Tuff Turf (HDTGM Matinee)
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Car antennas, weighted gym socks, old billboards, and axes are all things that hit people in this movie. We saw tough turf, so you know what that means. Now it's time for How Did This Campaign? We're gonna have a good time, celebrate some failure, not just be a hater, cause you know you're one good. How Did This Campaign? Let's all win the mediocrity of subpar.

Hello, people of Earth, and welcome to How Did This Get Made? I am Paul Scheer, and today we are talking about Tough Turf, James Spader, Kim Richards, and Robert Downey before he was a junior. It's a story basically just like Rebel Without a Cause, but different and less dramatic. But a young kid comes to a new town,

starts to flirt with a girl and the gang doesn't like it. I mean, there's more nuance than that, but we'll get into it all with my two co-hosts. Please welcome Jason Manzoukas and June Diane Rayfield. Welcome, both of you.

Wow. Wow. Thank you. Wow. I'm curious. I had not only never seen this movie, I was not, because this is like square. This is, I looked it up, 1985. This is square in the period of my life. You know, I'm 13 years old at that point, where I would have known, I knew all these actors. I knew, why have I never seen or even heard of this movie? Okay, well, this is the first time

that James Spader has top billing. So this is a big movie for James Spader, but I feel like this might have been

the beginning of the wave that we know Spader. Sure. I mean, we'll see Spader and Downey later in Less Than Zero, but, you know, this is, I mean, and to see young Kim Richards, who I also recently saw in an episode of Magnum P.I. Go ahead, June. Well, I was actually, I did not realize it was Kim Richards till, I was so distracted by the length of that hair. Yeah.

So it took me a while to realize that she felt so familiar. And then I, I, it hit me like a ton of bricks. Was anybody else worried that that long hair was going to get caught in the bike wheels when she's riding? I was worried about it. I was worried about it the entire time. It was such a disgusting length. And when you say long, it wasn't like long for the time. It was like Guinness World Book. It was like Crystal Gale long. Yeah. It was like novelty long.

Yes. And crimped. And yeah. So actually longer. So even longer. We saw it with a curl. That was straight. It was so, and you know, something interesting about long hair and women, because it's like it's,

It's seen as attractive, attractive, attractive, attractive. And then it gets too long. And hers was actually like a foot too long. But anyway, all of this is to say, Paul, I'm actually really upset that we didn't do a crossover episode with Casey and Danielle of Bitch Sesh to have some like Real Housewives historians on.

and dramaturgs on the show. I'm mad as well, Paul. I'm with you. We're both mad at you. I was really upset. I'm like, I have to turn on this movie. I blame Cody.

And nobody tells me, nobody alerts me. Nobody says boo about the fact that there's a real housewife starring in it. By the way, I didn't know either. Until mid movie, I also didn't put it together. So it was a sneaker upper. I think maybe just because, like I said, I saw her recently on an episode of Magnum P.I. The minute she showed up, I was like, oh, my God.

And I've never seen her. I don't know Real Housewives. But I was like, that's that same woman who I just saw in Magnum Piazza. It was one of the Real Housewives. And what's so tough in this moment for me is that you don't know Real Housewives. I know. I can't now trade on any of the contemporary knowledge. I know a little bit because this is my...

my one that I like. I like Beverly Hills, but I can't go as deep as June. I can't go as deep as Casey. If we want to maybe try to get them on the phone for the end of the episode to see if they can weigh in. I mean, I'm all for it. It's just so hard because it just feels so...

Should we just should we write to them right now and ask them to immediately start watching the movie and then we'll call them in 45 minutes? I will say because I guess I have to speak on behalf of like the canon, you know, the Bravo canon lore. Like it's so crazy because like it's the great works of literature. Like you need to speak to it. You need to speak to it. It's like I'm not going to not say something.

You know, my silence would be deafening. So what's so wild for those of us who know current Kim is she's so out of her mind. And it's pills. It's I don't know what it is, but it's something. And she is gone girl as a person. And I have such a love for her. She is the movie gone girl as a person? Yes. Yes. To me, I feel like she is.

This character, if she hung out with the leader of the gang for like 30 more years. If she stayed with Nick, is that his name? Well, that's what's so shocking to watch Kim Rich, young Kim Rich. I thought she did a fantastic job. She was great. Wow, she's putting sentences together. She's getting a thought, you know, communicated. She's walking and talking like it was such a...

It was such a shock to see her this way. And I never knew she had hair that long. So there's just a lot that I need to connect on. And I don't, I feel alone here. Not extensions. That was real hair. That was real hair. It's real hair. It's a thousand percent real hair. I do want to just speak to what Jason was saying about knowing all these people at this point, this is a year before pretty and pink comes out again.

in the theater. So, you know, so this kind of walks us back a little bit. I also would argue that James Spader, even though he looks like a man in his mid-20s,

is doing something very different than any other James Spader in the 80s role. He's normally like the coked up dude, the rich dude. And there is an element to that, but he's also kind of like this Batman character. Like I felt like, am I watching like high school version of Drive? That movie, you know, it's like, there's an energy here. I was like, oh, I was waiting for him to like go crazy. Yeah, it had all of the, like you said, Rebel Without a Cause. It had, it was like 10 movies in one.

It's a 1985 movie and it's set in, it's set then. So everybody's got all the, all the styles, all the new wave music, everything is 80s. But it has the structure of like, you know, 50s style gangs who are concerned with turf. Yeah.

Like we didn't nobody talked about like whose turf is this in the 80s? That's like 50s gang speak. That's like West Side Story or Grease. Or again, it's another 80s looking back at 50s style like like high school. Because again, this is a high school gang of toughs. We open up this movie with a scene. First of all, someone needed to tell the DP like, hey, we should put a light.

on some of these nighttime scenes. Because when, when Spader is biking around and there's another time when they're driving around at night, like it is dark. It's like if I took an iPhone photo. Because then, yes, it's too dark there. But then like when they're at the club, like,

where Robert Downey, period, just Downey, is playing with his band in the warehouse. It's bright as day in that warehouse. They light the scenes inside. Great. Or they just shot them during the day. Yeah, but it shouldn't be so bright. Like, I was like, who wants to party in this? I want a nice, dim...

That one dance sequence with Jim Carroll. Jim Carroll. The Jim Carroll band, yeah. Jim Carroll basketball diaries. I'm like, wait, this movie is truly... I wrote down, I think I love this movie. I'm not sure. My only grievance with this movie, quite honestly, is that it's almost two hours long. Yes. Yeah, it's very long. One hour and 52 minutes. And I looked at it, I was like, that has to be a mistake, right? It's gotta be, yeah. Otherwise, though, I, like you...

I was like, I would have loved this in the 80s. I would have loved a high school set drama, contemporary drama, a la those kind of, those old movies, like, you know, gangs and fights and all that. But, and then good music. It's like Marianne Faithful, Jim Carroll. Like there's all these great new wave artists. There's all this great music that's in, I mean, they've also got like

throwback, like Booker T and the MGs, you know? Yeah. Like, there's like, it's a great soundtrack. It's really interesting. Good actors. I was like, but this movie, I've never even, this, I don't know anything about this. But it also, to me, I mean, I enjoyed it and I also have so many questions because it's

The movie opens up in this sequence where you're watching this kid go. Well, I don't even know if it's because it's so fucking dark. And we learn it's James Spader, but bicycling through and it's not even a cool bike. It's just kind of like a normal 10 speed. It doesn't need, you know, and you're like, what's the tone here? What am I seeing? No parking sign. Okay, that doesn't really give me that much. Cocktails. Well, that's just a bar. It doesn't seem like I don't know what kind of city they're trying to let me know that we're in. Like, but it just seems kind of normal. And then you get to this scene.

Where there's an old man, you know, middle aged man, not an old man, middle aged man out on the street waiting for a cab. Young woman comes up to him to ask him for some money, which he immediately thinks is going to go his direction. He asked her for a drink, even though she does look like she is a high school student.

And this is all a ploy to kind of violently rob him. I mean, the way that opening sequence were... I don't know why they needed like eight people. Well, the split. Yeah, why so many? I wrote that too. The split is going to be very unsatisfying. Each of them is walking away with maybe five bucks. You know what I mean? Yeah. Or ten bucks. And what a risk, you know? Too many people to just be mugging one guy. Oh, yeah.

I'm the dude that holds the antenna. Well, I'm the dude who does the lookout. I'm the girl who rules the guy. I hold the knife. No, you know what? The really the extraneous person was the other girl. Yes. Oh, yeah. She's the one who just gave like sort of a thumbs up. But she's the look. But Kim Richards could have easily done that. That was really.

That felt extra. It felt bloated. They had it worked out so much that everybody had a role. And so they all had to like nod and be like, okay, now you go. And I was like, well, they've clearly put work into this, but actually they've overdone it. You don't, you don't, you like once Kim Richards starts talking to the guy, if you're just going to grab him and push him up against the wall, you can do that now.

Too many cooks in the kitchen. Because that guy is not going to put up a fight. You don't need to run game on this man. Because all they did was grab him and throw him into a wall. They didn't need anything more than the one guy to grab him and throw him into the wall. It felt like a... And in doing so, the opening of this movie is this street toughs robbing a guy, etc., etc., etc. But...

So it felt like I almost like the Warriors or something. You know, it felt like... And then hard cut to Spader rides his 10 speed in, foils the robbery, rides off. And next thing you know, it's a high school set montage. And I was like, what is...

Can we just talk about how he comes in? Because again, we're following this person on his bike. It just seems like he's riding around in the middle of the night. It has those feelings of like, I can't sleep, insomnia, whatever. And then he's whistling a jaunty tune. He's like a happy Batman. He is so fluid. He grabs a spray paint can, spray paints all the attackers, unarms them, and he's singing a song.

And then just kind of rides off into the night and the gang is like, oh, who the hell is that? But it's so weird because you're like, oh, this is a story. This is a vigilante story. This is like a... I thought it was going to be a very cool rider. Right. From Grease 2. Grease 2. Yes, we remember it well. Yeah.

Grease 2, which I did buy June the LP. We have the vinyl here in the house. Ooh, that's nice. I will say, though, that I still think it's a high school movie because before that sequence that you talked about, Jason, that high school sequence...

We cut to James Spader in his bed full of roaches. His bedroom is full of roaches. Disgusting. Like on the wall. I was like, ugh. And his room is a mess. And we see him under these covers like Cameron from Ferris Bueller's Day Off. Is he sick? What's going on? Has he gone catatonic? What is happening? And then he all of a sudden moves with these two people.

What we learn are like paintball guns. They seem to be shooting darts. I thought they were dart guns. I thought there was like a little blue splat. So two dart guns that he then perfectly aims at these two cockroaches on an Albert Einstein poster. Bam, bam. And like, oh, shit, this is a revenge movie. He never shows revenge.

That again, like he never shows. Yeah, he's not a sharpshooter. He's not. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Never shows any. Well, he does use them at the very end. Oh, yes. But I think what you're getting at, Paul, is was my point.

Was my concern as well, which is like, I never quite understood what Spader... And I love Spader. I've always loved Spader. I just love him. I never quite understood what his character, Morgan, wanted. Yes, and or what he cared about. What he cared about. Like, I get that he's sort of taken with Frankie, but in that first scene on the bicycle, like, it doesn't seem like he has...

this moral compass and is this sort of crime stopper or anything like that. It just seems like he happened to be there. I think he just likes mixing it up, you know, and it sounds like he's always getting in trouble. Like he, they got, he got in trouble in Connecticut. He got in trouble at boarding school, got kicked out. It seems like he just gets into trouble. Right. You know, and like to not to jump ahead too far, but, but, you know, it later in the movie,

His father is shot.

By the main guy who's bullying him and who's, you know, issuing him savage beatdowns with the locks in the towels. That was like a brutal scene. Anyway. Yeah. But Spader doesn't even react to his father being shot. Well, he doesn't seem to feel. Well, he seems to be like he what we're what we're trying to bond with is this kid used to be super rich and

And now he's poor. And he's, like, mad. His brother's still seemingly rich. Was he mad that he's poor? I mean, he wants to, like, show up the rich. Because I think there's an element to him, like, the rich kicked me out. That's why he wants to break into the country club. Like, I think he wants to be like, I used to play this game. I don't play it anymore.

But he also doesn't feel like he wants to. Yeah. And his brother is still in that world. And he's, well, once again, a little bit to what you both have said so far, like, Spader doesn't, Spader feels great in this movie and is doing a gangbusters performance, but he doesn't seem, I don't believe him. The only thing I don't believe is that he's these people's son. Oh, no. I mean. Okay, well, I have so many questions.

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Ever wonder what happens when two college best friends become finance experts? Well, you know what? Meet Nick and Jack, former Wall Street guys turned podcast hosts who have made business news fascinating and fun since they've been freshman year roommates every morning on The Best One Yet. They serve up the most interesting three stories at the intersection of business, finance, and pop culture.

like how Netflix borrowed a growth hack from Ludacris or how White Lotus, a TV show, boosted tourism by 20%. They even talked about why Apple should launch an AI smart toilet called the iTushy. I know it sounds funny, but when you hear what they're saying, it makes sense. Okay, think of it as your daily download from two finance experts that happen to also be each other's last call before bed. It's

It's sweet. 20 minutes, three stories, two best friends, one must-listen pod. I love this show because it makes me feel smarter. It's like getting hacks in a world that I didn't quite understand, and they make everything very palatable and kind of bite-sized, right? It's one of the most fun business shows you can listen to. Follow The Best One Yet wherever you get your podcasts. The scene where Spader's Morgan's older brother, Brian, is...

Is back. And we've heard before that like Brian is, you know, the favorite son and a son, all the right things. Fine. So with the scene where he's introduced, he's sitting with his mom outside and they're drinking wine. And I thought for sure. Oh, when I first saw them together, this is a date or this is her boyfriend. And the guy we saw earlier was his grandfather. Okay. Like the ages and the sort of, because that guy seemed so old. Right.

Well, when we saw his dad or, oh, I see the brother. Yes. So when I, cause so when we see him with Spader jump on his bike and leave for school, his dad's coming in from being a cab driver at night. And I, and in my mind I was like, okay, I buy this version of it.

I buy Spader as the independent son of a single father who's older and is, they don't really, they're not connected much. That made sense to me. But when they were instead like a family unit that had just been displaced from like Tony, Connecticut, then I was like, oh, wait a minute. Now I don't understand what this is anymore. And what happened in Connecticut? What happened to this business? Well, his dad's business went under at one point. That's all we know is it went under. He didn't seem like his dad did anything wrong. It just went under, I think. But there's a moment-

Okay. There's a moment in the movie where he's like, this isn't Connecticut, mom. Things are different here in Southern California. Like you could almost make...

a very clear connection to like the OC and Connecticut, Laguna Beach and Connecticut. Yeah, but this I think is Reseda. Yeah, this isn't the OC. Oh yeah, because it's like, what does it say on all the signs? Like fuck Tujunga or like fuck Toluca. Oh, does it? I didn't see that. I didn't see that, but this is not the OC. This is not Dana Point. This is...

It doesn't seem that... I mean, I guess it is rough, but it's like... It doesn't seem like this is a whole different world than Connecticut. Well, it definitely is different than, like, Toronto.

Tony kind of country club town. It's not that. You know, they have to drive to whatever, Beverly Hills or wherever they go to go to the country club, you know, which is fun and a funny set piece to give him an opportunity to kind of flex the nonsense of what he used to, the systems he used to live in. I have so many clips from that, by the way. Oh my God, great. I think that that

might have been Robert Downey Jr.'s audition tape for Saturday Night Live because he does shoot this movie and then goes the next year to Saturday Night Live. Like, oh, his character work is great. Oh, is that right? Oh, yeah. Wow. And again, Robert... I'm not making fun of it. Robert Downey is likable and fun and whatever, but it's like...

He definitely does a lot of the comedy heavy lifting in that scene that you feel like they're improvised and he just improvised. Yes. And it and it felt they very much felt, even though they only share a couple of scenes together, he and Spader feel very comfortable with each other. They have great chemistry and they also are both doing really good versions, already pretty great versions of Spader.

like their performance style to come. Yes. This is like a weird prequel to like less than zero. It's like a, it's a low stakes, less than zero. Like you're like, Oh, I liked it. Like somebody clearly saw this movie and was like, Oh, we'll put them all together. I just want to, uh,

I just want to play this one clip because we're talking about the dad and we may not get back to the dad, uh, RIP, uh, of with the dad giving like all these platitudes to him. Like when he talks to him about like what it takes to be a real man, it's like he's saying, and he, well, listen, just, just cut out that self pity and crap. I don't want you to be Brian. I want you to be you. All right. So you screwed up. So what?

I expect you to make mistakes. That's what life's all about, for God's sake. How else are you going to learn who you are and what you believe in? What do I do right now? Right now, you do what you really want to do. Do whatever it is that you know is right, that you believe in, that's all. And feel good about it. Life isn't a problem to be solved. It's a mystery to be lived. So live it. I couldn't quite tell in that scene, it's like...

Is it supposed to be like the dad has nothing to say or the writer is like, these are good platitudes? You know, it's interesting because I was actually thinking about that. I'm like, gosh, if you know, if our children were getting into trouble, like I'm not sure that the first thing I would say is just do what you want to do.

which is essentially what the dad says. Like, do you like what you want to do is great. Don't worry about your older brother. Do you? And it's like, well, I don't know. You know, I think that he is doing him and it's not working out. I think that I felt like even him, like what is, what is him? What is like, I don't know what his goal is. His goal is like, he stopped a crime. The gang is mad. They wreck his bike.

And that's really... And then... And then he likes the girl. And he likes the girl, and then he gets them arrested by stealing a car and then making them steal it from him. Like, he thought that process out. But he really doesn't do... Like, he just kind of agitates the gang. He doesn't do anything with a larger worldview. At one point, the principal's like, and you played those concerts on the roof.

He's in multiple scenes with musicals. I thought for sure. When that principal said that, I thought for sure inside of this movie we were going to get a concert on the roof. By the way. No, we didn't. We did get a concert in the country club. Of course. If I were his dad, I would say, let's get you into music lessons. But by the way. Which because in this movie, every single location has a live band playing, whether it's lunch at a Tony country club.

- Or a warehouse party, every place has a full band. - And he never gets up to play, but yet when he does play, this is not the song that you think of somebody saying, "Oh, you got up on the roof." ♪ I feel the thunder ♪ ♪ I feel the pain ♪ ♪ I know the struggles you keep ♪ ♪ The nights in the rain ♪ ♪ I feel your face ♪ ♪ I hear your eyes ♪

It's Morgan! He's crazy. Well, darling, would you care to dance? Yeah, he sings like this Neil Diamond song. It's like, that doesn't seem like the rock. You're mad that this kid likes Neil Diamond? He doesn't seem to be a tough dude. What's wrong?

What's wrong with this kid? I agree. You said it earlier, but I also wrote it in my notes too, Paul, which is there are elements of this that I was like, I had to look it up. This came out the year before Ferris Bueller's Day Off. And there are real Ferris Bueller moments, like the in the bed thing. And then also this like...

Let's break into the country club, pretend like we belong, and then let's get on stage and perform is kind of like taking over the parade float and kind of making everybody look at you, you know? And I felt like this was that, but that he chooses to sing a ballad, like a piano ballad, and the crowd just completely goes along with it. The Richie Rich country club people. The Richie Riches...

I love so much because, you know, it seems like in the 80s, the only thing you needed to do as either a costume designer or as an actual rich person was just take a sweater and

drape it over your shoulders, and then tie it in a knot right at your chest. By the way, that was my outfit. That was the way that my mom dressed me 90% of the time. Okay. A couple of follow-up questions, though, Paul. Wow. Are there pictures? You had to be old enough. Like, at what age? Because at a certain age, you were...

should have been dressing yourself. Wait, was your mom dressing you like that in high school? Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. When I was a kid, when I was a kid, but I will say that my mom... You wore like a power drape? Yeah.

Oh, yeah. My mom also used to dress my stepdad up like that. Is there a picture available like currently? Yes, I can get you a picture right here. Because that's a wild reality. If you're like a little businessman, a little weekend businessman. It's also like you're a kid. Like, how do you use your arms and play and climb and do all your things? My mom.

We were not of that ilk. We were not of the James Spader Connecticut ilk, but...

we definitely tried to dress that way. I mean, we definitely tried. Oh my God. That is your mom to this day. Rock say, you know, a sweater over a T-shirt or a Oxford white button down. I have no problem with that. I know you don't Jason, but always throws a nice little sweater over it. So this is a little sampling, a little flavor of all of my looks.

Okay, so this is number one. Okay, that's pretty good. I mean, that's, you know, that's like a, you know. Yeah, that's good. That's good. It's not quite country club good, but it's good. Is that a tie though underneath? No, it's just a buttoned at the collar white button shirt to the collar.

Also very patriotic, red, white, and blue. Yes. That's a little, again, like a little turtleneck, white turtleneck. Okay. I only wish you were wearing a little blazer. Whoa, that's great. All right. And then. Oh, listeners, these are really delightful. These are just so amazing. And then. There's you French kissing your mom. There's you Frenching your mom. There you go. Oh.

Oh, my God. Oh, yeah, baby. There it is. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God. It's a tie. It's a tie with a sweater draped over it. So it's not even a casual look because the tie dresses it up. Now, where were you going? I think I was maybe going to school. I'm not positive. Wow. Wow.

Wow. Yeah, there you go. That's me and my audition for Tough Turf. I also love, there's so much in this picture that I'm obsessed with.

The lines in the rug. Yeah. Which I needed to do. I had to essentially vacuum the rug as if I was hoeing a field, like up one side, down the other. Totally. I remember that's like mowing the lawn. It was the same. Yeah, I remember because I used to also do the vacuuming. So, of course, I noticed that. And then the table, this whole picture, this is incredible stuff.

By the way, do you like the empty wine rack that I'm next to? Emptily, exactly. Completely empty wine rack.

and a wall with nothing. Nothing on it. And the outlet cover is a different white than the wall color white. Yeah. Oh, there we go. It's also like the table is pretty far away from both the chair and the outlet. I'm obsessed with this picture. You look so cute. I can't honestly really handle it. The sweater draped over the shoulders is some next level stuff. Yeah. Uh,

You know, here's another, here's another, you know, this is another shot of me, you know, in my little Lacoste. I mean, look, I'm always, I'm a kid who's wearing a tie and a white sweater a lot. I'm wearing a lot. I'll say this too, though. Your mom's blouse, I'm assuming that's your mom. Yes. Your mom's blouse in this picture is really the focus. This is, this is gangbusters. This is ruffles on ruffles on ruffles. On sleeves. And then I think also like a princess sleeve. Yes. Yeah, that's a perfect.

That's a puff sleeve like Anne from Anne of Green Gables would say. Yeah, there's some good shots there. These are great. Yeah, so that is some tough turf looks for sheer. You know, going back to what we were saying about Spader, you know, I couldn't quite get to the bottom of why nobody pressed charges after Spader's father was shot.

By the way, James Spader literally, like, I understand, like, we're not talking about an acting choice. He is truly unmoved by his father being shot by his, like, enemy. I found that scene to be pretty brutal. I mean, this was the weird thing overall about the movie for me. There was, to me, it vacillated between being like, oh, this is like a high school movie, you know, very similar to Grease and, like,

this sort of class struggle and, you know, people from the wrong side of the tracks mixing up with these Richie Riches and all of that. And then there's music and there's these fun elements. And then there's some brutal violence.

That really escalates, really escalates to the point where... Escalates in like a, in a Saturday Night Fever way. Yes, yes, where I'm like, oh my God. With radical violence, you know, like, you know, at one point Nick is going to like kill Kim Richards. You know, like there's really, the stakes are, jump from high school, you're right, high school level stuff, you know, switchblades and fistfights to like...

True family massacres. Yes. Like, yes. Killing people like murder in a way that like, like, I don't understand why Nick is even able to be in the rest of the movie. He should be arrested immediately. He stole a car and he gets out like the next day. Like he basically, you know, and I guess maybe you can get out if you post bail, but it didn't seem like they had a lot of, uh, I don't know what's going on there because Kim Richards dad, I mean, that whole scene was really upsetting. He gets out of jail and then basically he,

They come in to just reveal, like, we're married. Frankie! Get out of here! Now do you see why you have to go? Frankie! I'm coming! Come to my house for dinner tomorrow night. No way! Hey, Frankie! Forget it. Come on! I'm coming! I'll be there. It's for you. Read it. Okay. Now go, Morgan. Go. Get out of here. I'm coming! God. What are you doing in here? Nothing. Can't a girl have any privacy around here?

Yeah, but not when we want to celebrate. Celebrate? That's right. It's not every night I get asked for my baby's hand. You gonna open it? What? Yep. Can you believe this? And you said yes. I'm so happy, sweetheart. I mean, what? Surprise? That was very upsetting. When she said, I'm not going to go to school, I'll just get married. I felt very upset. This movie is dark. There's a lot of dark stuff. It is. And compared to what Jason said earlier...

When a movie opens up with this montage of fun 80s high school where it's like, hey, you know all the groups? The weird walking kids. Oh, the big boombox people. Because they all had heightening of big boomboxes. The break dancers. And it's like, oh, you know, the snap bracelet girls. It's like, we're building on this kind of fun high school and then the next thing is like,

These tough girls talking about dicks and people getting stabbed. Like there are some like there are some turns. Like I said, this movie is like that heightened quick. Like we did. We get out of the fun high school immediately. Well, it really is like, you know, like the these kids are dealing with not just the machinations of high school itself, because you almost never see them in class.

or doing any of that, what you are seeing is them engaging in life or death battles. Like the locker room scene, I mentioned it earlier, where all of the bad guys, the bully guys, load up towels full of combination lockers, or locks rather, and proceed to beat Spader. Yeah.

I was so savage and brutal that I was like, he would not survive this. These would break his skull. Yeah. But James Spader also like, and this is what was upsetting about the movie. Like, yes, I understand at the end, you know, spoiler alert, he, you know, he saves, he doesn't save the day. He just escapes with his life and accidentally kind of kills the other guy. I was waiting for him to go like full Hulk. Like I wanted him to be like, now you've pissed me off.

But like people just whip out guns in this movie. Like guns are out. Like there are a lot of just like, but he never does anything clever or cool. And you, I don't feel like triumphant that he kills this kid. Like you want to just see him beat their asses. But every time he gets like one step ahead, he gets caught and just beat down. It's really like the movie is very bifurcated in that sense, because it is like,

Up tempo, new wave dance. This is a dance scene. We're going to have an R&B band. They're going to dance and be together and then juxtaposed with like savage fight. Like brutal fight that ends up with his dad getting shot. Cut to teenagers having sex.

And you're like, whoa, wait a minute. What is that? I don't know if this is a teen movie or if this is like the Warriors. But then I also thought, and this is where I'm going to also just be very honest and say, I also had a couple of thoughts where I'm like, man, the 80s must have been fun as hell. Because when you look at these people dancing, it's like, you look like you got rich kids, you got punks, you got break dancers. Did you think those scenes were like true representations of the 80s?

That part got it. They nailed that part. You liked that everyone was dancing. Old, young, rich, poor. I just like that it was sort of like dancing brought everybody together. They all like the same kind of music, but

also it was sort of like, hey, you dress like that, you dress like that, because some people are dancing like a court, like they've, like it was almost like 80s line dancing. I don't think that there was that kind of group community dancing in the 80s. They seem to live in a world in which whatever location they arrive at, there's a band playing and everyone's dancing. It doesn't matter what age bracket, it doesn't matter. Like when they are, when they go to the country club, which is full of old people, they're

There's still a band, a new wave band playing Twist and Shout. Yeah. And everybody's up dancing during lunch at like the Beverly Hills Country Club. So was it a weekend? I don't know. But so, oh, God, I was so upset when they're getting when Spader's kind of prepping everybody to go into the country club and giving them like makeshift drinks.

you know, makeovers to get them looking kind of preppy. Yeah. I was so upset to see Kim Richards take that main and like tie it on itself multiple times. Like she took her hair and made a ponytail. Like it was so distressing to me. I still,

I don't know that we spent enough time on that hair. Well, the hair is like... It was another character in the movie. It's its own character. Yeah, truly. It's making choices. The hair is making acting choices. Honestly, it was. By the way, it's a very malignant kind of hairstyle. You wouldn't surprise me if she had a... I'll give her hair this. It is so long that... I mean, usually when someone's hair is that long...

I would say about a foot of it is split ends at the bottom. But it did look pretty healthy. Well, I'm going to say, I'm just going to like open this up for everybody. If you want to imagine how long her hair is, I'm looking at a picture right now. It is obviously from her head.

past her... It's the point of hair that starts at her head. Okay, that's good. Good to know. As someone without a lot of hair, I got to start there. And it goes past her waist. It is like, it is almost down to... Like, I'm looking at it here. I would say if you put your thumb and forefinger, like if you put your thumb on your belt... Wow, what is it?

A thumb on your belt? They would be about that deep. You put your thumb on your belt and then did that? And then dropped your forefinger down. What? And dropped your finger down? Like, yeah, just dropped your finger down. That's how long the hair is. You put your thumb, okay, you put your thumb on your belt, you drop your finger down. That's how long her hair is. Here's the thing, too. The reason why... You know, the classic measurement of thumb in, belt finger down. Yes, go ahead. Little exercise for you here. What is your perfect day?

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At one point, I'm looking at hair and I'm like, if she didn't have bangs and also if she wasn't wearing the hair in a way so that the top also went up, like she has about like two inches going up, would it look as long? Right.

You know, because that's the other piece of it is that, yes, it's really long hair. It's also crimped. But then there's also this other hair around her face that's big. That's a different framing device. Yeah, exactly. It's not like cascading on either side, split in the middle, like parted in the middle or something, framing her face. There are wispy bangs going down. This is a classic 80s. Wispy bangs going down, wispy bangs going up. Of course.

going up. We're looking at a picture still from the movie Behind Paul and both of the women in the picture

Have that, you know, claw of hair going down, claw of hair going up. Which, by the way, I did. I did that in seventh grade. And I was like, this looks fucking great. Like, I've never looked better. By the way, another reason why I like this movie, and I think it was shocking to me, but when we are looking at these women, like, not only do they look good. I mean, these are tough girls, but they're also just eating hamburgers. I haven't seen a girl in a movie, like...

Like, just go to town on hamburgers. And Kim Richards, like, shoves that hamburger in her face. I don't know. That was a crazy scene. Just seeing girls just, like, eating burgers. Like, there's, like, their... I don't know why. Like, it seems so foreign to me. I'm like, I don't see that in movies. I don't see this, like, chowing down. Like, all the way to, like... I loved all of the outfits in this movie. Like, this was... This movie was...

I think one of the best versions of like 80s style that we've watched, you know, like some of the other ones that we've recently done, like Attack of the Rock Aliens or whatever. They really go for it, you know, in a way. And these felt like this was very this felt like me in high school or junior high in high school. This felt like these felt like ordinary 80s clothes. You know, I mean, even though they're I think crazy.

I think they're trying to show that they are less well off, right? Yeah, I think so too. You know, I think that a lot of the 80s stuff that we see, it's like, oh, these are not rich kids, but they are like, they have a little bit more money. I mean, this is supposed to be the poor side of town. Yeah. And I'm not going to lie, at one point early on in the movie, is actually before I realized it was Kim Richards. I thought she had a face tattoo. Yeah.

I thought that the thing on her head before the headband. So close to her face. And it was so thin. Yeah. It was such a thin headband that she's wearing early on. I could see that. Yeah. Well, I wanted to ask you about this, too, like about their wealth, because I think that they are trying to make a statement about class in here as well. Yeah.

But there is like this idea where it's like, are they that poor that Robert Downey Jr. needs to save that loaf of bread that he puts down his pants?

Like, because at one point, Robert Downey Jr. puts a giant baguette down his pants. And then the country club representative, who is very suspicious of them, pulls it out and then places it back down on the buffet table. Back on the buffet. That really got me. But I'm also like, is he stealing it? One of the other girls, not Kim Richards, but the other woman in the gang, is just grabbing fistfuls of, like, baguettes.

buffet material, like shrimp and whatever, and like putting them in her purse. It is very funny. I mean, it's, I think your point though, Paul is like, well, can they not afford food? You know? And I think they're just doing what they can. They're just making do. And I think it's fun to, um,

crash a party and steal a bunch of food. Yeah. I mean, you know, my dad used to do that at cocktail parties. Kim Richards' dad seems to own a convenience store. Her mother has passed away, we find out. Obviously, the rest of the gang members are in and out of jail. They seem to be very badly off. Robert Downey Jr., we see where he lives. And you know, Jason... That's not... Yeah, I wanted to say one thing about Kim Richards and her mom because I always find in a lot of these...

A lot of teen dramas, like you see either a boy loses his mom or girl loses her dad. But it was very nice to see that a that a girl had lost her mom and to establish like that grief, because I don't think it's portrayed often in movies. And.

And she is clearly, I mean, this is the thing about the movie. It's so weird. Cause I was like, Oh, what an interesting choice to give her that. Because to me, it explains so much of her behavior, you know,

smashing the hamburger into her friend's face, being in this like totally toxic relationship, but also wanting like the safety and security of Morgan. And like, it was so, it was such a good choice for her. And it made me really care about her, even though I didn't understand why she was so mad at Morgan's mom for just...

Bringing it up. Yeah. I mean, but also like I could chalk that up to just she's a teen teen histrionic. She's a teenager. But there are moments like that in this movie where you do or at least I found like there there are really interesting, weird choices that are unexpected that I really liked.

And then there's just a lot of stuff that doesn't make sense. Well, that's the, I was going to say, like, I think it's, I think this movie does both. This movie is constantly making wild choices or interesting choices, some of which work and make the movie actually cool.

quite a bit better than I might have thought it would be. And then some of them are just like head scratchers. Like, whoa, why did you take this this far? Now it's very hard to enjoy the more high school level stakes of the movie once I realize people can be shot. You know, like once I realize, because that's not even at the end of the movie. Like they shoot his dad like at the beginning, at the end of Act Two. Well, let me ask you this, though.

The choice on James Spader's part, as soon as he him and Frankie sort of make a connection after the country club to immediately want to take her not on a date, not to a restaurant, not to like get to know her better, but take her home to his parents. Yeah. And sit her down at a family dinner. That's straight up rebel without a cause, by the way. Like that is that is you're right. Like this movie has so many like legit moments.

parallel scenes. So I don't think that there was any reason for it, but in Rebel of the Odd Cause, maybe it makes more sense. Here, it doesn't. No, it doesn't. And it also especially doesn't because he has such an already established antagonistic relationship with those parents. Yes, or at least his mom. So, you know, he never wants to be home, so why is he? You know what I mean? Like, why... But I think you're right. They are just...

This movie is full of references to other things. But it's also like, here's the thing that's so weird. Rebel Without a Cause, there is a class difference. There is no class difference between any of these characters. They all seem to be roughly in the same thing, except for Robert Downey's character, who...

His brother like has Dobermans and runs a repair shop. I mean, when Robert Downey Jr. When Robert Downey Jr. Comes in to save the day with two rogue Dobermans. Like he's like crazy. I'm here to help you. I mean, it was amazing. And releases Dobermans upon the bad guys to like bite their arms. I just wish the Dobermans had been introduced earlier and more effectively because I would have been, I would have been like on my feet.

Like, I was so excited to see them come in, even without having any setup or connection. Oh, yeah. The fact that he arrives and is like, hey, and it's like, here's backup and two dogs. Great. I loved it. But I agree. Like, I would have loved it more if those if that had been established better, if that if there had been a little bit more legwork to that. Also, yeah.

If you're Spader, like, you are fine to get those guys arrested when you can frame them for stealing a car, but you know they're going to be at the warehouse, whatever, o'clock. Why not send the police there to arrest the people who shot your father? Who...

Who attempted to murder your father. Like, I don't, I can't figure that out. By the way, the dad, the dad kicked some serious ass. Oh, I was so proud of the dad. Yeah, the dad was great. Felt like hell. That dad, I have a lot of respect for that dad. I know I made fun of his platitudes and I know I'm going to slam him in just a second. But that guy was studying real estate. But in this moment, yeah. Because here's my issue. This guy, he's what, he's trying to drive a cab or is he trying to read the newspaper? Because when we see him...

He's got the newspaper laid out like he's in New York City, reading it on the hood of the cab in the middle of the night. Like, like, do some work. This is not an Uber world. Like, first of all, don't take the night shifts. Maybe the shift hasn't started yet. I think there is something. Maybe he was waiting for bars to close. You don't want to go out there or, you know, the day shift workers might still be on. Like, you don't want to grab someone else's fare. Yeah.

You also don't want to waste gas, you know, I guess. I mean, idling just to open up that. Then nothing tells me more. I'm unavailable than opening up a newspaper on the hood of the vehicle that you are using to perform your business. I also had a great amount of respect for the dad. I thought, you know what? He was I don't know what happened with that business. I really don't. And but he is trying to make some money. And why does the brother not help more? It says that the brother is doing well.

Yeah, why not? Why doesn't the brother like take some money from his shoulder sweater budget and give it to the folks? By the way, I did like that. I did like the two brothers at each other because it was just a lot of white. It was like, I'll have a yellow shirt on with a white top. I'll have a white top on with a yellow shirt. So many pastels on rich people in the 80s.

And by the way, the principal was a great character that they really set up. And then he never came back to do a goddamn thing. The movie couldn't decide whether it wanted to occur during high school or not. And they kept like really struggling with that in a way that it was a bummer. I really because I mean, for the most part, this high school gang, Nick and the bad guys, they seem to really mostly be concerned with beating up dads.

They beat up and shoot. James Spader said, then in a rage, this guy gives such a good rage filled performance. He goes into Kim Richards' father's corner store and basically body slams the old man and Kim Richards. He basically goes in there and like WWEs the whole place. It's really nuts. Okay. So, so it's,

And this is, again, like, the movie, like, steps over these lines. Because you think, oh, yeah, he's just, he's like a high school bully, you know, gang leader. And then you're like, oh, no, he's a...

Psychopath? Killer. Who is a grown man. Yeah. That's the thing that happens when you cast people who are actually adults to play high school students. When they start doing the violence at the level of adults, you're like, the dissonance between, wait, I thought these were kids. And you're like, oh no, this is a 27-year-old man suplexing an elderly gentleman. And I will say...

He picks Kim Richards up and throws her to the ground. And I was like, hey, what's happening? It was very upsetting. And you know what it was about that movie, too, is like the stunts. I mean, there's one or two bigger stunts, like when the billboard falls on somebody and then when the main bad guy falls off the ledge. But for the most part, it felt to me like the violence was...

Like, it wasn't like a movie violence where it's like, oh, I'm falling off the Sears Tower. It's more like I just fell eight feet, but I fucked up my neck. Like, my collarbone is broken. Like, the damage felt weird. And then the movie ends with, like, you feel dirty. Like, people were hurt. And then cut to... Well, not only were people hurt, Paul. Like, I think I want to know how many casualties there were in that warehouse. Because I know Nick is...

Nick appears to be dead. Robert Downey Jr. got shot in that part of your leg where it's like if you get shot there, you can bleed out. I mean, he's wearing a cast. He definitely was shot in his femoral artery. And you can see he's like, he basically has bled out. And the dog comes up and like seems to bring him like something to tie a tourniquet with. I couldn't figure that out. I was like, is the dog helping? Are these dogs like medical professionals? Those dogs work.

And saved the day, you know. I mean, by the way, that's what I'm mad about this movie. I know. Why can't James Spader save the day? Like, I want him to make the movie. It was more triumphant to have those two Dobermans appear. And I felt like a swelling in my heart when they came in. And I was so excited to see them do their thing. And I didn't feel that at all. But

By the way, I will say, don't you feel that Dobermans are such an 80s scary dog? Like, we don't hear that much about Dobermans being attacking anyone anymore. But like in the 80s, it was like, oh God, they got Dobermans. Dobermans. It was terrifying. Zeus and Apollo on Magnum PI. That's right. The neighbors there across the street from us had a Doberman and they would have him on like this very long chain. Oh God. And from the house. But the chain...

The way it worked, like, if you started to walk down the sidewalk, he would start racing toward you and, like, just stop right before he got you. Oh, God. It was absolutely terrifying. I do want to talk about, like...

some other terrifying things here. And I know we mentioned it before. Could we just go back to Robert Downey Jr. chasing James Spader with the car? We don't know it's Robert Downey Jr., but James Spader is like waiting on a bus stop. He's having like a very like music video moment where he's like grabbing like a stanchion of like a bus sign. He's like,

I'm so conflicted, sitting, moping, but it's like very much like music should be playing under it. Like the music, Voyager, the rock aliens music, which I'm always up for. And by the way, just came out of vinegar syndrome, uh, as a pristine DVD, which I bought. Um,

But then this car, one of the bad guy's cars, spots him and starts chasing him. And James Spader's running and he's throwing shit at it. And the car is bashing him into a corner. And James Spader's about to jump over a barbed wire fence. And he can't get up and he's going to get hurt. And then Robert Downey Jr. pops out. He's like, gotcha. I was like, that's not good, man. Yeah. I will say this. This kind of speaks to what we were talking about earlier in this way. That Spader...

And I'm certain he's young when he made this. You know, he's a you know, he's he's young in the movie. He's playing a high school person. Spader, to me, doesn't appear to ever be a character who has parents or who has a family or who feels tethered to anything. He is like in everything, like an individual only. Right. So much so that in the scene where he and Kim Richards right before they have sex, they

She is talking about all she keeps hearing is the sound of the gun going off and the shooting and the gun and the blah, blah, blah. And she gets to have this whole breakdown where she's reacting to the gun violence that she witnessed and was a part of.

And he never is like, that was my father that was shot. Like he, he, yes, he's not experiencing much more connected to his. She is having a complete emotional arc based on the events that were, uh, that led to and were a part of,

His father's shooting and he is completely not uninterested, but he's really unaffected in a weird way. It's very strange. It's a weird look, but I think that there's a plot. I mean, God knows where it was cut out because the movie is almost two hours. Like there needed to be something else here. Like did this,

the dad do something. Like, it's like, like I could understand that the dad gambled their money away, did something where he lost respect for his parents, but you don't even get that. You don't get anything. The dad just looks like a, like a, a lumpy mess of a guy until he gets, you know, fighting out there. He's like a Harry Dean Stanton. Yes. I want a Harry Dean Stanton. But Paul, you seem to be like so back and forth on the dad. Like one minute you're proud of him. And then the next. I know, I know. I'm very conflicted about this dad because I do feel like

I guess what I'm saying is the dad looks beaten down and I'm like, God, and he can't even get the love of his son. It would only make sense if the dad brought it upon himself, I guess. And that's what I'm trying to... I'm feeling I'm missing one part of it. No, the son... What's crazy is Spader feels no guilt. Right. The scene where Kim Richards is like, she feels guilt for being part of this shooting. He...

feels nothing even though it's his relationship with Kim and his continuous antagonizing of the gang that has caused the gang to get revenge on him. You know what I mean? He is...

His father was assaulted and shot because of Spader's actions. You know, I mean, not Spader didn't know that they would take it this far. But he keeps on antagonizing them. He never stops. And there's no reason for it. Like, there's just no reason for antagonizing them because they wrecked his bike.

Oh, I think, yes, but I think he starts antagonizing them just because I think he sees them trying to rob that guy. And I think he knows they are in that moment bullies or a gang or whatever. Right, but they're just upset with him now because he is going after Frankie. Yeah.

Well, no, but it's kind of a threefold thing, right? Because it's like it starts off where he foils their robbery. Then the next day they destroy his bike. Where they were each going to make roughly $3. Right. So they foil the $3 robbery. Then they get his bike and destroy it.

So now he's mad. So then he steals a car and concocts a pretty elaborate scenario where then he gets them to take his car as a collateral. And then I didn't think I thought he came up with that kind of in the moment. No, when he saw the car on the side of the road, he's like, got it.

And he went in there to dance with Kim to get them that mad so they would steal the car. Wow, that's a long journey. So then they get arrested. And then the next morning he finds a dead rat in his locker. And he's like, huh. Oh, maybe it's a squirrel. Dead something. It was pretty. And that was also very. That was another moment of like the violence is too much for what the movie is. Yeah.

And then I think the next moment is the guy gets out of jail, sees him with his girl. And now he's like, now we're going to go beat him up in the gym. And I just want to call one thing about that gym. And I as someone who's been to many a gym and seen lockers, I really appreciated that the lockers there were drawers.

I thought drawers is such a better way to do a locker. Interesting. Instead of a long locker. I like the drawer idea. Yeah, I thought that was an interesting way of doing things. Anyway. I think you need a long locker so that you can hang a towel inside. Well, why do you need to hang a towel? Why do you need to hang a towel?

I mean, this is in high school. In high school, you needed to have a towel in your locker so that you could when you had to take a shower. Wait, wait. But you first of all, you took a shower in high school. Like, I mean, like you were you had to. Oh, I never did. They made you after gym class. They made you take a shower. We went back. Dirty, dirty.

Yeah. We did too. Our showers never really worked. But I was like, I would never have stepped into the showers there. No, no, no, no, no. Wait, but so you keep a towel in your locker and then like next week when you go back to gym, it's like that towel has dried out. That towel is dry. Okay. Yeah. Oh, you don't throw it into a general wash. Wow.

And it's a towel you bring from home. Yeah, but then you're putting a wet towel back into a tiny area. Like that can't be great either. No, no, no, no. I'm sure it's bad. It's very bad. But here's my thing. Because I've thought about this before. When I go to a spa, the robe is always hanging up. But then I have to take it. You're wearing it.

Well, yeah, I put the robe on, but I take off my clothes and put them in the locker. But I always end up just folding them and trying to put them down. There's nothing to hang is what I'm saying. And so it seems like I've had that thought before. A drawer would make sense. I like a drawer. I mean, I never even thought of a drawer, but I'm kind of like, yeah, because it's so much extra space. Now, I just stayed at a hotel in Williamsburg and...

A very deep closet. No drawers. Not a single one. I hate that. Oh, I'm going to make a controversial statement. I never use drawers. What? When I go to a hotel, if I unpack, I unpack onto like a shelf or I want to be able to see what I have. But aren't you afraid of like the housekeeping coming in and looking at your undies? No. No.

You should be because I went You think they're looking at my undies? Yes. Me undies? I went on a carnival cruise when I was in high school and in the middle of dinner I went back to the room to grab something and I walked in

And there was a gentleman holding my underwear. What? What? Yes. Wait, I don't know if I've heard this story. Yep. What are you talking? And what transpired? I closed the door and I walked out. Oh, wow. And did you tell your parents or did you do anything? No, never spoke about it. Wow. Wow. Did you ever see that gentleman again?

I don't think so. Okay. But I was so shaken. Did you ever see that underwear again? No, I remember I was like, cause I remember what it looked like. And I,

I don't know what I did with it. I must, I think I like put it in my suitcase or something, but I also like, I did have to wear the rest of my underwear and couldn't explain to my parents. Like I know someone cause I was too, I of course was embarrassed and didn't want to tell my parents that someone was holding my underwear. I mean, that is crazy. That's why Paul brings up a good point. Like to have them out and about, you are kind of asking for it, Jason. Yeah.

I guess I'm asking for somebody to just peep through my trunks. Why don't you want to put them in drawers? I'm so confounded. I think the drawers are dirty.

Oh. I think people are putting dirty clothes in those drawers and nobody ever washes the drawers. Well, of course they're not going to wash the drawer, but yeah, I hear what you're saying. I think people use like hotel drawers as hampers and they put their dirty clothes in them. I do. So I don't want to put my clean. Yeah, one of them. So I don't know which one you were using as a hamper.

And I'll never tell. So it's like it's the same as like the seat, the pocket in the seat on the airplane in front of you, the back pocket where you put people. You know, I can't I don't know. Somebody probably just had a dirty diaper in there. Now I'm like, I'm going to put my phone and my book in there and then like, like that's the dirtiest place in the world. Like it's a dark drawer that's full of potentially bacteria that I'm like not going to throw my clean clothes in. Yeah. Now I'm so upset about it.

I can't take that on. I'll bring a Lysol wipe and I got to put stuff in the drawers. I'm sorry. I also will frequently just live out of my suitcase. See, that is unsettling. Sometimes I do, but often I like to... I know, I understand. The minute I get into a room, I like to fully unpack so I can feel like I am...

in the next... I'm in the zone now. Like, I'm in this place. But I hear what you're saying. I don't get what you're saying. Now that we're going on tour, Paul, do you think you'll unpack in every city? No, definitely not because that's too short. We're going... I mean, we're popping... I mean, this tour is intense. Yeah, this is like... I barely want to move...

anything. I almost want to pick an outfit for the live show that I get into right before the live show and get out of after the live show and just recycle that. And get ready because it's going to be, how we ended up with this, I do not know. In the middle of August, we are going to Texas and Louisiana? Yeah.

It's going to be 100 degrees with 200% humidity. It's going to be disgusting. I remember being in Louisiana, shooting a movie down there, and it was like May 2nd. They're like, ooh, you better get out because by the time it gets to the 5th, it's oppressive. And I was like...

And it was, it was awful. And I think that, yeah, I think the locals all leave. I think everyone leaves. Yeah. And we're like, we're coming to your town. We're coming. NOLA, welcome us with open arms. Uh, that's why we need some of that Detroit energy, Indianapolis energy. Uh, I,

And by the way, I know that we've announced at the top of the show, but we do have a live virtual show coming up. So if you can't make the tour, that is at the momenthouse.com slash HDTGM. If you can't remember that, just go to HDTGM.com and we'll announce the movie and it'll be a live show. So everyone in London and stuff. I know we were talking a lot about this movie. I want to bring up something from last week's movie. I'll bring that up at the end. But I think it might now be time for Second Opinions. What's up, jerks? I'm in this company.

All right. So thank you for that amazing second opinion theme. Here's the deal, people. Tough turf.

has 78% of five-star reviews. I mean, that's a pretty high volume. And I have to say... I'm not surprised, yeah. I'm not surprised. Only 4% are one-star. And...

There are a lot of Marvel Avenger fans here because of the Easter egg in this movie, which is there's graffiti on one of the walls that says the new Avengers and Robert Downey Jr. stands in front of it. And people think that's odd. And obviously James Spader played Ultron. So this is a this is a prequel to Avengers. Here we are.

Isn't that interesting? Those two guys have been working together in some capacity, even if it is... That's so amazing and it's cool. By the way, this is where they became friends. And then Robert Downey Jr. named his cat Jimmy in honor of James Spader. Oh, wow. By the way, I will say that there are moments like... Again...

Fan of James Spader. Like James Spader. But as a 25-year-old man, which is what he is in this movie, there are moments where if I close my eyes, I'm like, this is blacklist James Spader. Like, this is... He delivers some lines just like now James Spader. Would you guys be surprised to find out that the blacklist is still on? Oh, I know. Because our good friend Conor Ratliff has been on it. He came on our Twitch show, the one that Hubel and I do. Yeah.

And he told us this, Connor had to have like a parakeet like in a scene and the way he described, and you could check it out. It's online. We have it up. The way he describes like the acting style of James Spader. It's like,

seen it all, been there. And the idea was that the parakeet was supposed to go up his arm and land on his big bald head. And he was like, okay, clearly this is not working. What we're going to do is I'm going to place the bird here. We're going to do one take of it, and then we are going to move on. And it was just very like... I'm not surprised by that at all. Giving the right stuff, but we're not wasting time. Yeah. Let's not fuck around. And he basically...

Has The Blacklist been on for 15 years? I mean, how long? I think it's been on for something close to that. Yeah, I'm going to Google it right now. It's like Grey's Anatomy, which also is still on the air at season 19. Well, I mean, that show Supernatural has been on forever as well. Is it still on? I think that's finally done. But that was on for, and you look at the, oh my God, that was on for over a decade. So The Blacklist started in 2013.

And it is still on the air. Oh, OK. OK, so it's about 10 years. But that's 10 years, a decade, a decade of The Blacklist. I can't believe that. After he was already on Boston Legal for however long that was on. By the way, it's my understanding of The Blacklist that it was about this woman who

And they had to bring in a Hannibal Lecter type of character, Red Reddington. That's James Spader. And James Spader was like the Lecter. His name is Red Reddington? Oh, yes. What a name. This is my favorite thing. What a name. Red Reddington. Red Reddington. So they bring in Red Reddington to help them solve these bigger crimes because he's like this Hannibal Lecter genius.

And then at a certain point, they're like, yeah, we don't care about that girl anymore. Now the show is straight up. James Spader is solving crimes like he's like he used to be like we visit him in the jail and he talks to them. Now he's like out and about running a whole team like the show completely reconfigured around Red Reddington. Like it is wild that Reddington. Wow. That's like that's a that's a first draft name.

Yeah. And by the way, for their COVID episode, they just did an animated one. Whoa, really? Yeah. Because we have all... I love it. Yeah. They've done some interesting stuff. Like Connor, again, walked me through all the Blacklist. There's an episode of Dead Eyes, Connor's podcast, all about all of the times he's auditioned for the Blacklist.

for all the different parts. He talks about all the different parts he's auditioned for and didn't get, and then talks to all the actors who did get those parts on the blacklist. So it's a great, the series is incredible. And by the way, just so you know, if you can't get enough of the nine seasons of the blacklist, you can check out their novels. There are blacklist novels. Wait, is the blacklist based on the novels? No, went the other way. Whoa.

So now you can follow Red Reddington's adventures in print? Yes. Oh, boy. Wow. I know what the rest of my summer is going to be. I'll know what I'll be reading on tour. Blacklist, The Beekeeper, number 59, The Ring, number 60. I think that he's trying to take down the Blacklist. I don't know. But anyway, these are five-star reviews, and they're not great. I'm going to just be honest. The five-star reviews here are just very positive. This one is from Frank Tiregod.com.

Frank Tire God, maybe this is Robert Downey's brother who works on cars. Uh, Frank Tire God says early James Spader and Robert Downey. I am old. I remember when this movie was a coming attraction and I actually saw it in a theater five stars. Uh, so not really anything about the acting, just the fact that he remembered it gives himself five stars in a weird way. Um,

This one from Helen Damnation. She writes, James Spader and Robert Downey Jr. are deliciously hot. And at age 13, I thought Kim Richards must have been the most woman in the world. I think probably most beautiful woman in the world. I wish I knew why this one wasn't as popular as the other 80s films, but I enjoy introducing it to people. Five stars. We walk the night.

Great music drops in this. Like there is so many good songs that are never the soundtrack that I'd either never heard or was like, what is this? And then this one I really like from Mike H. Great film. And I still watch it from time to time. I'm in my mid to late 40s. Hate to say it.

But it reminds me a lot of my own high school upbringing. Five stars. True words. True words. I felt the same. And then this one, which I just like because why not? From Scott Spinach.

The Turf is Tough. Yeah. Any relation to Red Rennington? Oh, I don't know. Maybe. You know Scotty Spins. This one is maybe just one visually that I like because this is the Turf is Tough, T-O-U-G-H. I'm sorry. I mean, tough, T-U-F-F.

That's the whole five stars. But anyway, name tough turf. I mean, it's great. I had to like search for it on Amazon. This, by the way, I woke up Jason, just so you know, at four 50 in the morning to watch this. What are you talking about? I had to fly back from New York yesterday. And I was like, Paul was watching it last night. And I was on a different time. I was like, I can't stay awake last night. I'm just going to wake up early.

So it was really wild to like get up and like get coffee and sit and like drink water because I'm so dehydrated and watch this movie. But I was searching- For like two hours. For two hours. It was so long. My children woke up and I was like, you can't watch this with me. Like go on your iPads. But I had to at like 4.50 search for tough turf and,

And I knew it in my head, but I couldn't find my phone or anything to look at how that was spelled. Yeah. And it's such a wild name to search for because it's not exactly what you think. Yeah, it's a little it's it's it's it's felt a little bit different. By the way, I'm finding more blacklist facts as we're talking here. There are 10 issues of a comic series of the blacklist.

It has produced novels, comics, TV shows. I bet you there has to be a Blacklist podcast. I'm sure there is. I'm surprised there hasn't been a Blacklist spinoff. Or maybe they've tried and it just didn't work. I don't know. Oh, there's so many Blacklist podcasts.

Believe in the Blacklist. The Blacklist podcast. The Blacklist. I guess I meant like a sanctioned. No, no. There are sanctions. These are fan ones. And it looks like there is one official one. But they all are pictures of Red Reddington. And they are all... These are not... This is... This is it. And the Black...

So many people. The Blacklist Exposed is the 2017 Academy of Podcasters award-winning TV and film podcast that looks at the world of Red Reddington and all of his criminal enterprises.

Wow. Oh, my God. And then this one, there's enough. That's the blacklist exposed. Watching Paul read and discover this information, listeners, I only wish you could see the unadulterated joy in Paul's face. I just love when there's something like this that is like, you know what it is? Whenever there's a real nerdy culture around something that is...

more mainstream. I love it. I'm like, Oh wow. Do you have like, you don't get this for Chicago fire. No offense to Chicago fire. You know, it's like even law and order can't pull this off. Yes. The deep it's, it is really interesting to think about. And I'd love to hear from our audience. Um,

How many of you are blacklist watchers, right? How many people, how many millions and millions of people must to have kept it on the air on network TV for this long? It must be massively popular. So to think that I today, what, June 30th, 2022, heard the name Red Reddington for the first time.

For other people, they've spent a decade in the trenches with Red Reddington. Just in the trenches. They grew up with him. They listened to the podcast. They grew up. Yeah. They were like, I started watching Red Reddington in high school and now I have a child. I'm in my 20s. You know, like their lives. Like, well, you know, it's shocking. We've been doing How Did This Get Made longer than this.

The Blacklist. Just barely. Just barely. By the way, The Blacklist is getting about 3 million viewers an episode, which in this day and age is pretty high. For a show that long in the tooth, it's incredibly high. This is what I always think about. And I'm looking at all these lists of TV shows that have been on for a very long time, and they're tremendous. And, you know, and I think about, like, John Francis Daly, great funny guy, great writer, who was on that David Boreanaz show. Wow.

Bones? Bones. And he was the jargon guy. He was the funny lab guy, like him and Carla Gallo. Oh, God. Like really fun people. But I'm just thinking about this idea when you're on a show like Star Trek.

And you're that character. And you've got to put on the six hours of makeup. Oh, well, that is a different thing. And then you're still doing an hour long. Just to say, like, the warp drive is down. Yes. There's no easy in, easy out. It's like I'm putting on...

Klingon makeup and I'm going, I mean, that was the premise of our human giant sketch where my character was like wharf on a show. And I was so upset about it that I got myself, I got surgically implanted into my, my skin and then the show gets canceled. And then I have to try to find work as an actor with like this fucked up unpainted Klingon face. But, oh, so this is what I want to talk to you about. So we got a great call in the last episode of last books.

Of what? I saw... In last... This is... Keep this in. Yeah. Keep this in. What? That's the episode that... Last Looks. That's what we call it. Oh, Last Looks. Okay, I've heard of that. Last Looks is what the mini episodes are now. Okay, yeah. Got it. So we got a phone call here and this person brought up something that I...

Did not know. Okay. Let's play that. Hi, Paul. This is Lauren from San Francisco. I have an admission for Until We Meet Again. I was hoping you guys would mention the last shot of the movie where Eddie shows up in the audience of Lisa's concerto performance. It's the last half second of the movie. He's shrouded in darkness, but he purposefully turns his head just enough before the movie fades to black so you can tell it's him. And then she turns to look at him with a surprised look on her face.

What was the movie trying to do here? Is this meant to tell us that he's back after all and they get a happy ending? Does this concert take place in the afterlife? Was she in here long since dead? It's so perplexing to me. I absolutely have to know what you think of it. Thank you so much and until we meet again. I don't remember. I don't remember until we meet again. The piano movie? Did you look?

Well, I wrote it down and I was too nervous to say it because I was like, oh, now you're just going to notice it because the camera does linger on a face in the audience. And I was like, wait a second. So this movie says that he did figure out a way to get back from the dead. Like he is corporealized. Or he was just as a ghost able to go and watch her perform. What?

What do you think? Oh, well, I mean, I thought the idea was that he couldn't go hang around it. I don't know. Yeah, that's I agree. Anyway, for all of us to kind of miss it and not to be a big part of it. Maybe I could have been directed a little bit better, but it is in there. I didn't notice that. First of all, I'm so confused. I thought we were talking about the piano locksmith movie with John Cusack. Oh, yeah. No. OK. The piano. Until we meet again. The ghost movie. Yes.

Yes. So Molly says that he went to the afterlife but can come down to watch her play. But he is corporeal. Like he is taking up a seat. Did he buy a seat? I mean, it looks like he bought a seat.

It would be funny. It would have been better if he had been sitting on someone's lap. Yes. You know, who didn't realize he was there. And a lot of people bring it up to me, have brought it up to me. And I will acknowledge it that, yes, I worked with Jackson Rathbone. He was great. He was in an NTSF episode. He was really fantastic. And and also Spice is real.

Spice is real as a synthetic marijuana that caused a lot of problems for a lot of people. Oh, that's right. So just a couple of things. I think somebody said that last week or last time when we were recording. Someone said it in the chat. So there's a lot of good last looks teases there. Anyway...

Wow. We got tough trip out of the way. Just to bring it back to this movie for a brief second. It really is like we talked about like how this movie really vacillates jarringly between high school style kind of hijinks and ruthless violence. No more a better example than the final scene in the warehouse where Spader fights Nick, seems to kill him. And then it's hard cut to toe-tapping Spader

to toe tap an R&B band. Look at you. Yeah. And we cut back to live band dance sequence. Well, by the way, the original end was them all taking the SATs and Kim Richards going, I'm not smart enough. And then they kind of fade out on that, which is darker. That was the original. And so I think they just cut this music number where they all seem like, like Robert Downey Jr. seems to not have seen James Spader

Like, oh, we murdered that guy. This is the first time we're getting together at the live band. Yeah, I was like, I don't understand how you cut to this, this like red dress. We're all dressed up, getting ready to have a dance again. Like, aren't they...

Mustn't they be haunted by what they've seen and done? Or by the police. Anyway, I will say this. Tough Turf came out in 1985. It has a 17% of rotten tomatoes, but a 60% audience score, which is higher. The logline is where enemies are made, reputations are earned, and love is the most risky affair of all time.

Now, check it out. The budget was 1.5. Domestic gross was 9.3. The top three movies of 85, Back to the Future, Beverly Hills Cop, and Rambo First Blood. Now, this movie came in 104th place, but it was beaten by all these other How Did This Get Made movies, A View to a Kill, Ladyhawk, Life Force. And this movie beat Breaking 2.

Jim Cotta, and that Tom Selleck movie Runaway. So it wasn't, it was successful. It did something. I mean, it was successful, certainly. A budget at one point, whatever, and then it made nine. I mean, and I bet it made money on video. Yeah. You know? So tough turf. I can't believe I never saw this. Tough turf. I know. Somebody was really up my butt online about doing this movie, and I'm glad that we did. I mean, I would recommend it. Would you both recommend it? Uh,

I would. It is too long. It is too long. Absolutely. But I'm trying to think of what I would tell somebody to fast forward. If you took out all the musical numbers, it's an hour and 30 for sure. That's a good point. Because there's not a lot of plot. It's not boring. But you do sit through the musical numbers. There's full songs. Jim Carroll does three songs, I feel like. They play four.

If you fast forward when you see a live band, if you don't want, that's a safe place. But the music is good, though, too. I was just going to say, the music is good, so I don't necessarily think you need to do this. But that is areas you could fast forward because if they start playing a song, guess what? They're going to play the full song. And I will say that the songs are shot cool. Like, they intercut them really interesting. Yeah. And by the way, you can get the whole Tough Turf soundtrack for only like 14 bucks on Amazon. Yeah.

Like this movie looks good. Like, again, it doesn't seem it's not like it's Tammy and the T-Rex. No, no, it was done well. Or that Ed Burns dinosaur movie we just saw. Oh, my God. Yeah. You know, like this movie feels akin to those 80s teen movies in a in a way that I was into. You know, it just is too too long.

Obviously, we're going on tour. Go to HDTGM.com to find out where we'll be. But it'll be in August. We're in the hottest cities. We're coming up the Midwest. Tell your friends about it. Bring them all out. If you can't make it out to the tour, come check us out live virtually. All these shows are one of a kind. A brand new movie every single show. We cut stuff out.

It is an experience. We're not just getting on stage and talking into microphones. I mean, we are, but we also are doing other things that give you a very unique experience. Come out to the tour, please. You know, get out there. If I'm going to get on an airplane, you guys got to get in the seats. Come on. Yeah. That's, I mean, Jason, when I heard Jason on the Howard Stern wrap-up show this week, when you said, I'm about a year behind everyone, I was like, people don't even understand what this means that you are going out on the road. Like, support Jason here. So stupid.

All right, people, I want to give a big shout out and a thank you to our producers, Cody Fisher and Molly Reynolds, our engineer and maestro, Jack of all trades, Devin Bryant, our producer sitting in this week, Matt Apodaca, our publisher, Delilah Diaz. Of course, our producer, Avril Halle, who found this movie, gave it to us, cut these clips. Avril has been working hard.

overtime at finding all these movies for all these shows that we're trying to do and we can't be thankful enough. Nate Kiley coming in hot, giving us all the research at the last minute's notice. I love this team that we have and I also want to give a big thanks to the ghost of Craig T. Nelson on Instagram. He does all of our amazing art as well as Kyle Waldron. You can find all of our episodes ad-free on Stitcher Premium, but if you are a fan of the show, please follow us on Apple Podcasts. Check out our cheap public store and

Most importantly, keep on telling your friends. So we will see you next time. Bye for now.

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