Ep 890 | Missy Nails Miss Kay’s Famous Meatloaf Recipe & Phil Makes an Impossible Decision
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I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. I'm still down here at the Southern Lair. Jace, I want to note for the record that because you threw Zach under the bus pretty good on the last couple of podcasts ago because he didn't know when 10 o'clock was our time or 11 his time.

So he was about four minutes late, but he was 14 minutes early because I was on early talking to Maddie and he came in. So I just, I want that noted for the record because you've been throwing Zach under the bus, you know, quite a bit. Well, it's only the last 800 up.

I would say it's excessive. I noticed that. And the reason we're starting this podcast in this place is because it took me, I was here two minutes before we started and I was shocked that everybody was sitting or ready to go.

And then I once again offended Zach by saying, I said, I got to clear my head because I've had all these theological discussions this morning. And it's early, but I've had one, two, three deep theological discussions. Before podcast. Yeah. Zach was like, whoa, what have you been doing? I said, I,

I had these discussions on the phone because unlike you, when people call me, I answer. Yeah.

And so Zach rebuked me by saying, how about even though it's impossible to hurt my feelings, which is why. Well, you said that. You said I'm the last guy that you could insult. You said Zach's the last guy I can insult that that gets feelings hurt. That's what you said. So Zach said, how about for every 10 times you insult me, even though I'm not going to get my feelings hurt, you give me one compliment. So I'm going to give you your one compliment.

If I can, before you say it, if I can think, well, I don't have it yet. He can't think. Wow. Wow. He's got a partner. Well, I was going to say, make sure it's not a backhanded compliment. Well, you got that the other day. Remember what? Yeah. Larry got the same. He got the, he got Larry. Larry was old school. Yeah. And what were you, you were, uh, you like to use big words and yeah.

I was kidding. The one compliment I had is that Zach is somebody I can say anything to, and I don't have to worry about hurting his feelings. In our sensitive society, especially among men, that if you challenge someone, confront someone, or disagree with someone, the world is falling, or it's personal. Yeah.

And so, you know, it's difficult when you have these deep discussions. Somebody calls you and says, what about this? And you start saying what you believe. And then all of a sudden, they're like, well, is it that you don't like me? It's like, no, you asked me a question. I'm giving you my answer. It doesn't fit with your narrative. And now all of a sudden, you're taking it personal. Yeah. So there's your one compliment. Thanks for being a rock.

Zach. Zach the Rock. I like it. I am an oak. He is an oak. So, Jace, I heard you telling Dad before we came on that you're bringing him some of Missy's meatloaf because you guys have – Mom is still up in our neighborhood working on her strength and physical therapy before she goes back down to the river. So, is that what y'all fed her last night? We did. She came over, and it is improving slowly. It's a slow process.

And after every bite, she would just be like, you got it. You got it. And she's probably not going to like me saying this, but since we're talking about sensitivity and hurting people's feelings, she said, all the rest of my daughter-in-laws, they tried it. It didn't happen.

But you, Missy, you got it. And it was so good. So she it was her idea. She's like, you must bring Phil some of this because she all she's even though she's been down. Her number one thought is how can she take care of Phil?

30 miles away, which is I've been amazed at that. And dad, I was thinking about that too. That's 60 years together. You know, this year is 60 years. Oh, 60. 60. Yeah. Because, uh, you know, you guys kind of had an interesting start. So it's hard to exactly count from wedding dates and all that, but you've been together for

for 60 years since 1964 when he went to college. So y'all went together. 60 years. Pretty amazing. What's amazing is that Phil's neighbor brought him some Opelousas catfish belly meat, which for you maybe that are just new to the podcast, that is the greatest form of

of catfish that you can consume. Maybe any fish. Maybe any fish. Opalesis, which I said just a couple of podcasts ago, that the Sea of Galilee is full of. Yeah. And very few people are eating them.

But they are fantastic. And the reason they're so much better than a normal catfish is that my theory, I think I got this theory from you, is that they only generally eat things that are alive. That's right. Live bait. Well, when you clean a blue catfish or an eel catfish or a mud cat, you just look at the meat and you clean Opelousa's catfish and just look at the meat. You say, oh, I see why this is much better. You know the little black...

stuff that you see sometimes on catfish. Like you go to a restaurant and you're like, what is this? There's a little thin layer of gray, blackish material on the fish. Have you noticed it? It's coming from the belly meat. It's been so long since I've eaten that, I wouldn't remember. Y'all hadn't noticed that? Oh, yeah. So when you see that, an Opelous catfish does not have that anywhere on his body. Right.

So now, Phil, you're in a quandary. What to do? Is it meatloaf, world-famous Kay's recipe meatloaf, or is it opelousas catfish? I think a little bit of both would be the... Why not both? Well, you want to fry the catfish while they're fresh. Oh, yeah.

So I'd hit the catfish first. I'd put the meatloaf because you got about four days on the meatloaf. Yep. Yeah, it's one of the few things that gets better as time goes by. Yeah. Jersey makes a good...

concoction on that meatloaf. He makes an Italian meatloaf. It's a lot different than mom because he mixes it with Italian sausage and some other things. That's crazy that Kay was being very thankful for Jersey Joe and him feeding you. She said, but I did have to tell him and I'm scared to hurt his feelings, but he cooked a chili, a New Jersey style chili. And she said, I had to tell him this is not good.

But take this off the menu. I don't know if you have a memory of the Jersey chili. Yeah, they took it off. His feelings weren't hurt. He just said, whatever. Hey, you swung and missed, but they give you generally three strikes. Well, Stone was not nearly as diplomatic about that whole chili episode. Oh, you've heard about the chili, Al? Oh, yeah. Because he brought it to our house, too. And the worst thing he did, he didn't realize at the time, was he brought it when Lisa had already made chili.

And so it was just a direct comparison. So it turned into a little bit of an unspoken competition, which didn't turn out well for Jersey, but he's learned the Robertson way.

thicken up your skin and things will be good. Overall, you can't beat him. Good cook. Yeah. I had to tell Jill that we first got married. I said, you know, this is a harsh punch here. I mean, they're not, they're brutal when it comes to the reviews on food. So just, just know that in advance, if you ever bring anything to the table. Why not be thankful for that? You know, I am thankful for it.

Because we have consistently criticized the food to the point where, I mean, there's pressure involved in making sure that whatever is presented is excellent. If it's not excellent, then it's horrible. There's no in between. And whatever conversation we're having about a particular dish or particular food has no relationship to how we feel about our wives or the person. I mean, we love them to death. That's why we want it to be excellent. So that's our way.

Yeah. All right. So we've got a we've got an encore guest today backed by popular demand. And so we're going to take a break. And when we come back, I'll introduce our guest.

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Of course, our encore guest is our old pal, Larry Bowles, who's with us. Larry, we just we had such a good time with you on the last two podcasts. You're still convalescing. We've been talking a lot about in our cold open about convalescing. You're convalescing up in Oklahoma. And so you were gracious enough to come back because we got to Corinth. And I was like, man, we got to have Larry back to talk about Corinth. Yeah.

So welcome back, Larry. It's an honor. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. So we're in Acts 18 is where we're going to be today. In the last podcast or last couple of podcasts, we talked about Paul being in Thessalonica, Berea, and then on to Athens. And, of course, we got into that whole philosophical debate that he was having in the Europagus and everything that went with that.

And Larry, you brought up at the very end of our last podcast, I think you brought up Isaiah 29, 14, and which was, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, the intelligence of the intelligent. I will frustrate. We were talking about that in its context, but I looked it up after the podcast was over. And of course, that's the same quote that Paul uses in first Corinthians one, when he's describing the simplicity of the gospel and,

And the message of the cross, he says, you know, this is this is going to frustrate.

This sort of philosophical approach to all of it, because it is so different. And of course, that's what we talked about. Paul's message to the Greeks when he was in Athens is he was really going at the heart of that because the whole idea of the resurrection and the deity of Jesus is what sets Christianity apart. But not just in the first century and in this battle of ideas, but right to the current day.

2,000 years later, it's still the simplicity of the gospel. So it was a perfect place to kind of bridge that gap because Paul is going to leave Athens at the end of Acts 17. And of course, he's going to Corinth. And we know, of course, that Corinth becomes a big part of that as well. So just my first question to you, Larry, is how far is it?

From Athens to Corinth, because that's where you live and work when you're there. In terms of the region, just describe to everybody kind of what that's like there. Okay. Well, from Athens to Corinth is about 50 miles to the west, and it's not very far. When you're talking about the distance from Thessalonica to Corinth, you're talking maybe 125, 130 miles.

So it is it's not, you know, the difference between Europe and America, I always say, is that in America, we think 200 years is a long time.

And in Europe, they think 200 miles is a long way. So it's a pretty small footprint. But yet, you know, just the difference in culture, I think that as we come into 18, the things change so drastically between the Jewish, the pure kind of Jewish culture and

And as Paul enters into places like Thessalonica or Berea or Athens, just the it's almost an upside down picture between especially when it comes to women, how women were treated in a Jewish culture as opposed to how they're treated today.

in the Greek or even the Roman culture. And so in 17, 1 through 9, when Paul gets to Thessalonica, of course, he goes into the temple and begins to reason from Scripture. And it says that there were many prominent women there.

women that were there. Same thing in Berea, many prominent Greek women in verses 10 to 15. And then he comes in and finds the same thing in Athens. When he leaves Athens and goes to Corinth, what have you got? You know, you've got prominent Greek women who have money, they have position, they have power, they have wealth.

positions of influence. And this is a totally different environment than our mindset of, you know, like the woman at the well, the Samaritan woman, how can you even, you know, offer me a drink, that sort of thing. And so it's kind of an upside down culture to what we bring in the way of thought process to scripture. I was going to ask you because here in Acts 17, I mean, Acts 18,

we see that of course he, he runs up on Priscilla and Achilla for the first time. And, and Luke tells us that they are basically refugees from Rome because there had been an edict there that Claudius had ordered all the Jews to leave Rome. And of course, you know, historically everything that's going on there and that's going to continue to get worse, uh, emperor to emperor in terms of especially Judaism and later Christianity. Um,

But it's interesting because and I don't know if this is because the team was split up, you know, because they were he had sent them to different places and he's coming from Athens. But for what for the first time, we read that he basically has to earn some money. And and so because Priscilla and the killer were tent makers and that's what Paul did as well, apparently, that's.

We find out that he's earning some money and I'm assuming that's because, because later on we find out that he gets these messages that people have sent money from Philippi and other places. And he's able to then kind of go back into just full time, you know, ministry and evangelize in the city. Um,

And establishing the church there. But is that kind of what you what you guys see that happens with this setting here? This is like, OK, now, because, you know, Paul's one that said, I never really wanted to be supported by the church. But at the same time, people are giving him gifts. So, I mean, it's first time we're really reading about this kind of vocational missionary status, I guess. Well, that's true. And this is why Corinth was such a.

a unique place. You know, when you read the book of 1 Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, and this is why I bring up this distance, it's about 120 miles from Corinth to Thessalonica, they're worshiping the same false gods. They're basically doing the same things, but there's something going on at Corinth that is completely unique. And you have to ask yourself, why doesn't 1 and 2 Thessalonians read like 1 and 2 Corinthians?

And this is the problem that we have when we come to scripture is we were so often more concerned with what the Bible says than why it says it. And I always tell my Bible students that the three main rules of Bible study are context, context and context. It's kind of like real estate, I guess.

And so if you keep those three things in order, you're going to be able to do. But the who, what, when, where and why. And so I've said this before, but we, you know, we read through the Gospels. Jesus is crucified. He's buried. We get him out of the tomb and ascended into heaven. And then we go through Acts and we go through Romans and into first and second Corinthians. And we begin to kind of build our theology there.

out there with ever going back to these red letters and kind of looking at what Paul is saying. But it's difficult to build theology out of 1 and 2 Corinthians because it's not a theological treatise. It's a letter addressing specific problems to a specific people group in a very specific place.

And so he is, it's Paul's theology, whether it's in Thessalonica, whether it's in Corinth, whether it's in Ephesus, are going to be task theology or applied discipleship is what it is. And so we have to overcome the baggage we bring to scripture when we start looking at why did Paul say this to the people at Corinth, but over at Ephesus, he says something that's almost the opposite, spectacular.

It's because it's a different situation. Well, don't you think too that Corinth, I mean, it was known as kind of the sex capital of the world back then. And you see all that come up in Corinth. I just think it's interesting that he happened in quotation marks.

runs up on a husband-wife team, which when you think about what real love is as God defines it, and when you think someone who has built a city and is making money on sex that's not between a husband and a wife, that's going to be a pretty good foundation for ministry. And 1 Corinthians 13 comes to mind when he defines what real love is.

So what do you think about that? Oh, it's absolutely true. The thing about Corinth and why was there a tent business in Corinth anyway? Why? Why was there a market for tents? Well, before we had the Olympic Games, we had the Isthmus Games, and those were held in the Isthmus Peninsula right there just beside Corinth.

And people would come and they would stay for two or three months for these games. And so, so much of the analogies and the examples that Paul uses talking about, you know, I'm running to win this prize.

And I am fighting the good fight that I'm going to get this crown of laurel, you know, and finish this race. And so the unique thing about Corinth is that it probably functioned a little bit like New Orleans in, say, 1820. It was a shipping port and it had one of the largest slave markets in the world.

And the reason that the Romans came in and overtook this point in 146 B.C. was because whoever controlled that area controlled the seas around it. And it was a tremendous place of power.

And the Roman Empire at that time stretched from Spain all the way to the Caspian Sea, and Greece is right in the middle of it. Actually, the Greek Orthodox flag, if you look at it, has two opposing eagle's heads, one looking east and one looking west.

And so they kind of see themselves in that place. And at the time, the Roman rule, the Roman world, it was the center of the universe.

And so when Rome would go into these other countries, they would conquer them. And the first thing they would do is take the people and sell them into slavery and either bring them to that slave market in Corinth or send them back to Rome to that market there. Another thing is the Eastern influence that happens there when it comes to shipping.

And so everything that comes out of the Orient before that kind of Silk Road thing was going on, they were able to get things there by ship. And so sailors loved to come to Corinth. It was just a hedonistic place. And like I say, same false gods being worshipped, but they're doing it in such a way in Corinth that it's almost cult-like.

And so when we talked about on the last couple of podcasts, these five Greek ideas and this idea of dualism and the ecstatic speech and all of that, there's just a lot of stuff going on. So you can pick up so many clues.

From what Paul says in 1st and 2nd Corinthians and the analogies he used. And I brought that up in 1st Corinthians 13, a couple of podcasts ago, where he addresses the mindset and the ideas that these people are walking around with.

And so, you know, he starts, you know, if I can speak in the tongues of men and of angels, I'm nothing more than a clanging gong or a resounding cymbal. But one of the things that Corinth was known for was Corinthian bronze.

And a Corinthian bronze symbol would ring longer and louder than anything else. He says, you know, now I see as dimly in a mirror, a Corinthian bronze mirror that is polished is almost like a mirror. And so the beautiful gate in Jerusalem was covered and made out of this Corinthian bronze. It's mentioned several times in the Old Testament.

So that was part of the thing that they were known for. But why was there such a flow of traffic? Because it was a crossroads. Yeah, and it's an it's amazing looking thing. You took me there and I stood up there. I mean, it was one of the wonders of the world that I've ever seen. There's I mean, these high rise. I don't know how high we are. We were up there.

And you look at, it looks like a little bitty creek because you're so far above it. Yeah, that's when you were up on top at the, what do they call it, the Acrocorinth? Acrocorinth, right. No, that's when we saw the Isthmus. Oh, okay. Yeah, when you're looking at that canal, because that's where the port came through. Oh, yeah. And it was, I guess it saved you how much time, Larry, just to go through the

Yeah, they go through the peninsula instead of having to go all the way around. Right. What that is, I mean, Alexander the Great began building the Isthmus Canal, and it was an undertaking that actually did not get completed until probably the end of the First World War, beginning of the Second.

And so anyway, it was what they used to do is take ships and kind of put them on logs and roll them across. It's about a mile and a half across this peninsula, but it's about 46 miles to go around the horn of the tip of Greece there. And so it was vital. In World War II, Hitler took over the area and he had all of his

cannons and guns and he controlled the shipping in between the Ionian and the Aegean Sea right there. And it's just a very strategic operation

kind of a place. And as Hitler's losing, he blew all the bridges and then dumped all of his tanks and everything and made the canal impassable. And then the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, after the Second World War, dredged all that stuff out and got it passable to ship draft. Isn't that amazing? All these, I mean, you're talking about thousands of years after that started. That's still a strategic location.

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Well, it is, but now the ships were still going through, but it kind of made me think of that. If you build it, they will come, but if you don't do something good with it, they'll leave because the only thing left up on top was a little souvenir shop that looked like a 7-Eleven, and it was like, what happened here? You know, it was kind of depressing, but they're still using it as far as a port, but the city...

It just didn't hold up. Right. I mean, the topography has changed a little bit. When you look at maps, Bible maps, and how they look a little different, sea levels kind of rise and fall over a couple of thousand years. But there is a new modern Corinth, and then there's ancient Corinth where...

where Paul would have been. And you can literally walk on the surface that Paul would have walked when he got drug out of the synagogue and taken to the procouncil in front of Galio there in Acts 18.

But another thing is that when you're in ancient Corinth, you look up and there is this Acrocorinth and it's way up high. And so if I have the faith that can move mountains, this is some more Paul's language. I can imagine him standing there and looking at that. But this is where the Temple of Aphrodite was. OK, and this was, you know, we've all read.

about this just, you know, a thousand temple prostitutes, male and female, and all this sort of thing. Most historians, most geologists, archaeologists agree that

When Rome destroyed Corinth, I mean, they just leveled Corinth in 146 B.C., that that temple was probably wiped out. And the place just sat kind of wide open for a long time. And then I guess they rebuilt it. It's like 100 years, right? Yeah, 44 B.C. And so, yeah, Paul, when he would have gone to Corinth, I mean, the place would have been 110 years old. It was just in its glory.

But what went on up on this, you know, in this temple of Aphrodite, if it's not going on up there, all that means is all of that garbage that used to go on up on the mountain is now going on in the streets of Corinth.

And, you know, you didn't have to go far. So it was just it's just such an incredible. You ever wonder why it seems like everything in First and Second Corinthians is about gender roles and men and women and sex and marriage and divorce and remarriage and incest and ecstatic speech. And this is my point is that First and Second Thessalonians does not read that way at all.

Because there was some bad, bad stuff going on in Corinth that just wasn't going on in Athens, wasn't going on in Berea, wasn't going on in Thessalonica. Even Paul's description of his mindset is you see in the Corinthian letters as well, Larry. In 1 Corinthians 2, right after we were talking about that idea about the simplicity of the gospel and the importance of it, he made an interesting statement to the Corinthians saying,

which to me shows you his mindset of when he got to Corinth in Acts 18, because he said, when I came to you, brothers, 1 Corinthians 2, 1, I did not come with eloquence or superior wisdom as I proclaimed to you the testimony about God. And it's interesting that he makes that statement because we were marveling

At the job he did at the Oropagus in Acts 17, coming from Athens. I mean, I would have thought that was pretty amazing and pretty superior. But Paul himself was like, no, that's not what brought me here. I resolved to know nothing while I was with you, except Jesus Christ and him crucified. I came to you in weakness and fear and with much trembling.

Which is a really interesting way of describing his mindset. And I couldn't help but think about this kind of dust up he has in the synagogue when he basically shakes his garments out with the Jews and said, I'm just done. I mean, so this whole mindset, Paul was really, by his description, sort of a weakened state. He said, my message and my preaching is.

We're not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit's power so that your faith may not rest on men's wisdom, but on God's power.

And he goes into that. But so I thought it was interesting. Even his illustrations were about some of the things he saw, but then his mindset, the way it was going into Corinth, you can see there's a, there's a distinction for sure of how he's looking at things. That's why I thought it was interesting that it was really profound. When I read this, when in Acts 18, something strange happens when the Lord comes to Paul in a vision and,

In verse 9, because you think everything's going well. In verse 7 and 8, when it says Paul left the synagogue and went next door...

To the house of Titus because they had the Jews who had opposed him became abusive. That's in verse six. Right. And he shook out his clothes in protest and said, your blood be on your own hands. I'm clear of my responsibility from now on. I'll go to the Gentiles. So he left the synagogue and which is fascinating because he just went next door.

and kept preaching Jesus, and he went into the house of Titus Justice, a worshiper of God. Crispus, the synagogue ruler, the very place he had just been driven from, the ruler, comes to the Lord. He and his entire household believed in the Lord.

which is exciting because most of us, which also, which also just probably poured some real fuel on the fire with the, with this Jewish opposition. Cause one of their, their top guys becomes a Christian. But isn't that how the Lord works? Cause most of us would be so angry or fearful or, you know, we're just like, well, we're out of here. But he's like, well, I'm going to go share Jesus to the ruler. Yeah.

and bring him to the Lord. You don't think the Lord is powerful. But then he came to him in that vision. Well, I was just going to finish my thought. He came to him in the vision and says, don't be afraid. Keep on speaking. Do not be silent, which implies that

That he did come to them with fear and trembling. I mean, he was being abused. And I mean, it's a really vulnerable thing for him to say. And then he goes on to say, I got people here, but trust me, because you just wouldn't think Paul would be. He's like, he had a conversation with Jesus. He's doing the Lord's work. But it's still tough when you're being abused, persecuted, threatened. I mean, he was basically living a life of a fugitive.

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No, I just, you were talking about these, you know, I didn't come to you with eloquence. Well, in that culture, what they're looking for in Athens, what they're looking for in Corinth is eloquence and wise and, oh man, that guy is really smart. That guy has got this, or he has some knowledge, secret knowledge, you know, and that whole Gnosticism thing going on. And Paul just reminds us over and over again that

that don't be drawn away by smooth talking people, you know, and the gospel will preach itself, you know, the life of Christ, witnesses ahead of the words we say. I think it was Charles Spurgeon who said, you know, the word of God is like a lion. He said, you know, it's...

You don't have to defend the line. You just open the cage and the line will defend itself. And I think that's the way with truth, life, and light as we proclaim the truth of God that what people in Corinth, what people in Athens are looking for is

And you see it evidence as you go into Second Corinthians. You know, he's defending himself. He's like, you know, you're talking about these super apostles, you know, and I follow this guy and I follow that guy. And everybody's wanting to gather teachers around them to hear what their itching ears want to hear. People who don't want to hear truth won't listen to truth.

And so I think that is just kind of throughout that entire thing. We see all speaking truth. And what did it get him? Man, it got him stoned. It got him beat. It got him shipwrecked. It got him put in prison. And Jesus is like, just keep doing what you're doing. I got some folks in there that nobody's going to attack you. Nobody's going to hurt you. Yeah, Paul. Paul's interesting in his approach and and.

The Corinthian church, just adding on to what you guys are saying, you can't overestimate how much

of the responsibility that Paul is putting on the Holy Spirit to preserve his church and to advance his church. And, you know, that 1 Corinthians and 2 Corinthians passage particularly, I mean, that's what he's getting at because it was the—what does it say? I don't have it up. The Israelites or Jews demand miraculous signs and the Greeks demand wisdom.

You know, I equate that to kind of like the modern day charismatic movement on one side. Give us the signs, you know, give us the give us the proof. Give us the experience on one side. The other side says, no, give us the intellect. Give us the argument. Give us the apologetic. It's a great, great line from Spurgeon that you said there. But but Christ is like we we didn't bring any of that. Paul says we didn't bring it. We just brought Christ and him crucified and crucified.

I was thinking about this quote from Francis Schaeffer in one of his books, which is one of my favorite books, No Little People. And he says,

Rather than of the spirit, the central problem is always in the midst of God's people, not in the circumstances surrounding them. And when you read that passage of Paul's approach, you see it all throughout the book of Acts 2. It is the Holy Spirit who is producing the fruit, who's doing the work. And so Paul seemed to be just kind of in this vein of saying, I'm not really constructing this in a manner that

intellectually or experiential for you. It's not about my strategy. It's not about our methodology. It's not about anything other than that we are just underneath the power of the Holy Spirit. We believe the Holy Spirit is the one who convicts the world of sin, guilt, and judgment because Jesus said that in John 16. We believe that the Holy Spirit is the one that will guide us into all truth because he says that in John as well. And we're just leaning on the power of the Spirit to work in us. And we're just in a posture that says,

We're ready to move. And you see it whenever he's in an area, particularly here, where he's rejected by the Jewish people. So he just says, OK, well, you know, the workers are or the problem is that the harvest is plenty. The workers are few. I'll just go over to the over here where the harvest is happening, where the spirit's moving, which is with these Gentiles. And I love that because it gives me a lot of a lot of times in church leadership. I've always wanted to take on the responsibility of producing the result.

And the problem with that is that when you do that, even in your own personal ministry, you get arrogant and cocky if the results are good and you get devastated if the results are bad. But if you remember that the results are God's and that ours is simply just to be dutiful, then...

then we don't have to be captivated by the ebbs and flows of what the outcome is because it's God's outcome anyways. No, I was thinking the same thing because the two responses from Jews and Gentiles that you mentioned really shows you the two responses that we all have about our own efforts is that if you do believe, because some of them in the Corinthian letter

were they bought in and so instead of worshiping christ they started worshiping the people who were baptizing them yeah they were like oh you're because they that's what we do in our own life we either think too high of ourself or the ones looking for wisdom they're like no what do you do you're prof you're pontificating on all these answers to life and he's like well i'm a tent maker

Well, he got the same response as Jesus when he said, I'm a carpenter and that we've gotten Phil in our life about being duck call makers. He's like, well, you do not make duck calls. Well, they just kind of chuckle because they're saying, who are you? You're a nobody. You don't have any credentials. And so I think you see that in both cases, the response and our own individual response.

you know, struggle. We either think too high of herself, too low of herself. And, and the Jews and Gentiles are, they're like, give me the power or, you know, give me the wisdom. And so to Zach's point, when, when he,

went after chapter two in in first corinthians when he went into that how the spirit works in verse seven because that was right after he said we didn't come to you with eloquence and we came with you in fear but he said we speak of god's secret wisdom a wisdom that has been hidden and that god destined for our glory before time began and he goes down to verse nine and says uh

It is written, no eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him. But God has revealed it to us by his spirit. The spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man's spirit within him? In the same way, no one knows the thoughts of God except God.

the spirit of God. We have not received the spirit of the world, which is really applicable to what was happening in Corinth, but the spirit who is from God that we may understand what God has freely given us. And even that last statement, but we have the mind of Christ at the end of verse 16, Jay, is so powerful when you see that so far beyond anything that this earth has to offer.

Let me read this real quick, because to that point, you think, what does this have to do outside the connection with the church in Corinth? What does it have to do with Acts 18? We just talked about Acts 17, where Paul said that God doesn't live in temples built by man's hands, which the next question you should ask, where does he live? Where does God dwell?

And the scripture teaches that God now dwells with man. So when you mentioned that secret of the secret that's been hidden, listen to the language and Mark, whenever Jesus is about to give them or gave him the parable of the sower is Mark chapter four, verse 10. He says that when he was alone, those around him with the 12 asked him about the parables.

And he said to them, to you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God. We mentioned this on the last podcast, but I think it's relevant for what you just read in Corinthians. But for those who are outside, everything is in parables. But to you has been given the secret of the kingdom of God. And Larry, in the last podcast, mentioned Colossians 1.20.

27, which is the secret. It tells us what the secret is. It's Christ in you. So when Paul is talking there about the Holy Spirit, what he's essentially saying is making the case that God lives in you. Christ is in you. The Spirit is in you, living in the believer now. And he brings the believer into all truth. He takes what was the Father's and makes it known

to us and what was the sons and he makes it known to us. And no eye has ever seen, no ear has ever heard, no mind has comprehended the good that God has prepared for those who love him. And what that good is, it is that God now dwells with and in humans. I mean, that is a big, big deal. And so you see that flow throughout the book of Acts, right?

kind of at this climax in Acts 17 about he's not in the temple, he's in you. And then not just you, Israel, but like potentially all types of people, including the Gentiles, to which now Paul is going to take this exact gospel to the Gentiles. Well, to prove your point, Zach, when you say,

When he got to chapter 3 and verse 9, he said, for we are God's fellow workers, which he referred to Priscilla and Aquila the same way in Romans 16, when he said, they're my fellow workers and they risk their life for me. We are God's field, God's building. And then when he got to verse 16, it says, don't you know that you yourselves are God's temple and that God's spirit lives in you?

And that was a response to the same similar speech that he gave in Acts 17 that he gave in 1 Corinthians 3 where in verse 12 it says, if any man builds on a foundation using gold, silver, costly stones,

Wood, hay, straw, his work will be shown for what it is because the day will bring it to light. So it's the same theme in Acts 17 and 18 that he's saying that this is coming from the spirit that's in us. We're making Jesus' presence known here today. I'm glad he put in there about the Jews demand the signs. Because when we talk about the spirit living in a person, this is not...

This is not reduced to some experience. This is much more. This is much more than an experience. This is a connection and an intimacy and a oneness, a diversity in oneness that reflects the triune God, by the way, that is just... We can only scratch the hem of that garment, but it is so beautiful. It's much more than an experience. And I think when we use language about the Spirit, we're not saying this isn't...

simply an experience that you have when you're emotionally moved. It's much, much more than that. It's much, much more. It's anchored into the very fabric of reality, God himself. So Larry, we got a couple of minutes left. Bring us on. Okay. I just, you know, the humility that Paul continues to pour out. And when he says that I will be all things to all people,

What Paul is not saying is that I'm going to step into their culture. I'm going to act like them, dress like them. He would preach at the Areopagus to the smartest people on earth at the time, or he would go down into the streets of Corinth and he would reach in. He's saying that the gospel can be preached in absolutely any environment. And so he's going to

allow himself to be used in that capacity. And the one thing that is just overriding in Paul's message is to watch him use points of reference in people's cultures to

And not necessarily, you know, condemning or whatever, but it's kind of like telling a joke. If I were to tell you a joke and let's say that, you know, over in Afghanistan or Iran, there was this and that, and you didn't have any points of reference for that.

I'd have to explain the joke. The book of Revelation is a little bit like that. We don't have all the points of reference. And so we kind of try to make up these conclusions. But the idea that he uses elements just as Jesus did. Jesus, when he was in pastoral areas, he talked about sheep. When he's in agrarian areas, he's talking about vines and branches. And so he spoke to the heart of people.

And Paul was able to do that, to swing for the fence in Athens and then come in and do this stuff he had to do here in Corinth. Now, the idea that the mystery...

That Paul is talking about, everybody was expecting a Messiah, a political, military, whatever. But nobody was expecting that God himself would come to live in us, this Christ in us, the hope of glory. And the idea like like First Thessalonians 523 says that we are created in.

threefold, body, soul, and spirit. And so you go back to Genesis 3. And so I'm created. I have a body. I have a mind, will, and emotions. And I also have a spirit. And so God says, do not eat of this tree or you will surely die. And so they eat of the tree and God's word is true. And he says, boom, you're dead. They're still walking around in their bodies. They still have a mind, will, and emotions. Where did the death occur? They became dead to God in the spirit.

And everybody since that time is born in that condition. We are born with a need to worship. We're born with a need to be filled. And the world and everything in it, we try to meet that need from the outside in. And that's exactly what's going on in Acts 18 at Corinth. Everybody's walking into an environment and they're willing to do anything.

anything at all to try to fill that need to be loved and accepted and to have some kind of knowledge. But Jesus comes and he's the only thing that can fill me from the inside out. And so when Jesus talks about the kingdom, they said, where's the kingdom? Where is it here? Is it there? And he said, what did he say? He said, the kingdom is within you. It is among you.

Yeah. And it's just amazing. I've always heard that illustration that, you know, when God looked at the sea, he created fish. When God looked at the land, he created trees. When he looked at himself, he created humans. When you take a fish out of water, what happens? It dies. You take a tree out of the ground. It dies. You take a human away from God. It dies. Yeah.

That's a great point. So good stuff. We're out of time. We'll pick it up here in Acts 18 on the next Unashamed podcast. Thanks, Larry. It's always good to have you on. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes.

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