11 | The Marathon Continues | Mansa Musa and The Mali Empire
46:29 Share

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Black History for Real early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Now, Francesca, we both know that Black folks don't always get the shine we deserve for the cultural practices that we make up, you feel me? What would you say is one of Black people's biggest contributions to the culture that don't get enough credit? Ooh, that is so hard. I mean...

It's impossible to name just one thing because we are masters when it comes to music and fashion and food and and language. I mean, how many brands are trying to sound like black people in their commercials? Well, me, myself, I like.

You know how much flavor we put in, you know, so much of our slang becomes everyday language. For instance, take the concept of being cool or like saying how we cool. This was created and popularized by black Americans in a jazz scene in the 30s and the 40s. As in that car is cool as hell or I'm crazy.

when someone asks how you're doing. Or the words now being called Gen Z slang. But actually, it's just recycled black slang we've been sending the community for decades, ages, some would say. And if we're going to get real specific, let's drill down and acknowledge that it's black queer people that are coming up with a lot of the slang that people are using today, like shade, slay, and tee.

Oh, yeah, it's definitely important to acknowledge the intersectional contributions to language that black folks have had throughout the community. But it's also something to be said how linguistically African-American vernacular English is usually seen as like some irrational, unknowledgeable, apolitical stuff.

Until a white person believes that language is good. Oh, yeah. It's low class when we do it. And then it's cool and forward thinking when they do it. No pun intended. So let me ask you, Conscious, what is your favorite word that you can trace back to black folks?

Oh, yeah. This one right here, I think it's like contemporary, you feel me? A sensational black language that gets incorporated into cross-cultural lexicons. It's onomatopoeia. You remember the word from elementary school? It's a word that represents a sound. Ooh, like, ooh!

I feel like you say that all the time. You're like, okay, so boom. And then you start going off on a tangent. Is that it? Yeah, that's one I like using definitely, definitely. But the word bling, specifically bling bling, like the sound of a diamond when you make it glisten, when it make the noise, you know? It was coined in this context by the hot boys, you feel me? I'm talking about back when they had everybody rolling on spinners, you feel me? Back when we was...

That right there. Shout out to BG. Boy fresh out of jail. Shout out to Turk Juvenile Lil Wayne. The song Bling Bling is one that really comes to mind. It was a cultural phenomenon. I mean, everybody in they mama knows what the word bling means. As a matter of fact, a lot of Halloween costume stores might owe the hot boys some money. And it's tied to today's story, actually.

Because the richest man in history, Mansa Musa, the king of the Mali Empire, is making his way through Egypt on a pilgrimage to Mecca. The king of Bling, before Lil Wayne knew him, has been working on his diplomacy skills since his mother died. And what better way to make friends than handing out gold left and right.

That may sound mighty generous of the king, but what happens when you flood the market with too much money? Inflation. Inflation definitely. And folks don't like that at all. Let's get into some black history for real.

The moonlight illuminates the sandy beach as Mansa Musa strolls along by himself. He's feeling pretty smug about being able to slip his royal guards, a feat he hasn't been able to accomplish since taking the throne of the Mali Empire nearly 10 years ago. Musa smiles to himself. A peaceful night like tonight is a rarity nowadays, and it's important to appreciate the little things.

In the distance, a lone walker approaches as a cloud covers the moonlight. Musa moves to conceal his face and touches the hilt of his sword. He's won many battles with this blade, never afraid to take a life if need be. Musa grips the handle of his trusted companion tighter, ready for war.

As the person gets closer, Musa realizes it's a woman. He can tell by the sway of her hips. She looks familiar to him, but he can't quite place from where. Unless... No, that can't be. Musa drops his shoulders and releases the grip on his deadly weapon. He takes off in a sprint and lets out a joyful cry. Mother! Mother, it's me! The woman stops walking and turns away. Musa falters as he pauses his run. Mother! Mother!

Come close, I've been away. I missed you. The cloud cover moves, revealing Musa's mother, Cancun, and flowing robes as she looks out into the water. Slowly, she turns to face her son. Then why did you kill me? A worm slithers from her mouth as she speaks. In horror, Musa shuts his eyes and screams.

When Musa opens his eyes, he's in his bed. His royal guards rush to his side, but he waves them away. It was just a nightmare. A never-ending nightmare since Cancu's death in his hands. As the royal guard slinks away to grant their king his privacy, Musa looks at his sword on the victory mantle near his bedside and hangs his head. Before the last soldier leaves, Musa blurts out, Have I failed you as a leader?

The soldier stops in his tracks, afraid to look at his king in the eye and tell him the truth. The soldier turns to Musa and says, I am sorry for your loss, Mansa. As-salamu alaykum. The soldier walks out of the lush bedroom, leaving Musa alone with his overbearing shame, an emotion that can destroy the entire Mali empire.

Forget one-size-fits-all diets. With Noom, you get a personalized weight loss plan that's tailored to your lifestyle. No food is off-limits. Enjoy your favorites while discovering healthier habits. Noom's users love the flexible approach, blending psychology and biology to help you lose weight in a way that's sustainable for you. Stay focused on what's important to you with

with Noom's psychology and biology-based approach. Sign up for your trial today at Noom.com. That's N-O-O-M dot com. And check out Noom's first-ever cookbook, The Noom Kitchen, for 100 healthy and delicious recipes to promote better living. Available to buy now wherever books are sold.

Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. With the price of just about everything going up during inflation, we thought we'd bring our prices down. So to help us, we brought in a reverse auctioneer, which is apparently a thing. Mint Mobile, unlimited premium wireless. Give it a try at mintmobile.com slash switch.

$45 upfront for three months plus taxes and fees. Promo rate for new customers for a limited time. Unlimited more than 40 gigabytes per month. Slows. Full terms at mintmobile.com. Black is beautiful. Black is amazing. Not just for funerals. Switch to narrative. I think you should know. Black is beautiful.

From Wondery, this is Black History for Real, where we chronicle the stories of movers and shakers of Black history all over the world. The stories will inspire you, educate you, and more often than not, leaving you shaking your damn heads. I'm Francesca Ramsey. And I'm Conscious Lee. This is episode two of our three-part series, Mansa Musa and the Mali Empire. Today, we talk about Mansa Musa's

Journey to inner peace. After his mother's death, Mansa is filled with shame and guilt. The only way he believes he can make things right is by turning to Islamic practices. Completing a pilgrimage to Mecca becomes a priority. Soon, Musa will discover his journey to Mecca is anything but peaceful. This is episode two. The marathon continues. The year is 1322.

And the grizzled imam busies himself sweeping and setting out tea and fresh fruit to welcome his daily visitor. Years ago, the cleric found his immense influence diminished by the rise of the new mansa who sought fame and fortune at all costs. It was a terrible blow to the ego. But in those years of smallness, the imam had discovered his true peace in Allah, a gift he hoped to share.

The imam turns to greet his honored guests right on schedule. As-salamu alaykum, Mansa Musa. After refreshments, the imam gently and skillfully guides the discussion to his true purpose. Mansa, though I've loved receiving you these many days here at the mosque since your, um... Musa studies his tea and the imam decides to leave the king's mother out of it.

It is my belief that you might be seeking something here with me that can only be found elsewhere. Musa shakes his head. I do not understand. Are you saying the peace I seek cannot be found here in Islam? No, I'm saying that Islam is built upon five pillars and for many, peace is achieved by adhering to just a few. But yours is a heavier burden. Mansa Musa isn't following

Imam tries again. "Do you believe there is no God but God and that Muhammad peace be upon him is the messenger of God?" Musa nods. "Then you have already completed the Shahada, profession of the faith. Do you remember the others from when you were a child?" Musa thinks before answering. "Salat, which are duas or prayer?" The Imam nods and gestures for Musa to continue.

Zakat, the alms, money, or food we give to the poor. Saam, the fasting and seeking intercession with Allah. The Imam interrupts. Saam is important because it leads us where? The Imam kneels beside the king and gestures helpfully to the masjid marab, or notch on the wall indicating the direction of Mecca. Mansa Musa stares at the marab and whispers, Hajj or pilgrimage.

That's right. To find the peace you seek, you must return to the teachings of Allah. Prepare yourself in body and spirit. Make arrangements for pilgrimage to visit the tomb of the Prophet Muhammad. Peace be upon him, so that you can make intercession with Allah. Mansa Musa mulls the proposal over. Never made the journey. The Imam nods.

I have. And it will be perilous, one that takes years to complete. But it's not impossible. Other Mansas have successfully made the trek before you. It can be done. Musa rises to his feet with a new purpose. He believes this journey will lead him to the eternal peace he desperately seeks. I will make the pilgrimage to Mecca and start planning at once.

It's important to note that 12 years into Musa's reign, he started to make a little pivot from being hella violent to being a much more peaceful man. I made a tweet. I made an X. Sorry. No, no, no. We still call it Twitter. Yeah.

I made an X. What? Yeah. No, that's a tweet, though. Yeah, that sounds OK. Yes, you made it. Don't sound good. Shout out. So, you know, I'm saying musky for messing up some things. You know, I think that, you know, in black history for real is very on brand for, you know, one to incorporate something that was culturally made into something by somebody else and you mess it up. Yeah.

Sounds very remnants of pop culture that fits very well into this episode, actually. So you made a tweet that was kind of like a behind the scenes. Maybe people don't know that it's inspired by this episode. What did you say? I said that Mansa Musa allegedly killed his mama and he had a little colonial energy to somebody responded and said something like now he wasn't a colonizer. He was a conqueror.

And for me, it was like, fam, that's like some white supremacist semantics that literal colonizers in the Americas try to say when we start talking about them being colonizers. They went, we went, we was conquerors. It's like, yeah, it's a thing. I have like history is written by the by the quote unquote victors. Right. It just depends on what side of the story you fall on. For me, what's really interesting is.

is this happens all the time, right? Where you do something messed up and you say, you know what? In order to absolve myself, I'm going to turn to religion. I'm not going to do anything to repair the harm. I'm not facing any real consequences. I'm going to throw my hands and say, well,

I'm going to let, you know, the universe, the Lord, whatever powerful being I ascribe to is going to absolve me of my sins. And again, it's not it's not a new concept. And I just hope the listeners are putting two and two together. We see this stuff throughout history and to this very day. How how how easy is it to believe people?

When they genuinely trying to make life changes like this from being like a violent king to being like a peaceful man.

I mean, I think it really depends because ultimately, are you making that change because you know it's the right thing to do? Or are you doing the change in order to absolve your guilt? And I think that regardless of what it is you've done, if it's something as terrible as taking someone's life to something on a smaller scale, you know, whatever that might be,

You have to accept that sometimes you can't repair the harm. You could say, sorry, you could do all the things, you know, you could pay the reparations, you could do all the things and people still might not forgive you. And I feel like that's when you really find out where people's intentions are. Cause you have people go, Oh, I said I was sorry. Well,

Well, I don't forgive you. Yeah, you sorry. I'm still hurt. I accept your apology. I'm still hurt. I'm still hurt. And so, you know, again, it doesn't mean that people can't change. I absolutely think that people can change. But I also think that sometimes.

the hurt is just not going to go away and ultimately you have to accept that there are consequences for your actions and sometimes that's just what it's going to be. This is what it's going to be? Mansa Musa opens his eyes in his throne room and exhales. Rising to his feet, Musa stretches before beginning to fold his prayer rug. He's a little longer in the tooth now. The afternoon prayers can start to make his back smart.

He freezes. Is someone in his throne room without his permission? Without his knowledge? Musa looks over to where he shed his shoes, his staff, and his crown for prayers. They're all out of reach. Musa steadies himself, but then smiles when he hears it. An exclamation. Farba, is that you? Farba, the newly designated head of royal servants, walks out the shadows, positively shaken. Mansa Musa?

I didn't mean to intrude. No one told me you were making your afternoon prayers until it was too late, and I didn't want to be a distraction, so I just kept quiet and... Musa holds his hand to silence his very nervous servant before gesturing to the table near his throne. I take it you have business to report? Farba nods and silently scurries over to the table as Musa puts sandals on his feet, picks up his staff, and once again places his crown on his head.

As he joins Farber at the table, he notices that his servant refuses to make eye contact, probably still working off the panic. Musa sits and smiles, attempting to put him at ease. How are the preparations going? For the pilgrimage, Marquis? Musa na shindli. Yes. Well, the Persian silk merchants were initially quite happy with the immense order for enough silk to clothe 60,000 men.

as well as the down payment of course. Initially, I think the reality of such an order has finally sunk in the hand and they're less enthused. Musa moves the development over in his head before encouraging Farber to continue. Similarly,

The blacksmiths began running their mills day and night to fulfill the order of solid gold staffs. And then the camel herders began to complain about the amounts of camels requested, not having been born within the city and... Mansa Musa interrupts. Farba, take a seat. Farba says, have a glass of water to calm yourself.

"There is no rush. Tell the silk merchants and the smiths, and especially the camel herders, that the order will take years to accomplish." Musa leans in. "Between us, the point of this trip to Mecca isn't just a holy one, and it's certainly not just to show off all the pretty things we have. There's a certain danger at the edge of our kingdom." Farbot chokes on his water and sputters out denials, but Musa is having none of it.

The rumors are true. We've, rather I, have expanded the empire through force. And though those cities are ours to claim, they are also ours to hold. It is a long way to Mecca if we travel straight away. But the journey will be longer still if we take the route that leads us through those cities that are resistant to our rule. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Actually, I'm scared. Hold on. I got to ask you this question. I got to ask you this, Francesca. Yeah.

To you, what's the distinction between being a conqueror and being a colonizer? I mean, again, I think it's one of those things where like you're kind of splitting hairs. If you storm in and you say, hey, this is my shit now. You are a colonizer. But the person who's doing it, it's so interesting because the word colonizer is

it is just a description of a behavior. It is, it is inherently a bad thing, but people who have been called colonizers are starting to feel like it's a slur when it's not, it's just a description of your behavior. But for those folks, it's, it seems like they want to say, Oh, I'm a conqueror because that feels powerful and good versus like you, a thief. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, man. This is something for the listeners to marinate on and think on as they take on the rest of this episode. What's the difference for you between being a conqueror and a colonizer?

Musa gestures to a map on a table with two routes drawn. The first, a straight shot to Mecca, is 2,700 miles. The other, much longer route with twists and turns throughout important trade cities like Goa or Timbuktu. Farba looks nervously at Mansa and asks, should we bring more soldiers?

Manso laughs. "That's what the camels are for, Farba. Men will live and die in the heat of battle for the chance at the amount of gold those camels will carry. 300 pounds each of the hundred. That should result in smooth passage to the Holy Land and back." Musa watches as his servant studies the map. "Do you feel better?"

Farba nods. Then by all means, spread the news and have the Smiths resume regular sleeping schedules. Farba leaps up from the table and quickly makes his exit. Hold on, hold on, hold on. So you going to go expand territory and you about to expand territory with giving away gold? This man traveled to Mecca

With 3,000 pounds of gold? Am I hearing that correctly? Yeah, I mean, it's interesting. He's like, look, I know the people are going to be pissed, so I'm going to bring some money. I guess when you think about it like that, then it's like, okay, so if the conquistadors go to South America, North America, you feel me? Instead of with smallpox blankets that came with gold, would they make their conquering or colonizing come off a little bit smoother, cooler, because they got some shiny objects, or...

Yeah, I mean, look, the end result is going to be the same, but at the very least, at the very least, giving people some money to soothe, you know, the situation, smooth things over, I would think is preferred over just coming in and killing people and stealing their shit. Musa said if we're going to be outside,

We gonna be outside. Hmm. The number of people he traveled with was wild, too. I'm talking about crazy. Some put reports as high as 60,000, including 8,000 courtiers. Those are like personal assistants. And 12,000 slaves. Ah, yes, yes, the slaves. Can't forget about those. To be fair to Musa,

That 2,700-mile journey through the desert took them most of 1324 and 1325 to complete, and they needed a lot of help to pull it off. And since they didn't go straight to Mecca, those little diplomacy stops along the way led to some interesting showdowns.

As summer winds down, let your imagination soar by listening on Audible. Whether you listen to stories, motivation, expert advice, any genre you love, you can be inspired to imagine new worlds, new possibilities, new ways of thinking. With Audible, there's more to imagine when you listen.

And speaking of listening, you can listen to the best-selling science fiction thriller Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir right now on the Audible app and traverse the galaxy in a desperate last-chance mission along with astronaut Ryland Grace, all from the comfort of your living room.

As an Audible member, you choose one title a month to keep from their entire catalog. New members can try Audible free for 30 days. Visit audible.com slash wonderypod or text wonderypod to 500-500. That's audible.com slash wonderypod or text wonderypod to 500-500. Want to teach your kids financial literacy but not sure where to start? Greenlight can help.

With Greenlight, parents can keep an eye on kids' spending and saving, while kids and teens use a card of their own to build money confidence. As a parent, you can send instant money transfers, set up chores, automate allowance, and more. It's a convenient way to run your household, customized to your family's needs, and the easy way to raise financially smart kids. Get started with Greenlight today and get your first month free at greenlight.com slash wondery. ♪ Black is beautiful ♪

Just going over the checklist before we start our pilgrimage, we purchased provisions for the insanely large entourage. 100 gold-laden camels. 500 slaves, can't forget those, each carrying a staff of solid gold.

The time is different. I'm not saying it's good. I'm just saying this is what he did. I think it's an important caveat, right? Because we're not trying to make any excuses for anybody doing enslavement. But we acknowledge that all slavery is not created equal. And we know this for sure because you got 500 slaves carrying gold? Yes. They are obviously being trusted. Again, they're still probably being mistreated. But to your point...

They are being given some responsibilities that I have never heard of before. Next up, we've got, uh, duas have been made. Prayers. Check. We've followed the advice of the local sheik to not start until the Saturday after the 12th. Say what now? Yeah, that is a very super random tidbit that is actually documented, and I just thought it was kind of funny. Well, okay. Check. And we are off on our pilgrimage to Mecca. Well, the first wave, at least.

The caravan was so large that the guys in front started arriving in Timbuktu before Musa even left his palace.

Mansa Musa sought to use his trip to spread the influence of Islam along the journey. Being forced to face the responsibility of his mother's passion opened up a new outlook for him in whatever semblance of peace that he could find, he wanted to share. To that end, every Friday, no matter where they were, Musa commissioned a mosque to be built. This one act completely changed the religious landscape in West Africa.

These little stops were also covert missions of diplomacy that were super important for keeping the empires together. In the capital city, Musa spoke and people hopped too. But on the edges of his kingdom, the cities he conquered most recently, they sometimes like to test the waters.

being slow to follow orders, stuff like that. So Musa doing random pop-ups reminded them who's boss. Plus, he gets to drop off some of that gold to build schools and places of worship. And as you would imagine, those are lasting reminders. It's hard to raise an army against the empire if the citizens are taken care of. But not all stops win according to plan, huh? Oh, of course not. Otherwise, we wouldn't be making this episode. You see...

Musa decided to bring his wife, Inari Kanti, along the journey and she got super depressed with all the travel and not being able to take a bath. Oh, understandable. Hygiene is very important to my mental health too. And I know it was hot and I knew they were smelling funky out there. Musa decided to take a special stop just for her. It's a scorching day in Tuat.

which is a desert in central Algeria, and Mansa Musa sits in the shade watching his beloved wife splash in a pool of water. He notices Farba, the chief of the servants, lingering out of place and waves him over. Farba approaches him and bows deeply. Mansa, you wish that I inform you of any issues with the servants as soon as they arose, yes? Musa nods and Farba continues. This stop...

for the queen's sake, may have resulted in misfortune. Mansa Musa gets tight, immediately thinking Farba is speaking above his station. Farba, instead of making complaints, you should go back to your servants' quarters and find work to keep you busy and out of trouble. Farba throws himself at Musa's feet and begs forgiveness for the misunderstanding. Mansa, Mansa, no. I offer no complaint, just a report.

Musa relaxes and gestures for his servant to continue. Farber presses on. Manson, Manson, I carried out your orders to have slaves dig out a hole and fill it with water for the queen and her ladies. But now I must report that nearly 500 of the men have a disease on their feet. Manson Musa considers the connection. Is there something in the soil? The water?

As a married man...

What I know, nothing to mess up the entire trip or change the trajectory of an entire trip than this grown wife. So if his wife had got that on the feet, I don't know how the story would have happened. I'm glad I don't. And you know they're in the desert, so the toes are always out. It's not like you could put a boot on, you know what I mean? Cover them up.

Well, so you hungry is scorching hot. You stinky, you sweaty. You already depressed. You stink. And now your feet is itching with, oh man, I can't believe the gate pilgrimage of Mansa Musa was nearly derailed by athlete's foot. Lotrimen did not exist back then, but I'm sure they had some herbs or something to put on those dogs. The lack of Lotrimen AD was the least of their concerns. Like, yes.

Yes, icky feet stuff is bad, but the real danger was just out there in the elements. Crazy sandstorms, extreme heat during the day and freezing cold during the night.

And don't let nobody catch a case of dysentery. Oh my gosh, that just, ugh. It is not one thing, it's another. This just sounds really, really difficult. In all seriousness, yes, medical care, extreme weather, and the occasional bandit were all major concerns with the 14th century long-haul travel.

even when your entourage is 60,000 strong. Mansa Musa and company spent eight months on the road until they arrived in Cairo, Egypt. And everyone's pretty beat up and wanting to take another rest. And my goodness, they took a rest. And that had a ripple effect.

You remember the five pillars of Islam from the beginning of this episode? Yeah, I think so. Shahada, the profession of faith. Right. And there's Salat, which are duas or prayer. And Psalm, the fasting and seeking of intercession with Allah, which led to Hajj or pilgrimage. That's four, right? Which one are we missing? Zuccott, or money and food that we give the poor. Oh, right.

Musa was spreading around the wealth as he went, huh? And when he touched down in Cairo, Mansa Musa really showed out. But his generosity might have done more harm than good.

Musa comforts his camel before he shields his own eyes from the harsh Cairo sun. His slimmed-down convoy is passing through the market, and he's on high alert, careful to keep an eye as his men hand out gold pieces to the people. This is his favorite part, the range of reactions as they clutch the gold, first with disbelief, then a giddiness when they realize it's real. Their knee-jerk reactions can only be described as honest. Gold brings the truth to light.

Some would whisper their thanks before running off to the crowd, and some would rush directly to a merchant tent. His favorites were the children, though, especially the little ones. Most clearly didn't know what they'd been given, but they knew it was shiny and they knew they were supposed to bite it to prove that it was real. They'd squeal and run off as fast as their legs could carry them. The hardest reactions were the elderly or the infirm.

The need in their eyes, the exhaustion, the tears when their frail hands would secure a piece of gold. It was devastating every time. Despite the best efforts of the guards, these crowds would swell with people whenever Musa would hand out gold. And oftentimes the frail would get swept along like they're in a rushing river until Musa would notice and halt the crowd to let them through.

Musa scans the crowd once again looking for the fragile. A commotion breaks out behind him. Musa strains to see what the source is. Finally, in frustration, Musa dismounts his camel as the crowd thins and rushes to the source of the cries. An older man beating a younger man with a stick while shouting at him in Arabic. Musa's soldiers catch up and surround him. Musa demands to know why the man is attacking his own son.

He's not my son. The lazy good for nothing is my nephew. We've been housing and feeding him for years. And the first thing he does when he gets a taste of money is run to spend it on girls. Nothing for his aunt or uncle. Nothing for the years we spent feeding and clothing him. All his money went straight to loose women. He's selfish.

Musa looks down at the bleeding young man who stands up defiantly and points at Mansa Musa. "What's the problem?" He has much more gold. A hush falls over the crowd as everyone is taken aback. "I have more, yes." Musa gestures to the crowd, but it is for sharing with others. "This man is your uncle. Did you not think to share with him after he has so freely given to you?"

Or maybe give alms to the poor. The young man, clearly inebriated, cries out and lies bitterly. The great Mansa Musa, able to change the life of everyone here, but he chooses not to. So yes, I took my own. I am the poor man.

Musa's reinforcements arrive and the small entourage gets a much needed injection of numbers. As Musa is safely evacuated from the area, he sneaks a peek back at the uncle and nephew still fighting in the street. So far, the trip had been a success. One ungrateful person complaining about how much he had been given wasn't an indication of anything further than that, right?

As Musa contemplated the true meaning of Zakat, he grew uncomfortable as the young man's word took root. His actions were charitable. His cause was just. So did his mission feel hollow all of a sudden? Yeah, it's one of those things where I think it's, I understand people wanting to give back and I really try to do that myself, but I feel like we also have to talk about the root of

of the problem and that while money can solve a lot of things, if you've never been given money and you don't know how to use the money responsibly and you don't know how to stretch it, I mean, the things that rich people are so good at, really, you give a poor person funds and they've never had funds before, it can in some ways create problems.

more problems for them, especially when, you know, in this situation, your family doesn't have funds, right? Now you're trying to figure out how to stretch these funds. And this just idea that like poor people shouldn't be able to have fun with their money. It's like, well, you should be buying groceries. It's like sometimes you want to like go to the movies or like buy a cute outfit and that's okay. It doesn't like get to the, again, the root of the problem.

Which is systemic inequality. You know, it's always like you guys shouldn't be buying avocado toast and iPhones. Then maybe I think also, too, you see it be a conflict of interest because what we talked about at the beginning of this is that Musa already knew where he was going to do this trip for two things. It was going to serve as a subtle ride or subtle travel for diplomacy.

So for me, like not even getting too religious is like, hey fam, the reason why you got this tension in your heart and soul is because you trying to serve two gods. You trying to make it like you pushing the true meaning of Zakat. But in actuality, you only trying to pacify these folks. That way they take on your empire expanding as being some cool shit. And absolve the fact that you killed your mama. Yeah.

Exactly. So it's like it's like on a surface level, what you're doing is cool. It's admirable. But like deep down what you're doing is like, yeah, fam, the desire and the motive you have behind these actions is very imperial. Meaning it's unethical. You're giving money to the needy, but you're giving money to the needy insofar that they go and be good conqueror subjects. You're not doing it to further the word of Allah. You're not doing it to.

Islam, you're doing this to suture your feelings and emotions as being a goddamn conqueror, a colonizer. And you know that folks is going to be less likely to rebel against you if they're taken care of. So, again, you're not doing this out of the kindness of your heart. I allow you doing this to be a good ass like that and the way around it.

The important thing is that Musa's caravan made it to the safety and security of Cairo. It wasn't a city that Mali went to war with, and in fact, prior Mansas had stopped there on their pilgrimages to Mecca, seeing as it was the last major city before their destination at the time.

Cairo was considered something of a safe haven because it was a massive city with established governance. The rules, laws, and things like jail sentences and/or beheadings kept a lot of the marauders at bay. Plus, there are real beds. Life on the road can be a distant memory for a spell, but in a city like Cairo, there is a different type of danger to fear.

This season, Instacart has your back-to-school. As in, they've got your back-to-school lunch favorites, like snack packs and fresh fruit. And they've got your back-to-school supplies, like backpacks, binders, and pencils. And they've got your back when your kid casually tells you they have a huge school project due tomorrow.

Let's face it, we were all that kid. So first call your parents to say I'm sorry, and then download the Instacart app to get delivery in as fast as 30 minutes all school year long. Get a $0 delivery fee for your first three orders while supplies last. Minimum $10 per order. Additional terms apply. Black is beautiful.

Before we get to Act 3 real fast, hold on real fast, real fast. I want to say this real quick. I think the reason why I've been so intrigued by this story is it made me realize that I know most of world history through a Christian lens. And I think that we inherited the Holy War crusades, you know what I'm saying, between Christians and Muslims type. So I feel like me learning about Mansa Musa has really deconstructed a lot of...

Christian ideas and Christian historical implications of how I understand world history. I just want to throw it out there. I love that, especially because it really does fall in line with like the theme of our show that like you're never too old to learn. It's never too late to learn something and change your perspective or

on history, the way that you view yourself, the way that you view your education, and the way that you view your activism and the work that's important to you. So yeah, shout out to you for just like playing that seat. Thank you, Francesca. It's July 1312. Musa and his people are looking forward to relaxing and a little shopping in the city before they continue their journey when they receive a most honorable invitation from the Sultan of Egypt.

The Sultan was the ninth of the historic Mamluk Sultans and was on his third separate reign as he was removed from office once by his family and chose to abdicate another time. But you can't keep a good man down.

Exactly. The backstory of the Sultan is only important because one of his reigns overlapped with another trip to Mecca, or Hajj, made by another former Mansa of Mali nearly two decades prior, Mansa Saqqara. Other Malian rulers had safely made the trip to Mecca and back to Nani. Mansa Saqqara was not one of them. Diplomacy is dangerous business. I can just see how this royal invite set off a flurry of preparations.

The Persian silk came into play, I'd imagine. The gold gifts being laid out. The finest of the entertainers being brought along. Finally, the royal court for Mali moves through the city of Cairo to their host palace. But when they arrive, something is off. The two rulers stand opposite of each other and make no moves towards the other. Not the welcome Mansa Musa was expecting.

Eventually, a servant of the Sultan motions to Farba to have a side conversation. Farba returns to Musa's side and hesitantly relays the news. "Mansa, the Sultan is waiting for you to bow to him as Mansa Seqera did in his day." Musa is shook. "Why would I do such a thing? Because of Seqera? No, that's absurd. You tell them to move past this requirement or we'll turn around and leave."

Musa takes a minute to think it over before announcing to those within hearing, I bow only to Allah. A tense hush falls over the gathering before Mansa Musa continues, And it is the will of Allah that we see Mecca.

So I bow for a law and a law alone. Musa bows deeply. And just like that, everything's cool. The two parties united for a feast. They exchanged gifts and became friendly. So friendly that Mansa Musa and his cohort were invited to stay in the district of Cairo as guests for the governor for months on end.

I'm sorry. I'm a little salty that Mansa was able to like make this concession for homeboy. But his mama, he was like, nah, you won't catch these hands, mom. Like, come on. Like, you couldn't make any concessions to kind of come together with your mom. I mean, on the one hand, I guess this does show gross. But man, why does growth have to be at the expense of his own mother?

Yeah, man. I feel like, I mean, if I were giving him the benefit of the doubt, we don't, we don't say that he learned from his impulsive, you know what I'm saying? Display of violence towards his mama and learn how to like spare and, you know, value human life. But I feel like if we being critical, like outside of being his mother is thinking like, damn. So what you're telling me is that even in the 1300s, a black man would be able to,

have the benefit of the doubt for other parties, but still have the most violence and violence for a black woman. That's kind of crazy as well. Kind of crazy. By early October of that year, just a few months later, a family of ranchers noticed something odd when tending to their flock. A woman returns to her family land empty handed without the feed needed for their livestock. She tells her brother she got to the market, but didn't have enough money.

The sellers weren't even willing to haggle, trade, or barter. They just kept talking about a new price. Her brother, Mahmoud, put his hands on his hips. I cannot do your job and mine. You must find another who will sell to you for a reasonable price. We need to feed or else there will be nothing for our goats to eat with. No grass this late in the year. He notices his mother returning home almost empty-handed.

Not you too. The mom nods and then launches into a tirade against the caravan of Malians who dumped too much gold into the local economy. If everyone has gold, it's worthless. The men won't work for regular wages because regular wages won't cover the price of anything. I admit, when they first arrived, I was very happy. But now the price of everything has gone up, sometimes as much as four or five times the original. I don't

It's put us back at the same rate either. It's actually made us worse off. I'll have to go talk with the governor and ask him to complete their pilgrimage. They've gotten too comfortable. If they stay any longer, we'll all be done for. And with that, mom turns the heels and storms off.

The unfortunate family of ranchers were feeling the start of an inflation pinch that comes when you flood the market with a seemingly unlimited amount of gold. They learned in the 1300s the same lesson that Fat Joe was trying to teach us a couple of years ago. Yesterday's price is not today's price. After three months of zakat, or the Islamic practice of freely giving to those in need,

Cairo would be left digging themselves out of the hole that Mansa Musa inadvertently dug for them with his generosity. Musa was summarily invited to travel with the Sultan on his way to the Holy City to complete Hajj. But the damage was done. The price of gold in Egypt didn't stabilize for 12 years.

On October 18th, Mansa Musa and his caravan leaves Cairo for the remaining 1,000 miles left on their journey. Musa is starting to feel a familiar feeling. Shame. Even with good intentions, he manages to destroy an entire economy and leave people worse off. His head hangs low. He needs to complete his journey to Mecca to achieve true peace for everyone's sake.

If you like Black History for Real, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.

This is episode two of our three-part series, Mansa Musa and the Mali Empire. We use multiple sources when researching our stories. Empires of the Medieval West Africa by David Conrad, Mansa Musa's Hajj, a personal journal produced by the DBQ Project, and Mansa Musa and the Mali Empire published by Pearson were extremely helpful.

A note, our scenes contain reenactments and dramatized details for narrative cohesiveness. Black History for Real is hosted by me, Consciously. And me, Francesca Ramsey. Black History for Real is a production of Wondery and DCP Entertainment. This episode was written by Lauren Williams. Sound design by Greg Schweitzer. The theme song is by Terrace Martin.

For DCP Entertainment, associate producers are Quentin Hill, Brittany Temple, and Chris Colbert. The senior producer is Ryan Woodhall. Executive producers for DCP Entertainment are Adele Coleman and DJ Treacy Treese. For Wondry, Lindsay Gomez is the development producer. The production coordinator is Desi Blaylock. Sophia Martins is our managing producer.

Our producer is Matt Gant. Our senior story editor is Phyllis Fletcher. The executive producers for Wondery are Marshall Louis, Erin O'Flaherty, and Candice Manriquez-Wren. Wondery.

Hey, I'm Mike Corey, the host of Wondery's podcast, Against the Odds. In each episode, we share thrilling true stories of survival, putting you in the shoes of the people who live to tell the tale. In our next season, it's July 6th, 1988, and workers are settling into the night shift aboard Piper Alpha, the world's largest offshore oil rig.

Home to 226 men, the rig is stationed in the stormy North Sea off the coast of Scotland. At around 10 p.m., workers accidentally trigger a gas leak that leads to an explosion and a fire. As they wait to be rescued, the workers soon realize that Piper Alpha has transformed into a death trap. Follow Against the Odds wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen ad-free on Amazon Music or the Wondery app.