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It's Live in the Bream with the host of Fox News Sunday, Shannon Bream. This week on Live in the Bream, there's going to be a little bit of nostalgia as we look back. But the biggest part of what we're talking about today is looking forward.
the power of education in our lives, and the fact that just when you get out of school, whatever degree you get, high school, college, grad degrees, whatever, that's really just the beginning because there's so much in life to continue to learn. And it can give you all kinds of different successes in your life. And we have somebody who would know our expert for today, a global business leader, philanthropist, educator, artist, musician, pilot,
a modern Renaissance man. By the way, he's the guy who was CEO of two internationally recognized Fortune 500 companies, 7-Eleven and one of my 1990s favorites, Blockbuster. So we're going to talk about his Blockbuster new book called Education is Freedom. The future is in your hands. James, he's welcome to live in the Bream.
It is great to be with you. You know what I love that you're so transparent about your own story because it's so powerful. You did not start off with the advantages in life that most people would think would lead you to the C-suite. So how did you get there? How did education play a role in making that dream come true?
Well, I did not. I grew up in rather challenging circumstances, but this isn't a story that's that unusual. Just too many kids, too little money, but we lived in a house with no running water and quite a few challenges. But what I found is that that adversity that I faced as a kid was actually a strength because it taught me that
That it's not the crisis you face. It's not the challenges you face. It's the response to those challenges that make all the difference in the world. And in my case, I turned to education and it ended up being an incredible path to unlock all kinds of opportunity and continues to do so today. That's what's so fun about it. Hmm.
So how did you get there, though? Because I listen, I grew up, I told you before we got started, my mom was a teacher for decades. So I was always sort of in education mode. We didn't have much. My mom was a single mom with me very early on. And so we really struggled. But she always told me, if you can read, if you can get your education, you can do anything. It doesn't matter. This is an amazing country. And it doesn't matter where you start.
you have opportunity. And so even though we didn't have much materially, we had each other and she gave me this gift of education. How did you come to see that that was a way forward for you beyond your circumstances? It was, you're exactly right in the challenge of those of us who were in or are in those circumstances today. Um,
is you really don't know what the path is. That's really the primary reason in my book to say, hey, if I can do this, anybody can do this. But there's no one there to guide you, to mentor you. So like you, I was with my dad for a while. My parents split when I was very young. So with my dad for a while, he didn't really know what to tell me. My mom was a single mom then at that point when I ended up with her after my dad passed.
And so there was really no one to tell me what to do. But what both my father and mother did say, both of them had dropped out of school very early in their young life. But they both said, you know, Jim, it sounds very fatalistic. They said,
They can take your house, they can take your money, they can take your car, but no one can ever take away what you know. And learning is free, by the way, so the more you can accumulate knowledge, the greater chance of success you'll have in life.
They were so right. And I did. I became a sponge. And thank goodness. Thank you to your mom. Give your mom a hug. Because seriously, our teachers are the front line of defense for the future generations, really. It's a hard, hard job. And they're getting all kinds of challenges and criticism, et cetera. But they are the ones every day out there for very little money and very little thanks sometimes.
giving of themselves to help that next generation find those opportunities and be successful. And those of us who now have this lifelong learning love, which I do, it's one of the things I love so much about my job is
is that education made me very curious. And like you said, it's free. I mean, especially now with the advent of the internet libraries. Yes, I have an old fashioned library card and I can remember going through the card catalogs and looking for things. But just knowing that if I could read, I could do a lot of self-education too in addition to what I was getting at school. And I could go places that I couldn't afford to go, but I could go there in my mind and learn all about them. I could learn about
you know, science and math and law and all of these things. It was such a gift. So I'm glad that you said there are free parts to this too, because nearly every community has access to libraries. I think there's such a gift along with our schools and our teachers. But you say that there are important things about learning. You say you have to ask the questions, what to learn, how to learn and why to learn. How does that help walk us towards education?
Exactly. Well, it starts with what to learn. And that was really the cornerstone of the book because my ability to rise through the ranks of corporate management and ultimately be a CEO came down to three things I had to learn. It was the reality that change is going to happen.
And that your response to change makes all the difference in the world. And embracing change is critically important. And the second is having confidence because fear is probably the biggest killer of careers and corporations. People are just afraid of everything. And there's no reason to be afraid because –
Basically, you can learn your way to confidence in virtually anything. And then finally, clarity, the ability to listen and to have critical thinking, truly understand what someone's saying, and then to communicate back very simply. Simplicity is critical.
Often a challenge. So those three things change confidence and clarity. I've characterized as the what to learn, whether you're in school or whether you're in business. It's it literally all starts there.
We'll have more live in the bream in a moment. Pull up a chair and join me, Rachel Campos Duffy and me, former U.S. Congressman Sean Duffy, as we share our perspective on the discussions happening at kitchen tables across America. Download from the kitchen table, the Duffy's at Fox News Podcasts dot com or wherever you download podcasts.
Again, we're talking to James Keyes. Some would call him Jim. You tell us what you prefer. Education is freedom. The future is in your hands. His book out now. You say too that your love of learning helped you to figure out what your customers wanted. How did that work?
It did. You mentioned before curiosity, and I think that combination of curiosity, critical thinking, creativity, those are essential elements of a business leader.
To be able to constantly understand what their customer wants and be able to satisfy those demands. So often we find in senior management, we delegate those decisions. Well, I've got an innovation department to do that stuff or a marketing department to do creative stuff. But really, it starts with...
the leadership with the person at the helm to be able to have that natural curiosity that you described and just want to constantly keep learning about their customers, about new product opportunities, and then have some creativity. I use Einstein's quote, creativity is intelligence having fun. And it's such a great description of the creative process.
So, yeah, those are the elements that I've tried to capture in the book that are important for young people in school, of course, because curiosity is the basic foundation of all learning. But it's equally important, I've found, for the business community or for anyone professionally to be able to embrace learning through that constant curiosity that we have.
Yeah, gosh, because there's a whole big world out there of things I don't understand or know, but I love knowing I can get my hands on the answers or get to somebody who can talk me through and teach me. There's some experts out there, too, so we can learn from each other. It doesn't have to be a traditional classroom setting because once you get past that, there's still so much more to life.
Give us some good examples of other people that you think are doing this well, this idea of lifelong learning that's moving them forward, not just closing that last book. And, you know, I've got a brother who when he graduated from kindergarten and we have this little picture of him in his cap and gown, he walks across the stage and he's like, yay, no more school ever. My parents had to tell him like, oh, no, this is just the beginning. But really, that's what you're saying is, you know, in life, it is really just the beginning to leave your formal education.
It is. In fact, it's a great example. I sort of stumbled on this. In fact, the name of the book came from an experience I had. I was walking across campus at Columbia University where I was at the Graduate School of Business. I had been invited back many years later to teach a class. I ran into a young man and he had a t-shirt on. It said, Education is Freedom on his t-shirt. It was a
It stopped me in my tracks because it really was a wake-up call for me. I went on to that class, and I told those students, I said, I just had an epiphany. I thought I was done learning, but...
And armed with an MBA from Columbia, I thought, "I've got all the tools I need." What I told them was, "Your degree, when you walk out of here, is a license to learn. It has given you a set of tools, but you have to keep learning and keep building that tool set." And the other thing I learned from that t-shirt, ironically, that I shared with those students is, when I was there at Columbia, in a business school environment, of course, I thought it was all about wealth creation, right?
And I said, you know, I, the other part of my learning just now is that yes, wealth is important. It's a, it's a way of keeping score, but what it's really about is freedom. And that was the message my dad had as a little kid. He didn't even know how or why, but he said, son, I want the, for you, the freedom that will come with knowledge. And it's so true. Hence the name of the book, education is freedom.
The future is in your hands. Okay, so let me ask you about the debate that's ongoing now about the value of higher education, a college or university setting versus military or apprenticeship or vocational training. It seems like there's a real debate about, especially with a conversation about student loans and what is a good investment versus non-traditional ways that people want to get educated and move into any number of opportunities in life.
Yes, thanks for asking because honestly, the book has given me an opportunity to get out there and be a counterpoint because there is, I believe, a very dangerous narrative out there right now. First of all, any learning is good learning. I don't care what it is. Vocational learning, self-taught learning, homeschooling, any learning is good learning.
But there's this narrative that college is not for everyone. True. College is not for everyone. The opportunity is. And the reality that we face today, let's say for the next 20, 30 years, until there are other means of measuring someone's accumulation of knowledge besides a formal education, right? Um,
That process, that formal education, public school, private school, secondary, post-secondary school, we are the beneficiaries in the United States of the finest post-secondary institutions in the world. And they're under siege right now. But we can't – because of some challenges on campus, we can't throw out –
our post-secondary education, what we need to do is yes, fix it, but celebrate the reality that we have the best education system in the world and that we need to nurture it and make it better, not discourage people from even attending college or attending some of the finest universities in the world. So yeah, I've got a, a bit of a counter narrative out there that, uh,
College may not be for everyone, but opportunity is. And college is a big, big piece of unlocking opportunity for most of us. Yeah, my parents were sort of of the mindset. My late father used to say, you're going to law school or med school, so pick one. He was sort of only half kidding. I think in his mind, he thought, you know, you're a good student. So this for you, this path forward, you've got to pick one. Exactly.
and I'm definitely not into blood and guts, so law school it was, but I use it all the time in ways that are non-traditional, that are not in a courtroom and arguing a case. Just the research skills that I learned from that and stretching my brain to think in ways that I didn't before, there is a lot of good that can come from that. So how do we do a better job in making sure that there's access to everybody who wants some kind of opportunity at education?
Well, I think for starters, it's increasing the awareness that the opportunity is there. That was part of the reason for my book. There's so much to discourage people, whether it's the cost of college or the difficulty of the process, etc.,
It is absolutely accessible to anyone. Even if you started a community college and work your way up to a four-year, the opportunity is there. So we have to prove the awareness that this opportunity is for everybody and not discourage them from at least trying. And then there are a whole host of other things we can do to improve the education process. You mentioned before that
the libraries and libraries were wonderful. I was, I too, you had my library card and, and, and found that as a rich source of information. But today, if you think about it, that telephone in your pocket is virtually a portal to unlimited learning. So the ability to supplement whatever it is in the classroom, however challenging your classroom environment might be, we have the tools with things like Khan Academy, free tutoring and math, um,
We have all of these tools today that allow you to supplement your formal education with third-party technology support. And those kinds of tools, I think, make it easier for anyone that wants to use education as their key to success, as their key to unlocking doors. Mm-hmm.
Again, we're talking with Jim Keyes. He does all kinds of things. He's been very successful in all kinds of different fields. He's working in philanthropy. I mentioned he's a pilot. He's an author of this book. We're discussing education is freedom. The future is in your hands. So I referenced that you obviously were at the top of 7-Eleven and of Blockbuster. And I want to go back to Blockbuster because I loved it so, so much.
and spent many years, I feel like, wandering the aisles, getting really excited. And sometimes you pick up that case and find out there's no tape behind it. So you're not going to be renting that movie tonight. All the youngsters listening to this are like, what are you crazy people talking about? But I would imagine part of leading that company and now moving on to other endeavors is that things change and we have to learn to
how technology works, how things change. And whatever field that we're in, I think it gets into that argument you make about us being lifelong learners. It's going to have to happen or you're just going to get left behind.
Exactly. Exactly. And, you know, Blockbuster is a great case study for learning the importance of change, because unfortunately, I'd say 90 percent of the people out there have the wrong impression about what happened to Blockbuster. When I arrived at the company in 2007, it was the express purpose of using technology to transform the company, to take it that next phase. They had already made the shift. You remember Blockbuster?
Be Kind, Rewind, the old VHS tapes. Well, they made that transition in technology from VHS tapes to DVDs, and they were actually early. Counter to everybody's perception, they were actually early, very early in the development of streaming technology. They were earlier than the customer's ability to stream, if you can imagine. And the very first thing I did when I arrived in 07 was to buy a streaming company called MovieLink.
that was created by the studio. So they had all the brand new titles. Unlike Netflix with the older movies, this company had access to brand new titles. So we were very, very well positioned to adopt that change to streaming. What happened, what I didn't see, what no one saw, is that in 2008, the financial markets collapsed. Lehman Brothers shut down. We had a billion dollars of debt.
And now as leader, I had to shift my focus from transforming the company to saving the company and getting that debt refinanced and ultimately restructuring that company, which we did successfully with the sale to Dish Networks. But fabulous learnings inside of that blockbuster case study that most people just miss when they skim the surface and say, yeah, they didn't keep up with technology.
Well, yeah. And to sort of that point, when things don't go as we plan or as we hope, I've learned some of my biggest lessons in the things that didn't go right or didn't go well or didn't go according to my plan. And I think sometimes we can be so discouraged by something that is perceived as a failure or where we've missed the mark on something. But the truth is, we can learn in those moments, too. For me, those have been some of the most powerful. I wouldn't have chosen them, but they turned out that way.
It's very true. In fact, I've got a favorite expression I use. I have been a fan of Nelson Mandela and you talk about learning. He was in prison for over 20 years and used that time to study law and came out much better prepared to be president of the country for his time, ironically, in prison. Well,
Well, he has this beautiful expression, had a beautiful expression. He said, I never lose. I win or I learn. And that is so, so true. Right. That's really good. It is. I might have to make a little poster for my wall. I love that saying. It's so true because, you know, I mean, you think about Michael Jordan and how many times he missed the shot.
Or didn't make the team. Or didn't make the team, yeah. As a kid, yeah. Exactly. And there are countless examples of people who didn't win, but they learned from that experience and moved on to be great in the next one.
Yeah. And that opportunity is always there. No matter where you start from, I think both of us are good examples of that. If you can find ways to educate and to move forward, you have the tools, not guaranteeing you success, but at least an opportunity towards that.
with hard work and dedication. And the thing I always tell young people, when they ask for advice is you're gonna hear no a lot. You're gonna hear it a lot, just don't accept it. And I think there are ways around that, learning through your failures. And I love that saying from Nelson Mandela. It's a fantastic one to remember that we can win or we can learn. And there's so much in life to learn. Jim Keys, the book is Education is Freedom. The future is in your hands.
Thank you for all of the good that you're putting into the world. It's an inspiring book that I hope will launch a lot of other people, whether they're young or old, to think about how this can
enrich their own lives, whatever stage they're in. Thank you for joining us on Live in the Bream. Well, thank you, Shannon. I appreciate the opportunity and the future is in our hands collectively. Listen ad-free with a Fox News podcast plus subscription on Apple Podcasts and Amazon Prime members can listen to this show ad-free on the Amazon Music app.
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