The Immigration Crackdown
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It is Wednesday, April 30th. Here's what's happening right now on CNN This Morning. I'm removing public safety threats from this area. ICE is out there right now arresting people.

The immigration crackdown, it's a core tenet of President Trump's agenda. But how do the American people feel about it? Is he going too far or not far enough? We have some new polling numbers out this morning. Plus the case before the Supreme Court today that challenges the separation of church and state. Should taxpayers fund religious private schools? We also have this. Oh my God. Oh my gosh.

Hurricane force wind gust tornado spotted the damage on the ground following a line of deadly severe storms in the Midwest. Also today plans for a federal car fee 20 bucks a year for the typical sedan truck or SUV. What are the chances it will actually become law?

It's 6 a.m. here on the East Coast. Here's a live look at New York City. Good morning, everybody. I'm Adi Cornish. I want to thank you for waking up with me. OK, we want to talk about President Trump wrapping up his celebration of his first 100 days in office. And he believes one issue above all others helped him get back in the White House.

I won on the basis of, I think the number one thing was on illegal immigration, the border, the people pouring across our border that are from all over the world.

If that was the case, his handling of the issue may be driving some voters away. We've got some brand new CNN polling out this morning, finds a little more than half of the country believes Trump is going too far in deporting undocumented migrants. And that's up from seven points from February. 52% say these immigration policies are not making the U.S. safer. And even more people, about 57%, believe the government is not being careful to follow the law when carrying out deportations.

Well, if you get accused of being an immigrant, how are you supposed to prove that you're not without due process? Due process is something that either all of us have or none of us have.

Joining me now in the group chat, David Chalyan, CNN political director, Kristen Soltis Anderson, CNN political commentator and Republican pollster, and Charlie Dent, former Republican congressman from Pennsylvania. Good morning, everybody. Good morning. That protester really entered the group chat. That was the image I needed to see to kick off the day. David, I understand polling is your love language and you have some detail for us. What about these numbers was surprising to you?

It is clear when you look at polling broadly on the topic of immigration that on border security, closing down the border, this is President Trump's strong suit. What has happened here, I think that is pretty clear in the polling, is that some of the implementation of all of the policies is not necessarily being

wearing well with the American public. And what has happened is we've seen a decline. - So it's like snatching up the students maybe. - Right, or like the Obrego Garcia case, right? - Like questioning whether or not people are guilty of the things that the administration is accusing them of. - 'Cause you're seeing, I think it's 56% in our brand new poll thought that the Obrego Garcia case was handled incorrectly. That includes like 20% of Republicans who feel that way.

you see that his overall number on handling immigration trump's approval rating now is at 45 that was at 51 so he's now underwater on it again he does better on immigration than he does in his overall approval i'm not saying this is not a strong suit and if i were donald trump last night i also would have leaned into this especially given the economic concerns that are out there you're going to put immigration front and center but he still has warning signs on immigration all right what's interesting to me is when i think about the populations that moved to trump you had

the migrant crisis reach many cities right and cross over into an environment where people weren't used to having the conversation and so this is very different from trump one where it's like build a wall like if we can put up that list again of things people are wary of it's like a range of policies that might feel unexpected to people am i reading that wrong like irs data

and snatching people up off the street, revoking student visas, wartime authority for deportations. This is not a wall. Yeah, look, but Donald Trump...

We talk about what and how, as David kind of pointed out. They tend to agree with him on immigration. People should be deported who committed crimes. It's always the how and the execution that gets him into trouble. Even on issues like tariffs, I mean, they've gone too far, even though there might be some support for some of these policies. And we see it over and over and over again, and I think that is always their problem. They overshoot, they overreach immigration.

and that's what turns off so much of the public and that's why the numbers are bad. You said people need to look under the hood of these numbers. Yeah, so for instance, take the number there on deportations to Salvadorian prisons. You have about half, I think it was 51% in this poll, said that they're opposed to that. But then you take a look at the underlying numbers and there's also a really high percentage of unsure, which in this day and age I think is a little bit unusual. Anytime I see an unsure number on a question about a news story that's gotten an enormous amount of coverage, that gives me

pause. And it makes me think that there are a lot of voters who, again, are sort of spiritually with Trump on the idea that we need to be tougher on immigration. But we want to see how this plays out. And take, for instance, the Abrego Garcia case. You know, started off as one where people said, this is a Maryland father. How could we do this? And then I think in conservative media, you begin to see more and more reporting on the details of, well, but there was a domestic violence allegation, et cetera. And suddenly it becomes a much

muddier story, at least for Trump supporters. I think that's why you see such high levels of unsure. - I'm glad you brought that up because Trump was actually asked about, I think that case in particular on ABC. Here is how he responded.

This is not an innocent, wonderful gentleman from Maryland. I'm not saying he's a good guy. It's about the rule of law. The order from the Supreme Court stands, sir. He came into our country illegally. You could get him back. There's a phone on this desk. I could. You could pick it up, and with all the power of the presidency, you could call up the president of El Salvador and say, send him back right now. And if he were the gentleman that you say he is, I would do that. But the court has ordered you to facilitate that decision.

I'm not the one making this decision. We have lawyers that don't want to do this. You're the president. But the buck stops in this office. No, no, no, no. I follow the law.

Okay, so kudos to Moran for, I think even just as an interviewer, saying the questions in a way that everybody understands, because the common sense of this has been like, what? Why? Like, of course you can. But is there an impact of these kinds of questions, of like ICE agents wearing masks, right? Like of these like incidents that look hostile in a way to people that we're not sure deserve hostility?

Again, I want to-- - In a common sense way, I mean, right? - Clearly you can see some of that. To Kristen's point,

I don't think it's just Donald Trump's base of supporters or followers in conservative media who believe in the overall goal, as Charlie was saying, getting people who are here illegally, especially those that commit crimes, out of this country. I think there is broad support for that. So it does come to the how, and as you're saying, depicting the way it is done. What I think was so interesting about that exchange with Terry Moran at ABC

was less about the immigration piece of it and more, as Terry was pressing him, on the rule of law piece of it. And interesting that Donald Trump was sort of suggesting, no, that the buck stops elsewhere, not in the Oval Office, but that he's not involved in this and he's just following lawyers' advice. And when he said at the end, I follow the rule of law, I find this so interesting. This is a clear sensitive spot for Donald Trump. He understands the precarious nature

that he is in, if he is seen as defying a court order-- - Really? 'Cause everyone else keeps talking about the idea that he's trying to push things to the Supreme Court. - Every time he's asked about it, he stresses a message of like, I follow the rule, I have respect for the court, I'm gonna follow the court.

Does he think the court's going to rule in his favor and that's why? I don't know the answer to that, but I think he clearly understands the politics of not following the rule of law. Okay, David Chalyan entered the chat this morning. You guys stay with me, we've got a lot to talk about today. Coming up on CNN this morning, the judge arrested, accused of helping an undocumented immigrant avoid ICE. Well, now she's facing a new problem. Why she won't be on the bench anytime soon.

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Okay, if you're getting ready, it's 15 minutes past the hour. Here is your morning roundup. The Wisconsin Supreme Court has suspended a judge who was arrested last week. Judge Hannah Dugan faces two federal charges for allegedly allowing an undocumented immigrant to leave her courtroom through a jury door in an attempt to avoid immigration officials outside. In court on Friday, her attorney said she wholeheartedly protested her arrest.

50 years ago today, Saigon, the capital of South Vietnam, fell to communist forces. This marked an end to the Vietnam War and decades of U.S. military involvement in Southeast Asia. More than 58,000 American service members were killed in Vietnam. More than one million civilians were also killed in the conflict. Plus, there's this. Oh, my God.

This is a powerful line of storms leaving behind a lot of damage in Missouri. In Missouri, several tornadoes were reported. Wind gusts topped 90 miles an hour and then that same system caused destructive winds in Pennsylvania. That's where one person was killed as a result. The severe weather threat isn't over. The southern plains could see catastrophic flooding today.

And on to Florida, where that state could become the second one in the U.S. to ban fluoride in its tap water. State lawmakers passed the bill yesterday, and if Governor Ron DeSantis signs off, Florida would join Utah in saying goodbye to fluoride in its water supply.

Still to come on CNN This Morning, beliefs and ideas that used to be considered conspiracies have moved into the mainstream. How? Why? I'm going to speak with CNN's own Doni O'Sullivan about his trips down the rabbit hole. Plus, will Congress make cuts to Medicaid? President Trump says no way, but Republicans are divided as they look to slash billions from the federal budget.

And good morning to Tulsa. Please bring your umbrella as you walk out the door. You could see a lot of rain today. Some places in the state could get up to six inches.

All right, I want to go off script for a second because as a journalist, we're like living with conspiracy theories. They seem to be everywhere, whether it's about the so-called deep state or vaccines, taking it back a bit. Did we go to the moon? Are aliens among us? Is JFK really dead? What about Elvis? There are so many out-of-the-box theories.

that just live on. And the perfect guest to talk about this is my friend, Doni O'Sullivan. He's CNN's senior correspondent. He's got a new podcast out this morning looking at this exact question. And it's called The Account:

Doni, thanks for being here. - Thank you, Audie. - You've been doing this kind of work for a long time, meaning just going out in the world and trying to understand why people believe what they do. But for the last couple years, I feel like fact checkers have been kind of politically undermined. People also, even the term conspiracy theories say, well, you're just saying that about anything you don't agree with. So what were you trying to do here? - Well, yeah, it's from speaking to a lot of people for years now who believe sometimes a lot of crazy things

I've learned that you don't have to be crazy to believe crazy stuff. And even a couple of years ago, we did a documentary for the whole story with Anderson Cooper on people who-- there is, of course, many JFK conspiracy theories. But believe the conspiracy theory that JFK was actually still alive, right?

extremely out there. However, when we actually spoke to the family members, people, you know, because people just assume they see people in this group believing that JFK is alive, that they're all, have always been this way. No, their families tell a different story. Absolutely. And these people had folks who believed this stuff had gone through either recent trauma or childhood trauma or something happened in their life where they're searching for meaning, where they're searching for a sense of purpose and belonging. And that's what conspiracy theories often do. They offer community.

Okay, interestingly, for this opening episode, you're talking with Dr. Sam Vessier. He's a therapist and an anthropologist, which is quite the combination. I'm going to play this part of the conversation because it's not about being the person who's believing in the theories. It's about the rest of us. Here we go. Why doesn't the approach of...

trying to confront a person's beliefs or to try encourage them to think even more critically or to teach them how to think critically. Why doesn't that work? Because that does sort of seem to be, you know, I think the most, it's probably the approach people feel like is the most common sense.

Yeah, I think first in terms of behavioral science and how people come to develop a particular understanding of the world, human beings are not really convinced by facts. They're not, they don't, human beings don't select information based on whether it's true or not or on whether it's high quality or low quality. They select information in terms of who they get it from, in terms of who they trust, right?

So confronting people about deeply held beliefs and really values is something that does not work because it's stigmatizing. And when people feel attacked, they're on fight or flight mode. We're also mammals and we don't like being under threat. So when people feel attacked, they have no empathy for their interlocutor. Dialogue is not possible anymore.

Tony, I feel like this has direct implications for your job, what you do, my understanding of your beat even, like doesn't believe in facts, blaming the messenger, right, really being upset. What drove you to do this? Is this like you're feeling a little helpless and you're trying to find an answer yourself? Yeah, I mean look, as you know, oftentimes we do stories, particularly when we do stories about rather depressing things, sometimes an editor

will rather annoyingly ask, well, you know, can we throw in a solution here at the end? How can we solve it? And I've always said that's not my job. I don't have a solution. However, what I've seen with this and in the podcast series, I speak about my own mental health a bit and my own capability. I don't believe that JFK is still alive, but I, you know, true depression, anxiety can have a lot of irrational thoughts myself.

And I'm absolutely not saying that people who, all people who believe in conspiracy theories and mental health issues. - No, but given what you said earlier about trauma as a potential trigger, that those things can have implications. - Exactly, and that was the way for me to unlock my empathy to say, okay, I can see that a person here is really, truly believes this stuff and is engaging in this sort of irrational thought

And I think that's the point that the doctor was making there, that for us to help any people get out of rabbit holes, we need to be willing. Yeah. Doni O'Sullivan, listen, it's okay if there's no happy ending, but the journey is worth it, you guys. The journey is the destination. Please check out the account, Persuadable. It's available wherever you get your podcasts. It's out now.

Coming up on CNN this morning, it's an issue that could shape the future of education. The Supreme Court case that could green light taxpayer dollars for religious schools. Plus, details on the FAA's bold new plan to beat the summer travel chaos and get you to your destination. That includes some flights soaring higher than ever. Once upon a time, a young couple inherited their grandfather's castle in France.

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You can tell Trump just wants to focus on the positives. Today, when asked about his tariffs that tanked the economy, he said, to quote Bill Belichick's girlfriend, we're not talking about this. How are President Trump's tariffs affecting the economy? Today, we're going to get a report card for his first quarter back in office. Good morning, everybody. I'm Adi Cornish. I want to thank you for joining me on CNN this morning. It's half past the hour, and here's what's happening right now.

In just hours, we'll have our first glimpse at President Trump's second-term economic record. The Commerce Department is set to release its estimate of first-quarter growth. Experts predict a weaker number, less than 1 percent in growth. And later this morning, President Trump will assemble his Cabinet to celebrate his first 100 days in office. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth will be at the table. President Trump is sticking with him despite the Signal group chat drama.

The president also telling ABC that he had a quote "good talk" with Hegseth about Signalgate.

Today, the Senate is expected to take up a vote to block President Trump's tariffs. Earlier this month, they passed a similar effort to overturn his tariffs on Canada with the help of four Republicans. But that doesn't mean much because the House likely won't take this up after.

Also this morning, the Supreme Court will hear arguments in a high-stakes dispute involving taxpayer funding and religious education. So this case focuses on the nation's first religious charter school. It's a Catholic school in Oklahoma, and the charter school board there approved it.

Eventually, Oklahoma's Supreme Court got involved and ruled against the school because of the idea that charter schools are considered public and this would be a religious instruction going on. This pathway of teaching religion in a public school does, I think, put the first step in motion for the dam to be broken, separation of church and state.

Group chat is back. We're going to have Charlie because you were involved in charter school regulation in Pennsylvania What are the things that people don't understand about this idea of like? Public versus the parochial school model because people think I'm charter school as long as it's not the public school who really cares a charter school is a in fact a public school I helped write the law in the 1990s when Tom Ridge was governor of Pennsylvania and

Basically, the way it worked in our state, if a student went to a charter school, 80% of the funding for that student, public money, would follow that student. A parochial school, of course, is a private school, and there are many states that have vouchers or grants to go to the student's parents, and then they can use that to pay for the child's education. It's not a direct subsidy to the parochial school. So why are they trying to open this door? Is this an education story or a religious liberty story?

So in my view, something like this happens because you have a lot of parents who I think post-COVID have begun looking for alternative education opportunities for their kids. But need a way to pay for it. Exactly. And, you know, difference. You've had a lot of big wins for the school choice movement in big states like Texas this year. But this is a little bit different.

different because this is again still within the confines of the public system. It's also coming interestingly at a time that we're seeing religious observance overall on a bit of a decline. This is a longer term trend line with an exception of there's been a little bit of a like revival among say like Gen Z men. Just think it's interesting the dynamics of how people are thinking about spiritual faith in America today.

But to get at the heart of it, I mean, it is a separation of church and state issue, obviously, that the court will be grappling with. Now, do I think that this court, which has a

As most courts have a tendency to not do a sweeping kind of decision here, but maybe we're going to get something more narrow to this. But it certainly can open a door and raises questions because you're right. They're publicly funded. It's taxpayer money for these schools. They're independently run. I know some folks may think of charters as not, but it is taxpayer money. And so when you get taxpayer money involved in religious education, it does seem like

that we all have to sort of grapple with that basic constitutional principle. - And it scrambles the politics here. So here's Oklahoma's Attorney General, Getner Drummond, describing the consequences of allowing religious charter schools.

If there's a satanic application, we have to grant it. If there's a Sheree law applicant, we have to grant that. And I think although Oklahomans in general would support any Christian activity, this is not about Christian and non-Christian. This is about the rule of law.

This is really fascinating happening against the backdrop also the dismantling of the education department. These very heady conversations will be at the state level. The easy way out of this is if you want to get a religious education, go to the parochial school. And as a policy maker, well then you can provide a voucher. That's withstood constitutional muster.

But basically having religious instruction in a public school, and a charter school is a public school, a publicly funded school, I think goes a bit further than any of us would have ever imagined. Exactly. And the fact that it got to the court and got this far is something that people are really surprised about. So group chat, stick around. We've got a lot more to talk about in other topics today. Treasury Secretary Scott Besson, for example, is expected to meet with negotiators from Japan to talk

trade. Right now the U.S. is imposing a 10% universal tariff on Japan and an additional one that had been planned is paused. Anyway, that's on top of a 25% auto tariff. So these are already taking a toll on U.S. companies that do business in Asia and their customers. Every time you get a truck in, we're having to reprint price labels. We have to pass on prices to the customers. If our prices go up, then

Our prices have to go up. Prices really went up as far as getting the vegetables. What's impacted me personally as far as savings and leaning back on the things what I do eat and definitely getting off the things I don't need to. We're going to go live to Tokyo now and bring in CNN's Hanako Montgomery. And Hanako, first let's just talk about these talks. What's expected today?

Hi, audience. Good to see you. So these talks are actually coming at a really interesting time. They're coming on the heels of a new executive order that the U.S. President Donald Trump signed on Tuesday. Now, this executive order does ease some auto tariffs, which is a huge sticking point for Japan and the U.S. during these tariff negotiations.

But Trump has said that this new order is actually meant to help U.S. auto manufacturers as they're trying to navigate this interim period where they're expected to bring back a lot of manufacturing to the United States from competitor countries like Canada, China, Japan, and Mexico, for example. In fact, here's what the U.S. president had to say about those competitor countries at a rally in Michigan on Tuesday.

We don't want them building them in Japan. We want them to build them here. We want China to build them in here. We want them all to build them right in here. That's what they've done to us for 40 years, and they've drained us.

Now, Adi, we can expect Japan's top tariff negotiator, Ryosei Akazawa, to ask that Japan be exempt from the existing auto tariffs. Akazawa himself has said that they're simply too high for a lot of Japanese carmakers, that they can't absorb those additional costs. And this is a huge, huge issue for Japan as a whole, as a country, really, given the fact that about 3% of its GDP comes from profits made from the auto manufacturing industry. So again, Adi, we can expect the

top tariff negotiator to ask for some concessions, some deals that they can hopefully strike with the U.S. to ease this economic impact. Audie. CNN's Hanako Montgomery in Tokyo. Thank you for your insight here. Appreciate it.

The president has done a lot on his own the last 100 days using executive orders, but he needs Congress if he wants to get everything on his budget wish list, especially tax cuts. To make the math work, Republicans on the committee that oversees Medicaid and Medicare are looking to cut billions of dollars. And since cuts to Medicare for seniors is a political third rail, Trump wants House Republicans to focus on the insurance program for the poor, Medicaid.

House Republicans are working to invest more money in Medicaid than we spent today. The only thing we're going to cut is the corruption and the crooks that take advantage of some of the illegal schemes.

82 million people across the U.S. currently rely on Medicaid services for everything from children's health to elder care. So joining me now to discuss Julie Rovner, chief Washington correspondent for Kaiser Health News. So Julie, you and I both covered the Affordable Care Act, so we've been having this conversation for a long time. Can you talk about the potential cuts?

Like, what is the idea that's come forward? So one thing that's important to realize is that Medicaid, I actually went back and looked. This is my 39th year covering Medicaid. There were 17 million people on Medicaid in 1986 when I started doing this. Now there are...

As you said, if you include the Children's Health Insurance Program, 80 million people. In states across the country, including states that we call red states. And many red states. And many public polls say that most people know somebody or have themselves or a family member who have been on Medicaid, who have been helped by Medicaid. They don't want to see it cut. At the same time, we now have the

House Energy and Commerce Committee with instructions to cut $880 billion, most of which, if it doesn't come from Medicare, will have to come from Medicaid. So they're looking for ways to cut it without seeming to cut it. - Yeah, so here's an example of a reluctant lawmaker. We had a Republican congressman, I think it was Dusty Johnson, who was sort of asked about this idea.

What are you comfortable with on Medicaid? I think it looks like overwhelmingly members are not excited. They're not going to be supportive of cutting benefits to people who deserve to be on those programs. We're a rich country, but we absolutely need to take care of the most needy among us. That being said, there are all kinds of integrity and eligibility measures that can be done to really make sure we focus those dollars on America's most needy.

- Okay, decode the legislative ease here. When we talk eligibility, when we talk like, what are they really saying? - Well, one thing we know about Medicaid is that the more you make people come back and interact with the system, the more likely they are to fall through the cracks, even if they're still eligible.

So if you have to have them sort of re-up every six months instead of every year, you're going to get fewer people on Medicaid. That will save money, but that will not necessarily be cutting people who are ineligible. So saying to states, don't chase down the people who forget to sign up. That's their problem.

And that's what we see also with work requirements, which is the other big popular idea. What we know about Medicaid is that 90% of the people on Medicaid either already work, they can't work, or they're taking care of someone who can't work. Oh, so why are we talking about that? Because we've discovered when the few states that have tried work requirements is, again, that friction with the system. Many of them have trouble reporting their work hours, and they end up getting disenrolled. Again, you save money, but you're not getting rid of ineligible people. You're getting rid of eligible people.

Does the math of cutting the budget work without hacking away at Medicaid? Not the way it's structured now. And of course it's interesting because the Senate doesn't seem to really be very enthusiastic about this. So right now we're just looking at the House in terms of these Medicaid cuts. We'll see if the House can get to a number that they can agree on. So far there's a lot of talking and not a lot of writing.

Julie Rovner, thank you so much. I hope you come back because honestly, this is not going to go away. So I need a translator. I appreciate it. Still ahead on CNN this morning, a dangerous measles outbreak is actually now spreading across several U.S. states. What the World Health Organization is saying as the outbreak grows. Plus, some lawmakers unveiled plans for an annual car fee. So how much is that going to cost you?

Retailers and large importers are telling me directly that they've all but stopped imports from China. Goods coming out of China are two and a half times more expensive than they were just last month.

President Trump's tariffs are taking a toll on businesses large and small, as well as on you, their customers. There were reports that Amazon even floated a plan to show you how much these tariffs would cost next to their prices. The White House called that a hostile political act. President Trump then calls up Jeff Bezos directly to complain.

Amazon says, look, you got it all confused. This wasn't really approved. It was only an idea, not for the consumer specifically. Another problem for the president, though, is China, because its foreign ministry says bowing to a bully is like drinking poison to quench a thirst. It only deepens the crisis. President Trump, of course, disagrees. China probably will eat those tariffs, but at 145, they basically can't do much business with the United States.

- Cardiff Garcia is here. He's the editorial director of the Economic Innovation Group and the host and co-creator of the New Bizarre Podcast, which it must be exciting times at the New Bizarre Podcast. - Oh, it never ends. - Many a phone call. - Yeah, it's great. - Okay, so where do we stand in this moment? This week, we talked about the idea of like, oh, there's gonna be earnings reports. It's not just the first hundred days, it's the first quarter. And this is when people are supposed to get on their little speaker phones and say,

Here's what's going to happen. And what's been the vibe? Well, typically what happens at these events is that a lot of big companies, the ones that trade on the stock market, will give you guidance for how they're going to do in the coming quarter or the coming year. What I've been struck by is how many of these companies, companies like GM, Delta, UPS, Snap, have essentially said that this time we're not giving you that guidance on how well we're going to do. I can't imagine investors love that. They don't love it. The public doesn't like it. Like you have one job. Yeah, but you know what?

But they've essentially said that if we tell you it won't be reliable and that's not helpful because the economic environment has become so uncertain. And collectively, these companies make up a huge chunk of the economy itself. So that gives you a sense of just how much uncertainty has been unleashed by these tariffs. OK, that's Wall Street. Here's Main Street. A furniture business in Los Angeles. This is their owner talking about the impact of the tariffs so far. We'll have a Christmas in July sale and get rid of some things.

If it's not a going out of business now. When it comes in, we're going to have to write a check for $600,000 to the factory, which is about what we bought, and a million dollar check to customs. I mean, we won't do it. We'll leave the product at the harbor or cancel the order. We've been in business for 70 years. We'll go under if it stays like this.

Not that it was the point, but it does feel like Trump and the Trump administration is trying to engineer an economy where someone like that doesn't have that much product from China on the shelves to begin with.

Yeah, so what's happening now is that there's just a standoff between the two countries. And I think each side is waiting for the other one to blink and so that the de-escalation can start, right? Because in the meantime, it's going to hurt both economies. The thing to know, though, is that China has been preparing for exactly this moment since at least the first Trump term. When there were a bunch of tariffs then on China. Right.

That's essentially when the trade wars really escalated. It was continued in fairness under Joe Biden, and now it's gone to a level that I think people just hadn't anticipated.

China's been getting ready for this. It's been developing a lot of legal tools, economic tactics that it can use to harm specific American industries in response. So, for example, we've seen them stop exporting to the U.S. these rare earths, which are these elements that are necessary to make a lot of goods here in the U.S., a lot of high-tech goods. We've seen them stop buying certain agricultural products as well from the U.S. Let me guess, soy products. That's right. That's exactly right. And more fundamentally, the Chinese political

situation is very different from ours, right? The leadership there is deeply entrenched. So they're betting that they can ride it out longer than the U.S. can. And so in the meantime, there's a standoff and yeah, people in both places are going to get hurt. Also, it's interesting because unlike a smaller country, a Vietnam, right, or Italy or whatever, like people being like, okay, yeah, let's talk, let's talk. Yeah.

We heard that quote, right, about drinking poison. China is talking about the U.S. as a bully that they have to stand up to, which is not like out of the realm of how other countries are seeing this. Yeah, increasingly so. Yeah, so I think that that's like an added element to the negotiation here, or lack thereof.

Well, previously part of the American strategy was precisely to develop deeper relationship with traditional U.S. allies and then essentially confront China that way to try to get it to impose changes on the way that it trades with other places. The problem now is that China sees an opening

And now it's China that's going to traditional U.S. allies and saying, hey, we're a big trading partner of yours, too. And you can see that the U.S. is not reliable. It has imposed tariffs on you guys as well. So now let's us get together and confront the U.S. instead. So how far that will go, I don't know. Right. It really depends on what happens in the next few months. But that is the that is the strategy that they're deploying. Last quick.

- Great question, Treasury Secretary Scott Besson has been out there talking a lot. Is it helping or hurting? 'Cause the message is a little bit patience, you know, we have a plan. Is that actually making a difference? - You know, what's tricky about this is that depending on the day, a different part of the White House will say something completely different to what somebody else has already said. So I think in general, the comments coming out of the White House are adding to the confusion about what the strategy actually is. Is it to raise money from the tariffs

Or is it to use the tariffs to negotiate more trade with other countries and get them to lower their tariffs in exchange for our lowering our tariffs? And when you have a lot of these comments that don't make it clear exactly what the strategy is, it once again adds to the uncertainty that a lot of people in the business community are experiencing. All right, Cardiff, always a pleasure to have you here. Thank you for explaining it. You can catch Cardiff on the new Bizarre podcast.

Alright, we're going to turn to some of your headlines because it's seven minutes to the top of the hour. Here's your morning roundup. Harvard University facing backlash over two new reports about anti-Semitism and anti-Muslim bias on campus. Some students told the university task force assigned to do the review that they felt unsafe and unheard. This is all happening as a legal battle over federal funding continues to play out in court.

The World Health Organization is warning that the risk of catching measles in the U.S. is high as a multi-state outbreak grows. At this point, 781 people in Texas, New Mexico, Oklahoma and possibly Kansas have gotten the measles this year alone. Experts believe the actual number may be higher because many cases go unreported.

And getting ready to fly even higher this summer, the FAA announced that it will soon instruct some commercial planes to go above the usual 35,000 feet. This will mostly affect flights to and from Florida. The FAA says the change in altitude will help increase efficiency and cut down on delays.

Finally, there's a new proposal House Republicans are considering an annual car tax or fee. Basically, every passenger vehicle would have to pay a $20 registration fee and it would actually be higher if you have a hybrid or EV. But there could be some potholes, as we say in the plan. It's already facing backlash from some conservatives who say gas vehicles should be exempt altogether. Not to mention this roadblock, people already complain about having to pay state car fees.

$1,700 for the year. I have $1,700. I don't have $1,700 to pay my car taxes. I have to pay taxes for a car that's already paid off. Okay, so the group chat is back to take this on. This is such an issue that affects so many people. And the social contract has always been like, we're going to build these highways and we're going to take care of things. And the gas tax is going to help with that process.

As that has made less and less money, this is when lawmakers start looking at this idea. Charlie, you and I during the break were having a vigorous debate because I, as a person who does happen to have like a hybrid car, was like, no, I don't want to pay this tax. That's why I have the hybrid car. What's your argument here?

Well, those of us who drive internal combustion engine vehicles, we get to pay for the use of the roads through the gas tax. If you drive an electric vehicle, you do not pay for the use of the roads. But look at the fee, $200 for electric. I understand, but how much do I pay in gas taxes each year? I mean, I think Chairman Sam Graves is on to something. If you buy an electric vehicle, you get a tax credit to do so, but the poor guy who's got a used car that's an internal combustion engine, he gets to pay for the roads not only for himself,

but for the guy driving the EV. So I think there's a fairness question here. Sam Graves, chairman of the committee, is right to have this conversation. We are getting less revenue per vehicle mile driven because of efficiency and the EV. So the government needs money to fund the roads. He may be right to have the conversation. The blowback, though, is also coming from inside the House. So here's Republican Congressman Chip Roy when he heard this. Are you out of your friggin' mind? We're going to, like, the party of limited government is going to go out and say we're going to have a car tax?

That's legal speak. That's legislative language. That is very on brand for Chip Roy, first of all. And second of all, I do think that this is the kind of thing where anytime you're asking citizens to perhaps have to incur more paperwork in addition to paying a fee, there is a real potential for...

- A lot of what you saw on TikTok, those are folks who live in a state like Virginia, for instance, where you have to pay a tax every year on the value of your car. But just adding in a federal component, I imagine that might not-- - Yeah, 'cause it's another annual fee. - Just the politics, as you know.

because of the Republican commitment to not raise taxes, right, as a fundamental core. Fees have always been something that tripped up Republicans, right? Because a lot of Americans see it as a tax, right? And Mitt Romney ran into this in all the fees in Massachusetts when he was running for office, that it goes against the grain of no tax cuts. And Charlie, my question is,

It's part of the issue here because the gas tax has not been raised since 1993. Correct. But what begs the question, though, is we're quibbling over a fee for cars when there's a massive tax increase called tariffs. I mean, that's what the tariffs are going to make this issue harder for Republicans. I mean, this is a fee that people are going to see. You don't think they're going to be able to sell that taxes create revenue, the tariffs are actually a revenue generator? Well,

tariffs are a massive tax increase on consumers. I mean, that's going to be much a bigger hit to people than whether or not we're going to charge $20 or $200 for the electric vehicle. We're going to hear more about this in the coming days, but I love our energy. I also want to talk about what else we're keeping an eye on this week.

Kristen, to you, what are you keeping an eye on? I'm keeping an eye on the situation between India and Pakistan. We started this year knowing that there's conflict in the Middle East, knowing that there's conflict in Ukraine, being concerned about what might China do regarding Taiwan. But I don't know that India and Pakistan was on anybody's the world is scary bingo card.

after the terrible terrorist attack in Kashmir last week. Keep an eye on this. The Pakistani government has said they expect some kind of military action from India. We'll see. Okay, Charlie. I'm expecting the Philadelphia Phillies to get out of the slump that they've been in. They won last night against the Nats. And the other thing I'm watching is the reconciliation process in the house. It is getting warmed up. Those are two wildly different things.

things okay yeah and the boss to you you already touched on it earlier in the program but 8 30 today that gdp number comes out so not only am i watching what that number is but there's going to be fallout in the hours ahead and days ahead economically which again we know issue number one for vote but talk about what you mean by fallout like for the average person we're not like gdp thank

goodness. It's like, what is it that makes it have a ripple effect? That number comes out and if it shows that the economy is growing at such a small rate or perhaps shrinking, that's going to have ramifications on markets, it's going to have ramifications on Main Street, and it's going to have ramifications for Donald Trump standing with the American public. I think maybe in part because there's starting to be this element of like

I don't know, we don't believe you? Like the market is like, we kind of don't believe you. We heard from Cardiff that with the risk assessments or withdrawing guidance, they're not, I don't know, buying the message. - Well, and for political purposes, the actual economic data in some ways is secondary to the public opinion data. I can say that as a pollster, but this is something that the Biden administration complained about

Exactly. And look what happened to them. Okay. Group chat, thank you so much, you guys. We covered a lot of ground today. I want to thank you for waking up with us. I'm Adi Cornish, and CNN News Central starts right now. The biggest festival of the year is here. CNN Underscore Deals Fest. With the ultimate lineup of products and exclusive deals for home, beauty, cooking, and more. CNN Underscore Deals Fest. Shop now at Underscore.com slash Deals Fest.

This week on The Assignment with me, Adi Cornish. This week is the White House Correspondents' Dinner. And needless to say, with the decision to cancel the traditional comedy roast from the program, the vibes are off. What is even funny anymore when it comes to politics? Who gets to decide which comedians are the truth-tellers of the moment? And who's laughing now?

Listen to The Assignment with me, Audie Cornish, streaming now on your favorite podcast app.