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cover of episode Young Donald Trump, Roy Cohn, and the Dark Arts of Power

Young Donald Trump, Roy Cohn, and the Dark Arts of Power

2024/9/27
logo of podcast The New Yorker Radio Hour

The New Yorker Radio Hour

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Gabriel Sherman
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Jill Lepore
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Gabriel Sherman: 本片并非反特朗普,而是一部探讨特朗普与罗伊·科恩关系的人文主义戏剧。影片展现了两人复杂的关系,以及科恩如何塑造了年轻的特朗普,最终以特朗普背叛科恩告终。影片并非纪录片,而是基于史实进行的戏剧化演绎,其中包含了对特朗普早期事业的积极描述,以及一些有争议的场景,例如特朗普对伊万娜的暴力行为。影片的制作过程历经坎坷,经历了融资困难和好莱坞主流电影公司拒绝投资等挑战。 David Remnick: 作为访谈节目的主持人,David Remnick主要负责引导话题,并与嘉宾进行互动,对影片的制作过程和内容进行提问和讨论。他与Gabriel Sherman探讨了影片的创作初衷、人物刻画、以及影片引发的争议。他还与Jill Lepore讨论了英国警匪剧的特色,以及对米克·赫伦作品《慢马》的评价。 Jill Lepore: Jill Lepore作为一名历史学家和电视爱好者,主要分享了她对英国警匪剧的看法,并推荐了几部她喜欢的剧集,例如《安妮卡》、《凯伦·皮里》和《喜鹊谋杀案》。她还谈到了对米克·赫伦及其作品《慢马》的评价。她的发言与主题关系不大,主要作为节目内容的补充和过渡。

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This chapter explores the formative relationship between a young Donald Trump and his mentor, Roy Cohn. It delves into Cohn's background, his influence on Trump's approach to power and public image, and the eventual betrayal that marked the end of their partnership.
  • Roy Cohn mentored Donald Trump in the dark arts of power brokering.
  • Cohn taught Trump to use the media to his advantage.
  • Trump's early success can be attributed to Cohn's guidance.
  • Trump abandoned Cohn when he became ill and needed help.
  • Their relationship ended in betrayal.

Shownotes Transcript

Actors and comedians have usually played Donald Trump as larger than life, almost as a cartoon. In the new film “The Apprentice,” Sebastian Stan doesn’t play for laughs. He stars as a very young Trump falling under the sway of Roy Cohn (played by Jeremy Strong)— the notorious, amoral lawyer and fixer.  “Cohn took Donald Trump under his wing when Donald was a nobody from the outer boroughs,” the film’s writer and executive producer Gabriel Sherman tells David Remnick. He “taught him the dark arts of power brokering … [and] introduced him to New York society.” Sherman, a contributing editor to New York magazine, also chronicled Roger Ailes’s rise to power at Fox News in “The Loudest Voice in the Room.” Sherman insists, though, that the film is not anti-Trump—or not exactly. “The movie got cast into this political left-right schema, and it’s not that. It’s a humanist work of drama,” in which the protégé eventually betrays his mentor. It almost goes without saying that Donald Trump has threatened to sue the producers of the film, and the major Hollywood studios wouldn’t touch it.  Sherman talks with Remnick about how the film, which opens October 11th, came to be.

 Plus, Jill Lepore) is a *New Yorker *staff writer, a professor of history at Harvard University, and the author of the best-seller “These Truths)” as well as many other works of history. While her professional life is absorbed in the uniqueness of the American experience, she finds her relaxation across the pond, watching police procedurals from Britain. “There’s not a lot of gun action,” she notes, “not the same kind of swagger.” She talks with David Remnick about three favorites: “Annika” and “The Magpie Murders,” on PBS Masterpiece; and “Karen Pirie,” on BritBox. And Remnick can’t resist a digression to bring up their shared reverence for “Slow Horses,” a spy series on Apple TV+ that’s based on books by Mick Herron, whom Lepore profiled) for The New Yorker.