702 Carly Zakin & Danielle Weisberg: Co-Founders & Co-CEOs of theSkimm
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I am unwilling to give up, that I will start over from scratch as many times as it takes to get where I want to be. You just want to make sure you will get knocked down, but just make sure you don't get knocked out. So your only choice should be, go focus on what you can control. Hi everyone and welcome to the Kara Golden Show. Join me each week for inspiring conversations with some of the world's greatest leaders,

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Hi, everyone, and welcome back to The Kara Golden Show. So excited to have our next pair of guests. Very unusual that we do this, but we absolutely had to have Carly and Danielle, who are the co-founders of The Skimm. And if you have not heard of The Skimm, you've been hiding under a rock. It is such an amazing, amazing show.

Thank you.

And these co-founders, from breaking down headlines to demystifying policies and paychecks, the skim has reached over 16 million people. Maybe that number has even gone up a little bit, but it continues to grow. And Carly and Danielle are here with us today to chat a lot more about how the heck they did this. And I love how they've

dove in together to lead together, create together, lead together, evolve together, and stay mission-driven in a world that's constantly changing. So Carly and Danielle, welcome to the show. So excited to have you here. Thank you so much. Thank you so much.

It's a real treat. Thank you. Absolutely. Okay. So take us back to the beginning. What inspired you to create this incredible company called The Skim? Sure. So we started The Skim in 2012. And I think we were inspired by two things. The first was our friends who are smart, educated, and smart.

and really, really up to date on all things that they needed to know for their own careers or things that interest them. We were both working at NBC News in different parts of the news business. And our friends certainly were not watching anything that we were producing for a living. We saw a trend towards personalization

towards getting more and more information from all sorts of different sources about the things that you are actually interested in. And that's great. But there was quickly becoming apparent to us that there are things you just need to know to be able to talk to a wide swath of people, to be able to have conversations, to learn from another person's perspective. And

And just because I may not be interested on a day-to-day basis about what's going on with the markets, what's going on with tariffs, whatever it is, it's still going to impact my day-to-day. And I need to know about it. This episode of The Kara Golden Show is brought to you by Range Rover Sport.

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in a way that makes it accessible and fits into the limited time that you have. The second thing that inspired the company is really that we came of age in a recession. We graduated in 2008. We're part of a group generation that saw these kind of social norms no longer exist in the same way that you work for a company

for a long time. And in the end, you're paid off. Like there is a kind of social contract that they're going to take care of you and you work hard. Everyone was getting laid off when we started. There was so much instability. And we really had no faith that we were going to be able to financially take care of ourselves over the long run.

by waiting in line for one job to open up, maybe. So interesting. So were you working together? Is that how you two connected on this?

No. So we actually met in a study abroad program in college in Italy, in Rome. Very special. Which is crazy because you never know where life takes you. We both worked at NBC, but never like together in the same department. This episode of the Kara Golden Show is sponsored by Kachava. Okay, true confession time.

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There are five indulgent flavors, chocolate, vanilla, chai, matcha, and coconut acai. I stick to the chocolate, usually with almond milk and a frozen banana. It's fast, satisfying, and keeps me sharp without the crash. I'm a big fan. Adding more plant-based protein to your diet is a fantastic way to nourish your body. And you can try Kajava risk-free with their Love It guarantee.

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So interesting. So the early days of launching a newsletter from, I don't know if it was really your sofa, but it really was your sofa getting together. Whose sofa was it? Well, we ended up having two. The main one was Danielle's that I think you found on the street. No, no, no. That was...

That would be gross. No, I bought it from housing works with my, my previous, it was always from the street. And that's why I never liked to really sit on it. Uh, and then, then, uh, we had a smaller sofa that was less comfortable. That was mine from Ikea. Um,

That's, I love it. So what were some of the scrappiest decisions you had to make to actually get it launched? Oh my God. Everything. I mean, we had a couple thousand dollars saved up and that was it. So I think to launch it, people were always complimenting us on the design and it was so minimalist and specific and that's because we didn't have any money for designers. So

We designed the template ourselves. We paid someone who was super talented, a friend of a friend, like $50 to design our logo. This episode of the Kara Golden Show is sponsored by Kachava. Okay, true confession time.

Yes, I wake up at 5 a.m. No, I don't have a cold plunge yet. And absolutely, I still listen to 90s pop when I need a boost. My mornings are a mix of inbox triage,

dog hikes, and finding a moment to think between nonstop phone calls and emails. The one thing I don't want to think about, what's actually going to fuel me? That's why Kajava has become my go-to. It's not just a shake. It's a whole body meal that actually tastes good.

I started with the chocolate flavor and honestly didn't expect it to be this rich and satisfying. With 25 grams of 100% plant-based protein, no weird aftertaste, and zero artificial flavors, preservatives, GMOs, gluten, or soy, it's clean, powerful fuel your body wants. Each serving has over 85 superfoods, nutrients, and vitamins.

adaptogens, chia seeds, goji berries, maca root, satcha inchi, you name it. Whether you're plant-based or not, it's a smart way to get real nourishment that keeps you going.

There are five indulgent flavors, chocolate, vanilla, chai, matcha, and coconut acai. I stick to the chocolate, usually with almond milk and a frozen banana. It's fast, satisfying, and keeps me sharp without the crash. I'm a big fan. Adding more plant-based protein to your diet is a fantastic way to nourish your body. And you can try Kajava risk-free with their Love It guarantee.

Fuel your day with Kachava. Go to kachava.com and use code CARAG for 15% off your next order. That's Kachava. K-A-C-H-A-V-A.com code CARAG for 15% off. Check it out and let Kachava help you do what you do best. Today's episode of the CARA Golden Show is sponsored by Acorns.

Hey everyone, Cara here. Did you know that nearly half of people aged 55 to 65 have nothing set aside for retirement?

Listen, it's not too late for them, but you can make things way easier on yourself if you start planning for your golden years now. The good news, you don't need a finance degree or 30 days to get started. Acorns makes it easy to begin saving and investing for your future in just five minutes. Acorns is a financial wellness app that makes it easy to start investing for your retirement.

because the sooner you start, the more of a chance your money has to grow. You don't need to be an expert. Acorns recommends a diversified IRA portfolio that can help you weather all of the market's ups and downs. You don't need to be rich. Acorns lets you get started with the money you've got right now.

You'd be surprised at what just $5 a day could do. Plus, sign up for Acorns Gold and you'll get a 3% IRA match on new contributions in your first year. That's extra money for your retirement on Acorns. Basically, Acorns does the hard part so you can give your money a chance to grow, whether it's for you, your kids, or your retirement.

Personally, I've found Acorns incredibly helpful in managing my investments. I love how it simplifies the investment process.

making it seamless and stress-free. This is ideal for anyone who's busy like me, but still committed to building their financial future. Sign up now and join the over 1 million all-time customers who have already saved and invested over $2.2 billion for their retirement with Acorns. Head to acorns.com slash Acorns.

Cara or download the Acorns app to get started. Once again, that's acorns.com slash Cara or download the Acorns app to start saving and investing for your future today.

We also, our grassroots marketing sounds like such a strategy, but it was really just what we had. Like we had a budget to print postcards through like Vistaprint. 1,800 postcards. Yeah. And then also t-shirts.

Um, and when we felt flush, we would use like the, whatever the brand that, um, American apparel used, like those t-shirts and we would get the skim ones. And then when it was a little bit like we had to pair back, then we would, you know, use whatever was on Vistaprint. Um, and we would...

put those postcards in nail salons, Starbucks, coffee shops, gyms, like try to, you know, get into Equinox, use the bathroom and then leave it there. And,

And we did a college tour, which, you know, at the time we were still young enough where we could somewhat pass on a college campus. And we would run into like a dorm and leave it under the doors or sit in the cafeteria and pass it out.

Carly, what was your first message, I guess? Do you remember what those cards said? Like, what were you telling people? What was the promise of the brand in those early days? Our tagline was, we read, you skim.

And there were these turquoise postcards and just had the skim.com on one side and then that tagline. So just encouraging people just to go on the website and the website was a landing page and just put your email in to get the daily skim.

I remember hearing about the skim from Alex Wallace. I don't know if that name. Yeah, so Alex and I go way back. And I remember her being in my office in San Francisco telling me about you guys. And I didn't remember that. Did you know her from NBC? No.

um we knew her she didn't know us yeah she was like so she was a big deal executive and actually my first internship at NBC Matt and it's like is dating us a little bit but like yeah there was a um an on-call list that had to go out every Friday and it was like a physical printed paper of like everyone's cell number email and then like who to go to if

X, Y, Z happens over the weekend. So I would deliver these. And Alex was one of the people I had to deliver it to. And I would like shake going to like be by her office. Cause I was like, I really want her to know who I am and I want to talk to her, but I can't. So I would just like slip the schedule and the on-call thing, like under her door. Yeah.

So funny. She, I remember her just saying, this is going to be the next big thing. And I was like, really? Like, tell me more about it. She just loved you guys. And really, we didn't know her at NBC. So we met her afterwards and she's always been so lovely to us. I think it really speaks though to it's a,

You know, in order to grow a business, it's not just about having a great idea. And it's also about, you know, maybe people like Alex also watching the hustle, right? That you guys are really showing her.

that exists out there and having, you know, a great idea is one thing and a company that, you know, she thinks can actually make it, but also she spoke a lot about you. How important do you think that is

to be founders who are willing to kind of be out there and talk and show that you're taking these chances. And I just think that it's not just about the idea, right? Like it really has to be, you have to be willing to get out there and really talk because you're going to be your best salespeople for this idea. I think as founders, as you said, I think it's imperative that you are your PR person

you are your best PR, right? Like you are going to have to talk about this business, this idea more than you could ever dream of. Um, and you need to, I think also, you know, so much of, of the amazing network that we've built has been because we were shameless about going up to people and just striking up a conversation. Um,

And you never know where that will lead. I will say one of the things that I do...

question that has evolved since we started is the need for founders to go on social media and LinkedIn and build their own brand. And we love our founder Instagram account at Carly and Danielle, but it can be, it's a lot of work at times. And I think especially for women, what I've seen more and more is that there's an expectation that they are going to do that as well.

And I wish that that wasn't seen as so much of the norm that you, because those channels aren't for like the messy things, that content doesn't do well. And we all know that starting a business, building a business is lived in a day-to-day fashion of things going wrong.

Yeah, definitely. Although I do think over time, I mean, the more authentic you're seeing, and I think that people want to buy from people who are real, right? And I think you both have done such an incredible job of showing that and also showing that you have...

personal life, right? I think that's okay to show that. And that has changed sort of with, I think, as social media has evolved too. What was the moment you knew that the skim had real traction? We were talking about this earlier today. I think...

like there's like kind of two distinct moments. One is literally day two. We are sitting on our floor in our living room and slate published two articles, one of why you should skim and one, why you shouldn't skim. And we were like, how is there a debate about us? Like we've been in business for 24 hours and it's,

I just remember like looking at each other and being like, what have we done? Like in this like weird, like what's happening? Let's just like watch this happen. I think then honestly, because of a lot of the grassroots work that Danielle mentioned, like,

getting recognized not as like our faces but getting recognized like with the skim tote or the laptop that had the skim sticker and people being like I love the skim and being like oh my god and getting stopped throughout the country um truly like anytime we traveled of like people being like I read you every day and you know we kind of made like a pact basically when we started like

We will, the only bag or purse that we would use or wear would be our skim tote. And truly, I don't think that we wore, either of us like,

Whether it was a fancy occasion, not fancy occasion. I don't think either of us wore any other purse for the first 10 years. Like it was just the skim totes that people would see it. We were like living the brand. And I just like getting stopped because people were like, I wake up to you was just like, Oh my God, like there's, this is real. Yeah.

So you started as an email business and you've evolved far beyond that. So how did you decide when and how to expand beyond email? I think it was easier for us to decide to expand the verticals.

And then distribution methods came and went. So, you know, our thought was to start... We saw the white space around day-to-day news and then cultural trends that were just part of that. And then really our audience, we became pen pals with. And that became...

our skin ambassadors, which are many of our super users. And they were the ones that we were talking to. We were in a huge Facebook group with, we had focus groups and events just for them and this whole other line of programming. And what we would hear from them really dictated

how we started to evolve. So the thought of making things in your life more accessible, understanding that you have a limited time in your day, everyone does no matter what you do, no matter, you know, what your responsibilities are, there's only so many hours in a day. And so everyone has things that they have to do, whether they like it or not.

And so we wanted to really start to distill, how do you make the best decision you can with the amount of time that you have? And that started to just be, you know, how do I think about a prenup? How do I find childcare?

Here's a tough situation I'm in. And all of that was heavily influenced by the authentic conversations that were happening in the groups that really our SCEM ambassadors had created.

I love how you mentioned in those early days that you dropped off postcards, right? You were still trying to figure out who was going to read this and beyond you two, right? And I think that so often the founding of any business starts with this idea that often the founder is thinking, I need this type of business. But then, you know, you weren't in college anymore, yet you thought,

this would be really useful to people in college. And then you had this data that you looked at, that you started to look at, how do I target? Who are these super users? I'd be so curious to hear, when did you start to really understand who this audience was? And I think the second part of the question is,

I'm sure you have people that are still your super users that were in the beginning and their life has changed as you talked about prenups, kids, all those things. How do you think about the consumer that's been with you for a long time versus new audiences? How do you rank them in terms of importance? Okay.

Well, we're first and foremost, so grateful for those who have been with us, like truly this whole journey. Like, I mean, you know, companies talk about like LTV and, you know, the, the lifetime value of a user. And it's like, we have had such loyalty to this brand from the beginning that we,

the fact that we have users that have literally been with us for 10 plus years is unheard of. I think going back to your first question, we knew who our audience was instinctually before we even launched. It was just a good unspoken thing. I think we knew we were a part of it. We knew our friends were a part of it, just demographically. It's so funny because this

this obviously shows like how much has changed since we launched, but the word millennial was never like used. Like we did not know we were millennials. So I remember Googling literally like women in their twenties and thirties. And it was like female millennial, here's all the power that she has. Here's where she's falling behind. And we were like, Oh, just like we thought. And so we knew early on, like, this is who we are creating products for. I think we were like,

happily surprised to see there was like an intergenerational aspect to it where our target audiences, mom or aunt or whomever loved the voice, loved what we were doing. And we had a lot of high school who then became college kids who were like, this is how I, you know, teachers are like, this is how I teach current events to my class. So we, we definitely started to straddle kind of both ends of the age spectrum. But I think over time, like,

as we got more, I wanted to, yes, we got more sophisticated in like the data perspective, but also we've been built on zero and first party data since like the very beginning. We just didn't know what it was called that. So we literally would get your pen pals as Daniel said, like with our audience and we have people would just literally write like reply to the email and they'd say, Hey, I love what you're doing. I work in marketing. I figured you'd want to know about me. So here you go. And

And it would be like, here's my household income. Here's where I vacation. Here's where I spend like discretionary funds on. I mean, it was like everything. And so it was honestly understanding our audience. Like our audience told us how to understand them very literally. And then of course, like they grew up, we grew up.

The stakes of all the things in our lives took on more gravity. And that kind of guided the way for us to expand into a lot of the verticals.

I love that. So fundraising, when you look at, I'm sure you have a million wannabe entrepreneurs, existing entrepreneurs who have asked you this question over the course of building the SCIM, but what has been your experience with fundraising?

It's brutal. And I think anyone that, well, I think anyone that tells you it's not is either lying or they have managed to be like, just hit gold with big tech or data play at the exact right time. I think it is something that is so heavily dependent on, uh,

the momentum that you can create and how do you spin a narrative over the time that it takes you to fundraise that keeps your brand, company, executive team positioned as a hot thing that you want to get into. I think so much of it is marketing. Yeah, definitely. I think...

Something no one told me before fundraising was that often people will actually meet with you, but they don't use your service or they don't drink your beverage. Right. And so you you're walking into this den of people. And I think you guys agree.

can probably relate, where they're like, I don't get it. Why would you? What's the difference? And so you're so excited and so enthused. But if you've got an audience that really is not there and there's almost no way they're going to get there, the likelihood of turning them around is very unlikely.

Absolutely. I mean, I think looking back on both sides, like if you're in venture, let's just say you're just talking about venture capital, it's like part of people's success in that world is like pattern recognition. Like they can recognize similar steps or similar goals.

things that make them think of a company that maybe did incredibly well or maybe didn't. And like that expertise and pattern recognition makes an investor really, really strong. And the same way that also for as a entrepreneur pattern recognition makes an

The decisions that you make over time, much stronger. You start to realize when you're hiring people, I've seen this show before, like this is going to work or it's not, you know, debates. Like you're like, I've seen this before, like now just to make a decision. When I think back to like the early days of,

And how funding fundraising was just torture. And it was torture before we had anything. And it was torture when we actually had a lot. It just is not a, unless you were very lucky, it is not a great experience. And I think what we did it, what we had to learn was like the pattern recognition of, of,

When somebody is kind of just BSing you and like taking a meeting because they're supposed to take meetings and believing what they're telling you of like, this could be really interesting. Like, let me take it back to the partnership. And you're like, oh, this is like happening. And then nothing, you never hear from them again. So I think like understanding, we didn't have any understanding of that. So we were very like naive in the sense of like, we're like, that was a good meeting. They seemed really engaged versus picking up

the cues of maybe we weren't talking to the decision maker. Maybe we weren't talking to somebody who ever invests in consumer. So, you know, when I think about what made it so hard, there are certainly the biases that we all know about female founded companies, lack of female partners, like all of the things, biases against first time founders, all the things. But also like we were not sophisticated enough to recognize that

those patterns and could have saved ourselves a lot of time. Yeah, definitely. So co-founders, you co-founded the SCIM together. Any thoughts on if you were giving...

Maybe somebody launching a company about having a co-founder, maybe things that you found along the way were really important in working together to define any of those thoughts on the topic of co-founders. I think if you have a co-founder, you have it, it,

you need to make sure you have the right one more than having one. I think if you have the right co-founder, it is a miracle and also one of the best, I think, advantages you can have in building a business because there is someone else that understands inherently like the stress, the joy, the frustrations, all of it without having to speak. And that comes in

handy when you're exhausted. I think that there was such a trend when we started where it was like, oh, I started a business with my roommate. And it's funny, we would laugh because we were roommates. But

I had had a good amount of roommates who I adore, but I wouldn't have started a business with them. And I think, you know, we've, we've coached people a lot about the benefits of having co-founders and how grateful we are to have had each other. And at the same time, you know, kind of warn them that I think having the wrong partnership can also be the hardest thing

making the journey to success even harder. Yeah, definitely. I think, you know, going back to even the raising money topic, I feel like I founded, co-founded it with my husband. And the number of times that we heard like, oh, I don't know. I don't know how you, we don't understand that. That seems like insane to me.

Yeah, but it works for us. But we're very, very different skill sets. But I will never forget when we were talking to a VC early on and he actually wanted to talk to my husband. He said, I want to talk privately to you. And I was like, amazing. And so he talked to him and he said, listen, we really want to invest in him. We really believe in it.

Kara and you both have amazing experience in tech. We, you know, really want to do this, but you know, the, the, the, the husband and wife thing doesn't like, it just never ends well. And he was like, what, what are you talking about? And he said, well, you know, there's just a lot of like divorces and then the company breaks up and, you know, he's just listening and,

to what this gentleman was saying. And, and he said, Oh, I'm just curious, like what companies have you seen that happen in? And, uh, he said, well, I can't really think of one right now. And the net of it, I just, he got off the phone. He said, well, I don't know, but that's just kind of what our firm thinks. And I, and I, and I just started laughing. I said, you know, there's, uh,

he can't even name the, the example. And I said, it's probably not really the reason why he's not investing, but I think people just have these perceptions about why they're doing something. I mean, I'm like in awe that you were able to do that with a spouse. I think that is, I cannot imagine how hard that is in the same way that people are like, I can't imagine how hard it is for you and Danielle, like as friends to have done this for so long. I think though, like,

whether you are actually married or not, like having a co-founder is a type of marriage. And what are like the things that you have to talk about? And where I see a lot of people, we've coached a lot of people on this,

Or I'm like, don't move forward with this person or this scenario is they don't have the talks before they start. And so it's like in the same way, when you get married, like you have to talk about like finances, you have to talk about what happens. How do we disagree? What are our values as a future family? What, uh, you know, like, how do we want to fight? Like what, you know, you, people go to like couples counseling to figure all of that out. And, um,

One of the things, and honestly, there's some stuff that I look back, I'm like, oh, we were so naive on one thing. But on this part, actually, I'm so impressed that we knew to do this at 25 and 26. We sat down and basically wrote a prenup as if we were getting married. And we talked about everything. And it was like, what if...

something happens to you. What it like, what happens to your, to your equity? Like, I remember we like, I mean, this was before spouses, we literally had a conversation around like how to like tap in our siblings. We were like, what happened with, you know, one of us needs time off, which has happened. And so I think those types of conversations and also like the real parody and

um, economic incentives, economic incentive alignment is so important because a lot of times people use the word co-founder, but they don't actually mean co-founder. They mean I'm the founder and I have somebody who is a partner in my business, but that's not a co-founder different. It's different. And that's where I see a lot of people end up getting really hurt or like see the writing on the wall already and then don't know what to do.

So what do you think has helped the SCIM remain so culturally relevant for so long? Authenticity in that we know where we come from. And I think that's us as people, which has influenced us.

our team that we've been in business for, you know, together, the two of us, and this is how we work. This is how we communicate. And that sets, I think, cultural expectations and norms. I think also with authenticity and remembering where we came from, it is the millions of women who opened up to us who were so, you know,

thankful that they did and that we could be inspired by their stories and what they needed and create, try to create those things to actually help people make the decisions that are right for them.

Well, you guys have done such an amazing job. I mean, I'm so proud of you both. You guys should be so proud of yourself. And I think so often as founders, we don't stop and say that, but it's, you've built, I mean, the skim wouldn't be here.

today if it weren't for you two. And I know the sacrifices that you go through and it's not easy. And yet people think it's glamorous and, you know, you get to have the brand attached to you. But there's a lot of things that you have to think about and, you know, climb over those walls, knock down those barriers along the way that you guys have done an amazing job of

in doing that. So thank you for doing that. And thank you so much for sharing the incredible journey and all of your wisdom with us today. To learn more about the SCIM, head over to the SCIM.com and follow Carly and Danielle on their social too. We'll have all the info in the show notes. But thank you again. And thanks everyone for joining us on today's episode. Until next time. Thanks.

Thank you so much. It was so great. Thank you very much. Thanks again for listening to The Kara Golden Show. If you would, please give us a review and feel free to share this podcast with others who would benefit. And of course, feel free to subscribe so you don't miss a single episode of our podcast.

Just a reminder that I can be found on all platforms at Kara Golden. I would love to hear from you too. So feel free to DM me. And if you want to hear more about my journey, I hope you will have a listen or pick up a copy of my Wall Street Journal bestselling book, Undaunted, where I share more about my journey, including founding and building Hint.com.

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