I Was a Fraud Investigator — Then My Son Nearly Died | Pastor Mark Rice
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I found this club that he was going to be performing at. But it was one of those clubs where they were like, no guns and no cameras. And they pat you down. So what I did is I went over to the local supermarket and got a disposable camera. And I put that in the front of my pants. So when they pat me down, I figured they weren't going to pat me there. But in, I look quite excited.

to be at this club and I said, well, this don't work. Pastor Mark Rice spent his life exposing liars and chasing down fraud until his son had a near-death experience. That life-changing moment led him down an unexpected path from investigator to pastor. Now he's helping others break generational curses, find forgiveness, and heal from their past. This is a powerful story of transformation, faith, and redemption. I hope you guys enjoy it.

Pastor Mark, welcome to Locked In. I know there's some travel delays getting here, but you made it, and so happy to have you here today. Man, I am grateful to be here. Appreciate the opportunity. And thanks for being a listener of the show and finding us and reaching out, man. It's very—we appreciate it. I appreciate your platform and just the honesty, the honesty, the honesty.

and the people just being candid and forthright, you know, sharing their testimonies as to where they've been. And it's amazing. Some of the testimonies of just survival have been very, very riveting. And I appreciate this particular platform. And I appreciate you guys receiving my requests. I know it's not necessarily a consistent or normal transition. However,

It is when we look back at what's the driving factor, the driving force that ultimately get people to be locked up and in prison. That's some of the things I want to talk about today.

Yeah, I love having different perspectives on the show. Some people don't like it because they always want to hear the prison shot caller stories, but I can do that. I can sit here and listen to a prison shot caller every time. So I like having a diverse array of individuals, and it's relatable to someone. Each story will touch one person. Not everyone will agree with it, but then again, not everyone agrees with everyone anyways in the world. Absolutely. It doesn't even matter. Yeah, as I like to say, Ian,

I don't give a flying Pharisees what people have to say. A Pharisees? A flying Pharisees. You know what Pharisees are? No, it's a Phariseed. Pharisees? Okay. In biblical terms, those were the people that studied and they were the religious people. You know, they kind of had everything in a box. That's the way it should fit. And they weren't willing to consider religion.

other sources of power and things of that nature. Consider other options. They just had it in their mind that this is the way it's going to be and that's it. Interesting. So where did you grow up? Where are you from? I'm originally from Buffalo, New York. Oh, you're from Buffalo? Yeah. Oh, my family's from Rochester. Oh, is that right? Yeah. And I think you follow some of the rappers or you did?

From Buffalo? No, no, no. Just in general. I heard you speak of Wiz Khalifa and some of the other guys. There's a couple of rappers out of Buffalo. Oh.

Benny the Butcher and West Side Gun. I don't know if you've heard of them. I've heard of Benny the Butcher. Yeah, those are my nephews. Those are your nephews? Yeah. Benny the Butcher is your nephew? Mm-hmm. Wow. Is he still making music today? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So what they sing about is accurate. So we can all...

You know, we all have the opportunity to communicate and they communicate differently than I do. I'm not here to judge anybody, man. You know, people speak and sing and rap about their experiences. This platform is about people's experiences and what contributed to who they are today. Yeah. Tell us about your upbringing. What was that like? Yeah. So I...

Like I said, I was born in Buffalo, New York, and in the inner city. And like yourself, you know, I was raised middle income there until about 10 years old, and my parents divorced. And then my mom and I moved into the inner city, and I guess that's where I pretty much got my training, you know. And so I grew up there in the inner city. I grew up very religious, you know.

A lot of rules, regulations, and tradition. I didn't understand anything other than man-made religion. And I, even as a youngster, was a womanizer. So my story is when my parents were together at five years old, I was introduced to porn by my father. Okay. And for your listeners, in those days, in the 60s,

you couldn't get everything you wanted on your phone, right? So this is going to be before a lot of your time, but there was what we call a projector where you had film, right? And you put it through the projector and there was another reel here and then it went to like a screen. And so my father introduced me to porn there. And so that made an imprint on my life. And as I like to say, most people don't,

Even some of the shot callers and some of the gangsters that would be watching it, they would probably understand introducing their children to pornographic images at that age probably wouldn't be the best thing. That's why a lot of us at that age, our parents are introducing us to Sesame Street, you know, and some of these things. But that wasn't my story. My story is this is what I was taught.

And so that made an impact on my life and imprint on my life from the time I'm five to 50, you know, um, as I say now, my, my bride, my, my wife is the only woman I've ever been faithful to, but that is through, you know, the power, the redemptive power of, of Christ and where he bought me from, you know? And so I, uh, like I said, I grew up very religious and, uh,

I went to church, but I just went to church. I never received anything from it. I didn't have a personal relationship. And then on top of that, I end up becoming a fraud investigator. Right. And so with that, I'm super skeptical.

Right. So if you're operating in an industry where the majority of the people that you investigate are fraudulent, you know, you become very cynical for you question everything. And so that's just that was just part of my upbringing. And what happened is I began to pursue.

Deliverance. Are you familiar with that term? Yeah. Okay. Okay. Well, I wasn't. I had no idea what that was. I didn't at that age either. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Even as an adult in the traditional church, I had no idea what deliverance was. And my son had a near-death experience, my oldest son, and he went to church once.

And he was praying for a young lady and a demon manifested. Any idea what that means? A demon? A demon. Yeah. Yeah. I know what a demon is, but probably not in the sense. Okay. No worries. So this ancient voice began to speak through a 21-year-old woman. We didn't see anything like this in our church. And so anyway, he saw this or he alleged, he claimed that he saw this and he's telling me about it.

And I go, dude, that's not real. That's Hollywood. And he goes, dad, I promise. This ancient voice spoke through this woman, right? And then somebody in the ministry with experience came over and cast the demon out. You know, it has to go. And so he's telling me this, and I'm like, yeah, okay. And I know he's turned his life over so he's not –

hitting the joints anymore or drinking, but he saw something. But as far as a demonic voice or hearing a demonic voice come out of a 21-year-old woman, maybe not so much.

But as an investigator, I was intrigued by it. Right. And I wouldn't say I was necessarily researching to find holes in what he was saying, but there has to be an answer. So when you're doing investigations, you continue to follow the lead, follow the money, interview everybody. Sooner or later, you'll get to the truth is what we believe. So I began to investigate what it is he told me.

And I found a pastor online on YouTube and his name was The Real Exorcist. I was like, OK, what is this hocus pocus? So I began to watch this guy's videos for like two months straight, just watching it. And I'm like, what is this mass hysteria? But what was interesting in is that people.

in different countries were saying the same things that other people were saying. Like somebody in Russia would say what they're saying in Jackson, Mississippi. They're given the same testimony. Someone in Croatia, you know, would say what they're saying in Indianapolis. And I'm like, what is this? You know, and what happens, this real exorcist was coming to South Carolina. Well, I was intrigued, you know,

So and at that time, I didn't tell my wife or any of my 12 girlfriends. I went over there. Right. And I drove over there. And when I say that, it's not to stick out my chest. It's nothing to be proud of.

that's how bad my addiction was. That's how bad my addiction was. So I was introduced to that lifestyle even as a child. So I didn't know any other way. And I'm not making excuses. None of this is excuses. None of this to get whatever we talk about today is to give nobody a pass. What I want to present to you and your viewers is that there may be some contributing factors to some of the decisions we made and some of the places we ended up.

You know, when you're looking at these stints, you know, and these sentences, what does it stem from? If somebody says, yeah, well, I got caught. But outside of that, you know, what does it come from? Where do these thoughts come from? And this is what I want to present today, just as I say in our church, prayer.

Let's look at the big picture. How do we get here? Right. Yeah, sure. We got caught and we made some decisions. But what are the the the the factors that maybe we're not considering? Right. And so in my case, I just begin to investigate this. And then I end up driving us out over to South Carolina. And so it was like this conference room in a hotel. So I'm there in the back. I'm like, all right, these people are nuts.

But this lady shows up and she goes, my daughter has demons. And the guy says, OK. So he cast a demon out of the daughter and the mom. And what that means is just like what my son claimed he saw. This entity is speaking through this young lady. Another entity is speaking through the mom. He has authority. He's casting it out. And the ladies feel like free. They feel freedom.

And so I'm watching this. I'm not saying anything. I'm in the back of the room. Again, I'm watching these people. These people are out there, man. I've never seen this in church. So at the end, I call both of the ladies over and I now go into investigative mode. I talk to him, say, hey, what when that was going on, can you describe what was happening? And they both said it was as if something was speaking through me.

No, it was something was speaking through me and it was as if I couldn't control it. I could hear it talking to me, but I did not know why it was saying these things. And I was like, OK, all right. So now I take that information and I compare it to what I've been watching for the last couple of months. Right.

And I begin to pray. It's like, OK, God, if this stuff is real, would you show me? I don't want to go by what anybody else is saying. I want to show I want to know. So I come back to Atlanta where we live. And I told one of my girlfriends about this and she goes, I believe in that stuff. I would like to go to that church with you.

Now, this is probably the first time on your awesome platform that you had a pastor say, a married pastor at the time, say that he took one of his girlfriends to church on a date with.

But today's the first day of the rest of your life, and we keep it 100. So you were a pastor already at that time? I wasn't a pastor at that time. Oh, okay. But I'm just saying that's part of my history. Yeah. So it was a professional center back then. Professional center. Yeah, yeah, yeah. PhD in sinning. So we go, and they're ministering. They're praying with her. And an ancient voice speaks through this woman that I'm engaging with. And now I'm like, what the –

is happening. But now this woman that I'm, you know, intimate with is experiencing what I've been watching the last few months and then what I've seen in person. So then I said, okay, all right, there's a lot here that I just don't know. See, we have an issue in when we think we have a lot of things figured out because you don't know what you don't know.

And so I'm not bragging or anything like that. I just saw enough to say like, OK, if this stuff is real, you know, please let me. I'm praying to the big guy like, please let me know. And so now the pastor at that church in Atlanta, Liberation Freedom Ministry, he invited me to come to his church.

And so I started going to his church. One of my investigators was a preacher's kid, right? So I figured I'd take her along with me. She had to know some of this, even if I missed it in church. So we go, and it's more of this casting out demon business. People coming up and stuff is leaving them. And we're like, we're fraud investigators. So we're like, this is a bunch of you-know-what. And so we're like, let's go. And so we're walking out.

And this lady stops us before we get to the door. It's my first aha moment. Right. And remember, one of my girlfriends, she, something spoke through her, which is weird, but I just kept going. We walked to the door and somebody stops us. And it's a young man, maybe, you know, from where I am, maybe a few feet past you. And he's kind of sitting there staring with his head cocked to the side. But the sound coming out of this kid was like,

Any horror movie you ever heard. But he's not blinking, right? And no one's panicking. They're just walking around like it's another day in the office. And I'm like, what? Could this stuff be real? That's what I'm saying. And so that was like my major aha moment. And I just began to research. And I was like, OK. Even if I wasn't a born-again Christian, I can read and I can research things.

So I start Googling scriptures about unclean spirits, dark spirits, demons, devils, countless. Then I Googled the one that said they no longer exist and it's not there. Okay. All right. I know what I'm seeing. Now I'm seeing, I don't see any evidence that demons no longer exist. I was like, okay. So I kept going. Now me personally. Now, if this stuff is real and there are demonic influences around,

on certain behaviors, then maybe there's an answer for how bad things are for me. Not an excuse. There's an answer for how bad things are. Like who needs 12 girlfriends? How is that a thing? Who needs these continuous behaviors, right? And so some of us are dealing with the spirit of greed. And the one thing about greed is you can never satisfy it.

That's why some people looking at this podcast like, man, that's right. I had so much money and I just kept going. Right. Because you never can scratch that itch. You know, it goes for some of us. It goes from, you know, edibles to blunts.

Right. And then on and on and on and on. And before you know it, you're looking at an addiction and things of that nature. But anyway, it's spirits working against us. This is what is written. So I just began to pursue it from from that angle and continue just to go on. And I remember me personally going and like you and I are sitting here. The pastor is ministering to me.

He's speaking to me just maybe a little closer than you and I are. And what's happening, Ian, as he's speaking to me, I can hear his mouth moving. But at some point, I can see his mouth moving. At some point, I can't hear him. And before you know it, I'm like this. I'm like knocked out. This goes on for like 14 months. Somebody said, why didn't you give up? Why would I give up? I know it has to be something supernatural because all day, you know, I'm awake, you

But when I have these meetings, I like literally pass out. And so I just kept going back. I was like, OK, there's got to be an answer here. Right. And at that time, I still was, you know, having a lot of dealing with a lot of struggles, you know, my own life. Like I was understanding that I needed to give that life up, but I couldn't. I couldn't give that life up.

You know, I was a terrible, terrible womanizer. Right. Now, there is something that is called generational curses. And a few people on your platform want to likely mention that. Right. And so that's one of the things I'm here today from Atlanta to talk about generational curses. Now, we were grateful.

that I saw one of your testimonies that you grew up, you know, middle class, right? And you talked about the lake house and things of that nature.

Which is awesome, right? But many people can't really identify with, relate to that particular upbringing because all they know is poverty, right? And it's not to say one's better than the other. I'm not trying to say that. But the generational curse of poverty, right? And some of the brothers and sisters that will be watching this that have been incarcerated in prison, you know, they will relate to the fact that they will identify, excuse me, that

Their dad was in prison. Their uncles are in prison. Some of their brothers, most of the guys in the neighborhood have gone to prison. These are the things we talk about generational curses, right? That's that, that spirit of poverty or the spirit of lust or the spirit of addiction. You know, a lot of, a lot of people that have been addicted, they come from environments where other people are addicted. Their parents were addicted, right? These are,

ungodly entities operating in our bloodline. Okay. There's scripture in Deuteronomy 5, 9 that says the iniquities of the father are visited to the third and fourth generation. So we know what our DNA is. What I'm speaking to you about is our spiritual DNA. Okay.

All right. And so before I continue my personal story, let me just give you some background on that. So, OK, your father introduced you to porn at five. How does that work? OK, well, my father is the result of my grandmother who before she left, she had given her life to God. But when she was in her 20s, she made mistakes like a lot of us. Right. And she ended up sleeping with a married man.

Right. And then have my father as a result of that. OK, so now that is a bastard child. Right. And we use that term if we look at Scripture, Deuteronomy 23 to it says one of an illegitimate birth doesn't enter into the congregation of the Lord for 10 generations. What means there's a generational curse for 10 generations based on illegitimacy.

And a lot of us were born to illegitimate. We were born illegitimate. Excuse me. And so our parents weren't married. And a lot of times their parents weren't married. And so it goes on and on and on. And so that's on my father's side. So now you have a situation where a guy, you know, is what my grandma produces my dad.

And the guy didn't want anything to do with my father. So now you got the spirit of rejection and abandonment. My father and I always had a strange relationship. We could never put it together. It wasn't until, you know, I got into this particular ministry and understanding how important forgiveness is, you know, for us to kind of, for me to kind of look past that. But anyway, that's now in a bloodline. And so, yeah.

That's on my father's side. On my mother's side of the family, my great-great-grandfather was married, right? But he had two side families. I'm the result of one of those families on the side. Now, he had 13 children with my great-great-grandmother. And so I just talked to you about the spirit of illegitimacy. Excuse me. And then also you have spirits of adultery, right? Right.

and things of that nature, and unwed mothers. And so my mom, as they say, I was at a wedding. I think my mom was like five months pregnant. My first son was born out of wedlock. My second son was conceived out of wedlock. The third one I have is the only way I did it, I was supposed to. But then my second son has a daughter out of wedlock.

It's just a pattern. And we're not the only families, you know, and a lot of people that will be watching this, they can identify with it, identify with it. And so we wear certain patterns, cycles in our bloodline. And this is why, you know, I believe I'm here today to just get people to think about it.

what it is I'm saying and not dismiss it, right? Again, it doesn't give anybody excuse for getting locked up with bad behavior. Nothing I've done is an excuse, but there are contributing factors. And those are the type of things that I want to present today. But do you think it's more mental? Like say you didn't get introduced to porn, right, at five years old. Do you think you would have discovered that on your own because it's in your bloodline to discover that or –

does that just never happen, you know, if you're not introduced to that? So, for example, the individuals that go to prison and they come from a family history of individuals in prison or going through addiction, what if they were never introduced to drugs by their family members or if they never knew that their uncle or their father served time in prison or was a gangbanger or anything like that? What if they were born and just had a normal life

without knowing and that's where the mental aspect comes in like do you think it's mental mentally do they go down that path because they know that it's already existed in their family uh it's an interesting presentation i think it's supernatural i think excuse me i think we are uh

because of these ungodly forces, we're certainly drawn to certain behaviors. That's what I believe, and that's what I've seen by doing this for over a decade. So when you look at, like, say, my life, do you think that I was destined or that force was always meant for me to go down that path then? Not necessarily because from what I understand about your life, your parents –

You know, they didn't do any federal prison time. Right. So if I were to minister to you, what we would talk about is try to understand what drew you to whatever ultimately got you imprisoned. Right. And was it was it a lust for money? I'm just asking. I'm not suggesting what was that part of it?

I think it was my situation was less about money and more about wanting to be liked and be popular. Okay. Especially because I was bullied as a kid. So I wanted to fit in and I, you know, that's why I lied to my friends about losing their money because I didn't want to be hated or disliked for doing that. So that fueled a lot of it, you know, and then when you're, you're in the concert business and the nightclub business and you have all these people loving you and stuff, you don't want to be perceived as a failure. And especially cause I was successful in high school and I was,

you know, promoted as that super successful kid to fail not long after that, that was devastating to me, you know, mentally in my mind. And you want to, once you have that high, you kind of want to cover it up that, you know, things are not as they perceive to be. It's a lot like what social media is now and everything, everything, you know, it's a lot of people go through that. I just happened to do it on a way bigger scale that landed me in federal prison. Absolutely. Absolutely.

And so in that particular case, if I was ministering to you, we would probably go back to

What you felt like, what it felt like when you were bullied is something in our ministry we call inner healing. OK, what is, you know, the driving force for certain behaviors? So in your case, it wasn't the money or, you know, but there are times now when I speak to people in similar situations where there's a spirit of lust and not sexual lust, but lust for money.

admiration, you know, attaboys, he's the man, that type of thing. See, the enemy will use whatever he can ultimately for our demise, right? So if there, I call it kryptonite, Superman kryptonite, right? If there is kryptonite, the enemy will always exploit it.

Right. So my case, it was women. Somebody else's case is it's an addiction. Yours may have been, uh, uh,

the feelings that you have regarding being bullied. And now you're the man, you're doing this and everything. The girls are coming and the people are excited and things that when you, when you walk in a room, but the enemy ultimately will move to exploit that, you know? And so a lot of, a lot of guys I grew up, I was talking about this to someone just yesterday. A lot of guys I grew up in the city with in the city of Buffalo, man, they're on top.

But it's temporary. And I'm not saying every once in a while somebody makes it out. That's an exception to the rule. Many times they get murked or they do time. But the enemy will have us so comfortable in a situation that

where we shouldn't necessarily be, but it's ultimately for our demise. All right, guys, I need to be honest with you about something. I used to carry around this busted leather wallet that was literally exploding at the seams, cards falling out, receipts from five years ago, and it made sitting in a chair straight up uncomfortable. Then someone put me on to Ridge and it changed everything. This thing is...

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we learn about the major addictions like alcohol, drugs, and more so gambling nowadays because of

all the gambling apps and whatnot, but they don't talk about, say, a pornography addiction or, you know, womanizing addictions or wanting to be liked all the time addictions and the dangers of that, too. I think that's a lot of the issues that are going on as well. Absolutely. Absolutely. And this is what, you know, the dark side does. You know, it continues to

to push us into the point where we don't necessarily even want to admit that we've messed up. You were like, I can't tell anybody what's really happening here. And a lot of us, we continue to battle certain addictions today because we don't really have an answer for it. But this is why I'm here today. I want to kind of get people just to think about

what, if there are some contributing factors, if we look at our bloodlines and we look at our circumstances and see if there is any way out. So do you think that you never would have became this interested in it had you not been a investigator? Well, absolutely. I think that contributed a great deal, but also there's going to be a level of self-preservation. Like,

Okay, if this stuff is real, then maybe that would explain certain behaviors. You know, why somebody needs to sleep with three, four, five women in a day, you know? Is there something broken there? So when we talk about that inner healing, we have to try to get to the crux of the matter. You're saying you were bullied. You know, mine maybe was attention, you know, because for mine it wasn't –

My kryptonite, it wasn't just the physical aspect of everything. It was also the hunt. It was also the mental part of it because mine wasn't just like smashing these women. Like I legitimately were their boyfriend if you ask them who their boyfriend was.

They would say that. And again, so to work clear, there's no pride involved in that. In fact, I'm speaking about this because I want people to understand those people that are dealing with sexual addictions and some others. You know, there's an answer. We have to try to get to the crux of the matter and understand, you know, who ultimately can help us out of this. You know, because if God can save me, he can save anybody. And I minister to people every single day.

Right. And guys that have done some terrible things, you know, but I ultimately know who can set them free. Right. And what happens, society wants us to condemn us like we're always X cons no matter what. But if we were to for the people that follow the Bible or at least have some context growing up, you know, you look like Moses and David. These guys murk people.

Right. And God still use them. And I could just go on and on and on. You know, today's the first day of the rest of your life.

And things can certainly turn around for everybody. Well, on that topic, before we move on, it's interesting because you have individuals who are in prison serving life sentences. And you have, I would assume, some of their family members that listen to the show because we do get a lot of family members that want to understand how their loved one or a friend is doing in prison. And that brings up the topic of forgiveness and forgiveness.

How do people find forgiveness when they've done something so horrible and they're in prison for the rest of their lives? And, you know, they're trying to make peace with themselves and that. What would you kind of tell those people? I appreciate that question. So there is a term called legal right. And what the legal right means, what legal right means is if the enemy is operating in our life.

alive, excuse me, he has a legal right. There's an open door, all right? It is due to certain sins that we've committed or the iniquities of our fathers that we inherited. The most proficient weapon that I think that the enemy uses against us is unforgiveness, right? And so what happens, even when we change our lives, if we change our lives,

And we start behaving more in line with God's perfect will. When we don't forgive, it gives the enemy an opportunity, a right to operate in our lives, our finances, our relationships. Right. And so the people that are in jail right now for life sentences because of what they've done. Again, I offer to you.

that today is the first day of the rest of your life. Turn your life over to him and forgive. Now, forgive yourself and forgive others. Many of the guys that you interview were molested as children, correct? Yeah. Yeah, it's consistent. But that causes a trickle-down effect, right?

It causes certain traumas, right? And these traumas are never really dealt with. There's not anybody – in most cases, there's not a consistent process at some of the churches.

And then, you know, we go to psychologists and psychiatrists and things of that nature and counselors. But some of this is a spiritual component. Some of it has a spiritual component. Right. And so what we need is supernatural forgiveness, you know, and the way that we obtain supernatural forgiveness is, again, is via the power of the Holy Spirit. We need God to help us to forgive. Right.

Probably seven out of every 10 people that I minister to in and I'm thank you, Lord. I'm booked out well into September doing deliverance sessions, prayers for people all over the world. But seven out of 10 have have been molested as children. And it's that deep hurt experience.

That's down there. It's never resolved. And it comes out in certain behavior, some of the certain decisions you make that we make. And that's why you consistently will talk to people when they're, you know, honest enough to say, hey, this happened to me. You know, and it's how they've grown to react to it.

So going back to your original question, I would just seek guidance from the Lord as to how to overcome this, how to overcome. You repent for it, right? You seek to him, you know, you presented to him and ask him to take that away from you, that guilt and that unforgiveness. So in the beginning of this, maybe 10 years ago,

I believe I was given by the spirit of the Lord this that I'm going to present to you and your viewers. Make a list of everyone that you need to forgive. And if you're on that list, put your name first and then you pray over the list. Pray for forgiveness. When I first did it, man, I was the one guy that beat me out of like 60, 60, 60 thousand dollars.

And some other people, man. And when I first did the list, I didn't mean it. I put them on the list and I was like, God bless them and everything. But what happens in once I start studying and still start understanding how all of this works, this supernatural life works and understands the open door, the open door that unforgiveness is. Well, I knew the people on the list were between me and God, were between me.

God and I and the blessings that he has for me. Right. So we go to scripture. The Bible says, God, we're supposed to forgive others so God can forgive us. Right. And the people that know the Lord's Prayer, it says, forgive us our debts as we forgive or forgive us our sins as we forgive those who sin against us. We're literally praying that we're forgiven ourselves.

like we forgive others. Well, my record is too bad to hold anything against anybody. So those people that are on death row,

man, forgive yourself. Ask God to come in and supernaturally help you to remove all of the guilt and the condemnation and just understand that even you can end up in heaven. You can end up, you know, in the afterlife with the, you know, with the great I am. And I base that on

scripture. I base that on the fact, like I said, David, Moses, many of these guys, murder people, you know, Paul, and we can go on and on about that. But, you know, God has the answer. He cleansed Jesus's blood, covered a lot of, covered everything for us. It's just a matter of us understanding what our benefit package is. And that's part of the benefit package. So I would say to my brothers and sisters, that's locked up.

Or the families that's watching speak to them. They have to forgive themselves. That's that's that's being locked up. That's being locked in there and then locked in mentally. Right. So this is where we are. This is the circumstances. But it still doesn't mean you can't end up.

It doesn't mean that if you look at all the guys that were in jail, even in the Bible. All right. Now, granted, I hadn't gone to prison, but I was locked up, you know, and I'm far from perfect, you know. And so what happens, we because of that desire to be liked and to be admired, we have a lot of people in church leadership presenting that they're holier than thou when they're not.

Yeah, I mean, I think for the longest time I've I held a grudge against people that wronged me for a lot of the mistakes that contributed to why I went to prison. My business partner for, you know, going against me and people that lost the money I was investing in all of this. And then I've finally been able to forgive all of those people. But I think something I still struggle with is forgiving myself because.

It just there's just so much and no matter how much restitution I pay like because I'm chipping away at that number and stuff I just and no matter how good I do like with the show with helping others it still feels like.

I'm not doing enough some days, you know, because I want to just make everything right. But I can't speed up the process where it all, you know, is fixed. You can't go back time and fix it. And also, I know that if I didn't make those mistakes and I didn't do those wrongs, I wouldn't have the good that I'm doing now where I'm contributing positively to the world and helping others. So I guess what I battle with is,

were those wrongs for the right reason for the future? You know, did I need those wrongs in life? And were they good wrongs? Because maybe everyone learned a lesson in those wrongs. The individuals that had lost money, the individuals that went through the situations with me. And obviously I've learned from it because my whole life is different now. So I look at that too. I'm always kind of weighing those things. Yeah, that's a good presentation. Yeah.

You know, I don't know about good wrongs or anything, but I do realize that all things work together for the good. Right. And so if you hadn't gone through what you have gone through, we wouldn't be here today. Nor would people have a voice to say, let me tell you guys what it how it was on the inside. You know, a platform such as yours is unique, right?

And what it does is very riveting. And it does inspire people and even inspire some people. Listen, man, I need to stay on the straight and narrow. You know, these guys, these ladies have been through some stuff.

And me, personally, would I have the ministry that God has allowed me to have if I didn't have such a jacked up past? No way. No way. No way. But I realize that I'm not the only person that's out there dealing with sexual addiction. And what it does, it allows somebody to have a safe place. Right.

See, there's a safe place for somebody coming out of prison to come here and just kick it with you, man. And tell people like, you know, maybe because society is going to judge them. Society is most times going to put them down. You just say, hey, let's just talk about it. So granted, maybe it wasn't the path you would have chosen for yourself. But we're here now. We're here now. And today is the first day of the rest of your life. And what you're doing is good work.

It really is. But if you didn't have that path, would we be here? Those are the type of things that you have to really ask. And then when the enemy tries to remind you of your past, you remind him of your future and remind him of his past. That's what I always do. We don't shy away from it. See, what religion wants to do is to get us not to own where we come from.

Restitution that way. I'm telling you where I come came from. I'm telling people this is it. I'm telling you, this is my story. This is part of my story. You know, it's like it's like this. And people will say, oh, and that's an old chapter in your life. I'm telling you, it's an old book.

That's it. That's it. It's an old book. This is a new book, a brand new book. What's happening now. Right. And you have a you have a great future, young man. You really do. Thank you. Yeah. I'm telling you what I'm here. This is God's going to blow your mind. But no, I appreciate what you're saying. But yeah.

Just have to move forward, you know, and trust. And you are providing a great service for people. A lot of these cats will never have an opportunity to be on the Internet if it's not for you. Who wants to, you know, hear a mainstream media? Who wants to hear about it?

You know, a guy that came up as a dealer and work people or had that type of life or pimp and everything like that. These stories are riveting and they need to be told regardless of mainstream media likes it or not. We don't care about them. Just do what God tells you to do. You're doing fine. And as far as restitution, you know, pay the debt down, man. It will get past you and just keep it moving.

Seriously, don't stay stuck in that. Anytime those thoughts come back and for the people that's watching, anytime those thoughts of guilt that comes back, we just say rebuke those thoughts like, we're here now and we're here for a reason. You know, if I had perished when I was in that life of sin, man, we wouldn't be here, right? And then no one could hear this message or, you know, if you had

taking a dirt nap and you didn't and man you were you were in prison as a fairly young man federal prison right and you made it through everybody doesn't everybody doesn't make it through that yeah and I guess on the other end of it is when I look at the bigger picture if I wasn't supposed to be here those opportunities never would have happened the videos never would have went viral never would have had the podcast we wouldn't I wouldn't have the studio you know so all of these things started to happen whereas in

When I first started out in business and what got me into trouble is everything didn't work out. It was just a series of failures, whereas this is more a series of successes. Yeah, of course, there's failures here and there, but overall it's successful. So I needed the way how meaningful those failures were in the beginning is just the same as how meaningful these successes are. It's kind of showing me I'm on the right path. You're absolutely on the right path, man.

We both are not to pat myself on the back, but I'm saying and those who watch you are the people that watch it as long as you're in the truth. If you stay in the truth, you'll work everything else out. You know, it happened. What you did, you did. What I did, we did. Let's just own it and move forward. It's too much of, well, I didn't do that or I shouldn't. We did it. We own it. But we're here now.

I'm just glad I don't have hate. Like I see there's still people that just don't like me from my hometown or that. I mean, there's hate everywhere in the world when someone's doing something, but I'm just glad I don't have that energy. Like I'm so happy with the way things turned out. I'm not happy people lost money, but they will get their money back. They're almost made whole, you know, but I just to have that hate over something that happened so long ago and we're so young and no one got killed. Yeah.

And you when you look at the bigger picture of, you know, the terrible, terrible things that happen in the world. I'm just glad I don't have that. And I tell my dad that sometimes because he gets mad and holds grudges against people that had wronged me. And I'm like, listen, we just got to let it go. It just there's you don't need that in you.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And forgiveness is the key. Forgiveness is the key. I think it's Mayo Clinic. One of them, they actually, if you Google it, it will talk about unforgiveness contributed to certain sicknesses, even in our physical bodies. But mentally, it's just not. Just let it go, man. And anything that you're struggling with or your dad struggling or anybody watching struggling with,

Just turned over to God and said, listen, I don't want to have this hate. Like I said, I don't want to meet them in that energy. And I'm not saying it's easy, but you can certainly overcome it, you know. And you're in the process. And don't, okay, don't allow other people to keep you stuck. Because what they'll do, they'll keep you in prison. And you're free, right? You're owning up to it. You made a mistake.

Let's keep it moving. And if people are going to hate you about stuff that you did in the past, let them hate you, man. Don't let it affect you. You know, again, I was saying like me, man, just imagine my story. They don't, they don't, these, these guys don't want me in their churches, but I don't care. I'm going to do what God tells me to do. We, there, there's, there's power today via the power of Jesus Christ to day. There's people that we watch in this podcast. They know that,

Right from wrong. Right. And so what I'm speaking of getting back on that, just a supernatural component of this. That's why people that's watching this, even some of the guys that were locked up and they're no longer locked up. They can go back to the time many times when they were out in the street. They had a they heard a voice or they had an inkling of what they shouldn't do.

Like you'll talk to guys that said, man, as soon as I met that guy, I knew something was wrong. Like some of the guys that they did some work with. Right. This is the power of the Holy Spirit speaking to us. Right. Somebody said they'll call it a small, still voice speaking to them. And then we have to understand. But there is another force that will overrule that.

That voice, another voice or another drive that will overrule like me. You know, there were times when I was like, what are you doing? Two times, man. I remember I was at Orlando and I looked in the mirror and I caught a glimpse of myself.

And I had just entertained four ladies over the course of a 24-hour period. And a fifth one was coming to the hotel. And I caught myself. And I was like, what in the world? Are you becoming, man? So I called her up and I was like, hey, don't come. I'm going back to Atlanta. And then a few months after that, the same thing. I was in my restroom. And this was a situation where I had entertained five ladies within a 24-hour period. And I just remember crying out to God.

I said, God, I can't stop. I said, I make too much money. I have access to too many women. I can't control myself. I was like, God, do whatever you need to, but I need you, right? And so I tell everybody that part of that story, Ian, is, oh, he did it. Man, the money, all left. Dude, my credit was so bad, I needed a cosigner at a window shop. That's how bad it got. But I thank God for it.

If not, we wouldn't be here today, you know, and I wouldn't have been rescued. You know, sometimes we just have to call out to God and we have to say, I don't know how to do this without you. Even some of these gangsters watching this, dude, you can stop. You can, regardless of what the devil tells you, what circumstances tell you. You know, it's like I talk about that spirit of poverty. Some of us are so stuck in that spirit of poverty.

You know, we have to understand, is there not a supernatural component to some people that don't necessarily have money to feed themselves, but they're wearing shoes that cost $285? Am I judging anybody? No. I want people to look at the big picture. What is that? Hey, I know this is wrong. I know that if I sell this product in my neighborhood, that people will die. Man, but that Cadillac look nice.

Man, that gold. Oh, man. Yeah, that Bugatti. Right. That Rolex. I need two Rolexes. No, we have to understand what's the driving factor. And so here's something to chew on, everyone watching. You will spend eternity in one of two places. Let's put it in perspective. And again, you follow or you did rappers. Tupac. Heard of him? Mm-hmm. Okay.

Tupac, I think he lived like 25 years, but he's been dead almost 30 years. Big, 24 years, he's been dead almost 30 years. They've been dead longer than they were alive. Elvis, 42 years. Dead going on, what, probably 60 years. So there's somewhere in eternity, spending time in eternity, there's some people that will watch this podcast

podcast man and we're claiming that and we're believing that their lives are going to change young man let me ask you this what are you doing saturday i have two interviews you have two interviews and i thank you for that's a trick question what you're telling me is what you have planned for saturday kobe had plans for saturday but saturday is not promised saturday is not promised

Yeah. There's no guarantee, Ian, that you and I will ever see each other again. There's no guarantee that I will even be here when this is on the Internet. So I'm a realist. I understand that. You know, sometimes we think we live forever. But a lot of these people that will be watching this, if you guys and ladies think about it, a lot of people that you came up with are not even here. Some of you have seen so many things happen in prison.

And those people that left here, they're in one of two places. That's how important this is. That's how this is all you that you have guaranteed is today. Right now is all you have, Karen, not even the rest of this day. Right now is all we have guaranteed. That's it. So it's now where do we go from here?

Do we hold on to unforgiveness? Because we hold on to unforgiveness. We are now given the enemy a legal right. I talked about to operate in our health, our finances, our relationship, our ability to see outside of our circumstances, you know, the poverty, the the the the drive for financial gain, which is it's all temporary. Right. The the lusts.

You know, and so some of you are familiar with the term soul tie. And for those that are not, I'm going to explain what a soul tie is. All right. So if you are in an ungodly sexual relationship with a guy or girl, are you in an ungodly sexual relationship? The Bible tells us that you become one during sex. You become one. OK. And so.

And the ministry that I'm in, we understand what soul ties is. That means if there's anything demonic operating in this person, it is now operating in you and vice versa. So you heard the term body count and not the Merc body count, but body count. How many women you smashed? How many dudes you've been with? That's your body count.

In the spirit realm, it's way worse than anything you can imagine, way past anything you imagine because what's happening in the spirit realm, you're sleeping with this person.

but you're sleeping with who that person slept with and everybody they slept with and everybody they slept with and on and on and on. And if I'm telling you I've been in a certain pattern of my life since I was a small child, just imagine the soul ties that I personally created. This is why when I'm pursuing my personal deliverance, sitting down talking to somebody that hopefully can help me,

The enemy had a right to shut me down. The enemy had a right to put me to sleep. Right. And so many of us are dealing with supernatural forces that nobody's speaking about. But if you go back over your life and you look at or I challenge everybody, look at some of those decisions that you made, some decisions that may contributed to you being locked up or being, you know, an ex-convict or whatever.

you know, a single mom or a dad, you know, with four baby mamas or whatever.

I'm not here to judge anybody, so don't misunderstand. What I just want to do is I want to talk about some of the things that's plaguing us and looking at the big picture. And then now the generational curse aspect of what I'm saying, the iniquities that a father visits in the third and fourth generation, children born out of wedlock, ten generations, the things that our parents did, we inherit the things we did.

contributed to our current circumstances. But again, we're here now, everyone. We're here. Man, you know what type of trials I had to get here that I've been trying to get here since February. You know that? And I thank God that you had another engagement and we had to cancel the first one. I'm not going to say what it was because I don't know if you told people, but you had another engagement. So we thank God for that. But even...

My plan was to be here last night, right? Because, you know, you want to be here early. You don't want anything to happen. Well, I go to the airport, man. They canceled a flight. And so, okay, and there's no other flight. So in order for me to be here, I'm at the airport like at 4 o'clock. You know, it's no problem. But then we fly to D.C., and when we leave D.C., that flight is late, right? And so there's – but when we look at those things –

We had to understand, you know, there's something that didn't want me to be here. But we're here, man. This is going to connect with some people. I believe it. And for the people that hate, I don't care.

Why did you get into fraud investigation? Out of all the careers you could have chosen, could have been law enforcement, could have been something else. Why fraud investigation? Well, to be honest, man, so, you know, at 21, I had a son to take care of, right? And in our neighborhood, man, it was only a few ways out. Like, you're going to sling rocks. You're going to be an athlete.

You know, you know, so those type of things, which I wasn't very athletic. I don't think I grew until my senior year in high school. And but I knew I had to take care of this kid and I couldn't have the relationship with him that my father had with me. Right. So I said, OK, you know, Lord bless me with the gift of gab. And I said, OK, I can't be a comedian or a singer or anything like that. So here's the thing. So I said, well, what can I do?

No matter where I, because I knew Buffalo wasn't, I couldn't stay in Buffalo. It just wasn't going to work out. So I became a bill collector. All right. So a bill collector. So I collected bills for many years that I got introduced to investigations. So in bill collecting, you're pursuing money and investigations, you're pursuing information.

So when I was a bill collector, I became a skip tracer. And what that is, is a person able to to locate people. Right. People that skipped out on their debts. I was blessed to be able to become proficient at locating people. And so I got introduced to investigations, you know, because the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act.

You know, we had certain rules, you know, in bill collecting. Like we couldn't lie. Hey, is he in there? This is Mark. You know, but in investigations, you know, you can pretty much be who you need to be to get the information. So it was a fairly easy transition for me. And I kind of had a knack for it. And then, you know, so I started off being basically investigations professional.

doing a skip tracing, locating people, then locating assets, and then investigating people for fraud. And so that's how I got into it. And then that was it, man. Then I became a salesman. So I would go to XYZ company and I would say, hey, use our investigative service. We're better than the other guys and this is why, right? But

It's because I had years of experience actually doing investigations, the stakeouts, you know, watching people around the clock, those type of things, undercover work, you know. And what it allowed me to do is learn from the inside. And now when I'm selling people, you know, I could probably I'll sell something.

a salesman that never did investigations. So that became, you know, fairly easy for me. And it was a way for me to take care of these sons I started having. And ultimately that was my goal, man, money and women. And the money bought the women. And for you guys, let me just mention this to you real. You will never run out of, no, that's how I want to say it. You will run out of money

chasing women but you will never run out of women chasing money so keep that in mind and so I was in discipline and ultimately that's how I you know I got myself in trouble but that's how I got into investigations and then ultimately sales and then you know and in the sales you know there are certain cities that I went to every every month I went to Charlotte, Chicago,

Orlando every month and I established relationships there. And I was so comfortable with that life. I didn't consider other people, you know, I, um, as indicated, I built a relationship with these women where they thought, you know, I was their boyfriend. I wouldn't say they thought I was their boyfriend. And so like when I go to Orlando, um,

Let's say I'm in Orlando for three days. I will call each of them and say, I'm in town for one day, you know. And again, this is nothing to be proud of. You know, I just that was my reality, man. I just it's like we're not comparing somebody, but like somebody that's into, you know, selling, selling whatever they're selling. It becomes easier.

the more and more you do it. Like, you know, your situation, sometimes you get stuck and then you really can't stop. But there's a driving force behind these things. And again, like I said, it's for our ultimate demise. But, you know, for the grace of God, man, he'll pull me out of that. And I was

I'm grateful and I'll serve them for the rest of my life, man. Were you working independently or for like an insurance agency or how did that work? Yeah. So what we both we would have established relationships with individual companies and then we would also work for their insurance companies. Right. And so I worked work comp investigations and liability investigations. And I'll explain the difference here.

So if you go to Ian's Barbecue and you're a patron and you slip on ketchup and you hurt your back, you want to sue Ian's Barbecue, right?

And so that's a liability. That's a general liability claim versus one of your employees are taking fries out to somebody and they slip on the ketchup and they hurt themselves. That is a work comp claim. Right. And so that's that's pretty much what we investigate. We investigate to determine if somebody is legitimately injured, because sometimes they start off with a legitimate injury.

injury, but they're home for a few months and they kind of like this, you know? And so they kind of milk it, milk the system. And, you know, talk about that spirit of greed. You can never satisfy it. So now they're getting a worker's comp benefits, but they're driving Uber, Lyft, DoorDash. Right. And so it's, um, people can be very, uh, creative with,

As you know, about seeking paper, making money. And so we just have to learn to be as creative as them, you know, about catching them. Now, for all the ballers out there, I don't do that anymore. I do consulting work now and I'll be about Jesus, you know, but that's just the truth of the matter. Share with us some investigations you were a part of and how you caught those individuals. Oh, man.

There are so many. Let's see. Give us your top ones. Absolutely. Absolutely. So I had a... Okay. Yeah, this is one of my favorites. I think it's plantar fasciitis. And while I'm saying it wrong, please forgive me. But it is a foot injury, right? A foot condition. And so this guy...

His symptoms were that his condition was so bad that he couldn't wear shoes and he couldn't walk on concrete. Sometimes we can overdo it. I was like, you can't walk on concrete and you live in the city? All right, let's go with that. So we were able to do an investigation and we determined that he was in a R&B band. So I found this club that he was going to be performing at.

But it was one of those clubs where they were like, no guns and no cameras. And they pat you down. So I couldn't sneak in. Back in those days, we had covert cameras. But we had to have a fanny pack for, you know, all your wires to go to. You know, not like now, man. You can get, you know, something, you know, on your pinky to find it. But back in those days. So...

What I did is I went over to the local supermarket and got a disposable camera. And I put that in the front of my pants, if you know what I mean. So when they pat me down, I figured they weren't going to pat me there. But Ian, I look quite excited to be at this club. And I said, well, this don't work. This won't work. So now I'm there and I see all of these guys on the stage. I don't know. I had a general description. I didn't know which one he was. Well, yeah.

Some people know these old R&B clubs and these R&B clubs is usually an older black fella that will take pictures and usually like a Polaroid, take pictures or they'll sell like flowers or whatever, like roses for the ladies. So I was like, OK, I'll tell you what. I called a guy over. I said, meet me by the dumpster. He was like, man, meet me at the dumpster. He comes to the dumpster. I said, listen.

I'll give you $100, and this was years ago, so it was a lot of money, if you take three pictures of everybody on there, on stage. And so he did that, and I went to the client the next day. I'm like, which one is he? And they, that's him, right? But you see him with shoes, and he's dancing and everything like that. So the next day we go back, we get a guy some more money, and he takes 20 pictures of this guy. And so that's how we were able to bust a case, but not only that,

What happened, these guys bought a lot of their equipment, their amps and things like that. We knew they had to remove it. They had to move it from the club. And so I kept calling the club.

And I have an old man voice that I used to use. And I would just say, hey, I want to hire these guys to be to work at my my daughter's wedding or my granddaughter's wedding. When would they be in? And they were like, well, they're on their way, sir. And, you know, we call and then finally they're like, well, they're coming right now. So we hightail it over there. And now we got the camera and we're filming this guy.

carrying amps or stuff like that. So in a case like that, do you just deny the claim or are you guys referring him to the authorities for fraud? What we do is we send it back to the client. And I have some clients that, you know, give you a slip slap on the wrist and others that will lock you up.

We just provide the evidence and everything like that. What would you say was the most outrageous case that you had worked on? Like where the person was just like totally off the wire with it? Oh, gosh, man. It's just it's been so many. Oh, sure. Thank you for that. Remember, remind me that. OK, so there was this lady for a state government. OK. And she claimed a an injury.

Every time she was around the client, she walked against walls, drool. She didn't remember where she was. It was like a mental case and everything like that. What happened, a client reached out to me. They're like, hey, can you check on this situation? We sent this lady five checks, and they're coming back, and we've never heard from her. They were like two stacks of

You know, $2,200. So it's like 10 grand that nobody's calling to say, where's my money? I give you an idea that somebody is doing very well if they don't miss $10,000. I said, sure, we'll look into it. And a person has set up a P.O. box. So they didn't even want you to know where they live. Send the checks here. But once we get into it, this woman that was doing the drooling and everything like that, you know, she was like a secretary of

of a church. We determined that she had a married boyfriend. She drove a Cadillac. She had a couple of businesses, right? And the way that we found her, the state was paying her daughter to care for her, like Monday through Saturday, like in the morning. I mean, like 12 hours. That's what it was, 12 hours. So the state was paying this daughter...

to take care of the mom. And the daughter, in our investigation, determined to, was determined to have two children. So how do you raise two children when you're working 12 hours a day, right? And it just didn't add up. There's a P.O. Box. So what we ultimately found out is that the state was sending the daughter money and the daughter was giving her mom half of the money. So the mom was getting money from the state, taking half of the money from the daughter,

And she was really making major bank. What happened, she got comfortable with it. Like I told you, those forces, it becomes easy to do it. And before you know it, we were able to determine that she had, and I'm not here to judge anybody, determine that she had a married boyfriend. So we tracked him down. We went to his house while he was eating with his wife. And we knocked on the door and was like, yeah, you know, we want to talk to you about something.

And he was like, what? We don't I don't know you. They say, excuse me for one second, sir. Can you came up, come outside? We gave him a name. He said, OK, I'll be with you in a second. Right. And so now that is a witness that we could use in court to say, no, this lady's not mentally delayed or anything like that.

And then we were able to pull paperwork where she negotiated several purchases of property and she had businesses. So that was one that was really huge for that particular state. So the mom was faking being mentally ill? Uh-huh. Oh, so the daughter said that the mom was mentally ill? No, the mom stated— Was in on it?

That she was mentally ill. Her doctor said that she was mentally ill. She was drooling and everything. She wasn't. What raised the initial red flags to the $10,000 that nobody checked that no one claimed? It was they were sending this lady checks. They were coming back and she never called and say, hey, where's my money?

So they were like, something's up with that. If somebody owed you $10,000, you'd probably check on it, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So that's what it was. How'd she not notice that the checks weren't coming in? She's just probably making so much money, man. Oh, from other people that she was scamming or like other agencies? Other endeavors, other financial endeavors that she didn't even miss it. And that just kind of unraveled it. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

And there's just so many men. I, you know, I can't remember them all. But over the years, it's just been really tremendous. You just never know what people will do. You know, you never know what people will do to make money. I mean, even I mean, in this podcast, you certainly have spoken to some people that have done some things to make money. But it's the what's driving them to do it.

You know, that need to have, to possess things, to feel financially stable, you know. And some of us, we never can satisfy. You never can satisfy that spirit of greed. I don't know if you're watching the news here lately with these guys, with these billionaires, with the cryptocurrency. You heard the story that kidnapped this guy? I didn't hear about the kidnapping, no. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But anyway, did you ever feel guilty learning maybe private information about some of these individuals? No. Listen, I learned more private information now, you know, ministering to people. You know, you heard the term hurt people hurt people. You don't understand that until you just and until you and this type of ministry or, you know, even what you do. You know, when some of the guys tell you some of the things they went through as children.

That's never resolved. And it manifests in them being, you know, criminals, being locked up and things like that. So for your viewers, if you have some of those things that have been unresolved, seek help. It's OK. You know, we're carrying a lot of guilt around for what happened to us as children. You know, and again, my I'm not comparing my story to other people's story. But again, you look at.

You know, even my situation for the longest time, I was guilty that I behaved in a certain manner. I'm not saying I'm not guilty now, but I don't stay stuck there. I have to realize at some point you got like, dude, you were five. Right. And for the for the for the young men and young ladies, you know, that have dealt with, you know, even things worse than that, being touched and and abused. Hey, you were a child. You have to let it go.

Have to forgive yourself. There's so many people that feel dirty. You know, imagine the people that's responsible for caring for you. These are the people that take advantage or take your innocence. Right. Man, I dealt with I won't say the lady's name, of course, but she's she's one of my heroes. She's a person on our team, you know, our church. But when she came to me, her stepfather said,

had taken her virginity at nine. And then he and the mother began to pimp her out to the old guys in the neighborhood. That can be, well, that is very traumatic. But she's doing well. I talked to her yesterday, man. But those are the type of stories, unfortunately, that we hear far too often, you know, and things of that nature. And those are the things that

aren't necessarily being dealt with and, you know, it manifests into anger issues, distrust issues, right? And people being locked up. Did you ever feel endangered while on the job? Oh, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, back in the day, yeah. You know, we did undercover stings and stuff.

probably in places that we wouldn't normally be. I've had guns pulled on me and everything like that. But now, man, I was like, man, now I don't, I don't. Back there it wasn't necessarily fear was part of the job. But now, you know what, man? Jesus left the 99 to go to the one. And some of the neighborhoods I go into now, like, you know, we're covered under the blood. We keep it moving, man. Who's going to reach these guys? We went to Philly and pastors told us, don't go to that neighborhood. Right.

But, you know, we have to. So this is what God told us to do. So I don't know if you saw the interview. I know you did a little research on

on us, but unfortunately there's been so many school massacres, but you may remember this. Uvalde, Texas, Rob Elementary. You know that one? Yeah, because of all the issues surrounding the police response. 77 minutes to get in there. Yeah. Okay. And then the video footage of them just waiting there at the hallway. Right, right. So again, am I here to question them? No, I want to make a statement, okay? Yeah.

As we're learning today, we're talking about the big picture. 77 minutes, you hear these gunshots and no one's moving. How can that be? What other factors are there? Could it be a spirit of fear, self-preservation, those type of things? Those are the type of things that we look at, you know. But I want to go back to that particular incident.

Terrible. It was 19 children and two teachers. These are elementary kids. Right. So in our sessions and there have been times when people have literally had visions of the afterlife and it wasn't one or two people. It was scores of people in different parts of the world that would say that they would have a vision of heaven. Right. And they will see these children.

from Uvalde. It happened so frequently that I went to my wife, excuse me, and I said, we need to go to Uvalde because it didn't make sense that these people would experience this phenomenon and not the people in Uvalde, right? You know, somebody in Florida or Hawaii that don't know these kids. So ultimately, I'll give you the short version of the story. We end up going to Uvalde.

Me using the skills that I've been blessed with to locate people. Remember, it started off with me skip tracing. I was able to, from my desk at home, locate a survivor group. These are children, you know, that live through the massacre. Right. So I was able to find one of the parents there.

And we actually went to Uvalde. And as we prayed, excuse me, as we prayed for these children, they too now experienced what these people have been saying. And they were able to have visions of those children that had gone on before them. But they're whole. They don't have any bullet wounds. And everything that comes with that, you know, the miraculous vision

visions of heaven. They were able to encounter a one-on-one with Jesus. They were able to encounter the children who had gone on before them, their teachers and things of that nature. So there's no limit on what we have access to. The limit comes from our mind, right? Which is against the scriptural reference that says all things are possible to those who believe, right? So there's no limit. So if

we're allowed to see these type of things today in 2025, then some of the things that people are struggling with, he's still in the healing business. He's still, and I understand that.

You know, your viewership. That's why I'm here today, man. Listen, fellas, ladies, if God can save me, he can save anyone. And just like Brother Ian here, man, we got to overcome the mistakes that we made. They don't define us. That's what you did. It's not who you are.

That's what you did, son. It's not who you are. We'll move past it today. And it's like, hey, and if people want to hate you for something that you did, how many years ago was that? It's going on 2013, so 12 years ago. Don't hold on to that. Let them have that. Bless them. And you tell your dad, forgive them to keep it moving. Because, again, when we don't forgive, it's actually being used against us. I say unforgiveness is the poison of.

That the enemy has you drinking but telling you that other people are getting sick. No, man, let them have that. They want to hold on. That's between them and God, not you. Bless them. Don't meet them in that energy. Pay your restitution and do the big things that God has in store for you. Yeah. Is it hard? What were you going to say? Okay. You're thinking about writing a...

Like a movie? We're working on the book right now. I have an agent, and it's moving full steam ahead right now. Yeah. The book's going to be huge, but there's also scripts that's going to come out of it. Yeah. Have you been thinking about anything like that? Yeah. We're working on developing some type of spinoffs from Locked In and My Story and stuff, but the book's going to open up a lot of doors. It has.

It absolutely is. I mean, when I got out of prison or even when I was in prison, I was so gung-ho about my story that it didn't work out. And then it was only when I built this, things started to come because I made it not about me.

I made it about others. And that was the thing that brought me the level I wanted to be at. But I thought I was going to be at that level just sharing my story. So it's interesting how everything played out. Well, yeah. And this is part of it, though. This platform is part of where God is taking you.

You needed that. And this platform will actually provide even some more content for the books, the movies, the spinoffs. Man, you're going to be surprised. But stay focused on the future. Don't look in the rear view, man. Pay your restitution. Man, you have an amazing platform. And so many people are going to be – have been and will be touched by it.

And thank you all for getting on here and telling us your stories. They've been tremendous. It's been a blessing. And I'm glad that there's a happy ending to it now. So many of the stories that are like mine, like the fraud or prison type stories that are in the movies and on TV and the documentaries always end with them going to prison, getting out, whatever. Mine has a full circle.

you know, moment to it. Everything came full circle. Absolutely. So that's cool to see. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's going to go way past this. Was it hard or is it hard to kind of separate your investigative skills from your pastor work? Because like as a pastor, you have to be, you know, open-minded or you have to kind of trust people in a way. But I'm sure as an investigator, you could look at individuals and see that they're not being honest enough

um, or not telling the truth or, or not being forthcoming? Well, I like to say, man, as the money says in God's, in God, we trust. I investigate everybody else. I trust him. I'm just serious. Yeah. I, I, that's a great question. I think that if I did not have the investigative prowess that I was blessed with, that I wouldn't be the pastor that I am. And I don't, and I don't say that with a, with, with, um,

I'm not bragging anything like that. But what happens in my particular ministry, as I'm ministering to people, I'm also investigating because it's difficult for people to present to them what happened to them as children. Nobody really wants to, you know, so when you have guys on here to say,

Yeah, I was molested as a child. Big ups to those. But so many people never want to talk about that. So sometimes the benefit of growing in ministry is learning to have the ability to listen. Right. Because sometimes people can say things wrong.

without saying them, you know, by their body language. And, you know, you tell them, especially men, you know, you got these big buff men, man, they don't want to talk to you about what happened to them when they were six years old with their uncle. And I'm like, hey, man, this is a safe place. Let me tell you where I came from. You know, let me give you my story, you know, and just get to people where they have a safe place. I want to talk about some of this stuff, Pastor. I don't want to carry this anymore.

Man, I'm dealing with a lot of guilt, a lot of shame. I'm really angry. I'm angry that, you know, my mom knew this was going on and she didn't help me. Those type of things. This is what the devil does. He piles up, man. You know, before you know it, you're just angry. You're lashing out before you know it. You're locked up, man. Stuff, I'm telling you. It's a lot of people in...

prison now, in my opinion, that are there as a result of many unresolved issues. But hopefully this conversation will get people to talk. And some of the secrets that we don't talk about in these families that people ignore, they bring them to the forefront. Let's just deal with them. Let's get people help. Let's move past it. Pastor Mark, I appreciate you coming on the show today.

I appreciate you allowing me to be here. It's really been a blessing to have the opportunity to just talk to you. And thank you for what you're doing. Yeah, and thank you for speaking your mind and showing us a different perspective of the criminal justice system. I'm sure it's going to help a lot of individuals and families who also have loved ones in prison and just kind of looking deeper where our stories come from.

And because I think a lot of individuals think I have that thought process of how their past affected their future or what happened in their life, but they don't necessarily know how to put it all together and explain it the way that you were able to explain it today. I thank you for that. Yeah. A lot of this stuff is generational and it hadn't been resolved yet.

But you have the power and authority to break these generational curses. You have the power and authority through Christ Jesus to stop the patterns that's going on. Like some of you guys now think about it. You know, you don't want this stuff to go on to your daughters or your sons. You don't. You don't. You know, just think about it. Think about them. Think about your grandchildren. You know, as I mentioned earlier,

You're going to spend eternity somewhere. You've heard me say multiple times. Today is the first day of the rest of your life. You know, forgive, forgive people, move past that, forgive yourself, get out of that shame. You know, that is not your portion. You don't have to do some of the things that you're doing, you know? Uh,

Just ask for supernatural help. Say, God, look, I don't want to do this. I don't want to sling rocks. I don't want to, you know, there has to be another way. I don't want to sell my body. I don't, you know, ladies, whoever, you know. If I may, and you can certainly edit it out, excuse me, but on our website, we have a couple of prayers where people can break soul ties, right? Ungodly soul ties, right?

repentance prayer, forgiveness prayer, you know,

Matter of fact, I'm going to say it and then you can make a decision. No, I won't edit it out. It's all you. Yeah. Well, let's start with you, miss. Repeat after me. Say, dear Lord Jesus. Dear Lord Jesus. I choose to forgive. I choose to forgive. Myself. Myself. And anyone. And anyone. For anything. For anything. And everyone. And everyone. For everything. For everything. I choose to forgive. I choose to forgive. Those. Those. Who have hurt me. Who have hurt me. Harmed me. Harmed me. Caused me pain. Caused me pain.

Misery. Misery. Strife. Strife. Stress. Stress. Sleepless nights. Sleepless nights. Those who have taken advantage of me. Those who have taken advantage of me. Used me. Used me. Abused me. Abused me. Talked about me. Talked about me. Backstabbed me. Backstabbed me. Backstabbed me.

Betrayed my trust. Betrayed my trust. Or let me down. Or let me down. Lord, I choose to forgive them. Lord, I choose to forgive them. And I ask that you bless them. And I ask that you bless them. And whatever they did to me. And whatever they did to me. I forgive them. I forgive them. And I ask that you hold, I ask that you not hold it against them. And I ask that you not hold it against them. From this point on. From this point on. In Jesus' name. In Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. I bet you let it go, man. Don't pick it back up.

And you said, you know, somebody had been speaking to you about the Bible. But if we look at and I didn't do a lot of talking about Jesus, but if we look at his story, his brothers didn't believe him. His brothers didn't believe in him. And he was restricted on even some of the miracles that happened in his hometown. This stuff is real. And the devil is real.

But you're doing something to come against his kingdom, which is awesome. But what? So that we're clear with that comes attacks. OK. And so everybody that want to attack this podcast, I'm at significant revelation at Gmail dot com. My number is four seven zero five oh two six four four two. Don't direct it toward in. Send it to me.

You know, I don't mind because whatever you say still doesn't matter because it doesn't change the fact that everything I said to you was true. You know, and I know some of this stings, but it's OK. We'll get over it. We have to move forward. We have to stop these these cycles of behavior. We have to we understand that some of this stuff is not godly behavior. It starts with me. I was the worst.

I was the worst. Right. And that's why I said addiction is addiction. You know, if it's if it's alcoholism, if it's drugs, if it's sex, if it's porn, whatever it is. But there is an answer. There is there is an out. Yeah. And we don't want the the spirit that's imprisoning our people to keep going down the bloodline.

We have power over this stuff. It's just a matter of learning it, learning how to implement the power we have and having to stop today. So thank you. Thank you. And safe travels back. Thank you, man. God bless.