We're sunsetting PodQuest on 2025-07-28. Thank you for your support!
Export Podcast Subscriptions
People
R
Rhiannon Needs
Z
Zach Dorfman
Topics
Rhiannon Needs:本集讲述了一位CIA特工在反恐战争中的秘密行动及其最终的悲剧结局。这位特工为国家安全做出了巨大贡献,但同时也付出了沉重代价,其死因至今仍存在争议。他的故事引发了人们对情报工作性质、价值观以及心理健康问题的思考。 Zach Dorfman:我调查了这位代号为Antony Lagunas的CIA特工的故事,他的任务是深入渗透极端组织。这项任务极其危险和艰巨,持续多年,给他的心理健康带来了巨大的压力。尽管他为美国政府提供了重要的战略情报,但他的贡献并未得到充分的认可,甚至在CIA内部也存在争议。一些人认为他的情报价值不高,另一些人则认为他的工作至关重要。他的死因可能是自杀或意外过量服用药物,但根本原因是长期高压任务带来的心理创伤。他的故事也反映了CIA在反恐战争中的战略转变,以及对情报工作价值观的重新审视。 Zach Dorfman:Lagunas的任务是深入渗透极端组织,收集情报。这项任务要求他长期生活在极端环境中,扮演一个极端主义者的角色,这给他带来了巨大的心理压力和道德困境。他需要在维护掩护身份和遵守美国法律之间取得平衡,这让他身心俱疲。同时,他还要承担巨大的安全风险,随时可能暴露身份,面临被捕、酷刑甚至死亡的威胁。尽管他成功地接近了目标,但他的情报主要集中在战略层面,而非战术层面,这与CIA当时关注的重点有所不同,因此他的贡献在CIA内部也存在争议。一些人认为他的情报价值不高,另一些人则认为他的工作至关重要。他的故事也反映了CIA在反恐战争中的战略转变,以及对情报工作价值观的重新审视。

Deep Dive

Key Insights

Why was Antony Lagunas chosen for such a dangerous undercover mission?

Lagunas was selected due to his ability to self-start, handle dangerous situations, and live multiple lives simultaneously. He had a high capacity for compartmentalization and was deemed a perfect fit for the non-official cover (NOC) program, which is far more dangerous than official cover operations.

What challenges did Lagunas face during his undercover mission?

Lagunas had to balance two jobs: his cover as a jihadist and his role as an intelligence officer. The ethical strain of living a double life, the constant threat of exposure, and the psychological toll of maintaining his cover for years took a significant toll on his mental health.

How did the CIA handle Lagunas' mental health issues?

The CIA provided mental health support, including staff psychologists who spoke with Lagunas during his visits to Langley. However, the agency's structure incentivized officers to hide their struggles, as mental health reports could affect promotions and career progression.

Why was Lagunas' intelligence considered valuable despite internal debates?

Lagunas provided strategic intelligence that offered deep insights into extremist groups and their future trends, which was crucial for long-term understanding. However, some within the Counterterrorism Center (CTC) questioned its immediate tactical value compared to operations focused on killing terrorists.

What happened to Lagunas after his undercover mission ended?

Lagunas was assigned to the National Resources Division in Los Angeles, working undercover in the entertainment industry. Despite the less dangerous posting, he struggled to adjust and suffered from a clear psychic hangover from his years of deep cover in Cairo.

How did the CIA ensure Lagunas' safety during his visits to the U.S.?

Lagunas underwent extensive surveillance detection routes and used safe houses to avoid being followed. He switched cars multiple times and entered Langley through a secure underground garage to maintain his cover and avoid exposure to foreign intelligence services or terrorist groups.

What was the significance of Lagunas meeting George W. Bush?

Lagunas' meeting with Bush was a rare and prestigious event, indicating the high value placed on his intelligence. However, it failed to boost his morale, as he was already deeply affected by the psychological strain of his mission.

Why did Lagunas' death in 2016 remain shrouded in mystery?

Lagunas' death in a Malaysian hotel room was initially unclear, with some speculating it was a suicide or an accidental overdose. The CIA's handling of his death and the nature of his work meant that his real identity remained classified, even in death.

What does Lagunas' story reveal about the CIA's priorities post-9/11?

Lagunas' story highlights a shift in the CIA's focus from traditional intelligence gathering to a more militarized approach, emphasizing drone strikes and killing terrorists. His work, focused on understanding extremist groups, was overshadowed by the agency's transformation into a paramilitary organization.

Shownotes Transcript

National security journalist Zach Dorfman returns to True Spies with the tantalising tale of one of the War on Terror's most secretive undercover operatives. Known only by his pseudonym, this CIA spy delivered intel directly to the highest echelons of power - and paid a heavy price for his success.

From SPYSCAPE, the HQ of secrets. A Cup And Nuzzle production. Series producer: Joe Foley. Produced by Joe Foley.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices)