“It’s About Tom” with Kevin Nealon
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Today, it's all about Tom. In this episode, I'm reliving one of my biggest internal conflicts on The Housewives, whether or not to tell Luann that her fiance, Tom, was caught kissing another woman. This was a Sophie's choice. The messenger's getting shot. You're damned if you do. You're damned if you don't. And it brings up the major question, would you want to know?

As a result, I have a pretty hilarious breakdown. So I needed to bring on someone just as hilarious. Joining me on today's episode is comedian and SNL alum Kevin Nealon. You'll be shocked to hear who he identifies with. Let's get into it.

Hi, Bethany. I'm so friggin' excited right now. I can't even, I've been like thinking in my head about the first time I was in Say To You and I'm so, first of all, I love you. And I was just thinking like, what are we? How do we define our relationship? Like, Kevin was on, so nice to do that like gift talk show practice. And then I called you about stand up and then we did Just Be. And I feel like

If best friends are a 10 and people who don't know each other are a zero, what are we? Well... Honest. I have a lot of respect for you. I have a lot of respect for you because how... Just how complete you are. You're just... You're such a businesswoman. You're a great actress. You're a fun person to be with. Beautiful. And so I'd say we're like... I don't know. Maybe you're...

Well, because we don't hang out all the time. I'd say maybe we're 7.9. Jesus Christ. You're like me. You don't have that many. You have few people that you like really dig. That's why you said that. I like that. Well, that's pretty good. Yeah. Well, no, then I might invite you to my, and the next time I have a birthday party, which happens like every decade. Now I'm putting on my birthday party. It's like every year. It's actually never. Well, I have to be totally transparent.

I don't watch a lot of TV. I've never seen The Bachelor. I've never seen any of The Housewives, except for my wife. And I watched the episode they sent me, and I was watching it for the first time. I'm going, okay, I see what they're doing here. Okay. Okay, maybe there's some improv going on. Maybe they're kind of steering it one way. It was really interesting to watch the dynamics of it. Well, I...

It's funny because when I was talking to my partners at iHeart, they wanted, you know, and I think initially when I talked to my fiance about the idea, they thought like should be housewives fans. And I'm like, there's so much of that. And while there are some housewives fans, like Elizabeth Moss is a fan of some. So there is absolutely no, no one has to have seen the housewives or even. So I like that because it's fresh. You're just jumping into this thing. But.

you could tell from one episode, not on like a soap opera or telenovela, that like one episode you could be hooked in. You can understand where all the dynamics and who the characters are. Or do you not feel like that? Yeah, no, no, that's totally true. I watched it twice, actually. I watched the episode twice. The first time I watched it and I was kind of like,

learning each character's name and thinking, okay, I know Bethany, but I don't know any of these other people. Okay, she's the one that got cheated on. And then I was almost like, I had to watch it again to really watch it and forget about who's who.

and knowing you and then really finding out the meat of what's going on. Like Game of Thrones. The way you have to go back and watch Game of Thrones again. Oh yeah, totally. I can watch Game of Thrones again and not know what's happening. That's exactly me. It's so many... Right. Okay. So, and I have never seen this since back then when it aired. I only watched something once. We get sent the video or sent the link the week before it airs and I will watch it then. But just some inside...

Scoop that I just realized now from a business television perspective, I had left the show after three seasons for three seasons and they had three new people come on. And during the time that I left, the ratings declined significantly. They went from like 3 million to like 1.6. And this, these were the episodes that, that they spiked back up to 3 million. So these are like iconic episodes.

I mean, this was when everybody at Bravo was high-fiving each other. So this is like, I sent you like a good meaty one. And because you're married, I thought you'd find it, you know, just interesting, the dynamic of,

do they want to know? I mean, you live in LA, you live in suburbia and like there's a world of people who just don't want to know. And this is the, that was that light bulb moment when I realized, wait a second, not usually not that early in a relationship did I think that, but that I realized as a concept for financial reasons, for, you know, wanting to hide your head under the covers for, for

public perception reasons. There are just many people who don't want to know. What percentage do you think of people would not want to know? That their fiance is fooling around with them? Yeah, or a spouse. Yeah. Or a spouse. That's a good question. I would say the percentage would probably be maybe 40% wouldn't want to know. Would you want to know? I would want to know. I would, but...

But I will tell you something. I relate mostly with Luann. Wow. Yeah. And I'll tell you why. Because I had a girlfriend that cheated on me. And I took her back. I thought, okay, that was just, you know, one-time deal.

I didn't know the phrase once a cheater, always a cheater. Wow. And so I took her back. That soon in? Like how soon into the relationship? Well, first I discovered the emails. I wasn't even looking. This is back when sometimes you shared the same email. Or you had a couple of different emails.

And I came across her communication with a guy. And I literally got sick to my stomach because I totally trusted her. I never even thought of this. I never even imagined that this would ever happen. And it did happen. And I confronted her about it, which was not easy because I knew our relationship would never be the same again. It would never be the same. Even if we work things out, I could forgive her but not forget it.

So I took her back just like Luann wanted to do. Luann was like rationalizing and giving him, you know, all this whole reason why he did. He was drunk and never happened again. And, you know, and so that's what I did with her. You know, I thought, well, maybe I haven't been that, you know, attentive enough attention. So we got back together and within a month I discovered she was seeing him again.

Wow. And I took her back again. Wow. And then, you know, of course, my trust is waning even more than it ever did. And and then I said and I even I even called the guy and I'm you know, I hate confrontation.

I hate it so much. But this one I had to do. And he never answered the phone. Never answered the phone. I left a message. And then finally, I called him. He didn't answer. I said, you better pick up the phone now. Or maybe I should call your wife.

Wow. Hello? Hello? And I had had this speech prepared for so long, what I was going to say to him. But he never picked up the phone. And I kind of forgot the speech. And then I was overwhelmed with how much anger I had toward him. I just started swearing into the phone. I just kept swearing and swearing. And he actually started chuckling.

Anyway, so I gave my wife one more, not my wife, my girlfriend, one more chance. I was 40 and a slip. And about, I don't know, a month later, I saw tickets where she had rendezvoused with him, you know. And then I came home and I found a book in her purse that was all yellow highlighted. And it was a book like on breaking up, you know.

Wow. Yeah. So, yeah. And then it was over. Well, it's interesting that you brought up, you thought you weren't paying enough attention, et cetera, because I think that infidelity is not black and white. I would assume that in certain situations, if someone is really treating someone like shit, I know people in certain situations where I know the reasons why they're staying together and they're not, they're more logical and,

In some ways, it's such a complicated situation that I think I don't know what you're supposed to do. Maybe maybe you are supposed to have your own thing going. If that person is going to do what they're doing, maybe you are like I don't I don't think it's that black and white in this case. But so it's funny what you said about you thinking maybe it was you not giving up attention, because I do think that that does exist in relationships. There's never there's always some gray. But I also think, yeah.

She was at a low point in her life now, you know, as it plays out years later. And I was what it sounded like you might have been at a different place in your life. And I wonder if cheaters seek out people who would tolerate it on any level. Like I can tell you right now that if I held someone's hand for a second and kiss them on the cheek, he would literally never speak to me again. I'm not. He sounds like a real jealous guy.

He just, it's just, he's a more like morality code. Here's the line. Here's not the line. And he's not the guy that would ever comment on the way another woman looks or even look the other direction. He's very sort of like poised in that and just very formal and like chivalrous. So he gives out what he expects. He's not, it's not like he's a guy who's like, wow, she's hot or look, he just wouldn't accept it whatsoever. So I wonder if people attract people who kind of

would be leanings on that because if she knew that you would never tolerate it, do you think she would even have done it? And do you think that Tom definitely knew that Lillian would come back? I think he is. I don't think he took the relationship seriously. Well, you have to assume that no one will tolerate it. You know, you got to go off of that base right there. And, you know, I know some people who have that open relationship, but they don't want to know that their partner was with somebody else. Just don't tell me. Right. And,

Yeah, yes. And I know a lot of gay relationships like that, too. And you know what, that's a different story. But that's an unspoken agreement that I get, like, that's a different everyone's allowed to live their own life with the rate of divorce. Well, she even asked me one time, she said, Do you would you like to bring someone else into this relationship? What do you think about that? I said, No, no, what are you talking about? You know?

Or would you like to be with so-and-so or a friend of hers? Kind of like baiting me. Yes. No, I want to be with you. Wow. But here's the thing. I was with her for many years. And Luann was only...

you know, dating this guy for four weeks before she got engaged. That's why it's different than you. That's why I thought it was surprising that you related to her. That's why it's different because also there's a woman at a certain age in New York City with a bunch of barracudas all competing for the same men. And I feel like women, you

you know, men, women are like, they could smell it like blood in the water. Men, women, you know, women desperate to grab a guy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, as you, as they said in the episode, it's guys looking for rich women, women, you know, the Upper East Side. That's what I thought. Yeah. And how about, you know, guess what? This guy makes more than she does. Oh, okay. You know? Right. Yeah. That shoots down your theory about that.

Well, oh, well, yeah. Also, I don't know. Guys now men now want a woman with their own program. They're not looking to pay for someone's dental bills. Like I've just found that overall I've even I know some wealthy guys, though, that are dating women who have their own career. And, you know, the women are paying for a lot of the things. I think that men are kind of the days of men kind of just wanting to.

pay for every single thing that those days are over. My fiance is old fashioned in that way too. He would, it doesn't matter what it is, he would never allow me to pay for anything, which is glorious. Don't get me wrong. But that's not, that's sort of archaic in ways to people. I get it too, because I'm like that too. I'm just...

And there's a certain guilt that comes along with you too. Like if you're out with friends, you always want to pick up the check at the restaurant because you think, oh, I'm guilty because I make so much money. I'm the one I should have it because you Google their net worth before you go to dinner. And you go, okay, I'm making the most. I'm going to have to pick up the check. You locked up their house, the real estate taxes and the value that it's increased on Zillow. Yeah.

Hello, everyone. I am Lacey Lamar. And I'm Amber Ruffin, a better Lacey Lamar. Boo. Okay, everybody, we have exciting news to share. We're back with season two of the Amber and Lacey, Lacey and Amber show on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network. You thought you had fun last season? Well, you were right. And you should tune in today for new fun segments like Sister Court and listening to Lacey's steamy DMs. We've got new and exciting guests like Michael Beach. That's my husband. Daphne Springs.

Daniel Thrasher, Peppermint, Morgan J., and more. You gotta watch us. No, you mean you have to listen to us. I mean, you can still watch us, but you gotta listen. Like, if you're watching us, you have to tell us. Like, if you're out the window, you have to say, hey, I'm watching you outside of the window. Just, you know what? Listen to the Amber and Lacey, Lacey and Amber show on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Welcome to the CINO Show. I'm your host, CINO McFarlane. I'm an addiction specialist. I'm a coach, I'm a translator, and I'm God's middleman. My job is to crack hearts and let the light in and help everyone shift the narrative. Whether your get down is sex, drugs, alcohol, love addiction, self-hate, codependency, or anything else for that matter...

I want to help you wake up and I want to help you get free. I want to help you unleash your potential, overcome obstacles and achieve your goals. Most importantly, I don't want you to feel alone. So join me on the CINO show where each week we'll feature a compelling individual with an even more noteworthy story that will be sure to inspire and educate. Listen to the CINO show every Wednesday on iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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All right, so it's about Tom. And now here's the thing. I was not close friends with Luann at that time. There are moments that we've had more closeness, but at that time, like, you could see, it looked like a drawing room comedy with two different groups of, you know, trios, two groups of women, and I was not on the...

Luann group in the Luann group at that time. So it was weird for me to have this piece of information. And like I said in the episode, and thank God I had all that information because I remember later and I don't know what I would have been a great detective and a great lawyer. I just I am so thorough with details. But I remember playing the chess in my mind when so I have a friend who lives. We're not even friends anymore, but

We were never good friends. It's a girl that I know. I've known her since college. And sometimes when I'm in the summer in the Hamptons, you run into certain people, you'll beach walk with people, and you become sort of more summer friends. And then you don't really see them during the year because you're just... You know what I mean? They're like summer friends. So... And it's just filler. It's like, let's take a walk on the beach. It's a body to go take a walk on the beach with. That's a person you've known since college. Check. So this person, just for some reason... You know, some people watch these shows and it annoys them because these shows...

are often very superficial and don't tell the truth about people's, like to your point, net worth or a person's renting a car and they really don't have it or the husband's cheating and they're pretending on television. So some people...

you know, if you're honest about everything, it's fine. And if you don't say anything, it's fine. But when you go on television and whether you're Teresa from Jersey paying with hundreds of thousands of dollars of cash, when you know your husband's stealing or you don't have it like that, it annoys people. And I get that. It's kind of a lot of part of cancel culture. People who get pulled down are the people that are like going on and on about how nice they are, all that they have. So

I believe that this girl was irritating her because she knew the behind the scenes of this guy, Tom. She had friends who had dated him and it was like crazy to her. He was cheating on Luann with her friends and he was just a dog. So seeing this on television about Prince Tom, I think annoyed her.

So she happened to be at the Regency, which is this Upper East Side watering hole that all these rich, you know, nouveau riche douchebags go to. And she happened, her friend was there that night and got the, and took that picture and sent it to me two days before we were going to fly to go to Luann's engagement party, which was an episode prior that I did not go to. So she sends it to me and I'm on this show.

And I'm like, what the fuck am I going to do with this information? It's not my best friend and it's not my enemy. It's like right in the middle. So I'm like, what? And I'm on the show. And, um, and in the previous episode, I'm asking Luann, like, are you guys monogamous? Cause I'm thinking maybe Kevin Nealon said maybe they have an arrangement. So that's what I'm giving you that I walked into this thing with not knowing when to say it. And, um, the producers wanted me to drop it the second we got there.

And I like, I just didn't want to ruin the whole weekend and I didn't know when to say it. And I had all my facts because I knew that she would say like, no, you know, and that he would deny it. Like she had to have him cornered. So I had all my edits. I had a timestamp on that shit.

So, Kevin, what do you think about how I handled it? Honestly, all in. I'm going to be totally honest with you. Yeah. First of all, I don't think there's a timestamp on a cell phone picture, is there? There's a way to go into the data. I don't remember who found it for me, but there's a way to go in and find out when the picture is. No, it's not like just there, but you can go dig into the data and find out when it was because I wanted to have those receipts. It could have been three years ago.

And I called the hotel to make sure because I needed that information too. That's right. You did total thorough research, which was good before you started accusing somebody. Well, here's what I thought.

When I first started watching the show, I saw how upset you were and under the covers. And then Luann comes in. She doesn't seem as upset as you do. And I'm thinking, well, who got cheated on? It looks like Bethany's boyfriend cheated on her. You know what I'm saying? Because Luann doesn't seem that upset, you know, because she doesn't want to believe it, I guess. And so you dropped the bomb on her when you did. And...

again you still see more more upset than she was because you didn't know what to do and you know what a blow that would be um by telling her and um and then i started thinking yeah if you're a good friend do you tell your friend that someone is cheating on you because it will change their life i mean it's better to know sooner than later i guess but then you start thinking

what if they get back together? It's like when you, when somebody is breaking up and they're asking about, you know, their spouse or their boyfriend or girlfriend, you go, yeah, you can't say, I never liked her or him. I never liked, because then what happens if they get back together again? Right. Then you're like cut off from them. Well, an interesting thing that I'm going to say, because the show is about me really like giving the behind the scenes of what really goes down and the dynamic of being on a show like this. So let's, I'm going to be totally, totally honest. So,

This is why friendships and family relationships do not work on these shows. If people are good friends right now, it's because they're on the shows at the same time. It's not like Survivor where you can make a true alliance, I guess. I haven't been on that show. But my point is you're on this show. You're

You're not great friends with Luann. You're not not friends with Luann. If you're on the phone with your best, if this is your best friend, you're on the show. Now you're just telling your best friend off camera. Then what on camera, we're going to the party and we're all pretending everything's okay. And I'm never going to tell the show, the world what's really going on when then it's all a ruse that I'm compromising myself on this show too, that I agreed to like go on to. And it's an unwritten rule. Bravo doesn't call you and be like, Hey, listen,

If your friend's husband's, you know, cheating is taxes, you kind of have to say it because you think you're not going to say it, but you're going to say like everything comes out, which is why it's a toxic environment because it's very gotcha. You're always in some corner.

It's a zero sum game. You're either getting fucked or someone else is getting fucked. It's just never the middle. There's sometimes you're coasting for a second, but it's just like you're that loser in the middle of the apprentice season that like is just playing under the radar and everyone realizes that you have to be in or, or, you know, so that's the problem with the show. This is a real serious issue with a woman whose fiance cheated on her, but she brought this fiance onto the show as perfect and,

He had already dated and slept with Sonia. He had dated Ramona. It's a fucking joke. And now you're in this. So are we now going to pretend this is all serious when this guy's dated three other housewives? But here we're going to pretend we're on like real life privacy. That's why the whole thing's all mucked up and muddled as a concept for like reality. Does that make any sense? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you know, I think, you know, Luann could have gone to Sonia or

Or Sonia could have warned her and said, he's a player. He's a player. And by the way, you said you've never been on survival, but I think The Real Housewives is just like survival. Everyone's trying to survive. Exactly. Exactly. Here's what I think could have been an option for your character, for you, is you go up to Tom and say, Tom, you, I know that you cheated on Luann. Now, you either...

Go up to her and admit it and be honest with her and try to do whatever you can to salvage the relationship. Or I'm going to go tell her and she'll find out. That's genius. That would have been, we were leaving for the trip. The next day, everybody was leaving for the trip in Florida and in housewives land. They want to get it out now. Like they wanted me to say it Friday, the second I landed and we waited a lot and it got pregnant the whole weekend through, which is on previous episodes. This was like a

three episode arc of a shitty little trip in Florida. People go to Morocco and don't get the meat out of it. Like we could have gone to Secaucus and had a three episode arc. You know what I mean? Like they spend all this money to go to fuck. And we're the, New York is the queen of shitty trips that deliver. And I'm part of those shitty trips. We go to like, always go to cheesy Miami and like a cheapo Mexican trip. Other people are going to Bali. Like we always are like on the low. Yeah. So this was a three episode arc and it's,

It would have been, I would have said to the producers, to your point,

that would have been great. I'm staying, call Tom. He has to shoot. He'd call Luann and be like, they want me to shoot. Why? And she'd be like, why are you guys shooting? I want to be like, I can't imagine that would have been, the producers would be too lazy for that, but that's a superb idea. I should have waited all weekend. And then, but they like things to bust out like a pinata on the trips, as you saw later at the pinata. Yeah. But I like, that's a, thank you for coming into this prepared, Kevin. That was a very good,

That's I didn't even think of that. Okay. Oh yeah. I mean, I'm like Elizabeth Moss. I didn't realize how much research this would be. I had to take night courses on this to be prepared. You could do a side. She already asked right after she did it. She asked, she could do it again. Like she loved it. You guys can do a side podcast on it. Like you could do behind the scenes of the behind the scenes. We can do the rap show. We can do the wrap up. Yes. After dark. We wives. I watched the interview when I said, uh,

like I dropped this bomb, but like, oh, I want to go back on my merry way. Like I, okay, get out of my, like I told you, like I did what I was supposed to do. I told, I don't want to be like in this now with you in the room, like with you and Tom and the thing, you know, this is the quintessential shoot the messenger. Is this not? Oh, totally. Totally. It's putting the blame on the wrong person. You know, it's, it's the blame should be on Tom. Yeah.

And yet she puts it on you again. She's deflecting because she doesn't want to believe that Tom would have an affair. I mean, look at all the excuses she had. Well, it's not timestamp. How do we know what data is was and how do we know, you know, is that really Tom? And this could have been like a year ago. Right. So now I'm defending myself right now. I'm defending myself. Right. And then you you.

bathe in that guilt for a long time that, you know, maybe you shouldn't have told her. You know, like I said, I thought you were the one who got dumped in the beginning or who got cheated. It's crazy. From your perspective, let's hear about the characters, like your first instinct about each character and how they responded, how they reacted and what you thought of them. Well, you know, I...

I know that that is, that is a strategy that some people have and they can't help it. You know, when, you know, when you're, you feel horrible and then they start talking about how they got cheated on and all of a sudden it becomes about them. Right. Right. So, and I find myself doing that too, only because I don't know how to, you know, console somebody who's had a tragedy in their life. Like somebody said, oh, you know, my, my parents died and I feel horrible. I love them so much. Yeah.

Yeah, I remember when my parents died. I...

I still feel like they're right here. And all of a sudden it's all about you. And I think that was her, Ramona's, unknowing strategy. - Yeah, I don't even know if that's an incorrect strategy because I think it does make someone feel better that someone else has cheated on it for 25 years publicly. And that it's so funny how page six comes up so many times in the show too. Like it's gonna be on page, you had to hear about it on page six. - It's not even the New York Post. - No.

- Right. - They pay six. - Did you think that Luann was overly focused on the court of public opinion? - Yeah. - Like this is around, that's interesting to me. - Getting around town. Yeah, it's getting around, everybody knows. It's around the city. But ultimately she didn't care. She ended up marrying Tom, right?

She ended up marrying Tom and ended up divorcing Tom shortly thereafter. I was the, you know, here's the thing. It happened again later before they got married. I was always the most vocal one on the show in general. There was a girl. You were the most vocal one? Yeah.

That's crazy.

Sometimes it'll take several seasons, like in life, several years where you've said something and then you get vindication. It could be an in, you know, a parent-in-law that thinks the son shouldn't marry someone. They see the writing on the wall and you're screaming, you're jumping up and down. And I guess that's a question. How does everybody have to learn for themselves? Because it seems like a long, expensive, exhausting lesson. How do you really convey to someone that

that they're 100% going down the wrong road. Like, there was no doubt in my mind. There's other scenes months and years later of me saying to her, no, this guy's a bad guy. No, don't do this. Yeah, well, that's the peril you put yourself into if you start taking sides and then they get together. What kind of relationship can you have with that person again? If I found out that three significant people in my life

felt the same way about somebody, I think I would listen. That's my problem. Yeah. I never had that in my, in my marriage. It was only one person that thought significantly that like, that it was a mistake and somebody else who didn't mention it till later. So I guess people have to subtly mention it so we can get this math going. Three people have to say it.

Yeah. My wife is my most significant person in my life. And if I come up with a joke for my standup, I'll run it by her. And I think it's a really good joke, but she'll go, I don't know. And then in my head, I'm thinking, you'll see, I'll show you. So I go on stage and I do it. And sometimes it gets a laugh. Other times it doesn't. I'll come back and say, you were right. You were right. That's so funny. Right. If you did it with three people, three people thought it wasn't funny. There's no way it's actually funny. Yeah.

Yeah, that's right. And why do I even ask her if I'm not going to listen to her? You know, and I think, oh, well, I'm the comedian. I've had over 40 years of experience on the stage. What do you know? Well, hasn't she had over 40 years experience laughing in the audience? Probably more than that. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting, though. Yeah. And also, yeah. But you're probably delivering it differently to her. Do you deliver your jokes differently to her than you do on? So you're very dry anyway. Like meaning what's how do you deliver a joke the same way you're going to do it on stage to your wife at home?

Well, first of all, this joke comes out of nowhere at home. It's just like, hey, listen to this. I have a long buildup to it. They get my style and they're laughing already and they assume that this joke is supposed to be funny sometimes. And they're just laughing because they're used to laughing at everything they say. Oh, this must be funny because, you know, the other stuff was funny. Right. You need a buildup. Right. So you should have sex in the middle of sex. Just tell your wife a joke. It's like a buildup. And then you see if it's a plant lands better.

Right. And then if you're having sex, like out of the blue, um, and she doesn't like it, you go, well, you know, we didn't have sex yesterday. So how did you know? Exactly. Yeah, exactly. That's really fun. Exactly. That was good. That's why you get paid the big bucks, Kevin. Um, okay. So now we're at the pinata party. Um, first of all, moving toward the pinata with $10,000 worth of, uh,

Moving towards a pinata. That was actually, I have to say, I thought that was a very good idea. For desperate women, you know, desperate women that live on the Upper East Side. Yeah. And so for wealthy, desperate women. You know, I was proud of myself to put like some jewelry in the middle of like, you know, the degradation of having to like go through Tootsie Rolls to get a bracelet. Yeah. Like on your knees.

Once it's on the floor, then you make up a new rule. You can only have one each or something. You can only have two each. I made up. Yeah, I just made up. Because I know. Because Ramona, I knew she would go grabbing. And in fact, off camera, Ramona, there was another pair of earrings that I knew hadn't been found. And I was like, where's that pair of earrings? And Ramona was hoarding an extra item. Oh, that's so Ramona. She took it.

You have no idea. She took from someone else and she lost a shoe. I mean, it was hysterical. So an important question. I'm surprised they didn't hit each other with the sticks. I know. That should have happened. A fact. Yeah. It's the finale. It's when they try to piece everything together. Do you like my hair better long or short?

I liked it short. I did too. I was shocked in that particular episode. I didn't mind it short. I might have to do it again. I don't have a good, in my mind, I have a bad memory of it. But in that episode, it felt pretty like sharp and sleek, but I'm old. By the way, if you, I've learned this. If you're, let's say I have a girlfriend or whomever, and this happened to that girl I was talking about. She came home one day and her hair was almost like a

You know, it's almost like mine right now. She cut it that short. And you know what that means? They are ready for change. They want to change in their lives.

And they start with the hair. Oh, interesting. Okay. That's funny. That's one analysis of it anyway. I like it. At that time when I got that haircut, I was ready for change. That's very interesting. It was a moment. Also, my jumpsuit was inappropriately revealing and my boob was popping out, but I thought... Yeah, yeah. I noticed that. I know. You were the most provocatively dressed at that party. And of my whole housewives career, I've never worn something like that. It just... But it looked good. I like the way it looked. I like it.

like I nailed it, but it was, it was almost, the wheels were almost coming off. Um, so by wheels, you mean? Yeah, the wheel. Yeah. The wheels were coming out. Um, so Jules, they're divorced now. Nasty, nasty divorce. Luann and Tom divorced now. Ramona divorced from the guy that cheated on her and Sonia, um, divorced from a Morgan, like a grandson of JP Morgan. So

And Carol still friends with, but not with that younger man that she was with on that, like a little step and repeat. I forgot. What about you? Oh, I was going through a gnarly divorce, like a gnarly decade long, decade long on a two year marriage divorce. And I, when they said that the divorce was over, it was funny because I thought to myself, it was only really recently just over. But at that point it was legally legal.

custody wise and monetarily over, but I went back in for custody and it's been, it was a decade long nightmare, nightmare. So at that point that was like one gauntlet I had

gotten through. I don't even think I had gotten through the custody portion. I think that was just the financial portion. So what a nightmare. How many kids? One. Nightmare. Divorce is a nightmare. There's nothing that compares to it. It's just a nightmare. Especially if you have a kid. Especially if you have a kid. To your point about the people that you know that you were wondering if they should get married, fundamental differences are very critical in a relationship. If

Meaning Paul, my fiance, likes to go to bed very early. And it's actually a good influence on me because it makes me go to bed earlier. My body, you know, stays awake longer than his, but he's like tired early and he's real, you know, mellow energy. And I'm obviously not. But that is not something I call fundamental. That's more like habitual. Fundamental is like the things you find funny, like who you are as a person, your goal set, you know, your vibe with family or like,

Having guests at your house. Like, are you a person with the party all the time? Are you in homebody like religion, you know, culture? So I feel that fundamental differences are massive in in relationships. And I want to know what you think about that. Well, I totally agree with you. My wife was a better girl, too.

When I'm more laid back, I'll go to bed early just so we have that companionship, but then I'll get up. I'll get up when she's asleep and I'll get a lot of work done and do the things I want to do. But yeah, I mean, I agree. There's a lot of things that you need to have in common. I was a vegetarian when I met my wife and she wasn't. She was from the South.

That would be a fundamental, right? Going to bed early is a habit. And I would call being a vegetarian and then someone who loves animals and hunting, that would be a fundamental difference. I want to hear about that. Right, right. And I never pressed on her to change. But she just saw the way to eat and she thought it was healthier and she changed on her own. You know, I was never somebody who would tell anybody what to eat. Right.

But also I think, and I've been telling people this, that if you want to have a good marriage, I find that if you come from the same background, if you've had a good relationship with your family and they haven't, there's a lot of issues there. There are a lot of issues. And so, you know, I always ask people when they're about to get married. I say, you guys, you guys both like your, your family, your parents. And somebody will say, Oh, I hate my mother. I hate. And then the other person said, I love my mom. You know what I think?

Good luck. Absolutely. And, you know, or something you have to really work on. It's true. Like my challenges in my childhood are something I really have to work on and intervene in, in a relationship with someone whose parents have been married for over 50 years, you know? Yeah. But,

There are these, it's funny, like we are true, true to the core homebodies. We will venture out sometimes and do things and I'll do it. It's always, if I have to do it for work, there's literally nothing.

There's almost literally no exception. Those types of things come up all the time. Like if I've been in relationships with people that want to go out all the time and want to go out in big groups all the time and go on group vacations all the time. And it's it's like asking a dog to be a cat for me. You kind of you know what I mean? You want to you want to be able to you can be opposite, but it has to be that the person can really be who they who they are. That would make me who I'm not.

And I think about the fact that funny though, because Tom and Luann were very similar because they had a lot of fundamental similarities. Yeah. I mean that maybe that made her more forgiving to him. Maybe, you know, her, Oh, I get it. Yeah. And maybe she's had an affair before that she's never talked to. Maybe that's another episode. Oh, well definitely. Yes. A hundred percent in another relationship, but yes, yes, yes, yes. Yeah. You know what else? What I was thinking that, you know, you,

you know, when people meet and they just, they're wondering, you know, are they good for each other? As a friend, you're wondering that. I've come to, you know, from my relationships and, you know, I have a son now and I want him to be with somebody that's, that we really like.

And that is good for him. And sometimes you're young, you're just going for the looks. You're looking for, you know, somebody to turn you down with their looks. You're not thinking about their values and their morals and what they believe in in life. And so I, you know, I became a real believer in a mate and arranged marriages. Yeah, I agree. By the way, I agree.

Because we have the experience. We know. We can see it because we're not in love with that person. Yes. I mean, but you should give like, you could have your own version of The Bachelor. I'm going to explain to you. My assistant is 23 years old.

She met her, they're not engaged, her boyfriend. They've been together four years. She met him at her in college and they got more serious during the pandemic and they both had houses in Florida. So the parents all got to be close. The parents, all four of them are best friends, talk every day. The parents talk to the other kids. It's literally like an arrangement. It's like two families. It's very Game of Thrones, but everybody likes everybody. And it actually, it would be more enriching to your life too. Like you love your son's,

wife's family. You guys, you have a new friend, you know, someone to go on your hikes with you. You could do caricatures of them. Like, you know, it's like a whole thing. You should work on that. Like get started now, like get like 10 to 25 good candidates and do your own internal reality show. I like that. But the problem with both sets of parents liking your, your partner is if you ever break up, they're all going to gang up on you. Nobody will side with you.

Right.

Thanksgiving, we're with your parents. Christmas, we're with your parents. Like big gifts here. So if there's other things that people want from us, we're starting from an advantageous point. Like I'm like, okay, so now we're putting in a lot of chips in the beginning. So if we make mistakes later, people can't get really mad at us. We give Easter or something, forget it. So when you don't have two families fighting for the holidays, that one person has a lot easier.

Yeah. You know, like he doesn't have to split and tell his parents he's got to come to my family for the holidays. He gets to say to his parents, we're coming to you for everything. So that's a big gift. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, when you have your spouse that doesn't want to go to your house for a holiday, I mean, that's the beginning of the downfall.

Totally. Totally. Yes. And you realize when nobody's asking about your spouse, how are they doing? You know that they're not. Yes. Yes.

Hello, everyone. I am Lacey Lamar. And I'm Amber Ruffin, a better Lacey Lamar. Boo. Okay, everybody, we have exciting news to share. We're back with season two of the Amber and Lacey, Lacey and Amber show on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network. You thought you had fun last season? Well, you were right. And you should tune in today for new fun segments like Sister Court and listening to Lacey's steamy DMs. We've got new and exciting guests like Michael Beach. That's my husband. Daphne Springs.

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Welcome to the CINO Show. I'm your host, CINO McFarlane. I'm an addiction specialist. I'm a coach. I'm a translator. And I'm God's middleman. My job is to crack hearts and let the light in and help everyone shift the narrative. Whether your get down is sex, drugs, alcohol, love addiction, self-hate, codependency, or anything else for that matter.

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Luann is in the party and we are literally not talking about her or Tom at all. And she comes over and is entirely paranoid. Understandable. You're on a reality show. There are cameras. When you see a group of people talking, they're usually talking about you if you're not the one in the group. And then it turns and she wonders why I had all of this information and why I'm so interested in her life. And you see this thing snap to the other side where it's like, don't be interested in my life.

And that was a light bulb moment in my life of like, oh, you're the one who doesn't want to know. Right. Because my friends are not that my best friends are not the one who doesn't want to know. Like they're the ones who want to know. It's almost like when somebody doesn't want to go get a physical because they don't want to know what's brewing inside of them.

You know, they just avoid it. They don't want to go. They don't want to talk about it. I know a lot of people like that. They don't want to, they don't want to find out that they have colon cancer. So they'd rather not even go. So you're laying in bed with your wife and you're telling her about the fact that someone's cheating. Is she going to be like, who, which of you is saying, tell them? And which of you is saying, stay the fuck out of it? Well, with my wife,

Yeah. Or what would you, are you the stay out of it? Or you would tell, would you tell you leave it alone and ignore it? Well, my wife is more of the, you know, honesty, be honest, be transparent with everything. And I'm probably more of the other way. You know, it's none of my business, you know, find out, or maybe I'll have somebody else tell them. Ah, you would have told Ramona to tell you would have stayed out of it. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Or if I knew somebody, if I knew somebody who gossiped a lot, I would tell that person. Yes. But you had the winning strategy, which was to tell Tom. That was, that was great. Yeah. That was genius. I want to go back and ask them if we can reshoot that scene. So, so, so I, so I say, fine, I see him doing something in the street. I will not say it. And then that's the end. So there, there you have it. I mean, so, so what was your rose of,

of this episode and what was your thorn? Well, the thorn was, of course, that Tom cheated on her. But the thorn was that how she wouldn't confront him and or wouldn't break up with him. That was the thorn. The rose was how everybody supported her or tried to support her and how much passion you had for it because you just totally told her and then you took the consequences.

It's funny that you say that. I think one of the reasons it's rated so well and was a good episode, because I've watched back on other episodes of other cities and they don't hold up time-wise as much. I thought it was a good episode because I didn't think it was fake support. Yeah.

There's a lot of fake support on house as I'm supporting you to support your girlfriends, girls, supporting women and women stick together. I did feel that it was genuine from everyone. I did. Oh, what about the fact that Tom, I remember this. Sorry, everybody. This is behind BTS. I was on the phone with Dorinda. I remember laying in my bed in my apartment and her calling me. And it usually it's like, it's like rats or roaches in the city. You see one and they're really a thousand underneath. So what Dorinda said on television about Tom telling her, this is how it's going to play out.

She was on the phone with me. I remember in the morning saying to me, because she was good friends with them, she set them up. So because she set them up, she felt like she was sort of part of their relationship. Like she'd go out with them for drinks a lot and hang out, and they were all a group. Because she was getting all the credit for setting Luann up with her fiance. And then all of a sudden the pendulum swings and she's the devil for doing it. But she called me and said, Tom was like, basically, no, if you don't... Because he wanted...

her to cover it up and make it like it didn't happen or like I was lying or the restaurant was lying. They wanted to get the waiter in on it. They really wanted to do a whole cover-up job. And because they're good friends with Dorinda, it was like, you are not our friend and you will not be invited to the wedding. What about that scandal? Yeah. I mean, it just breeds more scandals. Like you said, you see one rat, you know, there's a lot around. Right.

Right. I can't believe he wanted. Yeah, he wasn't willing to just come correct. Think about that. He's on television now and he's going to be on the show again with Luann getting married, knowing that America knows he cheated on her. And I just don't think he cares. No, obviously he doesn't care. I mean, he doesn't care about a lot of things. He doesn't care about, you know, Luann's feelings. He's just kind of selfish. He's just out for himself. And that's why the marriage didn't last that long. You know, they got divorced. Yeah. He's just trying to.

He was trying to take the pressure off himself. He didn't want to get married. He was just trying to save face. Right? I believe that he didn't want to get married. And, you know, he probably had, he probably had a couple of girls on the side and that was just the one they caught him with. Right? Yeah. Cause I know if you knew Tom, like I knew Tom. Yeah, I know. It's about Tom. It's about damn Tom. Yeah.

It's about damn Tom. But I would be worried if I was Tom and I knew all those housewives were getting together and talking about me and trash me and, you know, sizing me up. I would be really worried. That's because you are who you are. Some people who have that charming, faux charming, they like to be relevant, even if it's that. And because, you know, he's not a model or anything and he's marginally wealthy. So he...

you know, likes a little bit of the, the shine people talk about him. And the fact that someone would even call him a player, it usually has to be, you know, that, that probably means.

That's kind of a compliment for him. That's what I'm saying. It's a compliment for that guy to be called a player. So I feel like guys, and there's another one. It's another breed. There's another guy. His name is Tom. And there's another one, Harry. I was, I was like, when are we going to get a dick? But we have a lot of dick. There were a lot, there was a lot of dick on this show, but there's another guy named Harry and he was the same. He liked to be housewives adjacent and in some scenes and like,

be the butt of a joke a little bit, didn't mind it. It's a strange and some money, but not a ton. Like this whole strange little subculture of these guys in New York. Stay away from them. And this weird group of women that actually like that because it feels like some sort of Upper East Side micro fandom. It's weird. But anyway, there's a thing with that. And they're all hanging out at the Regency.

Yeah. Is there a bar called the Regency? It's in the hotel. It's a Lowe's Regency Hotel. And it's the restaurant and bar, which where a lot of people do power lunches and breakfast in particular, because it's up in the 60s on Madison, like not far from everything. Right. Where they're all like the, you know, the finance offices are. And...

that was like one of the watering holes on the Upper East Side. It's just like Desperado divorces. Yeah. Yeah. Like it's, I don't ever, I literally, I go to LA more than I go to the Upper East Side. That's an absolute fact. That's not an exaggeration. That's a literal fact. So which housewife are you? Well, I'm not you because you are too, you're too aggressive and aggressive.

You know, I would probably be Sonia. You're the straw that stirs the drink? A little bit. Like I wouldn't be confrontational, but I would stir it up a little.

I was like, yeah, that's a, that's a great. Yeah. Because Sonia is like saying, making a couple of comments. She let us know she dated Tom. She let us, she was in the mix, but like stepped back a little, but we knew that she was sort of in there. She was the straw stirring the drink a little. Right. Fascinating. All right. Well, what did you think? What'd you think of the show? Well, like I said, I've never watched the housewives before. And, uh,

And so I kind of saw what the hoopla was about. You know, there's a lot of, there's a lot of drama. There's a lot of, you know, different personalities. And I, you know, I liked it. I liked it. Now I have to follow this episode. Now I have to follow this storyline to find out what happens. Damn you. I'm sorry. Did you laugh? Oh yeah, I did laugh. And also I was very analytical. It's like when I watch a comedian, I,

I know they're funny and sometimes I don't laugh at the material, but I know it's funny, but I'm analyzing or I'm trying to be one step ahead of them to see what they're going to say. You know, like, what's the joke? How are they crafting it or anything like that? But yeah, I really did like it because I know you. It's fun to watch it, you know, to see what you're doing. Well, I appreciate that. It's funny that you're probably the first person in your household to watch The Housewives. Yeah.

A lot of people watch it. I know a lot of people watch it. I know how, of course it's been on for so long. So people like it. You're the best. I appreciate so much you doing this. So what are you working on? Well, I have a couple of things. First of all, thank you for asking me that. Oh, of course. I always ask. These paintings behind me, these are paintings I've done caricatures because I love drawing caricatures. I've only started getting into it in the last couple of years, really going full-time.

full, you know, full power head. And then I got a book deal to put these characters and caricatures in a book and then opposite page, I do a little anecdote about them and, you know, how my experience with them when I met them, or if I didn't meet them like Freddie Mercury or somebody, I just talked about music and going to concerts and things like that. So it's called, I exaggerate my brushes with fame. I love that. That's like a quadruple entendre. Yeah. Right. I mean, I've got a whole like wall here full of them, you know, all just...

What a great passion. That's so amazing. Yeah, I'm so excited about it. And people seem to be excited. I'm going on a book tour soon. And my other project is I have a hiking show, as you know, Bethany.

And I hike with a different celebrity every week. Great guests lined up. And it's funny because when you start hiking out in the outside and there's no audience and it's just the two of you, I do it on a selfie stick. People are really forthcoming and revealing. And I hear some pretty good stories that I don't think they would tell on a regular talk show. Really? I love that. Well, first of all, how many caricatures have you drawn and

Then I want to know how many people you've hiked with and done interviews. In my book, there's probably about 60, 60 caricatures, but I've probably done about, you know, a hundred caricatures. Will you send me the book? Cause I'll definitely promote it. Cause I want to look at it. I want to look at my Paul, my fiance will be obsessed with it too. Especially the music stuff. Yeah.

Yeah, I'd love for you to have it. I will absolutely promote it for you. I love it. But what a great, and also like it's a craft that nobody else has. Like you do stuff, it's rare to do something that no one else knows how to do. That's what I find the most interesting about it. Well, yeah, other people know how to do caricatures and some of them are much better than me, but I just like doing it. It's like with the hiking thing. It's not like I've got a big contract to do it. I don't even get paid for the hiking thing.

No, but not anybody could do a character. I mean, I'm sure there are people who do it. There are people that also, you know, can make balloon animals and juggle, but not that many people can do this. So I'm excited. Balloon animals was my second choice. Oh, okay. We'll do balloon animal books of these people and then write about them. That could be the next time.

Welcome to the CINO Show. I'm your host, Cino McFarlane. I'm an addiction specialist. I'm a coach. I'm a translator. And I'm God's middleman. My job is to crack hearts and let the light in and help everyone shift the narrative. I want to help you wake up and I want to help you get free. Most importantly, I don't want you to feel alone. Listen to the CINO Show every Wednesday on iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hi, I am Lacey Lamar. And I'm also Lacey Lamar. Just kidding. I'm Amber Revin. Okay, everybody, we have exciting news to share. We're back with season two of the Amber and Lacey, Lacey and Amber show on Will Ferrell's Big Money Players Network. This season, we make new friends, deep dive into my steamy DMs,

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