🏒 “Less Taxes, More Trophies” — Florida’s hockey strategy. Chase Sapphire’s $795 fee. Roblox’s Farmville 2.0.
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This is Nick. This is Jack. It's Wednesday, ceviche Wednesday, June 18th. And today's pod, out of all the pods, is the best one yet. It's a T-boy. The top three pop business news stories you need to know today. Woo!

Yetis, we just got off the mics for an interview with an epic tech CEO. His company turns 20 years old this weekend. Yesterday, we asked you to guess which company that is. And what's the answer, Jack? Reddit. Reddit, that's right. We interviewed the CEO of Reddit, the co-founder, Steve Huffman. We talked about social media, artificial intelligence, and how Steve Huffman uses classical ballroom dancing to run his company. True story. That whole Reddit interview, we're dropping right here on Friday. But in the meantime, Jack,

Today's pot is the best one we've ever done. What are the three stories for today's tea boy? For our first story, Chase Sapphire Reserve, the ultimate millennial credit card, just went crazy. Because Chase increased their annual fee to $795. So we did the aluminum math for you. For our second story, it's Roblox.

The video game platform for teens has seen its stock nearly triple in the past year. And it's all thanks to one game, Grow a Garden. It's farming for fake plants. Basically, Farmville 2.0. And our third and final story. There's a strange phenomenon in the Stanley Cup finals of ice hockey. Yes. Florida teams keep winning. And it's really annoying. Yeah, it is. But it turns out lower taxes means more trophies. Yes, it does.

It does. But yetis, before we hit that wonderful mix of stories. Whoa, what a mix of stories for Ceviche Wednesday. Love the mix today, Jack. Do you smell that? Do you taste that? I mean, Jack, I think I can feel.

I think it's guava. It is guava, because yeti's the biggest trend across every single industry this summer is guava. Guava. The tropical fruit that's technically a berry. It's grown in Central and South America, and it's probably not at my local grocery store because I'm too far away. Guava. It looks like a pear on the outside, but nothing like a pear on the inside. Nothing like a pear on the inside. Don't call it a pear. It's a sensual fruit. And apparently, guava is the sweetest fruit in capitalism right now.

Because guava snacks, guava fragrance, and even guava technology are all trending. Get this. Videos referencing guavas on social media are up 76% this year. Get this. Google searches for guavas are up 1,000% since last year. First, it started with food, with guava-flavored candy and a Dunkin' Guava refresher drink. Hey, doll!

Make it a double guava for me. Then it jumped over to the beauty industry with guava perfume and lip liner sold at Sephora. Jack, there's even now a fintech company called Guava that just raised venture capital money. The newest streamer? Guava Plus. Forget hot girl summer. It's hot guava summer, baby. But there's no way the guava trend has leaped into AI, has it, Nick? Actually, Jack, it has. Oh, boy. Guava Health just launched an AI chatbot. And it's called Guava A.

Yetis, maybe it's the vitamin C. Or maybe it's just fun to say. But either way, we know one thing. Pineapple is jealous. Because Guava is the new Gucci. Zuckerberg, when are you going to launch the Guava app? Here we go. Jack, it's not Instagram. It's Guava-gram. Let's hit our three stories. Ha ha.

First, a quick word from our sponsor.

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Monarch money. All right, Jack, can I tell you about my SMH? What is that? It stands for my stupid money habit. You ready for this? I just realized I spent $412 last month on taxis. Nick, that's a car payment. I know. I could have probably just bought another car at this point. Now, Nick only realized how much he spent on Ubers, Lyfts, and yellow cabs thanks to Monarch money. Monarch. It isn't just about...

budgeting app, it is like a personal CFO. Now, I'm using Monarch Money too. My favorite part? Yes, Jack? I've actually retired my net worth spreadsheet. Seriously. Really? Because I have every single financial account I own linked to Monarch Money. You can immediately see your net worth because Monarch Money refreshes all your account balances instantly. So, to help you track and build your net worth, Monarch Money is offering 50% off your first year for listeners of this pod.

And it's not just us. Over a million households already use Monarch Money. The Wall Street Journal already named it the best budgeting app of 2025. We're not even halfway through the year. No, we're not. And I think I just spent $10 more on a taxi. So besties, get control of your overall finances with Monarch Money. Even though Nick apparently can't. Use code T-Boy at monarchmoney.com in your browser for half off your first year. That's 50% off your first year if you go to monarchmoney.com and use code T-Boy.

For our first story, the Chase Sapphire Reserve. It just increased its annual credit card fee 45% to $795. $795? So, Yetis, we just went full Oppenheimer on the math of whether that fee is worth it.

That is, if you are under the age of 45, then you have pledged allegiance to a different credit cult. I mean club. I mean card. Sorry, Jack. This is a heavyweight boxing match for high-end millennial credit card loyalty. In the red corner, weighing in at $750 billion is JPMorgan Chase, aka America's Most Valuable Bank, run by Jamie Dimon.

And in the blue corner, weighing in at $200 billion is American Express, America's most platinum of all the credit cards, aka Amex MX. And for years, it has been an arms race to offer the best credit card perks, but Chase just went.

Went nuclear. Here's the news. Chase is increasing the annual fee for their premier card from $550 a year to $795. Jack, that's a 45% surge. Safe to say, 45% is higher than inflation. And it's probably higher than your buddy Timmy's rent. So Jack and I added it up and we decided to do the plastic pointonomics, the swipe science, the miles math.

for you. And despite that annual fee, that's the size of a rent check. We think that card pays for itself easily for most people. It's basically like outsourcing a butler. So besties, here's how we're doing this. If you spend a lot of money on things, especially on travel, then a premium credit card, it's basically a no brainer on the break even. 795 bucks a year is a lot. But

the dollar value of all the perks you get more than offset the annual fee. Jack, why don't you hit the whiteboard for us? What kind of numbers are we looking at? This card includes $300 of credits for restaurants through OpenTable and $300 of credits for entertainment through StubHub and $250 of value in free Apple TV Plus and Apple Music perks plus a $300 travel fee credit that pays for your seat upgrade, your checked bag fee, whatever while you're on the go. So for those keeping track, which is Nick and me...

We don't expect you to be. That's $1,150 worth of perks right there. It's basically cheaper than your parents' country club, but it's actually the lifestyle you're living right now. So there you go. You just paid for the annual fee. But then you got to include the points. Right? We did the perks. What about the points?

Jack. This card gives 8x points for travel that you book directly with an airline or a hotel. Okay, so like $10,000 in annual travel spending, that's equal to what, Jack? $800 of points. Plus you get lounge access. But best

Besties, pause the pod for a sec because Jack and I used to work in finance and we know about finance. You always got to check the fine print. So Jack, what's the catch? You got to spend at least $75,000 a year to unlock the premium perks. So add it all up, besties. And if you are already spending $6,000 a month or $75,000 a year on your credit card, then, then this card pays for itself. So if you're a couple of dinks...

with that amount of joint spending, one of you is texting the other this link to this episode. Yeah, we have two of these cards, Jack, and right now I feel like I'm over-dinked. Yeah, I don't think you should have both cards, Nick. Hey, Molly, we gotta have a conversation. But yet he's... Here's the question. If the costs of the perks and the points is more...

then the revenue the company gets with the annual fee, why would Chase offer this card? I mean, Jack and I have covered a lot of annual reports for these credit card companies. And why does Amex, Capital One, literally every financial institution do something similar with a primo card? It sounds like a loss maker for the credit card companies until you consider our takeaway. Is it a loss llama or a profit puppy? So Jack, what's the takeaway for our buddies at Chase Sapphire? Alt taxes are taking over the economy.

Yeti's the swipe tax. The app tax. Those are two of the biggest hidden costs in our economy. They're hidden because businesses pay them, not consumers. But the costs trickle down to us eventually. Follow us on this one. The app tax is what Apple and Google collect. They take 15 to 30% of all money spent through their app stores. And the swipe tax...

is what credit card companies collect. They take a 2% fee on every swipe. And Jack and I would take a gander that American commerce is mostly paid on mobile phones and credit cards. That's the majority of payments. Therefore, the app tax and the swipe tax

are truly like taxes on this economy that we all pay. But here's the key. Instead of going Uncle Sam, those alternative taxes go to a dozen tech and finance companies that control them. So the reason J.P. Morgan is happy to offer crazy valuable credit card perks, it's because they collect a 2% fee on everything. Besties, the alt taxes, they are taking over our economy.

For our second story, a video game on Roblox just set an all-time record for most people playing at the same time. It's proof that the town square hasn't disappeared. It's just moved over to Roblox's garden.

Now, Jack, how about we kick off this story with a little bit of T-boy trivia? You've got the honors. What is the all-time record for most video gamers playing the same game at the same time? Well, it's not Pokemon, Goldeneye, Fortnite, or Mario Kart, despite six of your roommates playing on the same couch at the same moment. Roblox just confirmed they have this all-time record. Because on Saturday, 16th,

But wait, Jack, I gotta ask...

What exactly is Grow-A-Garden? It's Gen Alpha's version of Farmville. Yeah, yeah, it really is. Why don't you walk us through it a bit, Jack? If you play Grow-A-Garden on Roblox, first, you have to plant some digital seeds on your digital plot of land. And if you're ambitious, you turn the farm into a ranch by purchasing and raising a heifer or two, whatever a heifer is. You can also grow a jungle.

And then, Nick, if you, like, leave the game for a week and don't check it out, you'll come back and be like, wow, I need to weed my garden because there's weeds everywhere. Apparently the corn grows like rabbits over there. Basically, Yetis, it's a roller coaster tycoon game, but for forests. And 16.4 million people were playing it at the same time last Saturday. But Jack, can we please just sprinkle on a little bit of context?

here. Yeah. How about, what is Roblox? Roblox is a video game platform that requires no console, unlike Nintendo. You can play on your phone, your computer, all you need is an internet connection. So Roblox characters, you've seen them. They're blocky looking, they're charming in their lack of depth.

They're like digital Legos. Roblox, it's not just a video game. It's a virtual world where you live and you play online. Frankly, we see it as the first metaverse. When Zuckerberg renamed Facebook to Meta, Roblox was the only competitor in the metaverse space. Which feels like it's about now that you should share your full disclosure, Jack. Yeah, I invested in Roblox because I wanted a metaverse play, but I didn't want to invest in metaverse.

Yeah, you were doing some emotional investing, weren't you, Jack? Which I do way too much of. You would have gotten a better ROI if you weren't as emotional with the investing, right? If I had invested in Meta instead, I'd be like a lot richer. Because Betsy's Roblox stock collapsed after the pandemic was ending because people prefer the real world to the virtual world. But Nick, the stock has roared back. It has nearly tripled in the past 12 months and is now close to 2021 all-time highs. Get this.

Roblox is now worth 70 billion bucks. That's like 11 lifts right there. Roblox is worth more than Electronic Arts and Take-Two, the two leading video game studios. The virtual tables have really turned, Jack. And here's the wildest part. 35% of the players playing Grow a Garden are underage.

are under the age of 13. Although, like a 13-year-old, Roblox isn't profitable yet. Yeah, Roblox is basically living off of Wall Street. Actually, off of my allowance. Yeah, Jack's still down on that investment. Hey, that's not true. No, I'm up a little bit. It's almost tripled in the last year. We all appreciate a little bit of rounding. So, Jack, what's the takeaway for our buddies over at Roblox? Society needs shared experiences. We still have them. You just don't see them.

Ah, shared experiences. Yetis from the Super Bowl to the Oscars, the shared experience is what ties a culture together. But with the rise of personalized social media feeds, we don't have shared experiences anymore. We've lost our common understanding of what's happening in the world. And the shared experience used to happen in the town square, and then it happened on broadcast TV channels. And while those shared experiences appear gone, we think you can still find them and they're still happening.

It's just online and it's divided by age group. Like that 16.4 million humans playing Grow a Garden on Roblox, that's a population of Gen Alpha that's triple the population in New Zealand. And how about Gen Z? They all see the same memes on TikTok.

Millennials, we're sharing the same experiences on Instagram. Gen X's shared experience is on Facebook and Boomer's shared experience is on cable TV. Still. Yetis, we all still have shared experiences. But they're just meme-ified. They're online and they're borderless. Now, a quick word from our sponsor.

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delicious. Jack actually just used our promo code again for himself to buy another tub. He's got a problem with this stuff. By taking collagen peptides daily, you can support your hair, skin, nail, bone, and joint health. Get 20% off by going to vitalproteins.com and entering promo code T-boy at checkout. That's vitalproteins.com, promo code T-boy for 20% off. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.

For our third and final story, there's something strange going on in the Stanley Cup finals of hockey. Florida keeps winning. The reason a state with no ice is best at ice hockey? Income taxes.

Yetis, in order to tell this story, let's go back to April 2012. The New York Rangers beat the Ottawa Senators game seven at the Garden. You and I were there. Yetis, I've been to the Garden like seven times. Each time, Nick hooked me up with a ticket. It's an amazing experience for a big sports fan like me. Well, besties, right now you got the Stanley Cup Finals. Florida Panthers versus the Edmonton Oilers tonight. Florida could win tonight in game six or game seven tomorrow. And this is because

a geopolitical battle, has it not, Jack? Because on one side, you got Florida, President Trump's home state, and on the other side, you got Canada, Trump's 51st state. For that reason, for Edmonton, winning is a matter of national security. But here's a strange statistic. No Canadian team has won the Stanley Cup in 32 years. Okay, but here's a stranger statistic.

a team from Florida, the Panthers or the Lightning, has made the finals for five straight years. Those two data points and the absence of natural ice in Florida were enough for us to notice a pattern. Again, the only thing cold in Florida is your Frappuccino.

So, Yetis, as Marc Messier is our witness, Jack and I jumped in T-boy style, and we discovered this wild insight. Your hockey team's success is influenced by the taxes you pay. Or, to put the puck more precisely, teams with the most wins are

are from the states without income tax. Here's the numbers. There are six NHL teams that reside in income tax-free states, like Florida and Nevada. So those players in those six teams pay federal income taxes, but they don't pay any state income.

income tax. So, players from these six teams that don't pay income taxes earn 11% more after-tax pay than players from the other 26 teams. What you're saying, Jack, is a Florida Panther with the same salary as an Anaheim Duck effectively gets paid 11% more. Gretzky said follow the puck

But like crypto bros during the pandemic, hockey players are following I-95 down to Florida. Yeah, free agents, they're employees. Where they get paid the most, it matters a lot. So just like New York City lost financial firms to Florida during the pandemic, the New York Rangers have lost more players to the Tampa Bay Lightning than any other team. Because the same salary in Florida goes 11% further than in New York City. And Jack, what's the result when we add it all up?

Non-tax states are 18% of all NHL teams, but they represent 30% of the playoff spots. Four of the last five Stanley Cup champions didn't pay a penny in state income taxes. Holy gordy how. High tax states are stuck in the penalty box, but low tax states lift the cup. So Jack, what's the takeaway for our buddies over in the business of sports? It's a quote from Charlie Munger. Show me an incentive and I'll show you an outcome.

Yeti's turns out it ain't just hockey goalies migrating across state lines for this incentive. It's actually all of sports. Why do you think LeBron went from Cleveland to Miami? And why do you think Tom Brady went from Boston to Tampa Bay? Free agent Brady had spent his last season with the San Francisco 49ers. He would have lost three million bucks in taxes. We see the phenomenon of no income tax equals more trophies in every league.

except Major League Baseball. Good point, Jack, because there's no salary cap in baseball, so the rich Yankees and Dodgers can offset higher taxes with higher salaries. Charlie Munger once said, show me an incentive, I'll show you an outcome. Well, low-income taxes incentivize people, especially high-income people, to come earn more money. So the outcome is that teams in low-tax states are winning more trophies.

Jack, could you whip up the takeaways for us for Savice Wednesday? Chase Sapphire Reserve jacked up their annual fee by 45% to $795. And they make 2% on each swipe. Ah, the swipe tax. It's one of the two alt taxes taking over our economy. For our second story, Roblox's Grow a Garden game just set a record for most concurrent users.

16.4 million people. Besties, we still have shared experiences. They're just online and divided by age and group. And our third and final story. If the Panthers win another game, then six of the last seven Stanley Cups will be won by teams that don't pay state income taxes. No taxes, more trophies. As Charlie Munger said, show me an incentive and I'll show you an outcome.

But yetis, this pod's not over yet. Here's what else you need to know today. First, stocks dipped yesterday, likely on concerning developments about the Middle East. The president left the G7 meeting to deal with an escalating conflict between Iran and Israel. And then on Tuesday, Trump threatened Iran's supreme leader, demanding an unconditional surrender. That raised concerns that the U.S. may get involved in another Middle Eastern war.

And investors don't like it. And second, Mark Zuckerberg just made his most controversial move of the year. Guess what? He's adding ads to WhatsApp. WhatsApp, the messaging app with 1.5 billion users, mostly international users, it's owned by Meta since 2014. I mean, I guess, Jack, this would be like if Apple dropped ads in your iMessages and then started making money off

of all those emoji. Can you imagine if I got a mattress ad in between my message deals? Users hate the idea of getting spammed in their DMs, but investors dig it. Metastock is up 2%. And finally, last month we told you that Tinder was testing out letting you filter your potential dates based on their height. Take it from a couple guys right here who are six foot one. That was shocking.

That is such an embellishment. I love it. You got to round up on the rounds. But yet, the newest update from Tinder is double dates. You can now team up with your buddy, become a Tinder duo, and find another Tinder duo for a double date. There you go. It actually reminds us of a takeaway we did last year. Dating apps, they're turning into social networks. Me and my buddy Timmy, we're a package deal.

Now time for the best fact, yeah, this one whipped up by Jack and me because tomorrow you won't have a podcast. Tomorrow we're all celebrating Juneteenth, the second Independence Day of America that commemorates the end of slavery in the United States. It's actually the youngest of the federal holidays passed into law in 2021. On June 19th, 1865, the final enslaved people in America, deep

down in the bottom tip of Texas were finally freed. So it's long been celebrated by the black community, but Congress made it Instagram official just a couple years ago. And because it's a federal holiday, Wall Street's closed, the stock market's closed, we're off as well. Yes, we are. We'll be back on Friday with our interview episode with the CEO of Reddit. So we'll see you then.

Yetis, you'll look fantastic over there. And if you haven't yet, drop down to give us five stars because that's how we grow the pot. And if you're barbecuing tomorrow for Juneteenth, put a little piece of butter right on the top of the ground beef before you grill that burger. I think you meant guava, Jack. I think you meant guava.

And before we go, a happy birthday to Yeti Ethan Ramirez, turning six years old in Tampa, Florida, who listens to T-Boy and The Best Idea Yet, always helping others and enjoying some Stanley Cup wins. Hey, Ethan, if you're a Lightning fan, Nick is jealous of your team. And Anissa, down in Leesburg, Virginia, is a four-year Bestie listener and celebrating the best birthday yet. Happy birthday to Nicole Olsen in Utah. Zill has got a birthday

Happy birthday to Ashon Chabal in Cupertino, California. And Megan, enjoy that birthday in Irvine, California. Happy birthday to Wesley Brains in San Diego. And Alex Hines and Johnny Medina, we see you in Seattle. Congrats on the engagement. Can't wait to see some ring picks. Good luck to Alexis Jeslin, who's defending their PhD in Paris. And Chief Master Sergeant Ken Wilson is retiring from the U.S. Air Force this week.

Thank you for your 27 years of service. Congratulations to Manny Petty in Dallas, Texas, who's opening a nail salon. It was almost like they were born to do it, Jack. And Ethan Riker in Chimicum, Washington has got a high school graduation. Congrats on the big day, Ethan. And to William and Vivian Slade, just have a fantastic time. We heard you're taking a road trip.

Starting in Illinois. I don't know where you're going, but we're pumped for you. We actually just did an episode on the best idea yet about Ferrari. Perfect episode to listen to on a long drive. Oh boy, Nick's in selling mode. And while you're at it, drop down and give us five stars. Jack and I will see you for the interview up on Friday. This is Jack. I own stock of Reddit and Roblox, and I've never eaten a guava before. In fact, I don't even think I've ever seen one. And Nick and I both own stock of Apple, which is not a guava.

Every big moment starts with a big dream. But what happens when that big dream turns out to be a big flop?

From Wondery and At Will Media, I'm Misha Brown, and this is The Big Flop. Every week, comedians join me to chronicle the biggest flubs, fails, and blunders of all time, like Quibi. It's kind of like when you give yourself your own nickname and you try to, like, get other people to do it. And the 2019 movie adaptation of...

Cats. Like, if I'm watching the dancing and I'm noticing the feet aren't touching the ground, there's something wrong with the movie. Find out what happens when massive hype turns into major fiasco. Enjoy The Big Flop on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to The Big Flop early and ad-free on Wondery+. Get started with your free trial at wondery.com slash plus.