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Introducing: Behind the Sun

2022/4/20
logo of podcast CONFLICTED

CONFLICTED

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People
D
Diab
N
Nadia Al-Bukahi
R
Riyad
播音员
主持著名true crime播客《Crime Junkie》的播音员和创始人。
Topics
播音员: 本播客介绍了叙利亚塞德纳亚军事监狱的残酷现实以及囚犯的韧性,揭示了持续发生的侵犯人权行为。 该播客是一个六部分的系列节目,名为《太阳背后》,讲述了在叙利亚发生的真实恐怖事件,以及面对不公正的人们的力量和韧性。 Nadia Al-Bukahi: 叙利亚的空气和阳光与欧洲不同,反映了政治压迫与个人自由的差异。在叙利亚,空气中都弥漫着阿萨德政权的压迫感,而欧洲的空气则属于她自己。她讲述了她的父亲因和平主义活动而被阿萨德政权逮捕和拘留的经历,以及丹麦政府声称叙利亚安全的虚伪性,这与叙利亚持续的侵犯人权行为和对政治异见的迫害相矛盾。她强调叙利亚并不安全,叙利亚人无法返回家园。 Nadia还介绍了Riyad,一个在叙利亚被强迫失踪21年的幸存者,以及Diab,一个在塞德纳亚监狱与Riyad成为朋友的叙利亚活动家。他们的故事将揭示叙利亚安全的真正含义,以及在压迫下生存和友谊的力量。 Riyad: Riyad讲述了他被叙利亚政权绑架并被秘密拘留21年的经历,以及他与Diab在塞德纳亚监狱建立的深厚友谊。他描述了被强迫失踪的恐惧,以及在狱中与妻子短暂重逢的时刻,以及他被判处死刑后改为无期徒刑的经历。他强调了在绝望中保持希望的重要性,以及与Diab的友谊如何帮助他生存下来。 Riyad还讲述了他家人多年来不知道他的下落,以及Diab如何设法将他的地址传递给他的母亲,最终使他的家人得以与他团聚。 Diab: Diab讲述了他因参与在线政治活动而被捕,以及他在塞德纳亚监狱的经历。他描述了在情报部门遭受酷刑和审讯的经历,以及在法庭上受到不公正待遇的经历。他讲述了在塞德纳亚监狱与Riyad结下深厚友谊的过程,以及他们如何互相支持,共同度过艰难的岁月。 Diab还讲述了他在狱中设法将Riyad的地址传递给Riyad母亲的故事,以及这个举动如何帮助Riyad的家人最终与他团聚。他强调了即使在最黑暗的时刻,希望和友谊仍然存在。

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Nadia and Riyad explore the concept of safety and justice in Syria, discussing Riyad's 21-year disappearance and the ongoing horrors faced by detainees.

Shownotes Transcript

Translations:
中文

Hello, dear listeners. Before the next episode of Conflicted hits your feed, we have something a little different to share with you. The team behind Conflicted have joined forces with a charity called the Syria Campaign, and together they have been working very hard on a brand new podcast about a notorious prison in Syria called Sednaya.

The story reveals the truth behind the infamous Sidnaya military prison, and you'll hear directly from the brave people who have been detained there as a result of their opinions or political activism in the country. The six-part limited series is called Behind the Sun. It's both a heartbreaking tale of the very real and ongoing horrors happening in Syria today and an illustration of the power and resilience of those facing this injustice.

I think you'll find this story to be a vital addition to your listening queue. Here now is the first episode of Behind the Sun, and you can find the rest of the feed wherever you get your podcasts. Subscribe now. Just before we begin, I wanted to let you know that this podcast contains some descriptions of physical and psychological violence. Please use discretion. Since 2015, when I arrived in Europe, I have grown more attached to the sun.

I always think of the winter sun where I am in Europe as a guest of honor in the sky. It appears only in short cameos throughout the weeks, and when it does, you don't get the full feeling of it. A friend of mine once called it the fridge bulb because she felt that the sun was only there to light the cold days, but it doesn't really keep you warm. In Syria, where I'm from, I remember winters being sunny and warm. I miss them.

It's not only the sun itself that is different in Europe. The difference is also in how other things feel. Intangible things, like air. I don't know how to explain it, but in Syria, air smelled like Assad, my country's ruler. In every breath I took, his presence was powerful in my chest. In the back of my mind, I imagined him counting the number of oxygen atoms I breathe and only allowing me what's necessary to stay alive.

The rest of the oxygen was his. He kept it to remind me of how much he owns everything in Syria. But in Europe, all the oxygen in the air is mine. You can say air is air and the sun is the same everywhere, but they are not, at least not to me. As a Syrian refugee, safety was the reason why my family had to leave Syria in 2015.

Before that, my father was arrested and detained twice because the Assad regime saw his peaceful activism as an existential threat.

But now I hear people saying that Syria is safe, that the war is over, that the Assad regime has, quote, substantially improved safety in the capital Damascus. These aren't my words. It's the Danish government's description. The same government in clear violation of human rights conventions and wants to send back hundreds of Syrian refugees from Damascus to meet their unknown fate there. Syria is safe, they say.

Maybe they don't fully realize what has been and is still happening in Syria. They don't know about the real and ongoing horrors that more than 100,000 detainees continue to face in detention in Syria, just because they dare to express their opinions or criticize the authorities from torture to enforce disappearance and killings. The story I am going to tell you in this podcast is not just about these atrocities,

It is a story of love, friendship and surviving against the odds. To fight for all those left behind. But right now, what I think about most is that misconception about the meaning of safety in Syria. Is Syria safe? Of course not. Syrians couldn't go back to their country. From Message Heard and the Syria Campaign, this is Behind the Sun. I'm Nadia Al-Bukahi. ♪

The voice you heard earlier is Riyad. He doesn't speak English well, in his opinion, but he wanted to speak in English for you because he believes that it's best for him to try doing his own translation. As he just said, Riyad is Turkish. I met him for the first time under very strange circumstances.

The first time we were in touch, I was 13 years old and he was in prison. He was my father's cellmate and I was trying to connect him with his family in Turkey. He had been in detention in Syria for 18 years at that point and he didn't call them once. Of course, not because he didn't want to, but because he was denied this very basic right.

In his first six and a half years of detention, he was forcibly disappeared and his family had no idea where he was or if he was dead or alive. Rial had such an unusual and extremely difficult journey. And I would like you to hear his story. You were a child in this time, I know. And I couldn't believe myself. There is a child who helped me. When I met Rial over the phone, he didn't have any family members living in Syria.

He was in prison as I said earlier and there if you were lucky enough to get a chance to call someone you can't make international or internet calls. So the arrangement that happened in 2014 was that Riyad would call me on my phone and I would call his family and then connect their calls. You changed my life. You gave me hope, you gave me smiles and

How I say thank you and thank you and thank you, I know it will not be enough for you, Nadia. You have to know this, my girl. I did what I had to do. You and your family, your father too. Do you know that my mother, for the first time after 17 years,

She saw my face through your father's pictures when he dived my face. And I couldn't, or I will not, not just I couldn't, I will not forget all my life

that one family came and changed my life. My father is also an artist, and he drew Riyad's face so that his mother could see what he looks like after all those years. One of the reasons why Riyad is the right candidate to help me explain the meaning of safety in Syria is because Riyad is a survivor of enforced disappearance in my country.

After he was kidnapped by the Syrian regime in the 90s, he was held in secret detention for 21 years, completely cut off from the outside world and his loved ones. He was held "behind the sun." In Syria and other countries in the Middle East, "behind the sun" is a term that strikes fear in the hearts and minds of many. People say it when they speak about someone who has disappeared, usually under suspicious or forced circumstances.

or to avoid explicitly mentioning the notorious intelligence services known as "mukhabarat" or its officers. If you do something like that, you will probably end up behind the sun yourself. And the regime henchmen say this phrase to emphasize their ability to hide people without a trace. Behind the sun is dark, cold, cruel and far from safety. People die behind the sun.

When Riad finally escaped this abyss, he vowed to shed some light on these dark places. He co-founded ADMSP right after he was freed from Syria in 2017. ADMSP stands for the Association of Detainees and Missing Persons in Sidnaya Prison. Riad's behind-the-scenes location was Sidnaya Military Prison. Not many outside of Syria know of it.

When we're talking about the Sidney prison, I know when we say the prisons, many people thinking that the prison is like Democrats' country's prisons. But it isn't like this. In fact, Sidney is not a prison at all. It is not a normal detention center where you have rides, get visits or get a lawyer. You may not get sufficient daily food rations or see the sun and breathe fresh air regularly. Not at all.

These things do not exist there. In fact, if you googled "Sayyidina Yahya" now, you would find it widely known as the "human slaughterhouse". That's how Amnesty International called it. And that's how all the Syrians know it. The best description of it is a death camp.

The Syrian regime detains people and sends them to their deaths in Sednaya. Just death. There is no other destiny except for a very few people and those are the very fortunate ones who would survive this place.

This is Diab, he is a Syrian activist, Riyadh's best friend, a former cellmate in Sidnaya and one of the founders of ADMSP. He doesn't speak English, that's why you will hear an English voice over his words. Before Sidnaya turned into the synonym of torture and killing like it is now, it was just another addition to Assad's father Hafez's collection of prisons. It was opened in 1987 as a military detention camp.

To get as many detainees as possible, it was built on a very wide stretch of land, more than 1 million square meters or around 350 acres. And when it comes to making people disappear, Hafez al-Assad needed privacy. So it was built on a tall hill surrounded by wide empty land, hidden away more than 30 kilometers northeast of the center of the capital.

When they opened it, among the first prisoners were communists, Muslim Brotherhood members, and Palestinian detainees from Yasser Arafat's Fatah faction. Most of the other detainees were people who opposed the regime politically or anybody who had a different opinion to those of the state or the regime. In the past, there were human rights violations.

Anybody who vocally opposed the government would be sent to prison and tortured. But since 2011, the situation is no longer just human rights violations. It has become crimes against humanity. It has become war crimes. It is different. It became systematic. Human rights violations became systematic. Torture became systematic.

and at a mass scale. In Syria now, it's not a single individual incident here and there, or limited to some presence. No, no. Now, at every detention center in Syria, you are exposed to torture and exposed to forcible disappearance. So, this is what has changed. Whereas before there used to be human rights violations,

Now, the situation is a mass crime against humanity. Now as the world's attention appears to be fading, countries seem to be normalizing relations with Assad. And what might that mean for him? An escape from justice. According to the Syrian Network for Human Rights, nearly 128,000 have never emerged and are presumed to be either dead or still in custody in Syria.

Since March 2011, over 14,000 were killed under torture. Many prisoners die from conditions so dire that a United Nations investigation labeled the process "extermination." "The pace of new arrests, torture and execution is increasing," Diab says.

After 10 years of revolution or war or whatever you want to call it, I mean, there is no safety. There are still the security forces and intelligence branches. There are prisons and detention centers. There is forcible disappearance.

So, of course, it's not safe for anybody to live there or for anybody who escaped Syria because of the war or the security forces or intelligence branches to return to Syria. Because until now, nothing has changed. The policy of detention and forcible disappearance is still continuing.

If I asked anyone in the world, what do you think an Air Force intelligence service does, they might say something about monitoring airspace or countering threats related to Air Force or air defense systems. But just like how the meaning of safety in Syria doesn't match what it represents outside, so does Air Force intelligence or Air Force Mukhabarat, a.k.a. Al-Jawiyah.

They are the all-watching eyes and the all-hearing ears of the regime that monitor whatever happens in Syria. That's what most Syrians would say if you ask them about Al-Mukhabarat Al-Jawiyah.

When Bashar's father, Hafez al-Assad, the one you heard speaking to crowds, took control of the country in a coup in 1970, he did it using Al-Jawiyah, his own intelligence service, the one he created while commanding the Air Force in the 60s. To solidify his rule, Hafez al-Assad created a minority elite. The top leadership are drawn largely from his extended family and the Alawid community. We are all like lost individuals.

During the insurgency that rocked the regime and was led by the Muslim Brotherhood between 1978 and 1982, the role and power of his intelligence agencies expanded dramatically. During this period, they gained increased resources and personnel and demonstrated brutal ruthlessness to cow any potential opponent. The Rafat Assad at that time

He was an officer and he went to this detention center and killed in moments hundreds of prisoners for nothing. Rifat Al-Assad is Hafez's brother, in case you didn't recognize the name. He commanded a feared military group at that time called the Defense Companies.

To understand the context of what is happening now in Sidnaya and Syria and how the intelligence is running the country, we must go back to the times when things changed. Four years before Bashar Assad, the current leader of Syria became president. In 1996, Riyadh, then a 19-year-old student in Syria, was abducted while he was in public transit.

The Mukhabarat arrested him after he had sent a letter telling his friends about the stories he heard about the Tadmer prison massacre in 1980 and Rafat Al-Assad, the prison's brother, was involved in it. I wrote,

And I tried to send this letter to my friend in Turkey to tell them what reality this is. But the Syrian intelligence searched and found everything. I was a young boy and these actions took 21 years from my life for nothing.

From the moment of his arrest, Riyadh disappeared. Nobody knew where he went. His family and friends didn't know if he was dead or alive. At that time, the Syrian and the Turkish governments were in a Cold War, and Damascus was harboring the Kurdish leader Abdullah O. Kalan, one of the founders of the Kurdish Workers' Party militia, PKK, that was an integral part of the Kurdish-Turkish conflict. When did they capture me?

They made him sign and stamp his fingerprints on a confessional letter in Arabic, a language Riyadh wasn't completely fluent in at that time.

In the letter, he was falsely accused of spying on Syria and committing acts of espionage to destabilize the country. Remember, he was just 19 at that time. After 15 years, I learned they accused me. I don't know what they called in English, but...

to make matters or problems between two countries, they mean Turkey and Syria, and to brought armies against Syria. Oh, what I am, a superman. It's no surprise that Riyad finds it laughable that the regime thought a young man like him was responsible for such elaborate plots against the state.

Perhaps his laughter is an attempt to protect himself from these dark memories. But the Mukhabarat doesn't kid around. When he was detained, Riyad was with his wife. And after his arrest, he thought that they released her because she didn't do anything. But that wasn't the case. After one year in the intelligence branches, an officer came to him and told him that his wife was in their custody and they wanted him to talk to her. It was a real shock. I was frozen.

I said, "She is here?" He said, "Yes." I said, "Why? What she did? Why you are capture her till now?" He said, "I don't know. I am just an officer." Because just she was my wife. This is the reason. There was no reason, no reason at all. She didn't do anything. Riyad's wife became tired of her situation. They were married young and they were certainly much too young for this.

And when Mukhabarat men asked him to see her, she was 14 days into a hunger strike. They wanted him to convince her to end it. I said, "Okay, where is her?" He said, "In the car." "And you have to talk with her to eat or she's going to die and nobody will hear about her. Nobody will hear about you." I went to car and I saw her. She was there.

in the car and I tried to be strong in front of her but inside me I was crying I took her on my hands she was very very weak because 14 days she wasn't eat anything I took her and I began talking with her I asked her why did you do that why did you

do that. She said, because I want to die. I said, why? She said, because they are a creel. We didn't do anything. Why they took us here? For what? I said, I don't know. But I know one thing, just one thing. We have to, we have to fighting to go out from this hell. And I promise you, I will do everything to

take you outside from this place. It was a very bad moment in my life. Yeah. And of course, after that, she ate. They didn't release her after what had happened, but Riyadh did see her again. After two years, they took me to a political section in another prison. They brought all the

Moments like these are what keep people from falling apart.

Not many were this lucky, but this certainly helped Rial and his wife, for a while. After six years and six months from their detention and disappearance, Rial and his wife met again and saw a courtroom for the first time: the State Security Court. There wasn't any court, in fact. The judge said, "We sentence you to die." So I said, "What I did to die?"

And he stopped us there. And after a while, he began to reading again and he said, "Okay, we sentence you again to forever." I said, "Forever what? What do you mean?" He said, "You will stay in the detention center forever." All my life? Yes. I said, "What I did?" He said, "Shut up, man. Go out."

If you wonder how an official judge could be so flippant during sentencing, I'll explain a bit later. But for now, you should remember the judge's name, Faiz Nouri. Faiz Nouri also sentenced Riyad's wife to six and a half years, which is the exact same period she had already spent in detention. That said, she had already served her time and was free to go. She refused to go out. She said, I want to go out without Riyad.

I want him. And she began to scream and she began to cry, crying, crying. And afterwards, they accept to let her to come and see me just for hour. And I try to make her calm. I said, okay, go. And

When you go, you will be working for me outside. You will tell my family, you will tell my friends, my friends to come and help me. Go, please. Yes. And at that moment, I believed that I will not see her again. I know she will go and I will not see her again at all. Yeah. Yeah.

For two years after her release, Riyad's wife tried to work on getting him freed. She told everyone about him, about where they were and about the alleged accusations. That was when his family first knew that he was alive. But nothing happened, the Mukhabarat stayed as it is and Riyad stayed where he was. Riyad never saw her again. He learned after his release, 15 years after the trial, that she got married again and had children.

Riyadh has not married again. Between Riyadh's enforced disappearance and his trial, something happened in 2000. Hafez al-Assad died and his son Bashar inherited the presidency without fair elections. A few months after Riyadh's secret trial, Diab, a young Syrian, started engaging in online activism. He was a prominent member in an online forum, something like Reddit.

It was called "akhawiyah" which means "fraternity" in English. In this forum, Diab and his friends spoke freely about politics and other things. In 2003, the internet in Syria was relatively new, so people didn't know what level of censorship to expect. And they also believed the rhetoric young Assad was spreading at that time, that he's modernizing Syria and moving away from his father's role towards a more open and democratic Syria.

But his mokhabarat, the same intelligence services he proudly inherited from his father, grew tired of the forum. And they certainly wouldn't tolerate what happened when the forum participants took online political discourse to the streets in 2005. We tried to establish a congregation of young people. And we wrote a paper with our demands of the state.

Basically, what we were saying on the internet, we put it on paper, and some young people adopted this manifesto.

and we established an association we called Youth for Syria, Shams. Shams means the sun, by the way. They were members of the Sun Movement calling for freedom and justice for Syrians. Of course, the regime was growing tired of political activity in general, not just Shams, and started detaining well-known political dissidents.

The intelligence began to follow Shem's members, and they succeeded in detaining one of the movement's leaders. When Diab heard, he fled from his home in Damascus. The thing is, if the Mukhabarat can't get to you, they will try to get to your family. The Mukhabarat arrested Diab's father and demanded that he should turn himself in by meeting them in the street. I arrived at the meeting place.

After that, I found my dad with them in a car. I entered the car from the back door. There was a clearly high-ranking officer in the car. He was telling my dad not to fear, there is just a simple procedure, just a brief Q&A. We are just keeping him for a little bit, maybe just taking him for as long as it takes to drink a cup of coffee.

We'll send him right back to you after. There is nothing to worry about. We will return him to you." Of course, my dad clearly did not believe it. The intelligence officers didn't care about Diab's father, so they stopped playing nice. At the end, they got rid of my dad in a very humiliating way when he refused to leave. They forced him out of the car.

He kept looking at me and his eyes began tearing up at that moment. I felt like he was leaving a piece of his heart in the car. He was leaving his son. He kept looking at the car as it was moving away, like a piece of his heart was going away with it. They blindfolded Diab and moved him to an intelligence branch where he would be detained and interrogated for a while.

And just like the case in every Muqabarat branch until now, they took him underground and started torturing him for 30 minutes. And then came an interrogator. The interrogation was a mix of torture and lectures. The president is bringing technology to this country. He is the president of the Syrian Information and Technology Association.

and he brought computers to this country, the interrogator was telling me. This computer you see before you, we never would have dreamed of having it were it not for Mr. President. The President brought these computers and you are using it for this? Alongside the latin and the web and your other torture tools?

Is this your modernization? To have a computer and at the same time to have your whip, your baton, your tools to torture people with? The interrogation period took around 45 days. During this time, he didn't gain anything from staying silent or refusing to say what they wanted to hear.

In Syria's justice system, when the intelligence says something about you, you must admit it and everyone else should agree as well. As soon as you admit everything they want you to admit, that's the end. They stop the torture and send you to court. And we have to put court between quotation marks here.

Do you remember Faiz al-Nuri, the judge who sentenced Rial and his wife? In 2007, Diab stood in the same courtroom with the same judge. Faiz al-Nuri perfectly encapsulated the notion of justice in Assad's Syria. This judge had been heading the state security court since the 1980s. In the 90s, there was a failed assassination attempt that left him deaf and visually impaired.

And this is the man presiding over your case. This man will judge you.

In the trial, the judge is just a messenger that reads your sentence. And this particular messenger was a bad one. This man read my name, but then read the name of my friend's father instead of mine, and read the name of another friend's mother instead of mine, and read the birth date of yet another person. I didn't understand the accusation when he pronounced them.

I literally couldn't follow his words because he does not speak well. All I could understand was that we were sentenced and that we were being sent back.

The regime also denied Diab any legal assistance from human rights NGOs. And at that time, there weren't any lawyers who would voluntarily take Diab's case. Even now, it will be very dangerous for a lawyer to defend a political prisoner or someone accused of treason against the state. It can cost them their own freedom.

So, the court appointed a defense. But because each one of the lawyers feared continuing with Diab, in his five court appearances Diab had five different attorneys. When he was sentenced to five years in prison, Diab tried to tell the judge that he was coerced and tortured by the intelligence to confess.

The judge replied: "You are a liar! The intelligence doesn't do anything like that. If you were starved, how are you still alive?" So, the so-called judge was worse than the intelligence agents. He wouldn't beat you, but the only thing he would do is curse and insult you. Imagine

The judge is just telling you, "Shut up! Shut up!" and disparaging you all the time with his way of talking, saying things like, "You are traitors!" The judge would give you the feeling that you should feel lucky that he's not sentencing you to death. I want to pause here for a moment. At that time, in 2007, Syed Naya still functioned like the old version.

a notorious prison run by the military with a bad record of human rights violations. That would soon change. After his trial, Diab was heading towards the infamous "Tidnaya." One of the traditions that are common with all Assad detentions until now is a torture event known as "welcome parties." In the intelligence branches,

For example, you keep getting beaten and tortured until you confess what they want you to confess. When I confess, fine, I am a traitor. The beating stopped. But in Sidnaya, you are being beaten for nothing. They are beating you to break you from inside, psychologically and spiritually, to snatch your humanity away from you.

to transform you into an animal and then, like a sheep, you enter your bar, namely solitary confinement. You keep being beaten and sometimes they bring you some food and you could die at any moment.

So, Diab decided to avoid giving any reason for the guards to torture him. He accepted his fate and tried to cope with his situation.

At that time in Syednaia, inmates were allowed to read books and newspapers. But these publications had to go through Mukhabarat first for approval, which means it was just part of the state propaganda. At the end of the day, Assad didn't want dissidents to be able to think freely or have access to knowledge in Syednaia. Their free thinking is what got them inside in the first place.

By contrast for Diab, books were the things that kept him sane, and whenever there was an opportunity to get his hands on a banned book, he would grab it immediately. After some time in Sidnaya, Diab would meet someone who would change his life forever. We knew that there would be newcomers, so we all wanted to see who they were.

If there was somebody who fit my personality, somebody without problems, not radically religious or had any other personal problems, so we would have suitable company in ourselves. So I met someone and helped him carry his bag, and I immediately asked him, "What do you have in your bag? It's too heavy."

That person was Riyad. Since his trial and separation from his wife in 2003, the authorities moved him between detention centers, and during that time, nobody from his family was able to locate where he was. His arrival to Sidnaya and meeting with Diab would also influence his life in a great way.

I had, at the time, books from all the tinies. I hide them, I keep them. When he saw me, I had many books with me. And as a cat smelling milk, he could smell the books and...

and we immediately became friends. That is where it started. I began to borrow books from him. I was constantly asking him for suggestions since I wanted to read.

and we were not otherwise allowed to read anything other than what's authorized by the state. But with Riyad, I found some nice books, short stories, novels. Anyway, the relationship began to strengthen from here. He told me, "Where are you from?" I said, "I am from Turkey." "Wow, you said Turkey?"

I said, "Yes, I am Turkish." He said, "You are Turkish?" "Yes," I said, "I'm Turkish, man." It was a strange feeling. Oh, but he said, "Oh, the Syrian intelligence not just captured the Syrians, they also captured the other nationality." The bond between Riyad and Diab grew stronger and stronger over the years. They were two like-minded men standing back to back against life in Sidneya.

They call their relationship something beyond brotherhood. We were eating together, our beds were beside each other. It's to the point that you know everything about each other.

For example, I used to cook a little bit and Riyad would do the dishes. I knew, for instance, that Riyad didn't like spicy or salty food and he would drink his tea without sugar. So when I would cook for us, I would cook to his specifications. I wouldn't make the food spicy or salty.

It became like an old married couple, like a couple who'd been married for 40 years and know everything about each other. And each have their complaints about each other. But at the end of the day, they couldn't live without each other, nor would they ever divorce each other.

Still, there was one thing that Riyadh couldn't get over. For years, Riyadh's family knew nothing about where he was or what happened to him. They only knew what his ex-wife told them when she got out.

15 years, my family searched about me and one of my family members went to Syria to ask about me three times. He went to a Syrian intelligence centers and they told him that I wasn't there, but I was there. And my brother was very near to me, maybe meters, but they told we don't have this name.

Diab didn't accept the situation for his best friend. He decided to write Riyad's address on a delicate piece of paper he extracted from cigarette tin foil and give it to his mother on the next visit. He folded and concealed the message under his little fingernail to avoid detection during the body cavity search.

Diab had let the nail grow for more than a month before executing his plan. During a quick visit of about 30 seconds, he was allowed to hug his mother through a window. Diab kissed her hands and while doing so, he passed the tiny paper into her grip and tightened his hands around her fingers. She didn't believe that there could be someone whose family knew nothing about him.

And by the way, she just told me about this last year. She told me when I read the paper, I wanted to get out the same night. I was thinking, how could there be a mother who has known nothing about her son for 14 years? How could I sleep knowing that there is a mother wondering about her son for 14 years? And truly, she left for Turkey in two days.

After 15 years, for the first time, Diab's mother came from Damascus to Turkey and she began to search about my family, my family's address, and she found my mother at that time. And for the first time, Diab's mother told my mother that I am alive and my family now, they can go and see me.

Today, despite living in different countries, Riyad and Diab are best friends and co-workers at ADMSP. Their dark ordeal with the Syrian intelligence created a strong bond that stood the test of time. Nowadays, my kids tell me that Riyad is my brother. "Riyad is your brother, Baba. Baba, you have a brother."

"His name is Riyad." And I tell them, "Yes, Riyad is my brother, even though he's not my brother by blood." For educational reasons, I was trying to explain the difference between a brother and a friend, but even my kids loved him that much. And now, this is our lives.

Rial and Diab are now replicating what they did for each other to help the families of other detainees locate their missing loved ones. Their organization, ADMSP, today plays a pivotal role in informing the families of the detainees about the fate of their children. They do their best to locate the people who remain missing in Assad's network of prisons, in so-called "safe and stable" Syria. But Rial and Diab's story with Seydnaya hasn't ended yet.

In the next five episodes of this podcast, we will explore the transformation of Sayyidinaya. We will understand how the regime has used Sayyidinaya to control the population and suppress the 2011 revolution. We will hear about the families searching for their loved ones. And we will hear from a witness in detail about what happened in Sayyidinaya.

Next week on Behind the Sun, we go through the events that transformed Sidnaya from an ordinary prison to a human slaughterhouse. Behind the Sun is a co-production between Message Heard and the Syria Campaign, in collaboration with the Association of Detainees and the Missing, ADMSP, and the Syrian Center for Justice and Accountability, SJAC, under its project On the Margins No More.

The series is written and produced by Mohamed Farouk. Thank you to Raneem, Hula, Sara, Mays and Rory from the Syria Campaign and Rahaf from ADMSP for helping put this series together. Additional thanks to Mahmoud Nawara for providing voiceover and translation. Editing, mixing and sound design was done by Yarek Zaba and Ivan Easley.

Additional production support from Molly Freeman, Tom Biddle and Lincoln Bunder Westhazen. Sandra Ferrari is the executive producer. The theme music is by Milo Evans. My name is Nadia Bokai.