Ep. 113: Hunting Idaho Whitetails
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The only thing better than a successful hunt is celebrating your feet during the after-the-hunt moment. With a smooth taste made to be enjoyed on the rocks or with your favorite mixer, Pendle and Whiskey is perfect for winding down around the fire or putting your feet up after cleaning your game. If you're looking for the perfect drink to celebrate after a great day hunting,

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out of the first animal you kill. Meat from those organs are among the most nutrient-rich foods on the planet. You can get those same benefits your ancestors craved via convenient daily capsules from Heart and Soil. Find out more at heartandsoil.co. And remember, use code MEATEATER for 10% off your purchase.

Welcome back to another episode of Cutting the Distance Podcast. I'm Dirk Durham, and at this recording date, it's November 20th, arguably my favorite time to hunt mountain whitetails. With snowflakes dropping in the higher elevations, I'm packing my bags to head up and try a little luck at tagging a big buck.

After Jason Phelps talked about Kansas hunting on last week's episode, I wanted to compare and contrast my experience rival hunting those same type of deer in Idaho. Now, as all you know, I love archery elk hunting, and to be honest, all elk hunting.

But what you probably don't know is whitetail hunting was my very first love. Hunting whitetails from 12 years old with my dad looked a lot different at age 13 and then a lot different today. Back then, it was all big timber deer hunting, pretty much. Zero clear cuts, at least where I began hunting. This was state land, private timber land, and sometimes private property.

Sometimes I'd get permission from these local farmers who I worked for in the summertime putting up hay. And come fall, you know, I'd ask them if I could hunt and they would say, oh, absolutely. Because farmers, most farmers, they want to trim down the deer herd and the elk herd as much as they can. Well, 12-year-old me hunting was riding around in the truck with my dad all day looking for deer, hoping one would magically appear.

But man, did they ever appear? There were deer everywhere back then. It was crazy. You didn't have to drive very long and you would see a deer run across the road or be standing next to the road. But the funny part was they were almost impossible to get, right? You know, by the time you'd get out, run off the side of the road, run out in the brush, you'd try to get one and they were always gone. And so I kind of made a decision. 13-year-old me had had enough road hunting that very first year.

Every deer we saw, it was on high alert and running. So I wanted to shoot a deer more than anything in the world. And I knew doing it from a truck was definitely not the way I was going to get it done. So honestly, I think my dad, he hoped we didn't get a deer. I think he was just out enjoying it.

the fall woods, you know, taking in all the sites, all the pretty, all the pretty fall colors and driving around, sipping on coffee, having a candy bar, you know, it was that kind of a, kind of a vibe. And I think he was just out there enjoying it. I know, I feel like he had zero intention of actually getting a deer back then. So at 13, I made the decision that I wanted to get out of the truck and I wanted to hunt, hunt deer. I wanted to, to, to get in the woods on foot and,

and find a big buck. So I'd have my mom or my dad drop me off in the woods for a morning hunt or an evening hunt and then meet back where they dropped me. And this may be, you know, they may drop me 30 minutes before first light and pick me up later on that morning. They may drop me off right after school and I'd hunt till dark, a little after dark. In fact, most of the time I would hunt every single day before school until I got my deer ready

I'd go out for an hour or two, just get out there. Sometimes my mom would go with me. My dad, he was just like, yeah, it's cold out. I'm not into it. I think he was pretty much over it by that time. I think he'd go if we wanted to drive around, but he didn't want to. He called it beating the brush. He's like, I'm not going to get out there and beat the brush. He always thought if you beat the brush, you're going to just spook the deer over to someone else. So he didn't want to do that. So today...

deer hunting looks completely different. There's virtually no big timber. There's clear cuts everywhere on state and timber land. There's little, and some of the private stuff is not cut up so bad, but a lot of those farmers, you know, they, that I used to go hunt on their place, then they've long since retired or passed on. So it's definitely a different game these days. And I'd say there's, there's less deer today too. And I attribute to a couple of things that dominate those things, but yeah,

Some of the things I'll talk about before I tell you what I think the key things are is predators. Predators are taking their fair share of deer, that's for sure. You know, back in the early, or in the 80s and 90s, you know, mountain lions and coyotes were thick in Idaho. And they, I think they took their fair share of deer. But I don't think coyotes had the population like they do today.

In my opinion, today, wolves and coyotes are probably doing most of the damage. There's still some lions out there, but I think the wolves and the coyotes are taking down the larger numbers. For one...

coyotes, there's just no market on their fur these days. And nobody's really trapping coyotes in a large scale like they used to. There was a lot of guys just out trapping a lot of coyotes back in the day, putting a pretty good dent in their population. But we just don't see that as much today. The hides are hardly worth a thing, which is unfortunate because it really helps with creating some balance out there. Another thing to think about is disease.

When I was a kid, we'd never had any disease to speak of. We'd never had any blue tongue. We never had any EHD come through. And then in the 90s, we saw our first cases of that. It seemed like we had more droughts during the mid to late 90s, and we had some pretty substantial die-offs.

um, where, you know, we lost like 80 to 90% of the deer in some spots. And today, you know, we continue through the last, you know, if you look at the last decade, the last two decades, you know, we've had, I've had quite a bit of drought and we've had a few more EHD and blue tongue die offs. So that definitely does, um, put a, put a nail in the coffin on some of these deer herds. Um,

But they seem to bounce back after a few years and you start getting your deer herd built up again after a few years. But my personal opinion on one of the main culprits is too many tags and habitat loss.

I'd like to say first, 100%, I support logging in the timber industry, but with the massive clear cuts that have removed security cover for the deer, and also an abundance of deer tags for residents and non-residents alike, it's really taken its toll. I'll say the herds are starting to slowly look better as the clear cuts are starting to grow up a little bit and offer more security, but we're just not there where we were at back in the 80s and 90s.

Um, I think without, you know, reaction from the, the, the fishing game, I don't want to pick on them too much, but there's a lot of nuance. I feel like in, in big game management and one of them is, is loss of habitat and security cover. And when the, when they started making those clear cuts, you know, they were really great because you'd have big blocks of timber and then you'd have a clear cut and that would give the deer a ton of food and they still had somewhere to hide, but man,

Man, over the last five, six years, all these big clear cuts they'd put out there previously, they've all started connecting them now. They've wiped out a lot of the big blocks of standing timber and the deer are kind of running out of places to hide. But I will say in the last three or four years as well, some of those earlier clear cuts are starting to grow up and we're starting to get little fir trees and brush and deer are starting to find some new places to hide. So

So I feel like in the next five, 10 years, there should be a pretty good heyday of, of deer for deer. I feel like, you know, they're going to be a lot less vulnerable and a lot harder to see no matter how many tags are going to be out there. But one bad thing about having too many tags is, you know, and I'm, I'm all for everybody getting to hunt every year. I love to hunt every year, but man, at some point it gets tough because it gets overcrowded. Um,

And you have to look at Idaho's population, the resident population, the last three, four years, it's exploded from a lot of folks moving to Idaho because they love our resources. They love the outdoors. They love to hunt. They're looking for a different life or a different way of life. So I feel like there'll probably be some...

or changes in tag availability in the next few years, which I don't look forward to, but I feel like for the greater good sometimes it's painful, but man, we...

we have to have, have something done. So, you know, it's still a pleasure, a pleasurable experience again for those kids. Like if, if you take kids out, you know, you want them to have a good time and, and, and have fun hunting. You know, what makes, what makes a good deer hunt for me? Well, I personally, I just want to see a lot of deer. I just want to see does and fawns. I want to see young bucks. I want to see middle-aged bucks and I want to see mature bucks. Um, basically I want a well-balanced herd with the possibility of taking home a mature buck from time to time. Um,

I want to be able to take a kid hunting and keep him or her engaged by showing them a bunch of deer. I want it to be fun. We're competing with all this instant gratification of electronics and all this other stuff. And it's, it's really tough to get kids out there and show them a good time if they're not seeing a lot of deer. So that's for me, that's really what it's about. You know, I, I don't need to, to try to shoot 170 inch deer every fall. Um,

Some people might say, oh, you're just a trophy hunter. But honestly, I just want to see a well-balanced herd. I want to see just a lot of deer. I want to see does and fawns and little bucks, middle-aged bucks and old bucks. I just want to see, I'd like to see the same kind of deer hunting we had when I was a kid. That way this generation can enjoy that same thing I did. We've all seen plenty of gadgets and fads come and go. But here's one product that stood the test of time. Seafoam Motor Treatment.

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Now I want to switch gears a little bit, and this week's Pendleton Whiskey question and answer question is from an Instagram direct message. Now I didn't get the guy's name, but I'll read you the question he sent. I'm taking my kid on an Idaho whitetail hunt in a month.

and have been crushing maps as its new hunting unit for me. Some of the areas I've been eyeballing are clear cuts at timber edges and on state and private timberland. I've not done a mountain whitetail hunt in Idaho before, so I'm assuming they act similar to our Willamette Valley whitetail in Oregon. But if you have any thoughts, aside from that, I'm all ears.

Current plan is to archery, spot, and stock. I'll bring provisions to get in a tree if need be. This tag being new to me, I'm curious to see what kind of hunter numbers I run into. That's a great question. I've actually been getting similar questions a lot on Instagram, Facebook, because folks know I grew up in north central Idaho and have a little bit of insight on the hunting up there. But first off, I'd like to say, you know,

Archery spot and stalk will be kind of like taking a knife to a gunfight. The area, it's rifle season, right? Everybody's going to be running with a rifle. The area has a large number of other hunters using rifles, and they're going to be using ATVs extensively. The area is very roaded.

Um, there's a lot of roads that are open to ATVs. Um, recently there's been some, some closures to some of the roads, but I still feel like you're going to run into a lot of people running their side-by-sides and four wheelers around, whether that's, whether they're supposed to or not. It seems like there's always a bad apple out there. Um, abusing, abusing the, the laws. Um,

But I'd say if you're committed to bow hunting, I would a hundred percent suggest setting up a tree stand or ground blind. Personally, my style of hunting mountain white tails is a lot more mobile than folks who hunt in Eastern States. I'm more of a, I'm more of a get on the ground and hunt them guy than a tree stand guy. I like to cover a lot of country, whether I'm on foot or in four on four wheels, either I'm a pickup or I'm in an ATV, you know, on, on roads that are open. I've,

I really hate running an ATV at that time of year. Well, it's cold and I'm just not into hunting from the truck or the four-wheeler. I really want to get out there and just enjoy the quiet. Once it starts snowing, man, in the deer woods, it can be so quiet. There's no birds chirping. There's no bugs. There's no bees buzzing. It's just very quiet. It's just you and the sounds of like maybe some squirrels or the deer. And I just really love that.

So I just like to cover a lot of country to begin with. I like to look specifically for tracks. I want to look for deer trails. I want to look for rubs and scrapes. Then I dial it in from there.

Ideally, I like to watch an area. I like to watch a place where deer cross, crossing from feeding to security cover. This may give me a 50-yard shot or even a 300 or 400, 500-yard shot, depending on the area. But I like to kind of sit and wait in those kind of places, just because deer, they've got a pretty good eye for people walking around. But

But I will say, I do also love hunting big timber. I like to still hunt big timber. And that's kind of how I cut my teeth as a kid. And what I do is I enter a stand of big timber on a game trail, and then I move really slowly, so slowly that it almost appears that I'm standing in one spot. It might take me an hour to walk 200 yards. It's almost exhausting, honestly.

Um, just because you're moving so slow and you're just standing in one spot, you don't want any perceivable movement from a deer. And if, if you move that slowly, a lot of times you can walk up, you'll, as you move through there, eventually a deer will appear and you'll have the jump on them. They won't see you before you see them. And a lot of times I like to sit down when I get to the thickest cover, um,

Like as, as the forest, as the big open timber kind of starts closing in and I start getting into more fir trees and more brushy areas where deer tend to bed. I like to sit down and then I like to use my grunt call or rattling horns. And then I, I intend on, on,

calling in a deer out of that thick stuff. Cause a lot of times those does will bed up in there. And if there's a, if there's a buck there, that's not on a hot dough and sometimes a bucks, you know, depending on the period of the rep, there'll be a buck in there too bedded. He may not be on a doe, but if you can call into there, I've, I've had it happen several times where a buck will just come either come boiling out of there running, or they'll just,

They'll come so quietly and silently, you'll look up and you'll just see their feet standing there. And then you see a piece and a part of a deer and you're like, oh yeah, there he is. And then you have just enough deer to raise your rifle and put a bullet in them. Now for archery hunting, that would be tough. So that still hunting with an archery, with a bow, I feel like it'd be really tough because just central Idaho, north central Idaho, it's pretty thick cover.

A third way I like to hunt deer is to hunt them kind of like you would elk. I like to get on an old road or a trail that travels through kind of some semi open timber or a grownup clear cut that has lots of nooks and crannies, more of a flat, more flatter kind of country. I'm not talking about steep Canyon lands because if you're look, if you're into that stuff where it's more like Canyon breaks or, or big deep draws and ridges, um,

As you come around the corner on an old road, you round the corner, you look, you can see that whole hillside, which is pretty effective. You can see and you can glass it up and look and see if you can see a deer. But now you're walking. You've got to walk another quarter mile, half mile sometimes before you get to ever see another good sight picture. But I'm talking about kind of more flatter ground where as the ground unfolds as you walk, maybe every...

200 yards, maybe every hundred yards or so you'll see new nooks and crannies. Maybe it's a place they did a select cut of some logging or they did some, uh, maybe a clear cut, you know, 20 years ago, 15, 20 years ago. And there's still some old, old skid trails and logging roads that are exposed. And as you kind of walk your way around a main road or a main trail, you'll see, you'll peer down into these other, um, skid roads or, or,

or old skid trails. And it's a great way to just walk right up on deer. And a lot of times you'll find a doe there that's eating or moving. And if it's November 20th, I'm going to bet there's going to be a buck with her. More times than not, there'll be a buck. If not, you'll know it because she won't be watching her back trail. But if she has a buck with her, she'll be looking behind her nervously because not all does like a buck following them.

And if you see a doe acting like that, if she's looking behind her and then she kind of moves off, have your gun up, have your gun ready. And in that opening, cause that buck's going to follow that same line and you possibly could get a, could get a shot at a really nice deer. Now, another way to,

Just like the folks back East and the Midwest like to hunt. I'm looking for deer in the fringe area, fringe areas and, and the tree, you know, where the trees and thick cover the thin trees and the thick cover kind of, kind of meet. It seems like the deer love traveling that stuff. So, um,

I like to set up to where I can sit and watch a place like that. And if I was to put a tree stand, I might put it up in one of those fringe areas, especially if there was a really good trail going through there with a lot of tracks, especially this time of year, it's a little bit muddy, you can find big buck tracks.

You can find their rubs, you can find their scrapes where they've been traveling. It's a great way to set up. But as far as tree stands go, honestly, by default, I'm just not really a tree stand guy. There's nothing wrong with them. And I'd probably do a lot better if I start using one, but it's just a different style of hunting. But I will say, if you want to hear about how to hunt mountain whitetails from a tree stand, you got to go back and listen to episode 105, where Jason picks Troy Pottinger's brain on hunting mountain whitetails.

Troy is the real deal and literally has shot. He just literally shot a giant, another giant whitetail last week. Uh, get on Facebook, look up Troy Pottinger. It's a, it's a, it's an impressive giant buck and he's got several of those under his belt. Um, so that's a, that's a great deep dive to go into. If you want to listen to more about, um, hunting whitetails as far as a tree stand and maybe even with a bow.

Well, that's a wrap for this week's episode. I figured I'd share my thoughts on a subject that I hold near and dear to my heart, and that's Idaho whitetails. And if you guys have any other questions you'd like answered, just shoot us an email at ctd at phelpsgamecalls.com or call our super secret number, 208-219-7701. Just leave a voicemail and we'll play it on the air and answer it the best we can.

Try to keep that question about three minutes or less because it will cut you off if you go too long. But anyway, good luck out there and we will catch you on the next one. Outdoor adventure won't wait for engine problems. Things like hard starts, rough performance, and lost fuel economy are often caused by fuel gum and varnish buildup. Seafoam can help your engine run better and last longer. Simply pour a can in your gas tank. Hunters and anglers rely on seafoam to keep their engines running the way it should the entire season.

Pick up a can of Seafoam today at your local auto parts store or visit seafoamworks.com to learn more. The only thing better than a successful hunt is celebrating your feet during the after the hunt moment. With a smooth taste made to be enjoyed on the rocks or with your favorite mixer, Pendle and Whiskey is perfect for winding down around the fire or putting your feet up after cleaning your game. If you're looking for the perfect drink to celebrate after a great day hunting,

Make it Pendleton whiskey, the official whiskey of the after the hunt moment. It's not just poured, it's earned. Pendleton Distillers, Lawrenceburg, Indiana. Please drink responsibly. Pendleton is a registered trademark of Pendleton Woolen Mills. I'm sure a lot of you guys remember the old ceremonial hunting tradition of eating the heart.

out of the first animal you kill. Meat from those organs are among the most nutrient-rich foods on the planet. You can get those same benefits your ancestors craved via convenient daily capsules from Heart and Soil. Find out more at heartandsoil.co. And remember, use code MEATEATER for 10% off your purchase.