Max Lucado: How Happiness Happens
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It's live in the Breen with host of Fox News at Night, Shannon Breen.

This week on Live in the Bream, we have one of my favorite guests. You all know him. You will recognize his name. In fact, I was in a meeting right before I came in to record this with him. His name came up and folks across the room, their eyes lit up and said, oh my goodness, I love him. I grew up on him. I have every one of his books. We are very honored to have Max Lucado back with us this time around on the podcast. Max, welcome. Thank you so much. Thank you. Were you in a meeting of all my parole officers? Yes.

No, it was not your family members and friends none of that It was actually a very serious meeting about some some upcoming legal cases and that kind of thing and I didn't know I had to excuse myself to come and do the podcast so I wasn't sure if this audience How many of them would know of your work but immediately when your name came up? Like I said everybody's eyes lit up and they were so excited. So they all say hello. Well, thank you. Thank you. Thank you So we're talking about your new book how happiness happens and

It's such a great read, and it feels so perfectly timed for 2019 at a time where there's a lot of rage. There's a lot of intolerance, it feels like, on any number of political or social issues. People seem to have a lot to be griping about and unhappy about.

But your book gives us an antidote to that. So let's start by talking about some of the difficulties. And, you know, you talk about how we're very easily upset by any number of things. There are pressures in this world, and it seems to be we're in an environment that kind of feeds that. I think so. A fellow just yesterday said,

used the picture. He said it's like we, it's like our allegiance to our college football team. You know how intensely loyal we can be? Yes, I do. When somebody even brings up the rival, you know, we bristle inside. And that's one thing if it's, you know, college football. It's something else entirely, though, when it comes to our opinions. And it's, you

It's like we have our mindset of certain opinions. And if somebody does not agree with our opinions, it's not just that they disagree. It's that we have to be mad at them or intolerant of them. We can't. They become a rival. You know, they become the enemy. Of course,

Of course, there's multiple dangers, multiple bad consequences of that. One is that there's really no healthy dialogue or that interrupts the healthy dialogue. But number two, I think it takes a toll on us because we miss out on happiness that can come as a result of building relationships. So I think it's a serious issue we're discussing.

Yeah. And so much of your book, it's so funny to read because it's such the opposite message that we get fed all day, that the world would tell us that you're going to be happy when you make yourself happy and you're right to be outraged about all these things. And you mentioned a verse, I'm on page 53. This is one that my mom quoted endlessly when I was growing up from Philippians 2, 3, with humility of

mind let each of you regard one another as more important than himself and that just seems so counter messaging to everything that we hear these days you talk on that same page about a helpful exercise for the next 24 hours make it your aim to celebrate everything good that happens to someone else how can that change our mindset yeah can you imagine if if I took that seriously and every time I saw something good or heard something good happening I

to someone else, I would celebrate it as if it had happened to me. You talk about that would elevate the happiness in my own life because there's plenty of great things happening.

And what the challenge is, is that we see good things happening to others and we react in jealousy or comparison. And so rather than allowing that good moment to be contagious and bring joy to us, we miss that opportunity. We miss that opportunity. And I think that's why that passage in Philippians and your mom was so good to instill it in you.

It's just a fundamental principle to dealing and living with others. Count others as better than yourself because by nature we're going to say, I'm more important than they are. But if we could just perceive or reckon that every person is valuable, then that's an opportunity for us to develop this kind of joy-giving relationship that really gives life to us.

Yeah, and you talk about how social media has really complicated things because I think that it can stir up envy or disappointment or feeling like we're a failure. We haven't, our house is not that perfect. Our career is not that great. Our, you know, our kids aren't perfect. And it creates a lot of room for comparison and feeling like we don't measure up. And then being frustrated and angry with other people, unable to sort of celebrate their happiness. Yeah.

As you've talked about, how does social media kind of complicate these issues? And what do you do to manage it in your own life? Well, social media pours gasoline on the fire of comparison. It causes me to look at this moment in a person's life, whether it's on Instagram or Facebook or Twitter, and...

A moment that is a obviously, well, usually 99% of the time is a good moment in someone's life or they wouldn't be posting it. And the false assumption I can take is that that moment represents the rest of their day. When we know better, we know that all of us have day, every day is full of ups and downs and good times and bad times.

Uh, but I assume that my life is not as exciting as that person's because there's no picture of me riding a, you know, raft whitewatering through the grand Canyon like they're doing. So something's wrong with me. Uh,

And it's just a false narrative that we're pulling into our heads. So there's always been the potential for that, Shannon, of course. But social media, it just...

we check it so often or we turn to it so often that it takes quite a bit of diligence. I mean, really some serious diligence to stand against it. And so that's what we all have to do. And I'm not a hero at this. You know, I've...

I've noticed who has how many followers or I notice how many people retweet or like something that I post. And I wish I could say I was oblivious to it or not or nonplussed by it. But but I'm not. But I'm trying to do better.

And for the Christian, especially for the person of faith, our source of affirmation has to come from the fact that we believe there's a good God who knows us and who cares about us and that this life on earth is just but a wink, just a flash in the pan, and then we're going to be as that life as we were intended to. And that's where our identity comes from, not in whether we're liked or disliked on social media. That's awfully trivial compared to the big news.

But it's one thing to say that. It's another to practice it. But I tell you, it's worth the practice.

I'm so glad that Max Lucado, pastor and bestselling author, as we're talking about his new book, How Happiness Happens, admits that he might occasionally look at his likes on Instagram or Facebook or Twitter. I feel better about myself, although I too am trying to get away from that because like you said, it feeds this need for approval from all the wrong places and they're all a short-term fix. I mean, even if you have a great day and get a

thousand or million likes on something, your next tweet may bomb and no one cares. I mean, you really just like comparison gives birth to superiority or inferiority and nothing else else. You know, it either makes me feel better than you or worse than you. So it's a comparison is is is a no win thing.

Learning to be content in the situation in which we find ourselves, truly celebrate the good news that comes to others, that's really the pathway to genuine happiness. You talk about, I had to chuckle in the chapter where you're talking about people you call them, quote, opposite yous. These are people that are...

out of your comfort zone they may make your life difficult on you say in the book they can drain your joy tank there's tension and awkwardness anger low-grade or high flame can flare inability to manage the relationship can lead to isolation prejudice and bigotry what if your opposite you is your boss your next door neighbor your coworker what if your opposite you as your parent or child

I mean, we're going to have friction in relationships, and that's something that can then sap at our joy or our happiness if we don't know how to view it and manage it. And as we head into – well, we're already in a presidential cycle, aren't we? We're never out of it. We're never out of it. Yeah. Nobody knows this better than you do.

The inability of us to disagree agreeably, you witness the hostility in the conversations you have in the world in which you live more than most of us. It's disconcerting. What if you're a loyal Democrat but your dad is a Republican?

How are you going to have Thanksgiving dinner together? And so it's something that's a very real situation. And so I encourage people to think about this admonition in the Bible to accept one another, accept one another just as God and Christ accepted you. It's this idea of granting people respect, hearing them out.

Learning their point of view. Making it your aim to see life from their angle. Not a day goes by that we aren't tested.

to to to just react with anger because somebody drives you know a gas guzzling truck or they're driving an electric car there's so many things that can cause us to just be easily ticked off in society hey our joy is too valuable it's just too valuable and life is too valuable to be spent

on these things that they're important for sure, but relationships are even more important. So see if you can't, if you're in a cubicle or a home where your opposite you is right there, that's an opportunity for you to develop this ability to accept those with whom you have disagreements.

Yeah, you talk later about someone you'll call Buster, not his real name. But the fact that we all may have Busters in our lives, these are people that we may need to forgive. That may be very hard to do. But you talk about when we kind of internalize and hold grudges, how that saps away at our ability to be content, to be happy. But some of these people may have actually really hurt you in very real ways. Thanks for these great questions and for looking at...

at the manuscript so seriously because I think that's a real...

A real joy sucker. It really takes the joy out of our lives. And that's this thing of resentment. You know, when Duke University listed the eight characteristics of happiness, four of them had to do with a refusal to harbor grudges. In other words, a full 50% of characteristics of happy people have to do with the ability to move on in spite of the hurts.

And hurts come to all of our lives. Somebody said if hurts were hairs, we'd look like grizzlies. We've all been hurt. And it just happens. It comes with life. We get beat up. We get bruised. And so learning to move forward is really important. And I think in order for us to be happy, to find the happiness that we want, being able to not keeping our hurts from becoming hates is so essential.

And so in the book, I talk about what forgiveness is. You know, it's not glossing over. It's not endorsing what people have done. I talk about how to move on, what steps you can take.

I even suggest that at some point it's good to conduct a funeral and once and for all bury that moment, not suppress it and refuse to deal with it. In fact, I think just the opposite. I think bringing it to a surface and trying to work it through is essential. But at some point, it's good to just draw a line in the sand and say, okay, I'm moving on with life for the sake of the happiness that I desire and the happiness I want to convey to others.

So what is the happiness challenge? How do we make this practical in our lives? If we have difficult circumstances, difficult people, how do we, in the midst of a very volatile and sometimes really tension-filled day, how do we actually take that happiness challenge and find it in our own lives? That's a great question. So the big idea or the premise of the book is simply happiness happens when we make other people happy.

Since we can't control our circumstances, but we can control the way we treat people. And if happiness happens when we give it away, I want to become one who makes other people happy. And a side benefit, a great perk of that is that I'll be happier too. So what I challenge people to do is take 40 days. Typically 40 days is what's considered to be the amount of time that you can really ingrain a habit into your life. So take 40 days and over those 40 days, try to make a hundred people happy.

You can't force them to be happy. You can't guarantee they will. But you can do things like listen intently and praise abundantly. You can serve other people. You can greet other people. You can perform 100 acts over 40 days that will increase the number of smiles on the planet. And I think that, Shannon, as we do this, especially in the middle of difficult days or challenging days,

It lifts our spirits. I've been on the road quite a bit lately. And just yesterday, I was going through an airport, going through the security line. And I don't know what it is about the security line, but it kind of makes me cranky. I don't like going through security. Taking off your belt, emptying your pocket, getting all your stuff out. Yeah, you have to go through all that stuff for something that I didn't do, for something I didn't do. And so it kind of erupts me the wrong way. But you know what? I was thinking, okay, Locato, just practice what you preach.

And and I thought, OK, I can these poor people who work here, you know, they put up with grumps like me all day long every day. So I made it a point to go up to the fellow in charge who was behind the counter. He probably thought I was coming up to yell at him or something. I went up to him and I said, sir, can I just tell you, thanks for keeping us safe.

Thanks for keeping us safe. And you know what? I enjoyed that moment. I did. And it took that, you know, little unpleasant experience that we all have to go through when we travel. And it didn't make it just a delight. I'd still rather eat ice cream than go through TSA. But it made it better. And you know what? I think it made his day just a little bit better. He sure didn't see that coming.

And it was kind of a fun thing to do to surprise him. And I really meant it. I really did. I said, thanks. And so just look for opportunities to do that 100 times over 40 days. I double dog dare you. You'll be a happier person.

I love this idea. And like you said, I mean, if we really stop and look around, those opportunities are everywhere, whether at the DMV or the grocery, like you said, the TSA line, a classroom, a workplace, in our own homes when we have friction with the people we love the most. I mean, there are all kinds of ways that we can actually try to, you know, almost disarm people because, like you said, for that TSA supervisor, I'm not going to be able to do that.

I'm sure that does not happen very much to have someone come to him and

and say thank you for what you're doing. You know, I think that there are easy things. I mean, I'm at a checkout counter and I see somebody has a cute manicure or cute earrings or you like their lip gloss or whatever. I mean, it takes two seconds to tell them how nice that looks. And they may not get a nice word all day. And just to see a little smile on their face. I mean, if we look for the opportunities, I'm sure we can find them. And what is small to us may be huge to someone else.

You know, what is a breadcrumb to us might be a feast to someone else. We just never know. We never know. And as people of faith, we believe that God is involved in the small things. And so your simple greeting of somebody may be, you know, what they need to pull them out of a very, very difficult time. So don't underestimate how God can use a small moment like that.

It's true. We think about the commands of the Bible were basically boiled down to loving God with all of our heart and soul, strength and mind. But that's coupled with loving your neighbor as yourself. And as you said, I think we as human beings do tend to be very self-focused, selfish people, even if you're

a good person, a person of faith, you're working on yourself. I think our default setting is probably often to ourselves. I think you're right. So if we can look to other people and think, well, I want to treat them as nicely as I would treat myself and I'm buying myself that frappe. Why can't I get one for someone else? I mean, there are just little opportunities all around us.

The book, again, by Max Lucado, How Happiness Happens. If you're feeling discouraged or frustrated or you're like a lot of folks these days, and I even said this yesterday to little Will, who's sitting right here next to me. We were traveling yesterday, too. And I turned to her at one point and I said, my fuse is this short. And I had about an inch spread on my fingers.

Because we were just running and gunning and our phones are dying and we're trying to manage a million things. And so it's easy for us to get caught up in our own frustrations. But there's so much good in the world. And whether it's your neighbor who needs some help or a stranger, whatever it is, you give such fantastic advice that when we're trying to make other people happier, they feel lifted up. We always benefit from that, too. And you shouldn't do it expecting anything back. But I find that's almost always the natural consequence. So...

The Happiness Challenge. It's 40 days. Try to track 100 ways that you have encouraged or helped someone else find happiness. So listen, if you are listening to this podcast, I want you to tweet back to us to let us know, me or Max, at Shannon Bream or at Max Lucado, to let us know that you're doing the Happiness Challenge and let us know how it's going. And I'm going to take the challenge as well. Little Will is right here. She's nodding her head. She's going to do it too. So we're going to try to spread some more happiness where we are. And believe me, they need it in Washington, D.C. You spread a lot.

By the way, you do great. You really do. Thank you. Well, thank you. I appreciate that. And we hope that others will check out your book, feel encouraged by it, and then that'll be a wave of encouraging others as well. So let us know if you're going to do the challenge. Max, we always appreciate your time. We wish you the best with yet another positive, encouraging book at a time when this world needs it so much. Thank you. And again, thank you. You're an inspiration to all of us. Thank you, Max, for being with us on Live in the Bream. We'll talk to you again soon.

Hi, everybody. It's Brian Kilmeade. I want you to join me weekdays at 9 a.m. East as we break down the biggest stories of the day with some of the biggest newsmakers and, of course, what you think. Listen live or get the podcast now at BrianKilmeadeShow.com.