Twins!
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Welcome back to ID Part 2. It's one of your celebrity mentors, Kelly Ben-Simon on this podcast. You've been with me on the journey from talking about calling off my engagement last year to manifesting my future husband to going on set update. It's been so much fun so far and really, really healing. I am so excited today because I've mentioned this person several times on the show, but

And I think having him on the podcast is going to help you get to know me a little bit better. So I am bringing in my twin brother. His name is Tom Kaloran, but he's known to me as Tommy. Hi, Tommy. Hi, Tommy.

Hi, Kelly. Happy birthday. Happy birthday, Tommy. I love you. Happy birthday. We made it another year. Thank you for my present. You're the worst person to buy presents for because you're like Jim shorts. I'm like, Jim shorts. Who wants Jim shorts? Ask for Jim shorts, but you know, um,

40 again, Kelly. Holy sticky baby. 40 again. Tommy, let's get into this because we're on our deep part too. And actually, I've been, I told you about this, how much fun I've been having talking about love and kind of, you know, unpacking everything that happened last year. But I want you to tell the listeners what it was like growing up with us. Kelly, you're...

You are one of the most unique people in the country. Like you, you, when the, you've topped the funnel at the top of people that come down into the bottom of greatness, you know, you're one of those people. I mean, you've, you've funneled your way to the top and you're just, you've got all these unbelievable talents. You're so well-spoken and you're a hard worker and you're,

you're a fighter and all those things are amazing. So, I mean, you have so much talent growing up. I think all three of us are like that. And I think it has a lot to do with things that we had to do. You know, dad was a lawyer, had a busy law practice, but we still all mowed the lawn every week. You know how to operate a lawnmower. I'm telling America, I'm telling the world on this podcast, you can operate a push mower every,

Because mom and dad made you do it. I think it's made us all better people that we mowed the lawn, that we, you know, did, you know, when a car battery died, we didn't call the gas station. We jumped the damn battery with jumper cables. Do you remember that? Yeah.

You, me, Tracy, our older sister, Tracy, the three of us, we did. But I always got, I always, when we, when I mowed the lawn, you got to be on the tractor, you and Tracy, but I always did the hand, handheld because mom wanted it to be perfect in the backyard.

We actually never used that tractor because it was never worked. But it was a mindset that they were workers, first generation college. They had, you know, this is, they didn't, there was nowhere to go back to ask for a loan or to get money or to help out. It was them. Yeah. And so, you know, it's just thinking about you, you're just, you just embody all those values.

that mom and dad work so hard and you just watch them work and you just kept doing it. And I'm proud of you. I love you so much. But, you know, now we got to find you a mate. Let's work on that. What was it like? First, before we get family and mate, what was it like being my twin? I mean, it was amazing. It was amazing because Kelly, you know, when you when we were growing up, you

Your talent was just so apparent and your desire to be successful was so apparent. And, you know, it was just sort of breathtaking. Your rise into the modeling world was sort of meteoric. I mean, when you, you know, mom and dad. So coming from a family with a lawyer, dad had enough money to pay for you to get good pictures. Do you remember when you took my photos in the backyard?

For Teen Magazine? Remember you took those photos of me? I don't remember doing it. You took a picture of me one time. I did. I took a picture. Those professional photos got into the magazines and you got picked. And I remember being in the audience at some of the contests and you would see the other young ladies coming through and you were just...

you know, clearly the class of all those groups and you just would get picked and win contests and go to the next and get a contract. You know, what was interesting too is like when people talk about being twins and, you know, people ask me about being a twin all the time. And, you know, it's like we were siblings. I mean, we are, yes, born the same day, but we were siblings. And, you know, it was fascinating because like having you with me, I was always, I felt so confident. Like,

Like I was like, Tommy's there. Tommy's there. Oh, Tommy's there. Tommy's right there. Like I never felt like I was by myself or I never felt like, you know, I have any reason to be intimidated because, you know, we were in a lot of the same classes. We weren't in all the same classes, but we were in, you know, in a lot of the same classes. People ask me all the time. They're like, do you guys have telepathy? Do you think we have telepathy? It's just as stupid as a question on the planet.

No, we don't have telepathy. I mean, Scott, no. This isn't... We're not like Siamese twins that were separated at birth, you know.

and share the same organs. No, we're born on the same day, but we're brother and sister, Billy. Right, exactly. And it's like, I mean, you know, they talk about like nature and nurture and we were, you know, we had the same nature and we were also nurtured in the same environment. Yes, we can, you know, fix anything, clean anything. You ask us to do anything, we can do anything. If your listeners are looking for that magic win thing,

You know, you have to debunk it right now because, I mean, there are some things that have more in common with your sister Tracy than I do with you. Tracy and I might be better at telepathy at some things than you and I are. Yeah, but the two of you are lawyers. I'm not a lawyer. You're not? No. Shocker.

Okay, when I get married to my ex, I'm having the best time. So happy to see you, Dom. I love you so much. When I got married to my now ex-husband, what did you think about that? Did you ever think we would get divorced? Be honest. I mean, we were too young to really think about it.

like that you would get divorced but i mean we were all worried i mean i think i was worried it's just mom dad and tracy and others were worried that you know there was such an age gap between the two of you and that was just something that just worried us like is that gonna will that be successful and you know will will that continue to you know go forward and i think you guys i think the two of you had some good years together but i just you know he

He just proved to be, you know, I think there was some, I think he loved you. I think you loved him back, but it just proved to be that he wasn't going to go all in and commit to being like,

uh that he was gonna he would just lay down in front of a moving train for you or walk through a bed of broken glass for you and i don't know if i don't think it has anything to do with you that you are great i just think that that's a little bit of who he is you know he's been with many women before and he's been with

many sins. I think too, it's hard. I mean, it must be hard for a lot of guys. I mean, obviously we don't come from divorce, so that's something as well. But I think it's really hard for a lot of men to fill, to, to, to fill shoes in a better way than you and dad, because, you know, here I have this amazing twin brother, Tommy, and then I have my incredible father. So I've, I've been around such stellar humans that I,

you know, I don't like, it's not that, you know, I want a relationship and, you know, I've talked about this before. Like I would like a relationship where I, I, there's my partner, there is my best friend that we can do all these things together. And I think that, you know, it's hard to, because like, I have such high expectations because I was around great people. Yeah. But there are great people that you can be with, you know, I mean,

And we all are imperfect and we make mistakes. So, you know, I mean, and maybe your next, your second marriage that you had, I know you never got formally married. Let's call it last. Let's call it last. Second sounds like there's going to be a third. I don't know. But I mean, you were with him for a long time. I don't know how long it's going to be. And you were with him for 10 or 12 years. I mean, that was a very lasting relationship, but it was just the most disappointing relationship

I guess too, like, because like you and your wife Mimi, you guys are so close and you're such a beautiful relationship. And I like, and I've told Mimi this before many times. I've said like, that's something that I love.

want for myself as well. Like, I want that great relationship. And, you know, it's like Mimi understands you, you know, she and, you know, maybe also really understands me. And so like, that's the thing, too, is that, again, it's like the expectations are just like, hard. I don't think you're right. I mean, I can be inconsiderate.

Bibi's the best of the best. She's great. I love her. But I just wonder if you have this storybook view of how everyone's relationships are. I mean, she's amazing. I wouldn't trade a minute of my life or my time with her ever for anything on the planet. But I mean, there are days when she would just like to close the door and maybe never see me or at least not see me for another couple minutes or days. And so, I mean...

You know, relationships are imperfect and hard. It requires work and it requires saying you're sorry. It's so freaking hard. The older you get, it gets harder to do. But that's the critical thing. It's just like, can I just admit that I was a dumbass and I was sorry? Yeah, that's hard. So I don't know. I'm not sure I agree with you that there's this big storybook between the two of us. I think there's many great marriages. I just see you guys as such a...

As just like, you know, it's like they always talk about that missing piece, which I think is very beautiful, but I don't think of it like that. I just think that you guys are so beautifully compatible and I love that. But, you know, as interesting as that, when I when I was thinking about getting divorced before I even got divorced and I.

you know, spoke to mom about it and she was like not happy. And, you know, you and Mimi were so supportive of my decision and not, you were supportive of divorce, but you were supportive of my happiness. And I think that's something that's

also very unusual too to have that kind of very strong family bond because most people like are jumping from their family and all I want to do is be with my family. So I think that, I think that, you know, at first I was so, I was ashamed because I was the first one to get married and I was ashamed that I couldn't

with something that I had made a commitment to. That's how I felt, but I never felt that from you guys because maybe you knew it was happening. No, I mean, you just...

There's some things about him that I really liked. And, you know, I mean, he was very good to Mimi, but I mean, he was also just, you know, and if your beautiful daughters are listening to this, this is not meant to be critical of your dad. It's just like some of the things that he wouldn't do for you from a career perspective. And some of the things he did to you from a personal perspective are, you know, just not okay. So anyway, we'll just leave it like that. But

Anyway, but so then your next path was into your next relationship, which was

You know, it's almost like you went from the older guy to the younger guy. Like you went the absolute opposite direction. Yeah. Like you went as polar opposite as humanly possible.

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How do you think I navigated being a single mom? I'm really genuinely curious. And you can criticize me, but just gently. You know what? You were a single mom when you were married to Jill. I mean, let's be honest, right? Yes. So, I mean, these are basically your kids that you've raised from birth by yourself. He was around some, but not a lot. And I mean, that's just...

an underappreciated thing that you did and also trying to also, I think in the back of your mind, you must've known that it may not work out with him. And so you had to be prepared for the next step in your life and you navigate that being ready for the next career step. And then also raising the kids, which was hard. You know, it's funny that you say that because a lot of people, when they, when they're like, Oh my God, like on housewives, I'm like, Oh my God, you've written seven bucks. You've done all these magazines and all that stuff. And I, and I, and I,

I respond to that by saying, if I had been in a loving marriage, do you think I would have had the time to write seven books and to start two magazines and to do all these things and to be modeling? If I was in a loving marriage, I would be focused on my husband,

not just having this extra free time when my kids were at camp or school, whatever, to do these other things. And so I think, too, honestly, it's been very hard, not personally, but professionally, to constantly tell people that I did it for the right reasons and I

Again, I also had you and dad there for the girls. So when we would come for Thanksgiving, when we would come for Christmas, I mean, you know, you're such a patriarch. And dad is also such a beautiful patriarch that my girls...

whether they did things that were really, really great or really, really naughty, you know, I think that like, it was just, it was been so nice for them to, you know, be around, be around you. And that male, that male, the male in the, in girls' lives are, is such an important, important human because it really shapes the narrative for them in the future of how they're going to

work and love, you know, if they're, you know, they choose to be with a male that, you know, help what that relationship looks like. And so, you know, I'm so happy, you know, I'm just so happy that they had that. They had you and dad. But what did you think about when I went on Housewives? What were your thoughts? Remember, gentle, gentle. You don't have to be gentle. I loved it. I thought it was amazing. You, you know, you were great on it. You're natural. You're telegenic and,

fun to be around and I think it's wonderful. I'm waiting for the next step in your career past Housewives. I think Housewives was a starting point for you and you got more in you from that perspective, from whatever it is, that video production or video show or any type of

that type of medium, I think you're going to do something else. I think that's not the apex of your career. I think that's part of it. And there's going to be more. And you've got a real talent and it's going to be great. So I loved it. And it was a little bit weird at the start because when Housewives was first on, it was very new and very popular and very controversial. And

I think one of the things why it got so popular is because it caught people in those awkward circumstances and you got caught for sure. And now I just don't think it's as natural or, and you know, now they infuse, you know, there's alcohol is just infused at such a high level. I feel like, you know, um,

I feel like, but I'm, you know, I'm not there every day, so I don't want to criticize too much, but I mean, do you think that, do you think they saw the real me? Somewhat. Not, not, no, not all the time, but somewhat. So it's funny that you say that because I, I sent, I have my OG group chat and I sent a photo because I'm always like,

Thursday, happy Valentine's Day. Happy Tuesday. Happy Monday. How are you guys? Yada, yada, yada. I saw this and I'm always responding to the group chat. It's always crickets. Except for when I sent a photo of you. I said, it's my twin and I have a birthday today. No idea. They go, they go.

And who's in the group chat? It's like me, Luann, Sonia, Ramona, Jill, Dorinda. And they go, they go, who said that? Luann goes, who's that? And Jill's there and goes, that's her twin brother. And I can't remember who it was. I think it was Ramona who was like, she has a twin? I'm like, ladies. And Luann goes, he's very tall. He's very handsome. I'm like, what?

That's part of the problem with the show is it's not. Oh, good God. When I called off my engagement last year, what were you shocked or what were your thoughts? I mean, not really. I just, so like his, your relationship with him was, I felt like there's a lot of greatness in that. And there was, there was a lot of promise because I like being around him.

And he shares, you know, at some level he shared a lot of the values that I think you do and I do and Tracy and our family do. And so I was kind of, I was somewhat optimistic, but there was just always a, you know, a hesitancy is, you know, is he going to be able, is he going to be able to continue to, you know, move forward with the relationship as an adult and like as a responsible adult?

Not that he was, you know, adulterous or drinking. It's not, I don't want to give you a list of his own idea. That's not who he is. But, you know, being a responsible adult is just doing things you don't want to do, which is like going to work every damn day.

you know, producing for your family and, you know, making sure there's a place for a roof over everyone's head that night. And I'm not trying to say he didn't work because he worked. It's no question. It's interesting. People are like, when they see me on Instagram and I'm like, Oh, I'm showing or I'm here, I'm there. And they're like, you don't really work. I'm like work. I work every day. But,

But remember when I was, you know, when we talked about the prenup, you know, you know, you were like, do you remember what you said to me about the prenup? Not really. You said, get it. You told me to get it. Yeah, I probably did. Yeah. I mean, I just, why not? I mean, what's the hold up for, you know, having an agreement in a relationship when you're, you know, I'll just, you know, spoiler alert.

Post 50 for your listeners. It's a shocker. Post 50.

You're not supposed to say that. I know. That's why I did a spoiler alert. If you just want to... 40, Tommy, 40, 40, 40, 40. Yeah, yeah. So anyway, I think it sucks because he was, you know, he had a lot to offer. And I feel like, you know, some of his family was, you know, I never met his mom. His mom sounded like a great lady from what you told me about her. And I was looking forward to meeting her and...

He just has a lot of great things going for him. He's got beautiful kids, and he's going to figure it out for himself. I just think deep down inside, it was just going to be hard for... You were just worried about that day-in and day-out grind of making...

Your way through life was something I think you were a little bit worried about. Not that there was anything imperfect about him, but like, was it going to keep going? You know, was there going to be a sustainability to hit, you know,

his professional development and, you know. I think too, that's probably a lot of it too is from me and my insecurity and, you know, constantly being in the environment where I'm always reinventing myself. And that's just been like a fear that I've had for so long is like constantly reinventing myself and constantly being the main provider of

And that was a big, that was a big problem. What is the pattern? What do you, what do you think some of the patterns are? I get what you're, you're, you're sort of talking around circles like a circus ride, but I mean, it is true. What you're basically saying is how am I going to support myself? Yes. Without being. Yeah. So, yes, it's really hard. And so, you know, continue, not how am I, how am I going to continue to do that?

Right. Important. Yeah. So what kind of pattern, tell me what, tell me what are the patterns? What do you see in my patterns? Is it my, is it that I'm super immature? You can say yes. No, I really don't think so. I mean, I really like you've had some of your relationships. I mean, but I just, you know, like picking the, the, your, your second long-term relationship, um,

That was just a disastrous choice. And you, that, that just played into yours that played it. It sort of played into the, what you always told me about Jill's like, I want to just be able to, I want to be with somebody that will take me ice skating at Rockefeller Plaza and do things like that. So I felt like,

You thought that like marriage and you got married, you know, pretty young marriage should have been a little bit more romantic and storybook. And, you know, I think there are moments like that, but then I think you just were like, okay, I'm not married to Jill anymore. So I'm going to find the storybook playmate. And you did. Anyway, moving to the next thing, Tommy, what do you think of, what do you think of Pascal? I mean, I listened to a little bit of Pascal. I think he sounded just like Jill, which was just yucky. So that just, yeah.

No good. He asked me, he goes, so he's like, what would you do on our first date? And I said, like in jest, and I said, I would take you to the Viagra Triangle to Gibson's to see my Playboy cover. And he goes, what?

I said, I'm from Rockford, Illinois, and Gibson's is one of the most iconic restaurants in Chicago. And I am so proud that they actually wanted my Playboy cover. And I'm like, I would take you there to show off the cover. And he was so wildly offended.

Really? Well, why would you say that, though? It's funny because it's funny. I mean, obviously, I'm not doing that. But I thought it was so funny. And I wanted to see what he would say. Sorry. Why would you say that? That's just off-putting. That's bizarre. Don't say that, okay? Listeners, join in. Call in. Text in. Is there a live chat? No, Kelly, don't do that ever again.

That's ridiculous. All right. Keep going with your weirdness. So what kind of guy? So anyway, to make a long story longer, Pascal, we ended up seeing, I ended up seeing, meeting with him when we were in San Francisco and Napa Valley. And he was very, very, very nice. And so I said to him, I was like, what kind of, what kind of hairdresser do you see yourself like? And he said, Orbea. Orbea is the most iconic hairdresser in the world.

Okay. You're losing me here. This is very bizarre. It was very, very sweet. Very sweet. Very, very sweet. Very accomplished. Very accomplished. That's awesome. But you ruined that one. Why did you ruin that? What? Pascal? Yeah, I'm saying the thing about Playboy. Because I was having fun. That is dumb, though. People don't want to hear that about the Viagra Triangle. That's just nuts.

I loved it. No, no, that's terrible. That is a disaster. That is a disaster. Tommy's going to be like editing. Tommy's going to be like the group chat with my dates and be like, she didn't mean it like that. I just wish that the listeners could chat in right now to support me so that you could get other realization of how bizarre that is.

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Shop and donate online at macys.com slash purpose. Asian American and Pacific Islander Heritage Month goes on all month long. At California Psychics, we know some people can't read the career warning signs. Like your boss, still not knowing your name. You, Tina, Lisa, Sheila.

Whatever. Get that report to me by lunch, okay? It's Carrie, ma'am? Just get it done, Terry. So talk to California Psychics and receive the career guidance you need. We only connect you with the very best. So guarantee, if your reading isn't life-changing, it's free. California Psychics. Call 1-800-PREDICT today and get 20 minutes for just $20. All right, what kind of guy do you think I tend to attract or date? Is there like a type of guy?

or is there a personality trait that you think that I attract or that I like? I don't think so. I mean, I don't, there was the one guy you dated from North Carolina for a long time that was very successful, but he was noncommittal. Maybe it's the noncommittal. I think you're looking for accomplished people. That's a good word. I think you are. And all those people that everybody you've dated, except for the one guy pretty accomplished to just, you know,

the question with some of them is is is that going to be sustainable is that going to keep going um and so i think you're looking for that i think that's your trait you had that one uh 12-year blip with uh the guy with the white jeans and the flip-flops but other than that what kind of guy what kind of guy should i date i think you should uh date someone who's honest with you and themselves

you know, what they want in their life and what you want from your life and they're honest about it and, you know, that they know who they are and they understand who you are and that you can coexist together. Understanding that, you know, there are things that are important to you. So,

Those things have to continue. You want to continue doing your lifestyle and continue to improve and be better every day at what you're doing. It's just who you are. You're not going to stop doing that. So whoever it is has to understand that. And then you probably have to understand it for them, too. But I think you, I really didn't think you would. I mean, if you had the professional person, the accomplished person, whatever.

And I don't want your listeners to think that you're out looking for Mr. Wealthy. And it's not that I don't think it didn't work out with your engagement because you were afraid that he wasn't going to be, you know, Mr. Silicon Valley guy. But I mean, you're just looking for someone that's going to have stability, you

And professional growth and looking for growth as a person, as an individual, like and setting goals together. Someone that's honest, like setting lifetime goals. I want to I want to be here with you in five or 10 years. Maybe I talk about it. This is this is kind of.

Where do we want to be in 10 years? Where do I want to be with you? What do we want to do? What do we want to live? You know, it's interesting because like, that's what I do with C and Teddy is I talk to them about like what, you know, in five years, what their plans are and like, you know, how I can help them. And, you know, we always talk together, but I've never had that conversation with anyone. I've never asked anyone what their

they were going to do or what, you know, what they wanted to do. I mean, with the girls, you know, sees like, you know, mommy, now every, now that I had this great job and I'm feeling good about my, you know, financial success, you know, I, once a year I want to, I want us to go on a great trip with Teddy and, you know, for us to do these kinds of things. And like, I mean, it's just, I like, I've never heard that from anyone. So it's also for me, um,

It's just so amazing to think of my daughters in that way, but I also want them to have their own lives and to be the best versions of themselves. And I just want to be there and watch every part of it. But I've never had that. I've never sent someone like, okay, in five years, we're going to go, we're going to be in Florida, whatever it is, like Florida or Texas or wherever it is.

Puerto Rico, wherever, no one's ever, ever had that conversation with me. Well, or ever asked me, ever even said, like, what are your thoughts? Like, what are your, like, lifetime goals? Or, like, even any of those kind of questions. I've never even kind of, I've never even thought of those.

It should be a natural conversation that just evolves with the person and with your breakup. You know, the unfortunate thing about him is that he's not his. And that might be part of the reason for that breakup is like his kids are so much younger than your kids. He has one child that's still in elementary school and two other kids that are not even to college yet. So his life is completely unavailable. He can't. Well, I mean.

I felt like he was available as much as he could, but I mean, I almost felt like when he was with me and with us or like if he was at a holiday or whatever, it felt a little guilty to me that he wasn't with his other kids because I think his other kids are amazing. They're great kids. You know, that was a, that's a loss for me was, is those kids not being able to see them because I just thought they were impressive kids.

And he's a good dad that way. And they love those kids. So, but the problem that coming back, I'm doing my circle like you did is the point is maybe he wasn't ready to talk about those long-term goals because he couldn't see past getting kids through high school, really. So we need to find somebody who,

That's honest with themselves and honest with you and, you know, can see a future. Like, where are we going to go? What are we going to do? And it doesn't have to be like, are we going to move somewhere else? But like, what do we want to, you know, do we want to take like, should we plan a trip next year? Should we...

you know, do we want to, what do we want to do for our holidays? You know, you know, what's interesting is that like when I, I said to him, you know, when we were talking, we know, because I've never, never been on a honeymoon. And so I said, you know, because we're, you know, taking off for, for, to get married. I said, why don't we take all the kids to Disneyland for our, for our basic, for our honeymoon. And he kind of looked at me. Yeah.

But I wanted to do something for us, like all of us. I didn't want to just do something that was like him and I just going off and going on a trip and coming back and being like, okay, I want to do something that would like really was like family building. That's not a honeymoon though, Kelly. No, I know, but I've never been on a honeymoon. So I don't even know what a honeymoon is like. A honeymoon is simple. You go away and spend a week with your new bride and then you come home or a husband. I mean, what do you mean? Well, I never did that. So, um,

I mean, if you don't remember, I got married and then my ex-husband went off and I don't know, he went to like Fashion Week or something. I don't remember that, but Kelly... Tommy, do you think I should get married again? No, wait, just let me finish and go back. I forgot about that. I forgot about that, about him going to Fashion Week. And that is horrible. How do you not...

you know, have a honeymoon, even if it's a couple of days. I never, we went on, never went on a honeymoon. Well, and that's just part of the reason why that was just, you know, there was a lot of things that were just not going to be,

successful there that you know I mean the fact that that was not a consideration for him is hard that's really hard and that's just I'm getting emotional thinking about it Kelly I'm just so sorry that is just a broken part of your life I mean I honestly feel like and maybe this is like maybe just like talking to you about this is maybe like maybe come having me come to a realization that

You were my twin brother. I didn't have to take care of you. You took care of yourself and we did things together.

But I always felt that I always, like with Gilles, I always had to take care of him. I always had to organize everything. I had to like, you know, when he came back, I had to make sure that like, you know, he had like, you know, a place, a good place to live and a place to do things. And, you know, there was an environment for him that he, you know, he had friends and I was always taking care of him. And that obviously taking care of my girls and just, you know,

Some people are nurturers and some people are. I happen to be a nurturer. I happen to love making sure that people are healthy and happy and successful. It's just like part of who I am. But I have realized because when I started this whole process, I said –

To my producer, I was like, I'd love to do this podcast, but I'm not going to do it if I don't go through therapy. And so I started, you know, I was doing, I was going through therapy and being on the podcast at the same time. And one thing that I realized is that I don't want to be in a relationship where I'm nurturing the other person because I'm

That just puts me, again, I'm always on my back foot. I'm always like, how do I take care of things? How do I organize things? And I just don't want that. In the next chapter of my life, I just want to feel like I'm in a hug. I just want to come home and be like, ugh. It's like I've always been, I'm going to start crying, but I've always felt so alone and lonely.

You're not alone, Kelly. I know. You have people that love you, including me. I know. And your kids. Thank you. So let's go back to the answer to the original question, which is, should you get married again? And you were kind of asking it in a funny way. And absolutely, 100%, you should get married again. Now, your therapist, who is probably some New York crackpot, will probably say that's wrong.

But I don't really care. No, she actually said you should get married for the first time is what she said. Okay. Well, you know, I mean, I'm a lawyer, so I don't know about this stuff. But, you know, but I mean, it just seems like to me that having a mate is really important. You know, I was so we were having conversations with Mimi about like there are people that have gotten that have been widowed or, you know, and are older. And they're like, oh,

I'm not going to get, why would I get married again? You know, I don't want to get married again. And it just, I think to myself, and maybe I'm the dumbass, but I'm like, why wouldn't you want to get married again? Why do you not want to have that person that cares for you every day that you can count on, that you've got that text from or that call from, or like, it's what we're going to do something together and it's going to be good. It may not be great all the time.

But a lot of times it's going to be good. So yes, you should get married again. And I'm glad I'm smart like the therapist.

First time she met, like have like a real marriage, like a real, she's like, that's what you always wanted as a family for your family. She's like, go and get it. I'm like, okay. I agree with her. Maybe she's not as crazy crock pack, crock pack or whatever a New Yorker, as I said, maybe she's does have some sense. So since I've been on the podcast, have you noticed anything? I mean, we have, I haven't gotten to see you that much this year, but have you noticed anything different about me?

You're like, no. Yes. Is that the right answer? Do you think I'm more open? Do you think I'm funnier? Maybe not. No, I don't think there's been a big change, but I do feel like you, you know, you've, you've got to give yourself a chance to be with somebody that, you know, you got to give somebody a chance and they got to give you a chance and you

And, you know, it's really difficult. You know, the one thing that that dipshit Pascal said on that podcast, I did agree with. I kind of liked it. What did he say? He said that, you know, if you're going to go out with people, you shouldn't always expect that this you're going to go on a date and meet your future mate. You should go into it with.

The expectation that maybe I'm going to meet somebody or make a friend, which, you know, secretly, I think if you're going on a date, you kind of have that hope, right? That I'm going to meet the person that I'm going to, you know, hopefully this will turn into romantic. Yeah. But I guess really for, I guess what he, maybe what he's really trying to say is, look, don't put so much pressure on it when you go out with somebody, you know, don't give them a whole bunch of questions. Just find out about them and, and,

um you know let them find out a little bit about you and you know just kind of be honest because at this point in your life just you know i think honesty is the best policy to say look i mean

I'm after a future. You know, you seem great. Can we do this together? What are you after? And if the guy is just like a social climber or somebody that just wants to, you know, get his picture taken with you, then, you know, you'll figure that out pretty quickly. It's interesting because one of my friends on the podcast, her name is Cheryl Burke, and she's on Dancing with the Stars, and she is such an amazing human. I love her so much. And she said that she's like, Cheryl Burke, Cheryl Burke from Dancing with the Stars. She's amazing. I love her.

She's celibate. She's an incredible dancer. She's amazing. I just watch her all the time. I love her. Oh my God. She's so cool. And we've become really good friends. And she said to me, she was like, I'm going to be your girlfriend.

she goes, you need to ask more questions. And she goes, not, she goes, some people are like, you have to ask like, how many kids? What do they have? Like all these things. She's like, no, no, no. She goes, you're not, you're not answering, asking the right questions. She goes, if a guy is divorced, you can ask, okay, why are you divorced? But she goes, don't go into it. She goes, the way he tells you, you know why he's got divorced. So it's like, whether there was infidelity or there was no sex or whatever it was. So,

So I really, really love that. My friend Deanna, we've become really, really good friends after spending a lot of time together. And she was telling me how...

she doesn't know if she would ever get married, you know, again. And if she did, there was, she didn't have a prenup, which is all these things are great, but she was really good too with me and saying that like, and she's done a lot of work on herself. And she just said that, like, that I'm not asking the right questions and that I need to listen what they're saying and move on. And, and, you know, you just said that you said the same thing. You,

You said like, you need to find out like what their goals are. Like what do you want to sail for the rest of your life? And, you know, into the sunset, like, are you, you know, in a 10 year plan of, you know, of work? Like what is it? So. I agree with Deanna. You need a prenup. You need this. You need that. Maybe you don't need a prenup. Right. With that particular last relationship. Yes. But agreed. Agreed. I wouldn't, I don't know if I would, there's, there would be, there is certain situations where I probably might, I wouldn't get a prenup. Okay.

I mean, you might go in and figure out that maybe you don't need it. And right. You know, anyway, I just, I don't think you should go. I'm not getting married again. I'm going to get a prenup. I'm doing this. I'm doing that. Maybe. No, no, no, no, no, no. I'm open to it all. I know that I know my person is out there.

I love you, Tommy. Do you have any parting advice, Tommy, to give to my listeners on iTunes Part 2? They're going to love you. They're going to eat you up. First thing, what's not to love? Parting advice is...

Get out there and find it, listeners. It's out there for you. There are great people all over this country waiting to meet you. So go find them and be happy. I love you, Kelly, so much. I love you, Tommy. Happy birthday. Happy birthday. This has been so much fun. Thank you, Tommy, for coming on the podcast.

Are you single after a divorce and needing some guidance? I am here to help. Email us or call us. We're here to help. All the info is in the show notes. Follow us on socials and make sure to rate and review the podcast. I do part two and I heart radio podcast. We're falling in love is the main objective.

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At California Psychics, we know some people can't read the career warning signs. Like your boss, still not knowing your name. You, Tina, Lisa, Sheila, whatever. Get that report to me by lunch, okay? It's Carrie, ma'am? Just get it done, Terry. So talk to California Psychics and receive the career guidance you need. We only connect you with the very best. So guarantee, if your reading isn't life-changing...

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