Ep 943 | Jase Unwittingly Draws a Crowd at Buc-ee's & How to Handle Sex Scandals in Churches
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Investing involves risk, including risk of loss. Fidelity Brokerage Services, LLC. Member NYSE SIPC. I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. I'm just saying I'm a fan now, but I wasn't a fan. Last time we were talking about Dad's mic, now we're arguing about Buc-ee's. All right, Zach, so tell us why you love Buc-ee's now. I mean, I'm not going to say I love Buc-ee's, but I will tell you this. Let me start here. I don't like buffets.

Are y'all buffet people? No. I don't do buffets. Buffet. What do you mean? You know, like with that. Yeah. That's why, that's why I hunt. The woods is an all you can eat buffet. Yeah.

The water is teeming with buffet of fish. Yeah, I don't like that. The reason I don't like buffets, Zach, is because of one of the men on this podcast, one Mr. Phil Robertson, my dad, who basically instilled in us at a very young age that when we put a bunch of food out,

And then, you know, just have a free-for-all to go at it. The last thing you want to do is be dipping out of there. That's the message I got. I think that was in the context of what they call pot luck. Yes. But that's people cleaning out their refrigerator and throwing three things together that shouldn't go together and calling it a casserole and then wondering why everybody's grumpy or sick. Yeah.

But I think it still applied to a to even an establishment that basically thought, let's just put a huge amount of food out that the level of quality doesn't matter as much as the massive quantity. Yeah. What's put out there? That's the thing. That was like the thing. And there's businesses that are set up.

to basically corral people through it. I've just always kind of steered away from that. And, you know, everybody, all my, a lot of my friends love Bucky's, which is a, I don't want to, how would you describe it? Like a Walmart of gas stations. It's a convenience store on steroids is what I always say. Yeah. It's redneck heaven. I can't, that's why I can't do. I went there once and an hour later, when I got back to the vehicle, Missy's like, where have you been? I mean, I was thinking about calling the police.

I was like, I was meeting and greeting all the redneck world. Because that's what it turned into. They're like, hey, are you the... Oh, they're our people. Are you one of those duck guys? Well, I mean, the line formed. You had one line to the cash register, another line to the cash register, and then you had a special guest...

which was the duck guy at Bucky's. Zach, you need to – Fanta who owns that Bucky's, that's where we need to do all of our appearances is at Bucky's. No, I made a pitch. I turned around the cash register and said, hey –

find the manager and we might can work something out here. And she said, I don't think we're interested. If you're listening and you work at Bucky's and you know, someone in the upper echelon of Bucky's. Yeah. I mean, I feel like they're, I look, cause I w I was like, I mean, I, I wasn't a fan, but, but I'll tell you, I finally figured it out. Cause I stopped twice, drove to Nashville and back on our 40. There's two Bucky's on our 40. And, um,

When I tell you, they got the bathroom set up is there's got to be. A hundred. Oh, it's got to have a hundred stalls in the bathroom. Every stall is private. It's clean. They have hand sanitizer in each stall and they have a cleaner that you can clean the toilet before you use it.

You know what you're describing? And what I do, I've only been to Bucky's once. If I want to go experience that, I go home. Well, you're on a five-hour drive. Sometimes you can't. Jase, some of us are not hermit crabs like you and dad. Zach and I are men of the road. He's like, look, these great revelations, they have toilet paper.

I mean, they have a place to wash your hands. Then you have some hand sanitizer. I was just thinking about my home and my bathroom. I was like, well, I experience that three times a day at my house. Well, that's what I'm saying. If you're on the road, though, what do you do? And I used to say, go find out like a hotel lobby because that's always a good move. But this is like, I mean, I'm telling you, they built an entire business.

basically around, we got clean bathrooms and we got plenty of them. Yeah. And they got pretty good food there too. They make, they got a pull port sandwiches. I think I would tell you, like I tell my kids when they were young, I would say, whatever you need to do, do it now. Cause we're not stopping. Yeah.

And so they all go, you know, to the bathroom at our house and then we drive. Yeah. So I'm with both of y'all because I agree with Zach. I mean, you're exactly right. It's a clean, amazing stores, a lot of stuff there, but I agree with Jace and not even on the being recognized of as much as just too many human beings in one store. Yeah. And you can't already get in the parking lot. There's one down here that they just built. It's a new one that comes down to orange beach. Yeah.

And I mean, you know, first time I was, ah, Bucky, we, we pulled in, we, we, you know, we walk in there and, but it was at late at night. So it wasn't a ton of people. That's when they came back. Yeah. The next time I came by there, you could not get another car on the parking lot. There were hundreds of cars.

And I just want a convenient stop. There's a scripture that says something like a clean bathroom overcomes a multitude of sins or something like that. Well, look that up because I don't think that one's in there. But I think if people, I think we should travel from 10 to 5 at night, which is when I travel, unless my wife,

you know throws a fit and it's like what you're saying 10 p.m till 5 a.m yeah because then you can stop at all these places if they're open there's nobody in there you know there's no traffic on the road it's cooler yeah so kids kids will sleep if you kids are sleeping that's what we did most of our life which caused a little friction in the marriage but i'm like take a pillow and a blanket

And so I'm just saying, if you're really, if the walls are closing in on you, you know, that have small families. I don't know, Jason, I don't know if you knew this or not, but they're building a Bucky's in Ruston.

which is where dad, where you and I were born and where dad went to one Louisiana tech university. So they're building one out on that new exit in Ruston. So Bucky's is coming to Northeast Louisiana. It's, it's all, it's on the way. I think it's another year or two before they build it, but it's going to be right there in our backyard. So you can just go down there and do an appearance anytime you want to. Well,

Well, I'll send you and you can give me a report. I just want to say, I didn't get paid to say this, but I mean, I'm giving the official endorsement of Bucky's based on the bathroom situation. Well, first of all, I never heard of Bucky's, but I must say that I've maneuvered myself in the last decade. You are Bucky's.

I'm not. If you're looking for me around some store or anything, I've just. It's not you. It's not me. Are we ever going to find you at a Buc-ee's, Dad? That's my question. Will we ever find Phil Robertson? No, you're not going to find me on the premises. If somebody comes up to you and says, hey, I saw you the other day at Buc-ee's, you'd say it wasn't me. That's right, guy. Yeah.

I've never been down that Buc-ee's road. I know nothing about it. I was going to Turkey this morning. I said, I'm trying to think of a reason I would go to a place called Buc-ee's. Buc-ee, that's enough to shoo me out of there. Dad, do you know what the mascot is at Buc-ee's? You're going to love this. It's a beaver. The mascot of Buc-ee's is a beaver named Buc-ee. The beaver I know firsthand.

Is that because they work hard or whatever? Bucky Beaver. I don't know what the, that's the, that's the mascot. It's a beaver. So you think Mackie goes to Bucky's? Does Mackie go to Bucky? We're in Ephesians chapter four. It started, you started this act by giving Bucky's. I just had the experience. That's true. Oh, that's funny. Yes. We are at Ephesians four today. There's one last thought that I wanted to take us to cross us over today.

From the other one, I mentioned that idea about being full, the fullness of God back in 319 to surpass knowledge that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God. And I mentioned this briefly a couple of podcasts ago, but I did a little bit deeper dive into it. And I wanted to say something about it. Philippians 2 says,

It's in the ESV and I think the New American Standard. It says that Christ emptied himself.

In the NIV, it reads a little bit differently. Let me look it up. In the NIV, it says made himself nothing. But the Greek word there is actually empty. That's the word. He emptied himself, meaning that he became one of us and became a human being. And yet he was still God, but he was also human. But, you know, I just I just want to mention one more time, because the idea is.

That God is so full. He fills all things. He fills the universe. He's all powerful. He's all knowledgeable. And yet he was willing to become one of his creation to to save us, to offer a salvation and also to transform us and ultimately to glorify us. I just think it made the passage even more enriching to me to realize how great Jesus really is.

And what he was willing to do for us. And so that's that word for empty. It's mentioned four other times in the Bible, and every one of them is a negative connotation. And all the other times that it's mentioned, which I thought was interesting when you see that in a sense, the Romans 414, 1 Corinthians 915, 2 Corinthians 937.

And then 1 Corinthians 1.17 says, For Christ did not send me to baptize. Remember this context when Paul was talking about somebody was trying to get him to baptize. He did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not with wisdom and eloquence, lest the cross of Christ be emptied.

There's that same word of its power. So he was saying that I don't want to somehow put this on me because the power is in Jesus, not in me. And so he says, I don't want that to be empty. That's the same word and the same idea that Jesus did for us. He emptied himself. He became one of us, uh,

So I just, I don't know, it just, it really stood out to me that was so enriching to think about how great the love of Christ is. Well, it's interesting when you think about that verse, he's taking on Christ.

the nature of man. Yeah. He's not, but he's not giving up his deity in any, in any, uh, form or fashion. Correct. That's not what the verse is saying, you know, because in Colossians two, Paul says that for in Christ, the fullness of deity lives in bodily form. So, so you got a Christ in our God in body, which I think that's the,

That's the beauty of the whole gospel, really, is that you have the God that transcends so far above creation and humanity, and he creates. And then that God, the fullness of that God, takes on human nature and lives in bodily form, which is... Well, and think about it, Zach. I mean, Jesus is the centerpiece.

of all of these texts, it all comes together when he said, you, however, did not know, you didn't come to know Christ in that way, meaning impurity, continual lust for more, lost all sensitivity. He said, you didn't learn that from the Jesus. You were taught with regard to your former way of life to put off your old self

So there has to be a change in behavior, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires. Don't be that. To be made new in the attitude of your mind. To put on the new self, created to be like God, and true, and he goes over the truth about three times here, created to be like God, and true righteousness and holiness. Therefore, how you operate,

As you move forward, therefore, each of you must put off falsehood and speak truthfully to his neighbor. For we're all members of one body. We're all in this together. Jesus is the king. We're the kingdom. In your anger, it happens that it's easily, you can be easily angered if you're not careful. Don't let the sun go down while you're still angry. And do not give the devil a foothold.

He who has been stealing must steal no longer, must work doing something useful with his hands, that he may have something to share with those in need. Don't let any unwholesome talk out of your mouth, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs. These texts...

or a way to roll and it's amazing that it may benefit those who listen don't grieve the holy spirit of god with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption

So you can override all this stuff that's coming at you from the world. Get rid of all bitterness, rage, anger, brawling, and slander. They're out. You just don't operate that way. Along with every form of malice, be kind and compassionate to one another.

forgiving each other just as in Christ God forgave you. Yeah, I think it comes back to that. It's pretty blunt. That power of love and love of power. I mean, Jesus, that was the expression of God's love. I mean, he did what we couldn't do.

I mean, just reading that, you say, boy, this is a challenging way to roll here on what you give up and what you hold on to. It's all marked out. It's not like, well, I didn't know I was being so mean to those people. Well, it comes back to what happened in the garden. I mean, when Satan said, when you eat that fruit, you'll be like God.

That's what I mean about this quest for being our own power and authority and try to work everything out. But God in his love became a human. So just when you, it's hard to wrap your head around that because you're like God. The imitators of God so dearly loved children and live a life of love just as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us.

a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God. That's what I mean. He showed you the ability to surrender, to be humble, to be a servant. You remember when in the verse he says he became a ransom? If your name comes up, it needs to be on the love side. Do the acts of God.

not taken out or redeemed in somebody's meanness or mad at him or revenge. Yeah. Just worldly, basically, just rampant. It's just got to go. Yeah. Yeah.

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And just to reset it for transition, because that is zoned into where we're headed. We've studied these first three chapters of Ephesians, and basically they've given the plan in person.

I mean, this is, you know, we started at the beginning. This plan was before the creation of the world. And then it was all about who Jesus is and then him living in us through his spirit. Now in chapter four, he's going to talk about the purpose that comes out of that, which then becomes us. So it's not even, I agree with what you said, Jason, recent podcast, not necessarily about what this is just.

one size doctrine and one size lifestyle. It's more than that because it's understanding that we're all have to be purposed in who Jesus is in us. And so that changes us. That gives us new insight and it gives us new wisdom, uh, gives us gifts and abilities that come from the spirit. So all of those things are going to define our purpose and who we are and kind of how we live and what we do. And that's kind of where we're getting to in chapter four. And I think too, cause you're going to see a lot of opposition, uh,

And so he kind of resets saying, look, remember the overall calling that we've all been called in God through Jesus. And so then he gets into unity and he starts talking about grace, that God's grace has given us all this. So as a collective calling,

body of Christ, we can show the world what Jesus looks like. Yeah. But so the opposition, even as Christ apportioned, yeah, the opposition comes up because then he starts making statements and especially in the letters to Timothy and all, uh,

Because their backdrop, they didn't like this because it was taking their selfish wants and desires. And there was a lot of prejudice here and a lot of conflict. And you got the Jews and the Gentiles. And so, you know, just like a comment when he says, then we will no longer fight.

uh, be blown like, you know, on the waves, uh, immature by every wind of teaching. And he really gets in that with, with Timothy. And so they were having a lot of false apostles, a lot of false teaching, and it was all trying to get back to this worldly idea of what success looks like, how much money you got, who you're having sex with, uh,

You know, it's a jungle out there. What idol you're worshiping. Oh, man. So but, you know, being Jesus in the world means you you find this union in Jesus and in his grace and what he's put together. And that's where it's got to start. And so he kind of gives this battle cry of, you know, which we talked about this before.

And I'll go ahead and read it, I guess. You want me to read it out? Yeah, read that first section, the first 16 verses. Chapter 4, he says, As a prisoner for the Lord, then I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received, which is this is all about Jesus as Lord here. Yep. Not, in their case, somebody from Rome or some goddess that we've declared to have all authority. No.

Be completely humble and gentle, which is why you were bringing up that. Jesus gave us the example of what self-giving love looks like. And gentle, be patient, bearing with one another in love. Make every effort to keep the unity of the spirit through the bond of peace. And then I mentioned this before in the Greek language, those first two words, there is a four, four's not in there. He gives a chant.

And there are seven things he says. One body, which he's mentioned many times, which is the head, is Christ. We're the body of Christ. He gave an analogy of a human body. Jesus is the head. We're the body. One body. Uh.

One spirit. And remember, these are the same people that when this first started, they hadn't even heard there was a Holy Spirit. Yeah, that's how their whole thing started into them being the Ephesians, right? Just as you were called to one hope when you were called. So he goes back to that call and Jesus says, Lord, and we know that not only do you become a disciple of Jesus, you get God's spirit, you're a member of the body, but you also have this hope.

of eternal life, this inheritance as sons and daughters of God, as Jesus is Lord. So then it says one Lord, and there's Jesus is Lord, one faith, one baptism. And you remember that in Acts 19, when he baptized the first ones in Ephesus there into the name of Jesus, one God and father of all who is over all and through all and in all. Man.

What a sweep. Yeah, that's four times that's mentioned all, which again goes back to that fullness principle. It's the seven things that make us one. I mean, that is...

That's what brings us together. And you're right. And it started with the idea of Jew and Gentile that he mentioned back in chapter two. But but you could apply this to anybody, any group of people, any any mindset, any because I think about that one hope. I mean, that's a powerful thought when you think about it, because people a lot of people hope for a lot of different things. But there's only one hope.

That really matters to every single person. That is what happens? What happens? I mean, is this it? Is this is this life all there is? Is there is there something more? Is there something more enriching somewhere? Is there something after this? You know that we're here? You know, all those questions really boil down to one thing.

which is why he says that. I mean, when you think about that, this is a common human condition. It doesn't matter whether you're in Africa, whether you're in India, whether you're in the U.S., everybody has the same things they deal with every single day. Yeah. Well, usually when you read that, people don't like reading this in an earth setting because they're like, well, this seems, I guess the official word would be sectarian.

You know, this makes people uncomfortable. But I don't see that at all. I think it makes you realize you better be open-minded, number one. Why do you say it makes people uncomfortable? Because the word one. Because it sounds like you're being exclusive. That's what he said. People are like, one? Well, there's thousands of ways to...

You know, whatever. And find God. Yeah, finding God or salvation. There's thousands of religions. I mean, even in our own Christianity, meaning people that acknowledge Jesus as Lord, there's thousands of different groups. And I'm just going to be honest, based on my view, most of them don't like each other. So, do either one of you guys know how your liver is doing? No.

Every time we talk about liver, I think about that Bible verse in Proverbs where it says, you know, make good decisions or you'll wind up, you know, like a deer walking through the woods until an arrow pierces its liver. So I know that it's important. You must protect the liver, Al. The liver has to work. And look, even more than you probably recognize, Jason, the American Heart Association, they

lets us know that people who have fatty liver, which is a huge problem in our country and our culture, you're three and a half times more likely to have heart failure than those without. So it's obviously affecting more than just your liver. And that affects 100 million Americans a year. So it puts a lot of people at risk. Everything gets thrown at your liver. It's kind of your body's filtering system system.

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Try Liver Health Formula and receive a free bottle of blood sugar formula to reduce sugar cravings when you order today. Try Liver Health Formula by going to GetLiverHelp.com slash Unashamed and claim your free bonus gift. That's GetLiverHelp.com slash Unashamed. That's the centerpiece of which is not good. Yeah, just to give you an example, like I remember an argument I had maybe a week ago.

And I brought up some song that, oh, I know what it was. It was the blessing during COVID, you know, when, I can't think of who did that song. Oh, yeah. And your children and your children and their children and their children. Well, I brought that song up and, you know, and the brother's like, well, you got to watch those kind of songs. You know, some of these groups out there, and it was a little speech, right?

He's like, some of these groups, you know, the words of the songs are, you know, false doctrine. And so he started naming off a bunch of groups that he don't listen to. And I said, isn't that song an actual Bible verse?

And he's like, yeah, but you got to look into whatever group they're with. And I was like, I ain't got time. They're literally singing a Bible verse, you know? And then he got off on another issue saying, well, you know, some of these churches out here, and I think he was referring to some of these mega churches and all. He's like, they got sex scandals going on and stuff.

I said, look, I hate to tell you this, but there's probably a sex scandal at your church. Yeah. And he's like, well, you mean I hadn't heard about it? I said, oh, it's going on because there's human beings there. That's right. Yeah, there was a church in a town called Corinth that had sex scandals too. Well, but, you know, and that's a crazy illustration. But I'm saying we actually had that discussion yesterday.

And I thought, you know, we're not policemen here. And there's things that unite us. But at the end of the day, we're all flawed human beings. And you're never going to go to a church where bad things are not happening. Right.

And so, you know, I get it. There's some things that are deal breakers out there, but it's got to revolve around one of these seven things or I'm not worried about it, you know. And when did we get to a point where you have to quote somebody or, you know, because we quote a lot of people on this podcast that you quote somebody because it really impacted you and had a great influence on you.

that you had to agree with everything that person believes and said in every conversation they ever did publicly, or you can't ever even quote anything they said. I mean, that's insane. Well, that's why this, I mean, public disclaimer here, I know we've said it before, said again, we referenced a lot of people that, uh,

we don't line up with on everything. I don't line up with you guys on everything. Well, you're wrong all the times that, but we love you. I'm wrong on the things I'm wrong on things. I don't know I'm wrong about until I realize I'm wrong. And then that's right. But, but there has to be some type of generosity in our pursuit of the Lord. And I like the term generous orthodoxy or, or CS was called, called it the great hall of Christianity. I mean, but yeah, it's, if you become the heretic police, uh,

One, I'm just not that confident in my own ability. I want to have some type of humility that's like, you know,

I like what Bill Smith used to say. This is where I'm at right now. And it's not to say there's not an ultimate truth, but it is to say that I'm not the determiner of that. And even my interpretation of scripture is going to be flawed. It's going to be jaded. I mean, there's that thing there that I got to deal with. And I agree with you. There's a song called Reckless Love that was another one that a lot of people got angry about.

And I'm like, I guess depending on how you interpret the song, but I'm like, I mean, we read into this stuff so much. I mean, I sang the song and loved it. And for me, it was just that God is unabashedly coming after and just he is storming through to chase his people down. And that was very meaningful for me.

in a particular time in my life when I needed, I needed to sing that song to believe that. And, um, well, how many times have you heard people say, you know, you think about old hymns, they were written 150, 200 years ago. And, um,

you know, you're at a funeral somewhere and it was somebody's favorite song and maybe they were, you know, very older person and, you know, you're still moved and touched by those things. But, but, you know, you may say, well, you know, it's different now than it was then. Yeah. But it's about God's way of touching you through song or, or,

Psalm or reading or the scriptures or whatever. I mean, we just we shouldn't be the people that poopoo that I listen to all these old songs. Let's throw that out because only new or the other way around. You know, we do. And to the point of the text, I mean, you know, we don't have a lot of unity in the body sometimes because we're or can be very sectarian as believers.

And, you know, I know the rebuttal, too. I mean, I've heard it. I've even probably participated in it. I have, too. I mean, we all have. But I think a good litmus test is this. Are you talking more about what's wrong with people?

the body of Christ and that group or this group or whatever group, or is the grand trajectory of your presentation of the kingdom? Is it about who Christ is? Are you talking about, are you leading people to fall in love with him?

Or are you leading people to see how everybody else is a heretic and they're teaching false doctrines and whatnot? And I mean, we grew up in a church where I mean, how many times have you heard the word false teacher, false doctrine? I mean, are the denomination we grew up in historically was notorious for calling each other out and ripping each other's threads. And it's just like and you look at the fruit of that in the end. And and as one pastor said, you can be dead right. But you're you're just that you're dead.

Right. You know, and I think there's, there's, I think that's what's beautiful about the picture here is,

is there is life in Christ, and it's actually through the church that we experience the kingdom now, which is a reflection and a manifestation of the kingdom to come. And that's the picture that Paul is painting in Ephesians. And so I want to make sure that whatever I'm doing in my work in the church is

I pray to God that it is to that end and not simply just to call out everybody who's not doing it right.

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Head over to netsuite.com slash phil. That's netsuite.com slash phil. Check them out. That's why I brought up first and second, Timothy, because Paul's writing to Timothy about all this false teaching. And remember, he said, watch your life and doctrine closely. But when you read the entire letters, which I did last night, because I knew we were going here, just because he's like, be unified. And I've had people before. I mean, one guy comes to mind.

where I shared Jesus with him. He came to the Lord. He went off, went to some school, and he come back and basically said, okay, you're out. And I'm like, out of what? He's like, here's where you're wrong. And he was telling me all these things that he disagreed with me now. And I was like, well, I mean, I don't care that you feel that way. I'm going to disagree with you, but I'm still going to love you. And he's like, no, you're not.

It's like it was a deal there. He felt like he had to draw a line in the sand unless we come to agreement on certain issues. So I listened to the issues. None of it I deemed as very important. So I was like, all right, well, thanks for sharing. But I'm just going to disagree with you and love you anyway.

Which that kind of ended the relationship from his side because it's like, well, now you've gone from, I mean, he's like, I don't want to be unified with you anymore. So I think that's very dangerous. But first and second, Timothy, it has all this stuff about, you know, the words of doctrine and watch false teachers. But right in the middle of these things are beautiful moments where he focuses on Jesus.

And just to pick a couple, you know, even when he was talking about setting up overseers and deacons, when he got to the end of chapter three, first Timothy, remember that where it says beyond all question, this is three 16. The mystery of godliness is great. He appeared in a body was vindicated by the spirit was seen by angels was preached among the nations was believed in the world was taken up in glory. Well, who's he talking about?

He's talking about Jesus. Jesus. You know? So then he's like, the Spirit clearly says, you know, 1 Timothy 4, in later times, some will abandon the faith. The faith in what? In Jesus. It's like when you read the whole thing, I mean, I'm just skimming through here, but like in 2 Timothy 2, here's also the same kind of moment.

In verse 10, he says, therefore, I endure everything for the sake of the elect that they may too obtain the salvation that is in Christ Jesus.

with eternal glory. Here's a trustworthy saying. If we died with him, we'll also live with him. If we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will disown us. If we are faithless, he will remain faithful for he cannot disown himself. And my only point is that you brought up C.S. Lewis earlier. It's kind of like what he said, folks that's known Jesus.

kind of like focusing on the sun, the actual sun that gives us light and heat. But he's like, you know, I believe in the sun because I see it, but I also see everything else, which because the sun illuminates, you know, and that's kind of the way it is, I think, in Christ. And when you get to all these religious differences, I mean, the bottom line is,

Jesus is the center of this book. And I've said many times, I vehemently disagree with a lot of people that I love because they love Jesus. And that's what brings us together. Well, think about it. Look how singular this idea of one is. But look at what he talks about. He doesn't talk about all that stuff in this text. I mean, it's a body. In other words, a body of Christ. It's spirit.

It's Lord him. It's what we hope in. It's what we have faith in baptism, which is that, you know, that public confession that we're in one. And then he says, God, the father. So it's pretty limited when you think about it and what we're in the scope of what should unify us. I mean, we shouldn't get into this myriad of stuff you're talking about days. I mean, in other words, whether we're in Christ or not, that's where it gets wonky and crazy. I mean, we can be in Christ, but,

As long as I mean, he lays out some pretty specific things that are pretty big ones that that, you know, don't leave a lot of interpretation to. Yeah. And there's a I mean, I'm sure there's a place and there is a place. Right. Because it's in Scripture. There's a place for us to address false teaching. Sure. And there's a place for us to address heresy, you know, and heresy.

Peter, which one is, I think Peter talks about this. Hold on a second. Yeah. In second, second Peter, he talks about it in terms of like sensuality and, you know, things like the church giving over to sensuality and things like that. A Jew talks about it a little bit. And then the, the passage of first Timothy six, which is what Jason was alluding to earlier. There's also an earlier part of the book as well. I was just reading through this when you mentioned that. And I find it interesting that,

that in the same text where he's talking about false teachers, he talks about people who have an unhealthy craving for controversy and for quarrels about words, which produce envy, dissension, slander, evil suspicions, and constant friction among people who are of a depraved mind and deprived of the truth.

And when I read that, I think, man, so often how many times you see the same type of the people that are constantly saying false teacher, false teacher, false teacher, but they don't talk about this idea of

unhealthy desire or craving for controversy or quarrels about words. When I read that, I'm convicted. I'm like, man, I don't, because I can like veer into that. And I'm like, I don't want to, I don't want to do that. I don't want to get into a semantical game of,

with people about scripture and we're arguing about words and semantics and controversies. And then, and then there's another context here where, um, it's people who are using the word of God and the church for, uh,

financial gain. And that's their motivation. Well, Zach, I have a theory about that. I think a lot of people that do that, especially in leadership positions, are trying to cover up the immorality with all of this other stuff. Oh, it's all about the cover-up. What y'all just described is why I brought up a few podcasts ago about cults, because you got to realize the church in Ephesus was battling a cult.

That, you know, we're worshiping a statue and that became one of the seven wonders of the world. But have you ever noticed the tendencies out when a church goes wrong? It's usually some kind. It's the opposite of humility. You got some kind of people in power.

who are untouchable. There's nobody holding them accountable. So they've, which is supposed to be Jesus. He's the head of the church, not some dude. Exactly. And so now since no one's holding him accountable, he's like a typical human being. Yeah. He goes out to the world. I think the next thing is isolation. Yeah.

Where they, since there's so much evil and there's so many people that they disagree with, even in the religious world, they tend to isolate themselves where the world is not welcome. Yep. And so you see that in cults all over the place. I think there's also a detachment of Jesus from the scriptures.

So a lot of the things that they teach are from the Old Testament because they, like a lot of the Jews that Paul was writing to, did not see Jesus in the Old Testament. So they're just making all kinds of teachings based on the reading of the Old Testament. And it's not about Jesus coming alone.

You know, take care of the problems. That's a, Jace, that's even, you could even do that with the New Testament in a way. It's a little more nuanced, but I think that that is, that's what I was saying earlier about a great litmus test is if, am I talking about the scriptures or am I, or am I talking about how the scriptures point us to Jesus? Yeah. And, and that is different. I mean, that is a different thing. And, and,

And I mean, Jesus said this. He said, you study the scriptures and by them you think you're saved, but you miss me, the one they're talking about. And so I think that litmus test is, am I talking about making sure that I got all the right belief systems? Not saying it doesn't matter what we believe matters. Our doctrine matters. But as my emphasis on making sure that that's all checked, because I grew up like that. I grew up in the churches of Christ and it was all about believing the right way.

And I didn't really hear about believing in him, putting my trust and faith in him growing up. I'm just telling my experience. And so that's the big litmus test.

Is what we're talking about, are we talking about who is this God of the Bible that all the fullness of deity dwelt in bodily form? That's the trajectory of what's going on in Ephesians. And to Phil's point, Christ is the center of all of it. That's why the whole unity that he's talking about and the whole church is

is built on him. That's Paul's argument. It's not built on the right, all the correct systems. It's built on the person of Jesus. And then the scripture and whatever system we come up with should always be pointing us to him. And that should be evident in the way that we come across with the world around us. Ryan Reynolds here from Intmobile. With the price of just about everything going up during inflation, we thought we'd bring our prices down.

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We will in all things grow up into him who's the head, that is Christ. From him, the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament. Jesus has to be in the center. Supporting ligament grows, builds itself up in love as each person

Does his work. But you get down that below there, you, however, did not come to know Christ that way. The way he's talking about it is having all lost sensitivity, giving themselves over to sensuality, so to indulge in every kind of impurity with a continual lust for more. These people are claiming Jesus are ungrateful as they can be. You, however, did not come to know Christ that way.

it always goes right back to Jesus. Surely you heard of him. We're taught in him in accordance with the truth.

That is, in Jesus, you were taught with regard to the formal way of life to put off your old self, and here comes Jesus back, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires. It happens in the minds of the saved. To be made new in the attitude of your mind and to put on the new self, again, created to be like God, all three times in there, if you want to get along, you've got to be...

a bunch and a whole bunch of them in Jesus. Jesus has to be the centerpiece. Check him out, what he's up to, what he's saying, and you'll be all right. Yeah. And I love it, Deb, because he lays out exactly who we're unified in. And then that's where he's going in the rest of this text, the grace that he gives us, because the next verse he says, but to each one of us, grace has been given as Christ apportioned it. Meaning,

He's going to give us the ability and he's also going to give us the surroundings we need for us to be able to maintain that unity. That's why he talks about leadership and gifts and all the things are there. I do want to mention this because we're running out of time because I'm working on a sermon for Sunday. And, you know, I've been in Hebrew. We've been in the book of Hebrews in our Sunday series. And I've told you all before, it's amazing because I've never really linked the Hebrew study with the Ephesian study. But now that I'm preaching in one place,

And we're studying the other. It's amazing to me the parallels that keep coming up because I'm in Hebrews 12 this week, starting in 18, which is that great picture of the kingdom. You know, you have come to Mount Zion, the heavily. I'm in that text. He comes out of that in Hebrews 13. Exactly what we're talking about today. Once you realize the kingdom of God.

He's going to he's going to give them three challenges. One is their humility, pride. As you mentioned that a minute ago, the second one is sex, intimacy, relationship. And the third one, guess what? Money. So he lays out the very three things that we've been talking about that are common to man that derail us from the kingdom and from unity. And then he says, remember your leaders.

Because now we're talking about leadership, which is the gift he gives. So he said, consider the outcome of their way of life. And then listen to what he says in verse eight. Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever. Ultimately, that's who we follow to make all things right. So to me, it's like I was when y'all were talking a minute ago, I was thinking, man, Hebrews 12 and 13 is like reading Ephesians four. It's it's almost the Hebrew writer.

We went at it from a completely different approach, and yet he comes up with the same results. It's almost as if the same person inspired all of the scriptures. Yeah, kind of like that. Well, to me, I mean, I think it's a good question for people to ask on where they, and I'm putting this in air quotes, go to church. I mean, if there's a lack of transparency or accountability from the leadership, if they seem to be more interested in money,

uh you know then jesus if there's an isolation occurring like we're because you think about it we're supposed to be the voice of god in the world we're not we're not supposed to be isolated and and not have an open mind when it comes to studying you know the bible because some of these churches they they won't even let anybody you know study the bible or read a book that's not

part of their name or whatever. What are they scared of? I mean, we're in Jesus. I'm open-minded. I read all kinds of stuff. And some of it I go, well, I don't think any of that's true. I noticed that I was set on the porch on my way to the hoop nets way back to do my work. And Jephthah, they were about 10. And what's the just appointed elder?

Gary Osborne. Gary Glenn Osborne was there with him. They're 10-year-olds. And I watched them, and I kind of oversaw them. I didn't know about their parents and all, but I laid the groundwork out.

They told me the other day, he's one of the elders. Yeah, he goes in this Sunday. You knew Jeff's parents. You didn't know Gary's. Yeah, exactly. But no, Dad, you make a great point. I mean, every leader of God...

Started out as a young person and then had to find Christ and then allow him to rule his life. To know Christ. Exactly. Well, that's the point of this. It says so that we will all grow up. We're all at different maturity levels. And you can't panic because you change your mind on something or somebody's trying to share something with you that you never heard. I mean...

We have this Bible, but it is about a person that we're unified in. And so I do think another thing I wanted to say is if their focus is not on God's judgment instead of God's grace, I mean, God's judgment is real. But God chose to use his grace and love to draw people to him. And that, you know, if you don't believe that, a lot of people, they're like, oh, I don't believe that. Well, read your Bible.

I mean, just in Ephesians, we've done that. God's wrath has come up twice, and people who reject him, they will experience that. But his point is, look at God's love. Look at his grace. Look where we're at in Ephesians 4. What's he talking about? Live a life of love. Jase, you're back in my sermon again. We've all been given God's grace. I mean, we're all flawed human beings. Look at old Jase Wheeler when he go up there. He's back in my sermon because Hebrews 12, he lays out the picture of Mount Sinai

And and fear and and wrath. And then he goes to this beautiful picture of the kingdom. And it's all about worship and an unshakable life. It's the same thing that happened on the Isle of Patmos. Think about when when whenever John saw who Christ was, it wasn't he was scared.

But that was fear of God, followed by the embrace of God and his love. But when you were saying that, Jace, that you were talking about this progressive nature of us growing up in Christ. And I think that, man, that's a key point, because what, man, if I got to get and I can't, you ask a question in a lot of these groups about something that's not even maybe maybe it is a heresy.

Man, what if I'm just out of the world? Man, what if I just got off crack cocaine and I've been a Christian for two weeks? I need time. We need time to learn the truths of who God is. And if we can offer grace in that situation, we should on our theology. I sure hope so. All right. So, you know, we've had a good podcast, in my opinion, is when I hate to stop, but we have to because we're out of time. I'll leave you with another Smith. We mentioned Bill Smith.

He used to always say, in my studied opinion, and then he would tell you something. And I love the way that's framed. In other words, we study, we have opinion, and we try to help each other grow, which is a great thing to end in unity.

We got some guests coming up on the next few podcasts, and we're super excited about that. So we'll see you with our friends in tow on the next Unashamed. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube, and be sure to click that little bell to get notified about new episodes. And for even more content that you won't get anywhere else, subscribe to BlazeTV at blazetv.com slash unashamed.