Ep. 122: Chasing Dreams with Tucker Stanley
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Hey, American history buffs, hunting history buffs, listen up. We're back at it with another volume of our Meat Eaters American History series. In this edition, titled The Mountain Men, 1806 to 1840, we tackle the Rocky Mountain beaver trade and dive into the lives and legends of fellows like Jim Bridger, Jed Smith,

and John Coulter. This small but legendary fraternity of backwoodsmen helped define an era when the West represented not just unmapped territory, but untapped opportunity for those willing to endure some heinous and at times violent conditions.

We explain what started the mountain man era and what ended it. We tell you everything you'd ever want to know about what the mountain men ate, how they hunted and trapped, what gear they carried, what clothes they wore, how they interacted with Native Americans, how 10% of them died violent deaths, and even detailed descriptions of how they performed amputations on the fly. It's as dark and bloody and good as our previous volume about the whitetail deerskin trade

which is titled The Long Hunters, 1761 to 1775. So again, this new Mountain Man edition about the beaver skin trade is available for pre-order now wherever audiobooks are sold. It's called Meat Eaters American History, The Mountain Men, 1806 to 1840 by me, Stephen Rinella.

Welcome back to another episode of Cutting the Distance. Dan here with what I'd call maybe a new buddy, Tucker Stanley. He lives only about 30 minutes from me and we kind of met, what was it, Tucker, in 2020? Yeah, 2020 when I had that wild milk pig. Yeah, your dad was gracious enough. I wish my dad would have been buying you guys points, right, in some of these states or

And then when you graduated, he was going to send you guys on a pretty good elk hunt. So you had enough points to go to some good units, and you were talking to one of our good buddies, Ben Gorman. And I think he came out to my newly built Phelps Game Calls warehouse at that time, and we BS'd with you and Troy. So I first kind of got to meet you in 2020, but I had known of you before then. I wouldn't say rivals, people on that point aren't rivals, but playing in sports, kind of always the Stanley name's pretty...

Pretty prominent in the Lewis County area and kind of knew of you. And then, yeah, I got to know you. And then we've kind of stayed in touch. And shoot, we probably, what, BS once, twice a week about, you know, dream hunts or going on this. Or, hey, did you see how much this tag sold for? And just kind of stay in touch. So how are you doing? Good. I appreciate you having me on. It's been, yeah, it started in 2020 with us. And, yeah, my dad started buying us points back. See, Wyoming started their point system back.

what seven i don't know what max points is now probably 16 17 and so 16 years ago when we were probably eight nine years old and uh we could cash them in whenever we wanted and and uh so i i thought that was when i got you know someone knew a friend that knew a friend that knew you personally and uh that's how we kind of got started and kind of been good friends ever since yeah yeah we uh

Yeah, I think we spent a half hour last night texting back and forth going over Alaska sheep and some of the gear that I think is vital. And we're going to get into that. You got a sheep hunt coming up. But we always kind of jump into these. I don't know if you've listened to the podcast or not, Tucker, but we're going to kind of start with a couple of questions for you. And this question and answer is brought to you by Pendleton Whiskey. So yeah, just I'm curious.

What are you doing this time of year to get ready? I know you're in good shape, you know, a pretty competitive athlete in high school, you know, still like to get after it in the mountains. So not only, you know, from a physical fitness, you know, are you looking at applications? Kind of like what does an off-season, you know, look like for you? Well, yeah, I played college football. So, you know, my physical fitness continued into my mid-20s. Now I'm 31. And so...

it was really important to me to stay in shape, you know, cause you, you know, you work so hard to, to get to shape for, for sports and athletics and stuff. And I just couldn't see myself losing that, you know, and just letting myself go, uh, so to speak. And so working out for me has always been, um, you know, not, not an option. And so I never really, um, I mean, I work out probably five days a week. And so like, as far as like the off season, it doesn't, my, my training plan really doesn't

um, differ. And I, I kind of, I think just being an athlete has kind of helped with the hunting because before when I'd work out, it was, it was to, you know, be a better football player or whatever it was. And now it's like, I gotta be in shape for this hunt. And, um,

It's like my workout, you know, staying in shape to me is really important. And it's not just hunting, but hunting just happens to be my what distracts the mental pain of working out is like, you know, like you're doing this for a hunt and it'll be easier. And it used to be, you know, that you're doing this for football and this is what it takes to be the best. And that's kind of my.

Um, as, as a former athlete, it's kind of my, it's my new goal. You know, it's, it's, it's to be in better shape for hunting season. It used to be to be in better shape for football season. So this time of the year, I, you know, I'm, uh, um, you know, I ride the stationary bike

As much as I can just for the cardio, then I try to lift weights. I don't need to be the strongest man in the world anymore as far as what football took, but I lift weights and that doesn't change whether it's season or off-season for me. It's important for me to stay in shape.

Yeah. So your why went from football to your why is now hunting. And I always joke with people, if it wasn't for hunting, I'd probably be 400 pounds. I, I'm not as motivated as you to work out for other things. It's like, no, if I, if I didn't have to climb the mountain, I'd probably just, I would be that 400 pound guy. But, uh, yeah, I think that's actually how our conversation started last night. You were asking me about, um,

some, if I have a stair climber and I think that kind of kicked off the, the cascade of we were sheep hunting and sharing sheep hunting videos by the time we were, we were done. But no, it's, it's important. And, and you know, I, I'm, I probably get a little lazy November, December, early January, and then right back, you know, now,

um you know eating better getting ready because it is it's it's a year-long commitment or if you do get the two months that i screw up every year like it takes the other seven months to get back to where i was where it's like if it was always like if i'm always looking at like i want to be better today than it was yesterday i'd be a i would be a lot better off it's like i just kind of yo-yo where you're probably in a better you know situation where you're just staying constant um yeah i kind of describe it as like a i it's easier to maintain than it is to like

you know, do like a 75 hard. And I, you know, that's brutal. You know, I see people doing it and it's impressive and, and, you know, I commend them for it. But for me,

you know, I'm not like a strict, strict diet type of guy. I enjoy a, you know, a good beer or, uh, you know, uh, you know, a Pendleton and Coke or whatever it is. And, and I feel like if I just cut that off cold Turkey, it'd be harder for me to do. Or if I just ate salads trying to lose weight, it'd be nearly impossible. And so I just try to maintain and I kind of eat what I want. I don't abuse it, you know, but wait till you're 40 and see if you can, you know,

They used to say, wait till you're 30, but now I'm not 30 and now people are telling me, wait till you're 40. But, um, you know, I just kind of have, and I checked, you know, I've always heard a quote that was, um, what doesn't get measured doesn't get maintained. And so I try to weigh myself, you know, once a week, once every other week. And if it's not in check, then, then, then I crack down on it. Work a little harder. Yep. Um,

You know, you're, I would say you're not in the hunting industry, right. Which is pretty fair to say, but like, I would say you're one of those guys that hunts as much as the rest of us, you know, that, that are in, and I hate the word industry. Like there are people that make their living because of hunting type, you know, products or services or whatever. Um, so what are you doing? Like, what's your, your, you know, this time of year, we're all getting ready for putting in for draws.

like what's your approach on that side right now are you are you applying all over the country are you are you keeping it pretty you know specific to certain states how are you setting up like your future you know hunting trips well just the way the hunting industry is um you know i mean we're western washington where you know the hoof rot video that you guys released was pretty spot on there's it's not like it used to be so i haven't hunted in washington in years um

I, my kind of strategy is, I think eventually what this is all going to come to is for the average Joe blow guy like me, that's not in the industry. Um, you know, you have, if you're like an over the counter, over the counter guy, um, I think you're going to have to play the state game and, you know, you're gonna have to,

apply for Idaho. You have to apply for New Mexico. You have to apply for Colorado. You have to apply for Wyoming, Nevada, all of them, Arizona. And you're not going to be able to go to your same spot that maybe you and your family have hunted for, you know, 15 years. I think those days are kind of coming to an end and it's unfortunate, but, um, you know, with the draw systems, it's hard to rely on a tag every year. And so, um,

I've kind of been relying on Idaho and I know we're going to get into my, my Idaho hunts and stuff, but for the last five years, um, I I've been relying on Idaho for deer and elk. Uh, when we met 2020, I had max points. I cashed those in for Wyoming. So I kind of had to start over there. I think I checked last night cause I applied for my Wyoming stuff last night.

That was, I think I'm at four points again. So I don't expect to draw anything there, but what I'm kind of doing with all that is like, you know, I have four points for Wyoming. Um, I think you could probably get a general unit for four to seven points in that range. You aren't going to get anything, you know, any other quality units yet, but with the point creep and all that stuff, what I'm doing is like, if there's a year where I don't get my Idaho elk tag,

then because those come you know in december you'll know then i'm gonna go you know cash in my four six eight points or whatever i have at that time for like wyoming other than that year i'll go to wyoming but i kind of just threw like a my entry last night was like kind of for a hail mary wyoming tag that i i probably won't get but the reason i did that was because i've already got a while or an idaho tag and so i have you know three general points or whatever for montana

I don't have very many points for Colorado cause I was so late to the game. I played football until I was like 24. I went over to Europe and played. So I, I got started real, real late. Luckily I had the, my dad started a little up Wyoming early, but, um, New Mexico is a random draw, you know? So I put him for that every year. Um, you know, but that's kind of what I do is, is, um, I think you're going to have to like play the state game and try to get Arizona this year. If you don't draw Idaho or Wyoming or vice versa and just, yeah. Yeah. And, and,

Yeah, like similar to you, I've already got an Idaho archery tag. So it's like if I want to, I can just spend my time in Idaho and it's a pretty good unit. And so I'm my strategy now across all these other states is, yeah, I can draw, you know, I can draw Utah if I want. I can draw Colorado if I want. Yeah. You know, Nevada is all. But in any of those that I've even got a chance to get to take, I don't want it unless it's a like.

you know top tier hunt and to be honest it's even gonna get harder because i'm probably going rifle because i don't want to like mess up september yeah yeah it could be better but it's like oh if i get a premium rifle tag because i'm an opportunist i don't need to go do it with a bow or muzzle like i don't just give me a good tag a good hunt and i'm i'm happy but like i don't want to mess up archery so i'm really going to be like really kind of you know shooting for the stars with with premium rifle tags in all those states which have really really low odds but

um like i say it's more of just build a point and then we'll see if i don't get the idaho um or in the future if i want to cash in um you know colorado with their preference point system or you know utah with their modified preference point we'll we'll go that way um so yeah you also kind of get into like why or i mean like new mexico like i put in for their one of their top units just because it's such a far drive for us and so like yeah

You know, it's such a commitment to drive 24 hours or 22 hours or wherever you're going in New Mexico. So, you know, I probably won't draw in New Mexico, but I put in for my strategically put in for one of their better units because like if I'm going to drive down there, I want it to be for a pretty good unit. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. And that's, everybody's got their own, you know, strategy and we've talked about it a lot on here before. Like I look at Utah and Arizona, you know, I'm, I'm in double digits in both of those, but it's like, I probably won't draw for another 10. Like it's going to be maybe my going out party when I'm too old to hunt, you know, some of the harder areas. And then the, the Wyoming's Montana's Idaho's Nevada's kind of in that middle. It's still pretty hard to draw. Like I'm looking at those as like maybe my, my in between fits between, you know, in Idaho or Montana right now where you can draw, you know,

you know, fairly, fairly easily or get a tag in those places. So yeah, there's lots of, lots of strategies. So you're getting in shape, you're planning hunts, um, seems to be what kind of, you know, any, any diehard or serious hunters kind of thinking about right now is, you know, those two things, you know, staying in shape, um, and getting ready to just find your opportunity, right? Um, where are you going to go hunt? Where are you going to have to be in shape for what's that going to look like? Um, and then, uh,

My second question for you, and it's just, this is actually out of my own curiosity because I don't know what influence. So, you know, we were, we use some brands, we partner with some brands, we have contracts with brands, but as a guy that, that hunts as much as we do outside of the industry, you

um, like what influences your gear choices? Like, you know, I, I've been working with Kofaru since 2012. So it's like, I use their pack. You know, we were talking last night about what you need in a sheet pack. And I'm like, well, I wonder, I wonder why the heck do you use that? Or, you know, how do you guys get to those decisions? What, you know, is your, do you have a favorite, you know, hunting influencer that you listen to? Do you just ask lots of questions? You try them on, like, how do you get to what pack or what boots or what camo or, um, you get to.

I always joke that if someone pays me to wear it, I'll put it on my back, but I'm not in the industry. So, you know, it's, it's, I don't have a big social media following. I'm, I'm just a, a, a hunter that likes the sport of it. And so I, you know, no, but no sponsors. It's just, it's just what I want. And you know, which can probably relate to a lot of your listeners. And so like how I choose my gear is I,

hunting gear has just gotten so expensive. And, um, you know, you name off, you know, all the big brands and the, and the stone glaciers, the, you know, uh, like Kuyu, the first lights, the Sitka's all those things. And it's almost like when you start building an outfit, you can't be the guy that's mixed and matched. And so if you, if you already, you know, it's like, I remember when I first got, you know, some expensive hunt gear that, you know, you go from the

you know, cheaper Walmart stuff to like some good quality gear when the industry really changed. You know, I don't know. It seems like it really changed like 10 years ago or so. Yeah. It seems like Sitka kind of led that big, you know, cause it was, it was a lot of cheaper stuff and then Sitka came through and then First Light and QU came through and it was like, all right, now we got to all buy expensive, expensive gear. Like you can't do it in the cheap stuff anymore. That's yeah. And it was like, if you were Sitka, you were balling. And, and,

And so as, as I like got more serious about hunting, because like I said, like football, you know, it's played in the fall. And so I couldn't hunt as much as I wanted to until I was probably 25. And so it was like a caged animal. As soon as I could start to hunt, I just became obsessed with it. And, um, so like my gear, you know, you start buying, cause it's, you can buy a $500 coat, no problem nowadays. And so as far as like my gear, I, I, uh,

I don't really have anyone that like influences me. It's more so just like building an outfit. Like if I have those pants, I'm going to buy that coat. And as far as my pack goes, you know, I watch a lot of the YouTube stuff, you know, and, and not that they influence me, but like,

I just, if you see enough guys running something similar or trusting in it, it gives you some confidence in that. It gives you confidence, but also, you know, I, I believe that like, there is something we said about like, you get what you pay for, um, you know, whether that's, but there's some things that are just like outrageously priced that, you know, there's better options for it. But, um,

it's kind of like a Ford Chevy or Dodge, you know, you have people that are argue all of them, but I really don't think a guy would go wrong if he chose either one of them. Yeah. And so like, that's, that's like, like my pack and stuff. It's like some, some of the packs, they, they, they really, the only difference is like the compartments that they have or something like that, that maybe one guy might like over the other. It,

I think the quality is there on, on most of them at the upper end level. Yeah. Um, it's just like what you, what, what feels nice to you and what do you pack, you know, what are you used to packing and, and does it have room for all your stuff? A guy's going to like that brand, you know? Yeah. Yeah. And that,

I've been fortunate, you know, I loyal to Kifaru and been using them for a long time, but I've tried on, you know, the initial ascent, the stone glacier, the XO. And it's like, you could probably get by on all of these. It's just, you know, little tweaks in the suspension, different padding, different, you know, pack layouts and,

Um, yeah, I think, you know, when you get the packs or, you know, boots are a little more like specific to the person, right? You got to find a, a boot that has a last that fits your foot and has all the qualities you want for that specific hunt, you know, but, um, I was just kind of curious, like, you know, are you, are you like scanning the forums? Like, you know, do you search for the certain pack you want to buy? Like, are there any bad reviews? Are there any good ones? Cause I do want that on some of the hunting stuff that I might not have a connection for.

or a lot of knowledge, like, you know, what do, what do people think about this or that? Um, and, and just kind of see like, is there any major failures or people complaining about it? They like it. And then, you know, go ahead and make my purchase. If, if you watch like enough, um, like that, even the hunting channels have come a long way since, you know, 15 years ago and not, not like YouTube and the accessibility of, of, uh, people and what they're using and stuff.

So like for boots, you know, for example, I went into a sporting goods store here locally and I went in to buy Ken tracks, um, quite frankly. And, and that, that was what everyone was wearing. They were the $500 boots. And if you were a real hunter, that's, it's like the Sitka, you know, it was like, that's what you were wearing. Yeah. And I went in there and I tried them on and then I tried on the crispies and I haven't, I haven't gone back from crispy since, you know? And so,

Nobody influences me to do it. I tried on both boots and walked out with the crispies and those just blew out this last year. And I bought the same pair again. And so it's just kind of trial and error. Now the problem is I have a ton of hunting gear and if I really like a pack, I'll buy the same pack again. And then there's a pack that I got that I bought and I don't really use it that much. And so I won't buy it again

But that's just kind of how I pick my gear. And I have a lot of hunting gear now because you buy a little bit each year. And now that I've been, you know, taking it serious for six or seven years now, it starts to accumulate.

Hey, American history buffs, hunting history buffs, listen up. We're back at it with another volume of our Meat Eaters American History Series. In this edition, titled The Mountain Men, 1806 to 1840, we tackle the Rocky Mountain beaver trade and dive into the lives and legends of fellows like Jim Bridger, Jed Smith, and

and John Coulter. This small but legendary fraternity of backwoodsmen helped define an era when the West represented not just unmapped territory, but untapped opportunity for those willing to endure some heinous and at times violent conditions.

We explain what started the mountain man era and what ended it. We tell you everything you'd ever want to know about what the mountain men ate, how they hunted and trapped, what gear they carried, what clothes they wore, how they interacted with Native Americans, how 10% of them died violent deaths, and even detailed descriptions of how they performed amputations on the fly. It's as dark and bloody and good as our previous volume about the whitetail deerskin trade

which is titled The Long Hunters, 1761 to 1775. So again, this new Mountain Man edition about the beaver skin trade is available for pre-order now wherever audiobooks are sold. It's called Meat Eaters American History, The Mountain Men, 1806 to 1840 by me, Stephen Rinella.

I appreciate that, Tucker. Once again, you have questions for myself or our guests, feel free to email them to us at ctd at phelpsgamecalls.com or send us a social...

media message and we'll do our best to get them on here. Now we're going to jump into kind of the meat and potatoes of the podcast. And you've mentioned, you know, he played college football, played overseas a little bit. And so you've only been hunting for six years, but you've got some pretty...

some pretty decent critters in those years. I think that was one or the other. I talked to you and then I think, was it a year or two later, you killed a big Canada buck and you were trying to figure out how to get the taxidermist who I'd recommend and hooked you up with Roundy and brought your deer home from the Western hunt. So let's jump right into that on how...

you guys listening on audio can't see it, but just to the left, the, um, Tucker's head is, is a, the picture of this giant buck, um, a 203 inch Alberta mule deer. Go ahead and kind of tell the, just tell the story on how that one evolved and, and, uh, kind of, you know, there's a little humor involved on a, on a hunt that maybe didn't have that kind of buck as the expectation. Yeah. I would love to say that I've tracked it for five years and I had 40 trail cameras up, but that wasn't the case. Um,

Um, you know, I'm, I'm okay admitting that it was, it was right guy, right spot, right time, um, type of deal. But what happened with that hunt was I got a call from a local guy and they were kind of, I'm not going to say scrambling, but they were looking for three archery hunters for this outfitter. And, um,

um it was like a private land um not high fenced but it was like a private land outfitter that have thousands and thousands of acres up in alberta and they had three archery tags so this is 2021 and i get this call and it was like uh hey you're an archery hunter do you want to uh go to alberta this year and i was like yeah you know what what's that consist of and he goes well um

here's what's going on is you got to get the covid vaccine to go like that was when the borders were closed and it was vaccine mandatory and um at the time you know i hadn't i hadn't got it and um you know that that was basically like the the stipulations across the border and so the other 300s that usually go that take that tag they refuse to get the vaccine so um

You know, I started seeing pictures of these bucks. I kind of joke, but, and I'm like, how am I getting vaccine for those? And so I ended up getting the vaccine and, you know, I have no problem admitting that because it, you know, I, I, I think I did well with the deer that I got. I was rewarded.

Um, and, and so I got the vaccine and I went on the trip and it was the first hunt that I'd ever paid an outfitter for. And so to me, it was like a big deal. And, you know, it wasn't a real expensive hunt, you know, for the hunting world. You know, I see, you know, that sheep hunt and in New Mexico just sold for 1.3 million. I mean, you're, you're talking like a really, really low budget hunt for the quality of animal I got. And, um,

So I committed to it and I was like, man, you know, I don't want to go empty handed. It kind of adds an element when you're paying for a hunt.

to your standards. You know, when you go on an OTC hunt, it's, it's just like, you're having a good time. There's no pressure. You might get a bull, you might not. And you know, it's, it's, it's more relaxed where some of these hunts it's, you know, even like my sheep hunt coming up, it's like, man, I don't want to come home empty handed. You want to get the most out of it. And that's how I felt on that, felt on that hunt. And it was my first like big hunt. And anyway, the, basically the story was, is, is I missed a buck.

um kind of a jump shot type of of action i missed him and i was just sick to my stomach this sounded like day three and it was a seven day hunt and so i remember texting my wife like i don't know if i'm gonna get one you know because it's archery it's not guaranteed you know there's no baiting um and here we are spent this money and i was starting to get kind of nervous on day four and so day four rolls around in the evening

And I'm sitting in the tree stand and like right at dark, I heard just like a screeching noise, like a fence, like something was crossing the fence. And so I kind of got ready, got, got one, you know, my arrow ready. And that buck, you know, um, that, that I killed came in and, um, I shot him 20, 23 yards broadside. Um, and what's funny is, is a local guy here that was also there. He was one of the three tags. Uh, he, he was, he had shot a buck early that day.

And so I remember him coming back to lunch and we were just like looking at his buck and we were all like, dang, you know, I was thinking to myself, I would take that every, you know, all day, every day. And so I, I, I head back, it got dark and I head back, I shot the buck and then, um, you know, they picked me up.

And I said, I got one. And they're like, is it a big one? And I was like, it's about like, you know, the other guys, you know, I mean, I don't know. I didn't stare at too long. I was more trying to execute the shot. So he's like, all right, let's go back. We'll eat dinner. Then we'll go look for him.

So we go back, eat dinner and, and I wasn't even nervous. I like, wasn't thinking about it at all. And, uh, you know, like they were all chirping like, Oh, it sounds like Tucker got one about the size of, you know, of a Martin's and, and, uh, let's go look for him. So we all headed back out and side by sides to go grab flashlights. And we went to the spot of the kill. There's no blood. I mean, it was like, started making me nervous and we finally find some blood and it wasn't a very long track of the buck probably went, I don't know, 50, 60 yards. And, uh,

Anyway, we walked up on that and I remember the guide was like, he's just like, Tucker, you might want to come take a look at this thing. And I walk over to him because we're kind of grid searching at that point.

And, you know, I was like, oh man, I'm like happy with that, you know, cause I'm taking into consideration like how much this costs me and the commitment. And I'm like, I'm really happy with that. You know, that's a nice buck. I didn't like the longer we were there and the more like the gutting it and throwing it in the back, it started to like the way they were reacting. Cause he, he, he likes to like kind of downplay it. The guy does. It sounds like you downplayed it to start with.

well i didn't i didn't know you know like i was like oh yeah that's a shooter well i'm sure they thought you were messing with them like oh yeah i shot one like martin's and then he's like oh i thought you said it was the same size of martin's i was like i you know i didn't pay that much attention 200 inch deer and um so the more we started like taking pictures of it it was like oh you know this is like that's a legit fuck and and then we got it into the shop and stuff and started skinning it and they're like that that that's like a

an exceptional deer and you know they have 30 head mounts on their on their shop wall and um to my knowledge it was the biggest buck that they've ever killed there and you know happened to be with a bow happened to the one year that i went i got asked late because the whole covet thing it was just kind of it just all happened yeah they happened to you know you happen to be in that tree stand and not in a different one yeah yeah if i remember right how how far away was a buck when you first spotted it

It wasn't like a hundred, a hundred. Yeah. He was probably coming in at about a hundred because I heard that fence. And so I was on alert and he was probably 130, 150 yards. I was watching him and he, you know, he turned his head and his frame towards me. He's walking at me and I've never killed anything that big. So it was like, you know, and also you, like I said, with these, these hunts is like, is it big enough for the price you're paying? That, that weighs into my mind. And so it was like, okay, that's a shooter.

And so like I got ready and I, and I was, I quit looking at the horns. It was like, I'm just trying to execute this shot. And so, you know, I seen him come in and, and it all happened, but it's almost, I'm like thankful that I didn't have time to like think about how big he was. Did, did you know at the point you see him at 150, he was going to come your way or was there a lot of variability? He could have picked a different route or was it pretty like, did it was coming down like a fence line toward there? Was there like a reason he was going to walk by you?

Or did you like, cause I, I'm the guy that sits in the tree. Like, Oh, I shouldn't even get my bow out. Cause he's got 150 yards to cover. He's probably going to go a different way. Like I'm the most negative guy until it happens. Like I'm never going to get a shot anyways. Like it's cool to look at them. And yeah, I, I mean, it was a meadow. And so I, you know, I had my ranges. Um, it's hard to get ranges when it's just like a grassy patch. It's nice when you have trees that you can, you can hit, you know, with your range finder. So, um,

You know, on day four, I'm like, you know, if he crosses through the middle, he's going to be at 74. If he crosses through right here, he's going to be at, you know, you know, 54. And, you know, ideally he's 50 and in. And so all those things were going through my mind in any any, you know, kind of hooked and came towards me. And that's when I knew that, like, I was going to get a shot off because he was within any range that he came through at that point. He was within range. Yeah, gotcha.

gotcha no it's a it was a great buck i got the you know i don't did i take him to utah or just picked him up but got the hold him and see him i think you took him to utah and then rounding the next year or yeah or something yeah some yeah a giant buck you know 203 inch typical um just a just a stud of a buck um yeah like i said that uh

for, for six years. Um, and then you go, you know, 170 inch Idaho white tail, what two years ago or last, last, it would have been two hunting seasons ago, but last year, 2023 season, um, you kill 170 inch Idaho white tail, which just, you know, uh, a great buck. Um,

how's that hunt go for you? Like, what's your strategy on that? You know, talking to Dirk, who's my cohost here, you know, mature Idaho whitetails seem to be kind of making a comeback, but they're kind of on a pretty big downtrend. Um, you know, Dirk would cuss at you and call you an apple maggot and everything else. But, uh, no, we've got to have dinner with Dirk, you know, before and he likes you, but it, you know, it's like the, the whitetails coming back, but like, what's your approach to that whitetail hunt? Like, how do you go about it? Um, you know, without the ability to scout, um,

um any of that have you what was your strategy on and going it sounds like your dad had a chance this past year on a good one that didn't you know i know you mentioned you know you wish you were the trigger guy but sometimes you got to let the old the old men uh you know have a chance but what's what's that idaho hunt look like how do you strategize and plan for that yeah so like the idaho thing um what happened was a couple three three years ago um

we, we went up, we, you know, the whole Idaho system, I was online trying to get a tag for, for elk. It didn't happen. Um, I had a buddy that was like, Hey, we can go to this deer unit. Um, I was like, sure. You know? And, uh, we drove around the first day. We knew some people that had local people here that were also over there. And we, you know, we're just kind of getting a little bit of Intel, not nobody's spots, but just like, you know, there's deer everywhere, but where do you guys suggest? And we're getting some pointers from people and

We drove around the first day, a lot of snow. And we never seen a single deer the first day. And just driving around, you know, you know, I don't know. I didn't know how to hunt those white tail. I'd never killed, killed one over there. And so never seen a deer. And so then we got pictures of a buck that was killed there. And it was massive. I mean, is that one I sent you last night? Yeah, that that one. I was like, you know, we aren't even seeing a doe. How you know what? What are they doing? And so they said, well, he was sitting on a trail.

And I was like sitting on a trail, like what, you know? And, and, and so it really stuck with me because I'm open to learning and I've never done it. And so the next day we were driving around in a new area, a lot of snow, which kind of played a factor in this. And my buddy, uh,

you know, we were just driving around a logging road and he's like, Oh, hold on. You know, one of those deals where it was like a, a buck that was standing up on the hill and he ended up getting a buck that day. And I was like, gosh, there must be more deer over here. Cause it was the first success we'd had. And so I started looking like in the timber as we were driving back with his buck in the, in the bed of the truck. And, and I seen this, this trail come off the hillside and it had, you know, it was two or three feet wide with just tracks, uh, in the snow. Luckily there was no, and, um,

I remember thinking like, I'm going to come back in the same area tomorrow after we get this thing taken care of. So we took it back and it happened to me and my buddy, he was, he was like cutting his deer down the back, you know, doing that method. Well, like the skin was real like frozen and his knife slipped and he like slid his leg open. And I had to take him to the emergency room that night. So the next day he couldn't hunt with me. And so I'm like, Hey, don't worry about it. No problem. I'll be fine. You know? And so I went out on my own and, and I went back to that. I marked it, you know, on my Onyx and I went back to that same exact trail and

And I walked up it and I was like, well, this is what they said to do, you know, was like sit on this trail. So I sat there and luckily it didn't take very long, like 30 minutes. Here come like a little doe, you know, right over my shoulder, like 15 yards. Can I ask a quick question? Like, are you in the timber or do you have some, like, are you above tree lining? Could you have some visibility or is it a clear cut? Are you just like in the timber on this trail? So my first, um,

you know, time up this trail, I was in the brush and I realized, I didn't know that there was open timber around me. And so when I seen this doe coming over my shoulder at, you know, 10 yards or so, I was thinking to myself, like, you know, I can't believe this worked, you know, like there's a deer right there. Um, and I could kill it if I wanted to, it's, it's doe or buck over there. But, um, so, you know, luckily it came pretty quick cause I wouldn't have sat there all day and just got skunked.

Um, so it was pretty thick and I, and I didn't see her till about 10 yards. And so I sat there for a little bit longer and it wasn't another 20 minutes. Here come another deer, same trail. And so I was like, maybe I'm like sitting in the trail here because it was same trail, same spot, 10 yards away from me. It was a little Forkinghorn.

And I was like, I got to get out of the spot, you know? So I, I walked up the trail a little bit and midday noon and I walk up the trail probably 67 yards and it started to really open up. And I was like, this is a good spot. You know, it's kind of a downhill slope to a bench. And as I've kind of learned about this whitetail stuff, those deer like to travel on those benches because it's flatter and

And then they're looking for the saddles. I've learned a lot about it and I've really studied it because, you know, it's kind of my, my hobby and my passion now, but it's kind of a good spot because it, you know, it's, it's a down to a bench. So I sit at the top of that slope and I look down at that bench and I sat there the rest of the day. And I think I seen, you know, I don't know, 11, 12 deer total. And I should have got a buck. Um, I missed the opportunity.

So I get back to the, where we were staying at the cabin and we're all sharing hunting stories and the guys is like, what'd you guys see? You know? And they're all like, Oh, we seen seven today. And I was, I was thinking to myself like, well, I seen 12 just sitting in one spot and you know, they're like, Oh, where were you at? You know? And, and, and so I was like, well, maybe this is working. So I went back the next day and I, I hate to admit it, but I missed a really nice buck that year and it just made me so sick to my stomach. And yeah,

It was like the last day and it was a, it was a good buck. I'm not huge, but just a nice buck. And I kind of pouted over it. Um, I drew blood. Um, not very much though. It was, it was just like a little spritz of blood and,

I kind of pouted over it and I was like, let's just go home because my buddy had already tagged out, stabbed himself in the leg and we headed home. Well, it just ate at me for the rest of the year. And so I went back this last year and I was like, I'm committing to, you know, how many ever days I hunt, whether it's seven or 10 or whatever I have daylight to dark under that one tree. And I'm going to sit there and that's, I feel that's what it takes. And, and some days I see zero and some days I see 22, 25,

Um, and I killed that buck on day. It was funny. My dad was with me that year. And, uh,

he, he's not as patient as I am. He left on day probably four, but day five, um, 7.00 AM. I, um, and my dad texted me cause he was sitting laying in bed, you know, at home and he goes anything. And I texted him back. Nope, nothing. And I looked up and there's that 170 inch buck down there on that bench, just strolling through. And I, and I shot him and you know, these shots are 70 yards. That's why I was so sick over that one. I miss it. It was a layup, but

Um, that's how I killed that one. And then this year we, we missed an opportunity on one. Um, but I really think it's the consistency of sitting there and not giving up on it. And, you know, you could see one deer, like that was that buck, that 170 inch buck. That was the one deer I'd seen in three days. Um, my dad, he, he, he came out in the middle of the day, he was leaving and we went and drove around and we seen this really nice buck on a tailgate. And I was like, geez, look at that buck. You know, we pulled in, we're kind of just talking to the guy.

And, uh, he said he just walked in the woods and rattled. And five minutes later, this buck stuck his head out behind the tree. And I was thinking like, that's all it takes. You know, here I am sitting under this tree for 24 hours. And, uh, you might start some rattling, you know, in the future, you know, I've, I've rattled. Um, it's just never, it's never worked. And, um, not to say that it won't work, but I've never successfully had one just come and do that, you know? And so, uh,

I was like, what do you think? You know, like, am I crazy for sitting under this? I haven't seen a deer in two days. And he goes, you know, that spot's as good as any other. And so, you know,

um he's like it's up you know 50 50 probably and so i said well i'm going to commit to it and the next day is when i killed that buck gotcha yeah um do you feel the days you you see zero it's just not a good day or is there potential the wind's not is the wind pretty good in this spot that you can sit every day or do you have to play the wind and maybe not go in there a day or two or you know if you were in a tree stand would you not be able to see under the trees like is there a you think there's a way to make it better or you just kind of play it there every day and and

you know, the wind's marginal or how do you, how does that work out? I've thought a lot about this. I've thought about bringing on blind. Cause I, I mean, I've, I just literally took a dirt spot under a tree and made a little seat for myself. And, um, I've thought about like what a, one of those like blinds work. Um,

The reason I haven't done that is because I don't have the time to go over there and set this up like three weeks early, you know, and kind of get the deer used to it. And I don't want to waste a year and put up this blind and then, you know, just bring your scent in there. Then like you not see a deer for the first three days and it's like, well, yeah, you brought this brand new blind in that they aren't going to want to walk by. So there's probably better method to do it. If a guy had more time, as far as not seeing the deer on a day-to-day basis, um,

Part of me thinks this could be wind, but also the deer come from every angle. I had a one-horned or a one-antlered buck come in behind me this last year, and he was 10 yards behind me. He blew at me. He must have seen my shoulder or something behind the tree, but I turned around, and there he was sitting at 10 yards, and he ran off. I couldn't get a shot at him. I probably would have. It was one of the last days, but...

They come in from every angle. It's hard to say the wind because if it's blowing one way, then they might be coming in from that direction that day. If it's blowing the other way, you might see more coming from that direction. It's not like a consistent movement. Everything comes from one direction and swipes through it. They're able to come from everywhere and that's how it works. It's more so like I know what trails they're going to be on.

You know, I don't know which way they're going to be going, but I have a good idea what trails are going to be on. Gotcha. Gotcha. Yeah. The stud sounds like your dad had a chance at a good one. And, uh, you know, I've been, I've only been white tail hunting in Kansas, which is more trees tree stand. And I haven't had to figure a lot of it out, but like some of that stuff starts to go through my head. Cause there'll be days where you're in the best spot on the place and you'll have lots of deer, but they're catching your wind, even when you're in a 20 foot tall tree stand. Um, yeah.

So as I want to expand and learn about these whitetails, it always makes me wonder, the days you don't see anything, are they winding you before they get there? Or is it just the day that there's not good movement? Or they're not in the area? It always makes you wonder why and how come certain days you can see 20 and some days you'll see zero.

I've wondered that too. And I've thought about, you know, what I'm doing is no different than like, you know, the Kansas type of style of hunting. You know, they're just sitting in trees and I think their deer population is a lot more than, you know, a lot better, but that's, it's the same concept. And, you know, you do, you can't hunt mule deer the same hunt, the same way you hunt whitetail and, and,

You know, you got to hunt black tail different than how you hunt, um, you know, mule deer and white tail. And so I, I think the best strategy with white tail is a waiting game. Um, they're so flighty. They, um, you know, I, so I sit in this open timber where I can see 70 to a hundred yards and that you just catch them cruising and, um,

You know, I've had days where I've seen 24 and I've had days where I've seen zero, but it takes a lot of discipline to sit there day in, day out. And because all it takes is one. And so-

I think that that's a good strategy if a guy has the patience. Yeah. And one thing we haven't even touched on this conversation is my own belief is, you know, we see, you get to see on social media, you know, maybe thousands of people go to Idaho and shoot bucks out of clear cuts. They're killing small bucks. I honestly believe to kill the bigger bucks like you guys are seeing or have chances at tucking in the timber and being away from, you know, even though these bucks are rut, they're not necessarily completely dumb yet.

you're going to get your chance at your bigger bucks inside of a, of a patch of timber or a brush that, that, that buck just feels more comfortable, you know, being in. Well, that's where my spot, the way I kind of feel about it is,

It's an all day hunt. You know, I mean, if you're hunting clear cuts, typically it's like, you know, we got to be there right at first light. We got to be there right at last light. You know, the best chance for him to move is or come out and feed is, you know, right before dark or, or, you know, and how I feel sitting in the timber is this is where they live their day to day life. And so, um,

You know, it kind of makes mentally I kind of, you know, trick myself into believing that it could happen at any time. And especially during the rut, you know, if you get a hot dough, that buck doesn't care what time the day is. He's going to follow her wherever she goes. And I've had beer, you know, come and, you know, lay down.

20 yards from me just bed down and that tells me that i'm in their bedroom and uh you know when you feel like you're in their bedroom it doesn't feel necessarily like a you know like a morning hunt or um you know like all your eggs are in the morning and then like i don't go back for lunch i sit there all day and the reason is is because you know like like a nice buck comes strolling through at noon there's no reason you know it's not like they crawl into a hole they

And there's not a lot of clear cuts around there. So they got to be somewhere. And so if you just sit there and, you know, I bring a little sandwich and just try to stay quiet. And, you know, that's that's what I usually do, where if you're hunting clear cuts, it's more like a morning and a night time. And so, yeah, yeah, gotcha. Well, thanks for sharing kind of that whitetail tactic and how you approach it.

So I knew who you were. We had already talked in 2020, but I get a message from Dirk and John, who happen to be hunting the same unit as you in 2021 or 22, I believe. Elk.

And they messaged me. They're like, once again, Dirk, hey, who's this Apple maggot? Do you know who this guy is? Well, you also, we'll get into this in a little bit. You do real estate, but you also do some, I'll call it driveway grading. I don't know if you want to put a different spin on it. You rehabilitate roads, driveways is another business. And I believe your TRS logo was on the side of your truck or something that they let me know. They're like, who is this? Well, at first it didn't like,

catch on so i google search your name i'm like oh that's tucker like if you see him you know flip him crap and uh you guys happen to be hunting the same same area and elk but what i want to get to on this is you've hunted it you hunted it for a couple years right and then right now um

you know, I had been in the area before and, and gave you a, uh, just a recommendation. Hey, you know, you were in elk, you had chances, you've seen good elk, but you had, had you ever put it all together yet on that hunt? And that was pretty early. Um, I got, I, I remember I texted you and I said, what do you, what do you know about this unit? And you're just, you sent me a screenshot of your calendar, which was to apply to that unit. So I knew I was on the right track. Um, and, uh,

My, my wife's uncle, you know, he's, he's, um, getting older now, 70 or in his sixties. Anyway, he, he kind of put me in that direction. He said he had hunted 20 years ago for spike.

And so that's kind of how I ended up there. And then when I talked to you about it, you kind of reaffirmed my questions about it. So I found myself there and just like anywhere, you're just going into it blind. In fact, I took my wife, Madison, the first year I went and she probably doesn't like to dive into the canyons as much as I do. And so...

um, I, I probably didn't hunt as hard as I, I, I should have to get a elk out of an OTC unit. It's so competitive everywhere you go. And I didn't, I didn't get a bull that year. Then the next year I actually drew, um, I actually drew, there's a quality rifle tag. Um,

and so I, I've had success in the unit and I, I'm a firm believer that there's elk there. Um, you just gotta, you know, learn it and keep going back and trying new things. And, and, uh, so I, I, I kind of bounce around in the unit, you know, I don't necessarily stay in one spot. Yeah. And we, we talked and then I had went and hunted it finally. Um,

And then you went back and I'm like, hey, this is a general area. Maybe not as busy, maybe as busy as where... That was one thing we talked about your old spot is there was a lot of traffic around both Outfitter and...

diy type guys and um but what i i don't want to take any credit for this we just kind of threw in an area and you went and checked it out and there were elk there and then you kind of spun off of that right you felt some pressure you talked to it and this is another great tidbit of information i believe you talked to somebody right and they had made mention of a different spot and so you kind of spun off of the area yeah and um kind of give us that little rundown on how you

how you went from talking to that guy how you kind of cased the area and kind of figured out your plan set some cameras left and then came back yeah so i i now you know like on year five i've been to a lot of the the you know the unit and um you know for the most part us hunters are are good people you know i mean um you know like when i left last year i met some guys from minnesota and and uh

you know, I was leaving empty handed and I was like, Hey, there was a bull, you know, in that drainage. I, I couldn't get on him, but have Adam, you know, and, uh,

I kind of appreciate that with with us hunters, because I appreciate the same intel myself. You know, if I was just rolling because it's a month long hunt. So if I was just rolling in on day 15 and they're just leaving and, you know, and so I've kind of, you know, I meet people. I'm a talker. I'm in sales. And it kind of just led to like like a guy that was in the same situation I was.

where he's like, I can't hunt it this year. And he was just checking cameras. And, and, uh, he's like, you know, try this spot, this spot and this spot gave me, you know, weeks worth of Intel. And I, I mean, I was already camped there. It wasn't like, Hey, you know, head up the highway, turn this way. I mean, I was already there. And, um, anyway, super great guy. And, um, you know, I, I was appreciative of that. And so I got to try these different spots and,

there's elk and all there's elk all over. It's just a matter of making it come together with a bow. And, um, I left empty handed and I kind of, I had some opportunity, but I kind of blamed it a little bit on early. I went early in the season thinking maybe if I would go early in the season, there'll be less people, less bugles. Um,

but I would almost rather have less people than, than, you know, more talk. I kind of figured, well, I mean, I, there'd be days where I wouldn't even hear a bugle and that's real tough of the bow. And so, um, I went home and I got, you know, that season opens like the 30th of August or whatever it is. And, you know, so here I am, I'd been there for a week, nine days or whatever it was. And,

I come home and it's like September 7th, you know, and here I'm sitting on this Idaho elk tag and it's September 7th and I have, you know, 25 more days left of the month. And it's like, gosh, I just can't sit here on this elk tag that's burning a hole in my pocket. And so with my work schedule, I kind of, I kind of shifted and made room for another five days and I headed over there and I killed a bull on day two. Yeah. And that ended up being about a three 20 ish bull if they were on the big side.

yeah he was a funky horn bull he he had a stunted growth on on his left side but if you were to double his other side he would have been in like a 320 hole and and on that one you would in that new area went and explored do you you found a wallow that that they were hitting or using very regularly and then did you set a camera on that before you left

No, I don't have a camera on that one. Okay. A different one. Yeah. I have a different, a different spot that I have cameras on. I don't have a ton of cameras. Um, quite frankly, I put some in my whitetail spot. Um, I put more up this year. Um, I, I just kind of like to, you know, I see these YouTube guys and they have history with these animals and, you know, it's like, it kind of like, I kind of want that. And it'd be nice to see a three 50 bull in there and be like, Oh, I'm after him. He's in here somewhere. But I, you

you know, being in Washington and, you know, and, and being 15 hours away from all this stuff and work, it's hard to, it's hard to go over and check them and change batteries and keep up on them. Yep. Yep. For sure.

Um, yeah, so that was, uh, I mean, the moral of that story, you know, is, is don't be afraid to go check out new areas, you know, cause this was in a completely different area, you know, maybe an hour or two from where you were, you started hunting area and found some success. And just by talking to you about that hunt, I think you're going to probably continue to find success in there. Um,

um you know the way you made it sound and and you know as many elk are in there so you know find a spot same similar as your whitetail spot that just kind of work so let's get into some of the exciting stuff kind of what's your future plans i know you know you and then we've got a mutual friend justin um that we we kind of talk about our dream hunts you know because you guys i would say are real similar to me like that you know that alaska thing kind of really just

you know, turns our gears and then we're trying to figure out how to get up there, but everything seems to be so dang expensive and you got to have a guide or an outfitter. You're going to Canada. I went to Alaska. Um, you've got your sheep hunt this year. Yep. Yep. Um, so you're going to Canada for a doll sheep slash caribou hunt. I'm sure sheep is major priority. Number one in caribou are going to play second fiddle, um, to that you're going up there with Lancaster. So like, what else is like, how did you go about that? How did you like,

you know, when I planned, I just went from one guy I knew that hunted with my outfitter, booked it. Like, how did you, I mean, Lancaster is probably a little more popular, a little more well-known than the outfitter I chose in Alaska, but like, how did you come to the conclusion? Like, that's who you wanted to go with. Did you, did you call everybody up? Did you, what, what gave you the confidence to finally, you know, spend your hard-earned money with those guys? Yeah. So, um, how that sheep hunt even came about was back in 2021. Um, my business started to do a lot better and, you know, I'm glued to YouTube and,

Um, always watching new hunting shows and finding new guys on there. And, and, uh, anyway, finally my wife was like, quit talking about it and just do it. And, uh, you know, that's kind of what it came down to was, um, not, you know, I, I have the ability to do it, make it a priority and it'll happen. And, um, so that's what I,

That's what I did. And I started asking around. There's a local guy here, Kevin Clumper. He he he's been several times with Lancaster and he's the one that kind of pointed me in that direction. He's been with them numerous times. And so he said he put his name on them every day of the week. And so he's a Napervine guy as well. So that's kind of what pointed me in that direction was just a guy that, you know, has been with him several times. And he probably killed four doll sheep or something with them.

um and so that's why i went with them and and i'm pretty excited about it yeah yeah the reviews are all good um so doll sheep caribou um like what are your expectations on that you you talked earlier and and it kind of stuck in my head you know even on the mule deer um you know you talk about like paying for a hunt versus expectations and not that i'm i'm only 10 years older than you but like to give you some guidance like on this one's even more

it's going to weigh more on you because of how much more this is than, than the mule deer hunt. But like, if I can offer any guidance and it's hard because I'm very similar, like assume you're paying for the adventure and the doll sheeps extra. And like it, it was,

it, I, it didn't set in and I would be, I'd be lying to say I'm not a hypocrite on this because until I got there, it was all about like, I just really want to kill a Ram. Um, I ended up killing mine on day one and then I kind of missed the struggle. So it's like, and just the area you're in. So I don't know if that's going to help you. It's probably not. You're going to be like, I don't, I don't care. Like I still want to, and we talked about it. Like that was still my ultimate goal, but like, I feel like worrying about it.

It doesn't change the outcome, if that makes any sense. So I'm not trying to be your psychologist here. But it's like, you know what I mean? By having that worry or distress or anxiety of it doesn't end up killing it for you. So just enjoy everything you're doing. And that's just going to happen when it happens. If it is going to happen. You know, it's...

I don't have unlimited money. You know, like some of these people are buying these sheep hunts at the sheep foundation and you know, 80, a hundred, 250 grand. And granted they're like 50, 60, 70 year old men. Um, this was kind of like, uh, you know, like make it a priority and it could happen type of deal. And so it's a big deal to me. And, um, you know, and I, I plan to kind of keep making hunting a priority and go and go on more, but,

it totally weighs into the you know like you want to get a sheep and there's that pressure of you um and whether it's a it's a good bull hunt whether you have max points and you're burning them and it's like you know like when i was on that wyoming hunt it was almost like i was more worried about the score than i was the hunt of the bull and it takes away a little bit of the fun because you're you're you know you're like i don't want to waste these max points on on a 300 inch bull like i should be getting a 350 bull but really what i signed up for i didn't have a um

Didn't have an outfitter on that that first hunt and I was so new to hunting, you know Because it was like the first real hunt I'd gone on since football and stuff and I was like, alright, I'm done with football Let's cash these points

points well i was so new to it and um you know i got like a 300 inch bull but you know you would think a guy with max points in wyoming should get like a 350 bull and that's what i was beat myself up over yeah and so like it's kind of the sheep hunt you know when you pay money for it it's like you should get like a stud ram yeah and it's not how hunting works and that's what makes hunting so great is is the you know like when it all comes together like my you know my mule deer when it all comes together it's like you weren't expecting it makes it that much better but

unfortunately you're going to have to go, you know, um, come home empty handed sometimes to make the, those, those moments feel even better. Yeah. And you know, the other thing I realized when you get there is like these guides and outfitters can't control the weather. So you're like the, the Alaska weather, I don't know if where you're going in Canada is any better or if it's still like, we could literally be in the sun, uh,

the death, you know, it's clear and crisp and cold. The next second I'm like trying to rush to get my rain gear on because the system moved in within like 20 minutes. So it's like the weather's out of your control. Um, you know, I don't know about how those concessions work in Alaska or in Canada, but like, I don't know if pressure

pressures maybe a little more under control there because only certain people can hunt certain areas but like yeah I know it's hard and I'm talking out of both sides of my mouth but like if you can if you can get to a place to like not put as much pressure on yourself you're just going to enjoy it more and you're and really all you can do is be in the best shape possible and be able to shoot your gun that's going to be my new

Justin, our mutual friend there, you know, he was, he, he went a few years ago. Um, I don't know, you know, probably eight years ago or so, whatever it was, but you know, he said like when he was getting off the plane, there was a guy loading up a, like a, you know, Boone and Crockett Ram. And so he's thinking, Oh, this is a good outfit or I'm going to get a good Ram. He said day one, he seen a legal Ram that wasn't real big. And it was like day one, it's legal. Do you shoot it? He passed it up and then never seen another one. And so, um,

It's like, man, do you play that game of like, I hope I'm not put in that position. It's legal, but it's not real big.

you know, and you pass it up and then you just get socked in foggy. You can't control the weather. And it's like, well, dang, you know, then you're telling everyone, yeah, I passed them up on day one. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's it. That's tough. And, and, uh, yeah, I wouldn't, don't worry about that decision until you're, you're there. But, uh, and that's where you have to trust your guy and outfitter. They should give you good guidance. They should know how many more legal ones there are better ones. Um, and, and you'll make a good decision. Um, caribou, like what else is on your, your future, uh,

um, you'll list of what you're wanting to hunt. Um, you know, after, after the sheep and the caribou. Yeah. I'm probably just like most other, you know, regular Joe blow hunters. I mean, you have the, I'd love to kill a big moose and hanging over the fireplace. Uh, you know, something like that would be awesome. I was able to go, my buddy drew one of the Washington once in a lifetime tags this year for over in Spokane. And, um, but you know, you look at those big Yukon moose, um, type of hunts and that's always a dream of mine to kill just a water. And, uh,

I don't know. There's something about a big brown bear, you know, and I tell myself I'd love to do it with a bow, you know, sneak up on one on a beach and, you know, or wherever, you know, in the thick brush. But,

I've joked that I don't know if I have enough money to take a bow because your success rate is going to go way down. However, thrill might go way up. So I've contemplated if I did do the brown bear venture, would I take a bow and kind of try to get more of an experience out of it? And how cool would that be to shoot a big, you know, nine foot, 10 foot bear with a bow? Or do you just take a rifle and, you know, not get greedy? So, yeah, I

I would say a moose and a brown bear. I really want to kill one of those. Yeah. And you probably won't find it. I mean, the grand scheme of it, you might get an arrow in it, but you'll probably won't find an outfitter that isn't going to put like 10 bullets in it right afterwards. So you're going to start blasting. Yeah. I don't think their insurance companies like the plan where they don't follow up, but I'm, I'm real similar to you. Like Alaska just gets into your blood or the Northern. I mean, you're going to Canada. I keep saying Alaska, but like those areas, just like what they have to offer and just,

the you haven't been there yet but just like the feeling of ground being untouched uninhabited like on commercialized like our wildernesses are you can't go up in our goat rocks which is close to us and not see 100 people on the weekend like you can go anywhere you want alaska even prettier than the goat rocks and not see anybody or nobody's been there in five or ten years so i just i love it and it brings me back like

I'm going to get to check moose off this year, I believe. And the guide talks about like, we don't hardly see anybody in that area. Like there's nobody hunting it. And so it's just like, man, there's just something about Alaska. It is expensive.

You know, you don't have to hire a guide for this, but the logistics to where we want to hunt and get to some of these 70 inch moose is very, very difficult. And so the outfitter actually makes it cheaper than if you had to try to coordinate. You couldn't even do it on your own without their assistance. That's kind of why I was like, prioritize the sheep hunt. It's just like,

you know i was talking to one of those guys when i killed that canada buck and he used to guide cheap and he was saying that like they dropped one guy off one time um and and he said like he like started crying and what you know he just you know you're hundreds of miles away from anyone dropped off on a plane and just the remoteness of it and like after like two days they he just went home yeah i don't know just that yeah that kind of like made me even want to do it more and you know

You know, and I see these people and they they finally get enough money or whatever it is to finally go where they finally pull the trigger on it. And they're 60. And it's such a hard hunt that I committed to it at a young age and made it my priority just because I wanted I wanted something pretty extreme. You know, I want I want steep shale hard work.

um you know and i want remote i you know on that otc idaho hunt i don't know how many ridges i've come up on there's a guy just on a cell phone talking to his wife because he's got a pinch of service and it's like nothing frustrates me more than that yeah yeah no you're you're gonna love it and uh you want to talk about hard work i don't know exactly i mean some people it's crazy you know i've

I'm similar to you. I watched, cause I don't understand sheep. I don't, I haven't been around him. You know, deer and elk. I don't hardly watch on YouTube anymore because I understand, but like sheep's been this allure, like, and sometimes it's crazy. You'll watch somebody shoot one, like in the bottom of the Valley on day one. And then you watch the, the more typical, you know, 10 days. And so you're going to likely have your work cut out for you. And we were joking last night, like, I wish I would have known. I wouldn't have brought my trekking pole. I would have brought an ice axe because there were times where,

where it was so steep, my trekking pole didn't do anything for me. But if I could have put an ice axe in the side of the hill, you know, or the loose rock next to me. No, no, like,

There's an old saying, you know, that I've heard saying, like, if you're, if your sheep guy doesn't have an ice axe, then you should probably find a new sheep guy. Now I, I say that jokingly, but it's, it's a true thing. Like my guide, you know, had an old, he liked the old wooden handles. He doesn't like any new aluminum. Cause they, they, you know, if he needed to, he could repair it in the field, but like, no, he, his hiking stick was an ice axe and it's, it's really,

there's a reason why you've seen all the pictures of everybody. Like there's times where you're standing as straight up as you think you can stand and your faces are literally 10 inches. That's how steep it is. And you're trying to, you know, like the ice ax I think would have been better than my hiking pole. Um, because you got to imagine when it's that steep, if you have a hiking pole down the hill, like it's not touching anything. Yeah. You know, and you know, in hand up, I've never used trekking poles and I see everyone uses them. Um,

But, you know, like I was telling you last night, like I feel like I'm always carrying my bow or I'm carrying my rifle in one hand and I,

I bought some and I'm going to get an ice pick for my trip. But, you know, it'll be a first for me for, you know, just basically putting a heavy pack on and some trekking poles and just going. Yeah, no, it's, it's, it's a good piece of equipment. They're light, you know, they're, they're just as dang near as light as trekking pole. Now, you know, get it walking, walking stick height, you know, and it's a fun hunt. You're going to really enjoy it. You know, the way you're built, your mental toughness, you're going to really enjoy it. And, you know, I hope,

hope for the best and everything pencils out like you want. We were, we're getting pretty long here. We were going to talk on the financial and like planning these hunts, but we may save it for a second podcast down the, down the road. Um, but no, really appreciate having you, Tucker. Um, got to know you. Um, you know, I, I, I have no doubts in the next 10 years, you're going to continue to stack up, you know, big, big critters. And you, a lot of that's patients. And then the big thing, you know, from outside looking in is just like, you're taking advantage of all the opportunities available. You know, you, you make sure you have tags, you make sure you've got the time. Um,

And then you're working your ass off on the side to make sure the financials doesn't slow that up. You know, and yeah, and I always kind of joke, we joke before this, you know, everybody's always like, well, how do I hunt more? How do I make it so I can hunt more? And I'm like, the best way to hunt more is like, go get, go get a degree and being like a doctor. And then you can hunt it. Like everybody thinks you're going to do that through the hunting industry. And you're a great example, real estate. You know, you own a couple of businesses and you, you have the liberty to hunt just as much as, as

as I do you know our good buddy Justin you know he's a he's a chiropractor he's got the financial means to hunt just as much as I do so there's better or more efficient ways to do it than um you know trying to get lucky and strike gold within the hunting industry and I guess we'll maybe close all you know that with that like financial approach is like man you only live once figure out a way to grind do whatever you want and uh you know kind of kind of go chase your dreams yeah I mean like you know this sheep hunt at 31 years old is probably not in the

Dave Ramsey baby steps to becoming a millionaire strategy. But, you know, what I've found with finances is, is, you know, growing up, everyone tells you that like, you know, money is not everything. Money's not everything. And I, and I, and I agree with that, but you know, like I was telling you before, they aren't, they don't give away these sheep hunts for free. And so,

What I've in my, you know, what I've I'm not a doctor. It's just like find a side hustle or, you know, find a career that, you know, is is, you know, commission based or something like that to where the harder you work, the more reward you can get. And that's kind of what the path that I've taken. And it's not necessarily about the money. It's more so it'll afford me to go on this sheep hunt.

and I don't want to be 60, you know, just watching these videos saying, man, I would have loved to kill the doll sheep one day. You know, it's like, I'm just prioritizing it right now and, and, uh, making it, you know, um, just making it work. Yeah. That's what I've similar to you. We talked about it when, you know, when we were together that, that one time, um, it's not about,

The, the money it's about the freedom, right? If the, the money's obviously tied in, but like you live a life where your schedule can be moved around and you have the money flowing in while you're not there, you know, and some of these things. So I think it's, if you focus on freedom and not the financial and, and you'll be in a better spot, I think that's the, that's the best way I can explain it. Yeah. I'm lucky to like, like my wife has, she started to help out with, because we have rentals now and started to kind of build that portfolio and,

So we invest in real estate and then I sell real estate and, you know, I have that the gravel road, you know, hustle. And if I'm not busy, then I could go, you know, I'll find work. And, you know, that's that's it allows you I could work. I could hunt all fall if I wanted to. Nobody's going to tell me no because I work for myself. But yeah.

The problem is my income. It's like a balance of, you know, like when I went on that second trip to Idaho to, you know, I wasn't planning on it, but it was like, man, I have this tag burning a hole in my pocket. I can sneak away. You know, my wife had everything covered with, with my real estate stuff, you know, and I try to just slip out, you know, I don't, I don't announce it all over and just be like, Hey, I'm going to be gone for out of service for another seven days. It's like, I just sneak out, try to fill my tags. Um,

because I'm not in the industry. It's not, you know, I don't get paid to go. It's, it's, it's not like part of my, you know, I'm just, I'm just a guy with a job. And so I could hunt a lot, but it's kind of a balance of, you know, when you're playing your, you know, if you aren't, if you aren't making money, you're spending it. And that's kind of, kind of hunting. Sounds like you need to build the portfolio of rentals. So you can just, you can leave and you're making money. And I know, I know you've got big plans. If you knew the headache of rentals, you wouldn't have. I did. I had to, and I sold them.

They're, they're, they're rewarding and it's kind of like a stock, you know, rentals are, you don't get rich off of them immediately. It's, you know, it's, it's long term. It's a long game. Yeah. I'm excited to come on this again. Maybe talk about that part. Yeah. Yeah. The financial, I know Dirk just followed up. If you haven't listened to it, listen to the prior episode. Um, Dirk, Dirk met with our good buddy there and went over the financials of, uh,

of hunting so you know go check that episode out and um yeah really appreciate having you on tucker good luck on that sheep hunt maybe we'll have to have you on um post sheep and caribou hunt to see how that turns out for you yeah i appreciate you on and and i look forward to doing it again all right take care you do

Hey, American History Buffs, Hunting History Buffs, listen up. We're back at it with another volume of our Meat Eaters American History series. In this edition, titled The Mountain Men, 1806 to 1840, we tackle the Rocky Mountain beaver trade and dive into the lives and legends of fellows like Jim Bridger, Jed Smith,

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