Deep Dive
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As a guide and hunter, I've spent thousands of days in the field. This show is about translating my hard-won experiences into tips and tactics that'll get you closer to your ultimate goal, success in the field. I'm Remy Warren. This is Cutting the Distance.
Welcome back to the podcast. It's awesome that summer's in full effect because what that means is hunting season is just around the corner. Maybe you've got an early season archery tag coming up. Some seasons are starting in a month or less. Actually, there's already some blacktail seasons, archery seasons in California that have started already. Opening weekend was last weekend. And I'm going to talk a little bit about that.
So there's a lot of things coming up and maybe you don't have an early archery season, but Hey, we're, we're on that second half of the year where things are going to start picking up and those seasons are going to start popping around best part of the year. Fall is coming.
Now, one thing I really like to focus on is summer scouting because it can pay huge dividends when it comes to understanding the potential animals in the area you're hunting. It can also help you find good pockets to start an early season hunt and help you understand the animals in the unit you're hunting. Not to mention it's a great way to get a good lay of the land in a new unit that you might be planning on hunting later this fall.
So this week, I'm going to be covering the five key advantages to summer scouting, including what I like to call the velvet advantage, and ways to use summer scouting intel to find success during the season. But first, I want to share the story of a summer trip where we discovered a place I like to call the bull, which is hands down my most productive big buck hunting spot over the years.
It was early 2000s and my buddy Brett had drawn a tag in a unit that we'd never hunted before. And it wasn't particularly like a real great trophy and it wasn't anything. It was just a place that was easy to draw a tag and it was probably toward the end of his choices. And he drew the tag and we're like, okay, well, we always hunt together. Um,
This is awesome. We're going to go check out a new place. It wasn't one of the areas that we normally hunted. It was a little bit further drive, but hey, we were going to go check it out. So we did a little bit of like talking to a few people, a little bit of looking at some maps and we did what we like to do. We went out and put in a good scouting trip. It was myself, his dad, Art. So the three of us, we just kind of like loaded up the truck, went out, go check some places off the map.
We got out there the first day and started, you know, like looking, doing –
Just kind of checking out the area, checking roads, checking access points. This is way before we did a lot of e-scouting. So it was kind of like as much exploring as anything. It's like, okay, we're going into a new place we've never been. It's a big area. We have our map book. We've got a few spots marked and we're going to check it out. So we get up to some glassing vantages. We're tearing apart the country. And, you know, we'd seen some deer, but nothing crazy, no big bucks, just nothing.
kind of getting an idea of like, okay, here's some, some bucks. We've seen some Forkenhorn, some other deer, you know, a couple figuring out where the water sources were, this, that, and the other thing. So when the season rolled around, we weren't going to go in blind, but we also wanted to kind of think like, is this a good spot to hunt? So we were scouting and had this whole plan of where we were going to look. And some people had told us, oh, this is a good spot. And we were just like looking at it and
glassing and we just couldn't turn up very much. We're like, man, this is going to be tough.
And then we just thought, well, let's go somewhere else. Let's just go look at as many other places as we can. So we start checking some other places and we ended up at the end of the day, kind of driving up this one road that ended. And so we're like, all right, we'll just camp here. And then we'll, we'll check out this area, this whole completely different area over here. I was looking on the map. I'm like, man, this looks pretty sweet. You know, we'd seen it in the distance. We're like, let's just go look at this and see what, what we can find. So
We get there, we park, you know, we just have like our cots or I think I was just sleeping on the ground. But summertime, that's the best part about summertime is you can just, no tent, you don't need anything. You just sleep where you are. It's so nice. So we're sleeping there under the stars, actually a pretty bright moon. And next morning we wake up.
And we pop over the rim kind of like right where is a pretty steep hill where we're camping. We did, we did, we definitely just like would go until we'd find somewhere to stop, stop glass, go to sleep, wake up, keep going. So next morning, pop over the rim of where we're at. And lo and behold, just glassing this big sage flat. And it's like, it seems like there's nothing. And then all of a sudden I'm like,
Boom box. And it's a massive bachelor herd. I don't know, probably 20 bucks. And there's some studs in there. Like we just like, look, we all like each other. We're just like getting excited. Like now we've got the spotting scopes out and we're picking apart each week. Oh, this buck, look at the cheater on that buck. Oh man, that's a big three by three over there. Like, dude, did you see that buck? And then like, now we're starting to pick apart some others places in this like zone and
got the spotting scopes out and everything. Now we're picking out more and more bucks. We're like, this is the zone, this big base and this big bull. And this is where the bucks want to be. We checked a hundred different places throughout the course of the time that we had to scout. And for some reason, this particular pocket was holding bucks and not just any bucks, like some mature bucks, some really good bucks. So we're like, okay, this is going to be our zone. So
uh, later on that season, we go back in there. We couldn't hunt until October, like late October. And, you know, obviously it was a different time of year. So we didn't necessarily see the deer, but we kind of started to learn that little bit of an area a little better. We ended up, uh, Brendan ended up shooting a nice four by four. Uh, there was another kid that I had tagged. He shot a deer and we're like, okay, sweet. But that
That image of just all those bachelor bucks was in my mind. So I'm like, all right, they're there early. We got to figure this place out. Like we know that there's big deer there. We just didn't have a lot of time during the season to put in bred at school. So it's like, I'm like, all right, we're going to go back here. I'm going back here. I'm getting an archery tag here next year and I'm going to go for it. That next year I got an archery tag and ended up chasing the biggest buck that I've ever seen in my life.
Still to this day, the biggest deer I've seen. And I've seen some pretty good deer. I don't mean to be like pat myself on the back. I've seen all the big deer, but this is not just a big buck story. I know for sure would have been a new archery world record if I was able to sink an arrow in it. Of course I didn't. Things went wrong and you can listen to that whole story on episode one of this podcast. But over the years, this particular spot,
We've taken multiple big deer, multiple nice deer, seen multiple great deer, not necessarily just in that particular, right in that same Canyon, but we've
using that as a jumping off point, really understanding and learning the habits of the deer in this area. And over the years, I'd spent hundreds of days in this particular area. Now, when I say a particular area, for me, that's a very large area, but in this particular area of the unit, understanding the deer and because of it, really gaining a lot of success and a lot of knowledge of those deer. But I don't think I ever would have found this spot
Had I not been for summer scouting. And there's quite a few reasons that during the summer, the deer doing different things, but it makes them super susceptible to being spotted, which gives you a really good indication of the types of bucks in the area or types of animals in the area. And then you can use some different tactics to exploit that later.
Later on, there's been so many hunts that I've done where I've gone out in the summer, I've done my scouting and that summer scouting has led to the success that I have later on in that season, even in areas that might be a little more difficult once that season kicks up, once that pressure kicks in.
What I wanted to do is just kind of outline what I think are five key reasons that summer scouting can really pay those huge dividends when it comes time to hunting the season. Now, of course, if you're talking about maybe you've got an early archery tag, summer scouting is the most accurate scouting to what you're going to see when that season rolls around. But it's not necessarily the only time that the scouting is going to pay off.
What I mean by that is like, there's been many times I've had an elk tag, let's say a November elk tag. I'll get out in the season. I'll find a group of bulls. And then later on in the year, I will use that knowledge of what I've found to be successful later on. It's also really good for understanding.
Maybe you've got a limited entry tag. You're saying like, I don't know what type of deer, what type of elk, what type of antelope, what type of sheep, whatever I should be shooting. Like if I see it, should I shoot it? But summer scouting is a great way to understand the breadth of what's in the area you're hunting. So let's talk about the things that make summer scouting so beneficial. And the first is,
and actually quite a few of these, goes off of this idea. I've wrote many articles on this, but I call it the velvet advantage. And this is because as deer are growing their antlers or elk are growing these antlers, this particularly pertains to elk and deer or anything that grows antlers. There's certain aspects of them having that velvet and them needing energy to grow that velvet that can be exploited that lends them to being more susceptible to being spotted. So the first aspect
I like to call the bachelor party. And what that is early in the season, it doesn't necessarily have to do with the velvet, but it has to do with the way that herds of animals kind of congregate during different times of year. So mule deer, white-tailed deer, elk, even I've seen moose even do this. It's pretty rare for moose. They're a little more solitary. But what happens is
the bucks or bulls separate off from the cows or does and they bachelor up. They do this early in the season and then they also do this again in the winter after the rut. So they're all friends, they're all hanging out, they're all in safety by numbers mentality and they're grouped up in groups of bucks. How this helps the hunter is it makes it a lot easier to understand what type of bucks are in an area because they're together. It also gives you a good barometer of being able to compare bucks together.
Now, this first idea is what I like to call the birds of feather. So, you know, you heard that saying birds of feather flock together. I always think of that when I'm out looking at bachelor groups of bucks, because I always think I kind of have that like saying in my mind, because what you'll notice is a lot of times age classes of bucks will start to flock together. You might be in an area and you're like glassing and you're turning up bachelor group of buck, bachelor group of buck. And you'll notice that they're like
little two, two by twos, two by threes, two to three year old bucks. And there might be one big buck in there or whatever, but for the most part, it's like these younger deer have all grouped up and you're like, okay, I see this group of deer. And okay, you're seeing lots of deer. You might be seeing these different groups of bachelor bucks, but then it's like, you find this one group of bucks and they're all mature bucks, six to eight years old,
heavy antlers, what you're looking, you're like, wow, okay, that's different than these other ones you're seeing. But what that is, is it shows you the pockets of better age class. And this is easier to find during the summer because one, the deer grouped up and it kind of gives you this idea of where do those mature deer
like to live. There's a reason that those mature deer in a certain area. And it's because they've lived long enough. They know places where they're safe and they're kind of grouped together in this because they're kind of like, they've all got the same mentality. They've, they've survived, they've seen it all. And they're starting to group up based on deer that are very compatible to them. Now there is always like the caveat to that is sometimes you'll see a big buck and with, you know, a
Whatever. There's sometimes like I've noticed after I've spent way too much time watching mule deer, even during the hunting season, you know, one day, one year, God, I can't even, I was like literally just spent 30 days, one year out there watching mule deer, not shooting anything, just seeing what these deer do.
And what I learned was like, they have certain groups that they like, and you'll find like certain deer will stick together. And then there's like ones that rove and move, but you, oh, like overwhelmingly, if you're to graph it out, statistically certain age class deer tend to hang with certain age class deer.
And that's really helped me narrow down areas to focus on any time of the season, because you can kind of discount. This is if you're looking for a certain type buck or more mature deer, you can start to discount what you might think of as a nursery.
those areas, like, especially if it's an early season tag where you're like, ah, I'm seeing so many deer here, but they're all just like this young deer. They're all two-year-old deer. They're whatever. So that's like a nursery. Now it's great if you're just looking for success or maybe that's what you're looking for. It doesn't, that's cool. Then you found what you're looking for. But if you've got the time, you've got the time of the summer, these deer are going to be out. They're going to be more active. They're going to be grouped up together. You can start looking for those pockets that are holding those better age class deer. Because what that's going to tell you is there's something about this area that
that provides enough safety to allow these deer and enough, like the right food, the right amount of safety to allow these deer to get to a certain age. And there's something in this area where they're at that they tend to congregate toward. And so during the season, you can focus your attention toward those areas because you know that they're going to probably hold those better age class deer. So the next one, number two,
the one thing that summer scouting does because as that velvet, so this kind of goes back to that velvet advantage and what it is, is as those deer are growing their antlers elk or deer, they're expending so much energy in order for a buck or bulls to grow antlers.
It's pretty much like a cow or doe growing a fawn. Like it takes that same amount of food. It takes that same amount of energy. So they're going to be feeding a lot. And what that means is they're going to be out where the food is and it allows you to concentrate your looking when
when you're scouting. So as opposed to going out, let's say you've got a November deer season and you're like, Hey, well, I've got some time to scout. I'll go out in October. That's the worst time to try to look for deer because they aren't out in the open. They aren't feeding. They're in a completely different pattern during the summer, during the spring deer and elk are in their feeding patterns. And this, this pertains to a lot of other species. This pertains to sheep. This pertains to, uh, can pertain to pronghorn.
Not so much as other things like, but the springtime is really good. I would say spring's a little bit better for pronghorn. It's kind of a rabbit trail. We can talk about pronghorns on a different episode, but yeah,
what you need to think about is like, so their growing season is spring and yeah, they're, they're stacking it on as, as that spring good nutrition starts coming out, they're growing, they're growing, but you can't really tell what their antlers are fully like because they aren't quite developed yet. So as you start going into summer, some of that good spring nutrition starts shrinking up and you're limiting the number of areas where there's like still really good food sources. And you've got the advantage of the deer elk or whatever antlers are growing and
And you can kind of tell what they're going to look like, or you can tell exactly what they're going to, what they look like, but because they're needing that feed so much, they're very tied to food sources. And what that does is it kind of puts them one in a more patternable pattern. So you can find them easier, but it also allows you to concentrate where to look.
and allows them to be out in these areas more predictably in the mornings and evenings. They're more concentrated on food than cover. So it allows them to be out and it's really good for glassing, really good for finding. It's a really good time to take advantage of them being out in a place where it's easy to look because it's more open and generally for feeding areas and allows you to find the animals that you're looking for a lot easier. Combine that with the
the bachelor group factor, and you're already steps ahead compared to other times a year. The third factor, and the other two kind of led into this, is they're out more, which is true because they've got to feed. They also...
Or out a little bit more, or I consider it out a little bit more. I've heard this many times, and I don't necessarily know that it's true, but maybe it is. It just, it kind of like, it seems to work. They say, oh, deer elk, when they're growing their antlers, they're sensitive, which they probably are. And so they're out in more open areas. And that is true. You will tend to find deer elk out more. Now, here's the catch to that.
It's hot in the summer and they're going to need to bed a lot and they aren't going to want to be out in that heat. So they're going to be feeding in the morning, they're feeding in the evening, but they aren't going to be out in the middle of the day. However, I say out more because you can actually, it's easier to spot them midday based on bedding spots because they're going to pick bedding spots where they've got shade. They've got possibly a breeze. They've got a good defensive position, but they're going to want to be out in the middle of the day.
They aren't like necessarily buried into the thickest patch that you can find on the mountain. So it really lends itself to good midday glassing. When I'm out summer scouting, I'm putting a lot of time in the glass looking for those shady spots that I can actually see into that I think will be good bedding areas for elk, for deer.
But also not mess with that sensitive antler where they got to go bury themselves in like this really, really thick, dense brush, which they do when it comes October time. I've seen deer. I've bumped a deer out of some stuff. And I'm like, you look in it, you go, there's nothing in there. And then a buck runs out of it. And you're like, okay, there was something in there. And you don't tend to see that.
Like you do when they're in the velvet in the summertime, they go pick those more wind blown areas where it's like, okay, they've got a nice breeze. Keep the flies off them. They're up high. They're in the shade. They've got this good little pocket where they're safe. They're cool. They've got that nice wind. They've got a good wind, like defensive position where the wind's coming down their back.
They're looking down over the valley and, you know, their antlers aren't stuffed into a bunch of brush. And because of that, it makes it a lot easier for you to utilize the full day, even though it's hot, to be able to pinpoint those locations midday to kind of figure out where these animals are and maybe what's in your unit. So it's a really good use of time because you do end up seeing a little bit more animals.
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for summer scouting would be there's less pressure. So the animals throughout the spring, like there's no big game hunting season aside from bear season. Like there's nothing hunting elk and deer during the spring and through the summer. They just don't have that hunting pressure. And because of that lack of hunting pressure, they're a lot more patternable. What I really enjoy about finding deer in the summer is you can find them and you can go, okay, going back to
The other good advantages, they need to feed a lot. They're growing the antlers out. They don't really like to be in that thick brush. So they're going to find those bedding areas. And what you'll start to find is the deer...
with less pressure have these patterns where they go out to this certain feeding area then they go to this water then they go to this bedding area or the safety zone this cover right and now even though their antlers are maybe soft they definitely still go into timber they still go into to places you can't see into especially if it's a more timbered area
Now, this is where you can utilize your summer scouting for later in the season. And I don't, I haven't heard a lot of people talk about this, but this is definitely something that I've noticed over the years is when I'm scouting in the summer, what I really like to pay attention to is what I call their safety zone. So,
They aren't pressured. They don't necessarily have, they aren't changing their patterns every day or holding up and going nocturnal or, or getting into a pocket of cover where they feel safe and not moving from it aside from dark because they're
The hunters are out all day, bumping them, moving them, whatever. You can watch these deer during the summer elk, whatever. It doesn't matter what species with a lot less pressure. So they're just animals being animals without the added pressure of hunters in the area. So how do you use that to your advantage? You're going to pay attention to what their safety zones are. So they've got this pattern and most animals are creatures of habit, especially this is especially true when it comes to elk hunting.
elk have like a certain that's why they're herd animals and they follow a lead cow. It's like that cow knows the safety zones. That cow has like a good pattern of keeping that herd safe and they're moving and they're using all their eyes and ears and everybody combined to stay safe, but they're also falling into patterns. And I would say out of all the species mule deer, probably the least patternable, but they still have a general pattern. So
So what you can do is you can watch them. So you're watching them in the summer. It's like here, they're feeding out in this open. Then they're moving to this like nice safe bedding zone. But after that, like second, their second bedding, they're disappearing into this patch of timber. And you'll notice over time, there's going to be certain particular places where they go to more than others.
And those are their safety zones. Now, when deer start to disappear, when elk start to disappear later in the season, you know, like, where did they go? They were all here during the summer. They were doing this. They were doing that. But you don't see them. Did they move off? Not always. It depends on whether it's a migratory area or they're the resident animals. But if they're resident animals.
They've got their safety zones that they know really well. And so what they're probably doing is they're probably hitting those feeding areas more at dark when that pressure goes, and then they're holding up in those safety zones. So you can kind of figure out they've got a preferred bedding area, preferred area where they stay safe, but you can figure it out a lot easier based on watching them in a pattern when there's no pressure.
So you'll pay attention. Okay. You watch the deer in this particular area, like the bull where I'm talking, for example, we've hunted deer there from the beginning of archery season, all the way through October and even into the rut.
We've taken giant deer in August in the archery when they're on their summer patterns. And we've taken big deer in October, which is the hardest time to find them. But what we noticed is during the August season, they were going into generally they would feed, they would do their regular bed where they're out in the open. And then we go into this thick patch of mahogany off this backside.
And that was their safety zone. And when they disappeared in October, you know where they were? Just hold up in those safety zones, waiting for that rut to hit, saving up their energy. And by still hunting some of those safety zones, we were able to be a lot more successful on some of the really big bucks in the area that would never show their face during the light of day out in the open.
So paying attention to those safety zones is a really good way to kind of key in later in the season. That's really true, especially for elk when you've got the herd and you can see what they're doing with no pressure and then kind of figure out the preferred areas where they like to go, where they feel safe in the timber. And number five, kind of one of the advantages to summer scouting is you
It's hot and animals are a lot more tied closely to water. The water can be often more concentrated during the summer and they're going to need that water more often. So it's a really good, another concentrated spot to kind of pay attention to figure out where animals are or the type of animals that are in your area.
Now, when you think about it, this could be if it's legal and you want to do it, this is a good time to use some trail cams. You can do some trail cam work around water holes, around other things.
you know, the way that I think about trail cams, I like to understand what the animals are doing. Sometimes I use them sometimes even when they're legal, I don't use them. It's just, uh, I think some people have, you know, everybody's got their own opinions on different things hunting, but it can be a great tactic to be able to understand what animals are in the area, what water they're using and what particular places hold game animals. Now you're like, well, how does that translate to later on in the season?
In the summer, let's say you've got all this water in an area. In the summer, a lot of that water dries up. So the animals are going to get kind of concentrated to certain water holes or certain areas where there's water. So more animals using fewer number of places. What that does though is it helps you in a big area. You can say it's a new place that you've never hunted before. You're like, where do I even start? During the summer where I start is finding water because then what you can do is you can say,
Okay, maybe during the fall, all the creeks are running. So it's going to spread them back out. But you can narrow down the areas in a large area, like a big unit, narrowed down to small waters and say, which area is having the most tracks, the most sign, the most activity here?
in these water holes or in the water that's available. And then you can say, okay, during the season, when there's more water, I'm still going to focus in this general area. Now the animals I know are going to be more spread out, but it narrows down a large area into a smaller portion of the unit where you've got higher densities of animals. And then I'll hunt in those particular spots as the regular season comes on, even though I know they're going to be maybe more spread out like later in the fall, but I
But I know that these particular spots tend to hold more animals. Those animals are coming from a wider area, but they're coming right down to this little spot as the water gets small. And then as there's more water, they spread back out. But I want to be in that general area when that water spread back out because I know the concentrations of animals in that area.
When it comes down to it, really finding those exploitable weaknesses during the summer and then using that strategically to hunt during the fall can be an extremely successful way to find that honey hole, to find that spot. Really good spots are often not found by accident. They're found by persistence and looking during the best time of year to look. So the time of year where
You have the highest chance of finding what you're looking for. And then that kind of gives you like, okay, here's the area I can go to. And then as that season narrows down, as it gets to whatever season you're hunting, then you can focus in on that spot and hunt it and start picking it apart and find your success. So I hope that helps you guys. I know that for a lot of people, if you have the time, if you've got some, a weekend or whatever, get out, do some summer scouting, because I think it will pay huge dividends to you later in the season.
This week, actually, so tomorrow, just as like a note, if you're in the area or if you can make it, it'll be tomorrow will be Friday. So if you're listening to this podcast on Thursday when it goes up live, then you've got till tomorrow. If you're listening to it after that, then it probably doesn't pertain to you. But I will be doing a live Q&A. I've talked about it here before, but a live Q&A at the Pope and Young Convention in Reno, Nevada tomorrow.
I've got a one hour slated for two to 3 PM and I'm doing, I'm doing back to back. So two to 3 PM and then three 30, I'm starting another one for an hour. So if it's the first one's four, if there's other ones, whatever, or your question, you can answer it and you want to stay. I'm going to be doing two back to back live Q and A's Pope and young club convention, Reno, Nevada, uh,
This Friday. So that is Friday the 16th. If you can make it, that'd be awesome. I'd love to see you guys there. I'm going to try to, I'd say try because if something goes horribly wrong, I don't want people to be like, what happened to the live Q&A that you're going to do on the podcast? But I'm going to try to record it for this podcast because I think it'll be fun to have other people comment
other people live questions asked and answered. And I really enjoy that like question and answer format. So bring your hunting questions if you're coming and I'll look forward to chatting with you all there. I'm pretty stoked about that. There's also, I think I've got, I think it'll still work. Um, like a discount on day passes go on my Instagram. There'll be a scroll back. There's a post. I think it's like Warren 2021.
You'll get half off the day pass if you decide to come. Anyways, yeah, so hope that helps everybody. I know I got a lot of questions about summer scouting. People are getting excited, getting amped up about it. So I thought that I'd throw out some of those, well, kind of a more or less why you should summer scout and then ways to kind of turn that summer scouting into success later in the season. So anyway.
If you guys have some success, I always love to see those success photos, share those stories. I've got a lot of great stories coming in already of people who found success in some of those early seasons in California already. Black Tails, A-Zone, good job guys. So yeah, until then, get out and go find some fuzzy. I'm talking about velvet antlers. I don't know what you're talking about, but go find that fuzz. All right. Talk to you guys later or see you on Friday.
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