Ed Helms: Benevolent Fan of Flannel
01:00:00 Share

Art in your home can instantly transform your space and bring you joy. Saatchi Art makes it easy for you to discover and buy one-of-a-kind art that you'll love. Whether you're looking to complement your home decor, fill a blank space on your walls, or start an art collection, you can find the perfect piece for your specific style and budget at Saatchi Art. Go to SaatchiArt.com today to bring the beauty of art into your home. Plus, listeners get 15% off their first order of original art with code ROB.

That's 15% off at SaatchiArt.com. S-A-A-T-C-H-I-Art.com. Ever wish your favorite TV show had twice as many episodes? Everyone knows that feeling. And so does Discover. Everyone wants more of their favorites. That's why Discover doubles another favorite thing, cash back. That's right.

Discover automatically doubles the cash back earned on your credit card at the end of your first year with Cash Back Match. Now that's a real crowd pleaser. Everyone knows how it ends. Double the cash back. See terms at discover.com slash credit card. Ed Helms. Hello. I should get paid for this recording, right? Yeah. Because I'm recording on my end. I should get a little. Yeah, I think you should join ASCAP. Hey, everybody. It's me. You know who I am.

You know who I am. You know what I do. Rob Lowe. And this is literally. I'm very excited to have Ed Helms on the show. Been a huge fan of his forever. We have many mutual friends in the sort of Parks and Recreation office universe. And yet, we've never really met. So this is going to be a good talk. I just know it. So stand by.

Edward Helms. Robertson Von Lowe. Edward J. Helms. Not even close. When you started out, did you ever think about putting an initial in to make yourself sound like a more legitimate actor? Because when I came up, every actor, Michael J. Fox, Anthony Michael Hall. Like, if you didn't fill up Seymour Hoffman, like...

I just feel like I'd have three Oscars already if I had a third name. Yeah, you blew it. What would it be? What would your middle initial be? Well, Mike Schur. Oh, God. We're going there already? Already. Mike Schur. By the way, this might have been the greatest or most artful segue to get to Mike Schur ever, but it wasn't. He had Robert Bocephia Slow. Oh, I like it.

But then you'd be Robert Below. You'd be Below. Robert Below. I don't know what Bosephius... Is that a name? Is that an actual name? Bosephius sounds biblical to me. Doesn't it? Yeah, it sounds Old Testament, but I don't know.

I think, first of all, you've got to go with Edward. You've got to get rid of the short Ed. That's so interesting because I was raised Edward. That is my name, and my parents, and all through school, I was Edward. But then I went to summer camp, and the counselors would call me Big Ed. And I don't know. It just felt like it fit me better, and I never quite –

clicked with Ed. I mean, Edward, it just never felt right. I always feel like it's an awkward word to say. Edward, it was like people's mouths get, you can like sprain your tongue. And then Ed just, as soon as I became Ed at summer camp, I was like, Oh, that feels good. That just feels, feels right. And so when I got to college, I

I was just like, hey, everybody, my name's Ed. And I've never looked back. You're the first person that's ever told me I should go back to Ed. Well, only because I maybe just because I ran into Edward Norton this weekend. Oh, sure. And I don't really know. And I've always heard him called, oh, you know who's great in that? Ed Norton. You've seen how great Ed Norton's great in that movie. So I was about to say, hey, Ed. And I heard everybody calling him Edward. He's Edward. Yeah.

He's not Ed Norton. By the way, don't say Ed Norton, clearly. Don't you dare. And like I'm Robert on my birth certificate, but Robert's an interesting one because Bobby, I could be Bobby. Bobby Lowe. You don't want to be Bob Lowe. That's not good. I don't even know why. It's just Bob Lowe. Bob Lowe. Yeah, you don't want to be Bob Lowe. Bob Lowe. This is why people tune into this podcast. They want serious, hard-hitting stories.

Do you know what I mean? This kind of conversation changed the world, I think. We're not going to veer off of this. We are staying on nomenclature analysis. It's another 40 minutes of this. But speaking of names, I have wonderful producers who put together info on my guests and

Your nickname as a kid is my favorite. It just looks really good in print. I'm reading it right now. It says, there are all these bullet points about you. Born in Atlanta. He had open-heart surgery at 13. Very interesting. Then his nickname as a kid was Chuck E. Cheese. He said he had very large teeth that took him a long time to grow into. It might be my favorite sentence ever written. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. No, I had the gift of

of some giant choppers from day one. Did you get them sawed off? Because I have a friend who had a kid

It was like that great thing in This is 40 where she calls a kid Tom Petty because of the teeth. Yeah. So Zach Galifianakis makes fun of me endlessly for the size of my teeth. Like we'll be walking past a construction site and there's like a giant piece of sheet rock. And he's like, Ed, you lost a tooth. So stupid. Yeah.

But I mean, I do think they fit my face at this point. Like they're not they're not like egregiously large. But when I was a kid, they did feel that they were kind of large. And I think the older, you know, the seniors on the on the I was on the swim team in high school and and college. And but the seniors in in.

when I was a freshman, nicknamed all the freshmen. Chuck E. Cheese is really great. It's not nice. You know, they're like, yo, Chuck E. Cheese, grab me a towel, would you? Like hazing you as a rookie swimmer. Exactly. What was your nickname? Well, I never really, somehow I escaped having a nickname. I think it's because I moved during really specific times as a kid. Like I moved once in the second grade

And then I moved another time in the fifth grade. And so like those are the. We're talking big moves, different cities. Like those are the times where like people were coming up with nicknames, I think. So the only person who ever gave me a nickname worth a shit was Amy Poehler. And Amy Poehler hit me with Rolo.

Rolo. I like that. That works for you. And she was like, yeah, Rob Lowe. And she's like, how has no one ever called you Rolo? And I go, I don't know. So that that has stuck. Yeah. And that's nice, too, because, you know, most of the time I think nicknames are given to you by people that are trying to ridicule you in some way. For example, Chuck E. Cheese. Yes. And and and I remember complaining about it at the time. And all the seniors are like, shut up. You're not supposed to like your nickname, idiot. Right.

And so, you know, it just sort of that's the rule like you're not supposed to like. But when somebody that you adore, like Amy Poehler, gives you a nickname, that's like that feels good. That's like a good. It's like when a relative or someone you it's like endows you with. Yeah, it's like a rite of passage. It's like, man, Amy Poehler gave me a nickname.

Yeah. I was super happy about that. It's a good one, too. Rolo. Rolo. It's a good one. So you're doing a new podcast. Yeah. It's called Snafu. The theory is each, not each segment, it's each series of the podcast is about a different snafu. Yeah. So Snafu is the name of the podcast. Season one is actually, all of season one is a deep dive into Able Archer 83. Now, Able Archer

What that is, it's a funny name, but Able Archer is a military exercise that NATO used to do during the Cold War every year. And in 1983, that NATO exercise was misinterpreted by the Russians as a or by the Soviet Union, rather, as a.

build up to a possible nuclear strike from the United States or from the West. And so, so the, so the Soviets went on high alert and, and it, and it became this incredibly tense moment that where people thought maybe missiles were getting launched and there were weird kind of like misinterpreted radar signals and this and that. And it just, it's a moment where, um,

The world almost ended. Like nuclear winter almost happened. And we don't know. No one knows about it. It was very much. It was very hush hush. And it was it was only declassified a few years ago. I was going to ask how you heard about it. Well, I don't know. It just came up in honestly, in this context of like we have an idea for a podcast. And I was just talking with

some creative partners. And this, this sounds cool. And I just got obsessed. This is one of my also favorite things in, in the, um, in the research about you and the podcast is my favorite sentence. I mean, this is, this is the cold war you've got. Um, who would it have been? And that Brezhnev, I think would have been the, the Russian counterpart Reagan, right? And yeah. And Reagan and drop off and drop off. I mean, all these amazing people. And this is what I get here. Interviewed guests, including Matthew Broderick.

I'm like, damn. Well, you got to know why I spoke to Matthew Broad. It makes me laugh. No, but do you know why? He was very relevant to this. It has something to do. It has to have to do with war games, right? The movie. Of course it is. War games came out in 1983. And the movie war games for, for your listeners who may not know, uh, is about, um, a computer that tries to start a nuclear war, uh,

And the humans have to like intervene. And and it almost it's it's an almost nuclear war by accident. And then later that same year in November of that year, that actually happened. And so I had a really fun chat with Matthew just about the movie, which I was obsessed with as a kid, scared the hell out of me. I had like a lot of nuclear paranoia in the 80s. And he just had such fun.

memories and insights, but he didn't know about this event. Wow. Which is crazy because his movie was kind of like a punk rock prophecy of what actually happened. It's like when Jane Fonda and Jack Lemmon made The China Syndrome and about a nuclear meltdown and the weekend it opened, Three Mile Island happened. Whoa. That's a good snafu. I'd say.

I have a snafu I'm obsessed with. Can I pitch an idea? Yeah, please. The Halifax explosion. Halifax, Nova Scotia? Yep. Are you aware of the Halifax explosion? The only major news item that I know that came out of Halifax, Nova Scotia was when the cast and crew of Titanic was all dosed with angel dust.

Yes, that was a that's a good snafu. It was a my friend Bill Paxton was in that movie and he is. Oh, God, we fired this local woman who is the craft service woman. And she was just awful. And then, God, she showed up two weeks later in the craft service. And, God, she put some stuff in there in the crab bisque and we all ate it.

Did he get like a lot of people were hospitalized. He tells us he told a great story about he and Jim Cameron sitting on a dock just tripping balls and watching the sun come. They all got. Yeah. And then they but but in the public.

retelling of it. It was like a few crew members. Everybody, everybody got popped. Yeah. Oh my gosh. That's so, so nuts. They had a mind explosion. They had a psyche explosion. I'm talking about a physical, the Halifax explosion. I've been fascinated with it. So it's the, up until Hiroshima, it was the largest blast in the history of the world. What year are we talking? I want to say 19, it was World War II.

In the lead up to World War II. And I always do a bit about how polite Canadians are, you know, and how unassuming they are that they caused the Halifax explosion. Because the setup is a munitions. It was all repressed rage. It was all following orders. Oh, yeah. Doing the right thing. Being super nice. Like the hallmarks of why we love Canadians. And so there's a munitionship.

First of all, Halifax Harbor is the second biggest harbor in the world. It's huge. Giant. It's going to be a head-on collision between two boats. It's the biggest harbor in the world, head-on collision. A munitions ship loaded with dynamite and artillery shells, and it's headed to the front in World War II. And another ship full of lighters, cigarette lighters. Yeah, just 100 people smoking. And they have a head-on collision. I was like, how the fuck—

Could that happen in the biggest harbor in the world where literally the newspaper was like, munitions ship coming any day now. Everybody knew the munitions ship was coming. They figured out a way to hit each other in the biggest harbor in the world. And it blew the seawater out of the bed. It killed about, I think, almost 3,000 people. What? Oh, my God. It seared people's eyeballs to the extent that optometrists—

had to come to Halifax. And that's why Halifax is the, was the leading, um, you know, eye doctor or whatever the hell going forward, um, in history. Um,

Yeah, it's really insane. It's an insane, insane. But my thing was always like the captain of the of the of the munitions boat going, well, we're almost here. We made it across the Atlantic. It's world's biggest harbor. I think you guys got it. I'm going to go hit some shut eye if anything happens, you know, like wake me up. But if it's an emergency, here comes a boat in the front. Hey, that boat's coming at us. Yeah. Looks like it might hit us. No, I don't really know. Should we turn? Well, what if we turn and then it turns?

Then we'd really hit. Oh, no. We'll just stay like this. And it just becomes that thing. It's one of those. It's like when you're about to bump into a stranger on the sidewalk and you both kind of jog the same way. You're like, which way are you going? I don't know. Yep. And then boom.

Wow, that's intense. It's insane. And no, very few people know about it. Okay. All right. I'm, I'm, this is a contender for season two of snafu. What does snafu mean? Is that a military term? It's an acronym. It's a classic military acronym. It means situation, normal, all fucked up. Like it's normal that everything's fucked up. It sounds like something Tom Hanks would say in real life. Yeah.

And a real snafu, guys. And a real snafu today with Bob Zemeckis when we were talking about taking a meal penalty at lunch.

All set for your flight? Yep. I've got everything I need. Eye mask, neck pillow, T-Mobile, headphones. Wait, T-Mobile? You bet. Free in-flight Wi-Fi. 15% off all Hilton brands. I'll never go anywhere without T-Mobile. Same goes for my water bottle, chewing gum, nail clippers. Okay, I'm going to leave you to it. Find out how you can experience travel better at T-Mobile.com slash travel. ♪

Qualifying plan required. Wi-Fi were available on select U.S. airlines. Deposit and Hilton Honors membership required for 15% discount terms and conditions apply. Come on, jump. I don't know if I'll make it. Hurry. The floor is lava.

Oops. Hey, life happens, which is why your favorite styles from Ashley are available in life-resistant, high-performance fabric with removable, machine-washable fabric slipcovers that make it easy to clean spills, dirt, and imaginary lava. For more mess and less stress, shop Ashley's high-performance furniture in-store or online at ashley.com. Ashley, for the love of home. ♪

When you wrote your famous song for The Hangover, Stu's song? Yeah, I think the official title is Stu's Song. Did you have any idea that it would be as belittled as it is? Absolutely not. Because we had no idea that anyone was going to see the movie, right? Like, it just was... Amazing. We were...

Nobody in the movie at the time was particularly famous. I mean, we'd all done some stuff. So we were making this movie. We were having a blast making it and thinking like, God, I hope this works. I hope people go and see it. And then the song actually came up on that day, which was Todd Phillips, the director, saying, I think we need like a transition, like some kind of breath in the movie, in this moment.

you guys have just drugged, you're waiting for the drugs to kick in on the tiger. Uh, and I, and at the time, so, so we'd been shooting on this set with a big grand piano and I had been, I just always sat down at the piano and would plink around and make up songs about different crew members, you know, like just making fun of people and trying to make people laugh or just, you know, cause you're, you're just killing so much time on a set. And, um,

And so Todd was like, do one of those songs. Like, let's do one of those songs about the moment. And I was like, well, what is it? And he's like, I don't know. It's like, what would tigers dream of? And so that was the – that sort of kicked us off. And I went over to – there was another – there's the chapel set where we did all the photos that you don't see until the next day of Stu's wedding. Yeah.

Right. And so so that set had a little piano in it. And I went over there and kind of worked on it for I mean, I probably spent 20 minutes on it. It's like amazing. Just but that's part of I think when you're in a creative space and you're all and everyone's just like kind of firing and you're having fun and it's and you're like, oh, this could be great. OK, what's a tiger's dream of when they take a little tiger snooze?

Do they dream of Halle Berry? And you just kind of like come up with dumb stuff and you're like, the dumber the better. Okay, just go with it. And then we just went back. We went right back on set and shot it right away. And I think at one point Todd's like, we need a chicken on the piano. Put a chicken on the piano. So...

I love Todd Phillips's ideas. Yeah. It sounded amazing. Lots of makes him great. He's a great director. Look at what he's done. The, the Joker and, and now this, the Joker. Yeah. Spectacular. Um, did I jump all around? I have no reason. Um,

You were still on The Office when James Spader came in, weren't you? Yeah. Are you guys buddies? Well, we did a movie years ago called Bad Influence. I love that movie, by the way. I love that movie. Oh, thank you. Yes. That movie is so, so wild. It was very ahead of its time, and it really stands up. If you haven't seen Bad Influence and you've got two hours to kill, I highly recommend it. You know what's crazy about that movie is that James Spader is the good guy.

Yeah. Right. Like the normal one. He's the normal guy. You're the you're the psycho. I was originally supposed to play the normal guy. And I was signed to do the normal guy. And we were in production and we were trying to figure out who to play the psycho. And we I never forget. We saw a rough cut of sexualized videotape. Rough cut.

And we're like, holy fuck, this movie is unbelievable. And we thought about, let's get Spader. And then I'll never forget David Koepp, another amazing writer, went on to write Jurassic Park. Carlitos Way, an amazing writer, now director, took me to lunch and said, would you ever consider switching parts and playing the bad guy? And I was like,

Sure. You're great in that role. It's like it's the perfect your charisma just works because you sort of suck him in to your evil orbit. It's such a fun movie. I love that movie. I haven't seen it in probably 15 years, but I remember it was.

Like War Games, it was a movie that was just like basically on a loop on HBO when I was a kid. And I just I know that's great. I've watched so much of it. So, yeah, James, lots of we work together quite a lot on The Office. He I mean, his, you know, that famous speech that's everywhere. I'm the fucking lizard, you know, is that.

is so he I loved him on that show I thought it was the weirdest casting choice I'd ever heard of and and that's kind of what worked but what what was your experience like I mean you know you know you know Steve's gone and it's Spader like if you had a list of people

to come in, I would never have picked Spader. No way. It's kind of bizarre and wonderful. And a lot of people think it was great. A lot of people like didn't think like, it was just a really interesting moment in the, in the arc of that show. I thought, I mean, for me, it was just like, Oh wow, here's a Hollywood icon coming in to dropping in on our set, you know? And I just, I relished those opportunities to just hang out with, with people that have, um,

so many war stories and they've just been through so much. And, and, and as a performer, like there's no one more committed than James Spader. He's so dialed every take and he shows up completely off book every day for, for the whole day. Like he can, you can dip into any scene that you're shooting that day and he's off book. He's, he's done the homework. And on a sitcom, I,

Even the best actors are not doing that. Like...

Very like you're learning your lines between the scenes and great, great actors are doing a great job of that there. You're still walking onto set off book, but, but nobody's doing it the night before. It's just too much. There's too much material, right? But it's not too much for James Spader. Like he's in it and he's so committed. And I think he never, I think he didn't even use email. So he's like somebody, some PA was like delivering hard copies, scripts to his house and,

And then he's just going through the scripts and memorizing them. And we would do now there's this this funny thing that I'm sure you guys did on Parks and Rec where or or just in any number of productions. It's very common for a rehearsal to you start rehearsing a scene and then a director might say, all right, let's just let's just start rolling on a rehearsal.

Right. Let's shoot the rehearsal because we might get something. We might get some little surprise moment or whatever. James was always like, no, can't shoot the rehearsal. Put the cameras down. We're not shooting the rehearsal. And I was like, I was like, James. So just out of curiosity, why? Why does that not sit well with you? Why? Why? Why is it not OK to shoot the rehearsal? And he goes, because they'll use it.

And I was like, well, so what? Maybe there's something great. He goes, no, I'm not ready. That's why I'm rehearsing. I'm not ready. That's why I'm rehearsing. And, you know, he's so intense. And I actually had like for some reason, like he and I kind of cracked each other up. So like I had a really easy rapport with him. But yeah.

But I think he, like, really instilled some tension and fear on the set. Freak people out. Yeah. But I could ask him stuff like that. Like, what's up? Like, what's your deal? And he said it was so funny. He's like, look, they'll use it. And I don't want them to. So I'm not going to give it to them. Is it a stretch to say that he's our generation's Christopher Walken? Ooh.

I don't know that that's a stretch. I think that's... Name someone else. Which is a huge, huge compliment. And I've worked with Christopher Walken, too. Love that man. Love him. He is... Wow. All right, give me a Walken story. We'll swap Walken stories. Well, you know, he's so hard to read. Like, he just is so... Oh, yes. He's, like, such a stoic guy. And there was this...

There was this – so we did this movie called – Owen Wilson and I did a movie called Father Figures, which nobody saw. But I still – I actually really adore the movie and I think it's really sweet. And in the end – and Chris Walken plays this guy. The story is Owen and me looking for our father. We find out that our mother doesn't know anything.

who our father is basically right and so we kind of go on this road trip as adults um or that we've been lied to that our father really wasn't our father so we go on this road trip to find out who it is christopher walken's at the very end of the movie as this kind of like it's got to be him right and we have this really funny crazy climactic scene with him um anyway he so we

He comes to Atlanta where we're shooting. We're already well into production, I think. And it's like, okay, we got to go out to dinner with Chris because –

Because he's just getting here. We got to warm, just kind of like get to know him a little bit, warm him up a little bit. And it'll be good for all of us to get to know him. And Owen's like, I don't know. I'm kind of intimidated. Yeah, exactly. And I'm like, me too. But let's do it. So we go out with the director, Larry, Larry Scher, the brilliant Larry Scher, who was actually the DP on all the Hangovers and the Joker. Won an Oscar for the Joker, actually. Jesus Christ.

And he's just an awesome dude. And so we're all out to dinner at this steakhouse in Atlanta. And...

And it's kind of fun, but it's a little stiff. Like everybody's just kind of trying to be chatty. And at one point I go, by the way, Chris, thank you so much for picking up the tab tonight. Like this is really unexpected. I didn't know. I didn't know. Like I figured production would pay for it, but I, you know, I heard. And I get this like, he locks onto me with this like kind of cold stare. And Owen kind of looks at me like,

Buddy, that you took it too far. Like, you can't just throw a joke down like that. We don't have we don't have the chemistry yet. Right. And then he and then he he like just cracks the the little crinkle of a smile and that twinkle that that like Christopher Walken twinkle in his eye when you know that like.

He's in on it. And he, uh, and he, he chucked just the slightest little vibration of a chuckle and, uh, and we were in, and then we just, there was something about it. Uh, and Owen was still like, I can't believe you did that. Why would you? And it wasn't like a daring joke, but it's still, it was like in the moment, it was like a tense thing, but guys like that, like Spader and Walken, I mean, there, there's something about them that's,

their reputation precedes them and it's not even really who they are, which makes me laugh. Isn't that wild? So do you remember, are you familiar with this play Love Letters? I don't know. It's kind of a, it's kind of a hacky, but also really shamelessly moving play that was like very happening in the,

late 80s and into the 90s and it toured and the vibe was two iconic men and women sometimes the casting would be you wouldn't consider them to be together was the whole point would do it for a weekend and the cast rotated so you'd get like Burt Reynolds and Sally Field doing love letters or Ricardo Montalban and you know Dawn whatever and the play is a series of love letters and

starting when two 16-year-olds meet to their deaths in their 80s. And it's the story of their love. It's actually, as I'm describing it now, I'm giving it a hard time. It's super sweet and super great. So I see Chris Walken is going to do Love Letters with Diane Ladd, Laura Dern's mom, I believe. And I'm thinking, now, that is definitely the indie Sundance version of Love Letters.

I go and Chris is doing is, you know, he has torn the grammar out of it and he's doing, so tell me all it's just, it's mental. Yeah. And afterwards I go, so Chris, this is so cool. So explain to me how you do it. You come in, you're doing it for two weekends. You get the material. Like, do you get, how many run-throughs do you do? And like, was there a long rehearsal period? Oh, there's no rehearsal. I go, that makes sense. He goes, I hadn't read it.

I said, what do you mean? He goes, no, I read it tonight. I go, when? Well, during the performance. I said, wait, wait, wait. You're telling me you'd never read it until the performance? The letters, I wouldn't have read them. That's, I mean, the man's a genius. And here's the thing, too. When you speak in a cadence like that with lots of pauses, you can get away with so much because...

you have time to like make adjustments or like get something or make a choice and change or change gear. And like, everyone's like, Oh, it's just one of the trademark pauses that he's doing. That is amazing. You know, um, a Christopher Walken adjacent story is that, uh, Bradley Cooper does a phenomenal Christopher Walken, Bradley Cooper's accent and impression work in general, uh,

Jim Carrey level like there's he made the choice to be the brilliant you know actor that he is he could have also gone in the in the in the physical comedy direction and just and nailed it just as hard and Krasinski is the same way John Krasinski really yeah phenomenal we used to do on the office set the

The movie that John and I both loved more than it seemed like anybody else that we knew was Ace Ventura 2, When Nature Calls, which to me is far superior than the original. And we would just do scenes from the movie. And I felt like I was just trying to keep up with him. Like he's so, so funny. The physicality, it's...

Yeah, he's a special actor. And it's funny, those guys both, they both became such great directors. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you're right. I'm super excited to see Bradley as Leonard Bernstein. Me too. Wow. I cannot wait for that. He's, I just love him. I think he's so good at everything and a great guy and cares about his hair even more than I do, which I really, really respect. Of course. I mean, I think, you know, I think people who are

Both, you know, auteurs and narcissists are fantastic people. You're not a narcissist, Rob Lowe. I had this discussion about narcissists on the set of Parks and Rec one day. And Rashida Jones says, no, no, no, you're a benevolent narcissist. Oh, interesting. What does that mean? And she said, like my father. You're like, yeah, good, great. And so I'm like, anytime I'm compared to Quincy Jones, I'm good. You like to pull the focus on you with the stories and the.

Yeah, I think. Yeah. I mean, benevolence, a great word, isn't it? It's a generational thing. We all had a narcissistic parent, right? Oh, wasn't it? I don't know. I think the boomers, we all I think all generations suffer from. Well, everybody, we're humans. We were flawed. So but I think every generation has their thing. And I do think.

And by the way, it turns out I'm the last year of being a boomer, born in 64. Oh, you're a boomer. Yeah. Born in 64. I'm the last year, which is weird because I'm basically in the same age as Bill Clinton, who's like. Yeah, that is weird. But the boomers are narcissists. They were sons and daughters of the greatest generation were narcissists. I'd love to see the sort of psychological math on that, like how that how that works. Why? Why those the greatest generation narcissists?

Would raise narcissists or how that works. I'm generation X. So what am I? Okay. So Gen X are. We're benevolent something, right? I hope. Yeah. Benevolent version of whatever the Gen X foible is. It has to. And there has to be one. I don't know. We're pretty great, Rob. Gen X is pretty great. Come on, Nirvana. You're a benevolent fan of flannel.

Yep. Mm hmm. When I think of Gen X grunge, I go right to that. That ruined rock and roll for me. You didn't like that stuff to look like you're on the couch watching football is for me not an option. I would just counter like, what if that is dressing like a.

he means it like Kurt Cobain. Like what if that's, what if that's like a, it's a, it's a choice and he's going hard at it and he doesn't mix it up. It's not capricious. Like he's not wearing something else another time. Like he's going hard on this look. See, I connected to it because it was like, this guy is in some real existential angst. He's in that, like he woke up on the couch. It kind of doesn't give a fuck. He,

He's got some rage. There's and those songs like. No, they're great. There's no getting around it. Yeah. Never mind. I mean, it just like it totally just talks to your right to your soul. It skips your brain, skips your ears, just goes right to your soul. And the greatest album cover ever. The baby in the pool swinging towards the dollar bill on a hook.

Who later tried that? Apparently that guy tried to sue them or something. The baby grew up to sue them. Yeah. It's a wild story. So insane. I hear a rumor that Rutherford Falls with Mr. Mike Schur is being looked at to possibly do a third season somewhere. Or is that ship sailed?

That ship has sunk. It's sunk. Not only did it sail, it sunk. It sailed for two seasons over the high seas with great gusto. And we were all just the most sort of...

seafaring folks on that ship. And then and then it just got torpedoed like very. Yeah, it got hit by a missile. I had Mike on the show. He's one of my first guests. And it was. Well, I remember he he said we were working on like we were working on Rutherford Falls when he said, I am going to do Rob's podcast. And I was like, Rob Lowe has a podcast. Oh, wow. That's awesome. It

I remember that because it was the week – I feel like it was like the week COVID hit. Is that possible? It is possible. I think, yeah, because we were about – gosh, we were probably a week or two away from starting production when COVID hit. That's right. On season one. Yep. And then everything shut down and –

We were one of the first productions back up during COVID. And we shot two full seasons during COVID. And I'm insanely proud of that show. I'm really glad you brought it up because I am so proud of it. I love what it is. I love all of the people. You know how sometimes you've worked on so many things, shows, movies. Sometimes...

There's just this like abstract gel that happens in certain productions. And it's just it's the right combination of people. It's the right combination of material. It's the right amount of inspiration that everybody's feeling and mutual sort of respect and fun and playfulness and intensity and all these things that just sort of like

Somehow on certain projects, they just all calibrate perfectly. And I would describe the hangover that way. I would describe the office that way. And I would describe Rutherford Falls that way. All of those projects were profoundly meaningful projects to work on because of...

people and the process. And ultimately, the product is also wonderful. But from an experiential place of making these things, Rutherford Falls was deeply special. And you can still see it on Peacock. That's the great thing. Yep. Oh, it's still up. I love that. That's one of the great things about streaming. I have a show for me called The Grinder that I did. Yeah. And I feel the same way. I feel like

To me, it's every bit as viable as Parks and Recreation, but we had one season and it was gone. It was done. But you can watch it on Tubi. It's still around. And I love that because not everything that we love or that we're proud of or that we think is some of our best work lives for whatever reason. But it does live now.

in in streaming and that's so cool so people it's findable it's findable it's kind of hard to find sometimes but i promise you there are people listening to this who love you and in the big stuff that everybody knows that maybe didn't get to see um the show and they'll be like oh i'm gonna by the speaking of which we just quickly have to talk about chappaquiddick i love chappaquiddick oh thank you loved it too loved it very proud of that one really really good um

And I think maybe the big teeth helped. I'm just saying. I think a Kennedy cousin. Yeah, of course. Yeah. Joe Gargan. They've got those teeth going. Yeah. Oh, I had to work so hard on it. And I did a very mild version of that accent. But man, that for me was tricky. And I've always thought I was like, I guess kind of pretty good at accents. But that one, for some reason...

The Brahmin. That's called the Boston Brahmin accent, which is very rare. It's unusual and very distinct. I played JFK as well. And it's one of those accents where you're like, you could so easily end up looking like a Simpsons character. Uh-huh. Yeah, of course. And yet. Yeah, Mayor Quimby. Mayor Quimby. But it's like everybody knows they spoke that way. So you got to speak. You can't not do it.

Yeah, exactly. So it's, it's, I, I so relate to the good news is there's so much with, again, with the internet now and YouTube, there's so much archival stuff that you didn't know existed. Like there are these great phone calls of Kennedy on the telephone. Oh yeah. They're amazing. And, and Bobby's Kennedy's, uh, speeches. Um, I think I, I, I kind of understood intellectually why,

the role of the Kennedys in at that time kind of it and, and what a force of nature they were in, in historical context. But when I made, when I worked on that movie, I really kind of went deep on the Kennedys and, and you know, their father, Joseph Kennedy was a psychopath basically. Yeah.

And they're a deeply flawed, complicated family. But oh, my God, could they say some inspiring shit? Like they could tap into some really, really meaningful things.

and stirring emotional expression. And, and Bobby Kennedy gave a speech on the flatbed of a truck the night that, um, Martin Luther King was killed. Martin Luther King was assassinated. Was it in Indianapolis? I was going to say St. Louis. I think you're right. And, um, and I listened to that speech and I was like, you know, I just was compiling all this stuff, like just to kind of have the voices playing in my head. Um,

But I wound up getting so wrapped up in the content of these speeches. And like you said, those Kennedy, those those JFK phone calls and there was there was some just amazing shit going on. That speech from Bobby Kennedy was transcendent because it's off the cuff.

Exactly. They were great writers and they had great speech writers, Ted Sorensen and all the amazing writers. Sorensen also is a character in the movie. That's right. By the way. Yeah. And he's fast. That guy is fascinating. Yeah. I mean, there's so much. It's just such a rich character.

I mean, talk about a great, you know, rogues gallery of classics. But that speech was just that's, you know, that it's not just a speechwriter when it's off the cuff like that. They didn't want him to go there. They thought there were going to be riots. They thought he might be, you know, hurt. You know, we're going to go and we're going to talk. And the thing that I'm always blown away about that speech is when you hear the recording is it's clear a lot of people in the audience didn't know that Dr. King had been shot.

And you can hear the gasp when he talks about it. That's a powerful guy. That's amazing. Yeah, there was no Twitter back then. No Twitter. News traveled slowly. I always go to visit their grave sites when I have the time in D.C. Arlington is an amazing place in general, but to go to see the brothers is pretty spectacular, particularly Bobby's grave.

gravesite is, is amazing because JFK has the eternal flame, which is amazing, obviously. And Bobby has a simple white cross. That's it. So it's like the juxtaposition of that next to his brother, the, the burning flame. Yeah. And he's just the simple cross super. And then of course there are, um, there, he has some quotes of his like three or four great quotes, uh,

emblazoned on this little like retaining wall across from it. They're just spectacular. So if you ever, if you're around, you should definitely check that at Arlington. I'll do that. Yeah. They're, they're a complicated family and it's not all pretty, but, um, but man, I do find a lot of their, the big picture stuff, incredible and inspiring. Yeah, for sure. Yeah.

All set for your flight? Yep. I've got everything I need. Eye mask, neck pillow, T-Mobile, headphones. Wait, T-Mobile? You bet. Free in-flight Wi-Fi. 15% off all Hilton brands. I never go anywhere without T-Mobile. Same goes for my water bottle, chewing gum, nail clippers. Okay, I'm going to leave you to it. Find out how you can experience travel better at T-Mobile.com slash travel. ♪

Qualifying plan required. Wi-Fi were available on select U.S. airlines. Deposit and Hilton honors membership required for 15% discount terms and conditions apply. Have we missed anything? No, that's... I think we've covered every aspect of my life. I mean... The only thing I want to ask you about is your experience making The Outsiders because that was such a formative movie for me as a kid. And...

And if that was a good experience about like, I know nothing about it, but I, I just, uh, well, I have two thoughts. One is, and this is not to promote my own book, but if you ever get a chance, I have heard your book is insanely good and I can't wait to read it, but I haven't yet. Cause there's a whole big chapter on the outsiders. It's, it's a blow by blow of what, what it was like. Um, but it was, for me, it was like, um,

because I didn't go to college because that was my college. Like literally that would have been when I was a freshman. And so my fraternity was that group of actors. Those are my frat brothers. Yeah.

So whenever I see any of them, it's like if you ever had a frat brother or a sorority sister. Yeah. That's what it's like. You're immediately back there. You know them in a way that no one else will ever know them. So when I see Tom Cruise, you know, I know Tom in a way that nobody else in the world does, you know, and we go right back to to where to where we were. And and it was it was it was magical. It was it was super, super magical. We knew what what.

The audition process, which I go into in excruciating detail because it was excruciating. It was excruciating. I mean, everybody in the planet auditioned for those parts. Everybody. And you did it in front of each other. Francis had us. It was just a cattle call. And he would say, OK, you sit down and you get up and he'd mix and match and you have to watch, you know.

Dennis Quaid with Mickey Rourke with Scott Baio with fucking just madness and you know it was like may the best man win so we knew that we'd really accomplish something but we had no idea whether the movie would I never thought that it would remain what it

What it is, which, you know, every a lot of seventh grades across the country have to watch The Outsiders as part of the curriculum because they. Oh, wow. They read S.E. Hinton, which is and then they watch the movie and just, you know, selfishly as an actor every year. That's a new group of seventh graders who, you know, they weren't around for the West Wing.

They weren't around for Tommy Boy, and they certainly weren't around for Youngblood. So that's cool. Yeah, that's awesome. I mean, it was just, again, that was something that was just on HBO, and it really moved me as a little kid. Like, I think, what year did it come out? 83. Yeah. So it was probably on HBO in 84 or 5, and I would have been 10. And that was, yeah, it was intense. Yeah.

You'd have made a good greaser. You think? You don't want to be a Soch. I remember my terror. I had a feeling I was going to get cast because I kept getting called back and called back and sent to New York and mixed and matched. And I kept surviving in different iterations. And it was clear it was going to be Soda Pop, which is the role not only I wanted, everybody wanted. Because before Francis cut the movie down, Soda Pop was a huge part. In fact, if you

Now, thankfully, everybody watches what's called The Outsiders, the complete novel. That's as opposed to the movie, the version that came out in 83. But my worry was I was clearly going to get Soda Pop or Randy the Soch. And Randy the Soch is a great one scene, but that's it. And I was like, oh, please don't let it be Randy. Is that Swayze? Randy the Soch is an actor named Darren Dalton.

Okay. And he's the one who befriends Ponyboy and they have a kind of like, we're not as different as we seem. And they have a bonding and they say, by the way, tomorrow at school, don't look at me. Yeah. It's a very sad, good moment. But I was happy when it wasn't Randy. Nobody wants to be a Soch in The Outsiders. I'm just thinking I would have been typecast as a Soch. I would have wanted to be a greaser, but. He wanted to start a, what is it, a rivalry between us on the set?

So he gave the Socs, Diane Lane and Darren, more per diem, better script binders. Oh, God. I hate that shit, honestly. And put them on a different floor with better living arrangements, and it didn't make one fucking bit of difference. Everyone still wanted to be a greaser. Please. Get out of here, Francis, with that bullshit. I hate... That's the one thing that I hate is when directors try to manipulate...

Instead of just saying like, here's what I want. Oh, because isn't that the worst? I just feel so insulted. Like, come on, I can act what you want. Don't don't try to like make me angry in real life just so you can get like.

Like, I'll give you a better performance if I know what the fuck is going on. I just have one more thing, which is I have to tell you my Francis Ford Coppola audition story. Oh! Because I have... But it barely counts because it's kind of not an audition. This is amazing. So in... What was it? Ninth? This would have been my...

junior year in college. I went to college in Ohio, but I spent a semester at NYU film school as a visit. Like they had this visiting student program. And while I was there,

my buddy Mark and I, Mark Webb, who went on to direct, uh, Spider-Man and all this other great stuff. Um, we were, uh, we were just buddies in this visiting student program at the time. And, uh, and we were, we all, we were, we were wanting to be filmmakers, but we also wanted to be actors. And so we were going on auditions all over the city and just, just whatever we saw on backstage, we just show up at, at open calls and, and, uh,

There was an announcement that Francis Ford Coppola was casting on the road. Jack Kerouac's on the road. And he had an open call and it was in a church basement somewhere in Midtown, like some big church. And it was February, I think. It was so fucking cold. And there was like a foot of snow on the ground, you know, New York City snow, which is just gray sludge. Yeah. And gross snow.

And so but and to do the audition, you had to record yourself reading any bit of Jack Kerouac writing. Could have been a poem, could have been, you know, an excerpt from a novel, whatever. And you record that on a cassette tape, get your headshot, but put all that in an envelope.

And bring it to this open call. So I had my aunt take some pictures of me. I didn't have any headshots. But at the time, I was weirdly into this kind of beatnik look.

Just randomly. Cause I had these big lamb chop. I was a junior in college, just trying to try it on different identities, whatever, trying to find myself. I had these big lamb chop sideburns and these little round spectacles and really long moppy hair, like messy moppy hair. And I walked around in a dark, uh,

in a wool peacoat all the time. Just like this, you know, yeah. Uh, as you do, I don't know, like, yeah, like just romantic New York literature dork. Yeah. And, uh, and so I was like, I'm a, I'm a shoe in for this. Like I look the part. And so we go to this audition, it's five degrees out. The line is wrapped all the way around a city block. And, uh,

Every actor within the tri-state area is trying to, you know, get in front of this casting session. And we have no idea what's going on in the church. We get in line. It's the longest wait and it's freezing cold.

It's kind of fun though. Everybody's kind of bonding because it's such a terrible day. Right. Sometimes someone would come and try to cut in line and everyone – at a certain point, you know everyone around you and you're like, get out of here. We haven't seen you yet. And they're like, oh, OK. And then finally we get all the way around and –

And by the way, someone like a PA or somebody was bringing out trays of chicken noodle soup. Aw. That's a classy move. It is. That is a classy move. And so we had some chicken noodle soup to keep us warm. We finally get to the church door and it's kind of down into the basement. And we walk in and there's just a row of tables with like maybe five tables with somebody sitting behind each one.

And literally and Francis Ford Coppola is pacing behind them. And literally all you do is you walk up and you hand your envelope to someone who puts it in a basket and then you keep moving. And that's it. It was like a delivery system. It was just a way to like deliver headshots. But and there's a huge but here.

I'm walking in with my envelope. Francis Ford Coppola comes out from behind the tables, shakes my hand and says, thanks so much for coming. And and I.

And I was just like, oh, my God. What? Oh, my God. And Mark and I walk out and we're like, oh, my God, he shook my hand. What? That's so cool. Wow. Even if nothing happens, that was just the coolest thing ever. Next day in the New York Post or whatever, there's an article about the audition because it was, you know, it was a little local news item. Yeah.

It says that there was a code where if Francis Ford Coppola shook your hand, it was a signal to the casting people to put your envelope in a separate basket for like, you know, more analysis or whatever. And so I was like, oh, my God, I got the special handshake. I'm definitely I'm going to be Jack Kerouac. There's no question. Like, I definitely got this part.

I'm still waiting for the call. I still haven't heard. And by the way, he still hasn't made the movie. I don't think I don't think On the Road was was ever made. And there was I think Johnny Depp was going to do it at one point. But this is way this is like 1991. Maybe. No, no. Sorry. Ninety five, I think.

And, you know, now he's making Megalopolis, which he talked about on The Outsiders. So cool. He talked about making Megalopolis on The Outsiders. It's his dream project. No one wants to make it. It's hugely expensive. He's made a gazillion dollars making wine, and he's 80-something years old, and he's going to finance it himself. And that's awesome. Incredible.

Well, somewhere in his files is my audition material, and it's obviously brilliant. So hopefully he'll pull it out and be like, Megalopolis, we need Helms. Call him up. So if anybody in the Francis world is listening to this, this is – if there are two remaining roles – I'm pre-approved. I'm pre-approved. You're pre-approved. I got the handshake. You're on the short list.

That's right. Amazing. This is great. Helms, Helmsy, Helmsy. How about that? That's a good one. That's a very, you know what? People I'm very close to call me Helmsy. Helmsy. Yeah. See, you get, you get that one. You can, you can have that one. Roll on Helmsy. I knew that would be a good talk. I mean, you want to talk about wide ranging. They always like this podcast offers a wide ranging look. Well, that was wide ranging. We lived up to the hackiest description of a podcast.

that one can put out there. Wide ranging, no holds barred. We did it though. We really did. There were no holds that were barred. And what a great guy. I love this part of my job. I love this job. So let's keep it going. You got questions? I got answers. Let's hit the lowdown line. Hello, you've reached literally in our lowdown line where you can get the lowdown on all things about me, Rob Lowe. 323-570-5707.

4551. So have at it. Here's the beep. Hi, Rob. This is Diane from Woodbridge, Virginia. And I love the podcast, also Parks and Recreation. But I wanted to ask you about your role as Nick Andros in the original The Stand, a much underrated performance in a much underrated series. How did you achieve success

the ability to convey so much in a largely non-speaking role. I just thought it was great and just wanted to ask you that. Thanks so much and keep up the great work. Bye-bye.

Oh, thank you for that, for that wonderful compliment and callback to a part and project that was really important to me. First of all, I love Stephen King, and The Stand, I still think, is one of his best books. It's certainly one of the first ones I ever read. It really stands up. And I played, as you say, Nick Andrews, couldn't speak, couldn't hear. No dialogue. I have no dialogue. So you'd think it might be easy.

I never worked harder on a part than I did on Nick Andros. I learned American Sign Language. Interesting side note, this is kind of getting into the weeds, but I wrote about it in my second book,

Love Life when I was talking about acting and acting coaches. I worked with this great acting coach on that particular project named Roy London. And Roy sort of started Brad Pitt and Gina Davis and Michelle Pfeiffer. He's since passed away, but he was the guy. And I sent him the script. We had our first meeting and I was thinking, you know, I actually am deaf in one ear.

So I was, I had this idea that maybe I would get some sort of earplug or revert hearing aid with some white noise in it. So I could, I could actually be deaf. It'd be very easy. And I'll never forget Roy kind of let me talk and looked at me and I said, you know, and I could put it in my ear with white noise and like, and then I would, you know, I would, I would be completely deaf. What do you think? And he goes, or because you can hear, you could think about how you are still deaf in your own life. Yeah.

He quoted John Malkovich, who won an Oscar for playing a blind man. And they asked him, did you blindfold yourself and walk around your house? And he said, no, I just thought about the times in my own life where I'm blind. I thought that was super amazing. There's a lot of layers to it. But the real layer is, you know, the less artifice you can put into your performances, the less make-believe.

the better. And Roy's thing was, you can hear. Don't act like you can hear that you can't. So what I had to do was find a reason that my character was

would let people believe that I couldn't hear. And then he said, and don't ever tell the director because it'll freak the director out. So it's a very obscure, weird thing, but it's funny that you noted it. And I figured I'd, I'd share this probably too much information about acting technique, but, um, thanks. Uh, thanks for the call. Um, tune in next week and don't forget to download the entire season because, um,

There's a whole bunch of them that are coming that are super, super good. And thank you for listening. And I'll see you next time on Literally. You've been listening to Literally with Rob Lowe, produced by me, Rob Schulte, with help from associate producer Sarah Bagar. Our research is done by Alyssa Grahl.

The podcast is executive produced by Rob Lowe for Low Profile, Adam Sachs, Jeff Ross, and Joanna Solitaroff at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson at Stitcher. All of the music on this podcast was composed by Devin Bryant. Thanks for listening. We'll see you next time on Literally with Rob Lowe. This has been a Team Coco production in association with Stitcher.

All set for your flight? Yep. I've got everything I need. Eye mask, neck pillow, T-Mobile, headphones. Wait, T-Mobile? You bet. Free in-flight Wi-Fi. 15% off all Hilton brands. I never go anywhere without T-Mobile. Same goes for my water bottle, chewing gum, nail clippers. Okay, I'm going to leave you to it. Find out how you can experience travel better at T-Mobile.com slash travel. ♪

Qualifying plan required. Wi-Fi were available on select U.S. airlines. Deposit and Hilton Honors membership required for 15% discount terms and conditions apply.