695 Audrey McLoghlin: Founder & CEO of Frank & Eileen
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Hi, everyone, and welcome back to the Kara Golden Show. Super, super excited to have my next guest with us here today. What if timeless style and radical transparency and a mission to uplift women could all live in the same brand? Audrey McLaughlin made that happen. She's the engineer turned founder behind Frank and Eileen, the globally loved

B Corp certified fashion company built with intention and without compromise. And she took a classic menswear staple and reinvented it for women. Then she scaled it into the powerhouse brand that it is today while staying 100% founder owned and women led. And now,

now. She's on a mission to invest millions in female entrepreneurs through education. So I cannot wait to talk smart growth, values-driven leadership, and she's built a brand that actually means quite a lot. So Audrey, welcome to the show. Very excited to meet you. Cara, thank you so much. I think I'm the one that's so excited. There's like no words for how excited I am to be able to speak with an entrepreneur like you today. So...

Oh, thank you. So, so nice. So, okay. So I always love to start with the why behind the brand. What inspired you to create Frank and Eileen? That's a great question. And I think a lot of times I say it was kind of an accident, which turned out to be this serendipitous accident, but I was stumbling around my way of being a, you know, engineer turned novice entrepreneur. And I'd already started a couple of businesses and

One day I was working on something completely unrelated and got locked in a conference room for way too long, which was a theme in my career back then. And so naturally, instead of sitting patiently and waiting, I started snooping around and started pulling all these books off a bookshelf. And I pulled this old dusty book. And when I opened it up, there were the most beautiful Italian menswear fabrics.

And I just fell madly in love and lost all focus on what I was supposed to be doing there. And, you know, ultimately I thought, well, I went, I stole the book and went back to my factory that I basically slept at five or six days a week for many, many years. And I called this mill in Italy and asked,

do you have any clients that use these fabrics for women's wear? And they said, no, not that I know of. And I said, great. Then I want to set out to reinvent the button up shirt for women using these incredible men's wear fabrics. And so that it all just kind of happened by accident because I found this book. And then I think I was like, you know,

There's this instant connection and love story between myself and the fabrics. And I had always named my companies after family members and honoring my Irish heritage. And so I sat very late at night thinking, okay, who would I want to name it after to really embody this love story? And I was like, oh my gosh, my grandparents, Frank and Aileen. They have just like the most magical old world love story. So I named it Frank and Aileen.

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- A

That was my next question. So I love, love, love that that's where the backstory came from. So you launched in 2009 in the middle of a financial crisis and you were having your own challenges, personal challenges. What gave you the courage to just go and just do it?

Blind ambition, I think. I mean, I was in the process of losing everything, right? The 2008 financial crisis, I was a fledgling entrepreneur and was certainly not capitalized to be able to withstand, endure that kind of crisis. I had four retail stores and that was really, really tough time. So while everything was crumbling around me,

I mean, I would get phone calls like, don't come to the factory today. The sheriff is here looking for you. Right. So, I mean, my world was crumbling and I thought, well, there's no better time to start something from scratch and try to build my way out of these ashes. So that was, you know, when I was launching Frank and Eileen. Wow. So what kind of stores did you have? So I had four multi-brand retail stores. This was back, you know, 2004.

And then through the kind of financial crisis, I shut them down one at a time. And so we carried all the kind of best contemporary brands in the market at the time. And that's where I really understood that there was a hole in the market for reinventing the button-up shirt for women because I was buying every contemporary brand in the market at the time.

and shopping, you know, all of the trade shows and everything else. So I really kind of understood this missing piece of not only being a buyer and going to all the markets, but then working with the women in the fitting rooms at the stores, you know, inside my stores for seven years. So that's where I really learned everything about women and their bodies and dressing them and what they need. And so, yeah. Yeah.

Well, your shirts are a staple, right? I absolutely, absolutely love them. How many did you actually launch with in terms of SKUs?

One. That's a really important question, Kara. So one. And I think, you know, especially when I'm talking to young entrepreneurs and I think they all want to, you know, they get all this pressure from the outside of like, are you going to offer this and you can offer this? And, you know, I think being able to focus and do one thing extremely well, better than anyone else is so important. And I think they feel the pressure there.

And I remember that. And it was just, I think, you know, what you say no to is more important than what you say yes to. So we basically, we launched with one silhouette. So I went out to reinvent the button-up shirt for women using these menswear fabrics. And that was what we were offering to the market. So I spent six months developing what I consider the best shirt ever. I still, and it's called the Berry, which is Frank and Aileen's son, their firstborn son, which is my father. So that just seemed like the natural first

child to come out of Frank and Eileen. Um, and I spent six months developing the silhouette and I literally built it around, you know, the female form and built it on my body. I was, you know, the fit model for most of the years of the company. And, um,

And that was really it. So for five years, that was the product for the company. And the innovation came through textile innovation. So fabric development and, you know, all different types of fabric and washes and stuff. But, you know, 99% of the business for five years was just this single berry. And we would do maybe like a short sleeve version or a dress version, but, you know, 90, 95 to 99% of the business was just one single silhouette. And I think that,

As an entrepreneur, that really allowed me to focus on the thousands of other things you have to do besides just getting the perfect product into the market, right? And being able to work, you know, have a thousand jobs at once and think about, you know, customer and brand and marketing and finance and, you know, all of the things. So that's the truth. So what was your go-to-market strategy then? How were you actually getting it to consumers? Yeah.

I mean, I didn't have like a formal go to market, you know, like when, again, I think when I'm working with all these young entrepreneurs and we think about, you know, the formality of them thinking through all these things, but it was, it was much more kind of casual and in my mind and, you know, the apparel business and some other industries are sort of set up for go to market strategy. At the time, the industry was really all business to business, right? So you launched wholesale. Yeah.

There weren't a lot of e-commerce businesses back in 2008 when we were launching.

At the time, before even going to trade shows, I just went and I thought, well, what are the top three retailers in the country that I would want to launch with? And if everyone saw my product there, that they would then want to follow the early adopters and they would want to carry Frank and Eileen. So in addition to having it in my own four retail stores, I went to Ron Herman, Fred Siegel, and Barney's and asked them to carry the product.

And, you know, so I think, you know, there's some funny stories about that launch story, but I think I was just like, that's my strategy, right? I mean, I'm just going to launch with these three people, right? And be patient. And then I'll be able to build with the right kinds of retailers and partners to get the product out there.

I always call it borrowing equity, right? So because the brands that you mentioned, they definitely had a consumer base that got it. Yeah. And I use that term all the time. That's the perfect way to say it, right? I'm always like, look, there's equity in this. You've always got like strength in strengths. Like what do they already have? They already have the customer, the best customer in the world. So what can I offer? How can I add value to them and give them something they need and

And I already know what they're going to give me that I need, right? The customer, the association with their strong brand equity. And I think that that for us was really powerful at the beginning, right? Because of course, no one had ever heard of Frank and Eileen. It didn't exist. And I had no relationships or any track record in the industry to speak of. So I think, like you said, borrowing on their equity and their customer base was super important. Yeah.

So you initially then started out as wholesale after you had been on the retail side. What was kind of the thinking behind that of not, I guess, D2C to your point wasn't really as popular. I mean, it was around, but it wasn't really as popular. But how did you make that decision that I'm going to go wholesale now?

I thought, like you said, I thought that was the best way to access the brand strength of the best retailers. Now, I guess technically I was going direct to consumer in my own four retail stores, right? So I was going from vertical manufacturing all the way through retail, which...

was incredibly valuable to me both as a designer and as selling to retailers because – and I would hear it time and time again in market appointments for 10 years. I was the one selling directly to all these retailers around the country. And because I really understood retail, because I was working on the floor and more importantly in the fitting rooms with the women –

I could understand everything about what it was like to be a retailer. So then I was designing collections, not only for the end customer, but also for my customer, which was the retailer and understanding their retail cycles, understanding all the other brands they'd have on the floor and how Frank and Eileen would best complement and fit in with the brands that they have, understanding the customer and her needs. And so I think there was a lot in there of understanding all

the different distribution models within the business and understanding the end retail and that customer, understanding wholesale and understanding the design and development and production. What was the moment that you knew the brand had real traction? Was there any stories when you were like, oh my gosh, just some surprising thing that happened and

Was it a celebrity that started? I mean, you've had so many people that have been wearing it, but or was it you didn't have any product? I mean, it's like good problems to have at times. I always say you're always going to have problems as an entrepreneur, just whether they're fancy problems or not. Yeah, but that's a great question. And because I was like, you know, a little bit of a serial entrepreneur before.

By the time I launched it, I had learned some important lessons along the way about launching a brand. So I had launched one or kind of two, one main brand before Frank and Aileen, and I had named it like my French nickname. And I didn't really think about how important it was that people could grab onto the name the first time they hear it and repeat it. So that was an important lesson that I learned. So

When I was naming Frank and Eileen, that was one of the big things. I want it to be easy to hear and understand the first time and fun to repeat. So I think... And I had had... My previous brand, I had used the same strategy to launch it, launching it in my own stores and launching it with Ron Herman, Fred Siegel, and those kinds of retailers. So...

I remember the moment. I do remember the first season. I think I loved the product so much. I was so passionate about it. And I watched, you know, I put it into my own stores and I got to see it in real time and watch the way the customer reacted. And it was, it

It was just sort of there was this spark and this magic of the way they reacted to the product, but also the brand and the brand story. And I was like, not only have I not seen that happen with the previous brand that I had, but I honestly hadn't really seen it happen with any of the dozens of brands that I carried in the store. So I could tell there was a real magic and spark to it, which is

I think helped as the world was, you know, my world and the world were like burning around me. And I had this like little glimmer of magic and hope. And I knew that was really important to focus in and lean in on. So the longer you stay standing as an entrepreneur, the more problems there are that you've gotten through, I should say. So the pandemic was not easy for most entrepreneurs, right?

What was probably the most difficult part of the pandemic? And also, how do you get through those really tough times? Yeah, I mean, that, you know, that was 2020 was definitely one of the hardest years of my life. But it's

It is interesting. I remember at the beginning, I kind of would almost break 2020 for me into maybe three different parts, right? So there's that March 13th of 2020 when between March 13th and the next 10 days, we got 90% of our wholesale orders canceled through force majeure clauses, right? And at the time...

at least 90% of our business was still wholesale. We had this incredible wholesale business. We worked with all the best retailers across the country and we hadn't really invested in building an e-commerce direct to consumer business. And so that was devastating to us. But that moment was a really big moment in understanding the kind of company and team I had built

So within that 10 days, kind of this core warrior team that I have that had been with me for a long time, many of which had been with me since we built it out of the ashes of the Great Recession, they went straight into warrior mode. And it was like, we were ready for this. It's like we'd kind of built ourself out during such an incredibly stressful time where we had, not only did we have no money, we had negative money and I was losing everything in the process. So I think that all served us.

us well as a team and a company when we went into the next unprecedented crisis, right? Like none of us had ever navigated a global pandemic or supply chain seizing up all over the world. But it's like,

We kind of had the DNA for it. We were built for it. And it was incredible to go through that experience and strategy for the first 10 days with my team. We just sort of locked ourselves in a Zoom room, right? And we grabbed all of our stuff, went home, sent the whole team home. But that first 10 days were critical because we'd gotten 90% of our orders canceled. If we had simply just canceled our orders with our supply chains...

most of them wouldn't be in business when we came out of COVID, right? And so I kind of went to the team and like, we have to figure out how to protect our supply chains so that they're still there when we figure out what's going to happen next and when we need them. But at the same time, we also have to protect ourselves and make sure we're in business on the other side. So it was a very interesting time and we were super creative and super strategic and it was amazing. And then

Kind of the next phase was then all X number of retailers, depending on what part of the country, then calling back and saying like, okay, we're ready to take product.

And we started hearing again and again that we were one of the only brands that could ship products. So we'd gotten really creative about how to really analyze each part of the supply chain from yarn to knitting to cutting to sewing to washing and like, how can we kind of do damage control but also leave ourselves in the best position to have product when retailers needed it? And then the third phase was immediately figuring out how to grow the muscles to become a direct-to-consumer business.

And be able to, you know, speak to our customer directly, do marketing, creative, everything. And so some of those things, again, I think we're, you know, timing is everything. And we had certain things that had been in the pipeline and the timing came together really well with like launching our new Shopify site, I think.

30 days after COVID happened, it launched. So that had obviously been in the pipeline for many months before that. And we had just kind of finished our 10-year anniversary. And I spent the whole year really reflecting on who we'd been for the first 10 years and who we wanted to be for the next 10 years. So all of that work had been done before COVID. So I was kind of lucky of the timing of that. But

We had to really grow up and grow some muscles that we had never had before in order to navigate. And by the end of 2020, we were a very different company than we were coming into 2020. So fundraising is always a topic of conversation. Do you do it? Do you not do it? What type of money? How much? All of those things. It's one of my favorite conversations to have with female founders. So

I took a very particular path. And now that I've been able to scale the company, I like to call it the 100 Club. So I never took on any financing of any kind. I don't have any outside funding. I never did. And I own 100% of the company. And

that's a really great place to be. It doesn't seem exciting when you're small and it's hard, right? I mean, every day you're like, how am I going to scale this? How am I going to pay the bills? How am I going to hire someone? So I think in the early days, right, it might be harder than it is when you're raising money and have the ability to bring on great talent and scale the business. But I'm

I'm very much in love with how it feels after you get through all that hard stuff. And I, I get to own a hundred percent of a really meaningful brand and, and,

I basically answer to my team and to my customers, and I get to make really long-term decisions that are best for the team and for the customers. And I'm not worried about board meetings or financial decks or short-term ROI on investments or covenants or any of the things that people have to worry about when they're fundraising, right? And I love that. So...

That's amazing. So the B Corp, that's a major part of your mission and initiative. Can you talk about why that was so important to you?

Yeah, absolutely. So that came out of the 10-year reflection exercise I talked about. And during that year, I said, you know, I really, there was kind of all this talk about sustainability. And I think it started being really confusing to the customer at the time, right? Like, who really is sustainable? What does that mean? How much is marketing? How much is like the real DNA of a company? So

In that 10-year reflection, I started reading and learning a lot more about the B Corp certification, what it means. And so I really think that unknowingly, our core values have always aligned with what it's now considered to be a B Corp. And so I'd been thinking about it a lot, but we were really resource constrained on time, right? It's like a very arduous process to go through. It's

extremely documentation heavy, and we just weren't really set up to do that. So it was just something I was thinking about. But when COVID happened and the entire world changed overnight, once we went through kind of that early phase of protecting our supply chain and then figuring out how to build the muscles to go direct to consumer, at the same time, I kind of looked around and met with the team and said, okay, we need to

think about what opportunity exists today that did not exist in the environment yesterday. Like we've got to identify all those opportunities. And one was this sudden resource of time.

Right. All of a sudden I wasn't on a plane every week. I wasn't commuting back and forth to, you know, to the fashion district, downtown LA every day. Like we had this unbelievable resource of extra hours every day and every week that we didn't have before. So multiply that by the number of people on the team. So I said, let's immediately use this time, this gift of time, because we don't know how long it's going to last. Let's channel this into going through the B Corp process and go through the certification. So we did.

And from, say, March or April, we started that process. And then we finished and I think turned in our complete application in like October or November of 2020. And by the end of the year, we were B Corp certified. And, you know, for me, it felt like maybe almost being like a college kid again, because you get really confident. Like, I really think I think our values.

values align. I think we've been operating this way since the beginning. And you go through all the application, you turn it in, and then you get nervous. Then you're like, what if I don't get accepted? Right? So we're on the edge of our seat waiting and waiting for the acceptance letter. But when it came, something happened that I absolutely didn't expect. And not only did we get certified, but we got the highest impact score of any woman owned globally recognized apparel brand. And that was really eyeopening. It was like,

We had no idea, right? And it was only our first time going through the process. So we knew that we had left more on the table, but that we just couldn't kind of get all the work done on round one. So I'm really big on sort of memorializing things and having something that kind of gives meaning to something that happened. So I said, I've really got to figure out what I want to do so that we'll always remember this moment and that the whole team can always remember it and never forget it.

So that's what led me to creating the Frank and Eileen Giving Pledge. So that's how that all happened. So I said, at the end of the year, it was December 2020, the hardest year of my entire life. I said, let's create the Frank and Eileen Giving Pledge. We're going to pledge $10 million over 10 years to help create more women entrepreneurs. And I thought that to me felt like how I could make the biggest impact kind of on entrepreneurship for the next generation. I love that. So can you talk about the program a bit, the Giving Pledge?

Yeah. As soon as that happened, then I was like a deer in headlights because I was like, how do you give away money? I have no idea. I just spent the last 15 years learning how to make money. I have no idea how to give away money. And I'd never been exposed to philanthropy or anything like that. So I really had no idea. So

The first thing I did is sat and thought, okay, I think the biggest impact I can make is by helping to create more women entrepreneurs. There's not nearly enough, and I want that to be changed for the next generation and our daughters. So I thought, well, it seems like the most efficient way would be to reach out to people who are already doing this work. What educational institutions are really focused and best in the world at teaching entrepreneurship already?

So I had this moment that is so wild, but I reflected back on a moment that happened maybe 60 seconds, 22 years before. So when I went to undergraduate, I went to engineering school at Georgia Tech, and then I moved to Boston and worked for an MIT startup. And everyone I met at the time went to MIT. Like it just kind of, I almost automatically completed the sentence. Oh, it's nice to meet you. Where'd you go to school? MIT. And I met this young man at the time and he's, he,

He said, he didn't say he went to MIT. He said, I went to Babson. And I said, oh, I've never heard of Babson. And he made this like scrunchie face at me. And he said, it's only the number one in entrepreneurship, seven years, seven consecutive years. And I was like, la-di-da, excuse me, right? And we didn't really, I don't even know if we had Google at the time, so it couldn't verify his name. We didn't even carry around cell phones at the time. So I thought, but I was really intrigued. Like, I mean, so intrigued that this,

60-second interaction stayed with me for 22 years. So as soon as I made this giving pledge, I said, I wonder if that school is still number one in entrepreneurship. So I Googled it, and it turns out 29 consecutive years Babson had been ranked number one in entrepreneurship. So I thought, well, why don't I just give them a call?

What I learned quickly is that when you call people to offer to give them money, they call you back immediately. So that part of giving away money was really easy. So but basically, I put together a short list. I said, all right, who are what are the top three schools in the country teaching entrepreneurship? And number one was Babson. Number two is MIT. And number three was Stanford. I said, great. Let me reach out to the three of them.

And then I thought, you know, these are already young women who are kind of on the path, maybe have the self-confidence, right? They're already going to the best schools. And how can we encourage them there? But where I got really passionate is, can I make an impact on younger women?

And help that divide of all the women that I think fall off thinking, no, I probably can't be in entrepreneurship or they're lacking the confidence or the vision for themselves. Right. So I was like, I'd really love to impact young girls and get more girls on the on the path to wanting to seeing themselves as an entrepreneur. So then I did a bunch of research and it turns out there's this unbelievable school right in Los Angeles.

actually not that far from our office. And it's an all girls school, grades seven through 12. It's called Marlboro.

So I reached out to them and said, I know you're doing incredible things on teaching entrepreneurship to young girls. And I'd love to partner with you guys and set up a Frank and Eileen accelerator and incubator inside the school. And so we did that three or four years ago. And we've just had this incredible success on the quality of the pitches the girls are coming out with and just how life-changing it is for them to be exposed to entrepreneurship so young.

That's amazing. And are you actually giving funds to the 7th to 12th? Or how does that work? Yeah. Yeah. So we funded this Frank and Eileen accelerator and incubator inside Marlboro. We also have at Babson, we have the Frank and Eileen Center for Women's Entrepreneurial Leadership inside of Babson. At MIT, we're launching an

an unbelievable partnership right now as we speak. So stay tuned. It's going to launch in the, in the upcoming fall year for students, but just like these incredible partnerships, you know, to be able to help, you know, give the confidence and the tools and the, and the mentorship and resources they need. That's incredible. Well, I love that you're supporting this next generation so generously and not just with,

money, but also with time and mentorship. It's really incredible. I mean, when I think about your legacy and what you're, you know, really leaving behind, I mean, that's, that's absolutely incredible. In addition to offering clothes that are really timeless, right? That to the world, I mean, it's such a great brand, but it's so much more than that.

Last question. When you think about your leadership over the years, but also your legacy and kind of what you've learned about yourself and maybe it's your superpower, but what would you say is a very strong aspect to have for anybody wanting to go into entrepreneurship that you look back and you say, yeah, I got that, but I fine-tuned it over time?

Oh, I mean, I'm fine-tuning all the time. I mean, I think when I reflect back, I mean, entrepreneurship is so hard. And I was so young when I started, and I was not fortunate enough to go through these programs that I now partner with, whether it's Marlboro or Babson or MIT, right? So, I mean, I was just winging it and failing to figure it out as I went, right? And I think...

Being a leader and being inspirational to a team was probably one of the hardest things for me that did not probably come naturally. I think I was a little rough around the edges. And so it took me a long time, I think, to refine the way that I lead or manage people or find people, I think,

I think I just thought maybe everyone was as crazy and intense as I was. And that was just not... That was the formula for being a one-woman show, right? But that wasn't a formula for creating a team around me that would stand by me forever. So I think I've gotten much, much better at that. And we love celebrating anniversaries. I mean, I have someone that's been with me 20 years and 10 years and 70 years. So we always celebrate how long someone's been with the Frank and Aileen family. I mean, there's so much, I think...

You know, I think one of my superpowers, honestly, is probably patience, which I wouldn't seem like a patient person. Actually, if you, you know, I think if you know me, you'd think I'm a really impatient person. But when it comes to brand building, and I think I'm very patient, I'm very focused on the long game and thinking about things that we do today that will really serve us in three, five, seven, ten years. And I think that's really, you know, served us very well.

Well, you've done an amazing job. So Audrey McLaughlin, founder and CEO of Frank and Eileen, thank you so much for joining us and for all you're doing and sharing your incredible journey with us today. It's really a masterclass and purpose-driven entrepreneurship that you're

living. And I think there's so much to learn from you and the company you've built. Definitely. And for everyone listening, be sure to check out frank and Eileen.com and also follow Audrey's journey on social. And I hope, uh,

But when you enjoyed this episode, you don't forget to subscribe as well and share it with somebody who's maybe building something bold or wants to know more about founders and entrepreneurs, people that aspire to be doing exactly what Audrey is doing at Frank and Eileen. So thank you again. And thanks, everyone, for listening. Thank you so much, Cara.

Thanks again for listening to The Kara Golden Show. If you would, please give us a review and feel free to share this podcast with others who would benefit. And of course, feel free to subscribe so you don't miss a single episode of our podcast.

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