#740 - Nomad Capitalist - How To Travel The World And Pay No Tax
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Hello everybody, welcome back to the show. My yesterday is Andrew henderson is a founder of no mad capitalist, a global citizenship expert and a financial consultant known for helping people with offshore strategies. Should you stay in the country you were born? Is that the best, happiest place for you to be? What if there were a different option? Well, that's Andrews entire philosophy. To go where are treated best, expect to learn the best travel hacks to save on taxes, what IT actually means to have jewel citizenship.

White amErica ranks so low from attacks and financial standpoint, what you should do if you don't to renounce your citizenship, but do want more international flexibility, the best visas to get that are easy to acquire and much more very cool, real stuff that someone's made an entire career out of treating the entire globe as one market that you can kind of move between. Most of us think that that ends the boundaries of our country, but Andrew sees the world in a bit of a different way. And yeah, that's like at least a bunch of things that you'll take away from this that you've never heard of and never even thought of.

And I think encouraging people to see themselves as citizens of the world is A A good thing to do. I think I genuinely think that Andrews, making the world a Better place. So I really hope that you enjoy this one this monday.

Don't forget, doctor joe dispenser is joining me on modern wisdom, one of the most requested guest. And that is a huge three hour long episode. And you will miss IT if you don't have subscribed. So make sure that you do. I thank you.

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And there IT, was that hologram trading card. One of the rare is the last one I needed for my set, shiny, like the designer hand back of my dreams, one of a kind. Ebay had IT.

Now everyone's asking, no, just beautiful. Whatever you love, find IT on ebay. Ebay, things people love.

But now, ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Andrew henderson.

How do you describe what you do for work when you meet some on other copy il party?

I'd like to say that I help people go where you're treated best. Those are five magic words. I learned them from my father and very Young age.

He gave me a permission slip. I didn't have to stick around where i'm from. Um I didn't have to stick around and take care of my parents because they didn't want their kids taking care of them. They want to their kids to go where the best opportunities were. And he thought back in the ninety nineties, where I grew up in the united states, there would be Better opportunities by the time I got around to being in business.

And so what i've discovered is if you live in the united states or if you live in a country like IT, you're probably paying way too much in tax on that, saying you should pay zero, but you're probably paying too much for what you're getting. There's probably some things holding you back. Uh, I think what we're seeing now, this is a lot of opportunities in business around the world and increasingly, this multipolarity where the us.

Is pitted against other places. And so this going to be a choice which market you want to sell to. And so we help people that know about capitalists produce taxes, become dual citizens, find opportunities around the world that most people don't talk about because i'm a pretty contrary guy. And I think that what we think is the best is often not.

It's strange having read and listen to a goodness of your work. It's from first principles. It's kind of weird that people presume, well, this is the place that I was born. So this is the place that i'm supposed to work and live and die and bank and pay taxes and date all of these .

things at well um and I was born in clive and ohio in the U S. Right in the lake and right across the lake from canada. And I look and I say, what if and i've been born right across that lake, I in the grand scheme of things, that lake is a pretty small, pretty small thing.

And if you're canadian, you can leave your country and you can leave your tax burden behind. For one thing, you don't have to follow canadian regulations when you live overseas, you have a passport that for years emits. It's the joke, uh, that people respect a lot more and people are more open to giving a bank account.

Other countries just take a life as a global citizens. City is here. Life just as a canadian. Traveling is a lot easier. You know people aren't pick in onya. And to say that you're born that close to where your identity would have been different to me, to me, to shows of the miracle of birth.

But not only you know if you the movie midnight in paris talked about you know where we born in the wrong part of you know earth history, know what you've rather been born fifty years ago you know we can't change when we were born, but we can certainly change where we were born if we weren't born in a place that we want um we can change that. I'd also happen to think that my father said, sure, when I was born in nineteen and eighty four, the united states, according to the start of studies that do this IT, was the best place to be born. But there wasn't a lot of competition.

I'm talking here from malaysia. I think it's the best value destination in the world for someone who can work from anywhere. And you would have never been been talking about IT in one thousand nine hundred ninety four, but you can talk about IT today.

There's a lot more competition. The world changes. The world evolves. And even if you were born in the right place, maybe it's not the right place today.

What about cultural displacement? I was born in the U. K. And I live in amErica on an no one VISA. And I this part of me that just feel culturally displaced, you know a lot of the um way markers that you would references and things from history and things from your past and stop from culture and stop from all the rest of IT that that can be a little bit disquiet what's that like as a global citizen?

Well obviously different places at different cultures. I think that if you look at IT in a sense were all the same. Obviously we all of the same motivations um in a sense we're very different. There are places that I think IT is difficult to adapt. Um I think that part of my background, united states coming from a very humble back around probably caused me at time to spend a bit more time in places where people were a bit less agreeable because you you're taught you we're i'm from that you know look inwardly first um but let's take malaysia for example. I think you have probably some of the kindest people in the world that equality that have looked at as being extremely important.

I look at a place that i've spent more time in the last year next to where you're from an ireland um so the most polite and kind people and welcoming people in the world that had an incredible job, you know, transforming their country in the last thirty or forty years. And I said to myself, I made those are important markers. So I think the things that we're used to, sure, there's places where I go, but I still have an american mindset and it's frustrating.

And I just just talk to my team yesterday with the people all over the place. You we're gna run this like a business run by a guy who's from the united states. And yet, being out of the united states for many, many years, causes want to developed an international mindset to where, if I were to go back to the us.

Today, I think I feel very culturally, this place for mayor, because, number one, i'm politically homeless. I don't agree with trump on everything. I certainly agree with the bad and everything um and yet if you don't agree on everything, that seems for a lot of people you are communist or you are a fascist. I think that people are at each other throats or I am from, I think that would be the ultimate, ultimate cultural displacement that someone who's kind of developed an international sense of um I thought wouldn't be very welcome there today.

How many passports and bank accounts and stuff do you have?

I think it's five passports now, always looking for you. I had a coach, he said, how how about one new passport in one new property a year? The properties I decided I kind of got pietists around the world could like just put my time up, have employees into places kind of get tired of thing in hotels.

But okay, the passports, I think for now i'm good um yeah we've opened probably dozens of bank of council over the world. We have mutio companies around the world. We invest in things like stocks all around the world.

And as I said, mean, we're really my business, no, my capital, and we're expanding to hire people around the world. We've largely been kind of europe focused over the years, but we're really doing a lot of work now and let amErica um hopefully soon in asia. So for me, if they got planting flags, I want to have as many flags as possible.

Uh, but I want them to be corresponded to what the opportunity is. I live a malaysia because is someone who couldn't work from. And I live a malaysian most of the winter now is someone who can work from anywhere and who can live anywhere for me.

The idea of paying ten million dollars for this apartment um and then paying five or six million dollars in tax because singapore can demand that just as a one time you purchase for a foreigner. I don't have to do that to live in a place it's marginally easier to live in the malaysia. This places six on a grand and everybody marvels at how cheap that is for what you get um and yet if I want a bank, I trust malaysian banks, but singapore polian banks to me of the gold standard.

So i'm looking for all the places around the world where I can take advantage of what are you the best at? And the reality is when we say, you know go where you're treated best, the place where you're from, they're probably not the best at anything. Um the us.

Does not have the best banks and of the safest banks. They have the most bank failures of any country in the world combined. Um so but if they are if they are the best of something, you you should use IT for that. I'm looking for places of the best, and i'm planting flags there, and I think places all around the world of the best at something.

How do you concept ze the different elements that a person has to manage your play with the country of residents, bank count, tax status, stuff like that? Is there A A series of nobs and delivers that we're playing with?

Yeah, I think so. I mean, what what I decided to do when our business was to make IT based on what i've experienced, made a lot of people out there will help you get a passport in the carribean. I thought there is a real world chAllenge of going out and doing this.

IT can be tough. I mean, you go to bank. A lot of banks don't want to take non residents in these days, for example.

But yeah, I broke IT down and i'm continue to add things to this. I mean, you mention dating. I think it's a great one to add.

Where should you be dating? Um I just had a guy who worked for me. He lived in when he broke up with his girlfriend of seven years. Okay, I was this a bit of the rebound phase going on, but I took him to a couple of our officers.

We had some work to do around uh other parts of kind of eastern europe and IT was a dramatic shock that like wall, these people are much more interested in me. Um then maybe someone back home where i'm just kind of standard fair. And I think that if you just look at everything in life and saying, am I doing this, the best people probably ask themselves similar questions just without the geographically element. So I decided to add this overlay of geography to IT.

okay? So tax is one that's important. How much tax you are paying, ability to invest bank accounts, quality of life. What else am I missing from the big, the big buckets?

Where's your company based, which is in part is based on where you live, right? The the the mistake is if you live in the united states, but you put your company in the british versions, you can avoid tax. They figure that one out, right?

I mean, you have to to move as well. But if you live in attacks when they placed like a malaysia, you can have your company and a number of places that serve you well. Um where are you hiring people where people have the best attitudes?

Um I don't know that we're paying people that much less than we paid them in the us. Um there's probably keeping more money than they would to an equivalent in american, but we can start off paying them less to beginning with them quickly, scale them up once the risk is reduced that can hire more people, try more things. Um I think for a business on or those are important elements, where's your business based where the employees based and they all work together.

But then again, there's the personal things. Where's your data stored? Um you know if you're ency pto, I think people should perhaps have a letter and the letter should be stored somewhere that's an asset haven.

Where's your precious medals stored? Um you know, i've always like to light weight business models my entire life. I've started my first business in nineteen.

I never wanted to have a business where I had to buy a ton of assets. I had have a factory. I think it's a business because then you could be profitable immediately, and then you scale and nobody owns you.

I think the same thing about life, if I want to live in malaysia, do I want to be, you know, drag down to all my stuff is stored malaysia. If I own certain investments, it's all sitting in my living room. I wonder, want to kind of a light weight lifestyle where i'm flexible um I think that's the name of the game in this century.

What the difference can you explain to me between owning a passport, being a citizen, being a resident, having a VISA? What, what, what do all of these different things mean? citizens.

So I mean, generally speaking, citizens are entitled to get a passport. There are some things where, you know, a stateless person can apply for a passport and what's the national but generally speaking, if you're a citizen, you can apply for a passport. So passports a travel document, you want to be a citizen.

Um you i've been talking there's kind of the latest version of an old scm, the mexican passport scan where some guy de puts your name in the system and they can print IT a passport but you don't have any the formal stuff that shows you've actually been naturalized. And eventually, historically speaking, people start traveling these passports. They've actually have a problem because you're not really a citizens.

So you want to go through the proper channels to become a citizen and therefore to get a passport. Um so there's in a number of ways to get a passport. If you have A A parent or a grandparent or a great grandparent in many cases, who comes from somewhere, you could potentially go back and get that citizenship. You can go back to you .

can go back to a great grandparents generation and knocked on the door of the embassy and say, hi, fancy a passport.

In some they took a back even further um like italy for examples as long as italy existed or slave okay they even went back one one further recently yeah um you have to get your documents I ve missed the further back, the harder is to prove. And there are some exceptions like in the case of italy, if somebody became american before you before the next one was born, there was no dual citizenship.

There is some obvious, but yeah, you can go back to your family tree and you can track that and you can get a citizenship that way. There's citizenships you can invest in um but that does informal programs in a number of informal programs where if you're starting a business in hiring twenty people, there is probably a country that would like to give you citizenship and exchange for doing that. If you want to make a donation to occur by an country theyll give you a passport a matter of months and that of course you can just go and live in some country, eventually become naturalized two or three years in argentina, up to you know thirty years in same marino in in europe peno or or something like that um and so to be a resident gives you permission to live somewhere.

A country like malaysia is never really going to give any boy's citizenship. Asian countries is not really their thing. Citizenship is kind of an ethic thing. But you can be a resident.

And so I can have a residence permit for a certain period of time, as long as I keep my nose clean, as long as I maintain whatever got me to permit, whether I marry to a citizen, whether I invested, whether I did started the company. I'm a resident. If you're a resident in a european country, you know, if you go to the U.

K. Six years, you live there x number of days a year. Eventually you can apply for citizenship. And so, you know, there's different ways to look at this. Ireland, for example, if you live for five years, you can apply for citizenship, arguably one of the best passports in the world, not in the european unit, but also has accessed to live and work in the U. K.

Everyone lights the guy rish um and yet you can live in island for those five years as a special tax status that locals don't have, but that foreigners can I vail themselves off so you could live in ireland, speak english, have all the services, pay some tax, but not the fall. Fifty two percent people are paying on their salaries and then get one of the best passports in the world. So there's different ways to approach IT.

Plenty americans now just want they want a residence, permanent mexico or argentino malaysia is a place to go and be welcomed. They want a citizenship just in case something happens ah they want a citizenship because I think in the future, being in american will be bad for global business. I've seen that myself um but some people want to move so it's no is this a plan b? Is IT a back up or is IT like, hey, what I did, I don't want to live here anymore. How do I move somewhere else? How do I navigate the world?

Yeah, how just how badly does the U. S. Rank on your global list of places from a attacks and financial perspective?

And if we ranted on tax, I mean, IT is the one country that just across the board, taxes citizens no matter where they live. Here's the international of you. I'm a pretty liberta ian guy.

I believe in lower taxes. I don't know why you have to pay so much tax in the us, especially because you get nothing. Even my father shares the same view he likes to travel to germany.

Now he likes to travel to europe like, right? You know what? At least here they're getting something.

You don't get anything in the us. And even all that said, I know no one never signed up to pay high taxes. But if you live there, you know the in the U.

S, you're gonna pay the high taxes. If you don't want to pay them, you should be lad to leave. But the U.

S. Is the one country that without restriction taxes, you no matter where you live. Now if you're a business owner, you can incorporate your business somewhere offshore.

You can pay yourself as an employee e that offshore company and legally not have social security tax. You can examine to hold bunch of money. You can differ additional money at a pretty low rate.

And that saying you're going to move overseas and pay the exact same taxes we help americans pay a lot, lot less. But you stop to file. You still have to keep track of all the rules that what happened when I gave up my us.

Citizenship was I was suddenly able to access a lot more of my company's capital, our companies of cash flow company. We don't have to reinvest in all for our growth. I took some money out.

I built the collection of pantages up, so now I can travel around and live the lifestyle that I talk about, always having someone comfortable to go. I couldn't do that. I've got an apartment here in coal and poor its own by a company.

Nobody in the jurisdiction of the company understands IT. Nobody in malaysia understands IT. IT was done for one reason.

It's the legal way for me to acquire real state is A U. S. Citizen without paying a huge amount of tax. And so there's all these restrictions that americans have. Again, if you stay in the us.

Hair taxes, if you want to vote, if you think trumps gonna lower your income tax rate two percent, good luck. But if you leave, you should be loved to leave. And I think that australia tip telling in the way that the us. Is going canada, there's been people talking about IT. There's this notion now that citizenship is not as much a privilege as IT is a responsibility .

to obligation that even if .

you don't drive in the roads, even if you don't send your kids to schools, why are you paying? Because you're american, you should pay for the private for I didn't choose to be born here. And again, I was born fifty miles from canada.

And so for me, that's what's pretty unfair. And so and then that regard that must rank like the lowest of all. I mean, my friend is from norway, and if he just leaves the country and moves to due in the first three years, he has to pay a certain amount of tax.

But after that three years he's done. And if he moves to any number of nice countries that they like, he's done. So that's like a very, very small version of what the us.

does. But the us, for as long as you are a us. Citizen, you have to pay. And you know what, if I liked the us. So much, i'd be willing to pay that low relative tax.

But for me, the issue is I think it's offensive that there's this idea that since the civil war, just having that citizen chip means you should have to pay if I live there. Uglily paid. That's the deal.

I was fully compliant when I live there. I didn't agree with the rates, but you follow the law. I think people should have the chance to, if I think anything else is kind of like abuse.

Isn't wasn't the one other country with that global tax thing?

Yeah, I was funny because I had an employ mind that said, I have an eric train and taxi driver at this eastern african country next to ethiopia. IT broke away from ethopia and the nineties, I think, and they imposed A D asper attacks. I think that was two percent. And anybody's living overseas, and I think that I go, if you want to renew your passport, shows you the attack IT really wasn't enforced.

Because, as you can imagine, like the united states, is a lot more global power to influence banks and set up by a rest offices and everything else an era trade does war torn kind of the north korea of africa um and she's like, yeah the guys that he isn't pity that the s protects uh so yeah they do IT um again, other countries that in limited circumstances do IT australia kind of tip coming in. I think you'll see more countries doing a defective version of IT as in it's already kind of the. You're leaving a country like australia or like canada maybe, and you just kind of live a totally digital, no mad lifestyle with no base did you really leave? Maybe should still pay us.

So it's getting worse, which is why I think having second pats port is important. I'm not opposed to paying list. I, I, I will spend some time in ireland and I will pay something, but I don't think I mean, for fifty percent of your income, you know it's easy to make forty grand and to say, hey, i'm happy to paid my my forehand.

No one's are arguing with that. When you run a business that makes a lot of money and the government almost gets in your way more than a they're helping you and you realize will wait a second over there. They're doing with five percent texts.

What why do you need fifty? And by the way, have you been to to buy recently? The roads are I have a lot Better than they are in cleveland.

We're i'm from what where's this money going? So I think there's a certain classic countries where they're clamping down because they don't like the competition that i'm talking about. Don't realize I can come to malaysia with a territorial tax system.

My company can be based somewhere else. Maybe i'll pay a bit of tax on my own personal sale, but my company will be entirely tax free. And I can take a divided and I can pay a couple of percentage points of tax at the most.

And I I support the country that the country I biotic stuff. Maybe I employed people and they're happy with that. Australia, the U.

S. In canada don't like that. Malaysia doesn't like that. What is the process .

of saying I don't want to be in amErica anymore? What is that?

You go to the U. S. Embassy overseas. I said all the embassy of.

and so you have to leave. You can't tell amErica in amErica that you don't want to be amErica anymore.

Not because once, because generally speak, there is two appointments. And you go in the first appointment, they kind of explain IT to, are you sure you wanted? Do IT okay.

And then generate a combat IT could be, you know, the same day. IT could be a week from now. IT could be six months from now.

And some some countries depends on which embassy's dealing with um but after that second appointment, you you leave your passport and you walk out and your stone is kind of transitional state as the state department hasn't approved IT yet um which is generally it's kind of just a defective process um but I me, you you're in the sense not in amErica anymore. So I mean, have you can walk out back on the U S. So like they're going .

to deport you to where of course wow, yeah I don't even think that have funny. So I didn't if you didn't plan this correctly, you could have no passport.

They generally like they ask me and I was like the most professional experience i've ever had with the U. S. Government was my patron like I would even say kind uh, with the people now that everyone has that experience.

Um but I did and they're O K. We want to make sure you can you want to show us see of another passport just to make sure we don't want you to be stateless st. There is there are a couple of people have chosen to be stateless and they've to go and like get some stateless travel document is really confusing.

No one's ever going to understand don't travel if you want to do that, you're going a tough life. But yeah, I mean, therefore, ally, I guess if the embassy doesn't force you to, uh, not every and not embers, not every embassy is onna force you to prove that you have another passport um I member, there's a story of a guy back when dual citizenship was far less common. I met this guy who lives in vanities.

I he renounced in the seventies because he wanted to become a vana ati citizen to be an equal footing for business. And you could not be dual. So we had to up the us.

There's no U. S. Embassy in vantage, two sweet flow to australia. They took his passport.

He's like, well, how do I leave australia now there? right? Well, let's on our problem and there is this whole discussion of like, well, you can just hang out for ninety days and we will deport you and we will figure out where .

to deport you.

what eventually he got like emergency password or something and he got sent back. But um yeah I mean, there is a little bit of planning required.

Yeah just what about exit tax that when you left is the is what what is that? Is there such a thing?

So yeah, there's the U S. Has an x attacks, by the way, a lot of countries, I mean, this is one thing that people pick on the us. I get what they do IT.

Um because the idea is if you made a whole budge of money here, you don't just get to wipe the slate clean and pretend that money wasn't made while you are A U. S. citizen.

A much of my wealth now was made when I was living overseas. We can argue with those roads and bridges that are doing IT for me. They would say, what you were still A U. S. citizen.

You still at our support if you have two million dollars or more if you earned, what's the inflation just to number for this year? I am probably if if if you pay like a hundred and one thousand dollars in income tax federally over the last five years, and that's what your income tax bill was for the last five years. Or if your taxes aren't in compliance, what you can you can bring them into compliance before you expatriate.

So if any those things are are applicable, then you've got to pay an exit attack. We're basically they sell your assets on paper. So we have had clients who come to us where the first time they come to us, they have you know ten million their business, ten million dollars.

And so if they leave, you know they started at for zero at a ten million hour game, whatever that is, that the tax minus a small exemption, they're like, well, I can afford that. Then they come back two years later. Now with fifty million, they can afford to pronounce. Yes, I because I did .

have a friend in in canada who has a number of businesses that have grown in all a lot and he he literally isn't able to pay the money to leave yep, like a financial prisoner of his own financial success.

yeah. So I mean, like canada and other countries have an exit tax when you become a non resident because their tax system is residential. If you live in canada, you pay tax on anything that you are and anywhere in the world.

So like I invest in cambodia, if I get a divided from cambodia and i'm a resident of canada, canada tax, that dividend mine is whatever I paid in campoy, whatever. So people think, oh, that's a citizenship based tax. No, because you can just simply leave.

You don't have to go to the embassy and give up your passport. You just have to demonstrate that you've cut your ties and you've departed canada. You can return to visit within limited in parameters, but you're not giving up your citizenship to leave canada. So he is the same exit text, just not the same requirement to give up his password. Yeah.

makes IT difficult. The last year was the first year that I was fully exclusively filed in the us. Yeah, IT wasn't like the U. K. Was coming, knocking on the door.

And I mean, i'm glad i'm glad that I didn't have to go through the forms that the reason that you have an account to understands this stuff, but relatively simple, I hey, I didn't spend ninety days in the united kingdom. Therefore I I don't I don't got to pay the united king of of any cash. But that's not the same as IT is in amErica in the U K.

Different different test depending on what connections you have. IT could be over forty six, could be on nine one but you um the day's test can be difficult because I think people think like an australian, canada, if I spend under one eighty three no no this is one of the tests is how long you spend there. But what are your connections? What do you have? But yeah they let you go.

The U K. Is not one of the worst ones. Um and and so IT IT IT IT IT is aggressive.

Is anyone else more aggressive than america? I mean.

california is probably the most aggressive of all if you are live in the U. S. And life in california, they are just to main.

That's unbelievable. amazing. You know what frustrates me? People say there's nowhere to go because they live in a bubble. They watch their local TV news. Let's be honest. By the way, is the propaganda in the us really that much different than the propaganda anywhere else? It's, you know they're telling you about the nature if they want you .

to hear um .

you know people live in the bubble and they say, well, where am I gonna because there are thoughts of, boy, are gna go is canada or italy or something like that? By the way, italy is a tax instead of now, I mean, least they realized we've got to bringing some money to this a joint.

I mean, if you can pay a flat hundred thousand years a year and you can make much money as you want, they also have a fifty to seventy percent reduction for the first five years on taxes. At least they've done something to bring people in. But you know what bonus me is there's nowhere to go, even in a country like ireland. Pretty laid back at the immigration office, really laid back the tax office, laid back compared to the U.

S.

You come here to malaysia. You come to a lot of places. IT is not what IT is in the us.

And i'm not saying you shouldn't know pay um i'm a big fan of following the law is going to where you go with the laws um you know why why try and fight and changed the laws and fight against all your fellow citizen. What you wish existed already exists somewhere. Just go there and just you're fit in.

Um but the idea that that there's nowhere to go is nonsense um this the enforcement system just the the divisive is but the adversarial relationship of the government, again speaking is a libertarian not a huge fan of a lot of government. It's much less every serial in some of these countries where's the police immigration tax? These handful of western countries, IT is almost unique. How adversarial they are.

What should people do if they do to announce their american citizenship, but they do on to try and dial their tax back.

What if I mean if again, if you're british, if you're canadian, if you're from anywhere else, you should just find in their place to live if you are american? Uh, I didn't pronounce immediately. I I I remember my father read, um have the tax system worked to me? He'd come up and read articles from the wall street journal when I was a teenager, and I said, what is like, if you live here, you don't to pay? That's ridiculous.

He's like, well, so here you can to renounce your citizenship. I like, maybe all do at thirteen, and maybe all do that because that seems ridiculous that they trapped like that, but never thought that I didn't move overseas in immediately renounce. I took advantage of dramatically lowering the taxes. So if you're investor, you're the disadvantage.

So right now, in a bitcoins up, and I was telling him, nobody move out of your high tax country because when bitcoin was at sixteen thousand, now is at forty five thousand, uh, because you would have saved that hold thousand and nine thousand doors delta in capital against tax as as an american investment is passive. Porter rico s an option. That's pretty much your option if you want to lower your taxes on passive investments.

But if you run a business and a business to find as not a one man or one woman show, but a business with some employees, and I can function without you, you can incorporate that business in some tax haven. I think if you're america, that probably should be a zero tax jurisdiction. Just that the two systems don't fight too much.

What would that be like? What an example.

Um well the U A E nt really anymore. That was one people think about is dubai and theyve really come in. And I had a one of our wealthiest clients of all time.

Message me at night. I love the U A, but um this new nine percent not a fan. Uh, hang on.

There was a decent system. I mean, depending on the business in the british version in islands, there's also multiple structures. I mean, you're pRobing I going to be running robust payment processing this. So maybe there could be a us element to your business to do things like credit cards, but maybe the parent company is going to move somewhere else.

And that depends like if the parent company, I mean many different things, but you know traditional tax havens, british virgin island, I love man probably more difficult than IT should be long kong now um you know panama is not as robust, but that's an option. Um belize, that's a bust. Um depends mean here in malaysia, lab awan is three percent but set of a company and probably a zero tax Jordan tion.

Figure out some kind of structure depending on what your business needs, depending on how people pay. You take a salary from that company if you're married and you both work in the business, both take a salary. Obviously that given this is that formal taxi fice um but if you're married, potentially can take that close to about two hundred and fifty grand um you can avoid social security and medicare tax.

And then on the rest of vate, you going to pay some lower rates tax instead? The question is, if you can use things like tax treaties or tax credits to pay that lower of tax to some other country, and then take IT again as a credit against the U. S.

You know, rather than moving to a zero tax country, do you move to a country where you can pay five percent tax in europe, for example, and then you use, that is an office set against the us, because you are going to pay the us. anyway. You must put some tax into europe and then live in europe if you want to, and then work towards your passport and five years.

So these are the kinds of things that go into IT. Um if you're gonna be american these days, you're gonna have to pay something if you make more than six figures um and again, you know what, if you like the country and you want the option to go back and you're like k for ten years, let me pocket a boat of cash. Um fine, keep the U S, pay the U.

S. I am not supposed to paying some tax. I'm just a guy who didn't want to live in the U. S, didn't want to be american.

And so why would you not want to be something and pay for the privilege if you like being at pay ten percent, pay eight percent, I mean, that's not so bad, so lot Better than what you're pay in now keep the american passport. You're not going to get as good a deal as as you would as a as A U K. Citizen, just being able to pay zero but such as life.

Um the chAllenge though is again, that passive income comes are you going to sell the business for fifteen million dollars the future because that's where they're onna nail you. And so that's the issue where you might want to look at if you're are only concerned about tax planning expatriation. Because if you can argue that your business is only worth one million today and you only have a million dollars another assets, maybe you're under that two million dollars threshold and you can leave with no access attacks at all.

And then once the business grows, you know, I mean, again, tax was not really my motivator for leaving IT was the frustration of I don't like the way the country is being wrong and I don't really feel like I want to be part of that anyway. So why not spatted? But I will say from a financial point of view, the time when that happened, I was very fortuity as my business worth a lot more money. Now if I wanted to sell IT, i'm going to save a lot of millions of dollars because I because I left when I was worth, not really that a lot.

What's the reality of this pointer ro hack?

Well, I mean, you actually get live there. I think IT probably action. There's different criteria.

But I was just called half a year. Maybe I was called a little bit more than half a year. I'm a more conservative guy and and i've seen some of these things.

People pitch like what was on the ones last year, the multiple pension plan that one got unraveled and they have these different schemes that various advisers promote like go, it's so easy. You could just do know i'm not a friend. The old is so easy because eventually that stuff comes crashing down.

Let's say it's a little more than half the time important we could to satisfy all the things. I do think IT attracts the kind of person whose like, can I just get on a raft and float back to miami? No, don't do that. Like don't do that. Um it's a place that is not that efficient.

What's the quality of life?

Like i've never been. I I I don't i've been there only once. I I think people say they tolerate ate and by the way, by the way, people say, oh, you know, it's like people move from california to florida in droves now and and they don't think anything of that.

People move from new york to texas and droves, I would argue, save a lot more in taxes. And maybe to have a closer cultural connection. Okay, a lot of people from new yorker in taxes now.

But you might have a closer cultural connection with someone in ireland, if you're from boston and if you from new york, then moving to dallas. But for some reason, moving to ireland, moving to panama is scary. Moving to texas organ porter rico is not scary because it's in the us.

I don't think a lot of the local porter reka nessa like this. Uh, the system that they have going on there, I think you have some of the same issues as if you move to a foreign country. It's not that efficient people tolerate that.

I mean, if you want to do to me with the bank, just prepare to spend all day. And so I get IT. And if you want to be in american or if you just like if you just can't, if you already have tons of money but you plan having tons more, I get there are certain people who want to go there.

For me the issue was, uh, I was I was single the time when I exported um I didn't think I would date american. And so you know many people i've had where their their best tax move is to move the porter reo. They're got a mexican girlfriend. Well, you gonna get a Green card. How are you going to hang out with your mexican girlfriend, right? Um so I mean that's where the dating piece comes in like do i'll take the colombians all take the russian like the okay not not anymore but is a marry but um that for me was the problem porter record is you kind of limited to who you can who you can be with.

What do you mean when you talk about the global citizen sandwich and the try factor strategy?

So the trajectory strategy is as I get older, i'm more focused on being in in one or two places and then just kind of briefly visiting the others for business or checking at opportunities. Um but for a long time, I said I can't aside. I just love at all.

I'm legibly very curious person. I'm fascinated by absolutely everything. And I would, you know say hi, I go to mexico and I got to have some mexico and I got, I said, let amErica in my life and then IT come to asia.

I love IT. This is great. And then I go to europe.

Okay, it's something this, okay. The true factor is you pick three home bases. He got either a residence, permanent citizenship. Theoretically, maybe there's a tourist in some countries and you basically have three home basis and you split your time between them. Now you can modify IT.

But in the pure try factor, as I called IT, was four months and one, four months and another, and four months and a third. So that might be, you know, from december through march, i'm going to be quality and poor words warm, then April, may, june, july and to go somewhere in in europe. And then, you know, the rest of year i'm going to be in that america.

And I want to experience everything the world has to offer. There's different business lessons you learn from in different places. There's different cultures.

Um I mean asian cultures is substantially different in some ways to what you might be used to in the U K. And in the U S. And so some people, twelve months a year, they are going to burn out.

A lot of people become to asia, they do the two year thing. That's why they call them experts. It's not permanent.

They're not immigrants, right? They don't plan on staying. I think if you spent four months a year in asia in the best month, you would love coming back.

Um and so that was the tree vector or and IT just so happens that in the kind of countries that I tend to like that can be very tax friendly. And in some cases, it's just like, hey, you didn't spend six months in colombia so you don't OS N A tax. The goal was not tax avoidance.

That was the size effect. And so i'm in the tax business, right? People don't come to me to talk about how they don't like their mother or they want to dance.

Also, they come because they have a problem. Think too much tax. And so I prescribed IT, as I like IT for the lifestyle you might like IT for the tax.

The global citizen sandwich is exactly lining malaysia. Malaysia is called poor. I'm not think is the absolute best place.

IT is the best value place in the, in the, in the world to live nicest people. It's humid and the wise, good weather, tons of consumer conveniences. I went to a five star hotel where we have our no mad couples live event last year.

They have a beautiful gentleman club, like a smoke, like a cigar lounge, got four cocktails and happy hour served by a guy in a White dinner jacket. Who knows everybody who's successful in the country. And four cocktails costs me twenty three bbcs in the most beautiful long bion's you wear of smoking jacket.

They come and they can get a haircut. I mean, is nowhere Better. You obvious ly wouldn't pay that in singapore, but I do trust singapore more.

If I have precious medals to store, or I want to put ten million dollars in a bank, i'd rather do IT there. I do think malaysian banks are pretty darn safe, but i'm not putting my ten million dollars. They just don't have many options.

They don't have as many investment options as many currencies. It's harder to get the money out. So i'm going to sing singapore next door.

That's the top layer of the bread that's like the cream duo crem the media part. The meat in the middle is where you live, malaysia. And then the other layer bread is okay.

I own a home in malaysia. The trade off is it's not really increasing in value. That's that's a good amount supply. It'll take ten or fifteen years for me to see much appreciation. I let that my investment is .

a lifestyle investment.

And so you know, i'm the one of the largest investors in a fund that a friend of mine runs in cambodia, I think, cambodia and released as some of the highest promise for capital appreciation in the next five or ten years of any market in southeast stage and is accessible. And so I wouldn't live in cambodia. I wouldn't bank, you know ten billion dollars in campo dia.

I don't think I need to live in singapore. So the nice media part in the middle is where you spend your actual life living. Then the layers on top are the extremes of the best protection. And then the more adventurous kind of capital appreciation can't and you .

anywhere you can buy land in cambodia as a non citizen on resident. Is that right?

No there's like four countries in asia. Thailand was was promising to open IT up and I think they scrapped IT um for high investors malaysia, japan, parts of korea. Forget the other one.

But malaysia actually the most open and self day， you can own land, so you can actually buy land, you can build a house. I have a friend is doing that uh in team body you can not, but you can own condo buildings. Now ah you know there's a program, you if you if you donate money to a charity endorsed by the king, the king will give you citizenship.

Then you can go out as a new limited camp audio and citizens buy what you want. But um you can also sort of cambodia company and and you can do that. So you know what my friend that was, he's out of the game body and company pull everybody together because it's not really cost efficient to do IT to buy one apartment.

Um but generally in asia, you're not going to get citizenship. And outside of like malaysia, you're gonna a the condemned. Um that's how works.

But they're very tax family places. They're very laid back, very last affair. People come to coal import that he goes a muslim country. And everyone who comes here, the most progressive people I know, they say, everyone told me, we don't care, especially if you not, if you're not malays muslim, and if you're malaya muslim, OK, they're going to judge.

But even if you're malaysian, but you're not muslim, and whether the shorter shorts you can wear, the tiniest tops you can do what you can drink, you can do whatever you want, we don't judge you. That's like that's between you and you are god, we don't judge you. So it's this very laid back place. I am a big fan talking about muslim .

countries that are both muslim and not the by being british. That is the uh probably the most common h after someone like A A season in a beat for the summer or or maglev for sanity or someone like that, a lot of people going to to buy a lot of my close friends going in, living out there. There was a period, some my friends have been going out, literally ten years was a period a while ago.

Where did you have to get? You have to know an amari or something in in. If you knew someone who is a murali, you can kind of get this extra blessing.

And then so the period for a brief while, maybe five years ago, up until five, four or five years ago, well, you have to go and do like a VISA run once every quarter or something. And now it's a little bit easier. And a continues to doing that. But what's the give me the thoughts on bike is from a british person's perspective, it's the it's no my capitalist in capsule ted in a single country.

again, i'm a bit of a contrarian, right? And I think I almost like coal and poor. I think this is the best value, but I almost like IT in a sense because it's not bangkok.

Or if you go to bangkok, I just can't like to do my own thing. So we had our company to buy for a while and we decided to move out. The banking, I think, is quite difficult. The quality of private banking .

is it's .

not ready. It's is not and I just had that experiences recently as two months ago. Um i've got to go and figure out you know what's happening with some money that I sent them because the the quality of service in the bank system, not impressed if you want to run a business, I think it's much it's really designed to for people who want to live there.

So our finance team is into blazy, georgia. Um and every time we wanted to do something, they're like just come into the branch. It's like the us. They're like people live outside of the U S.

What do you talking about? Like people live set to dubai, like we can imagine that like because people who live there who work in banks and stuff their dream was to live to buy what how can you not live divide. It's impossible. It's not really set up for remote Operations. So um and now the freeze now they're bring in this nine percent tax and they are applying IT more aggressively to even the freezing companies than like the .

nine percent tax. I haven't heard of this.

So well, there's this global minimum tax that they brought in on big companies. If you have you know hundreds of millions of dollars in revenue, the world got together. Instead, we can't have you moving all your profits to you bermuda's ts apply some global tax that applies across the board, not to businesses like yours and mine.

Or maybe you're making hundreds, millions but not much um and so they basically said, okay, everybody y's going to raise their rates. So a country like ireland, for example so okay, we're twelve and a half. If you meet the threshhold will bump up to fifteen.

But what also happened was some of these countries that wanted to kind of get along or like, okay, we will increase our tax rates just on everybody um in the U A E did that this said OK, it's can be nine percent if you run on shore business. But if you're in the freeze ones, which is where a lot of people would set up in and there's different freezing es in in dubai over the country as long as you're not working with other U A E know entities, okay. And it's like, you know you're not going to pit, it's still gonna zero.

I said, okay, that's kind of my hong kong. If you're based in hong kong, you pay tax. If you're offshore, there's in a way you can examine yourself and not pay any tax. Okay, fine, fair enough. Well, then they started creeping in more and more and more into the freeze ones to where now it's like most people running a business are gonna pay nine percent even like we looked IT into.

Can we just keep our our tradeMarks there? Now you after you get transfers icing, you've got to move money into the ue from your other companies to pay for the value of the tradeMarks that you're using. And then we're going to teach that at nine percent.

So the U A. E. Basically rolled out at nine percent tax on domestic companies.

And then it's kind of been creeping into the companies that don't have any connection to do buy. They just said, hate zero percent tax. What a nice place to go.

I can get a back account. I can get a residence permit. I give the U A, E. Incredible credit for making the residence process that you mentioned incredibly easy. IT is one of the easiest in the world.

And if you want to a personal live there, they've said, for now, it's going to be zero percent tax on your personnel. So if you would just have against stock or earnings or but well, actually, stocks, if you have dividends could be a problem. But if you just have capital gains, if you have a bitcoin, whatever, fine.

But if you're going to want a business that's based in the U A E, I don't think it's that ideal. But I give them incredible uh, respect for how we've made immigration super easy. And I just proves the point, if you run your country to where you don't have a big social welfare system, you don't let people get away with crimes.

Why wouldn't you let anyone who sets up a company, anyone who invest some money, why wouldn't you let them come and be a resident? That's the way the us. Used to be.

And so I see at that point, like it's kind of like the new american dream, anyone who wants to make something of themselves come on in. We're not going to make IT hard and they don't. But I think on the tax side, in an effort to play kate of the global powers, they got a little bit more aggressive than they initially thought. And it's not the governments thought that the banks are difficult, but not just unjust. I'm not impressed by the banks.

I mean, we are talking about a country that change the weekend a few years ago. And just people, people that don't know. The dubai weekend used to be friday, saturday.

So friday night would have been been a thursday night. And you went back to work on a sunday morning. And one day, one day, everyone just woke up and the government said, hey, guess what? The weekend is saturday and sunday. Now all the british like.

yeah you going to come on sunday like but the house that and and I think I mean sadi abby is kind of doing this now as well. I mean, barry was always on the more liberal ones. Um I I think the whole golf with the U A E being the kind of the biggest stand out, he has done an incredible job at what I would call.

Let's go out and figure out basically go we're treat the best. Hey, who's doing this the best? Okay, let's let's just implement that. Okay, what do they get going to OK that .

makes a perspective. Yeah how interesting, right?

I mean, know you know bit here's what I going to sess whether country's a failure and and I know this because I we have people who work in some of these countries and that's why I was more affordable for us to go there. No, that's not how we do IT. We do IT this way.

Well, maybe the result of suck, and you should change how you do IT. But your pride gets in the way. I have great respect for the U. A. In the other countries. I mean, they have a pride for their country, but it's not the pride doesn't get in the way of let's make the right decisions yeah and they did an incredible job on that.

How do you say like philosophically non monogamist when IT comes .

to the procedures? Yes, yes, yes. I think, I think, I think nine monogamy in in the context of choosing countries and policies and things, that makes a lot of sense.

One of the things that i've had in my head, as you've been talking through all of this today is, dear god, how much paperwork is associated with all of this you're talking about? I mean, dude, I had to submit and i'm aware I tried to get into very difficult to get into but to a three and six seven hundred page hard copy portfolio for my o one and you know, to get a social security number. And there's no license equivalency test.

AmErica has the worst. Hey, guess what? America, you can't drive.

No one can drive in america, right? No one. Everybody's a bad driver.

There's no license equivalency between the U. K. The U. S. I need to retake my theory test in order to be able to get a driver's license, in order to be able to get a cab. But before I did that, I had to get social security number. In order to get social security number.

How to show my I ninety four, but your I N four is only trigger if you have entered the country through the border within the last three months, which meant I had to leave to go to the bahamas, to come back just to trigger this arbitrary number of my point being. I've had to deal with lots of paperwork, and I essentially live in two country that i'm invested in some form or a stakeholder in two different countries. And you're this like big long octopus with his tent ticals wrapped around many countries. Like how does how would anybody get even begin to get this started without just drowning in terms of correspondents?

Well, I I was in a bank not so long ago um in serbia, and I think the banks are safe. Everything is a nice kind of diversification play. But I was never placed to put a lot of money. I went.

I said, okay, let me get a new debit card just in case I needed, I never going to need you, but just in case I Carry around like this many debit cards and I want to pick them up and they're like, o juv a dinner card. My, yeah, I guess that expired. So they are require by law to give you this card.

You can make payments in serbian dinars like nobody uses IT, but they are required for you to give you one and they're like, uh, we've got to cut up your debit card and we've to come back in a month and I here i'm here like once or twice a year. I'm that coming back. So you know what? Go with your treat best.

I'm just not going of a debt card and i'll keep a little bit less money in that account. And um you know that's what IT is. Uh i'm probably going to sell some land I own next door month ago was just the thought of, oh my god, I got to build a villa.

You know someone's probably built a village somewhere else and I could just buy IT if I want to. And you know what, maybe I should just rent to villa for a while and just like put the money to work. Um so I think that you've got know that kind of the whole thought crisis behind what we're doing is like you don't figure of the U S because yeah, I had some properties that I owe to the us.

And IT was the most laborious process. Now the U. S. Real estate market does have more liquidity than some other markets. But were I on these properties? IT wasn't that great and I sold them and there was just so many fees and so many things to do.

And just like I think like the grass was literally happened in too long and I got a thing in the mail like violation and they're like they just wanted to pay a hundred box that doesn't exist in all other countries. I just went through, I go through end of the year, I pay the bills for seven properties. I have one of the people in my finance team helping, and it's pretty, pretty darn easy.

And I have people who have helped me. It's in in many cases in many countries is more informal. Someone was your real to agent three years later, if you want their help with the organist thing that i'll want to go with and check IT out um you pay a few box so I I I I found that yes, there's bureaucracy.

Um I mean having if you grow the business large enough, you just build in house team that specializes in IT. We do IT in house but I mean the same with with two bites became too much to manage uh you know we just said, you know what, we're just going to go back where we were um so IT is go where you're treat the best. And I think that again, the us.

Is an that's an extreme outlier. I saw statistics not long ago that if you're getting a Green card in a view for I figured if it's like a sibling or what kind of family remember you're trying to come as through family unification from certain countries of india, mexico, china. You applied in one thousand hundred and ninety eight.

That's when you file that. You that's when you did all the paperwork to get approved. You are now coming and to finalize the process. In two thousand twenty was two thousand and twenty three then um now whatever you think about family reunification, I mean we do that for people all the time.

You know someone is a portico residence permit and they add their wife through family unitization takes you a month or two or something um there's something that the U S. System is broken. And again, even in ireland just got someone A A A work for IT the either days they can go and to work there and they can work for their own company and kind of a tax sufficient way for them to to live in the country, took me a month and a half.

The person made a small mistake. The solicitor pointed IT out, oh my god, i'm so sorry. I at the government officer, that doesn't happen in the U. I mean the us. Is an outlier.

very um adversarial or very content curous .

IT really is. I I mean and you are the best situation. I mean go into A U. S. Embassy in and i've been there in georgia, for example, you know, and just watch the visit interviews there.

I mean, no, I want to tomo. Yeah, I went to the the embassy that because the wait time I was eighty eight days into a ninety day assa about to go over, if I had, have been immediately banned from the country, for god knows many. So that rebel, a leave, go to god.

Uh, I had to choice between l salvor, belize and guma. That rebel, let's go to gutium a so I go to a go to and to get ein a berlin twenty twenty four this is two thousand twenty two. You'd take an ages because this backlog from covered for people getting a one application london twenty twenty four uh gutta mile next week and hey, guess i'm going to a more right um so that was I guess that was a little bit sort of no, no, you're .

still burtt. I mean, I think you kind of stand out as the shining, you know my god, I finally somebody I I like um an x question again. Now I I mean I I I think if you you're british or irish m and getting an l one is is more straight forward.

But no, it's it's you know people say, oh you you you hate the us. I just don't think they're best to anything. I guess prisoner population per capital.

Um there are they're not even Better to obesity anymore. So I mean, like, I just want to go where things are best and I would if if people take nothing away from this. I I just I never felt good in the U.

S. Again for multiple different reasons. But like, I started traveling. You know the tsa, they open up your stuff there yeah and so many interactions with the government are unpleasant that when you go to so many other countries, if you think IT must be the same, it's it's not the same. IT really isn't uh, that is just not the norm.

let's say, to someone who's listening to this. Um maybe two people, one of them american and one of them isn't. And thinking and reit made a bit sense that I I don't feel a massive amount of vanity.

I feel like I could do with the change, but I don't really know where to start and going to somewhere to simply be a tourist like I need to perhaps I need to work in summer regard. Where would you like you mention? The device is very simple. What are some of the other places that's like on the the new passport Brown starter kit? Whose what what's included in that?

So I mean, my focus had been an entrepreneur re. life. And I realized maybe twenty years old, I had a vantage phone, remember, like a boy phone, and I would, I would basically know, called call people for my business, or call businesses, hey, you want to buy some, advertise them.

And I I really pretty early on. Why can I live this anywhere? And eventually I started to do as I was, as I was traveling.

Uh, i've resisted the urge to move fully. But I there some years, I traveled more than a half a year and i'd be in china, nobody would even know. I would literally call my clients.

They went know the difference. Um and you know I I think that's the perspective I come from is you have something you can take with you so first I would develop that um is IT. You know i'm a cyp to currency trader on a stock investor.

I have an online business I called yeah free answer whatever I can take with me, the cool thing about the us. Is there is more flexibility and not tax advice, but there is more flexibility, generally speaking, on keeping your us. Bank accounts.

And so you know if you leave the U K. Or canada, there are more like you should probably close that. Um I would get that in line first.

Now I think you know call on poor this is like new york was like twenty five cents on the dollar and had just know four cocktails, twenty three box that's like one cocktail and boss vegas or something. Um you don't have to make as much, but I would get to the point where I can I can support myself. Um I mean, you buy this, have lot of networking opportunities um depending on what you do.

Um I think that depends on your personality. I take a place like an ireland where they speak english, where it's very open. I would say the U.

K, but the U. K. Has no way to move there. We had nice for a no, what we had nal for ogc, no mic capital life a couple years ago, I told him, like you get one of the investor VISA, the start up VISA doesn't really work even if even when IT rarely does work is like you have to be the next facebook or you have to be investing in the next facebook.

Like there is no way for a person with wealth or a business to move to the U. K. generally.

It's just really data process for that. Um you can get a job and move to the U K. And get married and move to the U.

K. But like a guy like me can not easily move the U. K. So to me that kind of a bull work. You know, I like a place like an ireland. Somebody else might like a place like a switzerland that has maybe more established on the what you want to call IT, I mean, dubai oba sly, as a lot of very new money.

What about poor advertising for a while? Come and live in lisbon is on G, M, T, will give you a VISA that simple and so on. Is that not simple to get to?

They are, but they get, they get to the tax programs. They had a great tax incentive of cricket rows.

right? They're looking to training people in the trading crypto.

I okay for cyp to yeah unfortunate. I've lost some confidence in portugal um not a bad place to live um for me. You know the places that I i've mentioned today know malaysia and ireland.

People complain in both cases for opposite reasons about the weather. To me the weather is the least important thing. If you can handle some humidity, turn on the air conditioning in ireland and double doesn't rain that much.

Um so I think the use case for particles like all the weather, so nice, i've never entirely understood that one. Um so some of their inside I have gone away. Um I mean, the answers there is something for everybody. Um I may think mexico is an interesting place. A lot of is that there .

is mexico simple to be able to spend A A three months, six months. S, i'm going to go and do my graphic design from there.

Well, so i'm a big fan of having a residence permit, especially now. So mexico technically is like the U. K.

You get one hundred eighty days VISA free. But much like the U. K. They're not doing that anymore. Hey, when you're leaving, i'm just here for the six months yet.

We don't accept that can get the hell out or i'll give you one month, then you need to leave um if you can get a Megan residence, which is pretty easy. I mean, everything's easy, nothing is easy, but it's the qualifications are straight forward enough. You have a couple thousand and income every month.

Um you can get a residence permit live there all you want. Obviously that if you could live there too long, there's a tax planning question. But yes, I mean, mexico is a straight at place that amErica is a place where if you have income, you can get a residence permit.

Asia is generally a place where you need to have wealth. Put some money in our back, buy a property, you know, put in six figures. Let amErica is the place where if you're just starting out, um hey, show us a hundred to thousand and twelve hundred two thousand dollars a month and income for the last three, six months, twelve months, whatever here's your residence permit.

You could live here all you want so um I think columbia is interesting. People have in mind hagen, i'm in bogota. I think all of mexico is interesting.

I'm in mexico city in particular for me. But there are so many cities to pick particles. Interesting, they get rid. The tax intent of italy has a very interesting tax and set of people like that. You know, this depends on what you want. And I I think we popularized the country of georgia, their attacks friendly, not as affordable anymore without east of turkey, south of russia in the cases. So now you are to.

in judge.

decrease ly conservative .

coming into land um yeah .

I made is a very kind of conservative, respectful culture layback. So like armenian next door, they were always the ones who then there there's like forty thousand armenia in eug. I I went there and I saw armenian restaurants.

Georgians were always more like chill and enjoy great food, great wine, great hospitality. If you know a georgian, you've got a friend for life. Um so in that regard is nice.

The culture is a little bit different. Um you know i've enjoyed IT, but I also see why I could could get stuck up on that. Um I mean, it's just something. And then the south east of asia, I mean malaysia, thailand um but that .

gone a little more restricted to wealth and presumably a little bit more procedural.

You can get digital, no ad visas. Thailand has the toilet VISA. You pay a fee every five years, so there are more affordable ways to do IT.

If your goal is not permanent, you can also come to malaysia for ninety days on a tourist visit. And I would guess if you left for a couple weeks and came back ah they give you another ninety days. If you're a westerner um know if you're not a westerner, it's thirty days and that becomes harder to navigate.

If you can make two thousand dollars a month, I think IT is you can get a digital know that VISA that may not last forever. But the question is, you know what's your level of commit into this for me? When I left the us, I said I lied to myself.

I'm going to do this for a year. I knew I wasn't coming back. I was just keep the house, don't sell the house um but I always knew I was IT IT was done.

I think for some people, there's nothing wrong. Ong was saying, i'm going to have a five year adventure. I'm going to learn how the world works.

I'm going to pick up some new ideas. I'm going to learn, hey, they do IT over here. Same as we talked about in the U.

A. E. Hey, here's how they do this over here. If I added that, I bet that would be my business Better. I'm going to save some taxes for five years.

I'm going to bring that money back and then just do not enjoy my life. I don't think you have to do that. I mean, i've talked about you having kids. I could have kids and living multiple places heritor. There's number of things can do.

Yeah what does a question let's say that somebody does. That S A A solution that you look at for your client. Presumably you that you would need to pay, that would have to fly and be prepared to move with you.

What I mean, some people just move to one place. They move and they put their kids in international school. We've got a private client right now. Is I going to move to thailand and i'm buying in the same complex as the school. And um I mean that there is somebody to be said for that um you could international schools, a lot of places, you could home school and lot of places, I mean some of the northern european countries are pretty nasty on that but most of the rest the world is not.

Um but if you don't want to home school yourself, so I I know a family if we had a guy who's speaking IT at a light event coming up a this year named josh with sheet and he is a family of four and they home school them and they traveled around and they do with themselves. I also met a very successful guiding the entertain business who is doing kind of my professor. He's like, I heard you say, try vector and is like, that's kind of what i'm doing.

He has the homes around the world and uh, they hire to two to the travel. With them. So there's different ways to do IT. So but my point is I don't think that like this has to be a single person's game or a couples game.

I think you can keep doing IT if you decide to do IT for five years and to get the experience and to save the money. Um maybe you get an extra passport in the process. If you settle down in one place, I think that's fine too. Are always good to have more options, have more knowledge.

But the idea you have to give you up because now it's time to settle down um I I mean I I talk to my friend, I said bring your son, your sons and seventeen come over and visit me in asia, bringing for two weeks, take about a school, he'll learn more hanging in around in asia for two weeks then whatever they're teaching in the chicago school system okay, I mean, believe me. So I you know we have this bias that whatever happens in our country somehow works. Now we complain about our country.

Biden is sold as down the river. Trump is turning us into a fashion st. L. H. right? right? We complain about IT, but somehow it's still the best in the world. And that's such americans. Everyone said people.

And it's like, what way is second again? What's best about IT? Is your education system the best? Who was that there? IT wasn't going on all, but there was something similar is now outpacing the U. S.

In like math, literally a IT not .

not career or something you've heard of. But like, no, it's like our salvador or something like that. They're Better now. And so you you .

can have, I have non zero a cohort of friends who are run about my age meter ties. And I think, yeah, i'm gonna know kids. Kids are probably going to come along at some point.

Maybe they got a partner, maybe they're yy. They engaged mary, and they are staring down the barrel of the U. S. Education system with trepidation. The thinking like, I don't know if I put a child and I don't know what's going to come out the other side and you know, you look at how many different people are trying to innovate.

The way away from this is world of schools or i'd like um this one here that in apposite park that run by tim Kennedy and it's like all of this stuff sounds great, but I like all of these things are largely unproven. Now that may be Better than something that's proven to also be completely crazy or useless. But like, do I do I want my kid to learn how to whittle a flute out of a fucking in stick? Like, i'm gonna teach him how to how hold the ground.

Like, so the U. S, you totally correct. Like we have these things, education. I had a friend and .

friend moved to dubai, and he is salary like a million dollars seven. So he was screw as an american because if you just have a salary, you just get a small exemption. You pay in the rest.

But he at least was still paying less than lived in new york city. And he told me, when I had three kids, I had to earn four hundred thousand dollars pretext of the school. So imagine you, for thirteen years, you put four hundred thousand dollars into some fund for those kids, and you had them live in dubai.

They'd learn another language. They'd learn international. They would do, you know, something else. You tell the extra money.

And not being in new york and being some international wouldn't be far Better for them. Here's what else I think about IT. One of the concerns that some of our clients have and some my old friends in the U.

S. Have is not just the low quality of education in the U. S. But oh, they're teaching you know, there's this whole social conversation. They're teaching woke, they're teaching this.

They are teaching that and people sometimes get accept with me that i'm not so angry about this and I say i'm not angry, but because I don't even know what IT is really honestly, people aren't talking about that stuff where I live and I don't have to be a part of IT. I think that what makes people angry as powerlessness. And so we convince ourself to stay in the bubble based on where we're born because that's the best, that's what we're told, and we're fed the propaganda.

But then we gain this sense of powerlessness because we don't like the way things are being done, and we get angry about IT would become miserable because we don't think is not the option. I have plenty of options because i've decided to have options. And so therefore I don't to sit around like I want to bother me if I don't want to do something, if I don't want my kids to learn something, whenever that may be.

We're not going to do IT. There's there's a solution to that. I don't have to feel powerless Carry this anger around with me. And I thought I don't have to think that I have to base my entire life on one politician getting elected, and they're going to solve all .

my problems. I'd had I I think I didn't heard you speak about some people that have traveled abroad when the wife is pregnant to give birth in another country. How common is that as a neumatic strategy?

Why may I think it's much more common for, uh, people to come to the U. S. In canada and do that because in most countries in the americas have this birth right citizenship.

If you're born on the soil, you're given citizenship. I actually know somebody from armenia. I do not encourage them to do this.

I was being aware of IT. They get A U S. V, A SHE.

And her husband, he came over and gave birth. Now he has an american child. Um that was child can not sponsor her.

I was gonna does that work or put for the parents?

I think the child has to be an adult and then they can bring you. And so that's a faster one. That's anything you're waiting to twenty five years for that one, but only five what you're going to wait the eighty right? But the child always says the opportunities um they also have now this lifetime citizenship.

So it's like really this person is watches my stuff and they they didn't think of that but the reverse I mean so this um the the you know just your sheet. They gave birth to one of their children in coastal ica. Now they all got residence permits in coastal rica and the child to coastal rican citizen.

Um I think that's great because especially you like in american coastal rica s and ice anodos who hates the coastal rick ans, imagine you wanted travel, okay coast to be constant a visit to go to the U. S. Well, if you're U S.

Citizen, you're going to go with your U. S. past. We require to coastal weekend can pretty much go to most of the rest of the world， you know, canada, australia.

They can go, those of them with the toughest ones. But they can go to the U. K.

They can go to all of the eype. I mean, coastal weakens are pretty well accepted all around the world. So are our salad.

So are auto molds. I really pretty good past for that. You didn't think the people you sit, the entire story of that region is not so much cost.

Riga at people are all trying to come to the us. From our wealth. But if you have wealth, you have plenty of options in central america. And so um I think it's an increasing strategy. Brazil is one, people go to mexico is one.

Um sometimes you can get citizenship faster in brazil is one year if if you have a child or response now you gotta wait like an extra year to be processed. You probably to live there for a part of that two years. But um in some cases a strategy for you to get a residence or even citizenship in the country.

But if nothing else, you're just giving your travel and extra. And I mean, when I when I met my wife, this is one the things it's like, would you be going to go go to brazil? Alright that that sounds reasonable.

Oh my that seems like a prety open minded person um you know again, I had a friend, he told me, you know what you know what your superpower is, is you don't have this note, gia, about things that caused you to put up barriers oh we used to all go to portia is for you know after high school, you you don't get into that. And so my question is, it's very entrepreneurial, I think I want to give, but I want to know, my mother, my child, give birth in brazil, for example, uh, what do I need to solve for? I need to buy a few flight tickets so that, you know, family members can come, because that's what people want OK.

We want our family there. Um I need to you know maybe you're going to go there x number of months early for certain kind of fino appointment through out the pregnant y you know that's what you to saw for and the payoff is you now a child who has a passport? That potential is a domestic economy.

I think mexico is is I mean, look at the pay. So it's done incredibly. I was on C, B, S A couple weeks ago talking about the pay is incredible against the U.

S. dr. Mexico is moving in the right direction. I think you you're potentially giving them a passport in some of those countries. There can be a lot of opportunities. If nothing else, IT gives them an opportunity to travel, gives them more places to live. And I just you're just giving them a whole world of opportunities.

You mentioned there about living in a place before you perhaps move there in your experience. Are there any locations that are fun to go on holiday and might seem romantic or seductive as an idea, but the reality of living there for one reason or another is not what the holiday promised.

I was sticking in the day about vienna. I love vienna. And um now australia no tax program again.

My goal is, my goal is people confuses. I'm happy to pay some love of tax. We can argue with their tax is fair or not fair.

My goal is not to always pay zero. If IT happens that I pay zero, great. I had pay a little bit great.

I don't think any country is worth if you are successful person, forty or fifty percent, oh, you get free health care. What's great? You made ten million, you paid five million.

You could have bought your own health care. um. But I think that the chAllenge is some of those places that people like him my father loves germany um he just likes the vive.

Um it's harder to meet friends there. I really look at optimising um closed. I mean, I never flying back from vn f fourteen years ago that next a guy, american guy married to an australian and he said it's just a harder place to make friends.

Now I think once you make friends in some of those places, it's there are Better friends than you to have like an L A. I mean, it's more serious friends but I would say the same thing about georgia, for example. I mean, I have always been helped whenever I need something.

I didn't take me that long to integrate. They're just open people so I wasn't nothing is as good to bed. I love austria um but I think that maybe some of those central european places that a certain kind of person like myself who doesn't like the south thern european and laid back beach vibe, they think of austria.

I love vienna, but I think you can have a harder time making friends in a place like that. No, I don't think it's the language barrier. Uh, I can get by in spanish. My spanish isn't flue enough. And i'm starting not fast enough to engage the long conversations that the buried in bogota wants to have with me if I solved for that, I could have tons of friends in bogota.

Um so that that's initial the language berrier I don't think in in in central european is um you know I think those places in eastern ear that are very direct, I appreciate certain directives over time the directness turns into bristles in some cases um obviously and I just i'm not a big fan of resort destinations. I think people should you know I don't understand a thing of living in a vacation like living in a club, an island. But to each their own, somebody might like that.

I'm not a layed back person, but I think that you want to optimize for where can I make friends easily? And some of the happiest people that I know who are experts, or even immigrants in very far fun cultures, none of their friends are experts. I ve her friends who lives in thailand, all of his friends are tie.

They're educated, they speak english. He speaks some tie, but they kind of accepted him in english but he thinks like a tight person with some american attributes but he really kind of has the whole kind of thai approach um and he's stuck with IT for that reason. So I think that you you want to maybe have some local friends and if you have a hard time doing that, I think it's probably a place. It's more difficult .

how many of the the clients are working within the people that you come into contact with are doing the no mad thing as a protection strategy. Kind of like being a uh I guess a global rapper in summer regard. Um how is that? Is that on the rise? What do you noticing with thanks with regards to that.

it's an increasing number. I think there's always waves, right? So I think we're going to see that again this year with bitcoin crypt o currency as those go up IT, just just be so on twenty two, twenty one go I think was a big wake up caught for people um and we can debate, you know i'm sure there are some people who have views are more extreme than mine, but I mean governments around the world before restrictor and that shows that citizenship really is an application.

And me, if you are australian, you couldn't leave and you couldn't return. And look at how many people in australia said, well, yes, your your foot, you took a holiday in marisha. Like, what about the rest of us? Is like this whole kind of greater good, the individualism of U.

S. citizen. You've got a right to return your country that's a literally like international law like the united nations is not like some right wing concept um which just turn the window.

And I think people realized in what people thought were these great inflatable countries like oh my country can throw me um they don't really care about me have been paying all these years and maybe I haven't even complained about paying and now when I need support, i'm hung to dry and so I think you're seeing more people saying, yeah, I want to back up plan um whether that's about you know people want health freedom. We have people uh from the U S. That when rov e wade was overturned they said I don't want to live in the country.

Our abortion is not legal what people don't understand about me in my brand I I don't judge I mean to meet that the international political views that i've kind of picked up the again the dub approach of what's just have the best like what works if you want to live in a country, there's legal abortion. I'm going to a judge you for that um if you wanna in a place where there's less of a vaccine Mandate, i'm not going to judge you for that. Um I might agree with some of the positions and I might agree in part or I might not agree at all.

But like I think people are realizing that again, like where they're born, does that mean it's always going to line with their values? I think a lot of these countries are changing. And so yes, more people are looking for a plan b.

There's a fine line between kind of forcing people to do what you've done, which they may not be comfortable with, and trying to open their mind to do that. You can leave ah I get at what we get a lot. Uh, I want to leave in five years when the kids all graduate.

I mean, could the kids not go to school somewhere else with that, maybe not be Better for them? I I don't have kids in high schools, so it's not for me to judge. I think more people should have a plane, not because they can save money on taxes, but because I think you learn a lot.

IT changes you in very positive ways to live other places. And I think that people don't move because of this sense of fear. Again, they're happy to move to florida, not happy to move an equal distance to some other country.

Um but a lot of people want plan, be citizenship residents. Sometimes they want plan B, C, D, E. Um so yeah, not everyone that we work with now is moving.

Where's when we started IT was I want to move on. Tired of paying tax. Now there's a lot of I don't want to move or i'll move later or maybe all know get a residence permit and spent three months in the winter.

A one of the guys I talked to, a very kind of a wealthy guy, didn't realize as an american, he just can't go to italy and spent four months yeah you can't ninety days later, everyone had a native. You need to get a residence permit. You need to get some kind of citizenship. So it's kind of clearing up some of those basic misconceptions as well. Um but what is mentioned .

a couple of times today that italian, whatever the tax implications are the what what is that .

you've got a couple programs. So greece roled one out early, rode one out that kind of based on the switch model to a lumpsum. So you if you have a high income, you pay one hundred thousand years a year.

You're married, it's one twenty five and that's all you pay. And that's more flexible than like what portugal system was, where if you won to have your company a tax haven in pay zero, you can do that. You live in eily, whatever a lot of time per year and then you pay them this this illum b umb um so that kind of based on the the the swiss system, we are different cantons.

You can kind of negotiate different rates, but it's cheaper than switzerland um and and you can get citizenship in italy, uh maybe in greece, so that kind of a flat amount. So if you make a million dollars a year or million eos a year, ten percent basically. Um they also have an italy uh incentives.

They're going to shorten IT this year for how long you can going to take away some of the most aggressive incentives, but you can reduce your tax rate like is a free answer between fifty and seventy percent wherever depending on where you want to live in the country. So like them in the north, they're like fifty percent reduction. So the tax raise is fifty percent.

You pay twenty five. If you will live in the south, I think it's going to go down to seventy percent. So the tax rates fifty, you pay fifteen. Um so it's not zero, but if you want lifestyle, I mean that's a much you know a Better deal.

One of the things have been thinking today, as you travel around the world, you have businesses in various locations, bank accounts in various locations, and you mentioned about being able to use different currencies. If someone put a gun to your head and said, you have to have all of your life savings into one currency that isn't the U. S. Dollar, not IT, what would you be?

I'm glad isn't happen, I think who not .

threatened you? I promise i'm not threading you.

Uh, yeah. Be careful in the U S. Yeah no there's they're pretty aggressive. They know here's my construct. There's judgmental and is not judgmental um and so I think singapore are pretty judge mental country.

I E if you go there on like an african passport, they look at the list is your past portal list. Okay, there moki here to go. Ninety days.

welcome. Whereas if you do that in the U. K, it's like, yeah, you got a VISA. But like, you know, I think if you're gona hold a currency, that policy applies equally. Uh, one of the wealth est client will ever worked with.

So I you know i'm from a place that like the west doesn't like i'm against my country, but i'm from a plate like the country the west is like I don't trust the U. K. I don't want my money in U.

K. banks. I wouldn't to live in the U K. And it's just to mean for Better worse, there's a judged of like we like these people, not like these people.

I would probably say the singapore dollar is based on a basket of different currencies. Um it's the freest economy in the world. Um they do a great job running IT. I mean, name a place where retail banks are lending money to the central bank um I would say singing the singapore dollar.

What about you say let's say you're going around to smaller banks in these emerging or frontier countries or whatever, can you actually put a significant amount of money deposited into .

the bank count there? Do what you want. Studio is the question.

alright OK. So that first that question and then also, how do you assess bank risk? What's a good way to assess bank risk?

Well, I mean, look at the bank failures in the U S list. There are more bank failures in the U. S.

And I think pretty much of our country combined. Um so I don't think the risk is in the U S. Now you have the fd I C, which is basically broke, has less than one percent of all the money.

And if if you had a couple big bank players they wiped out and see your basically dependent on is the U. S. Congress gonna bail out. thanks. Ah i'm not so convinced that you know oh, I ve got millions of dollars in my bank account is the us.

Congress if they want to be bAiling out with taxpayer dollars in an increasingly kind of populist country, people who had millions of dollars in the bank, i'm not sure if that comes to that. They're going to. So I mean, I look at banks in places like singapore.

There's some of the highest rate in the world that's not emerging economy, but some of those banks might have Operations in other countries. At me, you look at the country to mention cambodia. There are stable asian banks that opened up offices in cambodia. If people are going and investing in cambodia, they're building my friends strategy as he's buying real state on corners in the city center that one day will get torn down to build sky papers or shopping mall because they're doing IT. I mean, when I first went to cambodia, have like one skyscrapers, now they're going .

up everywhere is because front running gentil .

ation front, it's it's a good A A bad name or a booklet me or something um so like yeah am I gonna go to cambodia? Invest in like you know some local bank. I may not my kind puts much money there. Um i'm going to go to armenia and invest in the bank. If I only like a guy, I mean this I can serve.

I I mean there are some banks like the eighteen th largest bank as I could own by like a guy h no but I can go to armenian and there's banks like there's there's french banks um yeah i'm i'm going to feel comfortable doing that because like do you think of that french bank in armenia collapses that nobody in france is going to pull their money. That bank of course they are so they have to make sure they move the money around. So I I think the risk is based on um the the quality institution and endured that the two origins banks are traded on the on the stock exchange doesn't mean they can't go under just like banks in the U S.

From the us. New U S. Stock exchange they went under. But I think that if you look at those factors um you can find decent banks.

You know the country like equal um it's a lot of credit unions, very high interest strates um the U S. Dollars deficient currency, which I actually kind of like because if anything ever happens, like they're not going to like force to take their currency. But you know the banks are there's no big huge banks that you would trust like all your live savings.

Um I I think for me the point is I wouldn't trust any with my life savings and me think about IT um and look at night or for us in the U K. Whether you like him or not. Yes we can know what.

We just don't want your business anymore. I mean, that can happen anywhere. Um so I mean, i've had things happen to me where they are like you know what who oh you're charging for that? Like yeah, you're not really the kind of client want.

Um and then what you do like the same bankers that want you know I give us all your business are the same ones that would cut you off at the knees. So I don't care how stable the bank is. I don't want any bank to have my money.

Um I just don't but you know for me yeah I am I put if you put a million doors in singapore, would you put one hundred thousand dollars in the bank of georgia? Um obviously, you know in some of emerging world banks, if you're willing to take other currencies, I mean, the georgian Lorry is done incredibly well in the last couple years. Meanwhile, you made thirteen percent interest.

So if you don't have any Better places to park your money, that's an interesting kind of diversification. There are some countries, if you do that, you can get a residence permit, for example. So it's like, how how does this stuff all work together?

I would IT move two hundred thousand dollars to a dominican republic bank, but if you told me, oh, we will give you a fast track, the citizenship I I be, i'm interested that right so um I think IT all comes standard. What are you getting out of the deal? Um higher registration, residence, citizenship or just in the case of like you know and I it's probably everything give you one more thing.

There's banks implicits like the bahamas. They don't even keep your money. They just have accounted bigger banks all around the world that would never take you as a client, you know B B paraben france .

or guitar national bank guitar the the stub hope ticket reseller of bank accounts.

They are best or just i'm in their small banks, they take your deposit s and they just have your money, someone they don't make loans, right? I mean like why is that like the U S. Banks get in so much trouble.

I mean, they just lend out to the hilt uh, and they know they're so uh, aggressive. In some cases, you get a hong kong, hong kong is actually opening up more now for banking. But why is home historically been so difficult to get a bank account? The banks literally don't want more money. They're so conservative. They have nowhere to put IT.

That's wild. That is absolutely crazy. What do you make of the of the mean of the passport, bro? Because you have been doing this for significantly longer than that mean has come about.

But there is a you know a strong trend at the moment of especially western, especially men, deciding that there is a problem with the culture of the dating or the government or whatever IT is and then going, right, i'm, i'm, i'm out of here. Is this where you are an early adopter or of this? Or is this sort of playing into your guys? Is culture in some way? What are you seeing?

I don't I be onest. I don't entirely know. My thought is that that passport or is kind of more focused on the dating element, right?

Court driver of IT. Um I I think for me many, many, many years ago, um I mean, I I was an entrepreneur, wanted be entrepreneurs. Eve years old IT wasn't cool back then.

Right now it's cool. IT wasn't cool and I wanted to be an entrepreneur. And so um you know I wasn't the most .

popular guy kid just kind .

like a business. You're a freak. Uh remember like being twenty one, my friends would drive me to bars and girls would like you know make fun and excited like I would good like you know business meetings and that was embarrassing and retrospect like know of this business meetings, like why you were in cuff links? Like, what do you? weird? I was something, and I remember being like twenty two or twenty three.

And I was on one of my early trips, and I met this girl from china. And she's like all the stuff that everyone else that was weird is like fast in to buy, like an asia, like with like you like you're twenty three and you get a business and you're making money and like it's growing. That's pretty like that's pretty like sound like nobody in china would be like under fifty would be doing that.

Like that's pretty cool. And I kind of showed me this kind of arbitrage opportunity. Um you know I I know dated people around the world is it's interesting.

I never looked at as something where i've never want to be when these guys where it's like i'm going to places I i've never shown a place for dating like cool and poor problem in a great dating location. Um that's probably why some of the people don't choose IT. Um I mean thailand or indonesia probably Better.

So i've ever really chosen in a place based on on dating um but you know i've enjoyed you know meeting people from different places. I never want to make dating kind of the only aspect, but I certainly think that. People should seek competition their life. I think the biggest thing, I mean, you look for competition for a restaurant, you look for competition if you're buying a product. I mean, people use apps.

And how can I save three doors buying this product somewhere else? Why don't you use competition for your taxes and for the government that serves you? Why not use competition for the people that you meet? And again, I made really is your whether you just want to find a short term relationship, or whether you're looking for your soul made or whatever you, whatever is, are the odds that they live around you?

I mean, really available out of eight billion people. The person that matches you happened to also be born. And clive on ohio like that seems ridiculous to me, right? And and if you look back through that human history, I mean, people didn't have so many options that is earn to live with that.

But like you live in a village and there were fifty people, you just like chose one. And really, those are the happiest relationships. Those are the most filling relationships. So I I am I not the .

guy I .

member. We were two in real state engine years ago and people wanted to buy property for airbnb. And we would go to some of the buildings and they like of this one of the government's for airbnb.

But the building band, airbnb and one one place, say what they told the story of. Some woman was coming home with her, a child, and a guy was a being, a served in the elevator. The of the elevator door opens, and there's this guy with with, you know, with the woman and and it's like, yeah, we don't want these people coming here anymore.

Obviously, the idea that an american guy goes to colombia and wants to find someone to to date, I see nothing wrong with that at all. Some people do. That's ridiculous. But obviously, I i'd like to now i'd like to have a certain love, love class about that. We're not doing things at all .

the opposite to do, like andrei, really. I love your work. I think it's a very first principles approach to people who live on a rock and these lines around IT a pretty arbitrarily drawn apart from the oceans, and even they weren't done of your own choosing.

And to think about IT from first principles, I really, really like that. I think your input is is massively needed and and really hugely a like inspiring actually. So I really, I really love all of the stuff that you're doing. If someone wants to get started, uh, with this, if they said, right, i'm brought in this sounds like it's something that's kind of cool. What are the first places that they should go?

We have a youtube channel, think over twenty five hundred videos. We put something out um you know fifteen sixteen times a month with these ideas you going to watch and get the vibe. Um our website, we've got almost that many articles.

No mad capital stock com. If you wanted a bit more aggregated, I read a book called, no matter capitalist, it's on amazon. It's more story telling than specific ideas.

We talk about some of the ideas. We talk about what's not possible. We talk about, you know, what you can do through the lens of fifteen years of my expLoring this.

So the book is a good to aggregate down into a shorter read. And then we host this, this annual event called no matter capital live. And we bring accurate list to people who everything from frontier market investing to, you know, giving birth overseas to lowering your taxes. We bring some of our staff that talks about our clients work so you from free to ten box to live events and then .

you'll be White love service i'm going to guess as well for the people .

that need to yeah if you have amid six figure income or a low seven figure network or above. We work with people all way up to billionaires to put together holistic strategies because he hurt me multiple times throughout, uh, saying, okay, well this bank account probably isn't work in its own but if you got a citizenship because you open that, you know you wanna you want to kind of consider the holistic nature uh and you have to consider the holistic nature given our our tax conversations. I mean, nothing works in a vacuum.

You can just put your company in the british virgin island and not move and think you're going to save tax because there's all kinds of rules around how that works. And so you've understand that. And so that's what we help people figure out. This is not only the known unknowns, but the unknown unknowns.

I Andrew, I appreciate. Thank you for.

Thank you.