Ep 1096 | Jase & Al Investigate the Mysterious Lights Hovering Over Zach’s Place
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I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. We are back in our boxes, as I like to say. What did you say, Jason?

a Trinitarian feel to it when we're separate. We're separate and yet we're one. We're in three places, but we're also together doing the Unashamed podcast. I would have not made that heretical joke. I just want to lay that out there. It was a joke. We're not claiming we're God. Well, quite the opposite. That's why I said we all have a Trinitarian feel. That is true. We reflect His nature.

Well, but our problem is our three aspects are me, myself, and I. Yeah. True. Which causes a lot of problems in life. So if you get that times three is my point. Yeah, that's a problem. Zach, you were telling us before we came on, you had, we have a lot of experiences this last week to talk about before we get rolling today. We're finally going to get back to John A. today. It's going to happen. So I'm going to make sure that happens.

But before we do, there are some things that happen. Well, we don't have to get into everything, but I do have a story that I'll tell you that I'd love to get your thoughts on because I'm not a conspiracy theory guy. Let me just start by saying that. Like, I'm the opposite of that. I don't buy into a lot of them. I'm very cynical when it comes to conspiracy theories. But I had a moment this weekend where I thought –

this might be an alien invasion. Really? Oh, boy. Does this have anything to do with Bigfoot? No, but I got something else to do. Were there any blurry creatures involved? Because we had those guys. You know what? That's who I should have called. Yes, that's who you call. I called Chad Robichaux. I should have called Luke, one of those guys, Luke Rogers. But I called Chad Robichaux because he's working on a paranormal documentary type show. So I called him to ask his thought. But

So this is what happened.

It's Saturday night, actually Saturday afternoon. The power goes out in all of our area of western North Carolina. I'm not sure what happened. I mean, it's out everywhere. And later on, we had some baptisms that night. That's a whole other story. Maybe I'll tell on the next episode. But that night, the power didn't come back on until probably 1130. Well, about 945, it was pitch dark.

And there's no light. You can see the stars because there's no light pollution. Yeah. Okay, listen. There was a steady stream for, I'm going to say, probably 45 minutes in the sky of these green lights. They looked like airplanes, but they were...

They weren't blinking, and all the lights were green. They really looked like stars. That's probably a better way. High up, but not quite outside the atmosphere. They were in a single file line at first. For 45 minutes, just one after another, probably 70 or 80 of these green lights. They just crossed the sky. Then I started seeing them come from other directions where they would intersect. I bet I saw...

A total of 145 minutes. Green, little small green lights. What do you think that means? Well, I have a couple of questions that I think would be helpful. All right. Number one, did you have your glasses on?

I did not have my glasses on. Oh. But I had witnesses. I had a bunch of young, there's about eight or ten teenagers outside who have great eyesight. And they're like, what is that? Yeah. Because it's like when we had the blurry creature guys on. Yeah. I wanted to ask something, but I thought they might get offended. What were you going to ask?

Well, I really wasn't going to ask it. I was just going to make a statement just at some point when they got into some of this stuff. Yeah. I wanted to say...

Have you ever thought about trying glasses? Yeah. Because, you know, blurry creatures. I mean, when things are blurry, I put some, like right now, these words are a little blurry. But look, when I put my glasses on, it's clear. Clear. Cleared right up. But here's the thing. So I saw it, and then in Black Mountain they had this, which just needs to be a reality show. It's called the Black Mountain Exchange. It's like a local thing.

Facebook page. I'm not, I don't get on Facebook. Um,

because they canceled my account. That's a whole other story. But it's like an exchange where all the local community gets on to have conversation and swap things and sell things. Well, that's a great place to figure something out. Internet chat room. Oh, yeah. So it was a chat room. There's a thin line. There's a thin line, very thin line between finding out right information and pooling ignorance. Yeah.

Well, they never came to the conclusion, but it did at least other people saw what we saw because it was a conversation. And so I'm thinking you have a blackout.

You've got some unidentified objects in the air. I'm thinking EMP attack by aliens. Yeah. We're about to get into something. Well, it just kind of goes against the theme of the Bible. I don't ever read that place where all of a sudden we're going to have an alien invasion. Yeah. What's ironic, though, is I read a series because I like some of that, like,

post-apocalyptic series. And there was one that was based in Black Mountain, North Carolina, Montreat, actually. And it was a three-book series, I think. And it was about an EMP. Oh, that's called One Second After. You know, they're making a movie out of that. Really? Yeah, I know the guy who wrote it. He teaches a professor at Montreat. The book series is outstanding. But in the book, well, I don't want to spoil it for everybody, but it's a country series.

that does it. And, you know, like we're under attack. So that's kind of... Well, my take... Oh, I never gave you my official take. That was just one question. What was your second question? Were you going to ask... Yeah, the second... It's kind of like... Look, I'm not a... I'm not known as a very intellectual type person. So I'm going to use you an illustration. I'm going to use an illustration that I think is helpful. And because a lot of times...

When we're duck hunting in a duck blind, we have a lot of arguments over the same question. Why do ducks flare? Because people start saying, you know, the ducks, they'll make two circles and they won't come in. And so all these theories, these conspiracy theories come up about why they won't come in. And I mean, you should hear that.

these things. Oh, you're right. Al, how many arguments? Oh my goodness. I'm talking about infinitum. I mean, it just, they never end on what it is. And dad was the king of the conspiracy. Oh yeah. But I made a rule and I don't know if I got this, I'm not saying it was from the Holy Spirit, but maybe the spirit of the wild based on my hunting experience. The spirit of the wild. I said at the end of the day,

There's only two reasons, two things that ducks flare. Do you know what they are? The two things? Movement would be one. There's two things. There's two reasons why ducks flare. And two reasons only. I would say maybe movement and some kind of coloration of something. Men are humans. Yeah. And equipment. Things that humans make. So if you think about it, these are things that come in...

that is not in their setting. It's not natural. It's not natural to their habitat. So what's the connection? I don't understand the connection. Laughter

Well, if you don't see that connection, I'm so simple. I came to you with such a simple explanation that it literally went over your head. Yeah, I don't get it. So when you look at the sky, you think, oh, what is that? Well, I'm going to give you the answer. It was either men or equipment, perhaps both. Well, it's not men by themselves. There may be men in the equipment.

That men may, when you see Greg. So you think it was some type of airplane. It wasn't airplanes. I mean, I'm thinking maybe drones. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You jumped to airplanes. I gave you the answer. It was something by man's design.

Oh, it was definitely by man's design. I'm just trying to figure out. I don't think it was aliens. Let me just stop. Well, you said that, right? You said that at the beginning. Well, I think I've proven my argument here. But what kind of man would put 70 to 100 flying objects? Like, what's the agenda? What's behind that? That's weird. I'm sure it was probably a meeting of men that produced what you saw. There was a meeting. Yeah.

Hey, I got an idea. Let's get in whatever the equipment was and line them up and go take care of it.

Did they ever solve the, was it an extension of the East Coast issue North Abuse Act? No, you're talking about the New Jersey situation? Yeah, what did they ever say that was? So then there was another object that came through that looked like the one in New Jersey. I don't know, because one of the kids brought that up and said, look at the picture of this. And I said, that looks exactly like the big one that came out. There was a big one, and then there was about,

80 to 100 small ones. Could it have been equipment that men had made?

Well, I think it was equipment that men made. The question is, who made it? Why is it there? I mean, that's a lot of traffic to be coming over your house at 945 at night. Well, that was the question the New Jersey people had. And then the other thing I thought is, is this happening all the time, but yet the light pollution has prevented us from seeing it? That's a good point. I'm just seeing it for the first time, which that'll preach. There's probably a story right there.

So prices are definitely going up on just about everything, which is why I'm constantly looking to cut the budget. I don't know about you guys, Al. What about you? Do you actually look at your budget? Got to look at that bottom line, Zach. You know, money doesn't grow on trees. I'm trying to keep it trim. Well, I'll tell you one of the ways that I've saved money recently is I downloaded the Rocket Money app. It's a personal finance app that helps you find money.

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No, it's probably too many sci-fi movies as a kid and alien-type movies. You are of that generation. You're either being influenced or you're influencing. So my question for the audience, though, is I know that – have you seen something similar in your neck of the woods? And here's the next question. Do you know what it is?

Yeah. I'm curious. Yeah, we want to hear your responses, Unashamed Nation. Go to your places where you get information out that we eventually find. We want to hear that because I'm sure there's some interesting theories out there.

Among our crew. Since I've already given you the answer, that kind of took the sting out of that. We know it was man-made. We don't know what it was. We're trying to figure out what men, Jase, what men made it. I have no idea where you're going with this connection. Could it be that somebody built this and sent it? On the flip side of it, though, on the good side of the evening,

was we did, Jill got a call right before it turned dark because the power went out and these girls were having a retreat at Ridgecrest Conference Center. You want to go ahead and give them the address so they can go check it out? What, Ridgecrest? Ridgecrest.

No, we don't give an address. But they... You have a lot of details, eh? No, I was like, I always think back to my dad when he used to give his address out in any kind of public setting. On national television. Yeah. Yeah.

Like, Phil, why don't you go ahead and invite them for supper? Well, they showed up at his house too. But these girls came over. They knew Jill. And the girl has a ministry where she ministers to college-age students. They had a retreat, and they were having a bunch of baptisms, but the power went out at the camp they were at. So then she called Jill.

I said, hey, can we bring some girls over and use y'all's pool to do some baptisms? So we ended up having about five or six girls get baptized in the pool at our house on Saturday night. And then we had another group that got baptized after church on Sunday. So we had a whole baptismal weekend as well. I like baptismal weekends. Was it baptisms in the dark? Baptisms. They all took their phones out and turned their flashlights on.

And everybody, 50, 60 girls shining the light into the pool. And the collective lighting actually lit up the pool. Look, if a neighbor happened to see that,

Right now, they're having a different conversation. They're like, I saw something that I can't put my finger on. It could be an alien invasion. There were these little flickering of light, like fireflies. Oh, yeah. But then I heard this huge sound of splashing water. And then singing. People crying out. So it was like some kind of...

supernatural phenomena, which would be technically correct. And there was an invasion from the Holy Spirit. It was an invasion. That's where I'm going with this. That's pretty good. I like this. Turns out it was some women giving their life to the Lord, and they were lighting it with their phones. It was powerful. It was a cool moment. Well, you know, it's funny, Zach, you said that because Phyllis is down here. She and her Missouri siblings are

And I'm not sure what I told me. It's just weird what to call you because we're not really connected, but they, you know, they're siblings in some way. And so she was telling me about a new painting that Tony is working on.

And so our old friend Cade, who's the new guy at Duck Commander building duck calls, who's from your area. He's from Lake City, Zach. Yeah. And I don't know if you met him yet, but he's a great kid. Knows duck calls, just, you know, super, super kid, but he's kind of got a beard and long hair. So Tony got him above the water and then Tony got in the water and he said he weighted himself down where he would have to go to the bottom and he took pictures of

Of Cade reaching into the water. He's trying to produce a painting, ultimately from a photograph, of Jesus reaching down to pull Peter out of the water when he's sinking in that famous scene. So just her description. He wasn't quite ready to show us yesterday because we FaceTimed him. He's not here today.

But I'm intrigued. I'm like, oh, man, what an awesome perspective. From Peter's perspective, I've sunk in the water, but Jesus is reaching into the water to pull me up, which is pretty cool. Which makes me think there's a thin line between capturing a picture of Jesus rescuing someone out of the water and dying at sea. Trying to capture said picture. Yeah.

Because you're right. If you tie, if you weight yourself too securely. Well, I heard that millstone tied around the neck, but I'm going to try. There's another story about that. Well, it's funny because Cade told me, he said, well, Tony, if you would just let all the air out, you'll sink. And Tony said, yeah, but I need that air. Yeah.

He's got some scuba gear, man. I don't know how he's taking pictures in the water in Louisiana. I mean, that water is like black. Exactly. He must have been in a pool. He's going to have a clarity issue. He must have been in a pool. Flood times. Hey, what's the guy's name again?

Tony? Cade. Cade. Yeah, Cade. They need to go back down to Cade's neck of the woods and get out of one of them springs in North Florida. The water's crystal clear. That's where you take that. Oh, that's beautiful down there. You're right. Well, John 8. Are we doing John 8, Al? We're doing John 8. Let's do John 8. Y'all want to? Let's go. You know, this John 8, it's a handful. It is. Well, let me reset. It's pretty deep. There's a lot of deep stuff.

I think the scholars call them hyperlinks. There's like thread lines here that go all the way back to Genesis. And you're talking about the whole chapter. Yeah, just in various places. It's like, wait, what? I mean, I think I've studied this for a few days. Because you just keep going down rabbit trails that are very enlightening. I say that because light is going to be a very...

one of those themes. I thought about that when Zach said that a minute ago about the lights and the baptism. Light is such a big theme here. By the way, I met a guy at an event, which I'll tell you about in the next podcast, a veteran event, and he makes these track chairs and

uh, for disabled. He had a kid that was disabled, but he makes these chairs. And so a lot of military guys get him. He's a wonderful guy, but he's a huge unashamed listener. And he told me, he said, you guys and what you're doing, especially in this study and John to tie in the old Testament has been the best study of my life is the way he put it. So I thank the Lord. Cause it's so much work. Yeah.

I've learned more about the Old Testament in the past year than the previous 30-some-odd years of... But it is amazing how it's all there. It's eye-opening for all of us because I'm seeing some things I had never seen before either. Well, what happens is when you go back and read, part of you is like, dang it, I didn't even know this. It's just embarrassing, really. But...

Yeah, light, which I have a rabbit trail on light when we get there, but I'll let you say it. Well, let me reset first because I want us to kind of be fair with this first text. Because the last is to my memory because it's been a few podcasts because we had a lot of really great guests on the last few podcasts.

But we were talking about this section from John 7, 53 through 8, 11, which was the woman caught in adultery. And we never really dealt with the text. We just talked about why it's a little bit controversial as to whether it belongs here. In some other texts, was it part of the original canon? And we kind of came up with two things.

sort of things that have been settled on. One is that maybe with some of the early church leaders, they were a little concerned about people getting the wrong idea about what Jesus meant. So they left it out of the canon for that reason, which may or may not be true. Or the second one, which I tend to believe is true, is that this was a story that was recognized from the first century that it happened in

But it didn't necessarily happen in the narrative of the gospel writers. And so they just stuck it here because some sometimes it's in Luke, sometimes it's here. But it belongs because, you know, God decided to put it here, which is what N.T. Wright said. He said, I'm not sure where it goes, but it really is a great story that that fits the narrative of who Jesus is. And so that's where we kind of left off.

you know, by at least setting that part of it up. And then, but I feel like we need to read it and then talk about it a little bit before we move on to the light. Cause that's where he's going to go from here. Is that, is that all right with y'all? Yeah, go for it. All right. So he said, so remember he's been in the, this was, he went to the Feaster Tabernacles and he spoke and his brothers had said, you know, you need to get out more and I'm paraphrasing everything, but he goes and he teaches for this eight day period and,

And then it says in verse 53, then each went to his own home. So they sort of put it in the context of that that was over. But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. At dawn, he appeared again in the temple courts where all the people gathered around him and he sat down to teach them. So it's a teaching setting in the outer courts at the temple. The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group.

So this is obvious, this is a shaming, terrible situation. And said to Jesus, Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. In the law, Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now, what do you say?

And it's interesting because I went back and looked in Leviticus 20, 10, and also Deuteronomy 22, 22, which are the two law passes here. And it doesn't say in the law passes that it's just the woman. It says if a man is caught in adultery, he's to be stoned and the woman along with him. So I just thought it was interesting how they were applying this law, which was incorrect. But he didn't even go there. But that's what happened.

They were using this question as a trap in order to have a basis for accusing him. And by the way, they didn't have any legal standing to do executions anyway. They're under Roman rules, so...

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They're using it as a trap because they're threatened by what he's representing. So that should really take out any concerns about this was some kind of sincere basis for trusting God's law as an Israelite. Yeah. That's what it says. They were using it as a trap. What...

Which, look, religious people today do the same thing. All the time. Yeah, most arguments, you're just ripping verses out of context just to try to make an argument to show that you're wrong and I'm right. But think about it, Jay, even outside of a spiritual context and a biblical context about law, it happens every day in our culture. Most people in government, especially in Congress, are lawyers.

And they split hairs and misapply and use bad intent for laws every single day to push an agenda. So, I mean, it's so obvious how much it happens, which in my outline I put, is it adultery or hypocrisy? Because that's where we get to, I mean, really quick. Well, you kind of see what I think we said on the previous podcast is they were –

wanting to stone her, but the trap was for Jesus. And then when Jesus didn't answer to their liking, now they're trying to stone him. Correct. So that should put it in the perspective that maybe they had a heart problem. And I thought about it, James. I looked up the other Matthew 12 and Mark 12 and Luke 20, the one where they set a trap for paying taxes to Caesar. Yeah.

And because it's the same framework and in those contexts, Jesus, knowing their intent, he said, you hypocrites, why are you trying to trap me? So to me, it's the same application, you know, to this situation here. You see, you see the heart of Jesus here, too, that it's I just think it's interesting. She is caught in the act of adultery. I mean, she is.

you know, acting out and living in sin. That's true. So when you read the part where Jesus says at the end of it, he says, where are your, basically your accusers, where are your condemners? Has no one condemned you? And she said, no, no one Lord, because obviously they had seen their own sin in that moment. In some regard, Jesus had read their mail and set it up this way. But then he says, neither do I condemn you go and send no more. And,

And I think that's a hard passage or a hard phrase to kind of wrap your mind around because it's almost like you said two things that almost kind of are the opposite of each other.

Because there is no condemnation here. I don't condemn you, but it's not like, go do whatever you want. Everything's fine. Go. You do you. There's no condemnation in this world. I'm just accepting everything. He doesn't do that. He does not bring condemnation, but at the same time, he gives the instruction to go and send them more. And I think this is indicative of how we come to Christ. We often put...

limitations on people. And we had this conversation privately now recently about when people come to Christ, what do they have to have together in their life before they come to Him? Because we're dealing in a situation where we live, where we are constantly having Bible studies and interactions with people who are not coming

from a Christian perspective whatsoever. We live in the deep South. Everybody at least has this kind of cultural Christian context. But then when you get into areas like where we live, a lot of the people here, they don't even have a context for what it means to follow Christ. And so the initial coming to Christ, I mean, we simplify that down to really, do you know you're a sinner?

Yeah. And do you know that God came in the flesh in the form of Jesus Christ and that he suffered death on the cross for your sins and he was buried and raised on the third day? And now he sits at the right hand and mediates for you. And will he be the Lord of your life? And what that means for that person in that moment, that's going to change quite a bit as they walk with him. And I think the same is true of this woman also.

She probably had no context of what it would mean to actually follow Jesus in a meaningful way, but she would find out over the course of her life. At this moment, it's just like, you're just coming.

And Zach, what you're describing is most of the New Testament, everything Paul wrote, because here was a Hebrew of Hebrew, Pharisee of Pharisees, guy who knew everything inside and out about Judaism, now tasked with sharing the good news of Jesus with the Gentile world who knew nothing.

about all that i mean nothing they had no background so when you're talking about the passover and sacrifice and all these things that if you understand jewish history you would get it i mean these people didn't know anything and so all these letters are written about now look you know you can't have these food sacrificed idols you can't do this you can't do that i mean he's constantly trying to shape their mindset but it's once they've embraced christ that

is what's got to happen first. Do you try to teach them through everything they've ever learned wrong, or do you teach them about who Jesus is? Where do you start? Well, that's why this is difficult. But you've got to remember, this is the same Jesus who said in Matthew, after he talked about salt and light and the Beatitudes and all that narrative, he then talks about he came to fulfill the law.

And then he gets into all these things that, you know, murder, adultery, divorce, and oaths telling the truth. But that adultery one, when he said in Matthew 5, you have heard that it was said, do not commit adultery. But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her.

in his heart and then he like goes to this graphic language you know if your right eye causes you to sin gouge it out and throw it away you know it'd be better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell so i mean it's interesting that part of the reason that this story had trouble finding its way in the bible was because it was it seemed to be

Scandalous. Yeah, of someone caught in adultery. But I'm saying, how could you be any more blunt in that? He's like, yeah, you're hung up on adultery, but if you just look at a woman. So the standard was way above what they're saying, even though.

It wasn't like, let's stone them. He was like, let's start plucking your own eye out so that you won't even head down that road. Well, I think what Jesus is teaching there, too, is actually pretty profound. It's almost like he's using a...

The term is argumentum absurdum, which is you push the logic. There you go. He's looking for the whistle. I thought you were looking for the crickets. Argumentum absurdum, where you push the argument, you push it out to its logical conclusion, and you say, is this absurd, like what we're saying? And so when Jesus actually says, if your right eye or if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out.

The point is, is that your eye doesn't cause you to sin. What causes you to sin is what's in your heart. And so the Sermon on the Mount— It wouldn't do you any good to doubt that. It wouldn't do you any good. Well, true. I was just simply making the point that people who say this story is in here, that somehow Jesus—

was making light of adultery is kind of ridiculous. Because where I was going with that is when he talked about light, which he's fixing to talk to in John 8, when he talked about light in Matthew 5, there's a connection here. He ends that little phrase by saying, people will see your good deeds. Where's that? Matthew 5. Because he's like, do you take a light...

And in the same way, yeah, yeah, in verse 16. Yeah. In the same way, let your light shine before men. Of course, he had just talked about the Beatitudes, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven. Well, we start getting into good deeds where we're getting, he goes to the law, him being the fulfillment of the law. And then I do think you're right. He uses all these illustrations, right?

And some illustrations in absurd ways, because he's saying it's basically this is coming from your heart. But what I was going to say, I think you're going to see that same connection when he says, I'm the light of the world. I mean, that's the I think that's why they put it here. But I was going to read Romans 8 to answer your question about when he said, neither do I condemn you.

Go now and leave your life of sin. Because we know what he's actually going to do. He's actually going to die for the sins of the world, be raised, conquering sin and death. But then he's also going to pour out his Holy Spirit. And I think you see a glimpse of that in Romans 8. I was having a conversation with one of my buddies the other day, and he's like, when he was...

coming to Christ and all the studies, he's like, yeah, I mean, he was obviously hooked on Jesus. But someone read Romans 8.1, and boy, he said, when I heard that verse, I was like, here we go. Because he had come from a religious background where he just thought, I'm never going to be good enough. I can't, there's no way. He kind of got the conviction of sin to a point of, there's no way out of this.

And so Romans 8, 1, therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. Because he says that. When he says, woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you? Neither do I condemn you. Jace, you are holding in your hand a food supplement that matches everything that you're wearing. Filled of greens. Filled of greens. And when you're at an early age...

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Well, then he starts talking about this law again. The law of the spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by, and this word is hard to translate into English. There's various versions. By the flesh or human nature, sinful nature. God did by sending his own son to,

in the likeness of human nature, sinful man, flesh, to be a sin offering. And I think this is the key phrase. And so he condemned sin as,

in sinful man think about this woman yeah he condemned the sin in sinful man through his death on a cross eventually in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us and then then look at this phrase who do not live because he said go now what does he say and sin neither do i commit condemn you

go now and leave your life of sin. So you go to Romans 8 here and you see, who do not live according to the sinful nature, the human nature, the flesh, however you want your take on that. But according to the Spirit, those who live according to the sinful nature or flesh have their mind set on what?

That nature desires. But those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. The mind of the flesh is death. The mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace. The sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. Those controlled by the sinful nature or the flesh cannot please God.

So you, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature, but by the Spirit. And if the Spirit of God lives in you,

There's that live again. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. And then he makes the point about the resurrection at the end. And if the Spirit of him who raised him from the dead is, there it is again, living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit.

I think that's the echo of kind of the story of Exodus is in what you just said, too, that I preached on Exodus 3 Sunday. And one of the things that I had never really seen before in Exodus 3, which is one of the most important texts in the entire Bible, when Moses is at the burning bush,

But, and this helps me frame this up where I can read John 8, particularly the story of the woman at the well, and kind of see where do I have Pharisee tendencies to be like this? And the tendency is that I want to separate myself through a system that I develop to make myself believe that I'm more righteous than somebody else.

But I think the burning bush is a great way for us to kind of all come to grips with the reality that Moses –

at the burning bush was actually living on the run when he has the encounter with God at the burning bush. Moses had, he killed the Egyptian. He had fled to Midian. He was working for his father-in-law, Jethro, who he was tending to his sheep. So he's just kind of like coasting, living off of his father-in-law's wealth. He's not like this great

He doesn't have like any of the credentials. He had a speech impediment, wasn't a great speaker. We really don't know about his moral character, but I mean. And he'd been doing this act for 40 years. It's not like it was 40 days. I mean, he'd been out there for 40 years. Like you're like, like this is not the guy that you call.

to this. But God did call him. And so when he has the encounter with God, then there's a whole thing there about God revealing himself as the great I am and Yahweh in that moment. But Moses, when he sees the bush that's burning and yet it's not being consumed, he's like, wait,

Why is the bush not being consumed? Fires consume things. That bush is self, whatever fire that is, is self-generating. It doesn't need fuel, which is a picture of who God is, right? But when he sees that, he is so overwhelmed by the power of God's glory that Moses says, who am I?

that I should actually go lead these people out of Egypt. He understands that he's not equipped for it in any capacity. He doesn't have the moral fidelity, the intellectual capacity, the ability to communicate. He's not the guy for the job. Which is totally different than 40-year-old Moses, by the way. Totally different than that guy. He had been kicked in his face, humbled, knocked to the ground, not the guy. And God's response...

to him is so telling because God never says, I'm going to build up your, let me build up your self-esteem and tell you how great you are. Let me give you all your credentials. Let me tell you why you're the guy. He doesn't do that. The only thing God says in response to the question, who am I, is,

Here you are. I'll be with you. He says, I'll be with you. And that's all the credentials that you need. And so I think what happens in this moment with these Pharisees is we tend to all want to separate ourselves in degrees of righteousness as we approach the great I am. But in reality, if you could fast forward to the day of the second coming, when Christ returns,

in his glory, here's what's actually going to happen. Everybody is going to hit the deck and we are going to collapse under the weight of the revelation of the glory of God because we're all going to see that it flattens everybody's

or whatever you think you've built, because anything that you think you've done before an infinitely holy and good God, it's just, it really is pretty much all filthy rags, the Bible says. Well, back to your original story you told, you won't have to wonder if it's the moment. Right.

Yeah. You have to say you're wondering, what is those lights in the sky? But you'll know when this happens because every knee will bow. Well, I was just going to say one of the reasons I think they put this in here, which he had already brought up Moses several times. You know, John 5.

He's mentioned him almost every chapter. Yeah. Yeah. John 1, John 3. Remember the pole, the snake, the snakes in John 3. And then John 5, he's like, do not think I will accuse you before the Father. Your accuser is Moses on whom your hopes are set. If you believe Moses, you believe me for he wrote about me. Yeah. And so, but then when he gets to 7, when he brings up, you know, about David, he

Or they bring that up when he said, John the writer is putting that in there. It's like in verse, where is it? 742. Does not the scripture say that the Christ will come from David's family, which will come up again. And then here we have another law of Moses issue here in chapter 8. Because it's like, in the law, Moses commanded us to stone such women as

But what do you say? It's going back to all the other time, John 5. But then later on in John 8, well, then we have Abraham brought up. It's like all these characters, which the reason John keeps bringing them up in the conversation and Jesus keeps bringing them up, and the Pharisees, they keep going to these guys. And he's like, yep, I'm fulfilling this.

everything that they were pointing to because I am yeah I I he's I am the fulfillment and isn't it John 8 that he actually says before Abraham was I am yeah that's how he is I mean we're getting to that well I was just making the point they keep going back to these characters and he's like yeah this is here I am this was the result of all that

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Go to roughgreens.com and use the promo code unashamed. That's R-U-F-F greens.com. Use the promo code unashamed. You don't have to change your dog's food to improve their health. Just add a scoop of Rough Greens. I think the practical application of this for us is like, okay, you elevate yourself up and we all do it. Like we all puff ourself up and look at how good I'm doing.

And I think that's like you're missing the whole point. Like it's not about doing good and in the sense of like I'm ascending, you know, I'm getting a higher level of spiritual, maybe higher consciousness. It's not that. It's actually coming to the realization. It's being in his presence. I mean, that's really what it is. And if we're in the presence of God,

All the bragging rights just seem to go away, and all of the sectarian garbage and just the haughty spirit of the Pharisee and the scribe here, it just gets evaporated. I mean, it gets absolutely evaporated here.

in the presence of a holy God. It just consumes, His presence just consumes it all. And I think that's what Jesus is pointing to, this all-encompassing mercy. So they're going back to the law of Moses, but they don't understand what Moses, they're like, you're so far from what Moses was doing.

I mean, like, are you kidding me? Jesus, you guys missed this whole thing. Moses is the guy at the burning bush. Go read that. Go read that story. And do you embody that type of humility? And do you also have a desire for mercy, which is also what Moses said in the Old Testament as well, that God said he desires mercy.

And I think that they're not displaying that at all. Well, Zach, that's the dirty little secret. What they didn't plan on on their way to entrapping Jesus was that they were actually confronting the only person on the planet that could condemn this woman or them or anyone else. Yeah, good point. And yet he chose not to. Jason, when you were reading Romans 8, immediately I went back to John 3.

Because this is where Paul's, you know, inspiration was for writing what you read. Because, you know, we all know John 3, 16, right? For God so loved the world, he sent his only son. But 17 says, for God did not send his son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.

Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only son. And here it is. Here's where we're going to John eight. This is the verdict. Light has come into the world, but men love darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. Everyone who does evil hates the light will not come into the light for fear. This deeds will be exposed, but whoever lives by the truth comes into the light because

So that it may be plainly seen that what he has done has been done through God. Which is kind of the point, right? The light comes on. And so when the light comes on, that means it illuminates reality. And so now you can actually see what's in the room. And then when you look in the room of your own heart, your own life, you're like, whoa, wait, he's holy. I'm not.

I'm going to worship this God. That's what it elicits. Well, I think that's why it's hard to wrap your head around when I said John 8 is a doozy because by every impression that you have, the narrative seems like they're putting Jesus on trial. This was a trap. And then you're going to see that in the next couple of paragraphs. But what happens because Jesus is the light of the world is

They become on trial. That's it. Without really noticing what just happened. That is it. Because the trap, all of a sudden, be careful when you set a trap. I used to use traps in various forms. And all of a sudden, you realize that you...

You get caught by your own trap. Exactly. It's like the story where it's like, man, be careful when you dig a pit because you might fall in it. That's right. Or roll a stone, it may roll back on you. But I think the Romans 8 contrast is, I get it, the law is a part of this and Jesus fulfilled it, but he kind of introduced this concept of the law of sin and death

being conquered by the law of the spirit of life. And so that's why I think the evil one here is introduced in a bigger way, because what Jesus is fixed to get into, this argument, seems harsh. I mean, it's like he takes the gloves off. And we're kind of trying to prepare you for what we're fixed to read, because it's like,

Very blunt. But he's... Well, I think he's introducing the evil one here because at the latter part, or I guess the middle part of John 8, when they're like, hey, we're Abraham's children. They keep going back. We follow Moses. We're looking for the seed line of David and all this. And he's like...

Let me just lay this out here. You're children of the devil. That's harsh. Well, yeah, it's like, well, how come? How did he? What's he got to do with anything? What are you talking about? We're all we're all believers in God. But I think you see that theme start here in John 8 and then it's revisited in John 12 and then it's.

revisited in John 16, where the evil one has a, you know, it's like, think 1 John 3, which is, you know, a passage people don't like to read because they're uncomfortable with it, because it says Jesus came to destroy the work of the devil. That's the whole reason he came.

And people are like, well, that's kind of taking it too far. But I'll read that. I've read this verse before, and people are shocked that that's in the Bible. But I'm going to read that. Where is that at? 1 John 3, verse 8. He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work.

No one who is born of God will continue to sin because God's seed remains in him. He cannot go and sin him because he has been born of God, which is a very difficult passage to kind of wrap your head around. But I think you'll see what he means by that as we go on, because this whole claim about being Abraham's children is,

And then Jesus saying, you're children of the devil, which is kind of what he's doing here because they're like, they're wanting to what? Because of sin, they're wanting to stone, kill this woman.

But verse 10 of verse John 3 says, this is how we know who the children of God are and who the children of the devil are. Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God, nor is anyone who does not love his brother. So I simply said all that to introduce the idea that he brings up this concept, good and evil together.

The kingdom of the evil one, the kingdom of God. I mean, when you tie all these theme lines into this and you're seeing Jesus fulfill what God's plan all along was and the resistance, he starts introducing the idea of this is from the evil one. Yeah.

And I think that's exactly why this text is where it is, because it's a good place to put it, which is we're going to see that contradiction in the next part of the text. We're out of time. We'll pick it up right here next time on Unashamed.