Elon vs Trump Firestorm plus What's Next for the Big Beautiful Bill & Chinese Nationals Caught Smuggling Dangerous Pathogens into America
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Well, welcome. It is Verdict with Senator Ted Cruz, Ben Ferguson with you, and we have got a very big show for you. And yes, we are going to talk about the elephant in the room. Two men that have had some back and forth, the most powerful man in the world, Donald Trump, the president, and the richest man in the world, Elon Musk. I want to be clear, I love both these men dearly and think they've done amazing things for this country. And we are going to talk about it. We're going to start with that.

Well, the battle that unfolded between Elon and Trump this past week, it was painful for all of us to watch. We're going to break it down. I was actually in the Oval Office with the president when the Twitter battle started. I'm going to bring you inside that, and we're going to assess what are the consequences and where we go from here. We're also going to talk about the one big, bold, beautiful bill, what's going to happen, what the Senate's going to do. I'm optimistic, but we're going to break down the details.

And then we're going to talk about a rather remarkable story about the FBI arresting a Chinese national for bringing a dangerous pathogen into the United States, a pathogen that could have done enormous damage. And finally, a Columbia protester, a radical Jew hater, who was talking about lighting someone on fire on the Columbia campus. He's being prosecuted for

for his crimes of violence. We're going to break that down for you as well. We certainly are. And I also want to talk to you real quick about something that's happening in this country and around the world and how you can get involved to stand with the people of Israel. We saw what just happened in Colorado. And the first question people ask is, what can I do?

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So, Senator, let's start with the Elon Musk, Donald Trump back and forth. I hate seeing this because Democrats are loving it. The liberal media is loving it. And I want to be clear. I think Donald Trump is not wrong. I also think Elon Musk is not wrong. And unfortunately, Elon is working under the assumption that Congress actually wants to do the job and save our country. And I think Trump's working under the reality that there's a lot of people in Congress who

that actually aren't looking out for the American people. Both men in many ways are right. Well, listen, what unfolded this week was incredibly painful. These are two men whom I know very well. They're both good friends of mine. President Trump has been an extraordinary president. His election, his reelection in November saved this country from absolute destruction.

Elon Musk is one of the greatest businessmen, one of the greatest innovators, one of the greatest thinkers I think the world has ever seen. Amen. And what he has done, whether with SpaceX, whether with Tesla, whether with all of his companies, or whether buying Twitter, or creating a free speech zone where people can engage in public debate and

That was massively consequential, and that doesn't even begin to touch the impact that Elon had at Doge exposing massive government waste, fraud, and abuse.

And so I got to say, I watched the two of them. And by the way, you and I, we had Elon Musk as a guest on this podcast. That is one of my favorite podcasts we've ever done. At the White House, nonetheless. It was at the White House. And a week ago, he and the president were very, very close. And what happened today. So I was sitting in the Oval as this unfolded.

And I was sitting there and the tweets were coming. And listen, Elon is brilliant and he is strong-willed and he's a force of nature. Donald Trump is brilliant and he is strong-willed and he is a force of nature. And these are two alpha males who are pissed off.

And unfortunately, they're unloading on each other. And I wish that were not the case, because I think the country does better when these two amazing heroes are working side by side for the country and not just unloading on each other. But listen, they are angry. It's not complicated. But it is unfortunate. I will say every enemy of America

Every Marxist, every person who hates our country, every person who hates freedom is cheering for this divide to be real, to be deep, to be lasting, to be permanent. They would be thrilled. Everyone who loves our country is cheering for Elon and President Trump to kiss and make up. Like, look, they may not agree on everything.

But they're too significant in this country for them to be fighting at cross purposes. I don't want either one fighting at cross purposes. And I will say, you know, listen, when I was in the Oval, Trump was pissed. I mean, he was venting on this topic. And I understand it. Elon was saying some really harsh things. I understand why Trump was pissed. And the back and forth, knowing both of them,

It was not surprising to see it. You know, I got to say, Ben, it reminded me there's a gif that's popular online from Anchorman where Ron Burgundy, you know, Will Ferrell's character goes, well, that escalated quickly because it just went from zero to 11 instantaneously. I get it knowing both of the players, but I hope it goes from 11 back down to zero or maybe one or two. I hope it goes every bit as quickly.

Well, as I said at the very beginning, the only people that are happy right now over this is the liberal media and the Democratic Party. And they're the ones are sitting there going, this is amazing. And I'm eating popcorn. And look, I think both these men are right. I understand Elon Musk's frustration in general. I wish Washington didn't have so many swampy people there. But.

there's also what we wish and the reality and the reality is it is really hard to get something this big done with dealing with so many players in DC and look I hope there's a truce I hope that both of them get this figured out behind the scenes very very quickly I think there's a very good chance that's going to happen because they're going to see the left and them celebrating over this as well and the way that you described it these two men are brilliant

and we need them working together for the good of the country because there's one thing I know about both of them. They both love America and I think there's no doubt about that.

Well, I think that's exactly right. I hope they will come back together on the substance. We're going to discuss in a minute. Both of them are right on the substance. President Trump is right. We have to get this one big, beautiful bill passed. We're going to. Elon is right that we have to make the bill better. We have to cut more spending and tackle the deficit and debt more than we do. They're both right. We're going to break that down in just a minute.

But I'll say also, look, the sentiment I have, I feel like the kids of a bitter divorce where you're just saying, I really wish mommy and daddy would stop screaming. I think a lot of conservatives are feeling like this is not good. Let's hug and make up. All right.

All right, so let's talk about the bill that obviously the fight with Elon and Trump has been over. You were in the Oval Office. This bill is obviously something that you've talked about with the president. There are people that have concerns about what's in the bill, and there's an opportunity for the Senate, as you guys are doing reconciliation on this bill, to improve it, make it better. What do people need to know about this bill? Like, what's in it that you should be proud of, and what are the changes that need to be made?

Well, listen, on the merits of the fight between Elon and Trump, as I mentioned, both are right. President Trump is absolutely right. We need to get this passed because this is the major vehicle to deliver on the promises we made to the voters. And failure is not an option. We cannot fail to secure the border.

We cannot fail to rebuild the military. We cannot fail to unleash American energy. And we cannot fail to extend the Trump tax cuts and make them bigger and bolder to unleash economic growth. All of those we are going to get done, and the only avenue to getting them done is this reconciliation bill. So we will get it passed. But that being said, this bill can be made much better. I'm glad the House passed it. That's the first step in this becoming a law.

The House came together. They got a majority. They sent it to the Senate. But, you know, a lot of people are asking, OK, what happens now? Does the Senate just pass the House bill? And the answer is not remotely. So what is happening right now is. Say that again. Say that again for everybody listening, because that may be music to some ears listening right now. Say that again.

The Senate will not pass the House bill. All right. There we go. We got it. I love this. I'm smiling. Keep going. So listen, under a constitution, we have two chambers, two legislative bodies. The House has passed their bill. The Senate is going to pass our own bill. And what has happened is each major committee has been given what are called reconciliation instructions to draft their portions of the bill.

I'm the chairman of the Senate Committee on Commerce, Science and Transportation. So I've drafted my portion of the bill. The Senate bill will have similarities to the House bill. The similarities will be anywhere, my guess is, from about two thirds to three quarters of the House bill. So the good provisions of the House bill will keep. The bad provisions, I hope, will jettison and say, no, we're not going to do that.

And my hope, what I am fighting in the Senate to do is to have the Senate cut spending significantly more than the House did. And this is a point. Look, I think there's a real possibility the Senate today is more conservative than the House. And that's unusual. That is rarely the case. Here's why I think that. There are 53 Republicans in the Senate.

I think it is entirely possible that the 50th most fiscally conservative senator is to the right of the 218th most fiscally conservative House member. That's a very interesting perspective, by the way, because I don't think people think about it that way at all. No, they think about that there are 100 fire-breathing conservatives in the House. That's true. But a majority in the House is 218, so 100 doesn't pass anything.

So if you ask the House, okay, who's the 218th? Who's the wobbliest Republican that gets you to a majority? That Republican, I think, is actually significantly to the left fiscally compared to the 50th Senate Republican. So I'm not sure how bold we will do, and I may have to do a podcast where I do a mea culpa and say I was too optimistic, but my hope is what the Senate will pass—

will demonstrate much more fiscal restraint than what the House passed. That's what I'm arguing to my colleagues. So I mentioned I was in the Oval right as the Trump-Elon battle was unfolding. I was there for two reasons. Number one, I was urging we need to cut more spending. And I gave the president a list of nearly $3 trillion of spending cuts that we could do.

urging, okay, let's cut the spending. We can do this. We can make this happen. Elon is right that we're bankrupting our country. And we need to do more than the House bill does. I think the Senate will do that. What will happen, the Senate will pass our bill, I think, right before July 4th. Now, when the Senate passes the bill, it's probably not going to be done. The likely outcome after the Senate passes the bill

is it will go to conference where the House and Senate will negotiate back and forth. The House will say, we don't like some provisions in this bill. The Senate will say, we don't like some provisions in your bill and we'll reach a compromise. My guess is the final bill will be passed at the end of July, right before the August recess and sent to the president to be signed at the beginning of August. I think that's likely. There's another chance when the Senate passes our bill, maybe the House just says, okay, we accept it and we'll pass it.

So that possibility is not zero, but I think it's more likely we'll have a conference committee and reach some compromises. I will say this, Ben. 2017, the last time we passed big tax cuts, I was here. I spent hundreds of hours negotiating those tax cuts. One interesting dynamic, if you look at the current House of Representatives...

more than 60% of the House Republicans were not in Congress in 2017 when we did this last time. And so the back end, it's a stunning number. That is a huge number. No one, I wouldn't have guessed that. Yeah, look, there's been a lot of turnover in Congress. And so most of the House members were not here. What happened in 2017, the House passed a good bill. It went to the Senate.

And we made it much, much better. And then actually it went to conference committee and it became significantly better. I'll give you a couple of examples. Number one, the House, when they initially passed it, did not repeal in 2017 the Obamacare individual mandate. The House conservatives are all my buddies. They said there's no chance you Senate Republicans will do this. You guys like all of the jellyfish in the Senate. They'll never do this.

Well, I led the fight in the Senate and said this Obamacare individual mandate, it is wrong, it is abusive, it is unfair. And we ended up unifying Senate Republicans and we repealed it, but the Senate added it. That was a major, major victory. Another example, the bill that passed out of the House initially in 2017 had big tax cuts for C-Corps, for big corporations.

but much smaller tax cuts for pass-throughs and S-corps, which tend to be small businesses. And in the Senate, we said, that's not right. We need to fight for small businesses. We improved that dramatically. I think the same thing is going to happen. And so I was sitting in the Oval saying, number one, here are three trillions more in tax cuts you can make.

And number two, I was arguing in particular the school choice provision in the House House bill. We need to make it bigger. We need to make it bolder. We need to make it more effective. That was the case I was making directly to the president in the Oval Office this week.

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Senator, let's move to this really, I would say,

shocking and scary news that not one but two Chinese nationals have been charged by U.S. federal authorities for allegedly smuggling a dangerous agricultural pathogen into the United States of America. It is basically, in layman's terms, a fungus that poses a significant threat to crops such as wheat, barley, and rice. It could cause massive disease and, in essence, famine on

on our agriculture in this country. And this was brought in this country and it just screams of another example of why you don't trust China and why we have to watch them and protect ourselves. It reminds, I think, a lot of people of COVID-19, but this could literally wreak havoc on our entire national security from a basic standpoint.

We need food to live strategy if it was weaponized against us.

Well, this is a story, unfortunately, you're not going to watch on the corporate media, ABC, NBC, CBS, they're not going to cover it. But China is our enemy. And China is, I think, the greatest geopolitical threat we have for the next hundred years. We saw with COVID the incredible threats of a pathogen, of a virus that can do enormous damage, can destroy trillions of dollars, can take massive toll in human life.

Well, this story, and I just want to read to you a tweet from the director of the FBI, Kash Patel. Here's what the FBI director said. Quote, New, I can confirm that the FBI arrested a Chinese national within the United States who allegedly smuggled a dangerous biological pathogen into the country. The individual, Yun-Qin Jian, is alleged to have smuggled a dangerous fungus called Fusarium

Graminarium, which is an agro-terrorism agent, into the U.S. to research at the University of Michigan, where she works. This fungus can cause a disease called head blight, a disease of wheat, barley, maize, and rice, causing significant health issues in both humans and livestock. It is responsible for billions of dollars in economic losses worldwide each year.

Evidence also indicates Jian had expressed loyalty to the Chinese Communist Party and had received funding from the Chinese government for similar work on this pathogen in China. Jian's boyfriend, Zunyang Liu, also charged in the complaint, works at a Chinese university where he conducts research on the same pathogen. Liu is alleged to have first lied,

that admitted to also smuggling fusarium graninarium into America through the Detroit Metropolitan Airport so that he too could conduct research at the University of Michigan. Both individuals have been charged with conspiracy, smuggling goods into the United States, false statements, and visa fraud.

This case is a sobering reminder that the CCP is working around the clock to deploy operatives and researchers to infiltrate American institutions and target our food supply, which would have grave consequences, putting American lives and our economy at serious risk. Your FBI will continue working tirelessly to be on guard against it.

You go through this and let's unpack it and just go back a little bit to paint, I think, the broader picture. We've seen China...

financially infiltrate our colleges, our best colleges. We have seen them by influence. We saw this hell with the Biden Institute, for goodness sakes. We have witnessed the number of Chinese students that we allow to come into this country, be trained here, have access to R&D here. And then we've witnessed what our government did under Fauci with the amount of money we were sending to China.

that was doing a lot of this type of research and other things. And we shouldn't be surprised...

that this is happening now, but this again goes back to the vulnerability. If China is sending you money and sending billions of dollars to American universities, and then we see this type of research and the access at these research institutes like the University of Michigan, etc., why isn't there a massive red flag on every dollar now coming in from China after seeing yet again the Chinese are our enemy and they cannot be trusted?

There's no doubt there should be. And listen, when I was first elected to the Senate 13 years ago, I was saying then that China is the greatest threat we have for the next hundred years. I got to tell you, Ben, at the time, that was a very lonely view in the United States Senate. Every Democrat disagreed with me and most of the Republicans did, too. They all looked to China and they saw nothing but dollar signs as far as the eye could see.

Now, COVID changed that for a lot of people. They realized the mendacity, the duplicity, the damage China causes. China engages in widespread murder of its citizens, torture of its citizens. It has over a million Uyghurs in concentration camps, modern-day human slavery, organ harvesting. But they also engage in massive propaganda, massive espionage against the United States, massive theft of intellectual property.

They are engaged in a global battle for world domination. Their objective, which they've told us, they're very explicit. Their objective is to be the dominant world power and to displace America. And we need to combat them on the global stage. China is engaged in Africa, in Latin America, in the Middle East, in Asia, every part of the world. China is trying to become the dominant world power. They are waging a thousand year war.

And when it comes to the danger of pathogens, look, you look at COVID. COVID, it was clear within the first couple of months of this pandemic that the evidence strongly suggested that the virus escaped from the Wuhan Institute of Virology in Wuhan, China.

We now know that the corporate media suppressed that story, that Facebook suppressed that story at the explicit request of Dr. Fauci. I will tell you, this podcast, Verdict with Ted Cruz, in March and in April of 2021,

When COVID was first starting, we laid out the evidence that this came from China, from the Wuhan Institute of Virology, before you could get it practically anywhere else. China bears enormous responsibility for what happened with COVID. I think the evidence is overwhelming that COVID escaped from a Chinese government lab. I think the evidence is significant that

that COVID was actually invented in a Chinese government lab, that they took natural viruses and they altered them using gain-of-function research. That's not as compelling as the fact that it escaped from a government lab, but I think there's a lot of evidence of that. By the way, there are multiple federal agencies that have now explicitly concluded that COVID likely escaped from a Chinese government lab. When COVID escaped,

The Chinese government covered it up. They suppressed the evidence. They destroyed the samples. They did everything they could to prevent others from understanding the source of this virus and also to frustrate efforts to stop the spread of this pandemic. Now, put that in the context of this story.

a dangerous agro-terrorism fungus that could do massive damage to crops, to livestock, to human beings in the United States being smuggled in by not one but two Chinese nationals being paid by the Chinese Communist Party. Look, it is not difficult to imagine

a pathogen like that being released in the United States and doing enormous damage. And that's the sort of threat our government, we need to be vigilant against when it comes to communist China. Well, and it goes back to, again, some of this evidence that apparently they've been discussing the plan to smuggle these biological materials since at least 2022.

The electronic devices contain documents expressing loyalty to the Chinese Communist Party, the CCP, and detailing research funded by the Chinese government. So the story just keeps repeating itself. It is over and over again. When we see these things happen, it's directly tied to the Chinese Communist Party, the Chinese Communist government, and we should not be surprised this is happening. Will there be any reaction or anything that Congress can do on this very quickly?

Well, listen, this has been an area I've been legislating for a long time. So, for example, one of the very first bills I passed into law dealt with Confucius Institutes. Confucius Institutes were formed on U.S. universities all across the country, hundreds of them.

And they were funded by the Chinese Communist Party. They conducted espionage and propaganda. I introduced legislation to cut off federal funding to universities that have Confucius Institutes, passed it into law. And as a result, we've shut down most of the Confucius Institutes across the country. So we can fight this, but we need to be vigilant and we need to fight.

All right, Senator, I want to move on to another story we teased this earlier. A Columbia protester and self-proclaimed Jew hater had direct links to Hamas terror cell. Disturbing new phone records revealed that the DOJ has come out with another example of we were not doing a good enough job of protecting America and letting people in that we did not know exactly who they were. Well,

Well, today's Democrat Party has rallied around defending the anti-Semitic protesters on college campuses, and the media has as well. And yet the viciousness, the hatred, the violence, and the ties to terrorists on these protests are significant. So this is a story that broke just this week, and I'm reading now from the New York Post. Quote, a Jew hater who protested against Israel on Columbia University's campus said,

and contemplated setting a student on fire, allegedly had a direct link to Hamas's deadly Al-Qassam Brigades militant group. The Post can reveal. Tarek Bazruk, awaiting trial after being indicted on three federal hate crimes against Jewish people, was, quote, a member of a chat group that received regular updates from Abu Ghraib,

Obidan, the official spokesperson for the brigades, according to allegations in federal documents. The accusation is the first evidence of an agitator receiving information directly from Hamas and taking action during protests on the university campus. Bazruk, 20, who was not a Columbia student, and many of the people who were conducting these protests were not students at the universities.

also frequently wore the green headband used by Hamas terrorists and boasted to friends about having relatives overseas who were part of the terror group, prosecutors claim in a letter filed with the court. While on Columbia's campus during protests in April 2024, Bazzarouk allegedly texted a pal saying he lit a flare and considered lighting someone on fire

but that there were, quote, too many people around him for him to take on. Otherwise, he would have, quote, hurted them. Columbia University says it has no record of Buzruk being on campus, and it wanted to be clear that this individual is not affiliated with our university in any way, adding that the school strongly condemns anti-Semitism and violence, and we are horrified by the violence and hate crimes described in the indictment. Buzruk, a U.S. citizen born and raised in New York,

This is the kind of violent hate and violent hate tied to terrorism that

that we've seen erupting at universities across the country. It's such a concerning, I think, thing now, because if you're a Jewish student, do you feel safe on any college campus? It's an honest question that we should ask. If you are a student on a college campus now, do you feel safe and feel like the campuses are going to protect your safety when they allow these protesters on college campuses? Yes.

that refers to himself as a Jew hater, right? Who protests against Israel on Columbia University. So now this is completely infiltrated the best media

you know, quote, universities that America has to offer are actually now becoming the most radical. And yet there are still people on the left that are saying, no, no, no, you got to allow this to happen no matter what. You got to allow these disturbances and these takeovers and the sit-ins and the taking over buildings and the attacking of Jews. It goes back to the anti-Semitism that has festered on our college campuses. Right.

And that the Democrats are defending, by the way, we have text exchanges between Chuck Schumer and Columbia University where Chuck Schumer said, look, it's only the Republicans who are concerned about this anti-Semitism. We, the Democrats, we're fine with it. I mean, that is the explicit position. There is a pro-Hamas wing.

of the Democrat Party. It is tragic. That didn't used to exist, but it's how radicalized they've gotten. And this particular individual who's charged, according to the Department of Justice, he had a picture of Obaida, who was the spokesperson for Al-Qassam, the military arm of Hamas, and one of an individual waving a Hamas flag. This was on his phone. And an Al-Qassam Brigades meme, which reads, quote,

By God, I would not trade the Al-Qassam brigades for the world and everything in it. May God be pleased with them and allow them to break the wicked enemy through him. Also included in his phone are quotes from text messages in which Baruch, Bazruk rather, allegedly identifies himself as, quote, a Jew hater. So that's his term for himself. Labels Jews as, quote, worthless, unworthy.

exhorted Allah to, quote, get us rid of Jews and called an acquaintance an effing Jew and told a friend to slap that B, and he did not abbreviate B, in reference to a woman with an Israeli sticker on her laptop, according to court documents. And understand, this individual is

There was a real risk of violence. He kicked one Jewish college student in the stomach. In a text message four days later, he wrote that, quote, if he ever sees a Jewish person, he is going to boom-boom them. He's accused of slugging a Jewish Columbia University student in the face while ranting about Hitler and the Nazis.

And he's been arrested a total of six times for his conduct at Israel and Gaza protests, including multiple assaults. Law enforcement searched his Manhattan apartment and found brass knuckles, four knives, a taser, an airsoft gun that looks identical to a revolver, spent casings from an actual firearm, and $500,000 in cash. An additional search...

turned up another $250,000. Now, Ben, who the hell has $750,000 of cash in his apartment? Let me give you one other fact just to color this. Baz Rook, a 20-year-old, lives with his parents. He has said he has a net worth of $3,000 and that he's, quote, unemployed and supported by his parents. $750,000 in cash. Yeah. Yeah.

And the big question is, how many more are out there like them? Final question on this. Trump administration also escalating pressure on Columbia as the Department of Education is questioning the university's accreditation. Is this the right way to start dealing with these radical universities? Yes. Yes. Stand up to them. The Trump administration is doing exactly right.

These violent protests occurred because radical administrators, radical faculty, they sided with the pro-Hamas protesters. And I am very glad. Look, you ought to just ask the question, why was nobody arrested during the Biden administration? Why were none of the protesters arrested? Why were none of the funders arrested? Why were none of the universities having their funding suspended? And it's because the Democrats...

They were cheering on the protesters as well. As always, thank you for listening to Verdict with Senator Ted Cruz. Ben Ferguson with you. Don't forget to download my podcast and you can listen to my podcast every other day. You're not listening to Verdict or each day when you listen to Verdict afterwards. I'd love to have you as a listener to, again, the Ben Ferguson podcast. And the Senator and I will see you back here for the weekend review on Saturday morning.

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You know what's great about your investment account with the big guys? It's actually a time machine. Log in and Zoom. Welcome back to 1999.

I'm Rodney Williams. And I'm Travis Holloway. Welcome to the Wealth Break Podcast, a real conversation about finance.

Let's be honest. Building wealth doesn't look the same for everyone. I feel like sometimes being broke is a cycle and that we might have to revisit that. And we're not stopping at success stories. What happens when it doesn't go right? How do you cope with it? Because wealth isn't just about money. It's about creating a life where you thrive and help others do the same. Listen to the Wealth Break podcast on the iHeartRadio app.

The Medal of Honor is the highest military decoration in the United States. Recipients have done the improbable, the unexpected, showing immense bravery and sacrifice in the name of something much bigger than themselves. This medal is for the men who went down that day. On Medal of Honor: Stories of Courage, you'll hear about these heroes.

and what their stories tell us about the nature of bravery. Listen to Medal of Honor on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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We have a winner. Yes. Listen to Armstrong and Getty on demand on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast.