Inside My Addiction to Pills & the Consequences That Followed | Maxwell White-Cohen
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Max, welcome to Locked In, man. Thank you, man. I appreciate it. Yeah, appreciate you for coming, making the drive from Massachusetts, right? Yeah, Oxbridge. Oxbridge? Oxbridge. I think you might be our first guest from there. Really? Yeah, definitely. There's not many people that have came out of Oxbridge. It's like right next to Worcester. Okay. Yeah.

And you've listened to the show for a while? Yeah, for years now. Awesome, man. So it's cool meeting you too, for sure. You guys are dope. Yeah, well, I appreciate you coming. I'm glad we got to hook you up with some of the Magic Mind Shots and the Mike's Bites. Excited about those. Yeah, let me know what you think. Those things are, I love those. Take them to bed. I'm excited to take them tonight. Yeah, take them before sleep. Some people, when they get high, it's like an upper. For me, it's like a downer. Like I go right to bed, I get knocked out. But like my cousin, when I got high with him, he...

He is up all night and really mad man. Yeah, I can't do that. I'm just like stoned ready for bed Yeah, I like it to use it at more more of a downer be able to just go to sleep with it I don't like being all jacked up and stuff I'll pass on the sativas and all that type of stuff like rather just sleep. Yeah, and these taste good like they're like candy act I

kind of in a way. Like, I could eat a whole bag. Yeah, but I don't eat a whole bag. But yeah, they're great. I really love them and they're a great sponsor of the show too. I appreciate it, man. So did you grow up in Massachusetts? Yeah, so I was born in Marlborough and I was there for like, probably like three, four years and then I moved out to Uxbridge. So it's been Uxbridge mostly my whole life, but...

Yeah, I was in Marlboro for a couple years. Who were you raised by? So I would go to my dad's on the weekends, and I would be with my mom and my stepdad from the weekdays. So they moved out to Uxbridge. I went with them. So I'd go with them out to Uxbridge and then weekends to my dad's house in Marlboro. Any step, I mean, brothers and sisters? Yeah, I have a half-brother. His name's Colin. He's awesome. He has a...

He's the man. He's the man. And he's on my mom's side, so he's my mom's son too. Okay, and what was the age difference between you guys? Four years. Okay. Four years. So it was just you and him? Just me and him, yeah. And as we got down the line when I was in eighth grade, my dad ended up having a kid with a new mother, so I do have another half-brother, but I only lived with him for like a year or two. Which parent were you closer to?

Um, probably my dad. I was probably closer to him throughout my life just because of sports like football, baseball, basketball. I was playing everything and he was my coach for everything. Lost him in 2020 and it just, yeah. Yeah, I was probably closer to my dad. What did your parents do for work? My dad didn't do much. He didn't do anything, honestly. He didn't have the best work ethic, honestly.

Didn't really work a whole lot. He did sales for my best friend's dad's company. So he kind of got hooked up into that job. He didn't really do much. My mom has MS and a couple other things, so she doesn't work. And my stepdad is a boss at a company that they ship out like piping and a bunch of stuff like that. He works in a warehouse. How would people describe you as a kid? As a kid...

As a kid, I was fun. I was fun as a kid. But I was up to mischief. I was always up to shenanigans at the time. Sports, sports, girls, and just doing my thing, really. Just, I wasn't...

Wasn't the best kid for sure like not all the parents wanted me to be around But the parents that actually knew me and who I was knew I was like a good kid I just had some tendencies that weren't the best tendencies Yeah, I feel like a lot of kids that are like that in high school or middle school are kind of like that simple stuff like that I wasn't doing anything crazy or anything like that. Were you doing any drugs or alcohol back then?

No, I started smoking probably my sophomore year of high school, I'd say. Sophomore year, I would talk shit about all my friends smoking in eighth grade, freshman year. I'd be like, you guys are this, that, and the third for smoking, and then I picked it up sophomore year and then have

haven't really stopped since. Now, did you have any, you know, career aspirations? Did you want to go to college? What was kind of like the plan? Yeah, in my head, I was going to go play football. I was going to go D1 somewhere and that was my plan, but I never paid attention in school. I wasn't,

terrible in school all throughout high school. Once I got into high school, like I was A's and B's in middle school. Once I got into high school, I kind of just veered off the path where in my head, my athletic ability would put me into a college and I'd be playing somewhere without getting the grades to get me there. And I had horrible grades. So my aspirations were to play football. And then once the play football dreams kind of went down the toilet, I

I kind of just went down the toilet with it. What position did you play? I was quarterback. Oh, okay. Quarterback, so popular. Yeah. Kind of. Yeah, I was good. I was really good, but I...

Do you know who Johnny Manziel is? Yeah, of course. Yeah, so he was like, as bad as it sounds, he was like my idol at the time. Like before games, I was watching Johnny Manziel highlights. Like he was my idol, but along with that came the partying and stuff. So I would show up to games hungover or still drunk or high or I was just showing up just... I wasn't giving my full potential and I was still good. Still have records there, still was really good, but I...

I was just messing around. My dad was going through cancer treatments too when I was starting there. So I just had like... Football wasn't my main focus. My main focus was not feeling the way I normally felt. So I was just like drinking, smoking. And then when I was on the field, nothing mattered. So it was like I drink when I'm off the field and then when I got on the field...

I was clear-headed, just football. And then once I got off, it was like, oh, here I go again, thinking about all the shit that's going on. No, just drinking smoke, like...

Did you meet kids that had similar thoughts and issues as you, or did you kind of feel like a loner? Oh, in school, I was a complete loner. There was no one really like me. There was maybe like one or two people that were like me, and I gravitate. I'm still friends with them to this day that had similar problems with their father and their family not being normal. But for the most part, everything around me, everyone's family was like a normal family, mom and dad together. Yeah.

Like all of that. That's what I was around, but I felt like I was the odd one out, if that makes sense. Yeah, it makes it hard, definitely, if you feel kind of like the loner. Yeah, so I went to the Johnny Manziel lifestyle, and I would just drink and smoke. I thought it was awesome. I thought I was the man, and then it's like...

If I paid attention in school and truly did my work, I could have went. And I'm not big, so I wouldn't have went D1. That was a crazy dream. I could have gone D3, and that would have been cool just to be able to play at another level. But I couldn't do school, man. I was coming in drunk high, just acting like an idiot.

I was going through, my parents put me through DCF when I was a freshman in high school. Like the protective services? Yeah, yeah. My stepdad tried to, I don't want to, I'm not going to bad mouth him because everything they did was correct. My stepmom or my stepfather and my real mom, everything they did was correct. I was probably a little out of control.

Like sneaking out and doing certain things, but they put me in the court system as a freshman and they tried to have me sent away as a freshman. They said I was setting fires. That was never a thing. That was never a thing. I was like a freshman, like playing with a lighter. Like I just got a lighter as a freshman. I'm like lighting it like this. Never put anything like the flame to anything.

And my stepdad like told that to the judge, wanted me to get sent away. I was literally not doing, I was just acting like a kid. And the judge laughed at him, was like, I'm not going to put your kid away for the stuff that you're saying he's doing. But either way, I was in the court system my whole high school life. And that made me like,

It made me have like a weird mindset. It made me think I'm almost like, I don't want to say like thug-ish, but like in the system. And it makes me like act that way, if that makes sense, as a freshman when I didn't think no one around me was doing that. It was just me in the court system. I'd have to have my DCF officer come every week to talk to me. And it's like, I didn't feel like I needed that at the time. But whole high school was DCF, DCF. And then I ended up...

As a senior, I was smoking weed and my room smelled like weed and my stepdad came up and he like kind of cornered me in my room. Like, and he has every right to do so. It's his home. If he doesn't want weed in there, there shouldn't be weed in there. It's simple as that. And I broke that rule. But he walked, he like kind of put his chest into me and like cornered me and something snapped. I don't know. You don't really, I don't like being cornered. So I punched him and he fell down.

He called the police and I got arrested as a senior and he charged he pressed charges on me for assault and battery on a family member. So all all football aspirations are out the window. Why would he press charges? Yeah, I know. I don't I wish I had the answer for that because that put me down a really downward spiral of like this that this that and it just kept going.

Even my defensive coordinator was the resource officer at the school. So my D coordinator for football and he was one of the officers that came to my house. I was in handcuffs and my stepdad was talking shit, was running his mouth and I was just in handcuffs. And like, what are you doing, man? You don't do that to your own kid. And the defensive coordinator like was barking at him, yelling back for my behalf, was like, why are you talking like what is going on here?

But yeah, he pressed charges. I went to, they sent me to a foster home for two weeks. My little roommate in the foster home was this little Spanish kid. He was in there for stabbing his other roommate.

So my roommate there was in there for stabbing a kid and I was in there because I hit my stepdad from I like I got cornered hit my stepdad He pressed charges. I got sent there that kid was there for stabbing a kid So i'm sitting there like what the what's going on? Like I don't think I deserve to be here Went there for two weeks went to like spanish church every day It was the weirdest thing like I don't I don't know any spanish So i'm just sitting in there and I don't know anything what anyone's saying. I just feel like a

Absolute oddball. Then I got sent after that, sent to rehab for a couple weeks. And then I got out of that. And then everything I thought about school, football, college, everything was out the window because that was my senior year. So once that happened, I had no...

way of getting that back. You know what I mean? Because I didn't have good grades. So even if I could maybe sneak on a school and do something and pick up those grades, that'd be one thing. But now I have a charge of assault and battery on a family member. So it's like, now I'm really screwed. Where was your mom when this happened? She was there. What's going on with her? She's more of a... It's his household. So what he says goes.

So that was it. But even with the charging, she couldn't talk him down or anything? No, I was in the court and I was talking to like the...

self appoint or the Whatever it is the attorney like defender public defender that they give you and I was like, they're not dropping the charges like aren't I can I just go home and they're like no They're not dropping the charges. They're pressing charges. I was like what I go up in front of the judge and I was I was like There's no way to my stepdad would actually press these charges on me and he's like, yeah I want to press charges and then judge. All right, he's um going to the foster home or whatever and I got sent to a Leahy and Worcester

Was there for like an it was like a day and then they found me the home with like this Spanish family How do you describe your relationship with your stepfather before that happened were their flare-ups were their blowouts? What about yeah, so before then it wasn't good because I'm just like a hard-headed like I Wasn't a good kid like I wasn't a bad kid But I wasn't the best kid if that makes sense and we would have a lot of arguments and stuff and

We were never like, we never had a really good relationship. Our relationship now compared to then is through the roof. Like me and him are really close now, but before then it wasn't good.

Why do you think you weren't passionate about school? Was it because your parents didn't really push you to be passionate or did you have any influences about school? Did you have a bad experience? No, they put, they tried to push me. Like they told me that school is important. You have to, you have to do your work. You have to do this, but they weren't really like on me for it. Like it wasn't like do your homework before you can go do this or let me see that your homework's done.

And not even like that they should have been doing that. I should have been doing it myself, but I didn't really have the biggest push. Like if that makes sense, it was more just focus on football, focus on football, focus on football. And that's what I would do is just focus on football and not school at all. And I just had horrible grades besides history. I love history. I'm a big history guy, so I would get good grades in history, but math couldn't pass math. Nothing else was just, I struggled historically.

And I just didn't put like my I didn't put effort in.

It's not like I truly struggled. I just didn't put the effort in at all. Now, when you said you were in the DCF system starting from freshman year, did that mean they physically removed you from the home? No. What does that mean to be in the system? So I had this DCF officer named Kevin, and he would come every week, and he would just talk to me. It wasn't like this big thing where I was taken away from the home. They tried to get me taken away, and that's when the judge laughed at

my stepdad for saying like he wanted me taken away for like using a lighter, sneaking out, doing little things that basically every high school kid's doing.

And he wanted me taken out of the home, but the judge said no, put this DCF officer, Kevin, in charge of me or whatever. And he'd come every week, talk to me. He looked exactly like Kevin Garnett, exactly like Kevin Garnett. And he was a really nice guy, really cool guy, but just like that put like in my mind that I was a bad kid.

Because no one around me was dealing with anything that I was dealing with. Do you wish that you got removed from the home back then? No. At that time? No. You don't think it would have changed the outcome? No. I probably would have been worse if they removed me. Because it was a good home. There was no problems with it. It was an amazing household. They're great parents. Everything was good. They just thought I was bad for what I was doing. Sneaking out and doing these little things where it's like,

a lot of kids are doing these things, just sneaking out and hanging out with their friends. I wasn't hanging out and like drinking or like getting high as a freshman. I was just sneaking out and just screwing around. - You think he just didn't have experience with kids your age? - Yes. - Was that the biggest problem? - Yes, because the way he parents my little brother is different.

Which came probably around the same time as you? He's four years younger. Four years younger. Yeah, and he parents him a lot. So he hadn't experienced high school yet or middle school even for that matter. He would have been elementary school when this was starting. Yeah. Now, were you charged as a juvenile or adult? Juvenile. Yeah, I was 17 at the time. So does that mean it's off your record now? Yeah, it's off my record. Okay. Yeah, it's off my record, but...

Like it made no sense to do it at the time like it just put me in worse of a downward spiral Like I was doing fine senior graduating that should have been like the highlight of my life to that point Graduating hanging out with friends and doing this but instead I was getting sent away to a foster home and sent away to a rehab because of At the time I was smoking weed like I wasn't doing I wasn't like doing coke or I wasn't doing anything at that time smoking weed and

So, then they sent me into a rehab as a senior too and I'm around a bunch of dopeheads and it's like, I felt like I didn't deserve to be there. But I took it in a positive way at the time. So, it's not like, I'm not complaining about it. It wasn't like, you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't regret that they did that. I probably deserved a little bit of it to maybe chill myself down, but...

I don't know. High school wasn't, it should have been better than it was. Do you think you'll always hold that resentment over your stepfather over that?

I'm because that's not like a moment. You could get back. I'm trying like I'm trying really hard to just get rid of that because that's still That's still in the back of my mind all the time because he didn't need to press the charges Like if he wanted to do like a little scare tactic Fine, but once we get to the court says the court say no, i'm not going to press charges on him I don't want him to be arrested and taken away for this. He cornered me

I didn't just go up to him and punch him like he put his chest into me and walked me into a wall like cornered me into a wall. Then the second my back like touched that corner, I just swung and then just went from there. And he told me he was like, I'm not going to call the police. I'm not going to call him. I went in the shower and I got out the shower and I heard him say Maxwell White Cohen on the phone. I was like, what? I opened the door and he's talking to the police. I was like, oh, there we go. And it was just downward from there.

So tell us how that incident directly affected your spiral from there. What happens after that? After that, I got out and I was on mandatory drug tests every month. So I'd have to go and they'd call me whenever and I'd have to take a drug test. So I stopped smoking weed because if I failed, I'd get locked up.

But if Coke gets out of your system, Molly gets out of your system two days a day. So instead of smoking weed when I got out, I started doing Coke and Molly because I knew I could get it out in a day, two days out of my system. So now I'm just doing Coke and Molly and drinking instead of smoking weed. That just went downhill. Like that was not a way to live at all.

Then I would do, I was doing that for a while. And then I ended up getting out of the, like I turned, I think it was when I was 21. It ended. It was either 18 or 21. I forget which one exactly, but that's when my dad got diagnosed with the brain tumor. And that made me pick up Xanax and lorazepam and get rid of the Coke and Molly because that those are uppers. So I wanted to just

like numb myself so I picked up the Xanaxes and the lorazepams and then that's when it really got down that's when it really went downhill so what in your mind specifically made you want to try those drugs was do you have friends that were doing them or did you know about them yeah no it was all around me I was all around me I had a ton of friends that were doing Xanaxes ton of friends and then I tried one and then I was like okay because I have like I have bad anxiety too

I took this one time when we were in our like Molly phase so bad. My friends wanted to get some and we drove out to Lemonster and we got some and it was purple. And I know what real like Molly looks like. And I looked at it. I told them all. I begged them. No, we can't do this. This is purple.

No, let's take it. We're fine. We're fine. So they all take it. And I'm like, well, I can't let them take it and I'm not going to take it. So I took some and it was meth. We were up for like two or three days. I pierced this part of my ear. I was we were all absolutely messed up.

And we went to a Walmart at like 7 in the morning on that stuff. And a family, a mom covered her daughter's eyes. She was like a four-year-old daughter. Covered her daughter's eyes because we had spray paint in our hair, like random piercings. Just horrible. 7 in the morning off actual meth. And she covered her daughter's eyes and said, don't look at them, honey.

And from that day, every time I go into a store, crazy anxiety, crazy social anxiety, never had anxiety all throughout high school was the most like social person, no anxiety. And from that day going anywhere, crazy social anxiety from that one moment.

And that's why I like I try to tell my friends not to do it anymore. There's no point because if that happens now, you're screwed forever. Like I'm still trying to figure out how to combat the anxiety that I have from what I think is that one trip. And it just it wasn't good. So I feel like that one Molly meth time is what like induced this anxiety for a long time.

Now, were you trying to escape the sadness that came with the news of your dad as well with your drug use? Yeah, I just didn't want to feel, I just didn't want to feel anything really like at all. Then once I got, once I found the Xanaxes and the lorazepams, I got prescribed lorazepams from my doctor. So I was getting prescription lorazepams while buying Xanaxes from like street dealers. And I was just eating them and eating them and

The last time that I saw my dad, he was in hospice and I don't remember any of it. Don't remember anything of it. I had like I was eating pills, just eating them. The last time I saw my father, I will never remember because I was so messed up on pills, so messed up.

He ends up dying. The next Father's Day after he dies, I say I'm done with pills. I got to quit pills. It's Father's Day. I got to quit it for him. He wouldn't want to see me doped up, zombied up. So it's Father's Day and me and my buddy that also lost his father died.

We set off fireworks for Father's Day in honor of our dads. We're setting off fireworks in the middle of the street, downtown Uxbridge at like 10 p.m. Cops come. And this is my first day off pills in years. And if you know anything about Xanaxes and stuff, if you they're one of the hardest things to quit because it can actually really kill you.

And the cops came because of the fireworks, but I got so nervous. I seized up. We ran. I jumped in my friend's room and I had a full blown seizure. Smashed my head on his like metal bed frame, seized up from no Xanaxes. And he ended up having to run out the house and get the cops that were looking for us to come inside and help me. Sent to the hospital, almost died from quitting the Xanaxes, told them everything.

And then they're like, yeah, you're really not supposed to quit a cold turkey like that. I was like, what the fuck? I didn't know. Like, I don't I didn't know that. And then I haven't taken a pill since that day, though.

Now, were you working during these days of addiction? So you have a job like what did that time period between, you know, 22 and graduating high school or leaving high school look like? Yes. So do you remember during covid when they were paying like five hundred dollars a month or five hundred dollars a week rather as a bonus? There was like six hundred or something. Yeah, something like that. So I was getting I was getting all those checks. So I would take those checks by drugs.

Not work and just get messed up all day every day like I I truly don't remember like Like two years in my life like whenever my friends asked me about certain like stories I'm like I have no idea what you're talking about I don't remember a full two years of my life because of that. Where were you living? I was living with my girlfriend at the time

Was with my girlfriend at the time she was your age? She's four years older than me. Okay, so she had her life established and whatnot had her life established She had an apartment in Rhode Island. I actually um when my dad was really down bad. I I was all messed up on pills and Drinking too. So drinking liquor with Xanax is a is a horrible combo terrible combo and I would just fight I was mad at the world like I was just mad and

Got in an argument with my girlfriend. She kicks me out. I'm leaving the apartment. I grab this glass table and I just throw it. Who knows why? I just threw this glass table, shattered it, and then ran, got in my car and left. Ended up getting charged with vandalism and all that. And that's a whole other story. Got charged with vandalism for that.

Didn't pay the fine ended up working. I heart I resand hardwood floors, too I was in a house Re-sanding a hardwood floor and the homeowner accused me and my co-worker of stealing it was like $2,000 worth of $2 bills from her closet and

Accused us of stealing it while we're working in her home, and I was like why would we ever I would never steal anything from anybody And I'm definitely not someone like I'm in your home like what are you talking about? She's like nope you guys stole so she called she called like a um she called the police and then a Agent some agent called us come down here We need a statement and oh by the way Maxwell you have a warrant for your arrest for not paying a fine that fine for breaking the glass table and

I tell him I was like, yeah, I was like bullshit. I was like I paid that I thought I did I was like bullshit. That's just like some scare tactic. Fuck you blah blah blah I end up going in there to give my statement with my other co-worker And they they took me first and then they put me in handcuffs They were like you're under arrest for uh, the warrant out of whatever rhode island for not paying the fine I was like, are you serious? And then they looked at me and then they're like so was it your co-worker that took the money? They're like we could let you go

They asked me they said they would let me go if I gave up my co-worker for taking the money I just looked at I was like I was like none of us took the fucking money I was like you guys are crazy. So why we ever take any money from a home? We're working in and they're like, okay, then you're going downstairs I was like, okay send me downstairs and then I just got processed and booked for that stupid stuff That was a whole different thing

Yeah, there's some weird stories just like weird little stories like that now was your girlfriend aware of your using yeah It was she a user an addict. Yeah, so do you feel like she kind of condoned it and enabled it? There was really I've talked about this with her and my friends too. There was like no stopping what was going on Like even if she said no don't do this. I was gonna say screw you I'm gonna do this anyways

There was really no condoning or pushing me. No one was telling me no, but if someone told me no, I was going to say F off. Was she doing the same drugs as you? Yeah, not as much. She wasn't doing as many as I was because she wasn't going to do anything besides dealing with me. Besides dealing with my ass at the time.

And it just wasn't good. I couldn't function without him. I was just eating him every single day. What do you think would have been a better coping mechanism to dealing with that trauma you're going through with your father? Going to actual therapy and actually talking about your feelings. That would actually help because this is...

And still like I'm still working on that. Like I'm still working on that. I'm waitlisted for like multiple therapists. Just talking to you right now feels awesome. Feels good to get shit off my chest. I still haven't talked to many people about it. So but I know it does help. Just this helps. Just me talking to like a therapist over the phone to try to get like to get off a waitlist helps. Just simple stuff like that instead of keeping it all in. I just keep it all in.

Keep it all in, eat drugs and drink and then explode. Because like I try to keep it all in and then one little thing would set me off and I'd explode. Bring us through like an average day, like from the time you woke up to what you're doing. So I'll give you this day, the tattoo day. I got arrested this day. So this is when he was...

This was right after he died. Your dad? Yeah, right after my dad died. And so, do you know Derrick Rose? Sounds familiar. Basketball player. Yes, yes, yes. So he has this tattoo, but it says Godspeed 2 with it. But my dad loved Derrick Rose. Loved Derrick Rose. Derrick Rose tore his ACL a bunch of times, but he's still a baller. My dad loved him. So one day...

So I wake up, this is, I wake up, I take, so I'm prescribed the lorazepam, but I'm also buying Xanax is off my dealer. So I wake up, eat one lorazepam, eat one Xanax. That's how I wake up. And then I decide, you know what? I'm going to get a throat tattoo today. F it. Screw it. I'm going to get a throat tattoo. I just look up throat tattoos on Google. I come across Derrick Rose and I'm like, you know what? That makes sense. My dad loves them. I love this tattoo. I'm going to get it.

So I just I'd start drinking and it's normally beer Tito's one of the two not good or nips I'm I was heavy in a nips too would get drunk with the Xanax high I went into the tattoo parlor drink in the tattoo parlor I have a bunch of bunch of tattoos not the best artist in the world, but I got a bunch but he'd let me just drink in there and just get really messed up and

So I just drank a ton of liquor popped a couple more Xanaxes and lorazepam is probably so I I probably take like two lorazepam and like one and a half Xanaxes a day not not a crazy like four or five a day addiction, but I was eating like probably like three or four a day and Just drinking liquor I get tattooed just I'm super messed up just drunk as hell and then I leave and

And for some reason I leave and I'm so drunk, I'm pulling into a gas station and I like almost drove into propane tanks. Like, you know, like the propane tanks outside of gas stations and like the, the, like a grit type, like the metal, you know what I'm trying to say?

Like those big propane tanks. Yes, yes, the cage. Yeah, in the cage, in the cage. And it was snowing, though, at the time, but I, like, almost drove into them, like, through them. And, like, I don't know if it was, like, something like me. Do you know what I'm trying to say? Like, I don't know if it was me trying to blow it up or if it was, like, I was just really drunk because I really was really drunk off a bunch of pills, too. But it was snowing.

I stopped the car, but I slid and slammed into the cement, like, little barriers in front of the little parking spot and the propane tanks. Hit the barrier, got out, my car was smoking, and I have this new just terrible throat ink. Mind you, I regret every part of this tattoo. I regret it so much, man. So much. But either way, I crash into that thing, I hop out with this fresh ink on my neck, and

And I look at him my car smoking I'm looking around and everyone's like looking at me and I was like oh fuck get in my car And I try to pull out I pull out and I like get up the street a little and I try to turn into my buddy's driveway that lives right there and It's like on a hill like this I pull in and right as I'm pulling in the cops passes me and sees my smoking cars I'm pulling in he has his lights on he's coming after me he pulls in behind me you drinking tonight and

No, my car is just smoking and I'm just I have this terrible wet ink on my throat like my shirts bloody from the Tattooing he's like you haven't been drinking. He's like I smell the liquor on you I was like no and then he's like you want to blow no I'm not gonna blow in that and then he just he brought me to jail and

That day and tried to charge me with a DUI. I ended up beating it. How did you beat it? He never performed any field sobriety test, like nothing. Even like he didn't have me walk one foot in front of the other because it was snowing and it was on a like a slant like this at the time. And what the judge said was like, well, you could have done it in the jail cell, like in the cell.

Like you could have had them do the whatever fields of variety test you wanted, but they didn't. Or they could have blood tested you. Or they could have blood tested me for sure. They could have done a lot of things. So as soon as you went to court, did they just release you? Yeah. Or did you have to actually go through the criminal justice process? No. So I bailed out that night. Like I had to get bail. And then at my first court date is when they were like, we can't charge him with anything. Like there was nothing there. They did charge me with a...

reckless driving I think it was because I did slide and slam into that pole and then leave and leaving the scene of an accident I did get but not the DUI because the judge said there's no way to prove he was drunk besides slurring his words and being mad that's what like the cop said they're like he was slurring his words in the cop car and he was mad and it's like

That's not like you can't charge me for being drunk because of that when you see other accidents like in the news from drunk drivers people under the influence How does that make you feel and reflect that you know that could have been you if you didn't get lucky? I got lucky a couple times, and that's why I don't I'm done with that shit because there could be It's just it's messed up. It's messed up. I have a buddy that died from drunk driving and like I know it's I know it's really messed up I know it's really messed up and I that was

Three four years ago, so I haven't been doing that and I definitely know I'm lucky that I didn't get charged with that because if I did get tried with that I'd probably wouldn't have a license right now But were any of your friends from high school checking in on you like your close friends guys on the football team kind of you know Wondering what happened to him? Yeah, so I had I had really good friends amazing friends and

A lot of good friends that would check up on me and just really good friends. No complaints there at all, man. What about teachers or that school resource officer? The teachers liked me. The teachers liked my personality. They knew me as a person, so they did like me, but they tried to push me. All of them tried to do what they could. I had this one math teacher who...

And he was, he's a hard ass. He was a real hard ass. But all he wanted, all he wanted from me was to just put in effort and pass the class. And I was like, oh, screw him at the time. This guy, like, and it's like all he wanted to do, looking back on it now that I'm older, it's like all he wanted me to do was put in effort and pass the damn class. It's all he wanted. But instead I'd sit there, screw him. I'm not going to do this paper. I'm not going to do this homework. Just bad decision after bad decision. But all the teachers were awesome. They all...

Like no complaints. They were cool. They tried to push me I had friends that were checking up on me trying to push me. It was just in my own head I just at that time. I didn't even i've told people this I didn't want to be living at that time Like my dad really was like one of my best friends. I loved him. Like he was awesome amazing, dude, and then just It would just be like one thing after the other like i'd be working in boston and he'd text me He'd be like he's like when are you coming home? I'm lying on the floor

I haven't lived with him in like four or five years at that time. Like he's just dying, just straight dying, losing his mind from this brain tumor. And I'm just sitting in Boston. He's I need help. I need help. I'm laying on the floor. I can't do anything. I'm in Boston. And it just be that like day after day of him texting me these things that just

that just slowly screw your brain up over time. Like it's one thing if it's once or twice, but like when every day you're dealing with your dad needing you when you can't help him when he doesn't even know where he is.

Like he was just lost. The tumor like ate his brain and he was just not the same person. Like the other day I went and looked at all the pictures of him when he was like actually dying. And I don't remember any of those pictures. I was so messed up on pills. I didn't even know he looked that bad, looked awful. And it's like, I do wish that I wasn't messed up.

I just wish I had those final couple months where I was like sober, clear-headed, just remember all of it, like every conversation. I don't remember a single conversation. And that sucks. That really fucking sucks. Yeah, time is something we can never get back. Never get back. And never get back. And that's what I'm trying to... I just try to put that into my everyday life. Like, you can't get it back. It's impossible to. I'd do anything to get some time back. Even like a day or some shit would do anything but...

You can't. That's got to be a very heavy burden to live with knowing that like your addiction ate up. Yeah. His last years of his life. Yep. Because I wanted to be selfish and I wanted to be numb. Didn't want to feel it. Didn't want to know what was happening.

And it's one of the biggest regrets I have because now I don't fucking remember anything when he was sick at all. And some people might say, oh, that's a good thing you don't remember, but not fucking sucks because I still want to know what he was like for that final year, two years. I was so messed up. I don't remember any conversation, nothing, no text, no calls, like nothing.

Nothing. Where was your mom and stepdad during your addiction? Like after that incident happened with him, are they in communication with you? Do you guys have any relationship? Yeah, me and one of my closest buddies now, actually, they were always in communication with him. He was always looking out for me because he knew his...

His mom has a little bit of an addiction issue, so he's seen it. He was one of my best friends since fifth grade, but I lost communication with him once I started doing drugs because he's not that kind of kid. He kind of separated himself from me, but he was still trying to text me every single day, like, you good, you good. I'd ignore him, I'd ignore him. He'd text my mom, and they were just like... It felt like at the time, I thought they were teaming up on me. So I was like all...

I was all like mad about it. I was like stop texting my mom like stop doing this mind your own business But all he was doing was being like an amazing friend and just texting my mom asking if I was okay And I would just I was holding like a resentment towards him for that Which is mind-boggling because all he was doing is trying to be an awesome friend And I was just pissed at the time stop texting my mom stop texting my mom, but they were there My mom was there. They wanted me to

stop. But there was no, there was no stopping me at that time. Like I didn't even want to live at that time. Like when my, truly when my dad was dying, I was just eating the pills and drinking. I just, I was waiting for the day that I just took a little bit too much and it was over and it never happened. And I'm thankful to everything that that didn't happen. Cause I almost died that one time from the seizure and I,

I took I'm allergic to Prozac and I got prescribed Prozac one time. I took it and I have you ever heard of dystonia? No, what's that? It's like when every muscle in your body like tightens So it's like almost like your body goes like this like into a ball and your tongue like So your tongue sticks out your mouth and you can't control it so my tongue hanging out my mouth and your mouth like

You can't close it. So it's permanently like it's permanently stuck open and all your body's like this and then you stop you like basically stop breathing got sent to the hospital for that one time and they're like, yeah, if you didn't come soon, you were gonna die. I was like, what the hell and it's just a bunch of little things of almost dying but not dying and

To now I will never go around that shit again. Never gonna touch any of that stuff again It's been years since I touched it But it's like I want people to know that it's like it's not a joke at all like that shit will kill you a hundred percent will and the stuff nowadays is all faked anyways like it's all pressed with bullshit and even if it's not and you are getting prescribed lorazepam it's not a good thing to be on every day at all and

Do you feel like your stepdad takes any or feels any guilt for kind of putting you on that path of addiction? I think he does. I think he does. He's the greatest stepdad, though. Like, he's amazing. He's an amazing dude. Like, I talk to him all the time. I don't regret or I don't have any resentment towards him for what he did. But I know that I feel like he does a little bit.

Because of I didn't have to I didn't deserve to go through all that shit for what happened Like I really shouldn't have been through all that um

But either way, he's still an amazing stepdad. Like really good dude, amazing husband to my mom because my mom can't work and she's super sick. She's in the hospital every other week. So sick. My brother has a brain tumor. It's like so much shit is going on, but he's always level-headed for the most part and he sticks to it. And he's just straightforward at all times. So what he did, it was my fault. I shouldn't have had weed in the house.

And it was probably my fault for punching him too. I probably shouldn't have done that, but it is what it is now. You were young. Yeah. You made a mistake. Yeah. And it altered a couple of years of your life. Yeah. It could always be worse. Always be a lot worse. There's one way to look at it. A lot worse. Now bring us through your journey of, you know, getting sober, that moment you were sharing with us before about that last day you had pills for the first time, but tell us some moments after that and what that journey looked like.

Yeah, so basically when I tried to quit on that Father's Day and I seized up, they told me you can't quit cold turkey. Like you got to slowly wean off it. So I did that. I take like, it was like one, it honestly took me like four days probably. You take one lorazepam, you take a half, you take a half, you take a quarter, then you're good.

Haven't taken any pills since then, which I'm grateful for. I'm still I still need to stop certain things. I still like I shouldn't be drinking on the weekends. I shouldn't be like I really shouldn't drink at all. But I am. So there's still things I do need to quit. But pill wise, I haven't done one since that day. And I because I know what it's going to do.

If I take one, I'm going to take another. And then I'm going to take another. And then it's just a downhill. And I have a baby now, too. I can't do that with a baby. Is that with the same girl from back then? Yeah. Is she clean now, too? Yeah. What was her process to getting clean? She didn't really have one. She just got clean. She wasn't taking them for a reason. It was recreational.

So once she was like, "Alright, I'm done with them." She just quit them. She wasn't taking them like I was. Like I was eating them and eating them. She would just be like, "Oh, I'll take a Xanax today." It wasn't an everyday thing for her because she was still working at the time. I was the bum that was doing nothing. Just sitting there collecting checks from the government. She was still doing her sales so she couldn't like be zombied out all day.

So she just, it was more or less, she had to quit just because I was quitting. Why do you think your moment of wanting to quit came, you know, a year after your father's death, like when Father's Day was, and not the moment he died? Like, why don't you think that wasn't a breaking point enough to get you to quit? Because I couldn't really, I didn't know how to deal with the death. Like, we had no funeral. There was no any sort of ceremony or anything, right?

Like there was just nothing so it's like the day he died I got a text which I don't understand why I got this text But someone that was with him said he was getting the death rattle. It's over That's how I found out that he was dead. He's getting the death rattle. I said what the fuck is a death rattle? I'm looking up on google. What's the death rattle and now i'm picturing my dad doing the death rattle and i'm like, uh What the like I don't know. I didn't know how to cope with it at all

Didn't talk to anybody about it. So I just kept getting messed up. There was no, I didn't know how to deal with it at all. I would just, I just kept going. It just took a probably a year to, for me to just be like, this is cause I was doing like bad shit. I was doing shit that I shouldn't have been doing all because of the pills and

So then I finally just got tired of it. Some people don't get tired of it and they can just keep going. They just say whatever. But for me, it was like, I'm done feeling like this. I'm just I'm sick of it. And once that Father's Day hit, it was like, I'm done. Now, if the COVID money wasn't happening, if COVID wasn't a thing, there wasn't all those benefits. Do you think you would have resorted to like illegal activity to get it? Or do you think you just never would have done it? No, I probably. So I was a brief. I refinish hardwood floors.

So I was doing that before COVID too. And I was doing it at the beginning of COVID. I could have stayed doing it too. Like I have coworkers that made good money during COVID. Everyone stopped with them. So I could have just kept going. But once I realized it was like, oh, you can get paid like $600 to not do anything. I was getting paid like $500 to bust my ass all week sanding floors. So I was like, I'm just going to quit and just collect checks.

I'd collect a check and then I'd get the check and I'd go buy an ounce of weed and I'd go buy like a hundred Xanaxes and I'd call it a day.

And I was doing nothing productive with the money either. Like, it's not like this is going into a stock or this is getting invested right to drugs. How does it feel now to be able to, you know, keep your paycheck, pay your bills? Oh, it's awesome. It's awesome. Such a different feeling being able to, and I've screwed up my credit during that time too. Had no idea what credit was. Like I was never like nothing about credit. My dad never had a credit card. My stepdad doesn't have a credit card and I didn't know anything about credit.

So I was putting like I was putting the cable bill on a new credit card that I got because I had just brand new credit And I just tanked my credit. I screwed up my life bad during those like three years from credit money drugs everything Yeah, that's one thing. I'll always be grateful for with my situation is it never affected my credit. I only had like one $500 prepaid card

That I didn't pay before prison. So when I got out, I just, yeah, I paid it off and that was it. Yeah. That's how you do it, man. That's my, that's probably my biggest regret is the credit because I'm still working on it. You need credit. That's a lot of struggle for a lot of people that are getting out or maxing it out. And I've met so many people that have just abused it. You know, they don't care. They look at it as free money. Yep. So I pay my cards in full. I use it to my advantage. You know, the points, the rewards, the cash back.

All of that. So I treat it, but I'm so grateful because you need it for the corporate apartments. You need it for all this equipment to finance everything. Yeah. And that's why like,

My goal is to build my credit so I can have a high enough credit score to go into a bank and say, give me a loan for this to open my, I want to open a flooring business, but I can't go in with my credit score and be like, Hey, can I have a certain amount of for a loan? They're going to look at me and laugh and say, buddy, like, what the is this? Yeah. So I'm just working my ass off on my credit right now. Just working every day. Yeah. Yeah.

It goes a long way. I mean, I worked so hard when I was at Whole Foods to build back my credit. And then I blew it all up when I, you know, I paid the minimums, but I maxed them all out to start this. And I just know that feeling of being drowning in credit card debt. I was paying like a thousand bucks every month. That's just for the interest across all those cards. It's crazy. You could really get yourself into a really scary hole. It's like an addiction. It can screw you. Like it can really ruin your life basically. Yeah. You could drown on it.

And especially if you miss payments and stuff. So now I treat it very clean and professionally. That was a big thing of mine. I was missing payments like crazy when I was messed up because I just didn't care. It's like, hey, I could put this $75 towards my car payment or I could put this $75 towards drugs. And at that time, I didn't give a damn about my car payment. What's going to happen if I don't pay my car payment?

Nothing's gonna happen and here I am my credits tanked and it's like okay. That's what's gonna happen I don't even know that missing payments on your car would screw your credit. Yeah, no idea. Yeah, I missed a few of those back the day I didn't care. I was an asshole didn't care didn't give a damn. I was like whatever man How did you fight some of the temptations to use pills when you're getting off?

That's a good question. Um, cause I'm sure there was some, and also like the second question of that is how do you still fight those off now while still actively using alcohol? That for that answer, my baby, I can't do, I can't do it again because of my, my daughter. Like, so before I had my daughter, it was more of, I knew what it led to.

Like I was getting arrested all the time and I was blowing up and doing things. I'm not a bad person. I know who I am. Like I know who I am inside. And the person I am on pills is not me. I'm not a good person when I'm on pills. That's all that, that's all that kept me from like, that's what kept me from doing them. I didn't want to be like that. My friends, obviously they liked me still, but they knew I was a piece of shit when I was on pills. Like I'd fight my friends and they'd have to knock me out.

Like and I didn't care I was just an asshole and it was but now it's I know I can't cuz of my baby There's no way in hell I can go back and start taking them. Are you worried about her mother your girlfriend using? Again in anyways, no just because she like it was really just recreational and like if you're using something recreational in my opinion how I am I can stop that whenever I need to if it's recreational, but I was doing that at the time to numb everything and

Like I needed them to just not feel anything. She was just taking him for fun It was fun to just take his annex and eat some food and watch a movie for her I was taking him because I didn't want to feel how the fuck I was feeling at all How do you feel these days? What kind of goes through your mind low to your general like temperature on a day-to-day basis? What keeps you going? Yeah, so

I just try to be the nicest person I can because I know what, like, people have been through. And some people don't really understand that. Like, I will never talk bad about you unless you talk bad about me. Like, if I... Like, you know what I'm trying to say? Like, I'm a really, really, really nice person. But if you're going to, like, try to take advantage of that, then I'm going to call you out. I'm going to say something about that. It's more of just...

I'm more just level-headed until I have a I'm trying to work on my anger like I'm I'm really trying to that's my one thing that I do have a problem with get into boxing

Dude, I've been thinking of it, man. But I've been trying to find a spot around me. Like in Uxbridge, there's not like a whole lot going on. Yeah, I go boxing three times a week, man. It helps you a lot. Yeah. I mean, I don't necessarily have anger issues, but it helps clear your head. I do my workouts. I hate not starting a day without a workout.

You do it in the morning? Yeah, I used to not be a morning person. So I was a morning person at Whole Foods, you know, because you had to wake up early. Then when I started this, it was like wake up whenever, you know, 9 or 10, go to the gym in the afternoon, go to the gym in the morning. Now I'm very strict. Got to be in bed at a certain time, wake up same time, you know, 630-ish, and then in the gym at 7, six days a week.

I might have to start going on that little schedule. You gotta discipline yourself. Yeah, it goes a big big way and I'm sure you wake up early in your line of work now, right? Yeah. Yeah, so I'm a custodian at night and then I refinish hardwood floors during the day. Not every day because the 16 hour day shifts with flooring sucks because I'm sore. I'm really sore from it. But for the most part I'm up early anyways because of the baby. Like no matter what I'm up. But I

I know that back in the day, football helped me keep that anger away. Hitting every day. I was a quarterback, but I'd still run you over. I'm not going to run out of bounds. I'm going to still lower my head and take a little bit of anger out. I think boxing would be a really good thing for me. I've tried to have me and my friends go. I just...

I got to get my anxiety down too. Like I definitely, it's my anxiety and my anger that I'm trying to work on. I'm wait-listed for a couple of therapists and stuff. Go to BetterHelp, you know? I've tried, but it's just 100 bucks a week, 120 bucks a week. I know there's that. We had them as a sponsor before. There's like a 10% discount, but that only brings it down to 90. But I'm sure there's some type of free...

service like it, you know, as a trial or something or I should definitely look into it because I have great insurance from the schools. So like that's why I thought I could just should be something then that. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I thought so, too. And I went I took like two days to do it. I'm on like four or five wait lists just waiting to hear back. Well, hopefully that works out. Thank you. Do you feel guilty when you use alcohol now? Because I know it like an addiction, like a little bit. Yeah, there is that thought.

of, you know, like, okay, if you're a crack addict, you shouldn't be doing this type of drug, even though you were never addicted to that. So do you feel guilty with that? Even though that might not have been your issue before? No, I know what you mean. I feel more, so yeah, no, I feel a little guilty and I feel more dirty. Like, if that makes sense, I don't,

So when I drink, it's more to like kill my anxiety. Like if I'm around a bunch of people, I can't be around a bunch of people like just sober and just sitting there. Like I have a lot of trouble, heart races, like insane anxiety, like a little bit of shakes and stuff. So I'll drink like at parties and around a bunch of people and stuff. And then...

The next day, I'm just like, I don't want to drink. I don't like drinking. I don't like being drunk. But when I am drunk, I enjoy it, if that makes sense. And it's just such a stupid mindset because I do feel a little guilty from it. But it's not like drinking would ever lead to me taking pills. Yeah, I mean, I don't really like drinking either. Like, I do it socially. You know, it's a fun time. You go out, you're with your girl or something, you know, you have a drink. Yeah, I mean, it's fun, you know. Like, I always toy with, okay, I'm going to...

not drink ever again, but it is fun. And I'm a lightweight, so I'm like two drinks in, you know, and I'm done. Me too. Now it's more like, okay, do I have anything I have to do the next day? You know, I got to take it casual. Priorities and stuff. Exactly. Priorities and everything like that goes a long way. Yeah. A hundred percent. I, uh,

I was bad with that a couple years ago. Like, if I had work, I wouldn't care. Drinking, I'll drink on a Monday night if I have to go into work and I feel like shit. I'm finally over that stage. If I have work the next day, I'm not drinking. Like, I'm not, I can't wake up and feel like shit every day. That got old really quickly. And I get, like, really hungover, I feel like, compared to some people. Like, some of my friends don't even get hungover. Like, they just drink a ton. They wake up and they're fine. I'm just like,

I'm dying. Like I have the worst anxiety. I'm shaking. I don't want to be around anybody just from drinking like five, six beers. Just, I don't know, man. Now, if your child ends up, God forbid, having an addiction issue, how will you deal with that? That's a good question. I just sit her down and I just tell her my story about what happened because I just, she's not going to have to knock on wood, but she's not going to ever have to go through what I went through.

She's going to have an amazing life, an amazing childhood. Everything is going to be perfect in a perfect world. You know what I mean? So hopefully she never gets there. But if she does, sit her down, tell her my story of what happened, why she can't do what she's doing. And if she continues to do what she's doing, then I'll send her to a rehab.

100% if she's really into it then yeah, that's what's gonna be best for her Then I'll 100% put her in a rehab make her watch this interview. Yeah, I do that. Yeah for sure I mean lived experience is what you know really changes lives sharing the stories getting it out there I mean you said earlier just sitting down having this conversation how else so much man helps a ton. Yeah people

And I know you were telling my brother this over email, like you felt like your story wasn't lines up with some of the other crazier stories. And sometimes I'll see people commenting on some of the like not as crazy stories and they'll be like, why is this guy on here? It's a prison show. And like it's it's not just prison and it's open to anyone that wants to share because it doesn't necessarily matter about the views. What matters is people.

That the person who reached out and took that, because it's a scary thing to reach out and be rejected. Yeah. I don't want to do that to anyone, you know? Like, I want them to feel the option of being able to get their voice out because a lot of these stories go unheard, you know? So that's the importance of it. That's why it matters. That's why we take everyone. As long as it has some type of element of criminal justice or addiction, you know? Like, I've got some...

wacky requests which I gotta politely decline yeah but it just has nothing to do with addiction or this or that you know it's like something that crazy that happened at work or anything it's like that's not my show you know there's something else there but if I could stretch it a little bit I will just so that person tells their story yeah that's what I was nervous man and you killed it you did great

Thank you, man. I appreciate that. Once you got going, it's my job to warm the person up. I started to feel like, yeah, at first I was definitely a little like shaky and nervous, but then it just started to feel like we're just talking, just having a conversation. And bro, I get like that too in big spots. And like, I don't like being in big crowds and I get anxious and then, you know, I start to shut down. It's just not me, you know? I like to do this, like this is where I'm kind of in control and I do the public speaking, but it's nerve wracking as hell to get up there.

Yeah. You got to just push through. Yeah, dude. I was like, this is... If you ask any of my friends, I'm the most anxious dude. I hate crowds. I hate... I don't even go out. I don't go to bars. I don't do anything. Like, I don't even like having people at my house. I just want to be alone most of the time. So doing this, like, they're like, dude, you got to step out of your comfort zone. Like, you got to... You have to do it. I'm glad they pushed you. Dude, me too. Because I was just nervous. I just...

Just nervous nervous anxiety and then I was like, you know what they're all right And then you text you emailed me back and I was like, all right, you know what? Yeah, I want to meet you too. I was like, yeah, you know, that's a medicals out of it. Yeah, that's true That's true. So it worked out. Yeah, so what would you say is the biggest takeaway you want people to learn from your story today that No matter what you're going through. It's gonna end. I

Like you're you're not forever gonna be feeling the way you're feeling like I thought for a couple for a good year two years I Didn't want to be alive at all. I thought there was no future I got my my whole body tatted up neck stomach legs everything tattooed because I thought in a couple years from then It wouldn't have mattered. I thought I was gonna be gone who cares if I have tattoos. I don't need a job in five years, but

But all those feelings are going to end and don't make decisions that are going to truly permanently do stuff to you and hinder you and your future over some feelings that are happening right then and now. Shit gets better. It's always greener on the other side. Grass is greener on the other side. It's always greener. And I just, yeah.

I love that, man. Yeah. Well, Max, I appreciate you making the drive out here and sit down with me today, man. Appreciate it, dude. You really did good, man. Thank you. You weren't nervous and you did good. It was good to meet you, man. Yeah, you too. Don't second guess yourself. Thank you. And thanks for supporting the show. Appreciate it, man. Awesome. Until next time.