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cover of episode Rodrigo Duterte’s Deadly Promise

Rodrigo Duterte’s Deadly Promise

2023/10/17
logo of podcast The New Yorker Radio Hour

The New Yorker Radio Hour

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David Remnick
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Patricia Evangelista
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David Remnick:本节目讨论了菲律宾总统罗德里戈·杜特尔特在其任期内发生的超过两万起法外处决事件。杜特尔特在竞选期间承诺将对毒贩和吸毒者处以死刑,并在就职后迅速付诸实施。这一行动在菲律宾社会引起了广泛关注,也引发了国际社会对人权的担忧。杜特尔特政府声称死亡人数在6000人左右,但人权组织认为实际数字远高于此。杜特尔特与特朗普的相似之处在于他们都喜欢发表耸人听闻的言论,但杜特尔特说到做到,他的“杀光他们”的命令贯穿了整本书,如同幽灵般的合唱。 Patricia Evangelista:作为Rappler新闻网站的记者,我目睹了杜特尔特毒品战争的残酷现实。我报道了大量法外处决事件,并与受害者家属进行了深入的访谈。我的工作让我面临着巨大的危险,最终不得不离开菲律宾。杜特尔特夸大了菲律宾的毒品问题,以此作为其竞选策略。他将吸毒者描绘成极其危险的人物,以此煽动民众情绪。他使用粗俗的语言,挑战社会规范,这在公众人物中是罕见的,但却具有极强的号召力。杜特尔特通过极端言论和个人化叙事,塑造了自己“救世主”的形象。菲律宾人民对杜特尔特的支持反映了社会深层次的问题,包括民众对某些人的厌恶和对改变的渴望。菲律宾在杜特尔特执政后依然面临着创伤和缺乏问责制的问题,这体现在选举结果上。我虽然离开了菲律宾,但我仍然会回到菲律宾继续报道,因为那里是我的家,故事仍在继续。 Patricia Evangelista: 我认为新闻报道的作用是记录事实,而不是改变世界。我努力保持客观,但我知道自己无法完全做到。我面临着道德困境,因为我既要报道真相,又要保护自己和消息来源的安全。我将继续记录菲律宾发生的事件,希望这些记录能够在将来发挥作用。

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Rodrigo Duterte, unlike Donald Trump, fully delivered on his violent campaign promises, leading to over 20,000 extrajudicial killings during his term.

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When Rodrigo Duterte ran for the presidency of the Philippines and won, in 2016, the Western press noted the similarities between this unconventional candidate and Donald Trump—who also liked to casually espouse violence on the campaign trail and beyond.  Duterte used provocative and obscene language to tap into the country’s fears about a real, albeit overstated, drug problem. “Every drug addict was a schizophrenic, hallucinatory, will rape your mother and butcher your father,” as reporter Patricia Evangelista puts it, “and if he can’t find a child to rape, he’ll rape a goat.” But, unlike Donald Trump, Duterte made good on his promise of death. More than twenty thousand extrajudicial killings took place over the course of his six-year term in office, according to human-rights groups—and Duterte remained quite popular as bodies piled up in the streets. Reporting for the news site Rappler, Evangelista confronted the collateral damage when Durterte started to enact his “kill them all” policies. “I had to take accountability,” she tells David Remnick. Her book, “Some People Need Killing,” is published in the U.S. this week, and Evangelista has left the Philippines because of the danger it puts her in. “I own the guilt,” Evangelista says. “How can I sit in New York, when the people whose stories I told, who took the risk to tell me their stories, are sitting in shanties across the country and might be at risk because of things they told me.”