward. But the inquiry is used to be about seeking truth. I've had been like that for couple thousand years or more since greek, certainly, and then IT changed some point relatively recently. And truth is now no a desirable thing because truth hurts people and IT can be mean.

So it's not only the people have different opinions on things they don't agree that .

the thing we used to agree on is worth they have .

different facts as well.

They have different facts but they don't agree that I mean, they don't agree that you should just follow truth whether IT takes you um because other things are prioritize over truth. I still prioritize truth overall things that I can and try to, uh, I think that's the interesting thing about the world, is finding out what that is true, what is not. But other people don't seem to have that same appetite anymore and would rather living lies, which I think is very dangerous for individual, very dangerous for society, in fact, is it's it's dangerous for an individual and lethal in a society. I see.

It's interesting to think about the motivations that people have for not believing something which is already on an on shaky foundation of we can't degree on the thing that we're not believing about. And grinder, one of my friends has this idea that a if no amount of evidence would dissuade someone of what they believe, then they don't have a rational belief. They have a, uh, religious .

ideology. Because JoNathan swift, beautiful ly put IT, we can't reason somebody out for position they weren't reasoned into. No, of course I am your dealing with document with many people today, they just they don't know which faith they belong to.

But this document for sure, I just do not very interested in their views because I think they can't defend them. And if you can't defend your views, i'm not very interested in them. I don't find them between ve.

I asked some this about whether or not we obviously would have had ten, fifteen years ago who's a big part of the new eighties movement.

And I guess you were ten gently .

on the of a wiper new thing .

okay um but you know your book .

the madness of crowds talks about the collapse grand narratives in one of the bigger collapses of grand narratives was religion I asked them whether or not looking back, he believed that his deconstruction of religion was on baLance and net go or net. He he managed to evade being to capitalize the way I think. But what do you think?

I think it's like a lot of things you deconstruct you. You only know afterwards whether not it's something you could have put back together. They like children with bicycles.

Very fine at taking them apart, very bad of putting them back together. Not comparing sama child. But I mean, I just I think that is there is something you notice only once you will take apart.

Once you can't reconstruct, you advise what what function IT might have performed. I said to sam on stage a few years ago that I I thought that this would all be fine if most aist were as rational and level headed as sam. But it's not sam Harris.

All the way down is like sam Harris, followed by total mentalist. And 嗯， you just will not reason or rationalize anything and are just screaming hard piece of insanity. So that's a shame.

But yes, I mean, I think of that whole thing works for some people, but obvious doesn't work for others. I mean, religion is, you know shop with out, among others. Saw IT was religion with philosophy for the masses.

Um absent religion completely. Seven, lots of options of what will happen. One is the the the the general public lose the overarching framework of their lives and have nothing to replace IT with.

Another one is that they do replace IT with other things. You know, it's a new religions which crop up all the time. You have the the religion of the body negativity movement.

You know, we have the religion of trans, we have the religion of gender, we have region of race and you know and all these things are just stepped into this void. And there are all dogmatic things with their founding texts. Um they've all got their own capacities of a kind rests.

Priests have uh, x communication rights. And I my miami observation really would be on d that is that I preferred to the old gods, you know I preferred the old piece of funding enough partly because we knew its floors. And the sweet point where you see the flaws of religious relief but can still live through IT is um is one even I can I can especially feel nosti c for because I I don't like the new priest od.

I find them um um as corrupt as any priest od in history. A with the negative attribute that that not everyones woken up to them yet, you know. I mean, we do, we have in our culture and equivalent, for instance, of the mean of the pedophile priest.

I don't think we do. I mean, in princess, I would love IT if the the sort of the adults who push, you know, gender small fear stuff on children were regarded as the current of the file priest. I think i'll be fine.

I think IT doesn't come with that yet. It's like the catholic church in boston circuit, one hundred fifty. The peace are still footling with the kids when everyone wants to talk about IT.

So IT makes me think as we were talking earlier on about some of the ways .

in which lots .

of decisions need to be made, you don't know how the outcomes are going to occur, that there are no solutions, only trade offs. Quote, I keep coming back to that in my personal life as well, but thinking about what people want to optimize for in their existence, there are our solutions ultimately like, and you have to give up certain things.

don't have give up everything.

But no, there's certainly Better solution, right? But the world is trying to maximize everything, is there is. And IT goes back to the uh, shallow on the empathy.

Accepting the trade after an inevitability doesn't fit into that paradise, right? We will always optimize for what is what feels most pleasure or apathetic in the short term. I don't know.

I don't feel that well.

That's what that's how IT plays out. I think for a lot of people, yes, if they have no character, if they have no character, well, what do you have tried for? I try to optimize for peace.

That seems to be the thing that for me in my personal life, I try to do if the Price is my sanny, the cost is too high no matter what IT is. And I continually throw that rule out of the window all the time. That's what I try them for, right?

My own rubra. I love that the peace in your, in your private life I try to my lake online about the general at the end of the importance of being at SHE says the general was a essentially amount of peace excess in his domestic life. You the way .

around ah you of .

peace in your domestic expect .

maybe just I try best I on IT but .

yet .

the this lack of of meaning and and people's desire there absolutely further n desire to trying fill that hole with as many things as they can.

Like liza.

like liza indeed. Did you did you see the stories that came out about liza? I was wonderful about her. Yeah what for the people they don't know? Lisa was on tour, uh, in amsterdam, took her back up, dances to the red light district, us, and made the back of dances, some of the back of dances eat bananas out of the vagina of amsterdam street.

As my view was what had happened here was a lisa thought you could outsource the eating of your fight food and vegetable to the vagina.

to the vagina of the stripper, or to the solution.

Tweet helpfully, SHE even outsources the five food and vegetable. But IT seems to meet IT.

Seems to me that both liza a. Allen, to generous a Jimmy timer, all of these people who up front.

oh, isn't wonderful. It's so great is not the squeaky clean island, the generous thing you know just dance and and of course they're horrible and real behind this course. It's a sort of rule that, by the way, actually with public figures is that the ones who are most you know sort of sweet, sweet in public tend to be anxiety in private.

Sometimes the opposite can be true. Some people who have thought to have a very hard edge in public can I should be lovely, lovely people in private, like migrate. Thatcher was a good example. Very, very nice to people around her. You know, they could make tough decisions.

It's to me, it's a account signal if I see someone doing the lizer thing, if I am so body positivity IT becomes their identity of how they a flaming sod card Carrying paragon on of whatever this thing is.

Well, it's also it's also a bit like the the jimmie savio um the hospital what was IT called is still good but there was a hospital for children that he raised money for all the time and whether anyone would tried to do an investigation to somebody know it's going to hurt the hospital for kids. You know you sure you want to run that story that's going to hurt the hospital. So there are lots of them our own age. You have a thing like that. They build the equivalent of the Jimmy children hospital, said in order to protect themselves.

you saying that liz's work with the body positivity movement is in a case to train effectively, put a wall. Yes, all bodied people in front of, very difficult, able to get, I think very easy to get over getting around IT might be more .

difficult um known OK and I going to do a .

count ran out of gas so I had this idea about um why certain women, our very pro body positivity movement and I was listening to build burr to a live show and he said, ladies, if you could only support the W N B A the way that you support a fat check who is gaining weight and no longer a threat to you, that I would be doing more numbers in the MBA is and I realized that some some non zero number of women may deep down in their darker moments, realize that they don't discourage some of their friends from are gaining weight yes, because they can eat themselves out of their draft xul competition tensions parles .

welcome on man like that as well. How do we play that? I mean, this is gonna a low side of my character but you you can't say always, you're sad if some they are not very close to you, but you knew you, you see them after some years and they know then that fat.

I mean, you can say there is in the slight, you'll never get become fat there there is if reversions is that with with men? I think I and I I think men can be complicated in that as well. Yeah the thrill when offend bulls early, you know.

I think it's very common that needs it'll be a german word for that.

Yes, I think I I think lost people do that, but it's is a prety bad thing to encourage among people. But yeah, I think this is part of the competition taking out of the competition.

I was thinking as well about how material conditions you were saying before, people's parents may be had IT Better in some ways, but also would .

have had .

IT way worse. Material conditions .

often don't impact .

people's Dianas in the way that they might have predicted. Rich people can be bitterly idiots, and poor people can be grateful heroes.

Although George said, by the age of fifty, every man gets the face he deserves.

What do you 明白 的？ I think there .

is actually true. I think it's a certain age IT might not be fifteen now, but it's a certain age where you do show your life on your your face oh yeah I mean prince, somebody who's very profoundly depressed for long time but IT writes itself across the face. IT writes itself in their eyes.

I think um people have particularly unhappiness write itself from some his face. Joy does as well. I mean, if if somebody smiles are they have love lines, yeah, you know and yes, IT is a great way in IT. I mean, we you know we know that because we judge people by their faces by the way they interact with us, by the way they look at us, have been sensible.

I found a quote the other day that that a people with low self team will always find a way to be miserable. And IT made me think that material conditions, a lot of the time of what Young people, but many people, lay at the feet of the respond ency, or the analisa, or the critical nature, or whatever you might be. And i've seen enough of my friends .

vacillate .

through varying levels of affluence or or relationship, or singles in this or whatever. And one of the things would sometimes that impact the way that they show up, but many times they are the common dominated between all of those situations. And material conditions don't actually impact the way that they show up all that much too. Well.

there is a problem of analyzing ing this, which is that anyone who's successful inevitably looks at their own path to success is being, to some extent, prior. Then I mean, all myself, I mean, you just get over something with wild luck. But most people are, a lot of people let me say who who are successful? A look back. And then I think, well, I don't understand this person who hasn't made IT to the same round of the letters I have. Why didn't they work harder as a sort uh callous is actually can creep in that um but equally people are to a great decent master their own fate and it's a very hard one to anise that I said because the outrider kew, the whole statistics, I mean the outrider who does very well, not everyone can do what he or SHE has done, but he or SHE is likely to think they could have done but you .

retroactively A A lot of people that achieve success look back at the route that was particularly designed by them, for them to achieve the very specific type of success that they managed to get, and then retrod fit. That is a universal law that anybody else could follow. One of the things I realized, as i've spend more time digin into personal growth and self development and all of that stuff, so much of that is post talk rationalization about one person's very craft or solution for this thing. And they say, these are the universal principles of x vine that any good no that not that it's .

highly peron's.

It's your personality just spun up and tuned up to eleven yeah I mean.

most successful people i've ever met have some stories of their own growth, which is both inspiring and not replay couple, but there are usual people. But what's the alternatives?

He said before, like you have to lay the agency your own feet, because if you were to perhaps admit the truth, because I was in the right place at the right time.

was that can be the case. Not many people say that, but yes, I do yeah yeah yeah you're in britain. The eighty is a good time to make money easier, Better um than today some people say, yeah, I was a great place at right time but most do sort of vai think they've made IT that they were sort of prey day. You know they will do that to some extent. I often describe myself as being lucky and then need some me to remind me me of how hard have worked.

Had a friend who joined goldman sacks in nineteen ninety eight. He said he had an absolute goldin period for about for yes, do a little bit less uh he said was already starting to wind down before lamon around yeah um some of that was to do D I A very early make .

IT clear about some of the hiring process is going yeah two thousand and .

six he was already seeing IT but he told me he made a trade uh on uh nine eleven he made he made a very particular trade and bypass all of the security um concern the limits on everything and the pit boss whatever he's just some Young dude he's been for two years right out of whatever is united.

What did his best thing .

of the trade came over and said, like, what the fuck are you doing he said, look at this if this, then that if this, then that run IT all the way down he said, this is the outcome. This is what's going to happen. And you like, we would like.

I don't know what is the first time he was concerned that that he was going to go wrong. And then he made the most ungodly dly amount of money in the space of three hours, and then all the market shut for ten days from from september twenty. And the only organization that had Better capital was golden because of this particular trade.

And he was basically told, we need to cut this, i'll check with. He was basically told, go home, don't tell anybody. Yeah, of course you made this. He shorted the market.

yeah. I mean, IT IT was widely thought of nine eleven that because the market tanked, because immediately, and we didn't know this, a world war, this was world war. And h. IT was regarded very sweet, being the duty of wall street to to not do that. But bush came back.

you remember you did that on zero announcement, and that was as much for the market stock market as IT for the locking.

Yeah, absolutely. yes. Because I stop out market, many, many more americans. I come in the percentage but are invested in the stock market than in britain.

I made like three times more or something americans for a one k more than fifty percent of the population. AmErica has some um investment in the in the art market. So it's different from in the U K. Where when to stop, when when the pound was shorted in the nineteen nineties by um sorry and others are they, a lot of beauty people are not that sympathetic because they don't see themselves as being involved in the stock market because they are there is a note in georgia。

Well, the telegraph recently spoke about his by his wife's biography or to biography.

there's new biography of some. Well.

George, well, was statistic massage guns, tic homopoulo and sometimes violent biographer of the legends. Writer's wife says darkness that runs through one thousand nine hundred and eighty four is a reflection of his soul. Should be a person. George.

Well, IT would be the obvious end point to the full circle, full circle. yeah. I, this is just a way they offer her to get publicity, to repeat things everyone knew. I mean, George well held the use of his time about gay man france. We know he was a little bit moph bic, but was the ninety four years, you know, Nancy boys and so on, as you would have called them, not, you know, people were that sounds .

like a nineteen ninety taxi drivers in assault that they throw.

He was a sort of word that all well, and people his generation would use fairs as, and he does in some letters and some his articles. But I mean, so lucky, what I don't care. I mean, was he statistic probably in some ways sometimes was could he be cruel and nasty, probably being a human being?

I just think that the the sadness of our range judging people in the party know, just wait, people do that to you. Yeah, you know, we wait till somebody waist up your own life in the baLance and finds you want to. I mean, I think it's repost ous.

Human beings are what we are. Being amazed us in the past is always just expression of our own vanity and thinking. We've got passed or bad.

It's like the way if a friend mine was saying to me the other day, and as a oxford, if you want to get a grant to study these days, say, in english, and you were to choose shakespeare at your subject of study, which is sort of unusual these days, are you you were for instinct to a fine shakespeare, guilty of you, racism, colonist thinking and so on. And IT doesn't seem to strike these people that actually their job is not to judge shakespeare. Shakespeare judges us, and he might find us .

wanting how .

so well he gives us visions of the universe and our place in IT, which you would do us well to listen to. And that might include exposing human follies, human weakness, human pride, humans in human last tendency to do evil in the name of doing good, or think you're doing good and do great harm. So much more.

All of this is in shake for his work, in his characters, in things he had he created in his mind, in his work. I think that if you look at a panel play of a vision like that, you should think, I wonder what he's telling us, rather than I wonder how I can judge him. What's the point of the latter? So boring human being from the past, in human being in the past. shocker.

Does IT always been this way as IT always been a people of the present, judging people of yesterday by the standards of today.

Um well most people didn't have time in the past to engage in that um too busy trying to put food on the table. What's surviving past the age of twenty five, you know but what IT is in our current society is as a very strange lack of respect for wisdom. Henry kissing just said this in the early is in the internet。 He said, all the knowledge is there, but where's the wisdom? People might not like me again.

He knows a lot more than most of his critics. Um I do think I said that. So the audit of the age, I think the dt, the vanity of trying to judge over from the past, our current standards is just, abd, you think you know more than checks, but think you know more than oil, are these are minos snapping giants. I don't care for them.

One potentially unfortunate situation is that women's mental health is in part down to master genetic songs. When B, T, S, leads singer Young cook changed to a more method ism music, a disturbing trend followed. A psychiatrists point of view on B T S is Young cook in the the messages of pop music.

Early in their teen korea, B T S took a deliberate stance to refrain from objectifying a sacchi zing women despite going against the music industry. Non, they achieved huge success. Now it's part of his solo launch.

Different imagery has surfaced in jg cook songs. They include a woman telling of her man that he will be your fantasy and swallow your pride to make him never think about cheating. Lyrics that identify .

so your pride in the particular suggestive.

wait, not IT, i've got to, i've got more to go here, lyrics that identify women as those holes over there. And a male rapper telling his female partner I wanted before you came so that I can fuck you longer. Of course, in reality, Young cook songs are par for the course or even time.

Does that work, by the way, what you just describe?

You never treated laminar by having a warm eye.

Yorick more likes. I did that before you game, and I just like to go to get did before you take. That's why I texted .

saying i'm .

not I was one of my friends had a.

had A A rubrics for this that was mass debate before you evaluate.

Oh, well, that's true. Yeah, that can be sensible advice.

I'm not sure if I like you.

I was just hanging. Yes, yeah.

but no .

good at time.

That's those holes over there. I rank before you came so that I can fuck you longer.

Well, where to start downstream from?

K pop is a listening of female mental health problems. That's what i'm saying.

There's a problem here, isn't that because on the one hand, popular culture does have a massive impact on the way we see the world. Uh, I use that a gym recently where I actually asked the himself to turn off the music because IT was a lot of rap, very unpleasant rap, with the repeat juice of the n word in IT. He was a black rapper or so I .

was assuming, right? Didn't find yourself mouthing along to the lyrics, worried.

but I I know that's right, what what problem could possibly emerge from singing along?

Someone got cancelled on tiktok for mouthing the end word along to a song, right? So it's it's not possible. It's no longer the sound of the world. It's the mall shape yes, that that word .

and enda, well, we know that it's a magical word in our time, which even the speaking of suddenly summons up the demons of the past, the world, very, very strange. But now I just said to, I said to the time I said, I I just wanna hear IT because I don't I just don't wanted in the background of my life .

you know that dream .

that we trained on this is another time but anyway no I just don't like I and that's one actually have no interest here in the word because it's a and world so I in my mental background yeah um but so but anyway the point is is, of course, popular culture has a huge impact on people, has a huge impact on the way people see themself IT. But at the same time, you can overstate IT.

You know somebody is not generally unhappy pages because of the popular culture apart. Anything else could you can easily step out of IT as I try to do um and you know be a part of your time but not be its creature as seller says and so no I I think it's a sort of weaker excuse for unhappiness that the popular culture happens not to be to your taste or avoided. Get out, look up from the screen.

When is council culture going to come for rap licks? Because IT seems to me that you know is we're fighting against the massaging y of air conditioning temperatures in offices that are conditioned to the male body temperatures opposed to the female body temperature or I mean.

the the the levity of the ero is just astonishing to me. You know, lots of people get tribute to me this court that that is not quite right and it's quite for me, but that that will be talking about gender pronounce when the barbarians break in. But I ve said something like IT quite a few times. But I mean, you know, gender norms and air conditioning is a sort of thing that you would be discussing just before you will get my hated. I'm totally serious about this.

It's sometimes it's like one of the things that actually genuinely shock me in recent weeks taking off the ham massacre in israel was know and and something which I do think at some point when when it's all die down a bit might there might be a moment of of of what you've got to got to say this carefully, but a moment of them seriousness, which is, you know, take the music festival within a few miles, the gaza border that has attacked all the Young people there, this sort of peace rave. And this isn't in any way to victim blame. These are people just wanted to dance and dance in to the early morning.

And I think it's got the piece, rave the piece of love, rave something like that. And then this hideous, are the world broken to to them, to their lives, and ended the lives, hundreds of them. There's something, there's something haunting about this I find because it's especially haunting because if sort of demonstrates your slogans and your attitudes only go so far and they can't keep out, some of the things are working at the edge. And I think that when I hear people winning about minor things, if you have any idea the world out there, if you have any idea of the things that was working, you couldn't possibly be complaining about this.

What, how do you think gaze for gaza will get on long term?

Well, at the joke at the moment is that there aren't enough tall buildings in gaza to throw things for gaza off. But these, I mean, these people are, you know, i've said ray often there, they're part the same phenomenon as turkey s for Christmas and chickens for K, F, C. I mean, I just, i'm fed up of these infringe idiot cases.

I mean, there so mentally defective these people are. And and incredible bly artistic. No, I can be queer and also celebrate.

Panta y no, fucking fuck off. You know, I can both argue for a two state solution and also celebrate careens, and also not let myself down. No, you can't.

No, you can't. You can't do all these things. At some point you're going to choose.

I got a video to show you. Show you this video.

Someone, please explain me what this means. What does reproductive justice free style? What is that? Even me like, what is IT need a party are not pretty abortions and illegal in policy, unless I like, you know, a super medical emergency in the mother.

Will that, from what I understand, actually, a lot of anything, how to go israel to get abortions, they want. So what is this in mean? Yeah, what? There's five people, all the mass. Very good.

That's danny, the other half of ryan, who wasn't other day that you, that you came. Voice cast. Reproductive justice means free palestine.

What do you think? And Young in amErica who have been taught this weird version of the world, where all oppressions into link and into lock, and you, you, either the majority of minority for minority rights and issues, or for majority rites and issues, and all minority rights and issues intercept over that. So if your queer, somehow you, no, no, is not even these ignoramuses who couldn't point to the river Jordan.

If you showed at them on a map more along the three americas, audino, from the river to the sea palace will be freely. They think the palestine is the underdogs in this weird version where they've mapped american racing. They mapped a very specific version of american ratio politics onto everything else in the world. The same thing you can, people talk about colonisers. I mean, there is a language of colonizers, apartheid, all this stuff.

And they've just tried to map IT everywhere when I say everywhere actually is highly selectively, highly selectively I mean the people who are talking about israel's being colonizers um when I saw that the other day on the streets of london I thought, yes, if only there was a name for large numbers of people who came from outside to the country, and if only we could identify what they might be called in britain, oh, IT would be immigrants. When did don't call immigrants colonizers in britain? You sure you want to follow this logical conclusion that talk about indigenous people.

People, oh, okay, great. Anyway, you don't want to apply that. Might there be a country or continents say, oh, europe, where you don't want to start talking about the indigenous people's? I notice that people don't.

But if you do want to. Welcome to hell. So no, all IT is having is a very selective mapping of a particular interpretation of the world that very dumb people in amErica have tried to put on certain selective other cases. And IT doesn't work. IT just doesn't work. But may they never find out how much IT doesn't work? May they never find out um I wish them bliss in the ignorance because if the ignorance ever gets parked, IT will be as brutal a day as can be imagined.

I've been thinking for a good while about how hypocrite y is a purpose built tool for the internet to use. It's it's like hat npt for the internet is the thing because the reason is a purpose built. It's like one of those.

Can you spot the difference competitions on a touch screen ipad? This is what's on the left. This is what's on the right.

On what you have is here's something that someone once said or a position that they used to hold. And here is what they hold now, or here is what they do in their real life. Here is whatever, and it's kind of what you are identifying here that you have a world view which is self contradictory. You're just using different words for one thing that is almost exactly the same for another thing, right? And then complaining about this one thing don't look.

everyone is to some extent. And I don't think, by the way, I mean, I mean on hyp hop with you in a for instance, I can see a scenario where somebody might say, oh, dog, is your hypocritical on this particular t question, I might say, well, you know, there are some things I think are even more important than not being a hybrid, such as, I don't know surviving.

I the one thing about him is hipolito y and there's a weird hypocras y is is easier one to catch people on is the truth of that? Yes, want to thought, yes. Um you just and and they do IT as you say on this is what this person has twenty years ago.

This is they say now h get human being in growing up shocker. Yes yeah um people they were allowed to have all the change their minds. They grow up, be rather boring to say the same thing I think the same thing only for seventy years um but yeah people find the boxy very, very easy to see. And it's about the only vice you can really catch somebody on. I think IT is if you say one thing publicly and do nothing privately is about the only one that people really comfortable done. Almost other moral judgements are Better, worse of sort of ability away, but people still are able to judge hypocras y um but I think I I mean, I think there are worst things, and I think not standing up for your loved one is not stand up for your country, not standing up for a yourselves in the face. Horrible opposition from within without probably worse than her ocracoke heard .

you say recently, you don't have to agree with everyone's principle to respect the principal y're .

sticking to did I say that? Yeah, sounds good. Yes, good. But I did.

yeah. But the reason that I like that is I think IT shows why .

the bravery conversation .

or standing up for something you believe in is something that is a right good. At least then if someone is prepared to stand up for whatever their beliefs are, that you can assume that telling the truth, especially if they pay a high Price for IT. One of the reasons why I have, uh, a good amount of faith that sam believes the things that he says because he pays an unbelievably high Price to continue to flip flop from one tribe to another tribe to another tribe member.

isn't unbelieved the high Price but the Price.

let's say, relatively high Price yeah I.

I mean very earlier in some people's career or when people first make IT to public notice, people say things like, you know, do you really believe what you say? The answer to which for most people is, or ought to be, well, why would I say, do I do believe that there are people who obviously do say stuff for laws or click or marry purpose, but at a certain point I want to accept that the person thinks what they think. No, respect them for IT.

At least do them the decency of believing that they mean IT. And I think that even on people I disagree with wildly, I an is such a boring argument that want some people use a particular left is, know, I wonder, actually even believed, I think they don't. I think they're doing IT for money. Well, that's an easier way to try to ignore them. Then actually trying to contend with the possibility of what they're saying is something they mean and believe and trying to work out there's anything in IT much easier to say the persons only .

doing exact paid or something. Yeah, that's the shell grafter accusation.

very boring accusation. Yeah and I don't doub there are some people who who that is .

the case with but wave fewer than wave fewer than people think Michael mAlice has a hierarchy of different um I think .

it's like the hierarchy of grifters. Don't know why I say my face media start .

mile terrible one of the it's like industry plant paid opposition controlled style. He goes all the way up and he said that he descended recently. He's not quite a paid opposition, but I think he's industry plant now. I think like freeman is paid opposition is paid is .

different from controlled opposition, maybe .

controlled position.

Controlled position is these are such weird terms that are cropped up in our area. I love IT again, I think I sort of low resolution explanation for that. They really, really know resolution explanations for things. Whenever I hear somebody described things as that, how we thought to know you're not doing with somebody who actually understands the world.

do you find there's a definitely a trend of conspiratorial thinking conspiring much stronger are adopted homeland than IT is in the U. K.

I think, yes, that's true.

What do you think are you? How conspiracy pill to you do you see?

I mean, it's it's this is the moment people controlled opposition you landed.

This is me allowing you to graduate. I think I .

talk about this on the boys cast as brief briefly and various people wrote to me say, ah, there you go as proof your paid.

you're glowing as is cold.

But it's that he heard your glowing no, what's IT so tell .

me if i'm wrong with this, mark, you're the resident glow expert but your glowing that means you you're .

like a planted .

person who's saying something that is outing the like. It's an intelligence Operation that breach the surface and people can see IT not comment on tiktok .

saying like you're glowing oit this is like the people that let to be FBI who are certain bartis t 续 um so your conspiracy oral so is the thing with the spirit y theory that is very difficult our eric because some of the conspiracies are true， of course, have come true um you know to be true a lability conspiracy, very probably true. They shouldn't have ever called nobody should ever have called that a conspiracy.

There IT wasn't a conspiracy theory is IT is one of a set of hype hythe's als to explain what happened with the with the with covered um so a lot of things get called conspiracy, which or not there are just hypotheses that should be allowed to remain on the table. And that makes a certain type person increasingly prone to believe that everything that's called conspiracy theory is not a conspiracy theory. And before you know, if you get, say, nation individuals thinking of the landings were conspiracy, we didn't land on the mood.

American didn't land on the mood, but I don't know whether the people who now claim that believe that the russians also fated. It's an interesting question to ask them. Do you think the solvents were capable of getting to the moon, but the americans were not american set up like A A blow fan and a flag on a dodgy popper, he said.

But the soviet did make IT. Or did the soviet americans both agree to pretend to have gone to the moon, but not really have gone? None of IT makes sense to my mind, but this, but I have noticed.

And it's you, the literally demonize rates that there are certain types of mental problems that people have that make them disproportionate, likely to believe conspiracy theory on on mass. And one of them is paranoia. The more paranoid 的 person is， the more likely to believe sort of thing. And that's the option. In my own life, I ve never had a number of people who've gone into the world of conspiracy are not come out and they are all people who have suffered paranoid epsom in their lives.

which adds up so fear and genders yeah.

And as they say, a sort of low resolution and explanation for complex phenomenon ah and you know and I think is also that so you can see you there is come about and is and used by people who this is isn't an original point. Many people made they made claims about them are made biology by people who don't understand how you believe to be chaotic.

The world actually is you can't face IT um so they can't face the fact that yeah somebody followed in the newspapers everyday or with your life did actually just dying of free car Price because the driver was drunk. They can't wear the idea. The world can't be that cruel. That can't be that random. You want to bed.

it's got to be coordination. I can't be coincident .

exactly so people who can't cope with the wild fable of the relected table of our lives um always go to the there must be somebody behind that. There must be somebody who's controlling all this. You can you joking? Nobody y's controlling us. Anything controlling the damping, I D want to know by now, of course, if not, it's such a very unsatisfactory place to arrive at in your life and by the way, my own observation is not very good for people personally because .

they start to lose agency themselves because of control .

gets and real answer, doesn't care, no.

doesn't even know that is death to you.

The the ability .

for people to hold two conflicting thoughts in their mind at the same time is supposed to be the market of sophisticated thinking. But IT does show up here, which is the government is both so useless that they can't get anything right and so sophisticated .

that they're able to. All our world is filled with the same world, filled that things like notice repetitive my trial, things like a nine eleven was an inside job of the americans to allow the use of the world trade. And also, yeah in nine eleven, good resume in ladon. They can do both.

There is somebody I knew interviewed the father of um the main nine eleven high jacket or the named gone out of my mind I don't cat he must he should be forgotten but interviewed the father in Jordan and he was simultaneously capable of holding in his head that his son was a great shahid matter for islam and that nine eleven was in inside job of americans. Like like choose is I think, do you think your song was an agent of the FBI and also a matter like, eh people do this. The most world is particularly proud turk in spiritual thinking because it's it's a source of flattery to itself to explain why they have created so few successful societies.

And and bond Lewis made disapointment ago, the problem in the muslim world is that they have to find its explanations. Because if you're given the revelations of maham's, you told this the last revelation ever from god, and that you are the people who have received this revelation and everything's going to go great for because you've got the revelation. And then like the juice, you have one country that doesn't much Better than of your countries, and you know, you can't get the economy of most your county going at all, and you can't provide for most your citizens, and nobody y's coming up the latter and the economies in the dust and all this. You've got ta find an explanation for IT because like what we were given revelation and they're doing much Better. So there's massive things like that, that sit underneath the movements of our time, which maybe billions of people on the planet believe, and they believe them could have flat to themselves, flatters the government who aspire to run these countries, to claim to run these countries um yeah, billions of people believe this .

should I was thinking about the extremist worldly believes largely in the west, but I guess everywhere. And I was wondering whether we have finally moved beyond peak walke. And a study came up recently that was kind of interesting.

Researchers from change research pulled over a thousand registered U. S. Voters from meeting to thirty four. A majority of both women and men consider a far right tim and far left ism to be flags in a potential partner. Seventy six percent of women in fifty nine percent of men consider identifying as a maga republican to be a large turn off. Sixty four percent of men and fifty five percent of women said they had also swipe left on someone identifying as a communist.

Fifty five percent of women .

to four percent of men and fifty five percent of women swipe left on on a common. Fifty five percent of men said that listening to joe rogan was a red flag. Forty one percent of men said the same for a woman being into astrology.

H, that I got with that one, if says, what's your star sign .

date over what is A A really famous mean where is on I message and the text says, mum, what time was I born and the reply from mum says, stayed fucked away from that girl.

IT IT is that the hearts thinks when IT comes up with a question shame.

forty one, thirty three percent of men said, for black lives matter, IT was a red flag. If they say black lives mount of fifteen percent of women, fifty three percent of women said IT was a red flag. If they refused to see the barbi movie, a thirty one percent of men, fifty percent of women, red flag.

If they say there are only two genders, thirty four percent of men, a fifty four percent of women, for they identify a conservative. Thirty three percent of men, for they identifies a liberal. So next time you're riving with someone, maybe saved the podcast recommendations and daily horsical pes .

for the second date, wow IT.

Fifty five percent of women say that listening to joe rog was a red fig.

I wonder of the species as any future .

because they can't listen to jerod.

Well, not like all these people are .

working .

out like every number of tensions of partners um how weird and joe turning up in that so that is amazing. I know what's happened to all the good old people who used to say, I don't have an opinion on that.

Well.

I got into those guys.

I got pulled in a good bit recently on the internet for not commenting on the recent sociopolitical fear that happening in the middle. And I quoted you, tony's sly, and said, i'm trying to make a habit of something which is very rare on the internet to not comment on something which I know nothing about, very good rule. And yet it's the rarest thing of all.

Why shouldn't people, people care about my insights into health and fitness, or my learnings about social psychology? why? Why shouldn't my fiscal advice be in? Why shouldn't my views on immigration?

It's much to be avoided that. And I mean, in the end, you made much less verdict of yourself. If you don't start talking about everything, I think I mean, the somebody recently sent me an article with relative nine persons.

I mean, ask for recently they want to publish about them at least and nearby opening said, I don't really know much about the really, but this is and I just say in that case, don't speak don't speak and say but here I think if if you don't know, just to agree not to do IT, that's one reason why is a lot of I mean, as a lot of television these days in the U. K. Where you can be invited on to debate the totally problems whose only there for baLance of completed baLance.

And I just can't do that stuff anymore. It's too demeaning. You know that if there's a subject you know about a war that you've covered or covered many times, as in my case for israel pma's wars and israel has law, was I dies can't be sitting there with somebody I hate to say this is not not maintained a mystery stic way but there's a lot of uh women who are currently invited on things for baLance.

First because I women, second because I provide usually left wing perspective and that's needed if it's me as almost well and you know I just is so depressing to know to give informed opinion about selling you've seen and reported on first hand and and then they go to the other person and they go well, like I think it's why don't why don't I just at home why I could be doing anything else and i've got to listen to somebody who doesn't know they're talking about whisp. An opinion live on air are so depressing but masses of people like that and it's just yeah you don't know about IT, don't talk about IT, it's a very good worth or tried out in private with friends and mates and try to learn. I read a book.

we morally obj to have a take on everything. No.

no, I think most people's opinion doesn't matter. I mean, that just doesn't. And I also think the people to spend their time online, broad speaking, to broadcast out their opinions on things should be told more often.

Doesn't matter um doesn't matter what you think. I mean one of my rules on on any war is you should never, as a writer, try to give advice to a government. You know, this is the israeli is, this is what the ukrainians must do. I need listen to you. I mean, first, what? You don't live in the country unless you live in the country, the pretty damn sure they should be a bit humble about telling other people about their lives, you know and also like who made you the tactics to you on everything the as cover .

everyone became a ology or epidemiology expert.

They became withdrawn ghanian an but and then they became a ukraine experts. And now they're all middle ast experts, and I just think is a should be regarded as a massive red flag that the person question is, Normally what's happened is theyve downloaded the set of opinions they believe that their tribe should have, right? And that's why the moron's marching in london.

Other cities know, with the exception of the museum, we just whipped up all the time by the fact that the jews do anything. I mean, most people don't care about other. Most arabs don't care about other arabs.

Nobody cares about the palestine inie. Nobody cares about them. Can't tell you how little they care about your Daniel lothian.

The egyptians love lebanese. low. Them done nothing for the palestinians for seventy years. And yet, whenever is ready, do anything.

The muslims across the west come out on the streets because they head to use. And you know, hundreds of thousands people have been killed in yemen, not a heap on the streets of britain. The basis, certainly not big protests, a basha assad's killed more museum in the last ten years.

Then how then? Everybody on every side killed in every war involving is, well, since nineteen forty, including the war of independence. Nobody cares.

The muslim don't come out on the streets. They don't care. The only thing they care about is the hatred of the juice.

And IT motivates them like nothing else, because IT hits at the core of their self, estee. They can't bear IT. And so that one is like, very interesting to me.

But the there .

are these fellow travellers who go along with them, who have downloaded, as I say, as sort pathetic american interpretation of colonisation, decolonisation, racial justice, reproductive rights and try to map everything on.

And my friends got a theory called grinders theory of the spoke bullshit. Many don't have an opinion until they are ask for IT, at which point they couple together a viewpoint from women, half remembred here, say, before deciding that this two minutes, two minutes old makeshift opinion will be the new hill to die on.

Very good, my friend. Pretty great. This spectator tempts, tends to run very popular pieces each time in a new big thing. The bluff is guide to whatever and it's great usually involves in foreign ty. You usually involves saying things like, well, they Better get this done before the brutal afghan winter kicks IT. Who made you an expert on like metrology and afghanistan like what are the ukraine have got to make this advance before they dread the the ukrainian and I just I mean.

I tried that love is .

guy is very useful rule I try france is never to write about any foreign policy if it's about the country. Have not visited, preferably visited multiple times. I just, I can't bring myself to do, and I find IT too embarrassing.

It's so interesting when you talk about knowing one opinion that a person holds, and from that one opinion being able to accurately predict everything else that they believe you. That mono thinking just proves that you're not a serious thinking. Well.

I think I just think it's fairly obviously for intense. You say, yeah, what's the problem with a big beard guy winning the women? Is weight lifting OK? okay.

I know all of other opinions as well. And to be fair, that probably works other around as well to a great extent. The interesting thing with most people is where the slightly out of sorts with .

their own political. That's exactly the point. You if it's been a long time and if you were surprised by the opinion of your favorite to think or or right or a commentator, whatever is that's probably reliable signal that they're not really thinking for themselves.

Yeah, if you're just permanently up yeah, I can old like the pair of shoes. Here we go again. The coped things happened. And I can already predict, such as such as opinion on IT you every single time, all of the time, every single time, you know the idiosyncratic of this persons very, very particular world view. Well, that's because it's not theirs yeah course and everybody else is is out source .

thinking and that was really sad about that is that uh that means that you're not really living your life and your living a patient of prescribed the set of opinions. So sad, I mean, so sad the wasted energies and wasted lives of people who've just downloaded a set of opinions and I just did just running them, you know, well, that's not your life, is just someone else's life. You're just really playing what was that .

quote you told me about about being shunted to the side of the road of your own.

It's a fit of lacking quote from a poem as years as a scription of a couple. He says something is pushing onto the side of their own lives. Beautiful line, terrifying line, horrifying line, to make everyone judged themselves.

What that mean to you?

Well, well, that means that there's a life that you hoped to live your life. You saw yourself living and you you got pushed, decide of IT and end up not living that life. I think a large number of people have that.

Almost all unhappy people i've met have that feeling to some extent. And then you've got a choice of poisons, one of which is to choose the poison of other people. Held me back. Another is to face up the fact you, in somewhere coward or a victim of circumstances, w something else.

But I think a lot, I mean, you know, is, you know one thing that Young people you know can be encouraged to do is to set out the sort of life they would like to live. Imagine the sort life they would like to live in the name for IT. And working IT out is sometimes difficult, sometimes not. But if you do have that image of your life, as you think I should be lived, and you end up not living IT that that is. But if you can feel yourself slowly being pushed away from you, I think that's a terrible, terrible feeling.

like watching your own demise occur second by second.

Yeah, unfortunately, i've never felt IT, but I definitely fear IT.

Where do you go to find or to avoid cowers, or to find resilient, so of bravery? Because a lot of the time, the easier path is easier and that the one that got the least resistance and surround .

yourself with courageous people, surround yourself with them with brave people and that can be bravely of all sorts of different kinds. And when I turned forty, I had A A dinner. Um I think you weren't invited to but it's saying because you weren't in town, if I remember right, they thought I directed a lot of my favour.

People are room at least. And I was interesting that a friend made a speech which he said is striking. I went the names of the people around the table, but some people will be familiar to listen this.

But a phenomenon, give up very touching speech. I was removed by which he said, how noticed what IT was? The dog was surrounded himself with courageous people.

I was from a very wide ring array of bits of the world in different disciples. And so when I was very touched by that, because I had particularly noticed i'd done IT. Um but then I rise.

I sort of had that actually yes, I had a must of sub country, but maybe now a consciously wanted to be around courageous people. I think courage is something that rubs of other people. I think it's enormously to be desired to be around courageous people.

And that might be different types of coverage, some physical, some of IT mental um so that that's one thing you have around yourself the crazy people, or at least not cowards not that is not the sort of people just say the same thing that I ve only meant to say and so on. So many ways people can get out of this non life. They are being jumped into one of my friends.

I wasn't a friend at the time. I just met him for the first time, but someone that had been interested in for a good while. I met in Austin a while ago and .

he'd had an interesting story.

You need face a cancellation over the less few years. And he's sort of told me the story, and he said, is SAT on some roof up late night talking about this thing? He was regaling me with the story.

He said, throw out my entire life. I thought I was a hard man. I'd like to do man things and around myself with masculine people. And I was into, you know, like guns and shooting and fitness and friends with navy seals in the rest of you said my tire life. I was scared that I was a coward.

It's terrified .

that I was a coward, he said. In my darker moments, I could always hear my Better self clearing his throat in the room next door, beautiful.

And then this cancellation thing came along, and he said, you know, even even the people that do really hard things, hard intellectual work, hard training work, hard physical work, all the rest of IT, there's a difference in the kind of difficulty that they do because it's elected, right? You've chose me to do the hard work out. But when the entire world comes to bear quot.

On you in a way that feels like chaos, catastrophe was whipped up into a world wind. Honey said, yeah, I, that was a genuine test and he was, he was very grateful. He said, my my Better self stopped cuffing and kicked the door and came to help. Good which? But just, yeah, I could always hear my Better self clearing his throat in the room next door.

Well the thing with that is um um the the difference between uh situation you find yourself in the danger three choice and ones that you ve uh first that he had been thrust into and probably know that the consequence of being thrust into dangerous situation is much more likely to lead to um P T S D and things like that um then if you choose to um and i've been fortunately my life most dangerous situations that i've been in have been once i've chosen to be and that's that's very different. But yes, i'm glad he found out that he was more courageous than he feared.

But I think about that, what a beautiful line to be more courageous than you fear. You are right, almost. This war against yourself.

Yes.

this fear of your own nature.

well, but perfect sense. What I mean as a horrible example, sometimes used, but I am, if you have a mugged for your wallet, let, let you a mugged with somebody, let, let if you a mug with a girl, your way of all looking after, and you just hand IT over there, like there's several reasons that is worth handing over the wallet for, one of which is that, why do I need to rist getting shot for, like stabbed or stabbed for one hundred box and few phone calls in the bank? Yeah, so that that the reason to hand over the world, what I the reason not to hand over the wallet is are you sure that you're not going to spend the succeeding weeks dreaming dreams of pornographic violence against your attacker and thinking they thinking how you're going, you torture to him if you could get your hands on him and the brutal way in which you would have revenge if you ever find them .

IT might be easy to just get your head kicked in a bit yes.

And are you sure you can live with the version of yourself that is you handing over the what I said this recent in the piece in new york post about the people on the new york subway where there's this awful thing you probably seen, where people you know like a woman will be being abused by some maniac fanno adult, you know, drug added and and you know, people like either look into their phones, including men, or they will get their phones up and light record.

And I mean, somebody said, dog is trying to get people killed and I wasn't towsy, but what I was saying was, where are the men? Just like, stand up and I confront the guy if he's got a woman by her hair and he's parking around the carriage and yeah that the back lash was like, what do you know? These people might get killed if they step in but I think yeah but also maybe will have a more civil society if people don't think they can go round and do this stuff without consequence.

I'd like to see far more standing up like that, I think is a pathetic position, particular for men to be to sit there like getting out their mobile phones. But you know, it's everyone's choice. I don't exactly know what I would do in some of the situations i've seen you read about on the new york subway.

Didn't that guy yeah, do a thing? And no, is in jail.

Did you get jail for IT? He's charge. He's coming up trial. This is a like Daniel media, I think former marine. He there was a guy on the subway who was um clear off his head on the various drugs, was a very, very violent toward people in the carriage. Some point tore off his top and like, i'm going to kill you or something like this and this marine at that point stepped in, got him into a choke hold, was clearly not minister, but the choke hold was too hard and he he suffocated the guy and he died at the scene but that man, the act marine is is is charged with I think murder not I think man also um and uh he could face a very significant prison centers. There's a lot of discussion in new york as to whether not a new york jury would actually convict him.

Was he being .

convicted in new york? right? Um because you could say that the guy because is a racial element like everything in amErica uh and because the former marine was White and the guy off his head was black. There was an attempt, of course, to put the the ratio lends on IT and we'll see if a new york jury IT should be comprised of also of women who have been on the subway and have probably had unpleasant .

interactions.

will convict this man for stepping in and genuinely think that he meant to kill the guy or just this was like a good, smart act gone wrong. But uh, it's very silently that stuff. There was a way in london about fifteen years ago, very much haunted me.

Girl did the victim impact statement that was particularly horRobin, that they were on the top of the bus in london, and a guy on the bus started throwing chips. So people's heads, and have a Young say, got up to say, mate, lay off. And the guy stabbed him, he died.

And that's an and in the wake of a story like that, a lot more people in the society will be craving on the bus because i'll have that example in their head. I might fear about this case in the new york marine cases that he, the marine, by doing what he did and IT going wrong, and the publish I got will stop other people doing good at one hundred. So a lot rides of the verdict. That's a lot of pressure. It's a lot of pressure and in amErica with the jury, when you're on one of these cases where society could break out in rioting and not sure well for this guy because the victim was an enormously um upstanding as a member of the community and had I think the video I didn't see quite a lot of IT was video but he .

d also had previous things where he had done of times that i've been in arrested a vian exam so .

he won't be that sympathetic activity. There are quite a lot of unsympathetically characters who get drag through the the laundry of racial justice staff in amErica and become sense. I went named in named. But going back .

to that sort of way you go when you need more resilient thing in the bravery, peace. What was that C. S. Lewis quote about about the times not being optimal. Oh yeah.

What's that? Oh, that's one of my favorite, one of my favor. Cements ever given the universe.

Ox octo nine. Yes, I love that. Lewis was a master of prose as well as theological writing. And he he gave this beautiful, beautiful salmon in which he said, yes. He said, you know, the conditions are not optimal at the moment.

The search for truth and beauty that are species go through, you know, are going through such a trial. But he says, the point is of the conditions never were optimal. They never are, says even those periods of history, which, which seem to be tranquil, like the eighteen century, turn out on coast inspection to be filled with crisis alarms, panics and all the rest of IT.

He said, if, if human, if human kind had put off the search for truth and beauty until the conditions were up til the search would never have begun and the main point he makes is that um there is something wonderful and unusual about human beings. He says the ants, for instance, have chosen their own route theyve chosen the safety in the security of the hive and presumable they have their rewards. But if he says this as men are different, and he gives his beautiful list, I think I can remember red.

He says they propound mathematical themes in the league cells. They quote the latest poeas advancing on the walls of quebec, make jokes on. This is not penh, he says.

This is our nature. Fuck, that's cold. It's true as well in my observation, absolutely true also.

Well, because i've seen people in the league of cities many times, cities under fire as IT is under bombardment, cities are being raised to the ground, and then and human life goes on this extraordinary thing. People continue their studies, if they can. People continue their family life if they can.

They, they ve realize that the conditions will never be optimal when they can be Better than they can be worse, but they're never perfect. And I think the real lesson of what Lewis is saying is, and I think it's an important lesson for Young people in our time, don't put off whatever is your meant to do until the situation is optimum. Don't don't fail to pursue what IT is you think you meant to pursue in your life until you have total tranquility.

For instance, you know that you have the house apartment you would like, until you have the relationship you would like, until you have. Don't put IT off until then or until the world is peaceful, which will never happen, never happen, never has happen, never will happen. Don't put IT off to then, because if you put IT off to then, that means you'll put IT off forever.

So do whatever you're meant to be doing now. Start now. If you have started already. If you started already, don't go any slower for god sake. And and this is part of the the cost of our times.

I've said this before, but part of the cost of our times is in almost expensive energy on idiotic things that you can do nothing about. Now I think we should say to more people, don't hold at the moon, don't shake your fist to the skies, get home with what you meant to be doing, and that will be different for everybody. But I just am very.

Well, i'm too irritable to put up with going at the slow speed that a lot of people want to make us all go out these days. So I want them out of my way. Yeah.

I think a lot about the arms of victim hod culture and no time for yeah that .

seems to me that like .

an existent al crisis is actually a lux ious position to be in because the bottom levels of mazdas hierarchy of needs have been sorted and the victim hod culture is so rampant at the moment because the human systems demand for chAllenge is outstripping reality. Y's ability to deliver IT to IT all of the problems, most of the problems that previously would have captured the front of our attention.

have been moved out of the way. Sensibility to .

chAllenge is now being tuned up ung.

Yeah no um I think it's too but I am just amazed by that. I mean, I feel sometimes were increasingly I can just a different the move now in um setting a different society i'm sure is the same with you and you are going up. But the britain I grab in was a place which which liked resilience.

I mean, we admire resilience. We didn't admire people who wind and mulled. In fact, those are the people who avoided at all costs.

God, she's a winner. God, he's a winner. I mean, you know, and people said things like, you know, mustn't grumble is one of my favorite. How are you mustn't grumble now would say, what? Actually, i've got stage for cancer.

Not sure that's grumbling.

I know. But we talked about IT like that. People from that generation still saying, friend, that journey got cancer moment is like, so boring, not so boring. Everyone I grew up with was like that.

Now you might say it's something unhealthy about that, but there's you actually something healthy about IT too, and there's something healthy about assuming that everyone has their troubles and so they don't need you to add yours to their list of things to worry about that day. And no, cherie block, and encourage me what you can. So on a city that bring him down.

it's it's a weird sort of self fulfilling prophecies, pedestrians ing victim hood, that there is a limitless sky on how much victim who do you can claim you, whether if your status and your prestige is downstream from your accomplishments, there is a limit on how much you can accomplish because you need to go out and fucking do IT right. Reality is going to constrain how much impressive stuff you can go and do.

But there is an ineffable university. My athletes foot and my gluten intolerance and my chronic flatulence and my, whatever else. Those are things that you can just continue .

to accumulate, like trinkets. Yes, I just find those people boring. I just don't care for victims.

Od I think it's undesirable emotion. It's it's a sign of a rather undesirable person. Um I but I don't know why we've given into this. I just genuinely particular in britton. I just baffled LED by IT because IT wasn't the country we had.

Well, maybe it's, you know, how you said your solution for courage was to surround yourself with courage people, if you kind of get this memetic wave, yes, almost moving through where fewer courageous people around, what creates fewer courageous role models, which means.

you know, yeah, yes, yeah. And you have a thing of manding persuaded to become cringing unique.

a good thing. Well, that's another reason why you .

know this conversation .

around the guy in the subway so interesting. Because is he, is he really supposed to stand up for the women? Or is that, is he man splaining? What if he man blains while he stops a woman down? The answer around her.

and of course, the answer to that is the error has to say, you know what, there's no such thing as man splaining, at least, is not very important. Get on something more important, like women not being insulted on the subway. You know, choose, choose, choose your priorities.

With the denial of sex differences would leads to the conclusion that that woman can like, why the woman? Why should the women stand? Why I shouldn't they use their upper body weight? yes. yeah. To push this fatal field, may I act of this lady?

Well, they say, is actually believe that one that doesn't meet reality very well. I'm not sure anyone would be very happy if the men in the carriage said to the woman, women in the carriage.

go on, go on. Yeah.

we've had our centuries of picture higher, right? What is IT this one? I got my goat recently with them.

So IT was in the U. S. I IT always happens now, and everything comes about conflict. And clinton was won. The worst culprits are doing this. They, they always say this thing, if you ve got to stop any war ones that they say, no, the first victims of war or women fucking not the men and men who do most of the fighting and the dying. He clean this point is, well, then the their windows and then .

yeah the the the poor widows of the men are the dead .

yeah there's actually the british M O D has a thing of as a special section now dedicated, I think thanks to the impressive inside of that military expert, Angelina jolie. Uh, they have a special bit of the M O D dedicated to women in conflict. Suffer of women in comfort.

Why do I have a the stuffing of manning conflict as well? Such weird priorities. Our age is totally unserious. This age is so unserious. So why you can't help thinking that at some point the main ax, the bb arries, were just break in, made ourselves a week.

But it's so captivating, right? This is what I meant when I said, you know how we progressive beyond peak woke because IT seems to me like both the hyper walke and hyper anti woke thing is capturing so much of the attention.

There's just, I so bored of these people there are so ridiculous, can spend any more of my life, life listening to them. I don't want to listen to the slowest kid in the class. I don't want to go to his or her speed.

I don't want to talk to somebody so mentally impaired that they think that we are a weirdly have afforded tic species, or that you can, the clown fish is a useful species to interpret behavior of human beings like we can go at this speed. No, no. Twenty years ago, at the door of the internet age, we had hope that we would get so much farther in the twenty first century. Here we are, this stupid society slowed down by many x debating the first thing we knew, boy or girl. Like, no, not going at that speed.

Amo rada o did an advert for H S B. C recently, which you may have missed. H S P C rewrote three classic fairy tales that mux called fairy tails.

And IT shows that women don't mean at all. With financial attitudes shaped as early as five years old, the new book chAllenges traditional gender stereotypes. The new book called fair tails, princesses doing IT for themselves, reimagine cinderellas leeming beauty and responsible as successful business women.

Prince charming. Charming is a race of the .

main character, ama. Redco read to them. So in the end, the princesses didn't need the prince to save them.

They set up their own businesses, save their money and then spend IT very wisely. Maybe one day you'll buy a tower or set up your own shoe business. That's a quote, said the .

tennis players, the worst. I mean, I read Megan markle book of the bench and that's worse. That's worse.

Um wow. Yeah, what a inspiring tail fairy tail is. So process is doing IT for themselves.

You ve seen the the south bk epsom of cartman wakes up. He is a nightmare. Have seen cartman a nightman IT. Turns out he is a diverse black woman.

IT is characters really cost, and all of his friends kenning everyone else are diverse feet, male, or trying to racial characters. And then calm wakes up from the nightlife his mother come. what? What are you having? Another dream.

Once you get, know, my all my favorite characters in in the cartoons have been replaced. I eviction diverse women and IT is OK up. okay? The CEO of disney isn't hiding under your bed.

Would you check? Would you check? Would you check? mom? OK, I checked.

She's not there more did he is going to come out again. And face of my favorite is, I think you like first women. I love this guys.

God, they keep doing IT. Um yeah I mean, the same thing. But there was rather unappealing Young woman who was meant to well is playing to no White and the new disney and no White villa. No, no, no.

somebody else. And SHE. But SHE said prince charming wasn't a prince.

He was a stalker. yeah. And he didn't need a prince charming to discover that he could be the woman SHE could be. I mean, this is like sub bar obama, circa two thousand and seven, like the prince is is the person she's been waiting for .

or something you your sister keeper.

And why didn't they invent new tail that I can never understand with that, why they just invent new tails instead of screwing up every existing tail. It's love. Make your boring movie about an inspirational tale of a woman who wants to start a business and then doesn't have some success. I mean, okay, make that in to a film. Why you have to go in RAM second rape of pilot of the the storehouse of stories of people like bread coup .

is playing snow light for daily. Why did you see that announcement? You don't see this. Let me tell you.

Jermy borrowin bench pero are doing that own live action remake of snow White with bret Cooper as snow White because she's like western trained, right? So she's very well trained up, supposedly a very well trained actor, you can say apparently like the triple threat podcast acting. And they announce that are the week it's gonna coming up next year.

Got I hope they slow. There's a .

rumour that disney has had to result a ton of scenes, including all of the dwarf scenes, because originally the dwarves went dow. They were like a multorum tio, just group of different people.

They were diverse.

ethnic women. IT was the sun thing again, but apparently this is just a room. But apparently theyve resht IT all of the scenes with the dopes to C.

G. I. Actual dwarfs. Oh, so you've gone full. Yeah.

because I know that there was a, there was a revolt of the dwarves, which is something you don't hear everyday. No, there was revolt of the doors because of because dwarf actors who have their equity cards annoyed because there's not many dead jobs. Yeah.

presume that they should have at least been seven. Yeah, was a plus stone actor one one to do all .

seven stance what you could have. Fine, I guess .

he depends on ding you to .

spread around the country. The point that actually was a pandy rebellion about this, because these are sound of you like death roles we ve got.

Is this not the same the people who didn't cast that? Is that not the same group of people that would say we can only have a gay actor playing a gay man, and we can only have a act playing a black man.

and we can only people as such? I went, use the word yeah. I mean, that again, have got time to go.

Th Epace o f t hese p eople m arketing i s p retending t o b e o ther p eople. People will be shocked that most people who play hamet are not themselves members of the danish royal family. Welcome to the world of makebelieve.

a charity shop in swansea, asked people not to donate sex toys. Bonanos customers have been asked to refrain from donating used and unused marital aes as they aren't quite the sort of toys were .

looking for when they say we want like your old books, your old toys. I didn't mean second toys. A perfect good policy for a second hands shop customers rifling through the second hand builder event. What do they got in here?

It's addressing room. yeah. Customers were also reminded that the branch had C, C, T, V, so that these items can be traced back to the original owners.

Oh, oh, according that means, that means you, that's like A, A, A thing in australia, boom, to step the next morning. Got IT do this good over the head, but he keeps .

landing in bananas.

Then they is a deal that i'll never die. Yeah, yeah.

Well.

thank you for that story that was beautiful. Well, i've got another. Is there a lesson we can take from this?

I think just be careful when you put your dildos really is the matter is the moral of, yeah, never leave your dildo in banana. Definitely in the barin bin school in laugh, ett has refused to celebrate halloween because IT isn't inclusive while going all out for L G B T plus history month. Is that much history with L G, B T .

plus gay history? I mean, a lots of gay people in history. And there is that, but is also what we used to call history. Um there is a much tea history. There's A B .

history.

I mean there are sort of i'm a bit skeptical about byle xul but um as a bit of by sexy in history because um but I mean again, these people are such ignorant as they never know anything. I can't tell you, Chris. I think I have to deal with on the shit and they just don't know anything and they keep like the owl thing.

They keep reporting their social discoveries as if people didn't know them before and everybody knows the stuff that they are trying to bring out. And it's just very tedious. And again, what's happened to the mainstream thing that why aren't we concentrating on big subjects, big authors, big historically issues instead, is boring, slow pace here at arc.

We're going to be attending at some point this week when I can know about the tagline, is something about a Better vision for the future, a more positive vision for the future. Yeah, Better story, Better story for the future. Sorry, job.

And what is your .

how would how do you think that we can begin to tell a more positive story for the future? Because IT seems to me that much of the proposals are quite easily criticize and often rightly so. But does this is sort of zero some view of happiness and growth? Somebody else is happiness somehow detracts from mine? Well, less particular british of you, of course.

very much. That guy has got something as because i've .

not got is taken IT from, yes, what's a more positive vision of the future.

But one would be that we're not facing imminent apocalypse and catastrophe a all the time from every possible direction. I'm particularly not ones that people have whipped up a new generation into a further over. I mean, I think that the Green apocalyptic thing is a particularly damaging.

The Young people, I think, is very, very bad for their mental health, very hard, very, very detrimental to their sense of how they build the future. And I think a lot of Young people have been like to about the proximity of of a global climate catastrophe. I mean, every time there is an actual catastrophes in the world, our leaders go straight back to the climate catastrophe and the climate crisis call IT.

What is happening is not a crisis um maybe a problem to be managed but is a luxury calling such things a crisis. A crisis is like of my choose on fire. And that's a crisis not like is possible that in forty years will need more A C I don't see that the crisis um but so yes, but I I think that in general, there are several things that a big stories, big narratives of people being in which is um innovating, that is the sap energy out of the society. You could feel IT the hopelessness ness if you tell Young people they are gonna burn to death a the hopelessness of saying, you know, you you you can't change anything or that this is the trajectory we're on.

I think that one of the other ones in the Green stuff is that the the hopelessness of saying people, effectively you shouldn't leave any footprint on the planet, including children, including children um and just to put one thing out there about the hopelessness of that, I mean, there's this new thing that many cities have signed up to, including london uh, which which is a future in which, among other things, we will not be allowed to move around very much and we will be allowed to flight perhaps every yes. I think IT is what's this is this of cities what's IT called i'm blanking on name is this new proposal for cities and twenty thirty or something the sidecar has signed up london to IT is when these carbon neutral fantastic fun twenty thirty yeah and and one of them is you won't be out to fly more than once every x number of years. And of course, none of IT makes any sense because among other things, all that means is part of the fact the airline industry is destroyed.

Is that what that means is the cost of airline ticket will be like forty times higher. But so they always assume you can do all of these things and nothing will change. Amazing you will be to put a rule like that in that you own, destroy the airline industry, whatever.

But all of IT is just so anti human. I mean, IT is so antar man. The aspiration of human beings should not be to be born, fight against the patriarch, leave no carbon footprint, and die in the most ethically fine manner, preferably taken out of the swiss clinic.

You know, in the night, burned in a cardboard box is not a very heroic c narrative, you know. And I think that actually, we do our entire lives around stories and around narrative. And we should not have the unique narrative that i've just laid out. We should have heroic c narratives. I mean, for instance, of the narrative of the a adventure of life being an adventure that you set out on a path and hope, you know, hope that yourself out in a heroic path, or, listen, exciting path.

You know, I mean, the counter point of the one I laid out earlier of the one, you know, you don't know the account part of the one I laid out earlier, which is the, you know, everything that's gonna happen if you go along this path of things other people have persuaded you to say is what you know, what you're going, you know everything to say, and you know, kind of what project for your life, for beyond, oh, you know, I say, well, yeah, there's another project as well. And it's the one that I and I suspect you are in cells in our life, which is, I don't know exactly, I don't know with that certainty, I don't know what happened, but if I put one foot fairly sure footedly in front of the next and and trade well and orient myself by things like truth, sure, I don't have the certainty. But it's an adventure. And it's my adventure, your adventure. You actually owned IT and then fancy that, you'll actually have your life.

We can feel proud of what you ve got to, right? Because you won't be venture acquired by somebody else.

You didn't spend your life saying things you don't know or mean or believe or just a repeating like a parade. In order to keep in with a group of people, you shouldn't seek the affirmation from you. You, you will live your life.

Remember that the outcomes that most people get, the ones that you don't want, in any case, the average american is obese. Divorced him with less than one k in the bank. So doing doing what everybody else does sounds like a very fire strategy, but the outcomes are ones that you don't want yet.

What I think that can be the case with with financially successful people, I mean, can be the case with people. I I often say that people are going into professions which they don't like. And and again, it's it's interesting. I mean, some of them, there are ones that people apologize for as you talk to them. Notice that Normally these days, one of the biggest self deflecting fashioned is lawyers you say to somebody know what are you doing i'm a lawyer I think why that you spent five years in .

full l time education, three years and developing to and Normally it's like they think.

oh well, it's not very interesting or something but I why would you do something where you am a lawyer? It's fantastic. I love doing .

this that british lawyers.

again, no of americans do that as well my point, financially well rewarded, you know and there's rules you can follow on that like like there are ones I don't understand. You are doing a job that pays you well and allows you to provide for your loved ones that's worth doing. If even if it's not your optimal role, doing a role that you don't much care for and you're not providing for other people and you don't see any particular purposes like that's probably not a good .

idea or you could go, you know the other options and the roots open to you that would allow you to also provide the family you are providing for.

yes. Yeah, the bravery narrative .

is definitely one that I think is lacking. And this risk aversion that we have, this Young people getting their driver's licenses later than our most commonly living arrangement for men, and to the edge of thirty five .

is living at home with their parents, are four people .

into full time employment later than ever. You know, I think about, you know, when we were actually know you are the worst person to talk about this, he told me you.

but most be no risk of current lazy on that. They manifest .

similarly. Most people could, seventeen years old in the U. K. Drivers license. I want to be free, I want to be liberated. I don't want to have to be asking them and dad for lifts. And um yeah there's .

not a .

there's not a narrative of adventure.

No, I I think that is important that because I think that you you don't have a narrative adventure and success and an idea of what that looks like um you know you are disproportion is likely to to live a more miserable life um but I think probably both of us to some extent of worked our way out as we've done IT and you know tordona path is not completely clear and if you said to me what are you going to do in ten years time out because I can particularly tell you, tell you roughly what I like to do is not entirely clear IT might be if I was in a corporate law, are hoping to make partner or something like that. But yeah, I mean, the the lack of clarity on this is should be energizing.

I have thought, well, that's what exciting about IT, but also for the desire for certainty, which is also exactly why the conspiracies m comes from, right? Because IT IT removes random chance from the world and makes everything coordinated. Rather than coincidentally, that desire for certainty really dissuade e people from going in, doing something which has potentially outsized outcomes.

Look at what happens, the narrative of leaving home or leaving the village or leaving the town. There's every reason not to go. Because if you go, you risk a lot of things. One of them is fAiling. And if you go and you fail, then you have to go back to, are you from .

between you like?

And then you can cancel yourself that you tried IT, but IT didn't work. A lot of people will not even make the try, because I think IT wit work, so they never leave and other people go, and they finally make IT to the city.

And I think that this is a story as old as a species, if finally make IT to the city, large governing place, and they they make, they make IT that no one of the reasons why new york is a thrilling city is is filled with people making IT, you know, I mean, twenty people who will fail. And it's it's very harsh in the way, because the two are so coast together. You know, millionaire blocks will have A, A, A veteran with a sign lying on the street outside.

So you always and and then you get that simultaneous thing of success and the and the mirror of IT of desperate failure. Or I didn't mean that a judgmental win, the case of the effort, but death, but your life very close to each other. And I suspect that both of these things fire up. New york is all the time.

Yeah, well, you're getting to see how far you could go and how far you could fall shown yes, in front of you all the time. Ah there's an interesting study by can this Blake in australia that looked at a wealth inequality in local ecologies, positively predicting. Self sexualization of women in online dating profiles so I think I followed that yeah.

If there is high wealth inequality, women both see the sort of partner they could get in their wildest dreams, under their worst nightmares. And IT positively predicts more sexualized images in online dating profiles and social media. And her argument was that IT arms up a woman's a competitive edge in terms of finding a partner that they think would be able to ensure they don't end up down at the bottom of the inequality distribution, and instead they end up in the clouds where they've seen people's outcomes occuring.

But of course, there are also people fake red. So I mean.

but that's the effective way to play the game.

I was once in india that had A, A, A guy. I got talking to him.

I said, I said h we were talking about how easier otherwise dating was in the outskirts of delhi, which means the slums and he said the trick is um he did describe as a trick is you if you meet to go you like you, you go for date with you borrow your friend's shoes for the instance theyll be a friend who has a pair of trainers, sneakers that are nice, good, and you borrow his shoes for the date. And then like another time, you might borrow our friends motorbike. So like the pool of men helps .

like soft. okay. And the idea, I have one good dating outfit in vehicle between ten.

and he said the idea was, you get the woman to say he loves you and you marry you, and then you do the reveal somebody, his shoes, your shit shoes, yeah. Which I thought was both horrific, admirable, he told IT to me like that, and horribly recognizable thinkable. The people who spash our money in restaurants and things you don't really have IT at all, pretend to live ove their means or do live about their means.

It's all to try to entrap a mate. I think people do a lot of sex. Yeah, I know i've seen .

do us much, ladies and gentleman, do us. I really appreciate you. What's coming up next working people expect over the next few month?

Um I don't know. I know what I expected the next few months and going to a couple of war zone and db report back.

I appreciate you. Thank you.

My thank you.