Deep Dive
Shownotes Transcript
Want the same expert advice you get from the pros in the store while shopping online at DiscountTire.com? Meet Treadwell, your personal online tire guide that matches you with the perfect tire for your vehicle. Get your best match in one minute or less with Treadwell by Discount Tire. Let's get you taken care of.
Today's top story, the flavor merger of the century between the peanut butter group and Chocolaty Corp. Joining me is a PBC executive. Thanks for having me, Barry. Now, how did you know the merger and the byproduct of it, Jif peanut butter and chocolate flavored spread, would be a success? You know, it was a gut feeling, a rumbling, if you will. Besides, they're two titans of taste. Very true. Goes great with pretzels. And pancakes. Apples too, I bet. Try Jif PBC today.
This episode is brought to you by Progressive, where drivers who save by switching save nearly $750 on average. Plus, auto customers qualify for an average of seven discounts. Quote now at Progressive.com to see if you could save. Progressive.com.
This is Episode 8, Swindled. ♪♪
In every murder investigation, if you find the answers to a few questions, usually you get a better idea of who could be responsible for the crime. Some of those questions are: Who had the physical opportunity and capability of committing the act? Who does the evidence point to? And probably the simplest qualifier of all: Who had motive? Sometimes people appear to have a ton of motive, but yet they're not the killer. That happens all the time.
So, everything I'm going to talk about in this episode is not intended to point the finger directly at one person. Instead, I want to factually walk you through what certain individuals could have stood to gain if John Wells was no longer alive. A big question I keep coming back to with this case is who in the world would have wanted a 17-year-old boy dead? What kind of threat did he pose to anyone?
Figuring out the answers to those two questions took a lot of digging.
It just so happens that in January of 2003, the same year John was killed, the state of Florida made a big change and brought the Florida departments of insurance, treasury, fire marshal, and banking and finance under one single entity.
So I figured Florida DFS was as good a place as any to start searching for records. Turns out, it wasn't. As far as what the state can do, we don't have a database of that nature. So, you know, we wouldn't be able to look up and see if there's any policies available. The DFS agent on the phone told me to contact the National Association of Insurance Commissioners, also known as NAIC.
That entity's website has an online form you can fill out to request a nationwide search for life insurance policy records. I waited almost 90 days, then followed up with a phone call.
- Thank you for calling the National Association of Insurance Commissioners Service Desk. Calls may be recorded for quality and training purposes. If you do not wish to be-- - I quickly learned that the NAIC doesn't have its own database of insurance policy records. NAIC sends a ping to thousands of companies letting them know I'm looking for policy history for John Wells. And if those agencies find a record for a policy, they'll respond.
The good news is that records definitely go back far enough to figure out if John had a policy or even multiple policies taken out on him. Let's say your loved one bought a policy back in like 19...
42, that company most likely has gone out of business or merged with another company by now. And they don't always tell you where the policy is going or who that policy is transferred into. Because when companies merge, they don't always just give them all their policies. They split their policies up to probably five or six different companies.
The bad news is that insurance agencies are not obligated to tell me, a journalist, what policies exist or who the beneficiaries are. Another reason they may not contact you is because you're not the beneficiary or like the executor of the policy. So if you don't hear anything within the 90 days, that typically means that there's no policy out there that you were beneficiary of.
Okay, but if I'm not the beneficiary, someone else could be, and I just won't ever know. Correct, and they will reach out to that individual. Does NAIC tend to have a good amount of insurance companies that they send requests to in the state of Florida, being that it is such a large state? I would say probably the larger the state, the more amount of companies. In the end, because I'm not a relative and I'm not a beneficiary, I can't take my search any further.
Law enforcement could, though. However, I can't find any documentation that detectives working John's case ever conducted a search for life insurance money. Nowhere in their reports does it state they contacted NAIC or subpoenaed an insurance agency for records. My best guess is that John just didn't have life insurance taken out on him, or if he did, no one knew about it.
I know from talking with his mother, Helen, she doesn't think Pat had a policy for John, and Helen and Max certainly didn't. And even if someone did have a policy for John, it's not like they would have been able to cash in on it immediately following his death. He was murdered, and it was unsolved. So it's doubtful any insurance agency would have paid out a policy for a homicide victim.
After my life insurance quest bust, I went back to square one and poured over documents on this case looking for anything that stuck out as potential motive for someone to want John gone. And that's when I realized there was something significant. Several of John's friends who police interviewed at random in 2003 and 2004 had subtly alluded to it.
John and Skip fought a lot and had problems and argued over the sawmill. I thought it was odd that Mel Sr. had not left a will for Skip to inherit the North Fort Myers Bayshore property. He spoke with John four days before he died, and he told me he was looking forward to the future. He said that Mel Sr. left him the sawmill.
Those were voice actors reading witness statements I found in police transcripts. The real identities of these witnesses are redacted, so I don't know who they are. But what they all say, in one way or the other, is that they were faintly aware of something tethering Mel Sr.'s estate to John. To remind you, Mel Sr. is John's step-grandfather by marriage, Pat's second husband, and Skip's actual father.
According to probate records, when Mel Sr. died in June 2003, just mere weeks before John, no one could find a will for him. That document would have designated who Mel Sr.'s sawmill business was going to go to and who would inherit his 45 acres in North Fort Myers on Bayshore Road. At the time, that land, the old farmhouse, and the cattle living on it was worth tens of thousands of dollars.
Deed records show that Mel Sr. and his first wife, Skip's mother, purchased the land for next to nothing in 1973. The sawmill in Arcadia was also a fairly lucrative business. Today, the North Fort Myers land is a coveted piece of property near State Road 31. It's developing into a busy commercial and residential corridor. So needless to say, what belonged to Mel Sr. back in '03 was worth fighting for.
According to Carrie, Skip's girlfriend, who you heard from last episode, Pat and Skip got into a bitter dispute over Mel Sr.'s estate in the fall of 2003, about four or five months after John died. Because no one could find Mel Sr.'s will, the question of who got what became a heated debate. She didn't want Skip to have anything. We had to hire an attorney, real estate attorney, because we were fighting...
Now, naturally, one would think that Skip would inherit at least some of his father's property, and some of it would also go to Pat, his second wife.
But without a will, no one knew for sure. And it wasn't like Mel Sr. was around anymore to clear up the issue. What's interesting to me is that according to several people who knew John, including his mom Helen, his ex-girlfriend Beth Flowers, and his aunt Laura Wells, Mel Sr. had promised John that he would be a beneficiary of his estate.
His mom actually mentioned this during an interview she had with DeSoto County Sheriff's Office back in July of 2003. Maybe John was in that will. I'm going to tell you, that is a big question that somebody needs to find out. Was there a will? I'm telling you, my gut's telling me there's something to do with the probate of Mel and is there or is there not a will? That could answer a lot of stuff.
During Helen's interview, the detectives blew past these statements. They focused more on questioning her about her alibi and learning the ins and outs of her bumpy relationship with Pat. Helen's suspicion that her son might have stood a lot to gain in the wake of Mel Sr.'s death wasn't just her belief, though. John's aunt Laura also remembers hearing something similar. He and Skip were having a little bit of a set-to about who, after the grandfather died, who was going to take over the sawmill.
because the grandfather evidently had promised it to John. And then Skip said that, you know, it was his. I interviewed one of John's friends from high school, a woman named Lacey Backard, who said she also heard from people in the community that shortly before he was killed, John had told people he was expecting to inherit some, if not all, of Mel Sr.'s assets.
When I was a little girl, my family used to go out there and we used to buy wood from his grandpa. There was a wood mill out there. So we used to go buy wood and I guess it was still sitting there. I guess he was going to, when his grandpa passed away, I don't know if it's true or not, but I was hearing it, that he was going to hand that down to him and he was going to start it back up.
You distinctly remember hearing from people in the community that knew a lot of the family members and knew John that there had been some expectation from John that he would inherit Mel Sr.'s sawmill. That's what I think, if I can remember correct. I know it's been a while, but I'm thinking that's what someone had told me, and I don't remember where I heard it. I heard it somewhere.
So, working through the logic here: If it's true Mel Sr. modified or drafted a new will leading up to the summer of 2003, which named John as a significant beneficiary, that would mean after Mel Sr. died in June, John would have been set to inherit a lot once he turned 18. If Skip and Pat didn't want that to happen, that might point to a possible motive for them to want John gone sooner rather than later.
However, my question is, did Mel Sr. ever draft a will at all? Did it ever exist to even go missing? Did someone intend for it to go missing so John could be swindled out of his potential inheritance? Did someone take the document out of the equation and then take John out of the equation? The only place to turn to for answers is public record. So that's what I did. Went on a hunt for this supposed missing will.
Do you want to set your child up for success? IXL Learning is an online learning program for kids covering math, language arts, science, and social studies. IXL is designed to help them really understand and master topics in a fun way. Powered by advanced algorithms, IXL gives the right help to each kid no matter the age or personality. IXL is used in 95 of the top 100 school districts in the US.
There's one site for all the kids in your home, pre-K to 12th grade. Kids can even access IXL on the go through the app or on your phone or tablet. No more trying to figure out how to explain math equations or grammar rules yourself. IXL has built-in explanation videos.
And look, my son is only two and a half right now, but I can already tell by the time he is in school, he is going to appreciate having someone explain why something is the way it is. He doesn't like just to be told. So those explanation videos are going to be super helpful. Make an impact on your child's learning. Get IXL now. And CounterClock listeners can get an exclusive 20% off IXL membership when they sign up today at ixl.com slash clock.
Visit iXL.com slash clock to get the most effective learning program out there at the best price.
This message is sponsored by Greenlight. A new school year is starting soon, and if you're a parent, you want to make this school year an opportunity for your kids to learn important life skills and continue building independence. For that, there's Greenlight. Greenlight is a debit card and money app for families where kids learn how to save, invest, and spend wisely, and parents can keep an eye on kids' new money habits.
There's even Greenlight's Infinity Plan, which includes the same access to financial literacy education that makes Greenlight a valuable resource for millions of parents and kids. Plus, built-in safety to give you peace of mind. My son is only two and a half, but already he knows what a card is and what it does. He actually took it up to a vending machine the other day, swiped it, and, well, let's just say he's going to be a spender when he's older.
And so Greenlight is the perfect thing for him. There's even a chores feature that lets you reward your kids for honoring their responsibilities around the house. So what are you waiting for? Sign up for Greenlight today and get your first month free when you go to greenlight.com slash counterclock. That's greenlight.com slash counterclock to try Greenlight for free. greenlight.com slash counterclock.
In the state of Florida, you can access a ton of information, records, and legal filings if you know where to look. According to the DeSoto County Clerk of Court's office, there's a large volume of records on file regarding the probate of Mel Sr.'s estate, but those filings are sealed. They're considered private, not public.
So I can only see abbreviated headings for significant filings in the case. And none of the descriptions indicate that a will was ever found for Mel Sr. or read in any kind of official proceeding. From what I could see, most of the court submissions have to do with Pat, his widow, filing paperwork to ensure she was a representative of his estate.
Attorneys I've spoken with say that if Mel Sr. ever made a will or modified an existing one, it likely was never entered into a court system, meaning the original document and any copies that were made only exist with whoever had the original and the law firm that would have helped him draft it.
The problem is, there are literally thousands of law firms in Southwest Florida that Mel Sr. could have consulted to help him craft a will or rework one to add John as a beneficiary. He could have used legal services anywhere in DeSoto County or in Lee County, where he was originally from. I've had no luck in finding a firm that could have done this for him.
Attorneys retire, die, or merge firms all the time. There's just no way to know if Mel Sr.'s will still exists or who has a copy of it now 19 years later. What I do know is that by the end of 2003, sorting out Mel's probate proceedings without a will allowed things to move swiftly in Pat's favor. The court decided by default that she would get full control of her husband's remains and assets.
She buried him in Joshua Creek Cemetery in the Huff family plot, where, coincidentally, John would also be buried. And according to Carrie and Helen, Pat eventually worked out a deal with Skip to divvy up the North Fort Myers property. There was a little 2-1 house, frame house, with a really nice barn. Skip ended up having to go get a mortgage to pay her to get his own home back that he was actually living in.
Skip and I got a new mortgage on Bayshore and in return to get Bayshore, we had to buy, we had to give her money, Pat money, and we had to give her the 40 acres with the cattle on it on 31 up here. That's the only way that we could get Bayshore back. After Pat and Skip finalized their deal, Gary says everything pretty much went back to normal.
It went on for a few more months, and Pat laid off of Skip. She had told everybody in Arcadia she thought Skip did it, but she kind of let up for a little while. By spring of 2004, Carrie and Skip were working on renovating the dilapidated Bayshore Road house, and Pat sold off most of Mel Sr.'s acreage along with the cattle.
The sawmill remained untouched though, and to this day still exists on the Southeast Hansel Avenue property. I've been told that Matt Wells, John's older brother, maintains it. But when my associate producer David Payne and I took a trip to Arcadia to check it out, we didn't get the impression the sawmill is still operable. There's a distinct feeling that there is to be no access to any of this.
for whatever reason. There are three locks on this gate now. Two no trespassing signs. Which is to the sawmill, which if the sawmill is still active, I mean, I get that. There's some equipment back there. There's some trailers. There's some tractors. That's expensive stuff. But the signage and just sort of the extent of security here and the fact that all of the neighbors seem to be as on board with that is just interesting to me.
It didn't take long after we got out there before a friendly neighbor pulled over to ask us what we were doing. Did you live here back in 2003? Oh, yeah. Name's Edward Mason. Hey, nice to meet you. I'm Delia. This is David. We're doing some research about what happened to John in 2003. John Wells, the teenager. We're trying to kind of chat with some people in the area to figure out, you know, people that were here and it was a big deal and...
Yeah. That was. My total knowledge of it was merely that he ended up disappearing. He had gone out shooting or hunting, whatever the case may be on that, and didn't find him. The point was he didn't come back. And then when they found his body, he was shot. Did you ever have any interaction with him?
So, the sawmill is still active, despite looking like it's been closed for years. Before Edward drove away from us, I asked him if he knew Pat, and he said he'd known her for decades. He called her Patsy.
When I asked him if he'd ever spoken to her about John's murder or would respond well to us knocking on her front door, he had a strange reply. Patsy wouldn't shoot anybody. Patsy wouldn't shoot anybody. I had to wonder why that was the response he chose. From the looks of things, Pat and Skip made out pretty well when it came to keeping control of Mel Sr.'s North Fort Myers property and the sawmill in Arcadia.
In the wake of Skip and Pat's arrangement, Helen was outraged. When the one-year anniversary of John's murder rolled around, law enforcement had still gotten nowhere in the case, and the two people Helen felt knew more than they were saying were living normal lives and splitting up property she felt would have been intended for John if he'd lived. She couldn't prove that, but still, she had a gut feeling.
Everything that had happened in the first year of her son's death caused Helen to reach her breaking point. She launched her own public awareness campaign, which included printing and posting hundreds of neon yellow flyers that offered an undisclosed monetary reward for information in the case. At the top of the flyer was an ominous message written in bold. It said, quote, End quote.
The flyers featured a photo of John along with a copy of his death certificate. Helen even paid to have several large campaign signs printed with similar messaging. You can see photos of these signs on the blog post for this episode. Every day, Helen would drive from Lee County to DeSoto County and staple hundreds of her flyers on telephone poles and fence posts surrounding her mother's property in Arcadia. And in Northport Myers, at Carrie and Skip's house, she took it a step further.
We came home one day and we had contractors there that were doing ceiling work. We came in and our whole house, the whole inside shell was covered with flyers and buttons and paperwork on the murder of John. And I looked up and Skip said, well,
I said, what is this? And he said, well, obviously Helen's been here. And all down Old Bayshore on every tree, there were flyers nailed to every tree. And I asked the contractors, I said, where did this come from? And they said some woman came up in here and said that Skip had murdered her son. And I just hit the roof.
Carrie and Skip never retaliated against Helen, but for months they lived knowing full well that she was watching them. Helen says over time, though, she gave up hounding Skip. They had lawyered up, nobody was talking, and nobody was getting anywhere.
And she's right. On multiple occasions in 2003 and 2004, both Skip and Pat had declined law enforcement's offer to take polygraphs. Each of them had hired attorneys, and they were no longer cooperating fully with police. They, along with Patrick Skinner, had already given FDLE their fingerprints and saliva samples, and they felt they had nothing else to offer.
The only thing police could do was keep waiting for DNA testing results to come in on items of evidence they'd sent off in the fall of 2003. Authorities' hope was that something from those results would confirm their suspicions about Pat and Skip, or point them towards a new avenue of investigation. In November 2004, all of the information police had been waiting for came in.
The lab determined that there were traces of John's DNA on the right side fender mud flap of the four-wheeler and the barrel of his gun. That was no surprise, since techs had already determined from prior blood testing that John's blood was located in those spots. His DNA being in those places was expected. Technicians had also extracted DNA from the buckle of one of John's belts and found it had a mixture of two people's profiles on it.
One was John's, and one belonged to another person the lab couldn't fully identify. Patrick and Skip were definitively ruled out as contributors, but Pat couldn't be excluded. But that wasn't necessarily a slam dunk either, because authorities knew that Pat had touched John's belt when she handed them over to detectives the day after John's death.
The lab also found DNA on the empty Coors Light beer can, but there wasn't enough genetic material present to develop a readable profile. No DNA whatsoever showed up on John's thigh strap. What I find odd is that according to FDLE's report, Tex decided not to conduct any DNA analysis on the handle of John's revolver, his other belt, the four-wheeler center console, right clutch handle, foot brake, or engine.
The lab also did not do DNA extraction on what I think could be the most important pieces of evidence in the case: the bullets. Nowhere in the forensic reports could I find documentation that the FDLE lab examined the five unfired 17 caliber bullets and the one fired shell casing that law enforcement found in John's gun. Now, to me, that seems like a huge oversight.
I'm not saying whoever shot John loaded his gun. More than likely, John loaded his gun. But I mean, to not even attempt to look for foreign DNA on those pieces of evidence seems outrageous to me. I don't know if this is because FDLA just didn't want to test these items, or they weren't asked to, or they didn't have the technology to. But whatever the reason, it's extremely frustrating to me.
And DeSoto County Sheriff's Office was feeling equally as frustrated about the DNA testing results by the end of 2004. Investigators had hit a complete wall in the case and were at a loss as to how to move forward. On December 6th, 2004, almost a year and a half after John's murder, FDLE sent a memo to the Florida Lieutenant Governor's Office explaining the dire status of the case. It says in part, quote,
No evidence of value to prosecution noted.
Both agencies will do all possible to solve."
And that's where the criminal investigation into John's case stayed for two years, until detectives re-interviewed John's older brother. And a simultaneous tip came in in the fall of 2006 that reignited the investigation. But this new information had nothing to do with the people law enforcement had labeled their prime suspects. This information pointed to a person of interest that police had never considered
an acquaintance of John's who'd made some startling claims to a girlfriend in the years after the murder. That's on the next episode of CounterClock. Sketch. Listen right now.
Dental One Associates, redefine what it means to visit the dentist. Get top quality personalized support from committed experts that prioritize the well-being and satisfaction of you and your family. Care is centered on a highly personalized treatment plan backed by the trust and support of long-lasting relationships. Find out how you can make an appointment for a custom smile design experience by visiting doa-seriousxm.com.
A more colorful life starts at an Ashley store. From earth tones to vibrant colors, Ashley stores have an array of eye-catching furniture for every room in fun and trending hues that will leave a lasting impression. So it's easier than ever to express your personal style and design a vibrant home that feels just like you. Your more colorful life starts at an Ashley store. Shop in-store or online at ashley.com.