Juneteenth Special: Tia Turner #Caravan4Justice
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What's going on everybody? I'm Marah. And I'm Tess. And welcome back to Sisters Who Kill. I hope that everybody enjoyed their Juneteenth. A holiday worth celebration, worth demonstration, worth education about our emancipation. What a beautiful holiday to have. This week we decided to tell you a story that's different from all the stories that we've ever told before.

This week, we'll tell you a story about a woman who is continuing to fight for our freedom, fight for equality, and now is fighting for her freedom. Our players this week are Brian Willis, victim, Danielle Lindgren, victim, and Tatiana Turner, victim.

are murderous. Well, accused. Tatiana Turner is mostly known as Tia Turner. Now, Tia Turner is a Justice Impact Black woman and founder of Caravan for Justice. Now, Tia was formerly incarcerated. She is a convicted felon for drug sales and domestic violence. When she was released from prison in 2008, she decided that she was going to get herself together and she wanted to do something different.

Bigger. Something better. So she pursued her dreams. She received degrees in audio engineering and moved to Southern California to get into the entertainment industry.

While in Southern California, she decided that she was going to shift gears just a little bit. She committed herself to helping those in her community, those that were disadvantaged, and she really wanted to make sure that she saw a world of peace. Tia wanted to dedicate herself to connecting people with social services, civil engagement, both political and nonpolitical action, to change the economy as a whole. Because when she looked out her window, she saw that change was

was happening too slowly. In March of 2020, when COVID shut down the whole world, of course, everybody was glued to their phone. We're TikTok-ing, we're scrolling, we're stuck in the house. And there was this huge Black Lives Matter movement going on. It seemed like every week there was another victim of police brutality. It was so upsetting to be a Black person in America at the time.

On March 13th of 2020, news of Breonna Taylor's murder hit the airwaves and the people would not rest. Say her name, say her name, say her name. It continued on May 25th of 2020.

We all watched the last 9 minutes and 29 seconds of George Floyd's life. He cried for his mother. He begged the police holding him down, saying he couldn't breathe, which started a new movement. Now we're not saying, "Say her name." Now we're saying, "I can't breathe." And it was just very hard to be heard in this time. We're all, you know, feeling stuck. We were on the wave of, like, a new revolution. You know what I mean? And all these organizations were getting together.

It was like the new age of civil rights. It was a time for us to reinforce the message of freedom. And we were going out and protesting police brutality.

Tia wanted to be a part of this movement. She wanted to make sure that her voice and the voice of her community was heard, which led her to establishing the Caravan for Justice. They describe themselves as a grassroots campaign dedicated to educating, organizing, and mobilizing their community. They say, quote, our focus is bringing awareness to social justice. On the Caravan for Justice Instagram, the earliest post was June 2nd, 2022.

Protesters were peacefully taking a knee in Long Beach, California. You can see signs ranging from "Black is Beautiful" to "Prosecute Killer Cops" or else. You see signs that say, "The white people that need to see these signs are not even here," which is true. The next day, the IG posts called for a car protest. This seemed to be the way that Caravan for Justice did their movement.

They would come out in their cars and they would caravan for justice, but not just cars, skateboarders, bikers, motorcyclists. You got wheels, you're in there. They would protest against police injustice, fight for things that people need, fight for real freedom for us, like safe housing, restorative justice, youth programming. Through May, June, July of 2020, this organization is flooding the internet with action plans. They're coming up with peaceful protests.

They've got a Skate for Peace event. They're giving educational materials to their followers. They're giving mindful tips for Black people and how they can move or heal themselves through this pivotal point in history. And then in August of 2020, Care for and for Justice hosted multiple protests. They had people coming out. This was really becoming, you know, a thing, a nice gathering for people. You know, this is—this was 2020.

And of course, that was always met with police, with guns, batons, tear gas, counter protesters, the Proud Boys. As much as it felt probably relieving to go out there and press to us and feel like you have a voice and stand up, it was scary. Like, I remember being 20, 20, I was like, I don't know what's scarier, like,

the protesting or COVID because people were getting arrested, people were getting killed, people were getting beat up for begging for peace in the streets. At an August protest in Tijuana, California, a man was shot. This older man was at the protest. He was taking pictures and he ended up being shot by Trump supporters. Tia and her team realized that they had to strategize. They had power in numbers, but

So did the Trump supporters. And they had to start thinking about how they can safely protest. At this time, Tia started working with other self-defense groups around the city. She decided the main thing here, of course, is peaceful protest. But if we're not being met with peace, self-defense has to be a priority. The people that were working with her, they were making shields out of barrels. They were learning how to protect people.

their face their nose they were walking around with batons and with pepper spray now here's the thing because tia is a convicted felon technically she's not allowed to walk around with these things now she is allowed to have a stun gun she is allowed to have a taser but she's not allowed to have pepper spray she's not allowed to have any other type of like weaponry such as a baton

She's seen in video with some of her leaders in her movement, and they're learning how to make a human shield with their guards because they need to be prepared when they are approached by those counter-protesters.

Now, these Caravan for Justice protests, they were happening in these inhospitable areas of Orange County. Protests, they were loud and they were really making moves. And when you're loud and you're really making moves and you're posting on social media, you're continuing to educate, you're having a protest every week at different places, not just talking about freedom from police brutality, talking about the leaders that are currently in office not doing their jobs, and you make a little bit of noise,

Trust me, the counter protesters are going to come. One time in Long Beach, a middle school teacher got into a brawl with protesters from the Caravan for Justice and safety was really being concerned. It wasn't just men. It was women out there because the counter protest is like, I hold a sign that says Black Lives Matter. You hold a sign that says white people matter.

That's a counter-protest. And it can also be peaceful. You actually do have the right to demonstrate just like I have the right to demonstrate. But what you don't have the right to do is put your hands on me. And these organizations had to realize that we love, love peaceful protests, but self-defense is something that we actually have to gear up for. Now, in September of 2020, a huge rally march was being organized by the Urban Organizers Coalition.

So this is 26 organizations that are coming together to support unity in the community, which I think is really important. Like we can have all of these grassroots organizations, but how are we working together, really working together? And of course, Caravan for Justice were ready to show up. They were posting on their social media about the rally that was happening and told everybody to bring their signs, bring their good walking shoes and

and to bring peaceful enthusiasm. They also put out a call for volunteers because they were expecting a really huge turnout. And of course, on the other side of the internet, there were counter protesters that were getting ready to show up as well.

There's this post that was from a counter protester called Olea Zalea, and it says urgent. BLM protesters are coming to Yerba Linda this Saturday, 926 at 2 p.m. near the Richard Nixon Library. We've all seen how most of these protests end up. They want nothing more than to create havoc and lawlessness in our cities. They hate America, calling all out.

Patriots, it's our duty to defend our cities and support our local law enforcement officers. Bring your flags, signs, voices, and show these America-hating anarchists that we will not stand by it and America is here to stay. America flag emoji, white arm holding up a muscle emoji.

It's really crazy, like, when these white people talk and they're like, "We need America." And it's like, why does it feel like America doesn't include me even though I'm American? You know what I'm saying? Because, like... Why would I feel like you're like, "America, I'm not part of that"? But here's the thing. Like, you want America, but, like, it is in our Constitution that I have a right to protest. Right. It also isn't, you know, liberty and justice for all. So if this is America,

It should be liberty and justice for literally all. It can't be just liberty and justice for you. And I think like this behavior starts that divide when you even just start to fear patriotism, right? I feel like Black Americans hate their country more than any other country. There's so much pride. People wave their flags. I feel like the only Black Americans who have flags or wave flags

are in the military and are proud to be in the military. You know what I mean? But we don't just have that outright love of country. And let's not get into the history of Black people in the military. You know, so it's just like, I think we struggle to have that outright love of country because our country has never loved us.

Very, very true. The Caravan for Justice, they have worked really hard to try and get this protest together. They did not get a permit, but they did speak with the mayor of Yerba Linda, you know, let them know that they were going to be at the Yerba Linda library protesting and just tried to make sure that they came off as peaceful as possible. On September 26, 2020, several dozen people came out.

and gathered for Care of InforJustice. You know, basically decided to occupy the Yerba Linda Library parking lot. It's about 30 miles southeast of LA. Across the street, it was at least 100 people, maybe even 200 people. They've got their flags. It's Proud Boys. It's the MAGA hats.

It's the three percenters, the people who you don't want to be around late at night when nobody's looking. And they're across the street on the other side of Imperial Highway. Initially, the authorities were like, "Listen, I know you guys are on different sides of this. Please, let's keep it peaceful. You stay over there, you stay over there." And at first, this had been getting respected,

But people were throwing middle fingers across the street. Ah, fuck you. Yeah, fuck you too. Da-da-da-da. The confrontation just grew. It became heated. It's very hard to be around a space when people truly do not like you. And there's a difference between people not liking you for a good reason and people not liking you for straight-up racism.

The Orange County Sheriff's Department was called out there and they declared the whole thing an unlawful assembly. And it was like, you go home, you go home, shut this down. So there's about 250 people in total. They're shutting this down because people are getting in a fight. There have been calls saying that some people are carrying weapons and it's supposed to be a peaceful protest. People have been pepper sprayed. And now the cops are out here saying disperse, disperse. And people aren't listening to them either. One of the members of the group

You know, was stating we don't encourage mayhem. We don't like the looting or the vandalism. That's not how we get our point across. But we do show up in riot gear such as masks and jock cups and helmets because we have to protect ourselves, not just from these counter protesters across the street, but from the police. Because it's so quick for them to turn against us, too. It's so easy for them to be the one doing the tear gas and for them to sick the dogs and for them to be waving epitomies.

And I think it also like being prepared, because if I reach out to the mayor and say, hey, I'm about to have a protest here. I just want to let you know, is there any permits that we need? They asked for permits and they were like, the law there is that if it's under 500 people who you don't need a permit. And there were still about 250 people there. So they were underneath the level of people that needed a permit. But the 250 are between the MAGA and the Caravan for Justice.

are letting you know that we're protesting here and we also would appreciate your support. That is honestly the most peaceful way that you can go about it. I didn't just show up randomly and be like, hey, yeah, fuck you. I'm saying, hey, I'm about to demonstrate just making sure that everybody's on their P's and Q's. Make sure that y'all telling people to come in to work, you know? Things are starting to get crazy and Tia decides...

Let me listen and get in my car and leave. So she's in her car and 12, maybe 15 Trump supporters come over to her car. They surrounded her Nissan Sentra. They're like, fuck you, America. They're chanting USA, USA. Like, what is that? What are you telling me? Am I shouting USA at me? Like, I don't understand.

Yes, that's where we live. We are currently in the United States of America. Tia's feeling very uneasy at this point. She's in her car. She's being told to leave. There's helicopters flying above her saying, disperse, disperse, clear the area, disperse. And she's like, I mean, I'm in my car, but I am surrounded. She calls 911 and she's like, hey, there's an angry mob around me. The people are surrounding my car.

They're pulling out weapons. They're pulling out guns. And the lady's on the phone saying, calm down, calm down. Can you tell me what this man looks like? What is he wearing? What type of gun does he have? Is he pointing it at you? Tell me your exact location. And all while this is happening, it's not some calm environment. It's people outside hitting on her car, beating on her shit. Like she's like kind of blocked in. They're all around the front of the car.

And it's like it's not one person. People are right with me. So are they wearing their wearing clothes? They've got guns, babes. The people are outside. They're chanting so loud she can't even hear the operator over all the yelling and banging on her car over the helicopter telling him to get out. One of the Trump supporters walks around to the back of her car and like kicks it from the back.

And I guess the car rocks a little bit. He's facing away from her car, but he, like, backkicks the back of her car. Rocks her car a little bit. People are still banging on her car. They end up busting out her back windshield, and she's like, "Okay, oh, hell nah. It's time for me to get the fuck out of here, 'cause y'all on another one." So she tries to, like, inch her car forward, give a little warning. They're not really going anywhere.

When she's seen guns, she's feeling threatened. So she's like, okay, I'm going to try and take this gap that I got. And hopefully these people realize that this car is moving to get out the way. She pushes on the gas. She kind of makes her way through the crowd. I say she's going maybe like,

20 miles an hour, maybe 30, right? And then she kind of peels off and then she stops a little bit. Now, when she peels off, it was a little rocky. There was a big, a little hump that she hit. And that little hump was two people. She ends up rolling over Brian Willis's leg. And they say that she ran over Danielle Lynn Green's head.

But Danielle did not die. So for me, that feels improbable. Like, maybe the wheel kind of skirted her forehead or something. But a car weighs, like, over a ton, right? At least one ton, right? I'm thinking that goes over your head, you're done.

Your neck or anything like that? No, not necessarily. Not necessarily, honestly. I don't want y'all to test it out on me. I saw the video. Her head was definitely under the tire, but that is not necessarily going to kill you. You can have head trauma. It could be about speed. It could be how the tire hit her head.

That's what I'm saying. I'm like, maybe not the whole tire. I mean, I don't know that the whole car went over it. That's what I'm saying. Right. But it definitely, the way they phrase it. The tire definitely made contact with her head for sure. When they say ran over her head, it feels like fully over. And I'm thinking maybe the edge of the tire might have skirted you. You know what I mean? But that still ran over.

There's getting shot and there's getting grazed. A newspaper said that her injuries were moderate, so they weren't severe. It wasn't she did not have life threatening injuries, even with the trauma of being ran over. Because, I mean, it was let's go ahead and just call a spade a spade. But it wasn't life threatening. She wasn't in critical injury. She wasn't in severe injuries.

Oh, yeah. I mean, she was able to walk afterwards. Her head was bleeding for sure. But you can still get ran over. She got ran over, Tazzy. She just, you know, got lucky, honestly. As hell, I guess. Shit. If a tire hits my face, I got ran over. Yes, I know you. I get it. You're going to yell the deepest threats of what I'm like. And so you think this woman, this hating-ass woman is not going to do the same? She absolutely is. I do, but I can still call it out.

The language that they're using, it's really making it seem like she squashed a watermelon, and that's not so much the case. No, no one said that she was dead. As she's going out of here, trying to get out of this area, Brian Willis is running towards the car. He's taking pictures. He walks around the back. He gets a license plate. He's up in her face, taking pictures with the camera or whatever. And so when she pulled off, he kind of got...

stuck under the bumper and he broke both of his legs. The right tire, the front right tire went over his right leg and it caused the compound fracture. And Danielle, she was standing right behind Brian when this happened and she fell as the car was moving forward. And that's when Tia's wheel kind of got hurt. But they were both taken from the scene into the hospital.

And a newspaper said that both of the injuries were moderate. Not severe, moderate. Tia, she kind of drove up a little more and kind of stopped again, I guess in recognizing, hey, maybe I've hurt somebody. And they swarmed her car again. It's like they said, get her, pull her out the car.

"Get her, get her, she ran over those people, pull her out the car." You could see them on the video grabbing at her doors, legit trying to get her out the car. - That's the scariest part for me. - That's the scariest part, right? They've got their flags, they're banging their flags at her car. - Like, "Oh shit, they're actually gonna kill me now." - Like, "They're gonna hang my ass." Even, there's this video as she tries to drive off from the second part of it, and it looks like this man, a lot of people chase after her car on foot, and it looks like this man is right by her window,

It's hard to tell, but it looks like he's pointing a gun at her and running like he's about to shoot her ass, and she kind of just pulls off. She ended up being stopped by some deputies down the road, and she was taken in handcuffs, where they later charged her with six felonies, including driving her car through a crowd of people. And at 40 years old, she was back in jail on a $1 million bond. I was expected to appear in court the next Tuesday.

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When this rally happened and when this video and these pictures hit the internet, I mean, the internet turned the fuck up. There is this dude, he's known as Mikey Knuckles. His name is Mick Sobscat.

Okay, so let's pretend like we put the whole video clip in there. This is outrageous. You literally hear them in the background saying, I'm trying to be peaceful. Do not come over here. And it's literally him being like, I don't give a fuck about your peace. And I think that that language is what everybody was hearing in 2020. Like, hey, hey, don't want to hurt you. Don't want to hurt you. Don't want to hurt you. But you're not going to slap me on one side of my face and then think I'm going to turn and give you the other cheek to slap too. You know what I'm saying? Mm-mm.

When protesters were being interviewed, they said, listen, we were not there to fight. We were not there for violence. We were there to express our feelings. And the community of Yerba Linda was not happy with us being there. One of the women said she was like, we were protesting and a woman came up to my face and looked me in my eyes and said to me, I'm a racist and you need to get out of my town. You need to go back where you came from.

And she said that was the scariest I have ever been, which is terrifying to me because people show you their racism. They treat you with their racism. But to look me dead in my eyeballs and say, yeah, motherfucker, I'm a racist. And I need you to fucking go. That's terrifying. Also, the protesters were like, listen, the police failed to intervene. We made contact with them early. We...

asked them to keep the peace. They should have been on both sides making sure that everybody stayed on their sides of the protest. You are allowed to protest. You are allowed to counter protest. But stay your ass on your side of the street and we'll stay our ass on our side of the street. And I think that that is the most that they could ask for, but they didn't get that. Now, obviously, the intention was for no one to get hurt. So immediately, the Urban Organizers Coalition issued a statement expressing their heartfelt sympathies for those that were injured.

This wasn't the first time that people and vehicles have collided with protesters across the city from both sides. We've seen in L.A. like the Thursday before this, that several drivers from the like anti Black Lives Matter movement group of people,

They were colliding with protesters and no one was being charged. A pickup truck in Hollywood. And granted, she suffered non-life-threatening injuries just like these folks suffered non-life-threatening injuries. But still, I'm being hit by vehicles and no one cares about our Black asses or even not even if they Black, our protesting asses for equality that the other person won't get charged. But when we hit somebody...

We're getting charged with attempted murder? No. And even when they were getting charged, they got like $25,000 bail. Not a million dollars. Ain't nobody got a million dollars. While the police were investigating, they decided to pay Brian a visit at the hospital. When he was interviewed at the hospital, he said, when she got back in her car, there was no one threatening her. There was no one hitting her car.

She could have easily just sat in that car. She could have gone the other way. They said that we saw her. She was out there with pepper spray. She was out there with the baton stick. And I've seen videos of her at different protests. And she's had a stick with her. And I've also heard her yelling, back up, back up. Get off me. Get off me. Give me my six feet. Back up, back up. And he said, I'm

After all that happened, I followed her car because I was going to get that license plate information. I was going to make sure that she was sent to justice. You got two broken legs. Hey, you followed the car. Cool, cool, cool, cool, cool. He said, I was going to get her. And she looked me right in my eyes before she hit the gas. I thought I was going to die. And the police said, OK, can you let us know what did she look like? Can you describe her to me? He said, she looked like a short Hispanic bitch.

And they said, no, she light-skinned it. You know who she looked like for real? She looks like New York's redacted. Yeah. Don't she? I could see it. And so... And...

There are reports that Brian tried to reach out to police multiple times to get her home address. And thankfully, the police decided to do their job and not share that critical information. But he was trying to. And Danielle, she was in the hospital for a couple months because it is a head injury that is very traumatic, even if you are able to walk afterwards to recover from her injuries.

What happened when I first got here? When I first got here for the first three days, I slept on the concrete downstairs. They put me at the high risk and ISO. And all the officers, especially the male officers, were teasing me and calling me a BLM killer and saying I'm going to prison forever and calling me a man. That was their main thing. I don't know what she is. Vroom, vroom, vroom every time I pass by and shit like that.

So they were just tormenting me. Every time I fall asleep, they kick the door, you know, wake me up. And it was just a hard time with the pain. Then I finally left that a lady saw one of the nurses. I was saying, please, like, I'm not supposed to be in here. And she got the right person to me. That person got me upstairs. Then once I got upstairs, I was in isolation for 14 days. So what happened was because of COVID, everybody's in isolation for 14 days.

So the first thing you do is when you get there, you only get a 20 minute phone call. Normally when you're in jail, you get an hour phone call so you can get out of your shower, clean your cell, put your phone. That wasn't happening. You got 20 minutes, go. So as soon as the door opens, you gotta run out.

which clearly definitely feels like an infringement upon rights. Over the next month or so that she's in jail, she's enlisting help from all these prominent Los Angeles civil rights group, civil rights leader Najee Ali, who has routinely appeared on television after controversial police shootings. And her supporters launched a social media campaign, the hashtag Free Tia, demanding, among other things, that

The authorities released her, reduced her bail amount, and charged the counter-protesters who threatened her. They held a press conference. They made a call to action. And all the while, District Attorney Todd Spitzer is issuing statements, calling her group professional militant organizers.

He said, quote, we support the right to peacefully protest, but these are not peaceful protests. These are organized protests that encourage others to engage in civil disobedience. My advice? Stay away from these events. They're not intended to be peaceful. So your advice to protesting is to not go. Got it. Real effective.

Tia, of course, pleads not guilty. She's now in for the fight of her life. She's facing nine years to life, plus the extra 26 on top of that. Every decision from here on out needs to be the right one because your life is on the line, you know? A spokesperson for the Free Tia movement

said, quote, "When we block traffic, that brings disruption to the status quo. People are in their cars, they begin to get upset, they look out to see what's going on, and that sparks a conversation." He was like, "That is what has sustained the demonstrations over the past few months. That's what we did. That's how we're getting heard out here." The people on Tia's side,

versus the people on the MAGA side. And it really feels like this prosecutor, Spencer, is on the MAGA side. Like, he's got a million-one excuses why there was no way that she could have been right. He says that her group teaches defense tactics to counter police efforts to curb violence.

not at all acknowledging the violence that the police put on them. And maybe the defense tactics are for defense, not offense, you know? He said that Tia's group showed up at the protest with helmets, tactical vests, riot shields, tasers,

And yes, at the same time, there was the larger Trump supporter group. He is saying that it's Tia and her group that are spraying the pepper spray, that are waving the batons, and they're the ones going after the counter-protesters. Tia's group is just responding. We don't encourage the attacks. We don't encourage the looting, the vandalizing, none of that. But we absolutely will support self-defense.

Right. It's basically them trying to figure out what came first, the chicken or the egg, you know? Who threw the first front? Who was violent first? History shows who has been violent first. And the fact that you now have to prove it, it's hard, especially when the law is innately on the side of the people that are starting the violence. That video tells us everything, you know? Mm-hmm.

And then it kind of like sparks a debate of what is the right way to protest, right? Who is really out there to be peaceful? There were statements from a professor at the University of Milwaukee, of Wisconsin, Kenan Ferguson. He said, if your goal is to attract attention, then violence will sometimes result. If your goal is to build community, then you're less likely to get violent. So what are we out here doing? Some others say different tactics, right?

in different contexts make different strategies more useful. So it's all depending on what you're up against when you step out there. Some people say you got to make people uncomfortable. You got to disrupt the spaces that people enjoyed. You got to put a pause on everybody's regular day life. You have to disrupt the routine. It's supposed to be inconvenient. It's supposed to be

you know, disruptive in a sense. Not like in a violent way, but it's supposed to like when they say, "Hey, get your ass out the street. You're blocking traffic." Absolutely, 'cause I need you to stop and listen. Right. Time is passing. Tia is still waiting on her preliminary hearing. 2020 comes and goes.

January 6th of 2021 happens when Trump and his friends storm the Capitol and we're seeing very minimal arrests. We're not seeing the same energy that people are having when it's Black people. I tell you what, if niggas ever tried to storm the Capitol, all they had to shut that shit down.

They came in there with the SWAT team spraying niggas down. There would have been guns a-blazing. There would have been so many deaths because not a single life in that capital would have mattered. Oh, my God. It would have been a completely different story. The fact that people took souvenirs, took pictures, like, had time to stop and pose was on some real bullshit. Like, y'all was at a fucking museum or something. It's crazy.

So her charges are put out there. She got charged with one felony count of attempted murder with premeditation and deliberation, six felony counts of assault with a deadly weapon, including one causing great bodily harm, one felony count of mayhem, two felony counts of the use of pepper spray by a felon. And if she was convicted again, she's facing seven to life plus 26 years.

One thing I see on there that's worth prosecuting is the pepper spray because you had it. Other than that.

In this time, they're just digging, trying to see how else they can stack charges against Tia. So then they look into a protest that she held just a couple of weeks before the one on September 26th. They're like, oh, we're actually going to give you two more charges of causing great bodily injury because they said that she used a four-foot rod to repeatedly beat two men who were lying on the ground after they had been attacked by protesters at Seal Beach demonstration. Don't have any video, don't have any reports on that one.

make your own conclusions. One of the victims had injuries to his head that required him to get staples due to the beating, so they went ahead and tacked that on there too. They filed those additional charges on February 18th of 2021. So time is passing, she's sitting, she's waiting, and on August 31st of 2021, she has her preliminary hearing. And again, it's really two sides of the same war.

He said, she said, who's right, who's wrong? Was this an attack or was this self-defense? The judge, Judge Beatrice M.G. Gordon, she starts this off with expectations that she doesn't expect this to take too long. She estimated about six hours for the preliminary hearing, and the prosecution came up with a witness list so long that...

The preliminary hearings went on for three days. The Orange County Sheriff's investigators and prosecutors said that she was a professional militant organizer and she encouraged others to engage in civil disobedience. And now it's time for everybody to have their testimony. You know, one of the first people that came up to testify was the police that stopped her and, you know, got her out of the car, arrested her. That officer was talking about how there were about 30 counter protesters that chased her

after the incident happened. He said that the car had several broken or shattered windows, not just one, but several. And immediately she told the officer, I'm scared. I'm scared. Please, I'm scared.

Now, they also asked this deputy, OK, what else did you hear? What else happened? And he said that he saw the entire thing go down from the very beginning. And he said that he heard somebody say, don't do it. Don't do it. It's not worth it. Right before Tia's tires screeched as it picked up speed.

Now, Brian, he got on the stand as well to talk about his two legs. His surgeon also got on the stand and talked about his injuries, what his recovery process was like, how serious they were. Because, I mean, if you see the picture of Brian sitting on the side of the road, I mean, I could tell that leg is broke. Oh, for sure. That shit fucked up. It's not completely going another way, but that's a bone, and it is not supposed to look like that. Yeah.

Like, you don't see bone, but you can see under the skin that that bone is not in place. Exactly. And so they asked him, like, OK, what were you wearing? And he was wearing at the protest a shirt that was referencing the three percenters, you know, the far right anti-government militia. They also said that there were Proud Boys out there, which is another far right extremist group, and they were working together to...

counter-protest the Black people that were there. He talked about how he believed that that attack from Tia was intentional. Now, Danielle, remember, this is the woman that got her head ran over. Now, initially, she did not testify for the preliminary hearing. Now, also, they played the 911 call because remember when they were beating on Tia's car, she called 911, which honestly is one of the smartest things that you could

that she could have done because she knew that there was going to be some official recording from her side. And in that 911 call, you can literally hear her screaming, oh, we got people pulling guns on us. We got people pulling guns on us. Help, help. You hear the people banging on her car. You can hear the fear in her voice.

But when the police officers are asked about the scene of the crime, they say that they didn't see any guns from anyone out there at all. All of this is happening and the prosecution, they're laying it on thick. But, you know, usually you're supposed to have proper time for your defense. But...

Orange County Superior Court Judge Beatrice M.G. Gordon was like, listen, today, September 2nd, 2021 at noon, I'm done hearing from both sides. I'm done hearing what y'all got to say and I'm going to make my ruling. And that's really rough because...

The prosecution has been saying all of their things. They've got all their witnesses up. What about my witnesses? You're telling me we have until noon today, but you've barely heard my side of the story. How on earth can you make a great decision? And you're telling me that we have to stop defending ourselves. How is that justice? And the judge was like, I think that there's more than enough evidence to let the jury decide what is the fate of Tia Turner.

She definitely said that she was set to stand trial. The trial was set for September 15th, 8 a.m., in the Central Court of Santa Ana in courtroom C-5. It's routine that after a preliminary hearing, the case gets reassigned to another judge.

Tia, she puts in her plea for not guilty. Still, you know, she's sticking with it. Now, this judge, they did dismiss six of the charges that included an assault with a stun gun, illegal use of tear gas, and following a false 911 call because obviously it's real. The judge did keep the more serious charges, including the attempted murder, causing mayhem, and the accounts of assault with a deadly weapon. Tia's attorney, Alicia Montero, she doesn't respond at first, but she was like, what just happened in there was an injustice.

And so she goes and she files for a new preliminary approval hearing because she wasn't able to call all of her witnesses. So how can you sit here and say you have enough when I still had a case to give? So she goes ahead and she sets up that. Now, some point, somewhere along the way, the people who have been supporting Tia end up getting her $1 million bail. She did get released and she continued her fight on the outside.

She leaves the courthouse after this preliminary hearing and she says she's going to return to work early Friday morning. She's got a gig building a set for a concert and she just knows that the trial is looming over her now. She says, "I just have to do everything

with that in mind, trying to live my life with that in mind and hope that things work out the way that they're supposed to. Alicia Montero, she's doing her lawyering. She's a senior deputy public defender, and she's about to make a point for all y'all hating on the public defenders. She's about to show y'all that they really do work.

She argues that the prosecution's list was insanely long with unnecessary witnesses on the list. She said that the prosecutor, quote, repeatedly asked leading questions of the witness. She said they had a lower standard of proof, probable cause as opposed to the criminal jury trial standard. She kind of explained, you know, with the lower standard of proof, the probable cause as opposed to the criminal jury trial standard of beyond a reasonable doubt, preliminary hearings.

often include only a handful of witness because they don't have to prove that it happened. They just have to prove that it could have happened. You know, is there enough to go to trial? So why do you have these many people on the list if we're not trying? This ain't the trial. This is just a hearing. She said, quote,

where she was denied the opportunity to establish an affirmative defense merely because the time estimated provided by the parties was inaccurate. Hear, hear. The prosecutors argued that the judges have the power to set these time limits to make sure that all the cases before them are fairly and efficiently heard and decided. They suggested to her that she budget her time accordingly.

This new judge who was hearing, you know, when the case got passed over, the new judge, Judge Leverson, he heard what she had to say. He heard what a sponsor had to say about

preliminary hearing and he heard what the prosecution had to say and he said, quote, "At the end of the day, defense did an excellent job with the time they had." And these reports, they're not going back to Judge Gordon, they're going to Judge Leverson, now the new judge who's over the case. And the prosecution argues, at the end of the day, the defense did an excellent job with the time they have. They just haven't shown they needed more. What are we to do about it? On November 19th of 2021, Orange County Superior Judge Michael Leverson ruled that

that the court finds the defendant was denied a substantial constitutional right. He said that this decision, please do not interpret it to mean that the evidence was not good presented by the prosecutor. He's just saying the defense didn't get a fair turn. So we're going to have to run this back and do a preliminary hearing where both sides are heard. Which is like, damn, why we got to go through all of that

for a fair preliminary hearing. Right. In the meantime, Danielle Lindgren, she's struggling. On October 8th, she files a personal injury motor vehicle lawsuit against Tatiana Turner as if she's not fighting enough. She's over here fighting for her life. I'm pretty sure she gives a damn about your personal injury case. Which, you know, I also think is the right way to go, honestly. Yeah. Like...

I don't think that there is a case for criminal charges, but I do think there is a case for a personal injury charge. And so, of course, like she's going to have to face some music for this. And I do think that that's fair. That's the music that you need to be facing. Like, OK, we're caravanning for justice. You do need to make sure that you're using our caravans in the correct way. She's trying to cash cow. She's white womaning it. Yeah, it's to be expected. Yeah.

He did set for a new preliminary hearing. The defense did get to argue their point. And then this new judge, Judge Levinson, he also ruled that she should stand trial. There's enough evidence. So it didn't change the outcome, but she did get her rights. And again, she was set to stand trial in 2022.

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rocketmoney.com slash sisters. Now they were preparing for trial. Trial was set for December 9th, 2022. But what we really needed was the attempted murder charges to be dropped. Yes, there are things that she does need to go to court for. But when you're acting in self-defense because an angry mob has surrounded your car and they're yelling racist things at you, they're showing their guns to you. All of this needs to be taken into consideration.

The attempted murder charge was dropped. Now, this was a huge uproar for everybody. It felt like it was a step in the right direction. Yes, there was still a long way to go and lots of years of prison being faced. But having the attempted murder charge dropped was just a pivotal moment in Tia's journey. Now she was starting to have some amended charges. There were lesser mayhem and assault charges.

But nothing that had the potential life sentence. Of course, you know, a felon with pepper spray that was still going to be there. And still, Tia entered a not guilty plea.

Her new bail was set for $100,000, which is a huge cut from her previous $1 million bail. But she was still facing a lot of time. If she was found guilty on all of these charges, she could end up with 19 years behind bars. Now, the attempted murder charge was a potential 30 years to life. So she's still got a lot to work for. Now, her public defender, who was working her ass off,

ass off, was extremely happy with these outcomes. She said they're happy that they're no longer facing a life sentence, but she also knew that they had a long road to hoe. Long road to hoe? It's a country saying. You know what it means. They did have a long road to hoe. You acting like you ain't never heard that before. No, that's a new one. I picked up what you were putting down. A long road to hoe? I can't believe you never heard that before. It's so old. I don't know a day in my life that it hasn't existed.

One of the other things that they were fighting for is to have her case be taken away from Todd Spitzer, who was the district attorney. And the reason was because there was a little bit of a conflict of interest. Now, you know that Tia is always fighting for injustice, and that means standing up and talking to people first.

at press conferences or when they are addressing the public. And when District Attorney Todd Spencer was in office, he was at a debate and Tia was there and she was protesting and she was asked to leave by the moderator. So there's this like implicit bias that the district attorney has on Tia. And he's been speaking bad on her name from the beginning.

And he was. He was talking bad about her from the very beginning. Her lawyer was like, listen, it's a conflict of interest. His actions, his statements, it's clear that he doesn't want a fair trial for the charges. Like, from the very beginning...

this whole case, the reason why it's going on so long is because the district attorney has a personal and political bias against Tia. And he's going to prey on that. When they tried to ask the DA, oh, so now you want to drop the charges. Why do you want to drop the charges down a little bit? They decided they weren't going to answer. But most of it was for their own reasons. Maybe we know because you didn't have an attempted murder. And there are a lot of things going on with this Orange County district attorney. Now,

Now, we're not from L.A., and sometimes it's hard to keep up with the happenings of local news. But there have been ongoing scandals about this particular district attorney, even as as recently as February of 2022. He has said really nasty things when it comes to black men that are

being deliberated on death penalty cases. And it really shows that he does not care about Black lives. He doesn't care about anybody that's under his jurisdiction and is not somebody that you want in office. And everybody was just saying that Tia was just a

a casualty of his horrible use of office. The victims, they of course had people that were behind them 100%. Danielle, she had her case about the motor vehicle. She also had a GoFundMe set up for her where she was able to receive $17,387. Now that happened in 2020. Now in 2022,

Her puppy needed surgery, and she told everybody that this dog was the dog that helped her get through everything during the traumatic events of 2020. So they set up a GoFundMe for her dog. He didn't need a major surgery. He had bladder stones. That's how she described it in a GoFundMe. It was emergency surgery for his kidney stones. I don't know.

So Blatterstones. And she received another $3,960. Now, Brian, there was also a GoFundMe set up for him where they raised $14,891.

Now, the surgery was very lengthy. They had to cut his quads. They had to insert a rod from his patella through his lower right leg. And there's plates, there's screws. There were a lot of things that he needed to recover. So the GoFundMe definitely went towards his medical bills, as well as a couple of burns that he had from the tire and from the asphalt. Like we said, none of the victims had any major life-threatening injuries.

And Tia is still fighting with the court. And this is the story of Tatiana, a.k.a. Tia Turner. All right, y'all, it is time for... Well, I'm not Black. I'm OG. I ain't do it, but if I did, this is how I would have got away with it. Of course, it's a little bit different today, but I ain't do it, but if I did, this is how I would handle this case.

Let me tell you something I think she did right. Calling 911 while in the midst of being attacked. Yeah. You know, it's funny because I was reading like some of the comments that people left and this woman said, obviously she meant to do it because if you really wanted to get out there, you would just honk your horn till they move. It's like, oh, life is so simple for you people. Do you think these niggas gave a fuck about a horn? They are busting her windows. Exactly. Exactly.

I do think they was pretty wild trying to call it deliberate and intentional because, let me tell you, it's not hard to kill somebody with a car. If it was deliberate and intentional, both these motherfuckers, somebody would have died. These people got away with minimal injuries, which...

tells me that it wasn't as intentional as they're making it out to be. Everybody tries to argue the fact that they've seen her trying to help train everybody else getting ready for these protests, but I also think that the reality of 2020 was that you had to be prepared. It was like Rodney King all over again in places, man. Exactly. We knew people that were putting together just care packages for those people that were trying to go and protest because they needed them. Like,

It wasn't just bring water out and make sure you have a good sign. Like, here's some pepper spray just in case somebody tries to come up on you. You know, like, make sure that you are prepared. Cover your eyes. Cover your nose. People have to think about every single thing. If people try to come for you, this is how we make a human shield with our handmade armor.

Because the attack could come from the counter protesters just as easily as those attacks could come from the police. And you did not know what you were facing going to protest for your freedom. Instead of parole or no parole, because this is an ongoing case, which we never do, let's do charge or no charge. What do you think, Tassie? I think especially this long after I would hope that...

I would hope that her charges kind of dissipate. Like we said, we don't... I'm glad that they dropped the attempted murder because none of that felt intentional. But I think even with the mayhem and all of that, we've called out points where it was an attempt to be peaceful, calling the mayor, letting them know you're going to occupy this space. And just the time that we were in, like...

Every black person was just hurting and, like, felt so helpless and so unsafe. And you just get out here and you try and just be heard, and these people are telling you, go back to your country like you, your mama, or your grandma was born somewhere else. We all from here, nigga. Like, we are from here. You know? Just as much as you are. Shit, you might have immigrated later with your Irish ass.

So I definitely would say drop the charge. I guess what name can keep her charged? Danielle. Get whatever payout you're going to get. I don't know if this lady got too much money coming her way. I don't know what you're going to get off of that. Maybe garnish her wages or some shit. But I think all that mayhem and stuff. And she can keep her charge for the pepper spray. Because, I mean, it ain't no walking around that. It is what it is. Yeah, there ain't no walking around that. But, like...

I think what I do appreciate about what I've at least seen from the posts of that organization is the fact that it's not just about protesting. Like there are so many things where it's like, hey, we're coming together and getting food for people that are unhoused. Hey, these are the people that you need to learn how to vote for. Hey, register to vote because the reason why the district attorney is bullying us is because they're voted into office. Let's vote them out of office.

hey, our representatives are not representing us. Let's vote them out of office. And I think it's so important to just think about 2020 because here we are four years later and the people are up, their seats are up and it's time for us to start voting again. And I want people to like really take into consideration what's happening this year and how important their vote is.

And this is, you know, Taz and I will be voting in Georgia. We're talking about a case that happened in California. But at the end of the day, it is extremely, extremely important that your local elections are what you're voting for. It's extremely, extremely important that you are voting for your presidential elections. And, you know, I think that's what's important.

You know what's crazy is that so many people, it feels sometimes useless. And a lot of people say that, like, why should I vote? These people don't care. The Electoral College, we all know that that's a load of bullshit. But saying I don't think my voice counts, so I'm not going to vote.

is willful ignorance, you know? And it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Yeah. It's not going to happen that way. If you feel like it already doesn't matter, so why should you do it? We go back and say, "Hey, you guys cheated. Now we don't have the numbers on our side." When we come back and say, "Hey, you guys are doing this and this is unconstitutional. We don't have the numbers on our side because you felt like you didn't matter." We're the only one who are going to make us matter.

And I think it's important for everybody to realize how important their voice is. Because think about it, like, Tia's a convicted felon. So...

That means somebody that is not even allowed to vote is still telling you to vote. What we do with the freedoms that we have as people that aren't convicted of felonies is we're voting for the people that have felonies. So it's not just voting for yourself, it's voting for your fellow man. Voting for your kids, voting for who where the voting laws have tried to prevent them from voting, whether it's some senior citizen who doesn't have a right to a poll or something like that, like...

You got to be a voice for the voiceless. We're all responsible for each other. You got to be a voice, yeah. Absolutely. And it's just so... I can't even explain how important it is. So...

If you are listening to this podcast, which if you've made it this far, congratulations. Please check all of our social medias. You can find us at Sisters Who Kill, Sisters Who Kill Pod, Sisters Who Kill Podcast. If you type in Sisters Who Kill, we will pop up and we will link to some resources so that you can make sure that your registration is up to date because voting is happening this year.

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Go about our day. If you would like to leave us a review, please do so. You can do it on Spotify. You can do it on Apple. You can do it anywhere. If they say rate us five stars, rate us five stars. If they say leave a review, say something nice. If you got something nasty to say, email it to me. I'll look at it. Maybe.

Yeah, you got one. Yes. This one says, I love that not only are you creating a space to talk about true crime as it relates to Black people, but a focus on women. This is such an underserved population. As a podcast producer myself, I really appreciate the production. You are both very dynamic. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. All love from over here. I love Sisters Who Kill podcast. My former student,

Shout out to Selena, class of 2023 from Virginia, if you're listening. Shout out to Selena for putting me onto this show last year, and I have been listening ever since. It's the first podcast I pull up when I'm in the car. Listening to podcasts in the car is my thing. Me too. You all narrate so well, and I feel like I'm there. I'm talking back to the podcast and everything. LOL. I love to take that itch to try out and the I didn't do it, but if I did segment.

Y'all have me rolling. Keep doing your thing and I will stay tuned. Sending love from VA, B. Allen. Thanks, B. Thank you.

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